Well There's Your Problem | Episode 12A: The Boeing 737 MAX
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- Опубліковано 19 сер 2024
- In this episode which took entirely too long to produce, @aliceavizandum, @oldmananders0n, and @donoteat1 realize they don't know anything about airplanes, and insult the French.
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MCAS is such a good anti-stalling system, that it permanently prevents the aircraft with it from stalling ever again.
MCAS is not an anti stall system.
@@farcticox1409 that’s why it’s so remarkable!
You can stall a wing in a dive too.
Well I for one am glad the 737 max is fixed and is no longer trying to kill it's passengers by having doors fly off mid flight.
favorite 737 fact: it’s the only plane in the world with a “patch bullet holes” step on the assembly line, since people often take pot shots at the fuselage sections during their cross country train ride.
America.
Other fun fact, there’s currently a maintenance notice out for the 737 NG over fatigue cracks in the structural element that joins the fuselage to the wing spar. This element is known as the “pickle fork”
Great country if you're feeling suicidal.
Bullshit. If an aircraft comes in with skin damage, the entire panel is replcaed. the is no "step" to do this.
Mister Dragon fair, but my point stands. Maybe I should have said “repair” instead of patch. But fuses come in with them often enough that there’s an existing, regular protocol to address it. Which is not part of the production process for any other plane, at least that I’ve ever scene.
No, it's not often. Large hail is more of a threat. Neither is planned for, nor is planning needed. It's just the installation of a new skin panel.
lawful good: trains
lawful neutral: bus
lawful evil: airplane
neutral good: bicycle
true neutral: walking
neutral evil: car
chaotic good: horse
chaotic neutral: skateboard
chaotic evil: apparently helicopters
Chaotic chaotic: Jetskis
What about all them innocent trees, wetlands and whatever else the treehuggers come up with? You cant just scar mother nature with rails or roads like that, man.
@YT user 597863 Thats what they just said/did with one of your new US high speed trains.
Reginald Benedict Victor Hugo Ashford Chaotic Florida
too soon
Boeing: "Let's just move the engines a little bit forward and up"
Everyone who has played Kerbal Space Program and seen those 3 little vectors go out of alignment: _"oh no"_
As someone who gave up and built my first plane like an air-breathing rocket using radial symmetry and enough jet engines to flick off gravity without aerodynamic lift, yeah, that's where my brain went too.
I mean, it's not inherently that bad--the issue was not that it fucked everything up, it's that it simply requires some training to understand and get used to the differences. MCAS was a horrible patch job to try and make the plane handle the same way, while Boeing tried to sell the plane as "it flies the exact same, no new training required".
@@Raptor747 Yes it did FK up the 737Max, shifting the engine position to above the wing created major problem with the balancing, center of gravity and charactoristics of flight. Once it enter into a stall it was pretty much fatal. Which is why Boeing went to huge efforts to hide this fact.
MCAS was also a rushed solution because Airbus Neo was was taking away Boeing market share and there was huge pressure to build a plane that could rival Airbus.
Its a pretty bad flaw, otherwise it would have already been solved with just "some training" and not this long grounding of planes while Boeing tries to figure out a solution.
@@wmd202 Nah the training is INCREDIBLY expensive. But now Boeing is going to pay for it.
@@wmd202 one of the most important selling points of the MAX was a common type certificate with the NG, if you need supplemental training to operate a variant type, you might as well just switch to a completely different type because training isn’t cheap, so airlines would prefer to not have to train pilots beyond what they absolutely have to
@11:00 Ooh ooh, I know this one! The "pilot voice" actually is semi-intentional, and is intended to make radio communication clearer. A steady, monotone voice is a lot easier to understand over the radio, particularly when crappy microphones, background noise, interference, or a spotty connection is an issue. The "uhhhhhhh" thing is so that the person listening to the radio transmission can tell you're still there; if you just stopped talking, they might think you stopped transmitting, or that they missed part of your transmission. "Uhhhhhhh" is just pilot (or radio in general; Ham radio folks do it too occasionally) for "this pause is intentional; I'm still here and you haven't missed anything."
It's also pretty common to start a transmission with an "uh" or "eh" prefix on the first word. Same thing; it identifies the first word in the transmission and lets the person on the other end know they haven't missed anything. Crappy radio etiquette can result in the first word getting cut off, and a quick "uh" tacked on to the first word lets the listener know that didn't happen. A slight variation of this is starting the first transmission with a salutation like "good morning," or saying the first syllable in a slightly higher pitch than the rest of the sentence (like "GOOD morning blah blah blah monotone pilot voice"). It's just a quick way for anyone listening to verify that they've heard your entire transmission.
I'm not actually sure how much of this stuff is intentional, or just something that happens when you do a lot of communication via radio. To some degree, it's just a weird linguistic quirk which has developed over time less than an actual rule. It's definitely somewhat intentional, however.
Source: my dad is a pilot. He absolutely does the pilot voice when he's on the radio. Funny enough, he doesn't do it on the intercomm; he only does it when he's on the radio.
I always check in to a new frequency with "GOOOOOD MORNING POTOMAC APPROACH!" so that the controller knows i wasn't going to say anything important anyway.
That is so cool
This episode aged well
I just said the need to do an updated video too, 😂😂🤣🤣😭😭😭. Some things change....and some things never do.
We have learned one thing or two about using cheap Logitech controllers in life critical systems since then too
Looking like there's going to be a 787 Episode before long. Also since Boeing killed a man over it.
@@mylesbarrett2031 They may have killed more than one person over it...
The ehhhh (referenced at 10:54) when pilots give messages, likely comes from radio comm habits. Since planes & controllers are all speaking on one frequency, only one person can talk at a time. So if you are taking a brief break in a sentence (like to check the number on a gauge) filling the airspace with a noise indicates that that it is still in use and someone else (especially one who just switched to the channel) does not start broadcasting their own call (ending up both jamming each other out). If it is something that will take more than a few seconds they would just break off a communication and start another radio call later.
Radio communication with Tower/Center/etc is absolutely required to get even a basic private license, with more types of comm coming up when the additional endorsements and flight hours to fly a passenger jet.
Especially with circuits that automatically add a "chirp" when you pause for breath, because they'll add the chirp just as you start the next sentence, so the first word is hidden behind it. "Roger tower, we are flying at... thousand feet, heading... and will be in your airspace in... minutes over."
"engineers are needlessly superstitious about the number 13"
this episode is hilariously cursed, has to be recorded three times, and even then has technical issues
WHO'S LAUGHING NOW
NASA - Apollo 13...
"Well, no more missions numbered 13 guys."
As far as technical issues go for this podcast, this episode is relatively unencumbered.
Not Engineers, Company Sales Reps and some of their Customers. Many do not have a Row 13 it's usually skipped, just like on Elevator Panels that some will use it as a Machine Maintenance Level.
By the time I'm watching it it's 12A.
Episode Mezzanine
(Everyone on the plane is drunk. It sways violently because the pilots are also drunk. Drunk stewardesses distribute martinis and Benzedrine inhalers to the passengers. A man stands up, brandishing a revolver in one hand and a martini in the other.)
Man: "Everybody! This is a highjacking!"
Passengers: "Awwwwww!"
Man: "Naw, naw, ish okay! We're going to CUBA!"
Passengers: "Yay!"
(Jolly Caribbean music begins playing over the plane's PA system. For no reason, the entire restroom unit falls out of the plane, narrowly missing Lee Iacocca.)
I need this two minute long low budget comedy skit in my life
Some notes:
- MCAS as approved by the FAA trimmed once, and then turned off. MCAS as shipped trims once and then pauses, but turns back on if the pilot trims with the yoke electric trim.
- It's the AoA sensor, not the pitot tube, that's for speed. They're also unreliable and there's backups, though.
- Its doesn't push the stick, but it trims the elevators which is actually worse, as the forces are way stronger. The whole point to electric auto-trim is to keep the forces manageable for the flight crew because otherwise you can't physically fly it no matter how much of a red-blooded republican you are.
- The MCAS on the tanker uses both AoA sensors and does sensor integration with other things to make sure it's not going screwy.
- The one on the 737 just uses 1 at random on startup because if it had more sensor inputs it would be a more critical device and hard-require way more testing and certification. This costs money.
- The trim crank on the 737 gets smaller every generation, and on the max its the smallest its ever been, which is why its impossible to move once its been over-trimmed. The forces on the crank get bigger with every generation too, so that's fun.
Some CORRECTIONS* is more like it. This was either sloppy research or poor delivery due to fatigue/fun, they all seemed to having a great time together.
Though I imagine there aren’t any safety hearings using this as a source
@@christi_L It's all sloppy research and a complete lack of understanding from the media. The Indonesians did a great job shifting the blame, read the actual report and it is shocking what Lion Air maintenance did and how poorly the pilots responded to everything. If it wasn't this accident, it for sure was going to be something else.
@@pyromcr Boeing shills are the worst.
@@pyromcrI mean, regardless of potentially sloppy maintenance etc the plane in question was still functioning very close to exactly as boeing (short-sightedly) designed it in the lion air crash. There's a lot of misinformation out there still from hearsay being passed as fact which muddies the waters a bit.
Yes, everyone involved could have both acted and reacted better to the circumstances that lead to the crash, but the fault in that accident still lies primarily with Boeing's hidden automatic "fuck you, pilot" trim system as the following incidents proved. They should have bit the bullet and tanked the cost of recertification. Maybe in an alternative reality lionair ditches a plane through poor maintenence and crew training, but that's literally not what happened here, even if it did play an undeniable role in hastening the ditch by some measure of minutes.
When you factor in a pitifully small manual crank (their only possible backup system if they somehow guessed to disable the e-trim despite that being undocumented!) and the design at that time where mcas kept forcing the trim into erronous and extreme settings whenever pilots tried to fix the bad trim, they stood no chance in hell of recovery once MCAS took over and the forces involved overcame the itty bitty manual crank's capabilities.
If you *solely* blame the charter/operator and their admittedly scruffy training etc, you genuinely just come off as wanting to believe boeing had no part in it, or that it was a "foreigner skill issue". If that's not your intent, make that clear by fully acknowledging the momumental role boeing played before just ragging on Indonesia, their pilots and that one company as causal instead of just an exacerbating factor.
Can’t wait for this to be the first podcast to cover the Tacoma Narrows Bridge collapse
It definitely is in that general area.
That's what episode 13 is.
I think I have a solution to their tyre temperature cycling issue. First, you make the wheels completely out of metal. Since metal doesn't work well with tarmac, let's make them run on metal too. Rather than making a big plate of metal, we'll make them long strips of metal that it runs on. Finally, let's eliminate the whole temperature cycling thing by not going up in the cold air, so it always runs on the ground.
As a side effect, it's a lot more efficient too!
🤔
Might require a lot of retraining.
Jet trains please
Significantly less efficient to have to build bridges ofver the atlantic and pacific oceans though
@@sea_kerman save a lot on fuel though!
"Helicopters just kinda crash from anything" great timing on the release of this video guys. This episode was totally cursed
Did this podcast kill Kobe Bryant
“Congratulations Boeing! You’ve automated 9/11.” Holy shit! That was funny.
I haven’t finished the episode, but I suspect that joke will not be topped. I’m ready to call it the funniest joke of the episode.
Finished the episode. I was correct. Good job, Liam.
And good job, me, for my wonderful powers of prediction.
I'm sure the CIA will come up with something to topple it in 30 minutes.
my systems engineering teacher brought this as an example of a bad human-machine interface because basically letting the pilot believe they're flying a different older airplane by doing different things than what the pilot wants, and lying to them about it, is Bad
This is why if you’re an engineering company, you don’t move your corporate HQ to an entirely separate building, in a new city, away from all the engineers.
They went from a company run by engineers to a company run by Wall Street guys which happens to employ engineers occasionally.
Next time you need a Riley available on short notice to talk about planes, I'm one of those, but a girl and not dead (AND I COULD TELL YOU THAT THE ORIGINAL 737 LOW BYPASS ENGINE WAS ALSO A TURBOFAN which is something I am irrationally passionate about)
Chad JT8D vs Virgin J57.
I mean, I don't see why they couldn't bring you on.
Hypercube Jones yep, here’s a cutaway if the JT8D, you can see the fan is larger than the core, with bypass channels on either side: engineering.purdue.edu/~propulsi/propulsion/images/jets/tfans/jt8d.gif
Yes
You guys gotta revisit this video again after the past month 😂😂😂
The angle of attack sensor is totally separate from a pitot tube. I highly recommended Mentour Pilot’s videos on the subject if you want the actual technical details on the whole thing and the way it was explained to the pilots about the new training.
Of course. One was invented by Hugh Pitot and the other by Jonathan Angle of Attack Sensor
The "uhhhhhh" is because the headset mic auto squelches on silences so they kinda self train unintentionally to keep the mic open by continually making some sound
this i did not know
On the Air France flight, the investigation had determined that as the pitot tubes froze over and the systems received unreliable information, the autopilot disengaged. This unreliable information was shown in the cockpit and caused minor confusion. The aircraft still had a stability control that would've kept it flying, but as the co-pilot applied continuous pressure on the joystick, that too disengaged. The co-pilot caused a stall and through his continued input prevented the plane's anti-stall from activating. Once everyone realized what was going on, they were too low for the stall recovery system to level the plane. So this is a case where the plane wouldn't have crashed if the pilots didn't do anything and it only did crash because their inputs overrode the plane's systems. Very different from MCAS.
You should do an episode on the recording of this episode
Shots fired
The circled globe in the Boeing logo was actually that of Douglas Aircraft, who created it because they built the first airplanes to fly around the world.
Douglas merged with McDonnell to form McDonnell-Douglas, which in turn was bought and absorbed outright by Boeing, who then took Douglas' logo for themselves.
More accurately, Boeing absorbed MD in name but MD corporate actually absorbed Boeing
I’m super late to the party here but that logo, in the case of Boeing, symbolizes “we bought McDonnell Douglas and wore their logo as a trophy.” As for what specifically McDonnell Douglas was going for, it’s some sort of plane circling the globe I guess.
Exactly this. But from a management perspective, the winners were the McD-D folks who came in, took over, and value-engineered the company to where it is now. Boeing used to have engineers at the helm, or at least those who would listen to engineers.
@@tombirkland yeah since writing that I’ve learned much more about how the post-merger corporate structure looked, and you’re definitely right about that.
Car bad, train good, horse chaotic good, plane mysterious metal bird of questionable morals
Butterbean the Cat planes have two pilots. One of them always lies, while one of them always tells the truth.
If you ever happen to cover water crisis things, I suggest you look up Nokia Water Crisis. Kinda like mini-Flint water crisis... Which was caused when someone decided to have a drinking water pipe and a poop water pipe connected by a valve, which of course, someone opened and forgot to close.
So literally the MS Estonia of the plumbing industry.
Or the Walkerton water crisis - or how budget cuts and lack of training lead to a town of 5000 getting horribly sick with E. Coli contaminated water. 6 deaths, two thousand hospitalized.
A good case study on how good engineering means nothing when the monkeys operating it dont know what they're doing.
[737 cabin]
Me: [chanting] doors, doors-
Other passengers: doors, DOORS
Flight attendant: [pounding their clipboard] DOORS, DOORS, DOORS!
This seems almost entirely a management disaster, just in a field that needs a lot of engineering. Which who could have expected when during a turn of the century merger, the stockholders replaced the functioning management at Boeing with the one one that just trashed McDonnell Douglas to the point they needed to merge, but hey they did well for the short term investors at that time.
And then compounded by the low maintenance and training standards in these regions. That same lionair plane had an mcas failure a day before and was improperly marked as repaired. LionAir also has a long record of never fixing any problems, ever, company policy is absolute denial of any responsibility for anything, and the Indonesian government is widely known for being one of the most corrupt in the world.
(I do hate the BA management of the last two decades, and glad mullenberg is out even if the stock holders failed to sue him.)
They did that because capitalism is so efficient
I mean, it's management that's directly affecting the engineering of a plane; i.e. "optional addons" rather than just being included, only one tube instead of both, etc. Whether those people are actually engineers doesn't particularly matter. A good number of these podcasts are managerial disasters because that's who said those screws cost too much.
Exactly, my thoughts exactly. When I saw that they merged with mcdonnell douglas, I knew not to trust any new planes they came out with.
@@singularityghost6290 Its actually arguable that the failings at Boeing come less from middle management that always seems to be micromanaging the wrong things, and more from upper, C-level management where a worship of shareholder value put immense pressures on the lower rungs in the heirarchy to get the MAX project done with minimal FAA oversight. One of the trends that has emerged since the rise of shareholder value economics in large publically traded firms, is that appeasing shareholders with share price rises over and above actual good governance has taken place. Boeing during the engineering phase of the MAX was instituting massive buybacks as well as internal austerity drives that cut the resources of the divisions that would eventually produce the 737.
newrepublic.com/article/154944/boeing-737-max-investigation-indonesia-lion-air-ethiopian-airlines-managerial-revolution
This looking to the share price as an augury of the company fortunes, rather than the management culture and style driving it into the ground, was instrumental in causing the failures of the MAX program. The worst part of it though, was that C-level management was quick to isolate and fire the engineers responsible for the decisions leading to MCAS when it was the C-level choices that produced an environment guaranteed to make an unsafe plane, while calling in favours to the FAA to go easy on Boeing during the certification process. This is the kind of management that can turn otherwise well performing companies and make it crash and burn. Much like MCAS.
You guys are going to need a part 2, 3, 4, 5 etc
im sorry but i just gotta call out alice for a bit here, the famous red wedge poster was not designed by kazimir malevich but rather by the equally formidable (and formidably named) suprematist artist and designer el lissitzky. i can sleep tonight knowing that four years of art history extracurriculars didnt go to total waste
The issue with pitot tube blockage by wasps had to do with mud daubers, which are solitary parasitoids and don't form colonies, but do look for narrow tunnels in which to build nest cells for their larvae and the paralyzed insects with which they provision them. You wouldn't be at risk of getting stung while cleaning such a nest cell out of a pitot, since mud daubers are mass provisioners and do not revisit nest cells once sealed; in any case, solitary wasps are typically very docile and can even be gently handled without significant risk of a sting. (Can confirm, I've done that myself! Never been stung by a solitary wasp.)
I don't blame the wasps at all on that one, they're just doing what's in their nature. If people don't want people (and, much more importantly, mud dauber larvae) to die in plane crashes, people should make sure to cover their pitot tubes, that's all.
"Episode 12A"
Engineers, a superstitious and cowardly lot.
I guarantee next episode will start with "Well, last episode we had a good discussion on the Tacoma Narrows Bridge collapse; go check out episode 13, if you missed it"
Going by episodes recorded and released, including bonus episodes, technically Episode 12 was episode 13.
@@scarylion1roar Bonus episodes are the equivalent of Basement levels, so probably shouldn't be counted.
GroundThing you were right
When I was young, I worked in an IT department and was on the list of people who were on call for production problems. One night there was a problem with an older but key job stream so I had to call in the programmer team responsible. After over an hour of poring over code one of them laughed and called the other two of us over. There was comment on an error handling routine that simply said, "I don't think this works". It was the first time that error had come up after thousands of runs. The programmer who had written it had already retired. It was pretty funny but happily, other than some lost sleep and the company paying out a little overtime, there were no other consequences.
Ghost of coders past
The angle of attack sensor is completely different from the pitot tubes. AOA is like a weather vane flappin in the breeze.
Ralph Nader's niece died in one of the crashes. He said that he will never let Boeing forget.
There were several engineering and social failures that led to this catastrophic failure, but in the theme of, "well there's yer problem":
1 - There are two AOA sensors (they're actually like little wind vanes on each side of the nose, not Pitot tubes), but the MCAS (yes Em-cass) software was designed to ignore one of the sensors after boot up... relying only on information from one side, on a sensor that has a backup because it's known to fail relatively easily...
2 - The software was written to repeatedly ignore and override pilot inputs. MCAS doesn't just use force feedback... it also automatically adjusts the trim system... literally changing the angle of the main tail surface to force the nose down. When overridden by the pilot with the button on the yoke, MCAS doesn't disengage, it just allows the change, but if the sensor, which as noted above may have failed, shows that the airplane is in a climb, it automatically adjusts the trim system twice as much. Repeated overrides doesn't disengage MCAS either... instead of writing the software to assume that a pilot knows what's going on after two or three times of not crashing the plane, the software engineer just wrote MCAS to push the nose down more insistently and repeatedly and more frequently.
There's yer problem... bad software engineering... not the first or last time some neckbeard causes a problem like this by assuming they know more than people in real world situations.
Your french pronounciation of Bombardier is correct, a company that started and maybe should've stuck to snowmobiles (chaotic neutral). Every nation wants its aeronotics sector to succeed and ends up putting protective measures like tarrifs, hiding flaws & shoveling money into it like it's an old coal furnace.
The wasps involved in that crash were potter wasps. Solitary bugs, not the ones that make the huge paper hives of stinging doom.
You need to really work hard at pissing a potter wasp off to get it to sting you, and if you do manage it the sting doesn't do much. They do however built their brood cells from mud and clay, and they do it very quickly.
Mud Daubers, what they're called here in Texas. Edit: They move in on good spots and put their little mud pots in them in a couple of hours.
Huge paper hives of stinging doom has just moved into my lexicon
This aged like a fine wine
32:37 "helicopters just crash from anything"
well that line aged quickly
Fuck, was that a year ago already
@@dansaunders1655 it appears so
I work with Chinese students in a Chinese university setting and they do learn by rote. I get back exact phrasing from my lectures in most or all essay answers, little to no constructed argument and no application (even when explicitly required by the question, so when I say how would you do this, I will get back the list of general factors including those irrelevant to this and even those that are wrong for the this case) and this is from the good students. I have also handed off a set of lectures to a Chinese colleague this year who started asking questions about an explanatory metaphor I had used rather than the thing I was explaining. So yes the Chinese education system relies on rote learning.
i will listen to this right now whilst trying to fall asleep and it will lessen the anxiety re: having to wake up early and the labor loop restarting for the week, heartfelt thanks to all that participate in this show :)
Well well well, imagine this popping up in my feed nowadays.
You know I am beginning to think we are never going to get to see the Tacoma Narrow's bridge episode. I think they might be joking about it.
i appreciate the detail that went into the subtitles! "[pitot tube voice]" at 32:52
The Downfall of Boeing documentary on Netflix, which covers the institutional factors contributing to the disasters, is both fascinating and heartbreaking.
The father of a passenger of the Ethiopian Airlines flight, he is just dead inside during all his interviews. Absolutely broken man. And he's recounting the sessions of the congressional hearings he attended where Capitol police try to stop him and other families bringing pictures of the dead - classifying them as "protest signs".
Eventually, they relent and permit the pictures, and they sit in the hearing with their pictures.
"And he's recounting the sessions of the congressional hearings he attended where Capitol police try to stop him and other families bringing pictures of the dead - classifying them as "protest signs"."
So much for freedom of assembly, freedom of speech, and right to petition smh.
About the "captain speech pattern" you wondered about. I think it has to do with them being used to talk via Coms radio. When you talk on radio you want to fill airtime between sentences to make shure nobody cuts you off because they think you have finished speaking. Because only one can talk at a time at one frequenzy. So you add alot of "uuuhm aaaahm eeehm" between everything you say XD
That might bleed over to when you are talking in the intercom because you use the same kind of handle when you use it.
Im only speculating of course but i think it seems reasonable.
Pilots make a sound when they pause so that people listening know they are not done talking. The radios only allow one transmission on a frequency. 2 or more transmissions at the same time will cancel each other out sounding like static or a high pitched squeal (see Tenerife)
There are two versions of the 787 those built by unionised labour in Seattle and those where someone dropped the bolts holding the doors on behind a seat and couldn’t be bothered to recover them so stuck the door on with duct tape and left the bolt rattling around in the cabin....
Holy mother of foreshadowing
When the pitot tube clogs up the airspeed indicator quits working so the pilot has to look at his/her gps to determine the speed of the aircraft. Then he/she lands and a guy with a coat hanger rods out the pitot tube and everything is swell again.
First stepdad was a Boeing employee who landed himself in jail (and the Seattle-Chicago move is how I ended up in Illinois), these days I drive Grumman-made mail trucks. Weapons manufacturers and I have an odd relationship.
Sunwing may be cheap but at least it gave child me an activity packet during flights so my sister and I wouldn't annoy the other passengers, other airlines never bothered.
Edit: I may not know much french but now I can take comfort in the fact that I know more about french conjugation than Alice does. Those 11 years of french immersion really did pay off.
Very jarring coming back to this episode in 2024
I thoroughly enjoyed this podcast. I laughed o much. The mcas never stalled an airplane success joke had me in stitches.
When its just you three guys I often like it the most. Also recording it three times might helps on the dead pan delivery. If you go ahead and release all three recordings of the same podcast I might listen to all of them. Keep up the good work. Love you guys and greetings from Berlin, Germany.
Two guys and one girl, I hope Alice can forgive you for the misgendering.
You should do a segment on those boeing LRV's. I used to ride them. They really were strange and bad. They used to make horrible pops and loud groaning sounds when the center joints were moving on turns. They were like that for over 10 years! Sounded like any bearing surfaces were totally dry and destroyed.
They also made other strange noises that came from the internal power system, which were always interesting. Like variable frequency ac that would rise with load, you could hear a loud continuous buzzing that wandered around in frequency - really unusual.
They broke down ALL the time and they were a real mess by the end. Even the buzzing sound was all screwed up and some traction motors sounded like the commutators were completely destroyed. I read that they ran out of parts. But I also read these LRV's were sold to England (From SF MUNI)... I don't get it.
Those fucking things. The only good thing about them was that you could prove your balancing prowess by standing in the hinge and seeing how long you can go without touching a handhold. My record was Riverside all the way to Park Street.
The "uhhhh" noise is picked up from wanting to let the other person on the radio know you haven't stopped speaking and are moving to your next thought.
As someone who lives near another Boeing plant and has followed this every step of the way, there's dark foreshadowing in the first 15 minutes
Have to say, Alice should become a professional subtitler, these are some of the best I've ever seen.
In my Grandpa's time at Boeing, they referred to it as "Boeing Airplane and Storm Door Company."
Episode 13 must be the Tacoma Narrows Bridge episode.
About Glasgow replacing trams with trolley buses and then buses,
Atlanta did the same. Trolley buses in Atlanta were called “trackless trolleys” and existed from the end of the streetcar system in the late 1940s to I guess the 1960s, being fully replaced by buses around the time MARTA was formed.
Finally, an aviation episode. This is the sort of thing I was waiting for. For the record, if you need somebody to be wierd about planes, hit me up.
Well there's your problem, a podcast about recording disasters.
My city used to be known as the city that builds a plane a day.
Now its known as the city that doesn't build any planes. Which I guess makes it like every other city.
The 737 machinists still have their jobs by the way, which is good.
New York Times: "the Chinese as a race of pilots learn by rote unlike the airmenship-having Americans"
Me: O R I E N T A L I S M
I wonder why this is coming up again now???
I was able to find episode 13. Just click and drag the thumbnail for episode 12A and drag it into the trash, you'll find 13 is underneath. Make sure to recover 12A though, if you empty the trash you'll lose it forever.
Sorry mobile users, I don't have a solution for you yet, I'll keep you posted.
I used to joke that Southwest's Baltimore to Pittsburgh flights were so short, it would go up to 10,000 ft and the pilot would announce "We're going to turn off the light so you can move around the Oh sorry we're about to land in Pittsburgh, please return to your seats."
I used to. It *literally* happens between Oakland and LA.
Bird flap wing. Bird fly. Plane fly. Plane flap wing.
Draco Rex and just like planes, Birds Aren’t Real
@@truegopnik6591 I've been in planes. cant say the same about birds.
I still love that gif of a plane flying like a bird.
the suicidal french flight computer is my favorite character
Whoever does the subtitles, thank you for your service
As a young person who grew up in Massachusetts, I had a painful flashback when you pronounces MCAS as "Em-Kass," taken back to my days in high school taking the Massachusetts Comprehensive Assessment System test (MCAS test). The truest of horrors- standardized testing.
I also grew up in Massachusetts. spent much of my middle school years at a private school. Fun fact: private schools don't have to do the standardized test bullshit, which is IMO proof that standardized tests are intended to lower the quality of education.
Listening to this in January 2024 a week after the door flew off a 737 max and a day after another one was grounded when a passenger noticed some rivets were missing from the wing. Might be time for a part 2!
So it was the Max that caused the Tacoma Narrows disaster, neat.
I can't tell you how delighted I am to see that the slide notes are Exactly Like That
A software problem kept Boeing's Starliner from reaching the proper orbit and hardware problems damaged the thrusters. And NASA is probably going to let them fly actual humans on the next flight. 🤬
At this point I wouldn't trust Boeing to fly me an hour to Dallas, much less to space.
It took them a while but the Starliner is fine now
Having your tires exposed to the elements is actually superior for cooling and to keep the plane from being ruptured in case of a boomboom. Just like on trains!
loving the high pitched noise in the background. really adds to the airplane nightmare asmr
Just found this podcast. I love it. The humor is very funny. The bit about the French flight computer made me think of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
Not activating Windows is Praxis
*tips pilot cap* M'CAS
M'CAS:
Pilot: O_O
That article pissed me off too for not going hard enough on Boeing but I feel like you’re being a little unfair to mr longwasher - he makes clear that the Chinese pilots later became some of the safest in the world after they had access to proper training.
Also I got the sense from it that it wasn’t so much the pilots fault as the airline’s for not giving a shit about safety, being corrupt as hell and generally exploiting the pilots and denying them access to the kind of training that would’ve prevented this disaster - he even brings up the fact that this same plane had almost crashed the previous flight n was only saved by the presence of a third guy in the cockpit with the wherewithal to switch off the bad thing.
Again I’m not saying resorting to kinda vague words like ‘airmanship’ and letting Boeing off the hook wasn’t a shitty thing to do I just think it’s worth considering the extra level of evil capitalism at play there. And I don’t think the dudes necessarily more racist than just an average white person
Also if anyone gives a shit, I feel like the equivalent to Train Good, Car Bad here is Boat Good, Plane Bad
Ever heard of the sausage factory worker who became a vegetarian?
I worked in a jet engine factory, I take the train
Re: L1011: Critical support for all non-DC10 triholes
DH Trident forever.
DundeeDriver D.H. Trident 3B can have little a fourth engine, as a treat.
@@keelhauling But only an exhaust hole for it iirc
@James Kresnik Wasn't that the DC10?
James Kresnik meaning UA232? In which case agreed, since that was a DC10.
Unless you mean EA935, which was an eerily similar incident, but for that, while that uncontained engine failure *also* took out 3 hydraulic systems, the L-1011 had 4 in total, and was able to land *slightly* less catastrophically.
Pilots talk that way when making announcements because they're used to talking that way to ATC. Silence can make someone think they're done. If they ever find themselves pausing they subconsciously say "uhh" which ensures nobody will accidentally cut them off. Source: 74 Gear, but I watched it a while ago so I'm not sure how accurate this is
This podcast combines all of my niche interests and it's fucking great. (They/Them)
They joke about Jakarta, Addis Ababa and Nairobi being towns in Maine, but this state genuinely has towns with names like Lebanon, Poland, Mexico and China.
Please make Well There Isn't Your Problem the Patreon bonus episode after the Liam's Van one.
The Japanese high speed rail system would be a good topic for that
@@jack_elliott Yeah, let Roz and Liam use our trusty Patreon money for a trip to Japan just to travel cross-country in a Shinkansen all day. Can't imagine anything that'd make them happier.
"Congratulations Boeing, you automated 9/11" might be the funniest goddamn thing i've heard
Listened to this on a plane, great idea, thanks for making me think about wing flex. PS was visiting in Philly and used regional rail for the first time in 12 years, thought of you. The transit group need to get the R designations back, how do I know it's my train when all they announce is that it goes to some dinky town
Somewhere during my undergraduate mechanical engineering education airplanes were described to our class as "aluminum balloons"
If you like force feedback look up the stick Shaker which is basically oops the pilot fell asleep shake the stick so they know they're doing something stupid like flying into the ground
broke: having your union make reaper drones
woke: having your union make reaper drones
Bespoke: unionizing your reaper drones to make a commune
Baroque: having your reaper drone union make reaper drones to defend the original communes from fascists, statists, and landlords
Nyarloque: Accidentally re-enacting the plot of the entire megaman X series
hiiiiii everyone else coming back here at the end of 2020 due to Recent Developments
For what its worth(and if it has already not been mentioned) the logo is that of McDonnell Douglas, which was acquired by Boeing in 1997.
Bombardier is a Quebeckian company so the name is pronounced the French way, Bom-bar-dee-ay. It would only need an é if there wasn't an 'r' at the end, but the 'er' ending at the end is pronounced roughly the same as é (not exactly the same, but close enough when you are anglicising it). Although as it's from Canadia, it should probably be Bombardi-eh 😎
I’m back listening to this episode due to recent events
Can't Wait for Episode 13: Tacoma Narrows