Triumph Bonneville T140v - Part 10 - Stuck Clutch!!!
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- Опубліковано 3 тра 2024
- Join the adventure as we tear into the Triumph T140v Bonneville to find out why the clutch was stuck. We take the primary cover off, tear down the clutch, reassemble it and take it for a test ride.
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I appreciate you taking the time to make this video. Fix one problem and another springs up a few months later. Maybe I'm a masochist, but keeping these old bikes on the road is part of the thrill 😂
Hi @tpolskiii, thanks so much for your kind word and taking the time to leave a comment! Really appreciate the feedback. Yeah, you are totally right. Working on these bikes and keeping them going is part of the experience, just as much as riding is! Like you say, working on the bikes is weirdly enjoyable :) Especially so, when you get them fixed and get out on the road. Thanks Again, and if you haven't already, please subscribe! Really appreciate it!
These clutches work fine 🎉
Hi @radboo4384, you're right :)! They're perfect when they work :) Thanks very much for your comment! If you haven't already, please subscribe. I'd really appreciate it! Cheers!
I have a Yamaha XJ6S Diversion 2011 and I put new friction plates in the clutch myself in April '21 because the clutch was slipping. The next time I came to use the bike the clutch was stuck on and the friction plates had swollen so I had to take the cove back off to adjust the screw and lock nut again. I still strap the clutch lever down between rides. The clutch behaves perfectly when riding the bike.
@diversionbob8482 that's really interesting! I have had a number of motorcycles, but I guess I have lead a sheltered life because I had never heard of the practice of needing to strap down the clutch handle to keep a clutch from sticking. I am learning something new :) ...and equally interesting that you have experienced this issue on a Yamaha. I thought this was purely a British Bike thing, but I guess not. Thanks so much for your comment!
It's not the adjustment. Use the correct wet clutch motorcycle engine oil. Just kick the clutch loose before starting the engine, they all stick after a while.
Hi
@peterboerema7260 thanks very much for the comment! I am using 20/50 motorcycle oil in the bike and did try kicking the bike over repeatedly. I also tried rocking the bike back and forth repeatedly over the course of a couple of days, but to no avail. That's why I resorted to taking the bike apart to see what was going on. I found that the nuts holding the springs down were significantly out of adjustment, with the top of the bolts sitting more than 3/8" below the slot in the spring nut slots. Given the nuts were this loose the outer basket and inner hub were able to 'wiggle' independently of each other, causing the clutch to bind. This is a new bike for me so a mystery as to why those spring nuts were so loose, but guessing it was attempt by the prior owner to achieve an easier to pull clutch handle. Thanks again for your comment and if you haven't already, please subscribe. I would really appreciate it :)
Not sure is your adjustments resolved the click on operating the clutch. When I rebuilt my clutch, it started making that noise. I saw a "raber's tech tip #1" video that explained what was causing it. As I recall, the fix was to slacken off the clutch cable at the lever, then adjusting the clutch push rod (in the center of clutch basket. Needs to be screwed in to to make contact, then backed off a 1/2 to 3/4 slack. Without that play, the lever is overextending the lift mechanism and snapping the ball bearing out of its keeper. Also, really good is lunmads video on how to balance the clutch basket so there is no wobble. He did it by kicking over the bike with the clutch lever engaged, a bit easier to see the wobble than when you turn it by hand.
Hi @DodgyBagehot, you're absolutely right about the clutch adjustment and works exactly as you have described. That process fully resolves the annoying 'clicking' that can occur when the clutch is maladjusted. Lunmad's videos are great and I have watched many of them too. Sorry to know that he has passed on, but he lives on his videos, continuing to provide great advice. The main issue I had other than just a stuck clutch was how hard the clutch lever was to pull combined with the engagement point being right at the end of the throw (when correctly adjusted). Both of those problems are now fixed. In this video I installed a 7 disc clutch with reduced the amount of force needed to pull in the clutch lever: ua-cam.com/video/yGT0_aIy-4I/v-deo.html Then I did a very easy modification to change the engagement point of the clutch (while still adjusted correctly), enabling the engagement point to move closer to the handlebar rather than at the end of the throw: ua-cam.com/video/DV3kxgZJmx0/v-deo.html Can't thank you enough for your comment and for watching the videos! If you haven't already, please subscribe! Really appreciate it!
@@MadTinkerman my 77 t140 had only 4k on it when I got it in 2019 , last registered in 1981. While the clutch had seized (of course), once I cleaned it up, the stack was well within spec. So I kept them. I have heard others say the clutch on these bikes is stiff, I have not found that to be the case. I wonder if different model years had different leverage on the handle. I did rebuild it, replaced the liquidfied rubber bumpers (whatever those are called) checked the rear thrust washer etc and lubed roller bearings. the basket needed a little clean up. I have found that if I don't clear the clutch an hour or so after a ride, it will get stuck. If rocking the bike in gear is not enough, you can always put it on center stand, start it up and put in gear, wait for it to warm up a bit, then ease on the back brake while holding clutch lever in. (Of course, keep front brake engaged, and weight forward to keep rear wheel up) In terms of operation, smooth shifting, no slipping, no clunks, I've had no problem with the original clutch plates. The trick of taking some pressure off the clutch by engaging clutch with a strap or something while it cools off might seem peculiar, but it is cheap. I'll run these until they are out of spec and then see what the modern materials are like. The original friction plate material looked like cork to me. Don't know.
HI @DodgyBagehot what a find! A 1977 bike with only 4K on it and not registered since 1981 is amazing and pretty much unobtanium if you were trying to find one! That's great that were you were able to save the old clutch discs by cleaning them up. By taking it apart and cleaning up the discs and clutch basket I was able to save mine as well and rode it for a while but the clutch lever was still quite stiff. I measured 43lbs of pressure (using an old fish scale) to pull the lever and, although not totally necessary as there was plenty of clutch material, I decided to swap it out. When I did the seven disc clutch mod I measured the old and new clutch plates with my caliper and interestingly the old clutch plates were a little bit larger than spec, which I found weird and I think that may have been the issue on my bike. The seven disc clutch are smaller than spec of course to allow for the 7th disc. Not sure if someone put the wrong fibre plates in it or if they were just manufactured poorly or what. In any event changing them out made a huge difference and now it only takes 17lbs of pressure to pull in the lever, so about 2.5x improvement and zero issues with the clutch sticking so far. I just clear the clutch before I start it each time by pulling in the lever and giving it a couple of kicks. For your bike with the original discs, apparently back in the day most guys put a rubber band or vise grips or something else to hold the clutch lever depressed after each ride, so that's probably the thing to do, although seemingly a bit weird, if it works that might be the thing to do with a bit of a nod to how it was done back in the day. Thanks again for the comment and have fun riding the great bike!
Those bolts (or captive nuts) were really far out. Like something quit half way through the job. I did the 7 plate clutch conversion on mine, which makes the clutch a lot lighter. My 750 came with the hardest clutch lever I've ever felt. I had to do something about it.
When I put everything back together I refilled the primary with 350cc of oil not realizing that the manual says to prime it with 118cc and the engine breather holes will do the rest. In the front of the manual it says the primary capacity is 350cc's which is what I put into it the first time around. I had to empty a bunch of oil out. Then the clutch worked fine.
Hi @daveco1270, I am also seriously considering the 7 plate conversion kit. I am in Canada and the Aerco kit is more available to me than the Hyde and it appears to have good reviews so thinking I may pull the trigger and purchase it soon, as you're right. Now that the clutch is properly assembled and adjusted, it takes significant effort to pull in the clutch lever. Curious to know which kit you purchased?
@@MadTinkerman I'm pretty sure I got the Aerco kit. It works great. My clutch lever has a much lighter pull on it now. It was a little tricky adjusting the clutch. I turned the adjuster screw in until I felt pressure then turned it out a half turn, maybe even a smidge less than half a turn, otherwise I'd get that clicking sound that's apparently not good. (Still not sure what causes that clicking sound when you're out of adjustment.) Being my first time doing a clutch, I wasn't sure how tight to go on the captive nuts on the pressure plate. I think I set them similar to what you did with yours. Also, I soaked the friction plates in oil before putting them on, but they stuck together and it was hard to free up the clutch, so i took it apart and wiped them down then put them back together. Then it worked a lot better. So going in with the plats dry might be the way to do it. And like I said before, you don't put the full capacity 350cc's of oil back into the primary. My manual says to prime it with 118cc's or some equivalent measurement. It'll slowly find the right level apparently.
@@daveco1270 The click sound is the 3 ball ramp plate in right hand cover going too far.. . Be sure to loosen clutch cable before attempting to adjust pushrod on clutch basket.
An SRM pressure plate with needle bearing lift mechanism helps too.
Hi @p-n, interesting info about the SRM pressure plate. I'll check it out! Thanks!
Yes, been running one on my Triumphs for decades
@@BLUESBOYBENFIELD good to know! If I have any other issues, I am definitely going to order a SRM pressure plate an install it. Thanks so much for your input. If you haven't already, please subscribe! Really appreciate it.
Another great vid bud.
@FuriousGriffin thanks so much! Appreciate it!
use a magnet take plates out, easier that way.
Hi @johnpetermoeller4783, that's a great idea! Using a magnet to remove the clutch plates would definitely be easier. I'll keep this in mind for next time! Thanks so much for your comment, and if you haven't already, please subscribe. Really appreciate it!
STOP THE PRESS: 45 year + motorcycle has previously had the clutch apart. !
Mount a sharpie barely touching the pressure plate , substitute a dial gauge if you have one to hand, disengage the clutch while kicking over getting any witness line as even, fine and consistent as possible indicates good even lift.
Triumph twin is a 'lawn mower engine' , you can't go far wrong.
@dogpaw775...Hysterical! Yeah, I guess I shouldn't have been so surprised to see that the clutch had been apart before ! :) Your ideas on how to balance the pressure plate are really good ones. I don't yet have a dial gouge so I'll give your sharpie idea a go next time I open up the primary. I am seriously considering a 7 disc kit, so I'll definitely do that if/when I open her back up. Thanks Again for the info and feedback, I really appreciate it!
Hello; is not clearly why so stuck?
How much you screw the clutch adjusters in depend on the thickness of the plates pack. In the manual says the thickness and mention to flush with the bolts but that is a reference due to the worn out of a used plate so you should screw them a bit more. Do the math. However; if you use a 7 plate kit (I have a Hyde one in a 79 and a MAP 6 plates on other 79) you need to measure again to decide. No slip no drag and no stuck ever with the MAP clutch. Possible the same with the Hyde but I do not have thousands of km on it yet.
--Is important to understand that the clutch do not need oil; the oil is for the chain mainly; so the plates should be assembled dry
-check the spring length (see manual) May be they are worn out hence you need to screw in more...
-When assembling you put 150cc of oil and nothing more.
-Other thing to do is align both sprockets; if you check the parts book you will see that there is a number for the shims required.
By the way I put around 10000km per year in these bikes mostly with success but is imperative before that to get rid of all the crap that PO s have been butchering and malpractice on them.
Hi @TheReverb1 thanks so much for the great information and advice! Since that video I have installed a 7 disc clutch kit by Aerco. I am in Canada and the Hyde kit would have taken longer to get here but apparently the Aerco is very similiar to the Hyde that you have. It has made a huge difference in terms of how hard the clutch lever was to operate and the clutch no longer sticks. I have done a video on that job too. If you haven't already, please subscribe! I really appreciate it!
The clutch hub must not be loose on the mainshaft !.Remove the hub & check condition of the shaft and keyway.
Hi @russturner1570 thanks so much for this tip! I did visually inspect the hub to check for grooving but didn't fully remove the hub as it looked to be in good condition. If ever I have similar issues again, I'll know to remove the hub. I have since installed a 7 disc clutch kit and it is working fantastic, with zero sticking issues. Here's the link to that video: ua-cam.com/video/yGT0_aIy-4I/v-deo.html Really appreciate you taking the time to share this advice and comment! If you haven't already, please subscribe! I really appreciate it!
@@MadTinkerman yeah, I agree the clutch basket and hub looked a bit loose. Two separate adjustments. The owner that backed the shit out of the clutch retaining bolts may have gotten further into that clutch. I'd read about what happens if either the hub or basket fail. I imagine it would be expensive if not dangerous. Triumphrat and britbike are good discussion groups. I'm sure there are others.
@@DodgyBagehot thanks so much for that input. If I have any issues with it, that will be the first thing I check! Thanks again!
Duct tape rag over handle works great .
Hi @sundayhinojosa8114, another great idea! Anytime you can include duct tape as part of the repair process, you should :) ! Thanks Again for the comment and the great idea!
It can be oil on the plates, when renewing the engine oil, if too much oil is put in crankcase it will breathe through into the primary case. Suction causes the plates to bind, the only way to free them is to strip the clutch and wash them in spirit to de grease.
@georgemoskal2098 that's interesting! Thanks very much for sharing this info! If you haven't already please subscribe as I could really use a few more subscribers :) Appreciate the feedback!
Cheap wide flat tip screwdriver and grind your gap in it?
Hi @sundayhinojosa8114, great idea! I had some flat aluminum bar so made a tool out of that which worked well. The screwdriver idea would be more durable though so will keep my eyes open for one with a super wide blade. Appreciate the input. If you haven't already, please subscribe. I'd really appreciate it. Cheers!