One thing I would add, as I didn’t notice you mention it, is to check for runout in the ejector rod. With the cylinder swung open, spin the cylinder and look for a wobble in the ejector rod, there shouldn’t be any. Wobble here is typically caused by flipping the gun to let momentum forcibly close the cylinder...not a good thing. In the event you have a gun that needs this addressed, Larry Potterfield at Midway USA has a video on how to correct this.
Totally agree... Roll my eyes every time I see someone do this. Creates stress on the pistol and is not faster, epically if the cylinder does not lock in the first try. Good point.
Great video! Just what I’ve been looking for! After shooting plastic guns and other semis for almost 40 years now. Recently started falling in love with the older (used) wheel guns. Fortunate enough to have the money to pretty much buy whatever I want, but knowing very little about them mechanically, makes me a prime target to over pay. Very well presented. Thanks again!
If you have all that $$ you SAY you hBe then don't be complaining about over paying... Also watch out for guys like me who will rob you after hearing you brag about having $$ like that
Me too, I’m Almost 22. Tired of everyone looking at me like im an idiot. I know what im talking about. I’m also not afraid to admit when I don’t. But other people see I dropped my ego and they can’t play games with me and I know that upsets them.
The first gun I purchased was a Smith 586 back in the early 80s. Thousands of rounds and a few years later it still passes the tests in your video. Thanks much for sharing your expertise.
This was incredibly informative. Very unpretentious. Coming from someone who has just about no idea on where to start with revolvers, this was very valuable. Thanks!
Great instruction. Thanks for giving us your time with straight forward instruction and no long winded yap yap about everything but what we're trying to learn.
As soon as you dropped the hammer and trigger still pulled back and checked lock up i was impressed. I was taught that some years ago. Your the first one to demo that . Most only ck it un-cocked and then cocked, but dont lower the hammer and cked Gteat demo.
My gunsmith has made recommendations in the past on what revolvers are a good buy based on availability of spare parts for a shooter. The last revolver I bought, a 586 4". Over the years someone had shortened trigger rebound spring by cutting loops, the chambers of the cylinder were out of sync with the barrel. He made the necessary repairs. He warned me away from vintage Python if I was looking for a shooter due to lack of spare parts and complexity of re-assembly. Good advise.
I see that this video is 5 years old...but it's great information. All I own and carry are revolvers. I very much enjoy when someone takes the time to relay information about them. Thank you for what you do.
Thank you so much for this excellently presented and educational video. My edc for the past 6 years next month is a Smith and Wesson 442 (no lock), and I absolutely love it. My Holy Grail gun is a Smith and Wesson Model 10 Snub Nose.
I resently learn about a forcing cone alignment reem tool sold by "Brownells". It's a kit with all the necessary parts to correct any irregularities of the forcing cone angle. The guy that showed before and after target test results it made a difference. He explains the same thing Your saying about led building up because the bullet isn't going straight through the cone , this also causes a slight wobble affect down the barrel which causes poor groups. There are only two companies I've heard of that through bore the cylinder down the barrel for perfect alignment, one in France, the other is US American Manufacturing company , if I remember correctly. Thanks for sharing your hobby 🤠
Great info here...unfortunately trying to buy a revolver, or any type of gun for that matter, is just a ridiculous process in today’s world. Everything is WAY overpriced!
It’s called inflation. We had everything cost more: homes, cars, guns, food. The reality is in that we need to learn and earn more and more to keep the same level of comfort. Actually it always was like that.
Good vid David, informative and presented with the intelligence and maturity that comes from someone who has lived a while on this here planet. I too am a revolver guy. I love shooting them and then taking them home and cleaning them up fresh again, all done with a lot of love. About gun screws........I think everybody that owns any firearm with a screw on it should also own a gunsmith style screwdriver set, PERIOD !!! They are not expensive. For all you nubees out there reading this, DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT use your mechanical screw drivers on ANY of your firearms. If you want an explanation why this is so, talk to a knowledgeable gun guy at your favorite gun store. He/she will fill you in.
Doug Prominski That is such an excellent point regarding the screwdrivers. One can get a set of gun smithing screwdrivers with hollow ground tips for a lot less than the value you will erode from your fire arm when you booger up a screw.
@@drdrake63 you say hollow tips, seems weak so not getting the image. What makes them better for the application?? Picture maybe in use if you have an opportunity to. Thanks for your well played out videos they are some of the best out there. Maybe they break before jumping and ruining or scratching/ gouging your firearm??
Are you the Dave Drake who worked at Rolla Sporting Goods in Missouri back around 1980? If you are you completely redone an 1873 Winchester for me. I am still amazed and proud of the job you did. It still looks amazing and beautiful. Thank you. I knew then you would go far and do well in the gun trade.
I have a colt police revolver from 1945 .38 spl with 5 inch barrel well over a hundred years old and still shoots smooth and straight and unexpectedly accurate too...Grandfather's revolver might be old school but that thing still works like the day it was first brought...Alot of barrel marks and holster wear on the outside but rifling and cylinders everything is still in mint condition just needs a polish
Great video! The more I understand and learn about revolvers, the more I realize that revolvers are not "simpler" or necessarily more reliable than a good auto like a Sig or Glock. With all the internal linkages and required tight alignment of all those moving parts in a revolver makes me feel more comfortable with a semiauto. My Glock has fewer moving parts than a revolver for sure and always has perfect barrel lockup and alignment! I still love my revolvers though.
My 'smith looks for a gap of between .003", which is the minimum tolerance to still function with leading building up in the gap, to .006", which is optimal. .008" is getting up there but does not necessarily mean the gun needs help. Most guns will behave just fine regarding lateral flash and shedding out the gap. If you have a revolver that tends to tighten up a bit during the latter periods of a long shooting session, a minimal gap may be the reason as the fouling thickens. A quick bristle brushing will often loosen things right up.
This is a very informative and educational video. I am very familiar with revolvers but you have shown me a few things I didn't think about when it comes to owning a revolver.
Another good reason for end play is errosion of the forcing cone which occurs if there has been a bunch of rounds put through the firearm and the only fix is to replace the forcing cone and that's expensive.
Great video! The only other thing to check would be removing the grips and checking to see if there’s any rust or pitting under the grips, as these areas are often not cleaned regularly. Thanks for sharing.
EXCELLENT!! Although I already knew most of what you said. I’m saving your video as a refresher every time I’m on the verge of wheeling and dealing for another S&W revolver. While Backpage was still active I preyed upon the young’uns that inherited dad or grandpa’s S&W that was anxious to trade it away for a plastic fantastic Wonder Nine.
Rather informative video, a few technical inaccuracies, but overall well done. The measurement reading errors were previously pointed out, a couple nomenclature errors, that “click” you sometimes feel when shooting double action is always there, you just don’t always notice it (that’s the cylinder bolt “falling” into its locking slot on the cylinder, it’s ALWAYS there). “Stacking”is the term given to describe how smoothly & evenly the spring tension increases (mainly on the hammer spring) as you pull the trigger in double action (it’s a term commonly referenced in archery when describing how “smoothly” a traditional bows can be drawn) Good info 👍
I have a new S&W 460 XVR with about 100 rounds shot thru it. The cylinder lockup is good. I have shavings, or lead spray, every time I shoot 5 rounds or every full capacity of the cylinder. I never knew about this term before. Thanks Dave.
Looking up S&W history and why certain perks were done to the revolver it became an interesting adventure .. I own a model 17 K-masterpiece that i have owned for years and it has the pinned barrel .. I also own a model 19 which has a pinned barrel also.. Added Cost was the biggest thing and the shooting public complained about $4.00 for this , and $3.50 for that task and so forth ( which is why the triple lock became a hard sell )..My old model 28 has a counter bored cylinder and pinned barrel , so it's more machine steps and takes longer to finish the gun.. I have myself and others have had it happen to them, some makes of brass even though it falls into SAMMI spec's won't fit the counter bore and drop in the cylinder all the way..I have also found this true with Feedom Arms revolvers too and more so kind of picky in my book, while at the range one day i had a box of Federal loaded brass and almost none would drop in the cylinder So i switched brass to loads i had using Starline brass and they all dropped in..The other thing i read was complaints from owners about this problem, S&W said the counter bored area must be clean of all deposits at all times , difficult cylinder rotation at times because one or two cases was thicker on rim measurement... That and the deposit built up on the face of the frame made cylinder rotation hard at times too..I've shot with fellows who would after a box of 50 rounds , open the cylinder and wipe off the face of the frame and was good to go once more ..so there were drawbacks with that ..Who would have known that these features all these years later those guns would command the price they get for them.. a triple lock 5 screw , last time i looked at prices oh ya i would have to take my banker along with me to buy one...
@@fabyanserrano00 There are several excellent history books on S&W history ! Standard catalog of Smith & Wesson is excellent! Also Roy Jinks has authored several books , all excellent history ! The excellent Blue Book of Gun Values is a must to have also !
Very informative thank you .... I finally understand about the canted barrel ... I sent one gun back to smith for that reason ... I don't believe to pay this kind of money for a less than perfect gun.
Points to consider as well, not covered: a hairline crack on the forcing cone hidden by carbon deposits as a result of overloaded ammo with higher than SAAMI specs and fixed by a new barrel. Also, a failed hammer push off test indicating the sear surfaces on the hammer and or trigger that have excessive wear which allows the hammer to fall without the trigger being pulled. This is a MAJOR SAFETY ISSUE. The fix is to have the surfaces professionally restored on the appropriate fixture (not a hand file with a vise) if there is enough metal allowing for this, or to buy a new hammer/trigger or both from the factory.
Thank you for the information on the Smith & Wesson revolvers with pin barrels that explains why they are straight extremely accurate. Thank you again.
It's your gun, do as you wish. That said...Colt Trooper MKIII, yes you can get parts for them from places like Numrich. The MKIII action was designed to be safe to dry fire. It has a transfer bar and the hammer face falls directly on the solid frame. The transfer bar imparts the hammer energy to the frame mounted, spring loaded firing pin. The MKIII is a hell of a tough and durable revolver, though not as finely tuned as the older (pre-1969) Colt's. I carried one (nickel plated 4") as a police officer from 1973-1988 when our department went to 9mm autoloaders. I still have the gun (we had to buy our own revolvers at that time) and it is working perfectly to this day. It has been dry fired countless times. It cost $154 in 1973. I still have the box and receipt for it. That was a lot of money in 1973. The Python, at that time, was WAY EXPENSIVE...at a retail price of $250!
Great information even if it's a refresher for me and thanks for the George Thorogood & The Delaware Destroyers on your intro bumper. It makes me like your channel even more.
I really enjoy all your videos and very much respect your experience and judgement. That said, the difference between 0.004 and, roughly, 0.007 and 0.008 is three and a half one thousandths, not three and a half one hundredths. One nunber is, of course, ten times as large as the other, a difference that an engineer or machinist would probably deem tooooo large. Though not always. Once, decades ago in chemistry class, I showed my answer, "x" x10^27, to the professor, whose answer was "y" x 10^28. He looked at my work and said, "You came within an order of magnitude. That's close enough," and marked it correct. The lesson I took was: all things are relative, including measurements. Good to keep in mind when the Instant Recall doesn't go your team's way.
Thanks David! I own semi autos as well as "wheel" guns! I use my 5 shot Chiefs Special as my every day carry and truck gun! This information will be used upon my next revolver purchase! Much appreciated!
I check for lock-up, on each cylinder, by inserting a range rod down the barrel, checking each cylinder. The most accurate means of checking for timing and lock-up.
Two things I like about my Taurus Model 65 It has a wound spring so the trigger is perfect The Cylinder does not rely on the shell ejector to lock in place ! You can't check the lock up on a Taurus like that, although if you did you would find it tight. To teast my lock up I pull the trigger all the way back and release it slowly, the point of lock up should be just before the hammer hits the firing pin. It's kind of a no brain'r you know.
I'm OCD when it comes to having perfect screw heads on my guns, I don't want to be "Bubba" Lol. What's funny is my brand new S&W revolver actually came straight from the S&W factory with chewed up screws! I know it was new because the SN# manufacture date was just 2 weeks old from my date of purchase, and I bought it straight from a reputable gun dealer. Anyway I got brand new side plate screws from S&W and put them in MYSELF, using the correct drivers. Now it's perfect!
David-------this was excellent, I really learned a lot, some things to look at...........my wife gave me the green light for a new 357................probably going with your 586...........have a nice night brother
I don't ask my wife permission for anything. In fact I used to get mad about her wasting money, now if she does I just buy another firearm. So if she wastes money I win, if she doesn't, I still win. She wanted a camper (I hate camping), I just got a huge grin on my face. We do not own a camper...😉
Good, even excellent point on 'lockup'. Forcing Cone is that section of the barrel, next to the cylinder which is tapered (very slightly) to allow all cylinders to 'line up' with the bore. One can think of the function as a "bullet funnel". Cylinder gap should be obtained from the maker. One doesn't want the front of the cylinder to rub or scrap on the rear of the barrel and must not be so loose to lose velocity and 'spit' either shavings or little particles of burning powder to the side. @ c 20:00, the S&W five shot revolver has not been carried in a holster for any appreciable time. Holster wear occurs on the sides of the muzzle end of the barrel and on the leading edges of the cylinder. The revolver shown has likely been kept in a case or drawer most of it's 'life'. That storage may explain the discoloration on the right frame panel. To a collector, any discoloration is negative. For a shooter, it will not weaken the firearm. But it is a valid bargaining chip. The flawless finish on the 28-2 is likely due to it not being used much. Stored carefully, but it has no signs of being in a holster for any length of time. The screw head pointed out does come from using the wrong screw driver. One notes however, the damage was done removing the screw, not screwing it in too tightly. I must confess I have marred a number of screw heads. I do pretty good work on the insides, and I don't mess up screws any more. In the interest of one's own peace of mind check function and such to see if the inner workings have been damaged. @ 27:00 the Colt pistol has the classic holster wear on the muzzle of the barrel. It comes from the holster rubbing on the inside of the holster when being inserted or drawn. Doesn't hurt functioning, negative to a collector. (Not disqualifying, but a demerit.) The finish on the 28 is 'blueing'. It is a matte or dull finish, but it's the same chemical process as on the Colt. The only difference is the Colt Trooper is finished better externally. They will both loose finish for the same reasons. However, mechanically the 28 (being a Smith&Wesson) is designed and built (in those days) much better for use. Finishes were rather limited. Alterations: Since I shoot double action only, I tend to remove the spur - cocking piece - on the hammer. If that to you is an alien concept, pass on it. Once I found a large frame S&W revolver in .45 ACP caliber. The original owner cut the barrel off and remounted the front sight. I find the trigger delightful and suspect a proper mechanic did some smoothing. A collector would have passed as the revolver was altered. It is in the other room as it suits me just fine. If one understands, finds the alteration acceptable and suits the mission for the arm, go for it.
I have a colt python 6 incher since 1985 it function so well up to now by s n' w thank you so much for this vid now i'm learning a lot and now i have a 38.spl. 2 incher....thanx again from tokyo,japan too hard to carry a gun here.....
@@Tread505 it's 3.5 thousandths (if you don't believe me try .0075-.004 on your calculator) and BTW - .0075 > .004; .007 >.004, the extra .0005 only makes .007 larger, not by much but larger none-the-less (everyone knows that 007 > 004 ;-) )
Lock up with the trigger pulled is a Colt test. It means nothing on a Smith and Wesson. Excessive side to side play means the cylinder stop, or the cylinder notches are worn.
A useful video, thanks! One suggestion, if you decide to do an update some time... maybe the most important safety check: can you push off the cocked hammer?
i LOVE THE S&W 44 MAGNUM built with alloy and titanium. It is so easy to shoot and lightweight!!! 💖 I see no point in wearing yourself out with a heavy gun when you can do the exact same thing a heavy gun does with a lightweight!!!
I want a medium sized 3 inch or less barrel. I'm really lost. I don't like the idea of having the lock. I love these old shiny ones, but the modern performance styles are also tempting. Idk. First wheel gun. For the car. Not too small
Dan Caron I have a GP100 I picked up in the 90’s. The thing is a tank. Mine is a 4” stainless .357 Magnum. I prefer the triggers on the Smith’s; but, the GP100 is an affordable alternative. I also have a Smith 66-1 K frame from the ‘70’s. . For that one, I prefer not to put full load .357 through it too much. Pretty much stick to .38 Special loads for that one.
Dan Caron, I've been trying to decide between the GP100 & the 686 smith, could you say why you chose the Ruger over any other? Personally I'm all about Ruger but Smith & Wesson makes a great gun too. I've heard them GP100'S Are a beast and you can shoot many rounds at once without any trouble.
M. Clark both of them can handle a heavy load. The GP100 was affordable for me at the time. I prefer the triggers on the S&W. You really can’t go wrong with either; but, there are a couple primary differences. 1. The Ruger frame is cast, as apposed to the the forged frame on the S&W. The grip on the S&W is full tang. The Ruger uses a wrap around grip insert over the main spring assembly, rather than a full frame grip. The S&W also has side plates you can remove to work on the internals. The Ruger doesn’t. Both are great revolvers in any case.
They over torque that screw because it is the arm retention and it is a common problem on all brand names that this screw loosens. Rather than to bust it up, it's better just to always keep your eye on it. My opinion of course : )
P.S. You forgot to mention timing. IF it's not timed right you could loose a hand or more bodily damage. Most won't even fire. Timing is when the cylinder bore rotates around and isn't exactly inline with the bore.
First grip the cylinder lightly pull hammer back wiggle cylinder if it clicks don't buy the gun. I used to see this failed lockup in new SWs. Even had a new one blow up which is common with unique powder you can't overload Hercules 2400.
I don’t think I’ve ever stood next to a magnum (22mag, 327mag, 357mag, 41mag or 44mag) revolver and not gotten hit with stuff. S&W, Ruger, Taurus and Colt. In the .357 magnum guns there’s no problems with .38spl and hitting my neighbors or getting hit standing next to the same gun. Same with .44spl. It’s all about the pressure of the round. I say this assuming the revolver times correctly and doesn’t have excessive rotational play of the cylinder.
Sonny Gunz : ALL revolvers will do that, it’s not a “sealed,” or “one piece” chamber/ barrel (has nothing to do with being a “magnum”). What you’re feeling isn’t bullet shavings, that’s “powder spray.” That cylinder gap (gap between cylinder & forcing cone) is an opening where hot powder gasses are clearly going to escape, and if you’re beside the revolver, you’ll may feel it (some “spray” out enough you can feel it, some don’t, but they ALL do it). A bullet-saving is a little piece os shrapnel, if that hits you it’ll be painful & likely draw blood. So don’t be alarmed if you’re standing by a revolver shooter & feel something when the gun is fired
I read about it when I was looking into reloading for my Smith 460, and that revolver can do some flame cutting with the right powder or should I say wrong powder.
The mis-alligned barrel (clocked) is a well documented issue with S&W units lately and S&W will not fix unless WAY off stating that they are "within tolerances".
Another issue with Smith and wesson is their sd40ve automatic pistol is for those who reload the brass bulges out just above the base of the cartridge side when fired, I returned the new pistol to be fixed, I then called them and was told they were aware of the issue but usually they don't fix them just return to customer but in my case, they replaced a part but upon return, it still bulged the case, I had told them I have never owned a gun which did so, I told them I reload, their answer was they dont recommend reloading brass, I figure the barrels were cut too deep where the ejector was thus causing this issue, I told them if I got it back and it still bulged out the cases. I would not buy another S&W. Their quality has gotten to the same quality and control of cheap pistol manufacturers, S&W use to make quality pistols, not anymore! Taurus makes a better pistol than S&W.
@@robertbradley8972 Yeah I would never buy any new Smith & Wesson revolvers today so I'll whole lot rather take my time and invest in the vintage revolvers which are a lot more fun to shoot and the quality is way better and a lot more accurate at least mine are true tack drivers !!! In other words I'de rather spend $700 to $1200 on any vintage near mint Smith & Wesson or Colt revolvers with box or not !!!
A very informative video good sir. I really like how you took your time to explain many aspects the of revolver. I didn’t see any Rugers in your collection, and was wondering why. As for revolvers with wear and maybe slight pitting, I personally like leaving them wrapped in a slightly oiled rag/shop towel (the cleaning towel) just to make sure they have a slightly oiled barrier. But overall good sir, a great video. Thank you
I didn't know that you are supposed to check cylinder lockup by keeping the trigger pulled back after releasing the hammer. I don't see how this is any different than doing it without the trigger pulled. I would think that cocked hammer lockup would be the most important. However, I am new to revolvers and not a gunsmith. But I am interested in learning why it is done this way.
Great helpful video! One question... How could you tell when your Colt was made? I've got an old Colt similar to yours and I'd love to know when it was made.
![АЛАУДИНОВ у Скабеевой: эти их ВСУ нас НЕ ДОГОНЯТ 😁 [Пародия]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/an0anqU4WGQ/mqdefault.jpg)
One thing I would add, as I didn’t notice you mention it, is to check for runout in the ejector rod. With the cylinder swung open, spin the cylinder and look for a wobble in the ejector rod, there shouldn’t be any. Wobble here is typically caused by flipping the gun to let momentum forcibly close the cylinder...not a good thing. In the event you have a gun that needs this addressed, Larry Potterfield at Midway USA has a video on how to correct this.
Needed this info on why, thanks 🤘🤞🤙💯
Totally agree... Roll my eyes every time I see someone do this. Creates stress on the pistol and is not faster, epically if the cylinder does not lock in the first try. Good point.
Great video! Just what I’ve been looking for! After shooting plastic guns and other semis for almost 40 years now. Recently started falling in love with the older (used) wheel guns. Fortunate enough to have the money to pretty much buy whatever I want, but knowing very little about them mechanically, makes me a prime target to over pay. Very well presented. Thanks again!
If you have all that $$ you SAY you hBe then don't be complaining about over paying... Also watch out for guys like me who will rob you after hearing you brag about having $$ like that
@@shanescatsandcannabisfarm2965you wouldn’t rob anything from these guys but the ammo from inside their guns.
Me too, I’m Almost 22. Tired of everyone looking at me like im an idiot. I know what im talking about. I’m also not afraid to admit when I don’t. But other people see I dropped my ego and they can’t play games with me and I know that upsets them.
The first gun I purchased was a Smith 586 back in the early 80s. Thousands of rounds and a few years later it still passes the tests in your video. Thanks much for sharing your expertise.
Very informative. I needed this to buy a revolver. There is one thing .003 is three thousandths not hundredths, just a slip of the tongue good info.
This was incredibly informative. Very unpretentious. Coming from someone who has just about no idea on where to start with revolvers, this was very valuable. Thanks!
Don't rely on any single source for this information.
Jim Gray I agree
Great instruction. Thanks for giving us your time with straight forward instruction and no long winded yap yap about everything but what we're trying to learn.
As soon as you dropped the hammer and trigger still pulled back and checked lock up i was impressed. I was taught that some years ago. Your the first one to demo that . Most only ck it un-cocked and then cocked, but dont lower the hammer and cked
Gteat demo.
My gunsmith has made recommendations in the past on what revolvers are a good buy based on availability of spare parts for a shooter.
The last revolver I bought, a 586 4". Over the years someone had shortened trigger rebound spring by cutting loops, the chambers of the cylinder were out of sync with the barrel. He made the necessary repairs.
He warned me away from vintage Python if I was looking for a shooter due to lack of spare parts and complexity of re-assembly.
Good advise.
About to buy my first gun/revolver this weekend. This video is gonna be my checklist. Thank you.
I see that this video is 5 years old...but it's great information. All I own and carry are revolvers. I very much enjoy when someone takes the time to relay information about them. Thank you for what you do.
Thank you so much for this excellently presented and educational video. My edc for the past 6 years next month is a Smith and Wesson 442 (no lock), and I absolutely love it. My Holy Grail gun is a Smith and Wesson Model 10 Snub Nose.
I resently learn about a forcing cone alignment reem tool sold by "Brownells". It's a kit with all the necessary parts to correct any irregularities of the forcing cone angle. The guy that showed before and after target test results it made a difference. He explains the same thing Your saying about led building up because the bullet isn't going straight through the cone , this also causes a slight wobble affect down the barrel which causes poor groups. There are only two companies I've heard of that through bore the cylinder down the barrel for perfect alignment, one in France, the other is US American Manufacturing company , if I remember correctly. Thanks for sharing your hobby 🤠
Accurate, straightforward advice for the novice looking for a good double action used revolver. Good job sir.
My favorite is my grandpa's .38 special Smith and Wesson snub nose revolver
Great info here...unfortunately trying to buy a revolver, or any type of gun for that matter, is just a ridiculous process in today’s world. Everything is WAY overpriced!
Two years ago a S & W .38 Airweight style revolver was $349. Today $547. The ammo? 3X more right now.
@@harperhellems3648 yep, don’t see any changes coming either, hope you’ve been all stocked up!
It’s called inflation. We had everything cost more: homes, cars, guns, food. The reality is in that we need to learn and earn more and more to keep the same level of comfort. Actually it always was like that.
@@usrenaem Well, I’m glad you seem to be ok with it! I think it’s gone way overboard.
@@usrenaemjust be content with what you have
Good vid David, informative and presented with the intelligence and maturity that comes from someone who has lived a while on this here planet. I too am a revolver guy. I love shooting them and then taking them home and cleaning them up fresh again, all done with a lot of love. About gun screws........I think everybody that owns any firearm with a screw on it should also own a gunsmith style screwdriver set, PERIOD !!! They are not expensive. For all you nubees out there reading this, DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT use your mechanical screw drivers on ANY of your firearms. If you want an explanation why this is so, talk to a knowledgeable gun guy at your favorite gun store. He/she will fill you in.
Doug Prominski That is such an excellent point regarding the screwdrivers. One can get a set of gun smithing screwdrivers with hollow ground tips for a lot less than the value you will erode from your fire arm when you booger up a screw.
That goes for fine watches as well
@@drdrake63 you say hollow tips, seems weak so not getting the image. What makes them better for the application?? Picture maybe in use if you have an opportunity to. Thanks for your well played out videos they are some of the best out there. Maybe they break before jumping and ruining or scratching/ gouging your firearm??
Are you the Dave Drake who worked at Rolla Sporting Goods in Missouri back around 1980? If you are you completely redone an 1873 Winchester for me. I am still amazed and proud of the job you did. It still looks amazing and beautiful. Thank you. I knew then you would go far and do well in the gun trade.
Bryan Baldwin not me, but I am from Missouri and I went to school in Rolla
I have a colt police revolver from 1945 .38 spl with 5 inch barrel well over a hundred years old and still shoots smooth and straight and unexpectedly accurate too...Grandfather's revolver might be old school but that thing still works like the day it was first brought...Alot of barrel marks and holster wear on the outside but rifling and cylinders everything is still in mint condition just needs a polish
Great video! The more I understand and learn about revolvers, the more I realize that revolvers are not "simpler" or necessarily more reliable than a good auto like a Sig or Glock. With all the internal linkages and required tight alignment of all those moving parts in a revolver makes me feel more comfortable with a semiauto. My Glock has fewer moving parts than a revolver for sure and always has perfect barrel lockup and alignment! I still love my revolvers though.
When you check the bore, use a piece of white paper against the back of the frame and it will show the condition of the barrel very clearly.
My 'smith looks for a gap of between .003", which is the minimum tolerance to still function with leading building up in the gap, to .006", which is optimal. .008" is getting up there but does not necessarily mean the gun needs help. Most guns will behave just fine regarding lateral flash and shedding out the gap. If you have a revolver that tends to tighten up a bit during the latter periods of a long shooting session, a minimal gap may be the reason as the fouling thickens. A quick bristle brushing will often loosen things right up.
This is a very informative and educational video. I am very familiar with revolvers but you have shown me a few things I didn't think about when it comes to owning a revolver.
Another good reason for end play is errosion of the forcing cone which occurs if there has been a bunch of rounds put through the firearm and the only fix is to replace the forcing cone and that's expensive.
Great video!
The only other thing to check would be removing the grips and checking to see if there’s any rust or pitting under the grips, as these areas are often not cleaned regularly.
Thanks for sharing.
EXCELLENT!! Although I already knew most of what you said. I’m saving your video as a refresher every time I’m on the verge of wheeling and dealing for another S&W revolver. While Backpage was still active I preyed upon the young’uns that inherited dad or grandpa’s S&W that was anxious to trade it away for a plastic fantastic Wonder Nine.
G-Locks are still highly reliable lol
And they're polymer 😏😎
Still love my chief special 38 though🤘💯
Rather informative video, a few technical inaccuracies, but overall well done. The measurement reading errors were previously pointed out, a couple nomenclature errors, that “click” you sometimes feel when shooting double action is always there, you just don’t always notice it (that’s the cylinder bolt “falling” into its locking slot on the cylinder, it’s ALWAYS there).
“Stacking”is the term given to describe how smoothly & evenly the spring tension increases (mainly on the hammer spring) as you pull the trigger in double action (it’s a term commonly referenced in archery when describing how “smoothly” a traditional bows can be drawn)
Good info 👍
I need a video like this for single action/ gated. This is still very informative. Thank you sir.
Andrew Brown I’m glad to help. I’m sure there’s plenty I left off too.
I have a new S&W 460 XVR with about 100 rounds shot thru it. The cylinder lockup is good. I have shavings, or lead spray, every time I shoot 5 rounds or every full capacity of the cylinder. I never knew about this term before. Thanks Dave.
Looking up S&W history and why certain perks were done to the revolver it became an interesting adventure .. I own a model 17 K-masterpiece that i have owned for years and it has the pinned barrel .. I also own a model 19 which has a pinned barrel also.. Added Cost was the biggest thing and the shooting public complained about $4.00 for this , and $3.50 for that task and so forth ( which is why the triple lock became a hard sell )..My old model 28 has a counter bored cylinder and pinned barrel , so it's more machine steps and takes longer to finish the gun.. I have myself and others have had it happen to them, some makes of brass even though it falls into SAMMI spec's won't fit the counter bore and drop in the cylinder all the way..I have also found this true with Feedom Arms revolvers too and more so kind of picky in my book, while at the range one day i had a box of Federal loaded brass and almost none would drop in the cylinder So i switched brass to loads i had using Starline brass and they all dropped in..The other thing i read was complaints from owners about this problem, S&W said the counter bored area must be clean of all deposits at all times , difficult cylinder rotation at times because one or two cases was thicker on rim measurement... That and the deposit built up on the face of the frame made cylinder rotation hard at times too..I've shot with fellows who would after a box of 50 rounds , open the cylinder and wipe off the face of the frame and was good to go once more ..so there were drawbacks with that ..Who would have known that these features all these years later those guns would command the price they get for them.. a triple lock 5 screw , last time i looked at prices oh ya i would have to take my banker along with me to buy one...
😂
The fact i barely understand what the fuck you're talking about makes me more interested in learning.
@@fabyanserrano00 There are several excellent history books on S&W history !
Standard catalog of Smith & Wesson is excellent!
Also Roy Jinks has authored several books , all excellent history !
The excellent Blue Book of Gun Values is a must to have also !
Very informative thank you .... I finally understand about the canted barrel ... I sent one gun back to smith for that reason ... I don't believe to pay this kind of money for a less than perfect gun.
Very useful and well presented information on revolvers, thank you.
Points to consider as well, not covered: a hairline crack on the forcing cone hidden by carbon deposits as a result of overloaded ammo with higher than SAAMI specs and fixed by a new barrel. Also, a failed hammer push off test indicating the sear surfaces on the hammer and or trigger that have excessive wear which allows the hammer to fall without the trigger being pulled. This is a MAJOR SAFETY ISSUE. The fix is to have the surfaces professionally restored on the appropriate fixture (not a hand file with a vise) if there is enough metal allowing for this, or to buy a new hammer/trigger or both from the factory.
👍👍
Thank you for the information on the Smith & Wesson revolvers with pin barrels that explains why they are straight extremely accurate. Thank you again.
It's your gun, do as you wish.
That said...Colt Trooper MKIII, yes you can get parts for them from places like Numrich. The MKIII action was designed to be safe to dry fire. It has a transfer bar and the hammer face falls directly on the solid frame. The transfer bar imparts the hammer energy to the frame mounted, spring loaded firing pin. The MKIII is a hell of a tough and durable revolver, though not as finely tuned as the older (pre-1969) Colt's. I carried one (nickel plated 4") as a police officer from 1973-1988 when our department went to 9mm autoloaders. I still have the gun (we had to buy our own revolvers at that time) and it is working perfectly to this day. It has been dry fired countless times. It cost $154 in 1973. I still have the box and receipt for it.
That was a lot of money in 1973. The Python, at that time, was WAY EXPENSIVE...at a retail price of $250!
Great information even if it's a refresher for me and thanks for the George Thorogood & The Delaware Destroyers on your intro bumper. It makes me like your channel even more.
That's "You got to lose"
@@seandonovan4186 Written & first recorded by Earl Hooker
Thank you for showing me what to look for when evaluating a Revolver.
I really enjoy all your videos and very much respect your experience and judgement. That said, the difference between 0.004 and, roughly, 0.007 and 0.008 is three and a half one thousandths, not three and a half one hundredths. One nunber is, of course, ten times as large as the other, a difference that an engineer or machinist would probably deem tooooo large. Though not always. Once, decades ago in chemistry class, I showed my answer, "x" x10^27, to the professor, whose answer was "y" x 10^28. He looked at my work and said, "You came within an order of magnitude. That's close enough," and marked it correct.
The lesson I took was: all things are relative, including measurements. Good to keep in mind when the Instant Recall doesn't go your team's way.
Thanks David! I own semi autos as well as "wheel" guns! I use my 5 shot Chiefs Special as my every day carry and truck gun! This information will be used upon my next revolver purchase! Much appreciated!
Very useful video! As one who is somewhat new to handguns I found it quite informative.
I check for lock-up, on each cylinder, by inserting a range rod down the barrel, checking each cylinder. The most accurate means of checking for timing and lock-up.
Excellent video without all the gobly goop that I dont need to hear, Keep up the good work.
I have a 28-2 from 1966. And would never part with it.
Thank you very much, Dave for this very helpful post of yours.
Just found a taurus 856 for $140. Teeny tiny bit of play in 2 chambers. The rest are Rock solid. I'm stoked.
I have S&W revolvers as much as 60 yrs old. 2 are Nickel finish... finish is real good, so not abused. I have a 5 shot stainless Mod 60 on my hip now.
Thanks. I'm in the process of obtaining a S&W 25-5, 45 colt 4". I will apply your inspection rules to it when I have it in hand.
Thank you for showing me what to look for. I learned a lot.
Goes for me, just developed an interest in this subject and you talk about it very well. Thank you.
Two things I like about my Taurus Model 65
It has a wound spring so the trigger is perfect
The Cylinder does not rely on the shell ejector to lock in place !
You can't check the lock up on a Taurus like that, although if you did you would find it tight. To teast my lock up I pull the trigger all the way back and release it slowly, the point of lock up should be just before the hammer hits the firing pin. It's kind of a no brain'r you know.
I'm OCD when it comes to having perfect screw heads on my guns, I don't want to be "Bubba" Lol. What's funny is my brand new S&W revolver actually came straight from the S&W factory with chewed up screws! I know it was new because the SN# manufacture date was just 2 weeks old from my date of purchase, and I bought it straight from a reputable gun dealer. Anyway I got brand new side plate screws from S&W and put them in MYSELF, using the correct drivers. Now it's perfect!
David-------this was excellent, I really learned a lot, some things to look at...........my wife gave me the green light for a new 357................probably going with your 586...........have a nice night brother
russ elder love the 586. I know you’ll love it too.
Your wife gave you the go ahead?? Seriously??
I don't ask my wife permission for anything. In fact I used to get mad about her wasting money, now if she does I just buy another firearm. So if she wastes money I win, if she doesn't, I still win. She wanted a camper (I hate camping), I just got a huge grin on my face. We do not own a camper...😉
@@stephenbrown6763 uh yeah. Way to save that money chief, that'll show her! Does she ask YOUR permission for anything? LOL.
@@scottzappa9314 We save money, could save more though.
Good, even excellent point on 'lockup'.
Forcing Cone is that section of the barrel, next to the cylinder which is tapered (very slightly) to allow all cylinders to 'line up' with the bore. One can think of the function as a "bullet funnel".
Cylinder gap should be obtained from the maker. One doesn't want the front of the cylinder to rub or scrap on the rear of the barrel and must not be so loose to lose velocity and 'spit' either shavings or little particles of burning powder to the side.
@ c 20:00, the S&W five shot revolver has not been carried in a holster for any appreciable time. Holster wear occurs on the sides of the muzzle end of the barrel and on the leading edges of the cylinder. The revolver shown has likely been kept in a case or drawer most of it's 'life'. That storage may explain the discoloration on the right frame panel.
To a collector, any discoloration is negative. For a shooter, it will not weaken the firearm. But it is a valid bargaining chip.
The flawless finish on the 28-2 is likely due to it not being used much. Stored carefully, but it has no signs of being in a holster for any length of time.
The screw head pointed out does come from using the wrong screw driver. One notes however, the damage was done removing the screw, not screwing it in too tightly. I must confess I have marred a number of screw heads. I do pretty good work on the insides, and I don't mess up screws any more. In the interest of one's own peace of mind check function and such to see if the inner workings have been damaged.
@ 27:00 the Colt pistol has the classic holster wear on the muzzle of the barrel. It comes from the holster rubbing on the inside of the holster when being inserted or drawn. Doesn't hurt functioning, negative to a collector. (Not disqualifying, but a demerit.)
The finish on the 28 is 'blueing'. It is a matte or dull finish, but it's the same chemical process as on the Colt. The only difference is the Colt Trooper is finished better externally. They will both loose finish for the same reasons. However, mechanically the 28 (being a Smith&Wesson) is designed and built (in those days) much better for use. Finishes were rather limited.
Alterations: Since I shoot double action only, I tend to remove the spur - cocking piece - on the hammer. If that to you is an alien concept, pass on it. Once I found a large frame S&W revolver in .45 ACP caliber. The original owner cut the barrel off and remounted the front sight. I find the trigger delightful and suspect a proper mechanic did some smoothing. A collector would have passed as the revolver was altered. It is in the other room as it suits me just fine. If one understands, finds the alteration acceptable and suits the mission for the arm, go for it.
Thanks,.. Really enjoyed the video. Well done sir!!!
Very informative, Sir! Thank you.
I have a colt python 6 incher since 1985 it function so well up to now by s n' w thank you so much for this vid now i'm learning a lot and now i have a 38.spl. 2 incher....thanx again from tokyo,japan too hard to carry a gun here.....
Love my model 19-3 and love his collection
Small detail - .1 =1/10, .01 = 1/100, and .001 = 1/1000 so .004 to .0075 is a difference of 3.5 thousandths not 3.5 hundredths.
Wouldn't it be 3.25 thousandth since .004 is bigger then .0075
@@Tread505 it's 3.5 thousandths (if you don't believe me try .0075-.004 on your calculator) and BTW - .0075 > .004; .007 >.004, the extra .0005 only makes .007 larger, not by much but larger none-the-less (everyone knows that 007 > 004 ;-) )
@@kennethbrown1919 gotcha. Im feeling pretty dumb right now lol brain farts happen
Very helpful and informative for me 👍
I am thinking of buying my first revolver, thanks 🙏
Thank you my husband and I followed perfectly with you. Great information
Very well done video. A lot of good info. Thinking about getting a revolver.
I have 2 Taurus one 38 Special and a 605, 357 magnum. Love how the trigger action is smooth.
Thank you. Enjoyed it and learned a lot.
Thank you for the education of revolver.
Lock up with the trigger pulled is a Colt test. It means nothing on a Smith and Wesson. Excessive side to side play means the cylinder stop, or the cylinder notches are worn.
Thanks Mr. Drake, I'm looking at buying a Ruger Security Six and this has great information.
Thank You! huge amount of information. I'm going to buy a gun today and you've helped a ton!
A useful video, thanks! One suggestion, if you decide to do an update some time... maybe the most important safety check: can you push off the cocked hammer?
i LOVE THE S&W 44 MAGNUM built with alloy and titanium. It is so easy to shoot and lightweight!!! 💖 I see no point in wearing yourself out with a heavy gun when you can do the exact same thing a heavy gun does with a lightweight!!!
Outstanding presentation! Thank you.
Nicely done. Informative and enjoyable.
I want a medium sized 3 inch or less barrel. I'm really lost. I don't like the idea of having the lock. I love these old shiny ones, but the modern performance styles are also tempting.
Idk. First wheel gun. For the car. Not too small
Great info, my revolver is S&W model 67-5 38 + special, the lock up is great info on how check.
This is a fantastic video! Thanks!
Great review on revolvers! I have Glocks..Smiths ....I'm getting into wheel guns now...just bought a GP100 and I love it!
Dan Caron I have a GP100 I picked up in the 90’s. The thing is a tank. Mine is a 4” stainless .357 Magnum. I prefer the triggers on the Smith’s; but, the GP100 is an affordable alternative. I also have a Smith 66-1 K frame from the ‘70’s. . For that one, I prefer not to put full load .357 through it too much. Pretty much stick to .38 Special loads for that one.
@@warmothgmc Same here...bought the 4 inch stainless in 357
Dan Caron, I've been trying to decide between the GP100 & the 686 smith, could you say why you chose the Ruger over any other? Personally I'm all about Ruger but Smith & Wesson makes a great gun too. I've heard them GP100'S Are a beast and you can shoot many rounds at once without any trouble.
M. Clark both of them can handle a heavy load. The GP100 was affordable for me at the time. I prefer the triggers on the S&W. You really can’t go wrong with either; but, there are a couple primary differences. 1. The Ruger frame is cast, as apposed to the the forged frame on the S&W. The grip on the S&W is full tang. The Ruger uses a wrap around grip insert over the main spring assembly, rather than a full frame grip. The S&W also has side plates you can remove to work on the internals. The Ruger doesn’t. Both are great revolvers in any case.
@@warmothgmc Thank you
Thanks for info. Been getting into S&W revolvers lately.
S&W make the best revolver my opinion
Thank you. I am looking for personal protection.
I hope I am not the only one that noticed you said the variance was between 3 and 3.5 on hundreds. The gap gauge is marked in one thousands.
Thanks DrDrake very precise information I am great fan of S&W revolvers !!! Greetings form an Argentine S&W revolvers enthusiast !!
They over torque that screw because it is the arm retention and it is a common problem on all brand names that this screw loosens. Rather than to bust it up, it's better just to always keep your eye on it. My opinion of course : )
Thank you for sharing your information.
The new Pythons seam to lock up super tight compared to S&W’s
P.S. You forgot to mention timing. IF it's not timed right you could loose a hand or more bodily damage. Most won't even fire. Timing is when the cylinder bore rotates around and isn't exactly inline with the bore.
First grip the cylinder lightly pull hammer back wiggle cylinder if it clicks don't buy the gun. I used to see this failed lockup in new SWs. Even had a new one blow up which is common with unique powder you can't overload Hercules 2400.
I LOVE MY SMITH AND WESSON 60-15 WITH 3 INCH BARREL
That's a good gun
Just found this. Great vid!! this really helps newbies like me!
I don’t think I’ve ever stood next to a magnum (22mag, 327mag, 357mag, 41mag or 44mag) revolver and not gotten hit with stuff. S&W, Ruger, Taurus and Colt. In the .357 magnum guns there’s no problems with .38spl and hitting my neighbors or getting hit standing next to the same gun. Same with .44spl. It’s all about the pressure of the round. I say this assuming the revolver times correctly and doesn’t have excessive rotational play of the cylinder.
Sonny Gunz : ALL revolvers will do that, it’s not a “sealed,” or “one piece” chamber/ barrel (has nothing to do with being a “magnum”). What you’re feeling isn’t bullet shavings, that’s “powder spray.” That cylinder gap (gap between cylinder & forcing cone) is an opening where hot powder gasses are clearly going to escape, and if you’re beside the revolver, you’ll may feel it (some “spray” out enough you can feel it, some don’t, but they ALL do it).
A bullet-saving is a little piece os shrapnel, if that hits you it’ll be painful & likely draw blood.
So don’t be alarmed if you’re standing by a revolver shooter & feel something when the gun is fired
You should also look for flame cutting of the upper frame, especially with magnum revolvers.
Jeffrey Tremethick That is a very good point Jeff
I read about it when I was looking into reloading for my Smith 460, and that revolver can do some flame cutting with the right powder or should I say wrong powder.
good info,,,everything lined up with the other videos buyers guides
Very Good video! Timeless and accurate advice. Thank you.
The mis-alligned barrel (clocked) is a well documented issue with S&W units lately and S&W will not fix unless WAY off stating that they are "within tolerances".
Another issue with Smith and wesson is their sd40ve automatic pistol is for those who reload the brass bulges out just above the base of the cartridge side when fired, I returned the new pistol to be fixed, I then called them and was told they were aware of the issue but usually they don't fix them just return to customer but in my case, they replaced a part but upon return, it still bulged the case, I had told them I have never owned a gun which did so, I told them I reload, their answer was they dont recommend reloading brass, I figure the barrels were cut too deep where the ejector was thus causing this issue, I told them if I got it back and it still bulged out the cases. I would not buy another S&W. Their quality has gotten to the same quality and control of cheap pistol manufacturers, S&W use to make quality pistols, not anymore! Taurus makes a better pistol than S&W.
@@robertbradley8972 Yeah I would never buy any new Smith & Wesson revolvers today so I'll whole lot rather take my time and invest in the vintage revolvers which are a lot more fun to shoot and the quality is way better and a lot more accurate at least mine are true tack drivers !!! In other words I'de rather spend $700 to $1200 on any vintage near mint Smith & Wesson or Colt revolvers with box or not !!!
A very informative video good sir. I really like how you took your time to explain many aspects the of revolver. I didn’t see any Rugers in your collection, and was wondering why. As for revolvers with wear and maybe slight pitting, I personally like leaving them wrapped in a slightly oiled rag/shop towel (the cleaning towel) just to make sure they have a slightly oiled barrier. But overall good sir, a great video. Thank you
MR. 357 I HEAR YA!!!!! ENJOYED THE VID!!!!!!!!!!!
I like Glocks too, and Beretta's! and Smith's
Me too! I’m running a 92a1 and.a 686 with a six inch barrel, love em both....!
Thanks for sharing your information! Appreciate it a lot. Greets from the Netherlands, T.
Thanks your video's on revolvers are great
Wow, love the videos. My family came from MN. Some very smart people still there.
Thank you for the video you've given me a nice bit of information to digest
I didn't know that you are supposed to check cylinder lockup by keeping the trigger pulled back after releasing the hammer. I don't see how this is any different than doing it without the trigger pulled. I would think that cocked hammer lockup would be the most important. However, I am new to revolvers and not a gunsmith. But I am interested in learning why it is done this way.
On your new S&W 357. Look at the space between the frame the crane. When the cylinder closed.
I let a Chiefs Special go a few years back and regret it. I was tight for funds and sold it and only got $250 for it. Still pains me.
We all have those kinds or regrets. I know I do.
Been there myself! It just means you have to buy more guns to make up for the feeling of loss and regret!
Nice work, makes me want to break out a few.!!
Great helpful video! One question... How could you tell when your Colt was made? I've got an old Colt similar to yours and I'd love to know when it was made.
Colt's website has a serial number lookup and it will provide you with the year if manufacture based on the serial number you enter.
Beretta says its safe to dry fire with a spent casing if you don`t have snap caps.
I have searched the entire inter-web and can't find any of these special spent casing rounds.
Great information learned a lot thanks.dont forget gun owners of America who do more for us