Backseat Driving a Wireless Install 900ft Underground
Вставка
- Опубліковано 27 чер 2024
- Ghost Town Living is one of my favorite UA-cam channels, so when I saw that they had set up a wireless network 900ft down an abandoned silver mine, I had to weigh in on their design, the issues they encountered, and what I would have done differently. Let me know what YOU would have done differently down in the comments!
Ghost Town Living video: • I Installed Wifi 900 F...
---------------------------
Buy me a coffee! ko-fi.com/crosstalk
Crosstalk Discord: / discord
Follow me on:
- Twitter: / crosstalksol
- Facebook: crosstalksolutions
- Instagram: / crosstalksolutions
- TikTok: / crosstalksolutions
- LinkedIn: goo.gl/j2Ucgg
Crosstalk Solutions - RECOMMENDED PRODUCTS: crosstalksolutions.com/recomm...
Amazon Wish List: a.co/7dRXc67
Crosstalk Solutions offers best practice phone systems and network/wireless infrastructure design/deployment. Visit www.CrosstalkSolutions.com for more info! - Наука та технологія
Chris! This is great. Very thoughtful and helpful for our setup. Would love to chat more on the whole underground Wireless plan! Hoping to bring it to the 700 and beyond. I'll follow up on your email thread.
When watching the original video and then this, I kept thinking "Why not use PowerLine if you're running / relying on power anyway?" The TP-Link TL-WPA8631P KIT looks like it can transmit over 1,000ft of electrical, plus if you want connectivity near your water pump you might just be able to use these off the existing electrical circuit run to there.
@@mathwizmf2013power line is always a last resort short of using wireless. Cable / fibre is cheaper and better.
@je8277 you could be right, as I've never used it personally, but I feel like it has gotten a lot better in recent years and I have even seen it used in LTT Tech Upgrades.
In this sort of setting, it might be a better / cheaper solution. $100 for a tx/rx pair is pretty cheap and could maybe even be an inexpensive redundancy.
Considering the possibility of failure, I like the power over coax solution instead of fiber (IF AC power at the bottom wasn't needed). If you use fiber, you will lose connectivity from power loss or fiber breakage - essentially more points of failure. Power over coax as well as powerline backup allows one of those lines to break in the shaft and still maintain communications.
Please you guys do a collab!
My opinion is it would have been best if you could use conduit for your power and run fiber. I have worked for an underground mining company setting up wifi and networking between multiple mines with Ubiquiti products. Bare cables even armored fiber is at risk of being damaged. Another crazy option I have done is casing a borehole that is drilled from the surface and separated from the hoist shaft.
When I first saw the coax, my immediate thought was "why not fiber?"
would have been cheaper and faster.
Same here. Could have run 10g easily with some single or multimode fiber as an uplink.
Same thought here, crazy not to use fibre!
When I saw 900ft underground in the title my first thought was they must have used fiber, until I saw the coax adapters 🤦♂
The only reason I'd think not to use fiber is its harder to rebind in case that armored cable does somehow get cut. I haven't worked with it but Ubiquiti's F-POE-G2 might help get PoE down there for $60 a pair + fiber with copper. Running thicker gauge dedicated DC wiring for that might have less of a voltage drop than the coax, but I'm dubious it would give redundant poe++ to a switch and be able to distribute poe to an AP and camera. And like someone else said, running low voltage next to high voltage isn't that safe, so maybe you just put a UPS down there and call it a day.
I appreciate the tone of this video, respectful and a genuine attempt to be helpful
Fiber is definitely the way to go. I love that you made this episode to talk about this kind of use case. Brent could definitely use this information to help get the town wired. Especially for the hotel and other activities that might happen down the line. Awesome! ❤👊
Chris basically laid out my same redesign for this initial stage. I would change this by planning for each of the levels they ran power to have a switch and AP with fiber linking down. It would be easy to add cameras and an SIP phone at each level. I would have also liked to see 2 conduits for power and data cables to protect them, but that adds a lot of cost. I would bet Ubiquiti would sponsor a redesign and have Chris and Cody do a few videos on it. It would be good stuff.
That's definitely a great design. There's more "moving parts", and certainly more expensive, but the redundancy and the fact that you only have a single level of fiber to replace if a fiber breaks/damaged/not working sounds like a great idea.
But I suspect there's a budget limit, and they probably were focusing on the goal too much, and not risking that scope creep.
Love Ghost Town Living! And he is an amazing story teller.
As I was watching this episode, I came to the same conclusion as you did; fiber would've been the much better solution. I was also thinking that I would've dropped a loop of fiber at the 700 level so they could've put another switch there for the camera.
I really thought the coax solution was not the best solution, and it did not make sense to try to do power over since they had power down through the mine.
As a long time follower of Ghost Town. I would like to see a power switch, switch, basic medical supplies, and provsionns on every level that is oft explored. I think it would be potentially life saving, and also enhance quality of life.
Personally, I would've run armored fiber (to your point, less issues with lightning via copper in the coax) but I would've put in a 2nd switch + AP at the water pump and then run fiber down the to the 900ft shaft below from there. Two things with that: 1) You create "gates" of failure of which troubleshooting becomes easier and 2) You create "like" experiences on each section of the mine. I'm kinda shocked that they didn't run at least 1/2 EMT in some fashion down the shaft not only for the electrical but also the coax, but that's just nitpicking at this point.
I also think you could approach the mine like you would a multi story building. I agree with the preference of fiber optic cable for the reasons you mentioned.
100% agree with all the points you made! The MikroTik switch was especially confusing considering the other UniFi gear they were using.
I'm fairly sure they are using that mikrotik as a router. The labels are just cosmetic. A hex-s would let you use the fiber via the sfp (not +) port.
I agree!! I was arguing with the TV as soon as a seen the coax come out. Looking forward to see yall install the whole town wifi. That will be a fun job.
Agree with most of what you suggested, Chris. I think I'd spend a few extra bucks to install a multi-strand (maybe 6 strand) fiber so I could drop off fiber at various levels of the mine complex.
Any tips for gear required, etc for each drop off? Learning for another project :)
I saw that they used UniFi products and was excited to see. I was concerned they appeared to be using such a long cable without an amplifier. 🤔😅
That would be a fun install!!
Agreed!
Nice project, agree armor fiber is a great suggestion
Hope this collab happens. I enjoy both channels and would love to see deployment. I do agree that coax would be an antiquated choice and why not run fiber I guess?
As a former EE for a mine, my view will be somewhat skewed, but I think your spot on here that Fiber would have been preferred, but maybe those converters were left from a past project or something. Also could have been an attempt to keep the UG AP powered during a primary power failure down the shaft (though that seems to have been lost). I used to see bunches of those Mikrotik devices, they were very common in the mining environment, as a way in some areas to comply with the communications and tracking requirement that MSHA imposes in some mining environments, could have been another on hand type of thing. One thing that would concern me in this setup (and admittedly I haven't watched the original video yet) is the voltage drop on the primary power system, if they plan to pull any kind of electrical load at the bottom, the voltage droop in that length of 12AWG will be significant.
As I haven't watched yet, 12/2 REALLY!
I know a situation where that was done over 500 feet and they blew out a water pump.
I don't know why as this guy is an "Expert" on everything. Worst job I've ever done. Unfortunately I feel like they're going downhill...
Love the idea. Exactly the kind of crazy I love. What would I have done differently? Well, I like EdgeMax switch gui and logic better than UniFi, so I'd use the EdgeSwitch 8 150w instead of UniFi switches. This is still a reasonably small network, so keeping track of IP addresses is not a hustle. The one other thing I would have done, I'd have used a plastic electrics box in the mine to provide the switch with protection from the elements. The AP is built to withstand some extra dust and water, but the switch is an indoor unit, so giving it a protective shell is not a bad idea.
While I was watching that video, I was going like WHY NOT FIBER? haha. Coax at 900ft ehh not sure I'd rely on that. Sort of figured power and data wouldn't work, but was surpised data actually did. I have no clue how those adapters work. But I do know DOCIS for cable internet surely wont at 900ft. Just depends on what frequency those adapters operate at, which I'm guessing is low.
If budgeting was an issue I still think the fiber route still would've been cheaper.
The US-8-150 switch has 2x SFP ports on it so they could have run 2 fibre drops from the surface - one to 700 feet and one to 900 feet.
Yes - excellent point...though would drive up the cost a bit.
Don't forget another link between 700 and 900. This way even if one link fails everything keeps working
Disclaimer: I've never set up a proper network from scratch so I'm just going off of what I've seen on YT. I have no personal experience for it.
When I saw the Ubiquity APs I was surprised the rest of the gear wasn't Ubiquity gear also. Keeping them all on the same brand (whatever that may be) keeps everything unified and easier to manage.
Running coax also would not have been my first choice, for a run like that I'd prob recommend fibre also but I wouldn't know what specifically to recommend for that either (see above)
Having a switch at both sides hadn't came across my mind but is a very good idea and I'd like to think I'd have though of that had I been setting that up.
If they didn’t want to run fiber for some reason, or if they didn’t want to rely on power down the mine, I would have used the MikroTik GPeR poe ethernet repeaters. Those little GPeR Ethernet repeaters/poe extenders are pretty darn reliable & will run 1Gb just fine.
I was thinking the same thing when I saw they used coax. I would have used fiber as well. I didn't know about armored fiber though. Learned something new! Great video, Chris. Keep it up!
Such a cool project, I hope you get to go and do the whole town!
Love teh connection to my other favorite channel. Also love the analysis.
I watched the original a few days ago and had similar thoughts. Obviously it worked but not how I would have done it, I think your solution is more practical and robust.
i'm surprised they didn't take the offer. I wonder why hmm. Your idea was good.
I mean - I'm sure Brent is super busy with all the projects around Cerro Gordo, and it just wasn't the right timing to be discussing Internet/WiFi when we contacted him originally. Timing is everything for these projects sometimes.
Great breakdown and analysis of this installation, I agree with your points Chris! This is a perfect use case for fiber, which I am sure probably seems intimidating to anyone who hasn't done fiber before haha. (My assumption is that the installer went with what they knew instead of trying something new - to them - like fiber)
I saw the 900ft mineshaft video last night and was thinking a lot of the same things you mentioned here
Cool! This project is about the time I unsubscribed from GTL with a different YT account, since it was a dedicated channel for a different part of my life. Cool to see he went forward with Internet down into the mine. Having been to Cerro Gordo, Brent needs all the help he can get.
I 100% agree with everything you said. Coax is expensive now, the fiber would have been cheaper than running the coax twice.
you know what they say about doing it twice you pay twice. Do it right the first time.
I agree with all your suggestions, that’s how I would’ve done it. But also, that thumbnail is the best.
That feeling when two of your favorite channels seem to cooperate in the future. ❤
WOW!! Exciting!! I would just like to be a fly on the wall in that adventure!! Real neat!! I would agree with armored fiber cable as well. I think I saw the power issue with the type of wire they used. But that may have been a cost issue as well. There are newer ways to traverse power over that distance, to a multi-point / Sub-panel coming soon.
He has received thousands of tips for everything, but he seems to rely on his cousin as we say in Italy, I would have done with fiber also for the future, and to get to the bottom of it or make the video a phenomenon, and with an ethernet cable and switch at each level with the possibility of shunting through the tunnels and making decent coverage at least at the entrances, there are then about 200 feet between the levels, also to have a backup at the bottom or close the ring, it's not that expensive, in fact it saves money, the pre-assembled connectors are enough and more, you just need the appropriate cutter, it's smarter than using coax and stupid expensive converters, they are so clumsy with a coax, they would have ruined even an armored submarine fiber cable hahaha, I would have put all UBNT devices to keep everything the network easily under control always and everywhere, he pulled a power cable that everyone advised him against for that length at 115Volt, perhaps he was only interested in making the video and turning on a LED bulb and the accespoint, I saw in other videos that was still using geostationary bidirectional satellitare, I think the speed is that, strange that it doesn't use starlink, it seems that the network for the valley is a project or will be done in the future, but I don't think it's that of the tower, which seems to be a private link of a telecommunications company probably gets the signal from his home where he has the old satellite system, it doesn't take much to understand that a collaboration could only benefit him.
There is also a thread on Reddit where a
He asked for input for what to talk about in the video, none of this was touched on really.
Oh yes the age-old the mayor calls on their nephew, cousin, brother or friend who knows everything absolutely everything about Radio's, telecommunications, infrastructure, County infrastructure etc...........................
😂😂😂👍
Feel like I should add some context This was told to me during a training seminar for ham radio supporting local county state emergency communications because they wanted to have a pool of people they could draw upon that wasn't said friend of mayor who actually knew some thing halfway about radio communications and had emergency situation preparedness and training of the State/county radio system.
Yeah apparently imagine hostage situation in bank with mayor and chief of police outside calling should we go with brother or cousin who has a CB radio...... Breaker breaker 19 we have a hostage situation >in southern accent.
Love both your channels. Would much rather have seen you down at Cerro Gordo doing the install and I’m sure it would have gone a lot smoother with you there too! Really hope you guys can collaborate on a project there and get the whole town up to speed, as well as fix/improve the mine setup.
Hilarious when I saw the mikrotik in there. Thumbs up!
This is good stuff!! I engineered and deployed a wireless network and full 10Gb fiber connected network in the Edgar Experimental (and teaching) Mine (old gold mine) in Idaho Springs, CO. Utilized technology from Aruba, Arista, Bridgewave and ONV. Getting ready to refresh with Extreme Networks in the near future. I use Unifi at home. I'm happy to discuss or compare notes anytime.
While I was watching that video I had the same thoughts about using armored fiber and switches at either side for the run down the mine shaft, I definitely think it would have been a better solution that is less susceptible to downtime, but I’m glad to see the solution they came up with worked.
If that fibre gets sliced and damaged, its far harder to repair, plus the power for switches. Can't do power over fibre. Would have to run copper for power and if that's DC power, the voltage drop will be nuts.
@@draconightwalker4964 pre terminated fiber is fairly cheap, and they already have power ran so that isn't an issue
Agree with the fiber but the electric they ran is a problem as well. 12/2 romex at 120v will lose 2.4 volts only using 1amp. 10 amps at that distance would cause a 29.4 volt drop so depending on what is powered, it’s way undersized and could have been a factor.
As I haven't watched yet, 12/2 REALLY!
I know a situation where that was done over 500 feet and they blew out a water pump.
I don't know why as this guy is an "electrical engineer" they know what they're doing. which is why he also dabbles in radiant heating. designed the whole system from what I understand, which didn't work. Also knows everything to know about construction.
I watched the original video and the fact that you also had basically the same suggestions I did means network engineers think alike haha!
I agree fiber would have been the way to go here. I would have suggested the 10 Port industrial switches at both ends. I have used them outdoors in semi covered areas (including in a wall mount box) that aren't condition or heated and they have held up very well.
Mesh Pro in a mine is probably overkill anyway. It’s not going to get very far in a silver mine. Less powerful and more AP’s distributed would probably be better.
I love how your conclusion is identical to my conclusion. I even commented on their video as well that they should have used fiber seeing as they have power down there!! I'm sure they will figure it out and have around 2 or even around 3 for upgrades one day!!
Fibre yes, but not to the 900ft in one drop, I would run fibre between each level and just couple them together for now, in future if network was needed at that level a switch could be added. Armoured would be less needed for this too, saving some money.
Fibre and switches every time - plan to expand /upgrade not just plan to work. 🎉
I thought fiber the first time I saw the video but then I realized, that coaxial cable would be easier to source and fix, the coaxial they broke can be used after continuity testing for other smaller legs of the network. BUT they def should have used MoCA 2.5 since they also ran a separate power line, Stopping at the 700ft level for the main hub down the shaft, then running another one down to 900ft from 700ft. Longer term I would like to see some 2inch Corrugated PVC Flexible Conduit put down the side of the shaft, with a few draw wires in it, so they can pull wire down there without going up and down the shaft every time, remember pull a wire replace the pull wire.
I think your redesign makes a lot of sense.
One thing that I would change, just based on this being a potentially life critical link, would be to identify a secondary shaft to run fiber through up and back to the houst house, making a physical loop. Then you can use CWDM optics and OADMs at each level to get east/west diverse paths to each level.
We ran 12 strand fibre to 975 and then down to 1450 at the mine I work at. Power is already down there so no need to push POE down the same cable. Computers, phones, radios, plc's, sensors and wifi of course all work fine.
Exactly what I was thinking
Agreed that fibre is the way to go. They are relative cheap and reliable. You can install two links to ensure availability. I would also try to spot equipment (mostly switches in this case) that is fanless given the environment.
Even if I am the biggest mikrotik fan I agree that they should had installed a unifi POE switch with fiber capability. All you said is correct. The only thing I would change is go with TP-Link omada since this is a low budget network.
Agree with all your suggestions, especialy Fiber would be better.. Have worked in big experimental buildings using coax, every time there was a thunderstorm we needed to go around resetting the devices due to electrical spike in the coax cable. Would also do link aggregation so they could withstand failure of one fiber cable. Would possibly also gone with 16 port switches as once they see the benefit of having internet down there they will most likely add more devices
This would be an amazing collab!
mate 100 percent behind you on this
Barely Wifi 7 arrived, Chris is demanding 8, love it buddy! Great Video Project, loved to watch the ghost town video internet thing and immediately thought on you doing the lake property internet project. Would love to see a good improvement from the first setup in ghost town, i am curious how to get internet down the shaft better than they did in the first try - fiber?
I have used those Ethernet/Coax adapters. This was in several high rise apartment buildings, to put security cameras in the elevator cars. There are a couple of reasons I can think of, in that situation, for using the adapters. It's a cleaner install, with only the one cable coming into the car and not having to worry about power. The other is this job needed cables that were designed for use to elevator cars. There was a suitable coax, but I don't know about Ethernet cables. The distance might also be a bit long for Ethernet at some sites.
lol... I watched Brents video the other day. I was "backseat driving" the whole time.
Woah!! Chris is a fellow Cerro Gordo fan! 🎉
I would do fiber as well, but as a diy project i can see how someone would prefer to run coax over fiber for maintenance reasons. They know how to splice coax, they probably dont know how to splice fiber.
Actually since they have power at the bottom i probably just would have run cat6 and used gper extenders at 300' and 600'.
90% sure they are using the Mikrotik as the router for the site. They arent using the "wan" port, because the wan port doesnt do poe out for the NanoBeam. So they used one of the poe out ports and just configured it as the wan.
dude so glad you made this video my thoughts were the same, definitely would have ran fiber than using those expensive devices and coax definitely could have been planned out much better too bad you couldnt have worked with brent to get his network setup it could have been glorious!!!
+1 for that collab!
I had much the same thought regarding the coax. That totally took me by surprise when they did that. However, I would be concerned that the armored fiber might be too heavy for a vertical drop like that, making me lean toward unarmored fiber with loops every so often attached to the sides, to relieve the weight. I also would consider an intentional loop from top to 700 to 900 back to top using STP so that if a cable snapped, they would still have connectivity while repairing it.
But in the footage, we see them anchoring the power, and presumably the coax... I would assume that they could anchor the fiber / armored fiber / conduit. Did they only anchor it at the top and bottom?
@@BenjaminSchollnick the video didn't show, I don't think
i agree whit all the points, especially for fibre, but the mikrotik can be configured any way you want, there is no strict rule for wan and lan ports.
The coax thingie is strange choice to take there, but all fine if working.
Fully agree with you. Fibre and Ubiquiti US-8-150 all the way. They really have limited themselves with the installation they have carried out.
Other than using a system which the management requires an internet connection to manage the local devices. It could also be the fact the mesh AP wasn't giving the cellphone connection as it wasn't set up, and the cellphone didn't have a separate internet connection... to connect to the server, which the AP was talking to, so it could get connection. 700 ft of power wire does also have a huge line loss, which they may not have taken into account, either. I think they thought that the range of the antenna would reach the 200 ft up... ignoring it is solid rock and not the air which is what the rating is for.
I haven't watched his channels, especially since I have realised he has massive backing which most people don't have a chance of affording. His bigger issue is how remote it is, not how much it costs to get stuff there (many people are just not able to do it safely)
Always test all your gear before deploying, when in tough layouts like this, so they are already configured at deployment time. It's also the good thing when you are dealing with winter weather too.
I like your plan... but could always run fibre to the 700 ft, with a switch, then back out the second port and drop the remaining 200 ft, to the other. I still prefer devices which allow for hardwire testing, and hardwiring everything possible. I would also use NEMA enclosures with heat and cooling at the top, and cooling at both lower spots. For antennas, I would use directional ones down below, as going straight down a tunnel, you don't need an omni antenna, as if it's mounted on a wall, it's already not going to be using half the beam.
They ran cable!?! He must be ex-Xfinity users. 😂 I agree fiber would have been the better choice. Regardless great review and assessment 100% spot on.
What do you mean my Comcast cough I mean Xfinity it's all fiber cording to the commercial the largest fiber net work ever according to the commercial"™" < heavy sarcasm.
I had the same thought, now why not run some conduit for the future? ;)
Also consider installing a couple of 3-5 feet slack loops.
The Mikrotik hEX he used can use any port for any purpose, so it definitely could be acting as a router. It's also 1/4 the price of the US-8-150W, and they have a version with a single SFP port for only slightly more (hEX S).
My backseat project management skills were also in play lol. Should’ve had an agile planning. Fiber and that ubiquiti switch were the way to go.
Don’t forget to add in managed power like WattBox for auto reboot at the bottom of the shaft etx
I agree with the fiber and switch setup. I would of also suggested trying a wireless bridge setup, where there was a wireless transmitter at the top of the shaft pointing down and setting up a receiver at the desired levels which then fed another switch to feed power and connectivity to other devices.
There are 2 problems with that.
1: Is the shaft a straight line?
2: The fresnel zone for a 60GHz radio (airfiber, wave, UBB) is 1.20m/4ft wide. Even worse 4m/12ft if using a 5GHz radio (powerbeam).
The signal would be lost every time some goes throught the shaft.
Not to mention the electrical noise created by the elevator. And the elevator itself probably taking much of the width of the shaft, again blocking the signal.
(/edit: typo)
agreed with all points
The mt hex is a router, not a switch. Anyway for me they should have gone with 2 hEX S which goes for around 70$ it has an IF for fiber and also a 24v PoE out. Second, I would use nanostations M2, yes they are slow (about 60mbits max) and can manage about 20 WiFi clients but they are the world champions in distance, especially in large corridors like a mine.
I'll have to go check out his video, but I 100% agree with your assessment! The Mikrotik is fine, but sticking with Ubiquiti would have been better. Coax is probably alright, but any new install like this should have been fiber. I get that it was probably a "budget" install because of low traffic / importance, but always best to do it right the first time.
I love my 8-150watt switches I own two both linked to the 10 gig aggregation switch using Dac’s An I highly recommend that they use these 150 watt switches In his mine.
I can’t wait for Wi-Fi 8
That's funny this was on my watchlist. Yeah it's almost like somebody thought isolation between buildings with glass would be so much better than running a copper line that's susceptible to issues. Plus coax field terminations not some thing you want to be doing in the dark one little strand and
I've used the Coax converters to power Axis cameras.
The Mikrotik hEX PoE has an SFP port, so you don't need Ubiquiti to use fiber. Also, it's a full router, not just a switch, so you can do interesting things with mesh routing, for instance. OSPF across multiple backhauls, perhaps? :)
its really good idea to add 50 Access point with power backup if a access point failed or got destroyed by a storm or disaster the other ones can work or adding alot like 200 ones in every mountain spot and a power backup like from anker or tesla maybe popular companies
Exactly! I was thinking that the whole time. Why coax?
Personally, I immediately thought that the best option here would be to run 6-12 strands of LC fiber down to each of the levels individually, have a switch at each level, and then you have plenty of spare fiber for other things (like maybe an intercom system like Studio Technologies' Dante stuff) and you aren't daisy chaining your network switches with other ones in weird to access places. Plus running 6-12 strands down to 900 gives you the ability to patch another trunk onto those strands to go down to 1200 like they plan to in the future. I also would never use unifi in an install like this and would rather deal with individually manageable things since it will probably be easier to directly attach a serial cable to a switch + have in band management rather than have to travel up a 45 minute elevator to make a configuration change then travel back down to see if it works.
When speaking about eliminating single points of failure that is exactly why they run coax for power and ethernet. Because if the main utility feed drops you would still have comms down there. Probably why they ran mikrotik because of its wide input voltage range. It's most probably a different power feed powering this setup obviously they had issues and ran a poe at the bottom but clearly that was not the initial plan for a reason. Ps armored fiber because it's less susceptible to lightening I don't there is much lightening down a mine shaft.
Fiber is obviously the way to go, I agree BUT, if that was me, I would have totally tried power line ethernet adapters first and see how well that works. haha
Love both of your channels. Excited for the colab! :) I've been doing something similar in conduit alongside my long driveway (a string of APs, one every N feet). I've been curious if it might be possible to run fiber with many strands (adding strands is relatively inexpensive vs multiple cables), and pull out 2 strands (or 1 with bidirectional optics) at each location without terminating all the strands. Would allow a single cable to "stop" at the well, then continue on to the bottom. Since fiber has basically unlimited reach, you could totally pull a single cable from the top all the way down a leg of the mine, stopping periodically to add an switch + PoE, AP, or Camera, etc. (assuming you also ran power). I'm not sure if it'd work, but my hunch is it might (to avoid splicing all strands at each stop, it might be possible to strip the entire cable sheath at each stop, protect all the strands in a fiber splice case, then only terminate 2 fibers?). I'm not an expert, just sharing an idea I've been curious about for my project. :) They also sell fiber with copper for power (mostly DC), which seems really versatile. Expensive, though, and Romex/AC is probably more useful for other things (can plug things into outlets, etc.) Also might be able to avoid fusion splicing with field assembly connectors.
Edit: Maybe this is more complicated than necessary. Especially if you could place switches every N feet and buy multiple pre-terminated cables with only two strands each. My application was limited by conduit size, but that's different here. Hmm...
Edit 2: Just found out this is called mid span access. Good videos:
- ua-cam.com/video/0NhMVcHiFcQ/v-deo.html
- ua-cam.com/video/PJ9XvFkF9Yk/v-deo.html
Edit 3: Possible parts
- Corning SST-Drop 12 fiber
- 1x Corning OSC-1-10-10-21 at each stop
- Corning/3M Fibrlok 2529 Mechanical Splices
- Bidi optics (1 fiber for each stop)
Or, cheaper from FIS:
- S09FD12CZEBL (12F drop cable)
- Z1-LOCDROP-EN
- Corning/3M Fibrlok 2529 Mechanical Splices
- Bidi optics (1 fiber for each stop)
Just having fun thinking through this idea... :)
When you talked about the coax, I was thinking the exact same thing: why didn't they go with fiber? I didn't know about armored fiber, as I'm not a low-voltage electrician, but it's good to know about for future reference. As to your final model of how you would have done the project, all I can say is "Great minds think alike." 😉
Just asking. Could you use Unifi-AC-Pro APs (with two RJ45 ports) and daisy chain APs with injectors throughout the mine? Granted, the cost would increase with every AP installed, but there would be expandable coverage.
I watch Ghost Town Living and have seen this episode. Very curious to what you pick up on and point out
I mean, he was putting an outlet every 100ft if i remember. Cheapest thing would've been to buy a bunch of 5 port switches and a big ass roll of cat 5e and not mess with moca of fiber in the first place.
Wouldn't those unifi industrial switches be a better fit for these unconditioned spaces? Oh nevermind I forgot those lacked SFP
What I would’ve done is send power and fibre down and use a media converters for the ethernet to fibre conversion Poe switch at the top and bottom
that is pretty cool, having Wi-Fi in a mineshaft
Chris, I agree with you, on the fibre down the shaft, but one thing i would change uptop, is your switch... i would of done USW-Industrial (430W) for reasons of the harsh enviroment, dirt, hot and cold.
USW-Industrial doesn’t have SFP ports for fiber.
@@CrosstalkSolutions oh yes correct, my bad
Just a thought is the shaft wide enough to use a wireless p2p down the side of the lift in the shaft?
I definitely though fiber, but considering they are wanting to also bring connectivity to other levels the coax would be a lot easier to splice into on the various levels than fiber would be. However, I think fiber would have saved a lot of hassle and troubleshooting
A crazy thought for the mineshaft! Is there line of sight down the shaft? If so why not use a 60 ghz building to building Bridge?
Hey you haven’t Done a video on any VoIP hardware recently. Would you be able to showcase or talk about some endpoints?
Fiber is the best way to go, but since they got power down there, why not start simple and cheap with a simple romex injector. Those things you plug in the wall and an internet wire to it so it injects the internet signal in the romex? Then you can simply add other devices to it or nodes at other levels in the mine
Those worked great in the house for me and since theres only 1 romex going down i figured they would work great
Edit; i just read more about them and 984 feet seems to be the furthest it can go, not the best option of course but should work for this!