Meh. I'm only taking the class cause I find the teacher hot. ;) While I don't agree with everything Lance says, he is very open with the discussions and makes some very easy to digest content compared to other specialty coffee UA-camrs.
The first video was awesome and it made perfect sense to me. I don't understand why so many people got worked up about it. Value is a massive component when ranking anything in my mind. Thanks, Lance
Hello Lance! I believe a ranking system like the one Crinacle uses to rank IEMs is best. Basically it’s a performance ranking followed by a value rating. You can get a better understanding searching for his ranking as he has it in detail on each grade and star ( value rating ). I believe this might be what people are actually looking for.
Gotta underline the other comments here validating your choice to bring price in. I'm right now looking to get a 64mm grinder or similar for the first time and having price and value as criteria made your list highly practical for me rather than just a wish list of things I'm not gonna be able to afford. It made me feel good about my choices, and didn't just create massive fomo. Love your work!
I’ll be honest I liked including price. So many people just want to hear that there 4000$ grinder that stalls was a great purchase. When they in fact know it was a good purchase ,if massively overpriced because of the diminishing returns and general attitude of people. Quality and Cup does matter as does price. For me it’s why the Zerno got an A. Keep crushing it, excited for the Mazzer review. Let’s be for real from a motor perspective all these DC motors would all be lower ranked. Everyone who works in the field can tell you how much better an AC motor is as long as the circuit board is done properly. It’s why so many things on the planet moved away from DC. So many of these coffee grinder makers just don’t;t fully understand how to get the most out of a circuit board and want to preserve space but only partially kind of lol.
I think as long as the criteria you are grading each item against is clear, I don’t mind what categories you choose to include. Thank you for making all these highly informative videos!
I think you should do a priced tier list: $100 - $500 $500 - $1200 $1200 - $$$ This way you can focus on the machines that are good at that price range but also why those grinders are good for that price
@@ahpadt You can but i think his rating were to heavly leaning on the price range itself. If he picked grinders in that price range he would only compare the merits of the grinder and not the price itself. This way you would have grinders that could be and S through F in one price range and allow for the same in another.
Brian Quan did that. He has several long streams on Grinder Tier List. You can check that one. It was also done by him with several other friends of him with plenty of experience. I highly recommend that videos.
@@JustPassingByBaby Sure and James did the same. there are lots of videos like this. Just trying to give Lance some ideas on how he can go about this in the future
I was very happy price was a factor. I get that how one should use the tier list with that in mind was difficult to understand. But, it was very helpful.
Lance I hope you read this because I often see you swayed by negative comments and potentially overthink it. I have a DF64V and I was watching your video wondering where it would fall, but after your initial explanation of the rubric I already expected it to fall a bit lower. I love my grinder but it completely made sense. So just remember there’s viewers and commentators out there that saw no trouble with it at all. If there’s any critique, it would be that it’s hard for a beginner with no understanding of the wider range of grinders to know why a lower tier grinder would be “better” or output higher quality than a higher tier one from your list. So the suggestion of doing it with a price range would definitely help newer folks to the coffee world.
Surprised by all the hate about price/perceived value. Sure “value” is going to be different for different people based on their financial means and what’s important to them. But tiered lists are just a statement of opinion, not somehow an attack on someone else’s buying decisions. And I think value is an important driver of many, if not most, buyers decisions about a purchase. Not everyone is looking to buy a Ferrari, they are just trying to find that good Toyota Camry you know? So I definitely say please keep price as a factor! If folks don’t like it, I guess you can break tiers up by like over/under $300, $1000, or something. Appreciate all the content you’re making, the hard work shows!
Nice Porto shirt Lance! Also, really enjoyed the ranking video, and pretty satisfied my lil lagom mini got a B (and also recognise & agree that the price is a bit high for the features and little tiny issues/nitpicks it has)
My first grinder I bought was a sette 270w and I returned it right away due to the sound. Too brain penetrating. I can’t handle anything with a high pitch so I’m grateful Lance considered the sound.
Talking about adjusting recipe and brew technique for 078 coming from other grinders, what would that look like exactly and why? Certainly particle peak is different from grinder to grinder, but I'd like to better understand how 078 is different than Comandante or Encore and how to approach it.
One critique I have of the tierlist format is that its hard to get an overview. I'd love some kind of visual representation in the video, the spreadsheet doesn't matter that much to me
IMO your ranking was spot on, there isn't really anything I would change other than adding a graphic. I get that it's an opinion. And I think that money is a vital factor. I'm willing to spend some money on stuff, but I also look for value. I don't have the money just buy the most expensive everything. And also, please don't just do what every other UA-camr does. Just do you! I auto skip any tier ranking videos because they're boring and honestly pretty dumb. They're usually just for views. They try to drive engagement by dunking on some and making others S tier for controversy: pure entertainment. Yours was informative and helpful.
For the comparison between the PK100 and the Niche Zero, it’s important to remember that the former device costs roughly 5X the price of the niche and is designed for lab work.
2min in and I have to say, taking price into consideration was the right move in my mind!!! Price, feature, value - that's the holy trinity. It would be too easy to just tier the grinders without price!
Does the Femobook A68 conical present coffee noticeably differently then 64 SSP HUs? I really want to enter the world of conicals and the A ranking + small footprint of the grinder has really piqued my interest. I also love magnets so there's that.
I have an ESP, the built in on my Barista Pro (basically the same thing imo) and a number of hand grinders from 1zpresso, timemore and Kingrinder. I find the ESP being an A tier disheartening. Taste is fine, I have no issue with that. However, it is plasticy and feels cheap. It is loud. After grinding coffee for three shots the grind constancy seems to become wild unless you let the grinder rest for a while. The thumb screw for the burr loosens after every 10-ounce bag of coffee. The plastic lever on the side vibrates out of place. Retention, for me, is high with caveats. If you use a bellows, it is fine. If you don't and just tap it to get the extra coffee out, you will end up with about an extra 3 grams in your catch cup every 4-5 shots. Price is good. And again, the coffee is fine. Fair body and balanced flavor if not slightly acidic (which is fine since I tend to run darker roasts, so it actually helps). And it is affordable. Now, I want to say that I pull, on average, 6 shots a day so I do use my grinder a fair bit. I do not drink filter coffee, at all. I just wonder where it would be on the list if it wasn't weighted by price.
I'm a DF64V owner. It's the new version, so it has the ioniser, slow feeder etc... I get that it's impossible to rank the DF grinders as they're shifting the goal posts all the time. For what it's worth, in it's current state, and give it a B, as it has genuinely improved and they now don't allow RPM of less than 800, but it's all good, here. Great video.
I liked your tier list video. Grouping by price is useful to me. if you drop that grouping, maybe do a Consumer Reports type of point system that compares all grinders against a set of factors and ranks them all from top to bottom rank. then if my budget is 500 I can still figure out the best bang for buck in that range
if you have the different values in a spreadsheet (as numbers) you could create a new column of results that divides some of the quality metrics by cost ($) so that folks get both objective quality numbers and some value metric to compare across price points more readily
I think a tier list not including price as a consideration would be the way to go but then a value for money scale 1-10 added as a side note to every grinder.
As someone who ended up getting 2 Varios w/ steels because of your videos talking about mods, I understand the rating system completely. It really helped me getting fairly close to high-end espresso (Flair 58) and pourovers for ridiculously low prices since I enjoy tinkering and modding things. If you don't have that predilection then a used Vario is a terrible grinder to get compared to what's coming out nowadays stock from Turin, Fellow, and Baratza for a similar price range. I'm eyeing an Ode 2 to replace my pourover focused Vario. I think the espresso Vario will pretty much be run until it dies because the taste of espresso it puts out has been unmatched compared to anything I've had within a reasonable price range but I haven't tried much else to be fair.
Thank you for clarifying. I suggest you do two tier lists in a tier list video (one price included value for buck and other regardless of the price) since you are already going through the effort. this will make video more comprehensive and satisfy everyone who cares about value or cup quality. you do not even have to go deep in the price list just say this for bang for buck gets this or regardless of value gets that.
How about a chart system -quality in cup 7/10 -probably with some comment, then build quality 6/10, retention, workflow, and finally price can be listed. Then the viewers can choose what’s important to them. This is pretty clean 4 ratings and a price. Another problem with price is different markets vary. I’m in Canada, mazzer philos is $1600, df78v is $1100, and a Weber is $5400. If these are even close in the cup I’m going df78v, if I’m worried about build quality and longevity I’m going mazzer, if I won the lottery I’m going weber. This overall rating really makes it harder. If we’re shopping cars quiet and smooth ride with great seats is far more important to me than my son. I know you have all this info. And thanks for doing that , it just needs to get presented differently
It's easy to see why people would be upset to find out that a respected coffee professional thinks the grinder they researched and bought with hard-earned money as a long-term investment, is D-tier or whatever. I'm the owner of a DF64V (G-IOTA VS in Europe), and it does have me exasperated with its stalling issues. I too thought they had addressed the issue with the new revision. Yeah, you can avoid the lowest RPMs, but grind quality for long coffee is kind of an ephemeral thing and so I always feel FOMO if I limit it to 800+ RPM to avoid stalling. At least it's easy to open, clean up and restart, and I slow-feed anyway to further improve grind quality so it doesn't happen all that often. But everything else about the grinder is awesome (though I can't say how much better horizontal burrs would be). I can't understate how much I appreciate its small footprint and quiet volume. Those are really important attributes to me, but I wouldn't recommend it to someone who wants hassle-free low-RPM coffee. I do wonder though if reviewers would have received the product better if it were _more_ limited than it is now (800 or even 1000 RPM minimum) from the start. Like, would you have given it a B then?
I prefer a dedicated espresso grinder and a filter grinder. As a predominantly med roast espresso drinker who enjoys body and texture , I’d love to know which ones shine in this.
Price is a factor. A big one. You’ll evaluate a McDonalds’s burger differently than one from even Five Guys and certainly one from a proper steakhouse (or enter fine dining)
I was also confused why no grinder got an F. While i totally relate to the not wanting to give an F because you didn’t want to upset people it almost challenges your integrity. I always love and respect your opinion because you’re up front, but when you said that it made me rethink about what else have you said that you didn’t want to say because of similar reasons. Overall, I still value your input and effort in specialty coffee, just something that popped up in my head personally.
There is nothing else i could've said that is similar. So not sure your critique holds any water unless you could name an example. I have made hordes of enemies off my opinions...
@@LanceHedrickUnfiltered lol all good I meant no intent my apologies if that’s how it came across. I have watched everything you’ve ever made and value your input and know for a fact you have all the integrity in the world
I think a lot of people praising price as a factor are ignoring that price varies significantly by market. Better to leave price out of the ranking and let viewers factor it in on their own. They are, after all, the ones that would know what their prices are.
Wut??? 😮 I watched the whole tier vid and my only Suggestion would have been having a visible spreadsheet. In any and all product ratings- there should always be a list of scorables for each category that determines overall placement as a tier. I don't understand why people have stopped doing it. Weather or not maximum points are evenly distributed, thats up to the critic to decide. I understand feelings have been hurt but there's no need to excuse the video. Im GLAD my Sette grinders were included and landed on the lower end. Makes me believe that there are superior grinders out there that will justify investment by means of a superior end result. Time for my morning coffee. Cheers** 😊
The whole video would have been completely uninteresting to me, if you hadn't factored in price. Anyone interested in the topic can say that, for example, EG-1 > p64 > Timemore 064 > Fellow Ode > Wilfa Svart > a blade grinder. Great value is what's interesting, though also more subjective and debatable. Comparing what great value means in different price categories is difficult and requires expertise about not just about the specific products but others in the same price range.
In all honesty, money should absolutely be considered. Value for money is so important. Great coffee is perceived as having an extremely high barrier to entry when in reality it doesn’t. Just because you have 2-3k to drop on a high end grinder doesn’t mean you have to get that grinder.
Great explainer video. Leaving price out or as a minimal factor is the right direction. No one can say what $100 means to another person. I think you can have your cake and lose weight too. There's no reason you couldn't do a filter only list, an espresso list and an omni list. You obviously have already thought all this out extensively. Essentially taking the same raw data and applying different filters to it. Thanks for everything. You care and it shows.
You should in secret put all the grinders in order of YOUR preference and then factor in cost. Reorder them with a per cost factor and then publish that list.
I don't know whether your "fixed gap theory" is pitched at both espresso and pour-over, but one of the things that's notable about your pour-over technique is that you "hardly adjust the grind size", instead making adjustment in the technique. Doesn't that make a grinder like the Niche more useful (ignoring the fact that you don't like the Niche for pour-over)?
I can not understand this praise for 078, must be something wrong with mine...I had to sell it for how boring coffee it made. Now I am wondering what did I do wrong...
whats your discord channel, love to join that. Also would love to hear your take on Zerno vs Philos for Europeans? Philos might be easier to get, but it so big and super ugly looking for sure.
i have a feeling you are a bit too honest and just care too much for the current youtube meta 😅 99% of the tier lists are just random rankings ppl come up with on the spot and are meant to be provocative to trigger engagement. it's not a great format for serious product comparison. you'll have to create a boring table on a website for that and comparatively few would really look at that.
I've watched a lot of different types of teor videos, and maybe they are more typically held to one category, but I think your list was helpful. You can look at each tier, and just separate it out by your target price. Encore is your budget A, Timmeore 64s is your $600 range A tier, ect. Not that hard.
While I appreciate your focus on swapping burrs in the ratings, I am not sure how relevant this is for the average coffee nerd. Good quality burrs often add a considerable cost to a grinder, so I in my personal opinion, a grinder with a lot of headroom to upgrade (e.g. DF64) should be compared BOTH to similarly priced grinders (let‘s say eureka specialita) AND to grinders that are the cost of the base model plus, for example, 300 dollars for upgraded burrs (this wouldt then something like a Sculptor 78S, which is a HUGE jump)
Feel like you care and spend too much effort on online opinions…. Just do what you feel the best for your channel, it’s YOUR channel, not anyone else’s.
No i care about making content that is helpful. If nothing i do is helpful because I ignore criticism and/or feedback, then what's the point? Appreciate the sentiment tho
handgrinders tierlist gonna be super interesting.
This honestly feels like a bunch of students are mad they failed an exam and the teacher explains why everyone failed 😂
Meh. I'm only taking the class cause I find the teacher hot. ;)
While I don't agree with everything Lance says, he is very open with the discussions and makes some very easy to digest content compared to other specialty coffee UA-camrs.
The first video was awesome and it made perfect sense to me. I don't understand why so many people got worked up about it.
Value is a massive component when ranking anything in my mind.
Thanks, Lance
Hello Lance!
I believe a ranking system like the one Crinacle uses to rank IEMs is best.
Basically it’s a performance ranking followed by a value rating. You can get a better understanding searching for his ranking as he has it in detail on each grade and star ( value rating ).
I believe this might be what people are actually looking for.
Crinacle is great. Also kind of hate him because ive spent so much on audio now
@@TheSwoon69 XD
Gotta underline the other comments here validating your choice to bring price in. I'm right now looking to get a 64mm grinder or similar for the first time and having price and value as criteria made your list highly practical for me rather than just a wish list of things I'm not gonna be able to afford. It made me feel good about my choices, and didn't just create massive fomo. Love your work!
I’ll be honest I liked including price. So many people just want to hear that there 4000$ grinder that stalls was a great purchase. When they in fact know it was a good purchase ,if massively overpriced because of the diminishing returns and general attitude of people. Quality and Cup does matter as does price. For me it’s why the Zerno got an A. Keep crushing it, excited for the Mazzer review.
Let’s be for real from a motor perspective all these DC motors would all be lower ranked. Everyone who works in the field can tell you how much better an AC motor is as long as the circuit board is done properly. It’s why so many things on the planet moved away from DC. So many of these coffee grinder makers just don’t;t fully understand how to get the most out of a circuit board and want to preserve space but only partially kind of lol.
Your by far my favourite coffee nerd out there. I'm pretty new to the coffee world but very happy I stumbled upon your videos. Thank you!!
Lance is a front for the real coffee mastermind, Hugo.
I appreciate the price included and understood what you were going for and it helped put things in perspective.
I think as long as the criteria you are grading each item against is clear, I don’t mind what categories you choose to include. Thank you for making all these highly informative videos!
I think you should do a priced tier list:
$100 - $500
$500 - $1200
$1200 - $$$
This way you can focus on the machines that are good at that price range but also why those grinders are good for that price
Agree, being single living alone in todays economy, I can only dream of a mid 4 figure coffee shop on my kitchen counter lol.
You can easily take lances list and arrange it per price categories
@@ahpadt You can but i think his rating were to heavly leaning on the price range itself. If he picked grinders in that price range he would only compare the merits of the grinder and not the price itself. This way you would have grinders that could be and S through F in one price range and allow for the same in another.
Brian Quan did that. He has several long streams on Grinder Tier List. You can check that one. It was also done by him with several other friends of him with plenty of experience. I highly recommend that videos.
@@JustPassingByBaby Sure and James did the same. there are lots of videos like this. Just trying to give Lance some ideas on how he can go about this in the future
I was very happy price was a factor. I get that how one should use the tier list with that in mind was difficult to understand. But, it was very helpful.
Lance I hope you read this because I often see you swayed by negative comments and potentially overthink it. I have a DF64V and I was watching your video wondering where it would fall, but after your initial explanation of the rubric I already expected it to fall a bit lower. I love my grinder but it completely made sense. So just remember there’s viewers and commentators out there that saw no trouble with it at all. If there’s any critique, it would be that it’s hard for a beginner with no understanding of the wider range of grinders to know why a lower tier grinder would be “better” or output higher quality than a higher tier one from your list. So the suggestion of doing it with a price range would definitely help newer folks to the coffee world.
Surprised by all the hate about price/perceived value. Sure “value” is going to be different for different people based on their financial means and what’s important to them. But tiered lists are just a statement of opinion, not somehow an attack on someone else’s buying decisions. And I think value is an important driver of many, if not most, buyers decisions about a purchase. Not everyone is looking to buy a Ferrari, they are just trying to find that good Toyota Camry you know? So I definitely say please keep price as a factor! If folks don’t like it, I guess you can break tiers up by like over/under $300, $1000, or something. Appreciate all the content you’re making, the hard work shows!
Finally an outfit that goes along the amazing videos! Love from Porto
Nice Porto shirt Lance! Also, really enjoyed the ranking video, and pretty satisfied my lil lagom mini got a B (and also recognise & agree that the price is a bit high for the features and little tiny issues/nitpicks it has)
I 100% appreciated your decision to factor in price in your tier ratings.
My first grinder I bought was a sette 270w and I returned it right away due to the sound. Too brain penetrating. I can’t handle anything with a high pitch so I’m grateful Lance considered the sound.
Talking about adjusting recipe and brew technique for 078 coming from other grinders, what would that look like exactly and why? Certainly particle peak is different from grinder to grinder, but I'd like to better understand how 078 is different than Comandante or Encore and how to approach it.
Ooooh but Lance i loved the fact that price was factored in 😅 don't wanna overturn your conclusion but for me the original format definetly worked
One critique I have of the tierlist format is that its hard to get an overview. I'd love some kind of visual representation in the video, the spreadsheet doesn't matter that much to me
IMO your ranking was spot on, there isn't really anything I would change other than adding a graphic. I get that it's an opinion. And I think that money is a vital factor. I'm willing to spend some money on stuff, but I also look for value. I don't have the money just buy the most expensive everything.
And also, please don't just do what every other UA-camr does. Just do you! I auto skip any tier ranking videos because they're boring and honestly pretty dumb. They're usually just for views. They try to drive engagement by dunking on some and making others S tier for controversy: pure entertainment. Yours was informative and helpful.
For the comparison between the PK100 and the Niche Zero, it’s important to remember that the former device costs roughly 5X the price of the niche and is designed for lab work.
2min in and I have to say, taking price into consideration was the right move in my mind!!! Price, feature, value - that's the holy trinity. It would be too easy to just tier the grinders without price!
I liked your approach about the list. But thanks for the extra context!
Does the Femobook A68 conical present coffee noticeably differently then 64 SSP HUs? I really want to enter the world of conicals and the A ranking + small footprint of the grinder has really piqued my interest. I also love magnets so there's that.
I have an ESP, the built in on my Barista Pro (basically the same thing imo) and a number of hand grinders from 1zpresso, timemore and Kingrinder. I find the ESP being an A tier disheartening. Taste is fine, I have no issue with that. However, it is plasticy and feels cheap. It is loud. After grinding coffee for three shots the grind constancy seems to become wild unless you let the grinder rest for a while. The thumb screw for the burr loosens after every 10-ounce bag of coffee. The plastic lever on the side vibrates out of place. Retention, for me, is high with caveats. If you use a bellows, it is fine. If you don't and just tap it to get the extra coffee out, you will end up with about an extra 3 grams in your catch cup every 4-5 shots.
Price is good. And again, the coffee is fine. Fair body and balanced flavor if not slightly acidic (which is fine since I tend to run darker roasts, so it actually helps). And it is affordable.
Now, I want to say that I pull, on average, 6 shots a day so I do use my grinder a fair bit. I do not drink filter coffee, at all.
I just wonder where it would be on the list if it wasn't weighted by price.
I'm a DF64V owner. It's the new version, so it has the ioniser, slow feeder etc... I get that it's impossible to rank the DF grinders as they're shifting the goal posts all the time. For what it's worth, in it's current state, and give it a B, as it has genuinely improved and they now don't allow RPM of less than 800, but it's all good, here. Great video.
I liked your tier list video. Grouping by price is useful to me. if you drop that grouping, maybe do a Consumer Reports type of point system that compares all grinders against a set of factors and ranks them all from top to bottom rank. then if my budget is 500 I can still figure out the best bang for buck in that range
Got a Zerno Z1 on the way from the August drop. Should be here in Feb/March 2025! Super excited!
if you have the different values in a spreadsheet (as numbers) you could create a new column of results that divides some of the quality metrics by cost ($) so that folks get both objective quality numbers and some value metric to compare across price points more readily
I think a tier list not including price as a consideration would be the way to go but then a value for money scale 1-10 added as a side note to every grinder.
As someone who ended up getting 2 Varios w/ steels because of your videos talking about mods, I understand the rating system completely. It really helped me getting fairly close to high-end espresso (Flair 58) and pourovers for ridiculously low prices since I enjoy tinkering and modding things. If you don't have that predilection then a used Vario is a terrible grinder to get compared to what's coming out nowadays stock from Turin, Fellow, and Baratza for a similar price range.
I'm eyeing an Ode 2 to replace my pourover focused Vario. I think the espresso Vario will pretty much be run until it dies because the taste of espresso it puts out has been unmatched compared to anything I've had within a reasonable price range but I haven't tried much else to be fair.
Tbh unless you mod ode with ssp then your vario with steel isn't gonna be beat for PO imo
@@LanceHedrickUnfiltered welp, looks like it's staying around longer. Thanks for the info!
I really liked that you accounted for price. Then it became a listing of value, not quality. That somehow made it feel more fun and useful for me.
Thank you for clarifying. I suggest you do two tier lists in a tier list video (one price included value for buck and other regardless of the price) since you are already going through the effort. this will make video more comprehensive and satisfy everyone who cares about value or cup quality. you do not even have to go deep in the price list just say this for bang for buck gets this or regardless of value gets that.
I love your videos! Please do a review of the updated Meticulous Espresso Machine. Thanks!
How about a chart system -quality in cup 7/10 -probably with some comment, then build quality 6/10, retention, workflow, and finally price can be listed. Then the viewers can choose what’s important to them. This is pretty clean 4 ratings and a price. Another problem with price is different markets vary. I’m in Canada, mazzer philos is $1600, df78v is $1100, and a Weber is $5400. If these are even close in the cup I’m going df78v, if I’m worried about build quality and longevity I’m going mazzer, if I won the lottery I’m going weber. This overall rating really makes it harder. If we’re shopping cars quiet and smooth ride with great seats is far more important to me than my son. I know you have all this info. And thanks for doing that , it just needs to get presented differently
Love the FC Porto shirt!
Can't wait your review of the Mazzer Philos
It's easy to see why people would be upset to find out that a respected coffee professional thinks the grinder they researched and bought with hard-earned money as a long-term investment, is D-tier or whatever.
I'm the owner of a DF64V (G-IOTA VS in Europe), and it does have me exasperated with its stalling issues. I too thought they had addressed the issue with the new revision. Yeah, you can avoid the lowest RPMs, but grind quality for long coffee is kind of an ephemeral thing and so I always feel FOMO if I limit it to 800+ RPM to avoid stalling. At least it's easy to open, clean up and restart, and I slow-feed anyway to further improve grind quality so it doesn't happen all that often. But everything else about the grinder is awesome (though I can't say how much better horizontal burrs would be). I can't understate how much I appreciate its small footprint and quiet volume. Those are really important attributes to me, but I wouldn't recommend it to someone who wants hassle-free low-RPM coffee.
I do wonder though if reviewers would have received the product better if it were _more_ limited than it is now (800 or even 1000 RPM minimum) from the start. Like, would you have given it a B then?
Dude. Dial it down a notch. Watch out for yourself. Ignore the haters. Hug Hugo.
I prefer a dedicated espresso grinder and a filter grinder. As a predominantly med roast espresso drinker who enjoys body and texture , I’d love to know which ones shine in this.
I personally would love a comparison of grinders based only on taste. Including handgrinders. And make it unfiltered for like an hour or 2❤
Grinder tierlist for handgrinders coming soon?
I'd like to see separate espresso and filter tier lists, without price factored. I.e., if money was no object, what are the best filter grinders?
Price is a factor. A big one. You’ll evaluate a McDonalds’s burger differently than one from even Five Guys and certainly one from a proper steakhouse (or enter fine dining)
5:21 Chocolate bombs? Conical grinder Vs flat produces different flavour?
And there was I thinking the choice of espresso machine was hard!
37:55 I bet my hat the unnamed "specific company" is Weber Workshops 😂🤣😂
Thanks Lance.
I was also confused why no grinder got an F. While i totally relate to the not wanting to give an F because you didn’t want to upset people it almost challenges your integrity. I always love and respect your opinion because you’re up front, but when you said that it made me rethink about what else have you said that you didn’t want to say because of similar reasons. Overall, I still value your input and effort in specialty coffee, just something that popped up in my head personally.
There is nothing else i could've said that is similar. So not sure your critique holds any water unless you could name an example. I have made hordes of enemies off my opinions...
@@LanceHedrickUnfiltered lol all good I meant no intent my apologies if that’s how it came across. I have watched everything you’ve ever made and value your input and know for a fact you have all the integrity in the world
Before you want to upgrade your grinder try to grind coarser, Just brewed a kenyan PB on my ZP6 @6 and it's define. Like Lance's stache.
I think a lot of people praising price as a factor are ignoring that price varies significantly by market. Better to leave price out of the ranking and let viewers factor it in on their own. They are, after all, the ones that would know what their prices are.
Wut??? 😮
I watched the whole tier vid and my only Suggestion would have been having a visible spreadsheet. In any and all product ratings- there should always be a list of scorables for each category that determines overall placement as a tier. I don't understand why people have stopped doing it.
Weather or not maximum points are evenly distributed, thats up to the critic to decide.
I understand feelings have been hurt but there's no need to excuse the video.
Im GLAD my Sette grinders were included and landed on the lower end. Makes me believe that there are superior grinders out there that will justify investment by means of a superior end result.
Time for my morning coffee. Cheers** 😊
The whole video would have been completely uninteresting to me, if you hadn't factored in price. Anyone interested in the topic can say that, for example, EG-1 > p64 > Timemore 064 > Fellow Ode > Wilfa Svart > a blade grinder. Great value is what's interesting, though also more subjective and debatable. Comparing what great value means in different price categories is difficult and requires expertise about not just about the specific products but others in the same price range.
In all honesty, money should absolutely be considered. Value for money is so important.
Great coffee is perceived as having an extremely high barrier to entry when in reality it doesn’t. Just because you have 2-3k to drop on a high end grinder doesn’t mean you have to get that grinder.
Great explainer video. Leaving price out or as a minimal factor is the right direction. No one can say what $100 means to another person.
I think you can have your cake and lose weight too. There's no reason you couldn't do a filter only list, an espresso list and an omni list. You obviously have already thought all this out extensively. Essentially taking the same raw data and applying different filters to it. Thanks for everything. You care and it shows.
Lance, where is the Ditting 807? Didn't you review it a while back?
You should in secret put all the grinders in order of YOUR preference and then factor in cost. Reorder them with a per cost factor and then publish that list.
Next do a Grindr tier list
Bad comment
my hero!!
I don't know whether your "fixed gap theory" is pitched at both espresso and pour-over, but one of the things that's notable about your pour-over technique is that you "hardly adjust the grind size", instead making adjustment in the technique. Doesn't that make a grinder like the Niche more useful (ignoring the fact that you don't like the Niche for pour-over)?
Blind burrs without prebreaker are out for kafatek max2 sept release
Unfiltered? I first thought that meant espresso only. 😅
I can not understand this praise for 078, must be something wrong with mine...I had to sell it for how boring coffee it made. Now I am wondering what did I do wrong...
whats your discord channel, love to join that. Also would love to hear your take on Zerno vs Philos for Europeans? Philos might be easier to get, but it so big and super ugly looking for sure.
i have a feeling you are a bit too honest and just care too much for the current youtube meta 😅 99% of the tier lists are just random rankings ppl come up with on the spot and are meant to be provocative to trigger engagement. it's not a great format for serious product comparison. you'll have to create a boring table on a website for that and comparatively few would really look at that.
I think the price complainers were a vocal minority like you said. I think including price made a lot of sense the way you judged value for money.
I vote in favor of your continuing to use price as one element in your grinder rankings.
I have one for espresso and one for pour overs
I agree btw, i have a titan but a pietro just beats everything.
I've watched a lot of different types of teor videos, and maybe they are more typically held to one category, but I think your list was helpful. You can look at each tier, and just separate it out by your target price.
Encore is your budget A, Timmeore 64s is your $600 range A tier, ect. Not that hard.
You forgot to say "I hope you brew something tasty" at the end of your video. 😜😂
Would love a 64 burr list!!
There is no best. Its all personal preference.
@@ahpadt agree completely - but I think it would be great to hear Lance’s subjective thoughts on different geometries.
While I appreciate your focus on swapping burrs in the ratings, I am not sure how relevant this is for the average coffee nerd. Good quality burrs often add a considerable cost to a grinder, so I in my personal opinion, a grinder with a lot of headroom to upgrade (e.g. DF64) should be compared BOTH to similarly priced grinders (let‘s say eureka specialita) AND to grinders that are the cost of the base model plus, for example, 300 dollars for upgraded burrs (this wouldt then something like a Sculptor 78S, which is a HUGE jump)
Go FC Porto! Greetings from Atlanta
Admit it, you only put the 078s above F so that us 078s users wouldn't all hunt you down (in dm's)
I think you need to make separate tier lists! Like a 0-500, 500-1500 and 1500-no limit!
Feel like you care and spend too much effort on online opinions….
Just do what you feel the best for your channel, it’s YOUR channel, not anyone else’s.
No i care about making content that is helpful. If nothing i do is helpful because I ignore criticism and/or feedback, then what's the point? Appreciate the sentiment tho
FC PORTOOO
Unsubscribing til you wear a sporting Lisbon T shirt
The opus is trash, it should have been an F
Lol I had someone else insulting me for giving it a c because it should be an A ha!
@@LanceHedrickUnfiltered lol that's why I commented
I got lagom p64, so that's endgame.