What Can We Do About WotC’s Horrible New OGL? (A Lot, Actually)
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- Опубліковано 2 сер 2024
- Copy-paste the following into the OneD&D survey notes:
I will not financially support Wizards of the Coast if they attempt to revoke any previous OGL. #opendnd
CW: I cuss twice
Chapters:
00:00 - Ugh We Have to Talk About the New OGL 1.1, I Know, I’m Sorry
03:01 - The Leaked OGL 1.1 is Disastrously Bad
06:27 - How Does the Law Work? Great Question!
09:05 - Acknowledging the Leaked/Unconfirmed Status of this OGL
11:07 - Can WotC Do This?
11:40 - How We Can Stop This
17:17 - Final Thoughts
OneD&D Survey: www.dndbeyond.com/sources/one...
Gizmodo article: gizmodo.com/dnd-wizards-of-th...
Wizards of the Coast’s original statement about the new OGL:
www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1410-...
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If this happens, we need to just completely boycott WotC until they revert it. Don't spend a PENNY on them until they revert it.
Seriously. The minute I discovered this leak and realized the implications of it, I cancelled my D&D Beyond account and have suspended all purchases of all WOTC, Hasbro, and D&D content until we get clarity-and even then, it's iffy. Even if it had been intended to be an internal-only what-if, the fact that anybody there had this idea is the biggest red flag I can imagine. They've wasted any goodwill they might have accumulated over the past several years, and that would not be easily regained, at least not from me.
WotC gets zero dollars from me and instead I'm happy to support any creators that tell them to F off.
If you want dnd books, buy ONLY second hand copies.
don't just boycott them - be LOUD about boycotting them. make sure they KNOW you're doing it. if they have even a doubt in their mind that you're not boycotting them, you're doing it wrong.
Honestly I wasn't going to anyway! I'm buying 5e stuff so long as they release that, but even without this, OneDnD was absolutely uninteresting to me. This just makes a bad thing worst from my point of view! :p
Wizards isn’t taking the 25% out of profits, it’s taking it out of revenue. Layoffs is an optimistic result.
Wait, really? How? How much margin do those creators have? Taking 25% out of any sale above 750k REVENUE would probably mean any sales above that threshold would result in a net loss for the creator. So will creators now artificially limit their supply to not sell above 750k? That seems crazy.
@@HazZzur That was intentional.
To me, not a content creator just a DM who likes homebrew, the worst part of the 1.1 is "you have to pay us royalties when you use our IP(past a threshold), but we can use your IP without paying you royalties, and at any time we can change the goalpost with only 4 weeks of notice."
Everyone wants to write one sided contracts like this. Along with how everyone wants you to rent/subscribe to their product rather than buy it. I don't see how things can keep going in that direction.
@@BruceOMalley Disney does it all the time, they literally have "anything new you draw while working for us is ours" type shit in their contracts
@@clarehidalgo yeah but that's a contract...a person can not agree to it. Same here...people don't have to agree to 1.1 because its not an open license that blanket effects everything. This is Wizbro attempting to be a defacto government to effectively tax and steal from creators who don't even have a contractual agreement with them.
Realistically the intent is so that if you create something independently of them that is similar to something that they create you can't sue them for stealing from you. That is almost certainly the motivation... the letter of the law is very different. Another likelihood is that they want force large publishers into alternative agreements with them are okay with the smallest publishers dying off.
@@clarehidalgo Every single company has contracts with that in it these days. Any idea that was created during work hours, or even with company equipment is the ownership of that company.
The only way they can really backtrack from this, imo, is to make it LEGALLY CLEAR the current OGL can never be revoked, never be "unauthorized" and never be changed. Any other statement or solution should be met with suspicion.
Same for me too. I'll never trust them, but if they put stronger copyleft wording into it, I won't need to trust them.
... should be met with WAR
We should make sure not to accept anything less than a clear OGL that cannot be changed, revoked, or deleted. Specifically to keep that original 1.0a OGL intact. Otherwise we may as well move onto other TTRPG systems that aren't WOTC or has bros connected.
@@skyrkazm1015 Exactly. Open up the SRD in a way that it is unambiguously clear that it can never be withdrawn. Otherwise I'm not giving Hasbro/WotC another dime.
I don't believe that there is any validity in a contract that says that one side can change the terms at any time. That's why the cell phone companies got rid of contracts.
If this comes to pass, a silver lining in all this could potentially be an upset in D&D's monolithic presence in the TTRPG scene.
That really depends on what people will be willing to buy and invest in. People are often fickle with short memories willing to put up with a lot.
Precedent says no. When they dropped the 3e OGL & D20 License in favor of 4e's "Game System License", there was a similar hue & cry for revolution among hardcore fans & small-press publishers alike, with Paizo as the standard-bearer. That GSL was actually way-less restrictive than this OGL 1.1, and would've run in parallel - you could still publish 3e-based stuff via the OGL.
But while we did see the rise of Pathfinder, D&D remained the behemoth in terms of sales and brand-awareness outside of the most deeply-embedded members of the community. I recall seeing the PFRPG Core Rulebook at Barnes & Noble a couple times, but once 5e came out, Pathfinder got steamrolled.
There's no other 3PP/TTRPG around now who is on a similar level to be considered a viable contender for Wizards' market share, and most of the active 5e mainstream audience never stepped out into the wider hobby. Official 5e is all they've known, all they've played/watched, and they have no particular allegiance to any other systems/pubs. Hasbro may well royally f*ck up 6e (certainly seems on that track), but that doesn't automatically translate into someone else taking the lead - the gap is really, really big.
Just need critical roll to move to Pathfinder 2e and bam, DND dies overnight.
@@archmagemc3561 I like Pathfinder's setting, still buy their APs, even. But neither it, nor Critical Role, make a blip of difference out in the broader D&D-playing world. It's really easy to fall into the trap of assuming that everyone is as plugged-in as folks who are vocal on internet hobby forums, but that's far from reality.
@@archmagemc3561 Considering they just tweeted about how D&D Beyond is the official Toolkit of Critical Role and they've been using DDB's sheets since campaign 2, that very likely isn't happening. DDB is their most reliable sponsor.
Let me tell you something I learned working with Microsoft (where the CEO that cooked up this hot garbage came from.). They are so used to having a captive customer that they assume no one will ever step in to supplant them thus being able to charge crazy licensing fees. Even if you provide well informed customer feedback to improve their products they will laugh at you because there’s no incentive for them ever change something when no one competes against them. They’re about to find out just how badly that model and attitude applies to the gaming community.
👏👏👏
If the Pokémon franchise is anything to go by, it applies pretty well unfortunately… I’ll still boycott but my hopes aren’t high
@@billyp673 the company so I’ve heard unlike Nintendo is actually tanking in terms of value though so there is a microscopic amount
A really compelling theory I heard recently, is that they just want to focus everything on their virtual table top system that is coming out with one d&d. So they are likely to just sell everything for the VTT themselves and so they don't need third parties anymore.
100% agreed. No one with even a passing familiarity of the history of TTRPGs would forget how many different games popped up from the late 70s through to the 90s and beyond. The only limiting factor of those days were the high cost of publishing and promotion, but that was before how saturated and ubiquitous the internet has become in our lives, never mind crowd funding. WotC and Hasbro is about to get a rude awakening.
WOTC:
*alienates Magic community with the 30th Anniversary release*
*alienates D&D community by (allegedly) butchering the OGL*
"wHy ArE wE lOsInG mOnEy!?"
it's hilarious that wizards has managed to further tank their PR after the absolute garbage fire that was the 30th anniversary of magic: the gathering. Their 2 most valuable ips and the execs of wizards and hasbro seemed determined to milk them for as much short term profit as possible, while ignoring the massive long term damage to the brand
I'd like to believe you are right but I don't know how true that is.
And right before the fucking movie. You'd think they'd want that to be a success too
Amen. VOTE WITH YOU WALLETS, PEOPLE.
As a magic player with no connections to DnD, I got this in my recommended feed, probably because I was in the discussion during the whole Magic30 shitshow. All I can say is that WOTC has been so incompetent in the past few months that it's just so funny.
Well thing is that they simple can milk it and then sell the IP in the future.
Sometimes, a Red Dragon protects people in its territory. Not because good, but because it's a Red Dragon. Red Dragons need things to dominate, and those creatures are part of its greedy hoard.
It's even worse than you've said. Wotc isn't taking 25% of profits, they're taking 25% of the gross revenue. So you might have a product that loses you money and wotc would still collect their share.
it’s super important to say, DO NOT send threats. I know there’s a lot of emotions with this but, especially in legal/business situations there is no good that comes from attacks. All it does is make your side, no matter how right or wrong you are, look worse.
If they go through with this they need to know threats are warranted because what they are talking about is in fact, legalized slavery via copyright infringement of creators under the threat of unconstitutional litigation.
@@cavemantero That's still not a reason to send a threat. Vote with your wallet, not a potty mouth.
@@cavemantero no it’s not okay. All threats will do is make the community look toxic
@@cavemantero Literally all you're going to do is make a court of law see anyone arguing against this as a bunch of whiny gamer babies.
@@cavemantero Whoa, calm down friend. Simply don't agree to the OGL. Thats it. Equating this to slavery is an unwarranted imaginitive stretch for sure.
This reminds me of a self fulfilling prophecy, like Anakin in RotS. In his attempt to save Padme he set in motion the very events that lead to her death. Wizards, in their very attempt to prevent the rise of a major competitor, may very well do just that. Blinded by gold seems an appropriate idiom for Wizard's shortsightedness.
Absolutely wild for WotC to think that they would come out ahead in this. They are severely underestimating the consequences of this decision.
Please note: They also lie about the intent of the OGL. Currently, they think it was only about static documents.
It's a shame the people who made the OGL are alive, and say otherwise.
It's a shame, WotC has previously included, in a FAQ that you could create, for instance, computer software.
It's a shame, that they had a separate FAQ explicitly to help people work within the OGL while creating software.
It's a shame, they also said, explicitly that while they can change the OGL, "you could continue to use an earlier, acceptable version at your option."
Imagine if they even blundered so hard and said, "there's no reason for Wizards to ever make a change that the community would of people using the Open Gaming License would object to, because the community would just ignore the change anyway." Wait, they said that verbatim in their own description of the original OGL. Such a shame, for those who want to lie about the intent and capability of the OGL.
Exactly! If they only intended for it to be used for printed products, why didn’t they do anything in the many, many years since Star Wars (pre-Disney) used the OSR for Knights of the Old Republic? They’ve certainly had time to figure that out
of course they are lying about it, just like they are lying about all the recent magic problems they are having thus why they are trying to jump on the D&D ship, too bad for them their stealth level isnt high enough to hide all their BS
Apparently Knights of the Old Republic used some game system elements from D&D so revoking the old ogl would mean that Wizards would need to either demand money from Disney
I heard that yesterday,. Can't wait to see them take on the mouse house.
I heard this as well. I was wondering if this would become a clash of titans. As much as we can call Hasbro a titan compared to Disney. Or would Disney even care if they aren’t making that much money off their game? Although, Disney doesn’t like to be told what to do and so I wonder if they were some of those conversations that Mike mentioned.
It's not "some". Knights of the Old Republic is just a virtual D&D game with star wars themes and a shitty railroady DM.
For the record though, it's perfectly within a copyright holders rights to NOT enforce their copyright. They can pick and choose entirely arbitrarily whether they want to seek action.
that's not how this would work they can only claim things that went in to effect or continue to be in effect after the release of 1.1, i don't know if The Old Republic the mmorpg uses it but Kotor unless they make a new one is unteachable. as fun as it would be to see Hasbro go agents the mouse and EA it wont happen
You're the man. I'm sharing this with all my friends who play D&D. I got into this hobby way too recently to have it ruined by a greedy company.
same. i just started an ff14 themed game. this probably means no updated content as the mmo advances since it's published using 5e rules
Same, sharing it with everyone I know who plays. This hobby has helped me in so many ways, I will not let a parasitic greedy company ruin it.
As always, I appreciate your takes. You're able to be way more collected about this than I am. But in my job I deal with C-suite folks every day and... even the dumbest executives I've ever worked with would look at this in a room and say "Wait a minute... what's the community reaction going to look like?" and then when told would decide this is brand-suicide and not do it. The fact that nobody was in the room to ask or answer that question honestly is as troubling as the events themselves.
Or the fact that someone *did* say it, and they were ignored. Neither answer is good.
Honestly, if they just wanted to update the OGL to account for things that didn't exist at the same scale when 1.0 came out (youtube, actual play streams and podcasts, digital distribution, etc.) That would be a different matter entirely, but these (alleged) leaks are so scummy and sinister that it's a huge loss of public trust however well or badly this turns out.
I'd also like to point out that Blizzard attempted this kind of retroactive revoking with Warcraft Reforged, and... well, look at how well that went for them.
And thank you for bringing up that these new terms would be a huge deterrent regardless of if they would/could ever be enforced, it's something I haven't seen brought up by other folks a lot. No indie creators who are already running quadruple duty as writers, testers, publishers, and promoters will be able to put on a fifth lawyer hat against Hasbro's whole dang legal team.
I begrudgingly came back to 5e following the third party support there and reasoning that they learned their lesson from 4e. It would seem that they learned the wrong lesson. I lied on the survey and stuck an “if” in there in a wordier but similar statement to what you suggested, but the reality is I’m done with anything this company ever puts out. I’ve got an ongoing campaign that I’m going to run through before shuttering the D&D Beyond account; that’ll probably take another few months, and that buys me the time to figure out what game or games I’m swapping over to. I’ve been wanting something less crunchy for awhile now, so Fate and Savage Worlds are looking like front runners (I’d probably prefer Fate, but I have at least one person at the table who might prefer Savage Worlds).
The important thing is, though, when the 7e apology tour starts up, I won’t be back. Fool me once; shame on you. Fool me twice; shame on me.
I'm personally switching to Vampire the Masquerade, (the 20th anniversary edition, specifically)
@@atlascove1810 I’m also considering World of Darkness content (I’ve enjoyed previous WoD stuff), but it’s not going to scratch that fantasy itch, so I want to get a setting neutral system before I delve into something specific.
Hasbro: "Hey, check out this new and improved OGL, supercharged with a Hemi engine! Ho ho ho ho ho!"
SupergeekMike: "I don't think so, Tim."
Yeah, this was a terrible blunder on their part. Even in the "best case scenario" for this OGL, I don't see it leading to more popularity.
😂 so true
If you are creator, please keep making things in a system agnostic format so that we can continue supporting you without helping WotC, I already have a bunch of RPGs both D&D and other systems, and the online communities can help each other, for free, adapt these creations into our chosen system of play.
As an auditor with a business degree, I know that a corporation's job is only to make money not friends and as an auditor, you need to think through worst-case scenarios so you can prepare for the worst. I am disappointed with Wizards as this feels like a 20-year bait-and-switch maneuver. Kobold Press is my favorite 3rd party publisher and I hope something gets worked out so indy creators can get a little something and Hasbro won't treat them like they are actually trapped in the Dark Sun world.
The thing is, it feels like WOTC hasnt thought out the worst case for them. The worst case for WOTC is they lose the lawsuit, OGL 1.0 is found to be non revokable and they have ticked off the community so bad, people only buy the 3rd party stuff, the OGL will still be in effect, they will have a riot on their hands and a boycot, and D&D will likely be stuck forever in 5th.
@@Kconv1 I agree, they are coming at this in a strickly legal sense and if there had never been an OGL before they would have stronger footing. Now they poking the bear, as it were. I don't believe the fans "own" DnD but it would be nice if WotC had a more collaborative spirit about it.
Non-profit corporation's exist.
@@Paxladar actually thinking about it, it could be even worse. Critical Role, Paizo, OSR or others could come out with their own rules system, that is close enough to D&D to easily convert but far enough away to survive court battles.Remember Sony vs Xbox, the Sony ad, where they said "this is how you trade discs" and PS4 flew ahead of xbox. Same thing "Here is our OGL, and we have in the first line 'non revokable!!!!' give our system a try" This would be an absolutely gangbusters and a half kickstarter!
@@Kconv1 I think that is exactly what will happen. Matt Mercer and his group were using Pathfinder before they started Critical Role and they have a huge following...more than large enough to sell a huge number of their own games. And honestly, having watched a few episodes, it wouldn't be too hard to make a better game that suits their style of role playing. If they teamed up with Paizo and the Pathfinder creators or another company who is already making their own fantasy game this could be done very quickly. If you were Paizo wouldn't you be thinking of ways to ensure your business couldn't be put in this kind of legal bind risking financial destruction?
Mike, I really appreciate your thoughtful, and thought-provoking approach to, like, everything. Thanks for creating a channel that is a port in the storm of UA-cam mayhem.
Never forget this moment. Pick your third party publishers and content creators and commit to continuing your support. If they branch out to try different content or systems because of this, commit to at least giving it a chance. They may be trying to prevent another Pathfinder, but they can't prevent you from finding a new system out there. They can't stop you from using the books you already bought. D&D is more than a set of rules or a publisher. It is a community and a way of life.
I just got 4 other ttrpg systems over the holidays out of curiosity but lo and behold, it’s now my cushion against the storm to come!
- Mouse Guard (Burning Wheel System)
-The Spire: the City Must Fall and The Heart: the City Below (D10 system)
-Numenera (Cypher System)
- Band of Blades (Forged in the Dark)
Also having reached the end of the video and hearing your suggestion to mention any 3rd party creators or other RPGs we like, I wanna give a big shoutout to Kids on Brooms for taking the urban fantasy magic school flavor of the Wizarding World and making it more inclusive.
I also want to shoutout to Mage Hand Press and their homebrew supplement Valda's Spire of Secrets, as well as Plus 3 Press and their upcoming supplement Elementara.
Lastly I want to mention the unofficial Pokémon TTRPG "Pokérole". I think it's really good at capturing the spirit of the Pokémon anime while running on the Storyteller system.
I am a content creator and a significant part of my income over the last years has been tied to D&D, primarily through the DMsguild. Last year I wrote my first full-length OGL book (Sailors of the Sunken Sea) and released it on to DriveThruRPG. This week I was going to announce a Kickstarter for my second OGL book, which was meant to be the start of a series of 9 books running over the course of the next two years and an incredible amount of work has already gone into them. As you might understand those plans have been thrown into disarray. I barely make ends meet as it is and with everything going on I don't know what my future looks like, but it's not looking great. I want to thank you for spreading awareness of this issue and raising so many good points.
If you want us to offer alternative system ideas, the two I've played in the last decade were Savage Worlds(incredibly versatile system), and anything Powered by the Apocalypse(PbtA). I've had some problems with PbtA, mainly since I think I prefer having more crunch and don't want narrative to come at the expense of it.
But y'know what, 5e had that same problem as far as I'm concerned.
FYI: Savage Worlds uses the old OGL. They are in danger too.
I don't like pbta systems, but there are great systems like you mentioned savage worlds (they recently released a fantasy focused manual), the old runequest 2, and many others... The point would be to create a third party community that publishes for the same system at the same quality of 5e
Another options would be to just use the basic concept of the game mechanically and just play without officially licensed material. Go full homebrew if you want. They cannot copyright the idea of bounded accuracy (which is what we roll any dice for). They cannot copyright the concept of resources being finite, or replenished on specific triggers. They cannot copyright any of the things that make D&D a game. They can only copyright the extremely specific things that aren't relevant to your experience with the game.
@@imayb1 technically true. But if they are so far modified from DnD that they could drop the ogl with no worry of law suits.
Savage Worlds use of the ogl is lip service at best.
All of this is painful due to how much D&D means to us as a hobby and as a system we made friendships and memories with. However, at the end of the day, especially as Hasbro's stocks have been plummeting for the last years, they forgot something that caused Pathfinder to take over when 4e failed:
*They* need us. We do not.
While everyone is looking at how it effects publishers creating content I'm also concerned about how it will effect services that help market towards it such as Fantasy Grounds and Roll20, you can presently choose to use these services for free if you are homebrewing or using published works but what if WoTC then says "you use our character sheets so we would like a portion of your membership fees" would they be able to afford to still offer free use or will we be seeing more and more of them getting strong armed into charging for entry-level access to their supplies tied to D&D?
I've watch a few other videos on this subject Mike, but seriously dude, I apprecite your insights the most. Keep up the great content. Happy New Gaming Year!
Part of me is curious if the leak came from someone in WotC who doesn't agree with it, and wants this kind of outrage. I know that it's a long shot, but it's possible that one of the designers is against this and wants to force executives to walk it back.
Noticed the survey was still up last night and it made me very happy.
I have rarely feel so uplifted and motivated by a youtuber talking about this new OGL mess. Subscribed!
Great video sir and well spoken on how to approach this issue without losing sight of the multiple side paths to reach it.
I was waiting for a few of the calmer heads to speak before really diving into this. Thank you for your analysis.
Thanks for putting this out. I hadn't remembered the survey was still open. I was able to go and take it as I was watching this video. They have an option to bypass reviewing the new stuff so it doesn't skew those results and just lets you enter additional comments. I was able to relay our message there. That said, if they do go through with this I'm glad I already own the core books so I can just homebrew everything from there, I won't be supporting them any further if they revoke the OGL.
This is a good video. I like that Mike is standing with our community.
We're absolutely here for Dollar Votes. I'm wondering if this would hit Critical Role, and what they've said on this subject. I personally am glad that I already have every book from them I could want to play 5e, so I can just stop buying stuff from WotC if this gets implemented without compromising my game.
The 3rd party companies that came to meet with WotC had to sign NDAs before seeing the new OGL, so no one from CR has says anything, although Matt liked a Tweet basically saying that the new OGL would be a disaster, that might be the closest we get to a statement from them.
I may buy hardcover copies of a few books I only own on DDB, but I don't want to touch anything they're putting out this year; it's tainted to me.
Damn it, I'll still see the movie. But no new books, you bastards!
I've noticed that in the new campaign, Matt has renamed all the gods and at first I thought it was supposed to show some cultural differences between Marquet and other places in Exandria. But I wasn't completely convinced because the names had always been the same on other continents (and I can't remember if the gods were mentioned by Marquesians in C1). And then this all surfaced and I'm now convinced Matt is more likely trying to save whatever he can from WotC. That's how they managed to do it for LoVM, and it will make it easier for him in the future if he wants to move away from DnD.
@@SupergeekMike CR has maintained since moment one that they would rather fail doing it their way than succeed doing it someone else's way: I think that like from Matt was a "warning shot" to WotC. It wouldn't be prudent for them to make a statement based on speculation - even backed my multiple well regarded sources and essentially confirmed by Kickstarter grade speculation - but I would be genuinely shocked if CR wasn't already working on an agreement-independent system (maybe even with Piazo, or Kobald Press who they've had a relationship with in the past) to use instead.
Honestly, the only advantage WotC has is the OneD&D site, and the only reason I'm not already working on a site that brought together non-1.0 game systems and hosted online character sheets and a market for their source books (a la current D&D Beyond) is a complete and total lack of programming savvy, and even them I'm actively reaching out to people I know that do.
Personally I wouldn't be surprised if CR had a private licensing agreement with WotC outside of the OGL, much like they licensed elder scrolls and witcher music for bgm.
Thank you for this smart analysis, and the possible concrete next steps!
Excellent video. I've recently burnt myself out running D&D so I'm excited to see what other systems and things you're going to bring to this channel in the future, but I enjoy watching this content just for your views on stuff even if it's not directly applicable to anything I'm doing right now. Thank you for taking WotC to task for an incredibly evil and gross move on their part.
Great video with good ideas. I also got into 7th Sea and cancelled my pre-orders with WotC. Gotta do what ya gotta do.
This is the most cogent and comprehensive video on the topic and I've watched them all.....or at least it feels like it😮💨. SUBSCRIBED.
This was a fantastic and very level-headed approach to the topic. Best of all, your advice of civil - but firm - feedback is exactly what would get their attention.
Thank you for this video. I know this time must be esspecially stressful for you as a content creator. Your content is appriciated, and I followed your call to action.
I've watched a lot of videos about this over the last few days, and I think this is the most comprehensive and constructive. Thank you.
Best video about this so far- I’m going to go leave my review because yes. I won’t be giving wotc any money unless major major changes are made.
I don't play DND often, I am a dm for Vampire the masquerade. But this honestly sucks! You all have my support.
Mike, this was a great video. Your take on it was very personal and well-worth listening to. Pulling a license that was listed as perpetual is pretty low. I realize there may be a legal difference between perpetual and irrevocable, but most of us aren't IP lawyers. And I want to try Fantasy AGE anyway. Or just play something else I already own. We don't need to shovel more money their way.
I very much appreciate your video on the topic.
Great video, you have gained a new subscriber!
Honestly the most horrible and detestable part of this whole horrible and detestable mess is the fact that Wizards of the Coast can just take your creative work, or just say that you can't publish it.
So I definitely agree that everything in the OGL 1.1 conversation is all alleged, mainly because it hasn't been officially released. So with One D&D content, I have been taking the tactic of "they are playtesting things, it is how the game grows and gets better" Which from a game creation perspective is true. Then I heard about the OGL 1.1; at first I didn't really think anything about it, "it is a leak, its not official", but then I really started looking into it. I 100% agree with you, this is Hasbro and WotC trying to throw their corporate weight around. From everything in the OGL 1.1, it looks like they are trying to stop another Pathfinder from coming out.
The thing I am struggling with is this, I only recently got into D&D about 2 years ago, it started with me diving into CR, then I found a game, then I became a DM. I have invested hundreds of dollars into DnD Beyond because I really enjoy the ease that it brings. So I am fighting the sunken cost fallacy. I agree with everything you are saying, if this gets released, I don't want to support a bully, but I also just got into this system and...ya.
I don't have much more to add, I'm working through my own shit, but it just saddens me that they would try to do this to the community, especially when it is now super popular and is now mainstream culture.
The community should come up with a reasonable 1.2 OGL and make WOTC agree to it.
Thanks, very insightful.
Great call to action Mike. Well spoken, and great points made.
Yeah, this was on the wind for years, it's been slowly marching towards this. Hell, I saw this coming when they started editing digital content people had paid for. Doesn't matter if the edits were good or bad, what they meant is the items you bought were theirs to control, you were just paying for access. Once they started talking about there being One D&D, and essentially D&D as a service, consolidating their markets, buying up online platforms/storefronts, it was clear this would be the next step. You consolidate before you attack.
And make no mistake, that's what this is. It's an aggressive shot across the bow of everyone making money off the OGL. Never mind those creators are one of the only reasons D&D is where it's at right now (I mean, I don't think there's a viable legal strategy, but there's a logical one that WotC essentially owes Critical Role, Penny Arcade and a host of others a cut of it's current success.) Much like UA-cam and their content creators, and every other platform that hosts content, they are all too eager to cut out the people driving profits, or to hamstring them, and to try to divide things so they get as much of the pie as possible. Of course it's a symbiotic relationship, but they never see it that way.
The big irony to this is the OGL might not be needed at all, as you cannot copyright game mechanics. Of course this could be challenged, but no one really wants to be the one to test the language aspects. However, it's probably something that needs to be tested at some point so they can stop being empowered to wield it as a bludgeon.
I am not happy with this. Even the language in what that *have* released is not great.
"OGLs, SRDs, & One D&D
We love the interest and passion the community has for D&D. We love D&D, too. So, when we see the D&D community concerned by rumors and misunderstandings, we want to clear the air and share the facts with you, even if it’s a bit earlier than our original plan. You all matter to us, and we want to provide transparency on how D&D will continue supporting third-party creators.
So, here are the facts:
1. Will One D&D include an SRD/be covered by an OGL?
Yes. First, we’re designing One D&D with fifth edition backwards compatibility, so all existing creator content that is compatible with fifth edition will also be compatible with One D&D. Second, we will update the SRD for One D&D as we complete its development-development that is informed by the results of playtests that we’re conducting with hundreds of thousands of D&D players now.
2. Will the OGL terms change?
Yes. We will release version 1.1 of the OGL in early 2023.
The OGL needs an update to ensure that it keeps doing what it was intended to do-allow the D&D community’s independent creators to build and play and grow the game we all love-without allowing things like third-parties to mint D&D NFTs and large businesses to exploit our intellectual property.
So, what’s changing?
First, we’re making sure that OGL 1.1 is clear about what it covers and what it doesn’t. OGL 1.1 makes clear it only covers material created for use in or as TTRPGs, and those materials are only ever permitted as printed media or static electronic files (like epubs and PDFs). Other types of content, like videos and video games, are only possible through the Wizards of the Coast Fan Content Policy or a custom agreement with us. To clarify: Outside of printed media and static electronic files, the OGL doesn’t cover it.
Will this affect the D&D content and services players use today? It shouldn’t. The top VTT platforms already have custom agreements with Wizards to do what they do. D&D merchandise, like minis and novels, were never intended to be part of the OGL and OGL 1.1 won’t change that. Creators wishing to leverage D&D for those forms of expression will need, as they always have needed, custom agreements between us.
Second, we’re updating the OGL to offer different terms to creators who choose to make free, share-alike content and creators who want to sell their products.
What does this mean for you as a creator? If you’re making share-alike content, very little is going to change from what you’re already used to.
If you’re making commercial content, relatively little is going to change for most creators. For most of you who are selling custom content, here are the new things you’ll need to do:
Accept the license terms and let us know what you’re offering for sale
Report OGL-related revenue annually (if you make more than $50,000 in a year)
Include a Creator Product badge on your work
When we roll out OGL 1.1, we will also provide explanatory videos, FAQs, and a web portal for registration to make navigating these requirements as easy and intuitive as possible. We’ll also have help available to creators to navigate the new process.
For the fewer than 20 creators worldwide who make more than $750,000 in income in a year, we will add a royalty starting in 2024. So, even for the creators making significant money selling D&D supplements and games, no royalties will be due for 2023 and all revenue below $750,000 in future years will be royalty-free.
Bottom line: The OGL is not going away. You will still be able to create new D&D content, publish it anywhere, and game with your friends and followers in all the ways that make this game and community so great. The thousands of creators publishing across Kickstarter, DMsGuild, and more are a critical part of the D&D experience, and we will continue to support and encourage them to do that through One D&D and beyond."
From D&D Beyond
I think this is why so many people said, “Well, okay, some of us just might keep publishing for 5e, that’s fine.” Obviously WotC saw that reaction coming and they’re trying to close that door. It’s very gross.
Hey Mike, hope your wife recovered well. I also got COVID over Christmas...not idea. Still looking forward to that livestream!
Really good take. Subbed. You are fair minded and fun. 😊
i loved this video because it was not just panic :) great job
@16:53 Damn son that concluding question/statement hit deep bro
I like the content you make, thank you
if this goes ahead it makes all of us poorer. so lets make them poorer. The community rejected 4th ed. we can do so again
Love your point that D&D games are typically about a team of underestimated people taking down seemingly impossible foes. Maybe the suits Hasbro has appointed to run WotC need to have a closer look at the material. :) edit: In response to your query about other systems, the ones you mentioned are certainly worth a look. Warhammer Fantasy would be my pick (though definitely not 3rd edition!) It's a gritty low fantasy system and there is a good range of 3rd party material out there.
Great summery! as for me I'm making a Universal TT Wargame/RPG called Ad Arbitrium: Strategies and Treaties "Trium: S&T" that is wholly unique and shares only impetration with other games TT or otherwise... Which this is my first video of yours and I'm subbing as this is very fair and I like your out look on the hobby of Table Top. As for recommendations basic fantasy a good starter fantasy TTRPG that's free. Cogent Roleplay a youtuber made universal RP first TTRPG. Fate and Gurps the greats of the universal TTRPG scene and I don't have any other Fantasy TTRPGs as my collection is mainly Wrargames.
good luck, nd hoop for the best!!
I've been talking it up on other videos, but I absolutely love the Witcher rpg rules. The combat is actually mostly defense oriented, which I love as a DM/GM because it keeps the players engaged even when it's not their turn
"Google capitalism, you're in for a shock" made me spit out my coffee and is my new motto.
Great comments. Agree completely. WOTC should not underestimate the determination of the community.
Thank you for this video. You bring up some ideas I haven't heard before. I'm so glad now that I quit supporting D&D in any form after 4e came out. I remember all the kerfluffle around the design of 4e and the fact that there was no longer an OGL. I moved on to other RPGs and having been happily gaming with other companies ever since. I didn't watch Stranger Things as I'd already heard they played D&D in the show. I don't watch Critical Role and any Twitch streams using D&D content have me looking elsewhere. I voted with my dollars years ago and Hasbro has only confirmed that I made the right decision.
For what it's worth Mike I'm happy to jump systems with you.
Yes, without word directly from WOTC, it's all still "alleged." However, there are a couple of things that scream "yeah, it's the actual real deal" (leaving aside the question of the reliability of the leak sources). First, all the talk of there being an NDA necessary to even get into negotiations for the new licensing set off alarm bells in my mind-it's one thing to negotiate contracts in a closed manner, but these don't seem like a simple closed-door contract negotiation. It seems like they were muzzling those who could prematurely expose these shenanigans. That led me to the second one, that WOTC _knew_ how the community would react to this new license, _knew_ it was going to alienate fans and creators alike, and wanted to try to close everybody in a locked room before they could do anything about it.
I also note that as of noon MST 09 JAN 2023, there still hasn't been anything from WOTC or Hasbro about the leak. If it had been something they were workshopping in-house to gauge response, they likely would have had something in mind PR-wise in case drafts leaked out. This alone, to me, is sufficient to conclude that it is, in fact, what they are trying to do, and that players and creators alike need to respond with a resounding "screw you" back to WOTC and Hasbro.
shenanigans seems like an accurate if way too kind a way to describe this unambiguously vile tactic.
Thanks a lot for making this OGL more understandable. I've read several threads on twitter and I found it uncomfortable to read that I think I understood half of what implies at the time.
Also, I've been thinking in making a DnD inspired comic (maybe making use some of the ancestries or monsters) and now I must give a second thought about....what should I do with that. Maybe erase those ancestries for good and try to avoid problems....or just say f*ck you HoTC and do what I had in mind anyways.
At 16:56 Bahahahaha! I love that comparison! 100% agree the worst audience to attempt to do this too. 🤣 Keep up the good work and great video, brother! 👊😎🍻
Since we're bringing up D&D alternatives in case the corporation does what corporations tend to do, Shadow of the Demon Lord is mechanically quite similar to 5e, with a distinctly more Warhammer Fantasy-esque feel (grittier, grosser). It's also very well-supported, and has a more straightforward-flavored fantasy version coming to Kickstarter soon. My group moved to it from 5e and hasn't looked back.
Thank you! Thank you! and Thank you very much! Finally! Some actual intent, points and clarification.
6:38 it's this uncertainty that WotC is literally banking on to trap creators and farm their content. Just read the copyright law on game rules. It's actually pretty simple and clear.
I honestly don't pay a lot of attention to new DND stuff but I'm finally in the know. Submitted my play test survey
This is one of the best videos on this topic.
This situation is very bad and absolutely unnecessary on Wizards' part. But several points based on the full leaked text now that I've read it:
1. The royalty is on revenue not profits. Even if you lose money, you still owe them money. Given how high the royalty is, I don't think it will be possible to make a profitable OGL'd supplement for most people.
2. There are about half a dozen different possible legal outcomes from them making the old OGL "unauthorized". I'm talking with a copyright lawyer on Friday, but all of them seem pretty bad right now.
3. Some poor soul in the Wizards legal department spent a lot of time and energy fixing nuances and minor issues that the community has raised over the last 20 years. That was completely thankless work and I doubt anyone at Wizards is going to give them credit for it. But I feel for them. They did all that work and the company didn't even bother to lead with "here's all the stuff creators have complained about that we are going to fix" before introducing the toxic stuff.
4. There is one important concession in the new OGL. It admits something Hasbro has not done before: that you can, without the OGL, create "characters, classes, settings, spells, items, new rules, and other creations" for D&D. The problem is, as you pointed out, that they are going to claim you need the SRD for everything. The text of the license even includes an example in which someone simply mentions the word "Dragonborn" and now must reference the SRD.
5. I think that for most creators, making non-SRD D&D material isn't going to be an issue once we learn how to do it. But I don't know how to coordinate as a community and spread that knowledge. Not everyone can afford to pay a copyright attorney. But, for now, I think the safe bet is to make something like _Hot Springs Island_ where your work is unambiguously not subject to the OGL but also very clearly a D&D supplement.
6. Unless I missed something, their new position is that Critical Role and anyone else streaming their game-play needs special permission from Wizards. This stuff isn't covered by the terms of the new OGL.
7. This isn't even about greed. And that's a problem. You can reason with or at least predict greed. But the top leadership at Hasbro is completely erratic. Their own investors don't like them, don't trust them, and think this is a horrible idea that is damaging the value of the brand. Investment analysts have all responded negatively and think the company is worth less now than it was before. I hope what you are asking people to do works, but I assume that if they are willing to bear the full force of Wall Street's wrath, they don't care what creators and players think.
Thanks for mentioning other games like Witcher and 5TD that don't use the OGL. Any chance of seeing some videos on those types of games in the future?
That’s something I’d love to do already, and now especially! Probably not for a few months, but once I build up my buffer and can work further ahead, definitely 👍👍👍
I'm not tired of it. This is IMPORTANT and while fatigue is an issue, the fact is we can't fold on this. Not one inch. This is OUR game.
@SupergeekMike I am so glad you were able to describe the problems that indie publishers have. The jobs that are lost when costs go up. Especially the issues that come in the the community when others horn in on what you have made.
I see this issue as a very simple problem. For the past 23 years 3rd party content creators have been parasitically feeding off of the content and creation of WOTC without paying for it. And, untill recently, WOTC has been a spineless, easily intimidated publisher that caves to the rabid, frantic complaining of its fans when it makes business decisions that are in WOTC'S best interest but they don't like.
I want to look at this issue from a different perspective, if you will. The costs of writing, publishing, printing, and shipping (especially shipping) books in the past two decades have risen to levels that have made surviving as a publisher very difficult. Okay, pass the costs onto the customs when you can. Fewer distribution sources due to book store closures and Amazons hard line cost pricing. Problem three, pirates are stealing you content and publishing the details of your content in text and video form online without compensating you. That's an issue because for every book that doesn't sell when a gamer simply pops over to a website instead of buying a guide, the costs of running a publishing house go up. New popular 3rd party creators start making money, I mean serious money, using your privately owned IP. Enough that it actually poses a real competition threat to your own book sales.
So, what happens now. Well, cut staff, or hire staff that you can pay less? This has happened at WOTC decreasing the quality of new book creation. Increase book prices? You can only increase prices so high before you price yourself out of the market. Maybe you publish fewer books and focus on promoting those you have? 3rd party content creators are still selling thier books using WOTC's ideas without paying for it. Again you lose sales to a competitor of your own making.
Now how would you react if you let you niece use you famous patented cookie recipe for her bake sale and a few years later she was earning thousands of dollars with you secret family recipe? If you ask her to stop the people that she hired might be fired! But it's not her recipe.
Or, what would you do if a group of artists had squatted on your land for years? They make popular art that sells well! But they are squatting? On your land and not paying rent!
Your argument is peple might be fired. There will be a financial cost to real people. My response is those independent publishers should write, design, promote, and distribute unique and independent TTRPGs TTRPGs thier own designs. Its called adapting to the business environment. If the only reason you make sales is your content uses someone else's IP to make a profit then maybe you need to pay royalties. 25%? Well maybe not that much, but something. Is WOTC threatening the viability of it's own competitors? I would, in a heartbeat. I don't know of a business that wouldn't try to claw back the rights to it's own IP when not doing so negatively impacts its financial viability. Will people lose thier jobs? Those people aren't employed by WOTC. Not thier payroll, not thier problem.
I actually applauded WOTC. I thought it was idiotic to allow people to sell their own DND shit for years. In my opinion they should have gone with a license similar to the Creative Commons Share and Share alike license all those years ago instead of the idiotic OGL.
I was so excited for your take on this! Thank you for addressing it. I only learned about all this yesterday because I live under a rock and your video gives me hope.
The issue with just protesting in the playtest feedback is it won't get to people who can affect change. The employees sorting through that won't be handing those to higher ups. If anything they will write a program to filter out anything with that hashtag and then handing whatever is left over to the next arm of the process. It wouldn't shock me if the people on the top end of the company never even knows it happened.
So, in this, the age of technology and social media, text messages and email, spend the .60 cents or whatever it costs in your country to write to their corporate HQ and tell the CEO in a physical letter. It's Illegal in many parts of the world to interfere with and open mail not addressed to you, so he'll be the only one allowed to open it/accept receipt of it. It may seem tediously old fashioned but look at it this way, you spent 30+$ on a book for this game, what's 60 cents or even .99 cents (oh and add in a few more cents in case you don't have an envelope) for one that heavy berceuse you had so much to say. Plus, it has the added bonus of showing them that you were so serious about this that you were willing to take the time and effort and cost to write to them, it shows you mean business because email and texts take 30 seconds at most for most people, you can say something you don't really mean then oops its already sent. A letter shows dedication and means so much more than a 2 second note that may or may not reach the intended recipient.
Bruh. Just use the books on anyflip for the time being until the OGL changes
As a swede i'm biased but check out Free Leagues Forbidden Lands or their upcoming game Drakar och Demoner/Dragonbane if you like fantasy. Easy to learn mechanics and a lot of focus on the RP. We play a lot of their games in my group so.
Players don't need WotC to continue playing the game. If they make unreasonable demands, we can drop them and continue on as before. We already have the rules, we have dice, we can play, no matter what they say.
Content creators have it much harder, but there are always options and alternative systems, some of which you've mentioned in the video.
D&D may be the king of tabletops right now, but it is corroding the stone its throne is built from.
Grey Ghost Games makes Fudge and it is one of my favorite universal systems.
Thank you for this video. I have been seeing some mixed or outright contradicting info about it, so it is useful for me.
I'm almost sad I don't spend money directly to WotC so I can actually boycott them if that OGL pass, I don't have dnd beyond and buy second hand manuals (pro tip for anyone who want to buy the three corebooks: in this fine post christmas period you can find brand new manuals on second hand webed site). But what I do spend money on is third party content, and this new policies is making me even sadder. There's a few third party content I was looking forward to eventually buy, and some of the aspect that I love in my games directly comes from third party content (like my whole character creation comes from an elf and an orc had a little baby), and yes I can and will still use it for 5e, but that means I probably won't be switching for 6e with that policy of theirs.
On the other hand, that was the push I needed to actually look into other rpg lmao. I finally bought sense and sensibilities (yes, it is wildly different from dnd, but my table still is excited to try it) and for the past two days I have been working on a Numenéra one shot to try it out ! And I'm actually quite excited with it !
one more little fun thing about all this... it really is the WORST time to do this, not only for the discussed reasons but also.... we are entering if not already in the era of GEN Z wich got introduced massively to TTRPG's and DnD through different recent media.
they are litteraly gambling getting more money from GEN Z, wich we already know is one hell of a shitty idea.
if this goes through there is a good chance WotC goes full on titanic and sinks to the bottom of the TTRPG abyss.
really surprises me how big corporate still struggles at reading the zeitgeist/air du temps in 2022 and now 2023
WotC aren't the only ones, almost all of them are trying desperately to make more money in a system that is falling apart day by day
It is a very good time to support indie game designers and try new systems.
Ill add that the Swedish publishing firm Free League (Fria Ligan), has some really good games, and as far as I have expereinced a good team of people. I have not checked if any of their stuff will be hit by the potential new OGL, but they have some good games.
I think Kobald Press is heeding Littlefinger's comment on the troubled situation in Westeros
"Chaos is a ladder"
The only books I'm missing at this point from DnD is post-Tasha's Cauldron of Everything, and I personally think they have been doing an awful job creating work around this time and have little desire to purchase the new books. This business with the OGL has killed my want to do this, and I've been playing DnD since 2014 and DMing since 2017, planning to finalize a book I've been working on. At this rate, I'm just going to look into building my own system because this is just that dangerous
Them going back to OGL 1.0 is not enough. They need to add a line that says that the OGL is irrevocable and can't be deauthorized, otherwise fuck 'em. They're untrustworthy, and if we come out on top, we need something legally binding that says this can never happen again - ever. If they don't take this path, I will never be their customer again.
I spent the last year and a half making a 5e world book. i was going too release the info in December but due too complications of a sick variety I could not. Now with this news i do not know what too think I hope this thing gets solved so i did not waste the past year of my life but who knows.
Submitted my feedback with this just today.
On an unrelated note: get that Warhammer FRP book ASAP. Even if you don't end up playing it, there are a lot of really great features Warhammer FRP has that are relatively easy to introduce into other similar tabletop games, and can add a lot of depth to them, especially if you like a bit of grit in with your fantasy.
We should do a protest outside their head-office
I love your comment at the end regarding banding together.
Best video on the topic
You mention a number of games as alternatives, but so many games were released using the OGL, even when they weren't trying to be compatible. Pathfinder (which you didn't include) but also 13th Age (which you did). I don't see a declaration of product identity or an OGL in my copy of Blue Rose (the AGE edition version). The non-D&D style games using the OGL are a heartbreaking casualty here.
Wow, yeah, this whole thing keeps getting worse from every new angle we look at it from. Sheesh…