Sea Dragon is the Massive Rocket of Spaceflight Dreams
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- Опубліковано 10 сер 2017
- For more details on Sea Dragon, check out my companion blog post over at Discover: blogs.discovermagazine.com/vin...
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The Sea Dragon lives in “For All Mankind”!!!
*Laughs in Saudinian* *with bad russian accent* soon it will be real, just wait.
Sadly,not for me, im european and cant wach it on netflix... 😔
@@RipskyOfficials it’s not on Netflix. It’s on Apple TV +.
@@valerie80yearsago90 *"Sad space noises"*
@@RipskyOfficials
VPN?
I bet the Florida Coast marine life is glad the Sea Dragon stayed on paper.
Manatee conversation: " I dont know Phil, God damndest thing I ever saw....came right out of the ocean!"
Yeah, that probably would F a lot of sea life...
It would have been REALLY loud so it would had have been launched more than 1.000 miles away from the coast of florida and YET it would have still been loud and clear to hear
Yeah agreed I'd rather have happy fish than this crap ... Elon's starship is better anyway
Not really the sea is empty af and it was going to be launched as sea as it would make it quieter
Excellent video! I had the honor of doing some engineering work for Robert Truax, the main inventor of the Sea Dragon. There have been attempts to revive this general concept, including Sealar and Excalibur, but these were woefully underfunded. Bob passed away a few years ago, but his worthy design concepts live on. We may yet see large pressure-fed launch vehicles become operational, though not exactly like the Sea Dragon.. Composite tanks and ablatively cooled engines are two key enabling technologies.
I feel like this is an idea worth revisiting today. Imagine the space stations that we could build with this kind of cargo space.
Juan Nunez It is not because the need for this amount of lift capacity is not there.
The Sea Dragon could put the ISS into orbit in one launch and still has ~40 spare tons left! :D
We kindof are though, the ITS works on similar principles (although much more advanced)
nintendomite And much much smaler
+nintendomite Dude, ITS is the opposite of a big dumb booster, it has 9 engines instead of 1, loaded with a full flow staged combustion cycle which is the most complex turbopump on the market, intends to operate with multiple refuelling in orbit (complex manuver) and is expected to land on its own on concrete perfectly on mark, perfectly vertical.
ITS is the triumph of complexity.
Sea Dragon is my favourite rocket. The supertanker of space.
This rocket could have made possible very large construction projects in Earth orbit and on the Moon. For example, the huge rotating wheel space station seen in Kubrick's 2001: A Space Odyssey, and the massive moon base in the same film.
The economy of scale would have even made such projects affordable (by Apollo standards.)
Future topics? How about "Project Orion", that makes the Sea Dragon look like a match stick.
"Saturn by 1970"
If not Orion, then at least NERVA motors. They fired a few of those at Jackass Flats.
yes indeed Dysons Orion, but the Nerva would be good too! In deep space Orion would have made so much sense.
A project Orion video or a NERVA video would be pretty cool!
OH yes!! Lets light off a couple of nukes over our heads and cause the cancer rates to rise all over the world for a great picture of Jupiter. Or send people to space at the expense of birth defects, human suffering. Should cost only about hundred thousand people dying horribly and their descendants paying the price too. Victims of the Hiroshima and Nagasaki blast are still dying from them. UA-cam it and see. I wish the human race rise from this immaturity.
Have a look at the Nevada nuclear testing grounds on google earth. Or Bikini atoll. The explosions used for an Orion launch wouldn't be as bad.
Somewhere, there's a parallel universe where the Sea Dragon was built and used. I'd like to visit.
Francois Lacombe
Somewhere there's a parallel universe where I hover slightly above the ground. I'm trying really hard to make it this universe tho...
Somewhere there's a universe where i have a life. So, so far away...
Graham Kyhl
Lolol same
Francois Lacombe there is also another where we still use the Saturn v and another where we are all dead
More than that, there's probably multiple sea dragond launching because the cold war never happened and there is less war, and there are sea dragond everywhere, kind of.
"To invent an airplane is nothing. To build it is something. To fly it is everything." - Otto Lilienthal (sometimes attributed to Ferdinand Ferber)
Not true anymore, modern aircraft represent a massive engineering challenge because of their performance, tolerances and the regulations in places, just the APU in modern jet liners or military jet in itself is way more complex than anything Otto Lilienthan ever build.
Building them is now way easier because we have big industry dedicated for that, computer simulation and this is almost the same to build it virtually or for real with modern technology where most automated machines do the job with high precision, but this is still difficult.
And with modern fly by wire systems on aircrafts, flying it is basically easy, most modern aircraft almost entirely fly themselves.
It's all inverted !
My point is this Sea Dragon sure gets a lot of lip service for a paper rocket that never existed.
True
Chris Gonzales Was this after he ended up not credited with the first proper flight?
How fun is it to watch this old video after seeing two seasons of "For all mankind"
There is nothing hotter than brains! Keep up the good work Amy!
Putting a Mercury Capsule on top of a rocket with 367 times the required payload capacity... seems overkill. :D
Only as a controller the main payload was carried under it.
It could launch a small crewed mars mission in one go and would have made grandiose plans such as Von Braun's 1952 Mars expedition actually feasible since it would get the number of launches needed from 950 down to 68.
I'm writing a timeline that could have lead to a manned Moon landing by 1966 and a manned Mars landing by ~1972. The lunar mission mode is by upgraded MERCURY direct-ascent using Saturn C-3 to the Moon, while the Mars mission is launched by a SINGLE Saturn V with 4x UA1205 SRBs. The Mars complex is comprised of the Mars Orbital Rendezvous lander (derived from the Moon lander but with a heat-shielded, lifting-body shell and the descent engine starting ascent), a hypergolic orbit insertion stage, a hypergolic TTI (Trans-Terran Injection) stage, and a modified Manned Orbital Laboratory habitat with brute-force life support, storing all required food and oxygen. The Mars complex would only mass ~70 TONS in total.
First & foremost, it's a cargo ship.. an 18-wheel semi-truck carries as many people as a motorcycle.. so do you consider a semi hauling 40 tons of cargo and 2 people to be overkill also?
+Dan Moser I understand that the tiny manned capsule is not the actual payload. The joke is, that it looks awkward.
I suspect the only thing that would have made an American Mars landing by 1972 possible would have been a Soviet moon landing by 1966. ;p
Yesterday I met a gentleman who had a role in the testing of the device that fired the charges that severed the cables between the ascent and descent stages of the Lunar Module prior to lift off from the moon. I have since learned that there were literally hundreds of explosive devices used in Apollo systems. Considering the wow factor of things that blow up maybe discussing some of these systems could be a good topic for a future video. Thanks for all the great programs Amy.
It would be intriguing to see how they would solve for a structure that would not only survive the vacuum of space but 400 feet of water pressure also. Your channel rocks. As a kid in the 60's I would write a letter to NASA and they would send these amazing packets with crew portraits and mission guides. Wish I still had them, I would send them along.
if you, Everyday Astronaut, Curious Droid, and Scott Manley every made a collab video it'd prob be the best space video ever made
love your work Amy!
Wasn't Sea Dragon's sheer size also an attempt to take advantage of Square-Cube law where the larger the internal volume, the LESS volume of materials is needed in relative to contain that volume?
I suppose that was one of the ideas, but this reasoning only works when the exterior structure doesn't need to support anything, else you also need to make the walls thicker as you scale up the volume. The Sea Dragon assumed that pressure would do that job of holding up the structure. I personally am pretty sure that this would not have worked, it would have become unstable right after launch. Even if they would have managed keeping the pressure, the ridiculously large engine would have caused unsurvivable oscillations (for humans and the rocket itself).
The strength of steel cylindrical cross sections doesn't decrease linearly with the internal volume. The larger the cylinder, the thinner the walls relative to the diameter for the same strength.
In addition, a pressure fed engine is far easier to damp due to significantly less non linear vibration because of the lack of high speed moving parts. They solved the problem in the F1, and that was more difficult.
I have never heard of the Sea Dragon, this is fascinating stuff, thank you!
David Clarkson lol, you uncultured swine
Watch the post-credits part of s1e10 episode of For All Mankind
minduton I immediately started UA-cam searching for this very episode after I finished For All Mankind!
I can't wait to see how the Sea Dragon effect space exploration. Maybe a Skylab type space station in lunar orbit
Fascinating episode. I recall reading about it years ago.
Another old concept that I recall is a British system called 'Mustard" (I think). It consisted of three flat-ish ships (shaped like mustard or pumpkin seeds) joined together. Have you ever heard of that one, Amy?
I was waiting for this, nice video, great work! :)
So not actually rocket based, but I would LOVE to hear more on the history of OKB-1 and OKB-52 and the rivalry between, Korolev and Chelomei.
You never seem to give the Soviet stuff much screen time at all, actually, and that's half of the space race.
Delightfully Informative as Always... Great Job!
Ah Aerojet General, I can still remember hearing the rocket engine tests when I was growing up in the 60's. The entire Sacramento area would shake.
thanks for covering the subject
You're the prettiest rocket scientist I have ever laid my eyes on.
So cool. You teach us so much unknown space history. I am thankful for your channel!
This was fantastic! Curious Droid spoke of this rocket, but didn't go into such detail. Thanks so much!!
Hi Amy! There is another vintage rocket project it might be fun to study: There was a project called OTRAG that promised a modular approach to rocketry. It consisted of simple tubes filled with solid propellants that could be mated together to reach the desired thrust for a very low cost. If I remember well, the OTRAG had a German father and was being developed for Libya, so it had to be stopped for geopolitical reasons.
How about something on the British 'Black Knight; Rocket and the British Space Program as it was before it was abandoned in the 1960's?
What about Project Orion? Nuclear pulse propulsion FTW!
again Amy is beautiful to hear and beautiful to watch. She forces me to learn new things.
Thanks for doing a video on Sea Dragon!
Interesting video. Thanks Amy!
My dad worked on both rocket systems in the 1960'S. Both gemani and Apollo. That's where I learned to shift a 4spd transmission. After he got burned during a test. I was only 6 years old .Great memories.
Wow I learn so much from your presentations. Yes I am so happy for you to have found your path. It's beautiful and divine.
Thanks for the video! I'm working on a 1/96 scale Sea Dragon, and had to rely on the designs and specs from NASA where you pulled the images. It's great to see parts of it in a simplified video.
At 7:20 you mentioned that the total cost of Sea Dragon would be 2.8 billion dollars. Is that adjusted for inflation?
It is.
MrVillabolo I hope so
Yeahh
@HaloLoreNerd Yeah wildlife is probably the reason we are not gonna see a rocket of that size in this time
Hi Amy, please do a video on the High Altitude Research Project. The one with the two battleship guns welded together, aimed at the sky.
The post credits scene brought me here.
Great show! Keep them coming.
Thanks Amy for taking my suggestion about this topic for this episode
Billy Ritchie : But it was really MY suggestion !!
Thanks Vintage Space for covering the Sea Dragon! The massive payload capability and fewer failure points in the use of only one main first stage engine is why I had hoped the Sea Dragon would be mentioned in your fine presentations. It is definitely worth the mention as Mr. Musk intends to produce the Falcon Heavy with DOZENS of First Stage engines and the risky high number of failure point probabilities that go along with it. You have mentioned in other episodes how the Soviets had tried this uber-multiple-engine approach on their N1 with colossal failures!! Thank-you, I think this Sea Dragon concept needed to be seen in thIs era, and you have done your usual splendid job of it! Regards,
Pretty sure I've suggested this too. ;)
The book Great Mambo Chicken and The Transhuman Condition made a big impact on me, though really only the first chapter: Truax.
Truax's cost studies showed that if you want to get to space cheaply, the Shuttle was absolutely doing it wrong.
Smart, beautiful and Canadian. Can it get any better!
Finally, a detailed video on the monster of a rocket! :D
Bet that launch makes one Hell of a wave.
Thanks for the history lesson on the Sea Dragon, loving all the releases as always.
Cue, the Nah sayers..., of course!
Fantastic! Great video!
This was uploaded on my birthday! This is my favorite rocket!
I love it all ready!!! great idea!!
An Astoundingly Superb Science Presentation. Thank You, A.S.T.
Awesome stuff, keep up the great work!
Finallyyy❤ thanks for the upload 👌🚀🚀
Great video. This is such a fascinating idea.
Firstly, I like the shirt.
Secondly, that's an awesome thing. I wish they could have worked more on it. It would have been tough on the local critters, but it gives me some good ideas.
That would be very cool!
What magnificent sight that would be!
I think they should give a serious re-look.
Yay I have been waiting for Seadragon!
Thanks Vintage Space for covering the Sea Dragon! The massive payload capability and fewer failure points in the use of only one main first stage engine is why I had hoped the Sea Dragon would be mentioned in your fine presentations. It is definitely worth the mention as Mr. Musk intends to produce the Falcon Heavy with DOZENS of First Stage engines and the risky high number of failure point probabilities that go along with it. You have mentioned in other episodes how the Soviets had tried this uber-multiple-engine approach on their N1 with colossal failures!! Thank-you, I think the Sea Dragon concept needs to be reviewed in this era, and you have done your usual splendid job of it! Regards,
Good episode
Nice information, enjoyed the episode and subbed.
I love the longer videos.
A video on "Big Gemini" would be cool!
Great Info & research. I have never heard of this rocket.
Amy, you are great!
Yay! \o/ I believe I asked about this before and now you made a video! Woot! Thanks!
Don't get me wrong, the Apollo missions were pretty cool, but when you look at the amount of more sustainable awesome space ideas that cod have been done instead it doesn't really seem worth it to me.
Also they could have used the sea dragon to get to the moon.
@@alwynwatson6119 Yeah, but... it's a bit of a waste of resources when you're only sending an Apollo spacecraft. Not to mention the fact that the Apollo moonshot was supposed to be a crash program that got done quickly and was over with, not a sustainable way to space that would work for years to come (they only really cared about beating the Soviets and getting it done before the end of the decade,) and the Sea Dragon does not fit that description.
Great presentation! This made me remember seeing a video for a similar project from the 2000s. A little googling revealed that it was a Space Systems/Loral project called Aquarius. It turns out Aeroject was also a partner on the project!
Kid, I just love it whenever you dig deep into the archives.
Wouldn't it be great if someone were to make a full sized replica of this monster using inflatable elements? That would be inspiring.
This is brilliant. 1963!?! Wow.
Such a cool name. I find it interesting that they were throwing around "dragon" for spacecraft names that long before SpaceEx started naming things "dragon"
0:28 - OK call me pedantic, but it's truly great to see 'its' spelled properly, without the spurious apostrophe it so often gets!
Great Video !!!
Thanks for clarifying the Coles Notes. I've heard you say it a few times before and thought you said "cold notes".
JeffDM She didn't clarify it enough for this non-American non-Canadian to understand what it is about though...
@@bennylofgren3208 Yeah, that’s an old question but…
Hi Benny, Coles Notes/CliffsNotes are student study guides published in North America. Coles notes were invented and published in Canada by the Coles brothers (owners of Coles Books, the largest bookseller in Canada at the time) in 1948.
In 1958 they sold the US rights to a fellow by the name of Cliff Hillegass, who published them in the United States under the CliffsNotes name.
I kept imagining it was a Saturn V rocket. You tell me not to push the button, I'm going to push the button
As a space enthusiast who grew up with Apollo, I can't believe I never heard of Sea Dragon before. I honestly thought the writing team at "For All Mankind" had dreamed it up. Wow, what an amazing super-heavy lift vehicle that would have been.
I love you space girl you are my hero ! why ? cause you put two of my favorite topics together : lovely ladies like you , and rocket tech history !!
I thought I was a classic old NASA Nerd, and I never even heard of the Sea Dragon! Awesome stuff!
Amazing video !
The Sea Dragon is probably one of my favorite rocket, it's a shame it was never built...
It wouldn't have worked, if it was built. That engine is just ridiculous. Combustion instability and oscillations would have ripped it to shreds.
That would a great thing to watch launch.
45 sec in & I've already subscribed this video is well done.
As an engineer, I like the simplicity and elegance of this. The simplest possible thing that does the job. I've seen two approaches to this, both starting with an extremely simple design, from which they either go "more" or "bigger." This is the "bigger" approach, scaling it up to the absurd, but theoretically works. The other is "more," where they take a simple, proven, reliable mass-producible base unit, in this case it would be a relatively basic booster, and strap a large number of them together. Even if any one were to fail, the rocket as a whole could be built to complete the mission with a few failed units. Both these designs sound like what a little kid might draw if you asked them to draw a moon rocket, either something huge and simple or a massive bundle of simple units - and they are right, for they haven't been muddled by education and conventional wisdom. They don't overthink a problem because they don't know enough to do so, so they come up with something absurdly simple, which in the end is genius.
And then there's project Orion... probably the most American idea ever conceived.
Propulsion of spacecraft with nuclear bombs. Yep. Nukes. The funny thing? The damn thing would actually *work*!
Learn the damnest stuff on here on I never heard of before! Well done!
As always very professional. I call this #AmysWertarbeit . Keep moving, Papageitaucher. Wish you good luuuccckkk :))))))
Who doesn't love the good old "Big Dumb Booster" concept?
Yes, Orion and the early ideas for the different space suits. I saw one in the museum in Florida that had steel armor!
Hey, Amy! You should make a video about Von Braun's circular space station and ferry rocket.
Very Good !
Thanks so much. I requested this a while back. Suck an amazing rocket this would have been!
Cool, been waiting for you to tackle Sea Dragon for a while!
I thought only the first stage was planned to be reusable. Did you read the full report from 1963? I have only found two out of three parts.
The Sea Dragon is still genius that is usable today! Simplicity is often the best way to work missions. We need to keep this timeless technology available. I'm sure it could be built more cheaply these days.
>Sea Dragon video
aww yesss
Sea dragon becomes a plot point on For all Mankind. We get to see it realized. I always knew Sea Dragon as a footnote in development of heavy lift rockets, so nice to see it have it's moment in the sun.
Good video
Take a look into the Sea Serpent being developed by Ripple Aerospace - it's pretty much this.
Loved this one!!!!! Any room for ion propulsion vids in the Vintage Space toy box? I think they were tested in the '60's. Not your standard fare but hopefully still vintage.
"That's why they put it in the sea Karen."
Thank you.
Just saw Amy on 'Impossible Engineering' (which it obviously isn't!) Talking about the Saturn V!
Great video. I never knew Sea Dragon was a thing. Aerojet also tried to develop large solid rocket boosters. Have you done a video about the Aerojet-Dade rocket facility?
It's in the end credits of the season finale of "For All Mankind"!
OMG ITS THE SEA DRAGON LAVIANTHAN!
Awesome!
Awesome as always, but, are you OK Amy? You seem sooooooo tired... You know better, but you might just got us a little bit worried. Luv! Fans from far