hello, the way the emperor ally can buy cards seems a bit broken to be honest, it means that for every single card up for bid the ally can bid the combined spice from both himself and the emperor (the emperor gives him the spice via wealth sharing, and the ally needs to not have a full hand) and the spice isn't even lost because it goes back to the emperor, the way my group plays it is that the ally have to pay the bank so that it makes more sense (same applies for guild ally shipments).
Hi Jack, thank you very much for the clarification. Like someone else here said its so helpful to have an official source to point people to. Yesterday we had a game where we faced both situations, the way we played it for the emperor was same as you explained but we used the same rule for the guild in that the guild was helping their ally pay for shipment which they paid to themselves so thank you for clarifying our mistake. I have two questions here: 1- does this mean that the emperor can just give spice to their ally at any point during the game that they can use for anything (ex for revival?) or does it have to be at a specific time for a specific use ( like bidding)? 2-you mentioned the emperor can help pay for their ally’s space combat, is it only the emperor who can do that or does that apply to other factions?, how does it work when the ally has to reveal how much spice they are using in combat? Does the emperor give them spice before battle plans are formed? Or do they just pay after plans are revealed and if so how would that work? Thank you in advance
Emperor can give spice at any time. Only Emperor and CHOAM can pay for an ally’s spice in combat. They typically pay after plans are revealed though it must be agreed on beforehand. Both can give the spice before but in the case of CHOAM all spice given must be used for dialing.
i understood everything, except at 5:46 you said something that slightly countered the logic i was following throughout the video so i wanted to make sure i understand :) let's say that the Guild is allied with BG. i will try to make a couple of conclusions myself, and you tell me if that is correct :) - if Guild pays for BG's shipment, that spice goes to the Spice Bank because Guild is paying - if BG pays for Guild's shipment, that spice goes to the Spice Bank because it's Guild's shipment ? basically there are 4 combinations when talking about this alliance's shipment, right: BG pays for BG's shipment, BG pays for Guild's shipment, Guild pays for BG's shipment and Guild pays for Guild's shipment. and in 3 out of 4 of those combinations, the spice goes to Spice Bank, but only if BG pays for BG's shipment, the spice goes to the Guild. is that correct?
from FAQ: "...while non-allied players can bribe each other, the bribes are not collected until the Mentat Pause phase, whereas spice shared from the Emperor is collected immediately". Does it technically mean that the Emperor can give money to anybody (ally or not) for any reason and it's collected immediately? Why then confuse with the word Ally in the said answer in FAQ ("the Emperor can give spice directly to allies for any reason.")?
Is the same in the case of Tleilaxu? If Tleilaxu want to cover reviving Ally's troops from the tanks, They need to pay (half of the cost) to the spice bank? As they cannot share their spice with the ally and get the spice right back?
Another thing I would see, and you demostrated the right way to do here, is that the Emperors Ally would ask his sugar daddy if he could afford a treachery card. Emperor goes "sure", and the ally would up the bid. Without any spice changing hands. Afaik the player is only allowed to bid as much as he actually has behind his screen. So the Emperor has to physically give him the spice tokens, so the ally can up the bid. This is important for karama, giving the spice by imperial credit card, as well as paying spice to emperor. Emperor CAN keep the spice, but that would be considered an "ally pays for treachery bid" transaction and that spice would go to the bank. But then again... how much can someone bid, when the ally agrees to pay in part or full for a treachery card? Only as much as they have themselves? Or the combined spice pool of both parties (barring karama)
You can bid more than you have if your ally allows it. They do not have to give you spice in order to bid. That would be unwieldy with spice transfers between allies during a bid that ultimately went higher than the alliance can afford.
I just house rule that anyone can give spice to anyone at any time, not really sure why any of these rules exist they just cause confusion and restrict players unnecessarily. the only reason I can think of for the restriction is the choam charity problem.
The Emperor is significantly weaker when he just doesn't have half of his advantage. A big part of the point of allying with the Emperor is the flexibility in transactions that the other factions just don't have - even the Guild or Choam, who end up very rich too, are restricted by strict rules on paying others. It's a strength of the Emperor that makes him unique from the other factions.
@@howiieb The emporors large amount of money already makes him strong at supplying others the rules on exchanging are just annoying, and the approach of not putting them in the rulebook and insisting they are official anyway is bizzare
@@vincenturquhart1370 It is explained in the rulebook, on page 12. The rulebook never states that alliance players can share money directly, and then lists the specific things they can pay each other for - this is essentially explaining the rule in full. The alliance for the emperor is really weak without this limitation, only actually allowing for a little extra revival - not a huge advantage.
So nice to have an official designer video to point to!
Exactly this caused an hour long discussion when we were playing!
hello, the way the emperor ally can buy cards seems a bit broken to be honest, it means that for every single card up for bid the ally can bid the combined spice from both himself and the emperor (the emperor gives him the spice via wealth sharing, and the ally needs to not have a full hand) and the spice isn't even lost because it goes back to the emperor, the way my group plays it is that the ally have to pay the bank so that it makes more sense (same applies for guild ally shipments).
Hi Jack, thank you very much for the clarification.
Like someone else here said its so helpful to have an official source to point people to.
Yesterday we had a game where we faced both situations, the way we played it for the emperor was same as you explained but we used the same rule for the guild in that the guild was helping their ally pay for shipment which they paid to themselves so thank you for clarifying our mistake.
I have two questions here:
1- does this mean that the emperor can just give spice to their ally at any point during the game that they can use for anything (ex for revival?) or does it have to be at a specific time for a specific use ( like bidding)?
2-you mentioned the emperor can help pay for their ally’s space combat, is it only the emperor who can do that or does that apply to other factions?, how does it work when the ally has to reveal how much spice they are using in combat? Does the emperor give them spice before battle plans are formed? Or do they just pay after plans are revealed and if so how would that work?
Thank you in advance
Emperor can give spice at any time. Only Emperor and CHOAM can pay for an ally’s spice in combat. They typically pay after plans are revealed though it must be agreed on beforehand. Both can give the spice before but in the case of CHOAM all spice given must be used for dialing.
i understood everything, except at 5:46 you said something that slightly countered the logic i was following throughout the video so i wanted to make sure i understand :)
let's say that the Guild is allied with BG. i will try to make a couple of conclusions myself, and you tell me if that is correct :)
- if Guild pays for BG's shipment, that spice goes to the Spice Bank because Guild is paying
- if BG pays for Guild's shipment, that spice goes to the Spice Bank because it's Guild's shipment ?
basically there are 4 combinations when talking about this alliance's shipment, right: BG pays for BG's shipment, BG pays for Guild's shipment, Guild pays for BG's shipment and Guild pays for Guild's shipment.
and in 3 out of 4 of those combinations, the spice goes to Spice Bank, but only if BG pays for BG's shipment, the spice goes to the Guild. is that correct?
Correct
from FAQ: "...while non-allied players can bribe each other, the bribes are not collected until the Mentat Pause phase, whereas spice shared from the Emperor is collected immediately". Does it technically mean that the Emperor can give money to anybody (ally or not) for any reason and it's collected immediately? Why then confuse with the word Ally in the said answer in FAQ ("the Emperor can give spice directly to allies for any reason.")?
Emperor cannot give spice to anyone. Only their ally. Any spice they give to a non ally is a bribe.
Is the same in the case of Tleilaxu? If Tleilaxu want to cover reviving Ally's troops from the tanks, They need to pay (half of the cost) to the spice bank?
As they cannot share their spice with the ally and get the spice right back?
Factions cannot pay for their ally’s revival, not even the Tleilaxu.
@@jackredathewarp except for Emperor when he pays for the extra revival
Another thing I would see, and you demostrated the right way to do here, is that the Emperors Ally would ask his sugar daddy if he could afford a treachery card. Emperor goes "sure", and the ally would up the bid. Without any spice changing hands.
Afaik the player is only allowed to bid as much as he actually has behind his screen. So the Emperor has to physically give him the spice tokens, so the ally can up the bid. This is important for karama, giving the spice by imperial credit card, as well as paying spice to emperor.
Emperor CAN keep the spice, but that would be considered an "ally pays for treachery bid" transaction and that spice would go to the bank.
But then again... how much can someone bid, when the ally agrees to pay in part or full for a treachery card? Only as much as they have themselves? Or the combined spice pool of both parties (barring karama)
You can bid more than you have if your ally allows it. They do not have to give you spice in order to bid. That would be unwieldy with spice transfers between allies during a bid that ultimately went higher than the alliance can afford.
I just house rule that anyone can give spice to anyone at any time, not really sure why any of these rules exist they just cause confusion and restrict players unnecessarily. the only reason I can think of for the restriction is the choam charity problem.
The Emperor is significantly weaker when he just doesn't have half of his advantage. A big part of the point of allying with the Emperor is the flexibility in transactions that the other factions just don't have - even the Guild or Choam, who end up very rich too, are restricted by strict rules on paying others. It's a strength of the Emperor that makes him unique from the other factions.
@@howiieb The emporors large amount of money already makes him strong at supplying others the rules on exchanging are just annoying, and the approach of not putting them in the rulebook and insisting they are official anyway is bizzare
@@vincenturquhart1370 It is explained in the rulebook, on page 12. The rulebook never states that alliance players can share money directly, and then lists the specific things they can pay each other for - this is essentially explaining the rule in full. The alliance for the emperor is really weak without this limitation, only actually allowing for a little extra revival - not a huge advantage.