"The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels. As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."
if the rapture takes place on the last day of the trib then there are no physcial bodies to populate the millenium. Sheep go to heaven goats go to hell.
The harvest is verses 49 to 50. We must note that verse 30 is part of the Parable of. the tares beginning with verse 24. What is special about this parable is our 'Lord' explains it in private to His disciples in verses 36-40. The depth of this parable is tremendous and concerns the teachings of the Church of Smyrna Rev 2, verse 2:9 and the Church of Philadelphia, Rev 3, verse 3.9, those who claim to be of the tribe of Judah but are impostors.
The only way you can get this parable to disprove a pre-trib rapture it to totally ignore the context of the parable for the sake of putting all focus on the order of the gathering. Because if you _do_ take the context of the parable into consideration it actually supports the pre-trib view. What this parable illustrates is the fact that false doctrines will spread throughout the Christian world as the tribulation period approaches. With that in mind, let's take a look at the verse in question: "Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.’" (Matthew 13:30) Yes, the weeds are gathered first and then the wheat, but what exactly is it that represents the tribulation? Quite obviously it is the actual burning that takes place _after_ the weeds and wheat have been separated. So think about it! If this verse proves a post-trib rapture then wouldn't you expect BOTH the weeds and the wheat to be thrown into the fire? Instead we see that _only_ the weeds are destined to be burned whereas the wheat is placed in the barn so that it _won't_ be burned! So how do we explain the weeds being gathered _before_ the wheat? As far as I can see this only makes sense if we take the context of the parable into consideration. Since the parable concerns false doctrines, the "bundling" of the weeds most likely represents how people gather around false teachers and false doctrines. So the sequence of events from a pre-trib perspective is this: 1. the weeds are bundled (into cults and other religious groups) 2. the wheat is take to the barn (the rapture event) 3. the weeds are then burned. (the tribulation)
Thanks so much for this! I am surrounded by wonderful believers at my church who ALL wholeheartedly believe they're going to be whisked out of here before ANYthing bad happens! I didn't get saved until I was 27, and when I learned of this rapture before the tribulation, I wanted to know more about it and started reading. And I was like "wait a minute, that's NOT what this says!". Unfortunately, the people who adamantly believe in and defend the mythical pre-tribulation rapture are TOTALLY UNPREPARED spiritually for coming events. If the devil wanted to come up with ONE thing that would PACIFY THE LARGEST GROUP OF FREE CHRISTIANS IN THE WORLD, and leave them totally unprepared for his coming onslaught, even take them out of the fight before it's even started, he'd be hard-pressed to come up with something BETTER than the "pre-tribulation rapture".
Lets fact check his claims...... Here's some quotes by the early church fathers for a pretrib rapture...compliments of Ken Johnson's book "Ancient Church Fathers.” These quotes come long before Darby. Irenaeus, AD 170 Against Heresies 5.29 - When in the end that church will suddenly be caught up from this, it is said, “There will be tribulation such as not been since the beginning, nor will be.” Ephraim the Syrian, AD 373 On The Last Times 2- ...because all saints and the elect of the LORD are gathered together before the Tribulation which is about to come and be taken to the LORD... Tertullian, AD 207 Against Marcion 5.16 - He [Paul] says those who remain unto the coming of Christ, along with the dead in Christ, will rise first, being “caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.” ...By the mouth of Isaiah, it was said long ago “who are these who fly like clouds unto me, as doves with their young ones?” One quote from the author of the Shepherd of Hermas, two quotes by Cyprian, and one quote by Ephraim the Syrian reveal that at least some of the ancient church fathers were Pretribulationists. Shepherd of Hermas The Shepherd of Hermas was written about AD 150. It describes a dream and gives the interpretation of it. The church (bride clothed in white) escapes the Great Tribulation because of the promise of the Lord. This is not to be considered Scripture, but it does show that many second century Christians believed in a Pretribulational Rapture. Shepherd of Hermas, AD 150 Shepherd of Hermas 2.2-6 - Go therefore and declare to the Elect of the Lord His mighty deeds and say to them that this beast is a type of the Great Tribulation which is to come. If ye therefore prepare yourselves and with your whole heart turn to the Lord in repentance, then shall ye be able to escape it, if your heart is pure and blameless… the golden color stands for you who have escaped from this world… Now ye know the symbol of the Great Tribulation to come. But if ye are willing, it shall be nothing. Cyprian Cyprian was bishop of Carthage about AD 250. Notice he did not teach we must endure the time of the Antichrist, but we will be “delivered” from it. He tells his readers that the coming resurrection was the hope of the Christian, and points out that the Rapture should motivate us as we see the last days approaching. Cyprian, AD 250 Treatises of Cyprian 21-26 - We who see that terrible things have begun, and know that still more terrible things are imminent, may regard it as the greatest advantage to depart from it as quickly as possible. Do you not give God thanks, do you not congratulate yourself, that by an early departure you are taken away, and delivered from the shipwrecks and disasters that are imminent? Let us greet the day which assigns each of us to his own home, which snatches us hence, and sets us free from the snares of the world, and restores us to paradise and the kingdom. Epistle 55 - The Antichrist is coming, but above him comes Christ also. The enemy goes about and rages, but immediately the Lord follows to avenge our suffering and our wounds. The adversary is enraged and threatens, but there is One who can deliver us from his hands. Ephraim the Syrian This next quote is from a work entitled Pseudo-Ephraim. It has the title pseudo, not because anyone doubted the sermon, but because when quoted later, two historians said it was Ephraim the Syrian who wrote it, and one historian said it was Isadore of Seville. Whether this was written by Isadore or Ephraim, the sermon was always accepted as genuine. It clearly teaches a Rapture before the Tribulation occurs. Ephraim the Syrian, AD 373 On The Last Times 2- ...because all saints and the elect of the LORD are gathered together before the Tribulation which is about to come and be taken to the LORD...
@@ExperienceEric The problem is that it doesn't matter what the early Church fathers believed - and a lot of that doesn't sound like they believe a pre-Trib Rapture at all. What matters is what the Scriptures say. The biggest problem with those espousing a pre-Trib Rapture is that there is no verse that states the Church will be Raptured out before the Tribulation. And any good Bible scholar knew of two people who never saw death, who were caught up to be with the Lord while alive, and they were Enoch and Elijah. Of all of the teachers in the New Testament, Jesus would have known about them both - He was probably the one who caught them both up. They were perfect examples to use for God taking the Church up before anything went seriously wrong on Earth. Paul would have used those examples himself, being one of the most brilliant earthly minds of that time, and the apostle to the Gentiles, as a friend of mine liked to point out. But they didn't. Instead, we have Jesus speaking of the believers being gathered after the tribulation of those days, at the Last Trump. Paul writing about the Antichrist coming first in II Thessalonians 2. When the Bible makes direct statements on a subject, that's the last word.
Great job. Many pastors love teaching a Pre-Tribulation Rapture because it keeps their pews full of people. If they deviated, there'd be much less people in attendance.
Biggest problem with both sides of this issue is that philosophy is used to define what you all are interpreting from scripture. All I am saying is "Watch and pray" stop judging who is saved and who isn't. Lets make sure that we aren't hanging on to vain philosophy and playing a side game created by the devil himself. We are to occupy until his return no matter how we interpret scripture. Its when we start interpreting non-scriptural conclusions, (From both sides) the devil laughs at our divisive arguments and how we go on the warpath towards each other with "Pride" marching out in front. Shame on all of us. We are all supposed to be the body of Christ! And lately all we do is attack each other over things that have nothing to do with the spreading of the gospel of Christ. Instead we have one side standing in line retired from the active body waiting for the pre-trib rapture, (which could happen). It just isn't clear enough for a true call and the other side is saying Hey! Your living a dream! People keep naming dates and so far the bible is true on that. Jesus said only the Father knows the time and the hour. I for one would love to see the pre-trib rapture but I'm not counting on it. And both sides of this issue needs to stop condemning the other side. We are all supposed to be one body with one accord. God is in total control and I trust Him to do as His word proclaims. If there are grey areas, they should be treated with Godly wisdom with pride (which He hates) nowhere in the room. Are we taking this to the throne? Or are we playing games that are being refereed by the devil himself.
Spreading the gospel doesn't mean leaving out the part that may scare people. We can't just preach the comfort zone. We need to preach the character zone and that only comes thru adversity. While works don't save us and salvation is only thru the blood, works do prove us. We can't be silent about the truth just to get along with other believers. The truth is Revelation 12:11 tells us they overcame by the blood of the Lamb, the word of their testimony and that they loved not their lives to the death.
Jesus doesn't know the time day or hour but he knows when he tells us in John ch6 vs 39,40,44,54 he tells us 4 times that he will raise us up at his return at the last day that's when the dead in Christ will rise and be with him forever the dead in Christ rises at the last day of the tribulation not the beginning its the last day at the last trumpet at the 2nd coming of Christ that's why its called the 2nd coming it's as plain as day right out of Jesus's mouth straight out of the bible not a left behind books or the great late planet earth book that the pretrib rapture system is taught from because it's not what the bible teaches. The resurrection of the dead in Christ as said by the pretrib rapture believers say that the dead in Christ will be raised up at the beginning of the tribulation. The bible says it will happen at the last trumpet at the last day at the 2nd coming of Christ. Lazarus sister came to Jesus saying master if you were here my brother would be alive. Jesus said that he is sleeping and Martha said I believe that he is sleeping and will be raised up at the resurrection of the dead at the last day. No one taught a resurrection of the dead at any other time but the last day.
First, I love your name, Polski Girl. I'm actually a Ski, but had to change over to Sky because of sign on issues in the past. Now here I go - The Great Apostasy is already here. Proof? Just watch all these prosperity preachers and their congregations. They speak gibberish claiming they're speaking in tongues, bark like dogs, uncontrollable body movements, fake healings claiming it's true, saying we're all little gods, that Jesus spent the three days and nights when He died on the cross that He was battling as well as being taunted by Satan and his demons and after the three days and three nights that He was reborn, etc. Then you have so-called churches like Bethel as well as Hillsong which aren't even churches in the true sense, etc. And this is just the church. We have devils for politicians pushing children to be transgendered, drag queens telling stories to kindergarten children, the murder of children AFTER they're born. I'm on a rant, true. The points being, the apostasy isn't in the future, it's here now. Walk with the King and be a blessing.
You score 100%; 2 Thessalonians 2 verses 1-4. The apostasy those believing the antichrist, Satan is the 'Christ' -'the falling away first, those who believe in the rapture. And as the 'Spirit' explains through Paul - "let no man deceive you.. 'Christ's 2nd Advent Will not come until that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition which is another handle, name of Satan. What comes out of the antichrist's mouth - I have come to rapture you....
I have found this same situation telling my Christian brothers and sister - but they are like the Jews of old 'stiff necked, hard hearted' and their response when I ask them to read the Word with me - they get up and leave in a huff.
My heart goes out to so many believers that have put most of what they believe based on a 'pre-trib' rapture. I've often wondered if the 'great falling away' will include many of that group that believed everything would be just like the 'left behind' movies or the many pre-trip books that came out in the 60's and early 70's. I will admit that I was once a pre-trip proponent and then started reading the 'Whole-Word' and not just the part that met my early belief. I trust that this teaching, and prayerfully many others with the whole 'truth', will go out to the masses. Thank you.
The rapture and when literal hell breaks loose out of the pit will most likely cause it.... I mean Jesus literally says he will raise some up at the last day LAST DAY
No need to wonder if a Christian brother or sister believes in ((>>Pre-Tribulation, Mid-Tribulation, Post Tribulation>>)) if you truly LOVE Jesus with ALL your Heart, Soul and Mind it should not make a difference on anyone’s belief on the RAPTURE. If you are praying, ready and studying the word of God (DAILY) and worshipping God in Spirit & in Truth and sharing the gospel with a (lost and dying world) you are doing your part for the kingdom of heaven. Philippians 2:12-13 “Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, (work out your own salvation with fear and trembling), for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure.”
@@natureocean9466 God is not a God of confusion. To casually say it doesn't matter whether scripture says this or that (Pre, Mid or Post) is no different than the Muslim saying we all pray to the same God. As you said, worship God in Spirit and In Truth. God spirit leads us to "The Truth" (Sign that you are being led by God's Holy Sprit) so we are not decieved in any shape or form. You fall for "A Lie" you will likely fall for "Many Lies"... 2nd Thessalonians chapter 2 as you read to verse 12 is tied to the deception of believing (NKJV)"The Lie" on in the KJV "A Lie" The mindset of not adhering to the word of God but believing doctrines of men is why God sends a strong delusion... it's addressing the Church. People will fall away because they put their trust and hope in a belief of being taken away, when it doesn't happen there will be those who's faith in this false teaching get shattered. They will question everything. I pray they turn to scripture to see the truth and notmlose hope.
@@Kubs777 You know something we really do not know, only God knows, that’s why we “live each day as if it were our last”. The Great Commission: To spread the gospel to a (lost and dying world). 🙌🙌🙌🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼
@@natureocean9466 Yes, we must be ready at all times as no one is promised tomorrow. Like you and many others, I used to think it doesn't matter to know the truth about the end of the age as it relates to Christ's return. Then I sought God with my whole heart, he showed me like he showed others who desire the truth. The gathering of the saints and meeting Jesus in the air, is clearly stated in scripture regarding the gathering of the saints at the end of The Tribulation. I choose to believe a lie that i was taught from the pulpit, on TV and many well renowned Christian leaders. You see its that same mentality not seeking the Truth out Satan exploits, as he does with many in the church, especially life long believers... Most are not prepared in their hearts for what is about to happen. Their faith is about to be tested. Choose this life or Christ. It will cost many their lives. As its stated in scripture (Mark of the Beast) We have a few years left before the Son of Perdition comes after every believer... If they are not prepared some will fall away from the faith. As it was written in 2nd Thessalonians 2 & 1Timothy 4:1
Bible says we shall be caught up in the air and will be with the Lord forever. Your deception is amazing! Jesus comes back with his saints that are caught up into heaven. we come back with Jesus after the 7 years tribulation. Gary Moore
False teacher. Jesus returns with his angels from heaven after the tribulation, not the saints. Matthew 16:27 For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and will then repay every man according to his deeds. Matthew 25:31 “But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. Mark 8:38 For whoever is ashamed of Me and My words in this adulterous and sinful generation, the Son of Man will also be ashamed of him when He comes in the glory of His Father with the holy angels.” 2 Thessalonians 1:7 and to give relief to you who are afflicted and to us as well when the Lord Jesus will be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in flaming fire
Our concern, and I mean all of ours is 'God's Truth - it is the 'Holy Spirit' that generates our boldness - as you are with your reply - those who want to know 'Christ's Oracle in John 18:37 - 'God's Truth - know the wicked will flee from it - Proverb 28:1.
Endure sounds like work . The gosepl for the body of a Christ is salvation by grave theough faith , NOT of works ....avoiding the mark of the beast sounds like alot of work....explain that
Learn Scriptures. The UNKNOWN DAY of the Rapture …The KNOWN DAY of his coming , the Second Coming . The Church is not mentioned on earth after Revelation chapter three, she is in Heaven at the Wedding Feast of the Lamb. The Church cannot be overcome, in the Tribulation Judgment of seven years AntiChrist is given power to overcome the Tribulation Saints.
@briancharters8720 so you're saying the 12 that followed Jesus, and the Christians of the other countries didn't face tribulation and die for their beliefs by being persecuted? Are we more special than them? America doesn't go through the tribulation other countries do nor the people in the past. We will see the tribulation.
@@7Logik Enduring is just not rejecting God when things get hard. You may think it's work, but work is what you do to earn something. Enduring is what you do not do so that you do not earn punishment.
FAI studios is doing a wonderful breakdown series on why pre trib is not biblical they are a wonderful ministry with great resourses based in israel. They also have an end times summet in dallas texas coming up its time the church and ministries start speaking on these topics and the urgency of endurance of the saints
REv. 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. At no time in history has the church in Philidelphia been kept from any world wide hour of tempation! Hence a future event, Hence a pre-trib rapture! Easy!
@@edkay3601 - However, the entire Tribulation is not the wrath of God poured out on the world. That begins after the antichrist sits in the rebuilt Jewish temple proclaiming himself to be God. The false prophet causes an image of the antichrist to be setup and forces people to worship the image. But does the entire world worship the image? Of course not! How in the world will the entire population of the earth manage to go to Jerusalem to worship this image? Collectively impossible. Example: How would people living in the northern most parts of Russia that only get about two hours of sunlight per day with the rest of the day actually being dark manage to make a trip to Jerusalem to worship the image of the antichrist? Only in Israel and the surrounding countries in the Middle East can this occur. I actually love blowing holes through the false teachings of ministers who believe in a Pre-Trib Rapture. The Book of Revelation is primarily geared to events that will happen surrounding Israel and Jerusalem, not some Revived Roman Empire (the ten nations of Europe as many claim). However I don't write off a microchip or whatever in the right hand or forehead for people here in America. Afterall, people wouldn't have to travel to Jerusalem to physically worship the image of the antichrist. They just have to take the mark to show allegiance. But overall, the focus is involving the Middle East, not the so-called European Union, or the world divided into ten regions. If anyone believes that, then I should believe the Easter Bunny actually exists.
The Truth is Answering: oh, here we go again, "the Pre-Trib didn't begin until 18th Century Darby argument." Actually, if you open your eyes, Paul spoke directly on this topic in the 1st century AD in the 1st letter to the Thessalonians. And then he clarifies the difference between the Rapture and the Day of the Lord in the 2nd letter to the Thessalonians. You and your followers should be aware that there have been many other church documents discovered which confirm that it was taught well into the 3rd century. You're argument is myopic, not to mention it directly contradicts the plain text of Scripture.
Yep, and according to the early English bibles: Tynedale, Coverdale, Matthew and Geneva. They use the word "departing", not "falling away". This utterly clears up 2 Thessalonians 2:3
Revelation, chapter 20, verses 4-5! This represents the best single evidence to refute a pre-trib rapture! That and the Christians dying for the sake of the gospel in the Middle East as we speak!
YES, that passage is the nail in the coffin when combined with Thess where it says the dead in Christ rise first. So resurrection FIRST, THEN Rapture. Rev 20:4-5 specifically states it's the FIRST resurrection, so impossible for rapture to take place before the FIRST resurrection, but then it spells out that the saints who refused to worship the beast or take the mark will be part of the first resurrection. So no way the rapture can take place before the tribulation, when the first resurrection includes those killed in the Tribulation.
@@jacob.tudragens I had to respond, because I can't tell you how many videos I've watched and comments I've read about the post-trib rapture timing and NONE of them mention that verse, and as I mentioned it's THE verse that nails it down. Now I would argue the Corinthian verse that spells out it's at the LAST trump, would clearly indicate it can't happen before the 7th Trumpet, which is the last trumpet mentioned in the Bible, but the Pre-tribbers are so slippery. They just claim the last Trump refers to a feast and not the actual last trump in the Bible. An absurd rationalization, but that's what they do. It's all they've got. THIS verse however can't be argued.
@cryptojihadi265 They also misunderstand the 'wedding feast', thinking it is the bride and groom that is eating when revelation 19:17-18 says something different!
@@jacob.tudragens WOW! We must really be on the same page. I thought I was the only one that caught that. Haven't even shared it with anyone, but yes, from Rev 19 it REALLY seems to indicate the Wedding Feast is the dead bodies of the wicked being fed to the birds of the air. Regardless, it does mention the wedding feast in Rev 19 at a time that makes it IMPOSSIBLE for the Wedding Feast to take place during the 7 year tribulation period, which is a core tenant of the pre-tribbers, that we are all up in heaven having a 7 year party, LOL
Thanks for exposing the pre-trub rapture for its inconsistency with scriptures pertaining to Jesus' return. If a secret rapture was true, then the angels present at Jesus' assention didn't know what they were talking about and Jesus would be returning two more times.
Noted, thank you for your boldness - speaking out. My personal view is personal and I am thinking we are abandoning our Hebrew brothers and sisters to take on the antichrist singularly - that bothers me. 'Christ' gives us faithfully what we will go through as stated above in Matt. 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21 - and he admonishes 5 of the 7 Christian churches in Rev 2 and Rev 3 - for correction. These are the Christian communities that will be present during the tribulation period of the antichrist. BUT READ REV 3 VERSE 10, FOR THOSE WHO ARE BOLD ENOUGH TO SPEAK - 'Jesus' takes care of us...
I think this rapture business is gonna cause some of the great falling away Paul talks of not sure but possibly tho.. that and when all hell breaks loose literally and people won't be able to stand.
I agree. The Pretribulation Rapture narrative is only taught in Churches in Western Civilizations; America, Europe, Australia, and parts of South America. You will not find this teaching in third world countries or in Asia. Corrie Ten Boom warned people about this false teaching. Just google "Corrie Ten Boom and the Rapture" to see her letter she wrote before she died. I believe, as you do, that when tribulation unlike what Western Civilization has seen. Tribulation Christians have endured in the Middle East, parts of Africa, India, and China is something Christians in America and Europe are wishing to avoid.
Actually the rapture is God's "Scared Straight Program" for delinquents. People who hang around church but don't really believe the message. They are all going to get straightened out once the Tribulation begins. That's why Matthew 24:30 says the people that are left on the planet when Jesus returns are in mourning. Not rejoicing.
You don’t think spending 7 years building a boat and being stuck on it with your in laws for a whole year doesn’t constitute tribulation? Coming out to everything you knew and loved wiped out completely?
They do not understand correctly. During the time of Noah the world was filled with sin, pride and evil (tribulation) and then came the wrath of God and destroyed evil. The same with Sodom. In both cases they were living in the tribulation and then removed before Gods wrath. It's the same in the book of Revelation. It's Satan and the evil in man that brings about the tribulations and then believers are removed (like Lot and Noah) then Gods wrath will destroy the evil. We will live during tribulation and be removed before Gods wrath, just like Noah and Lot. I don't know why people can't see that. Proverbs 16 18 Pride goes before destruction, And a haughty spirit before [f]a fall.
@@kingsolomon3175 Not to mention the way geologists have examined the way the world is and worked back to the cause. A worldwide flood where "the fountains of the deep" burst would cause multiple, massive, and unimaginable tsunamis. The continents would rip apart, volcanos would emerge and erupt, the water gushing up would hit the upper atmosphere and return as huge hailstones, frozen to sub-zero by the atmosphere they would freeze rivers and lakes and bring on an ice age.
In Matthew ch13 in the story of the wheat and tares we see that the wicked and the righteous are harvested at the end of the world both together at the same time. The angels came to Jesus saying master there are tares/wicked growing among the wheat/righteous let us go and gather up the tares/wicked. Jesus said no let them both grow together until the harvest and il tell my angels to first gather up out of my kingdom all who offend and do iniquity and bind them and burn them then gather up the righteous and bring them to me. We see its not the righteous who are taken away its the wicked because Christ kingdom is here on earth. Jesus tells us in Matthew ch 24 that the end of the world will be as the time of Noah people were eating and drinking and marrying until the flood came and took them away so shall it be at the end of the world. Noah day its the flood that took the wicked away and at the last day its the angels who take the wicked away. Noah and his family were left on earth and Lots family were left and the wicked were taken away. The one taken and another left its the wicked who were taken away and the righteous who were left plan as day. Lazarus sister came to Jesus saying master if you were here my brother would be alive. Jesus said that he is sleeping and Martha said I believe that he is sleeping and will be raised up at the resurrection of the dead at the last day. Paul said that we will be changed in a twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet. The last trumpet is at the last day at his return the 7th trumpet at the second coming. Revaluations ch20 tells us that the people who didn't worship the beast or his image and didnt take the mark and died for their testimony of Christ are raised at his return and rule with Christ a thousand years. Blessed who has part in the 1st resurrection the 2nd death have no power over them who have part in the 1st resurrection. If the church is resurrected at the beginning of the tribulation why isn't it mentioned and why isn't it called the 1st resurrection but Jesus never mentioned it and Jesus only taught one resurrection at the last trumpet on the last day at his return John ch6 vs 39,40,44,54 .
Wm: our concern is half of the Christian peoples on the planet are rapture advocates and half are not - if there are 2 billion Christians then we should be concerned about 'God's Biblical Truth because the consequences to half is severe & written in REV 14: 9-11 - shouldn't we be concerned about each other.
If you read it real carefully what Jesus said in Matthew 24 and you contrast that with what Paul says in 1st Corinthians and 1st thessalonians is like they are basically saying the same thing except Paul is going to go a little bit In detail into the whole trumpet sound
The problem is people twist by putting Jesus' words in context with Paul in 1 Theselonians. But when Pauls words put in Context with Jesus' words, you find the truth.
Our 'Lord' lays out the end of days events in Matt 24, and Mark 13 in private to 4 Apostles and earlier that day to the multitude gathered in the Temple courtyard, Luke 21, gathered to hear our 'Lord' Preach and Teach THESE TEACHINGS DISCLOSE THE 6 SEALS THE EVENTS THEREIN.
Jesus tells us when he will raise us from the dead in John ch6 vs 39,40,44,54 Jesus tells us that he will raise us up at the last day is when the dead in Christ will be resurrected at his return at the last day. Paul tells us in 1st Corinthians ch15 vs 52 that we'll be changed in a moment of a twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet. At the last trumpet is the 7th trumpet at his return at the last day. 1st Thessalonians ch4 vs 15,16,17 is the same event in Matthew ch24 at the 2nd coming. They both have Christ appearances and both have the shout of the Arch angel both have the trumpet blast both have the resurrection of the saints it's the same event. Jesus only taught one resurrection of the dead and he said it will happen at the last trumpet at the last day at his 2nd coming. Jesus never taught a resurrection of the dead in Christ before the last day. If he did I'd like to see it.
In one passage Jesus meets us in the air and in the other Jesus comes down to Earth in his second coming. That tells me there is a rapture and then the 2nd coming.
brianbandy4483, No, all of the prophesies line up perfectly. They all tell the same story but focus on different details. Read it again, in context. Read them side by side. There are atheists who comb the scriptures looking for "Errors." Bart Ehrman is good at finding "errors." The "errors" are often such things as when a gospel writer mentions a person at an event that the other writers failed to mention. This actually proves that they are telling what they saw, and not just copying from the others. When 2 witness tell the police the exact same story the police assume that they are lying. That's because we all process what we see differently. At a recent Bible class there were 4 women and 3 men. Now, if I told someone about the class I might say, "Robert, Pastor Sachs, and I were there." My friend might say to someone else that "Diana, Karen, Jill, and Colleen were there." Were we at two different meetings? This is the "logic" pretribbles use when they claim that the fact that the Bible calls the body of believers a church, but individual believers "saints" or "elect" means something earthshaking and proves the pretrib rapture! This is also the basis for your comment. Jesus, Paul, John, and Daniel all told the same story. They were each individuals, they each told the story from their own point of view.
We meet him in the air in his second coming, in that coming the dead in Christ are resurrected and together with the living righteous they reign with Christ in heaven for 1000 years, after the thousand years in which Satan is bound on earth Christ returns to earth and before descending with the new Jerusalem on the Mount of Olives, the wicked are resurrected to be judged along with Satan and the fallen angels in the final judgment and are consumed in the lake of fire and sulfur, this is the second death, eternal death, then all things are made new and we will reign with Christ in the new Jerusalem on earth for eternity
The Dead Are Raised First [1 Thess 4:15] We who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will not precede those who have died. Therefore, the Rapture cannot take place before the dead are raised. The Bible tells us WHEN the dead are raised [1 Cor 15:52] "at the Last Trumpet". Also, we are told this takes place on "the Last Day" [John 11:24, 6:39, 6:40, 6:44, 6:54,12:48]. Finally, we are also told this takes place after the tribulation [Matt 24:29, Mark 13:34]. Also, "saints" in Jude 1:14 and 1 Thess 3:13, is a reference to "angels" (holy ones - Strong's G40 Hagios) - not human saints, but "angels" are also called "saints" or "holy ones" (Deut 33:2, Ps 68:17). The Rapture cannot take place before the dead are raised - the dead shall rise first. Therefore you cannot have a Rapture (of the living believers) until the dead are raised first, placing the timing of the Rapture after the dead are raised, at the Last Trumpet, on the Last Day, after the tribulation...just like the Bible explains it. We must not contradict these Scriptures as so many have done. We need to embrace and understand these plain statements from the Bible. Please share this with everyone. With thanks to Jesus our Savior. Amen.
@gospeltrax 2513 The slerping in Christ may well be those with a perfect faith. Those crippled wirh soubt may be the ones who remain. Still alive may mean those who have not died n been reborn.
@DaemonZodiac the ones who are still alive are the 144,000 who are in the mountains of Judea being nourished for 42 months while Satan is persecuting the Saints. Once the saints are killed *Revelation 6:9-11 *Revelation 12 and 13 then God pours out His Wrath upon the whole world👈 Then Jesus comes back with those😅 saints, the last trumpet is sounded *1 Corrinthians 15:52 Matthew 24:3, the dead rise and 144,000 are caught up to meet the Lord in the air, and destroy all those surrounding Israel and throws Satan in the pit, along with the Beast and the false prophet. Satan is released after 1,000 years for a short season to attempt one last time as the world repopulates more humans to weed out the goats and spare the sheep all who are called to serve God👈💯🤌
The greatest problem with believing in the pretrib rapture is that when the Antichrist comes, they will risk failing to recognize him for who he is. They will say, "It can't be him bc we are still here." They will end up risking following the Antichrist with all his charisma who will tell them everything they want to hear, and no matter how vile he be they will excuse him as "just a poor sinner like us." Pretrib rapture is a massive deception from the enemy himself so that when his Antichrist comes, he will deceive many. I hope, when that time comes, that their eyes will be opened and that God will show them their error so that they WILL recognize him
this is exactly why when people say its no big deal, i tell them its a huge deal and major false doctrine that sets up the church for the great falling away.
I don't really know, and to a certain extent don't care, as long as the Lord Jesus comes back, as He will, it's all good. My view has always been along the lines of -- the dead rise, and then the believers are caught up (this certainly implies a rapture, yeah, I know, but WHEN?) To meet the Lord Jesus in the air -- doesn't say He's going to land -- YET. But assuming this happens at the end when Jesus does return to earth, at the end of the great Tribulation -- Paul said we are not destined for wrath, okay, maybe Paul was speaking of the judgement, however, the church believers are the bride of Christ, so is the Lord planning on His bride going through all of the horrific things laid out in Revelation? This hardly seems like a nice engagement. But I'll admit it might be part of the program. It just seems a bit strange, not to mention stressful. One thing to consider, a good Bible teacher I've come across, Les Feldick, said (and I'm not saying he's right, but it makes sense) is that there's (in a way) two gospel messages, to two different audiences. Primarily, the first is the gospel of the Kingdom, focused to Israel and the Jews, delivered mainly by Jesus and most of the Apostles, except for Paul, who preached the gospel of salvation to the gentiles. What Mr. Feldick said was you should consider who was speaking, to whom were they speaking, and what they were trying to say. Basically that the Kingdom message was to the Jews, and the salvation by grace and believing in Christ Jesus was to the gentiles. Similar results for both groups, but different methods and messages. I can't help but wonder if most of the Jewish believers that will be saved, will occur after the church has been removed from the stage so the children of Abraham can once more take center stage. I know that there's some teachers that think the rapture, and particularly a pre trib rapture is somehow harmful to the church and it's work, but the opposite view, that if the church didn't have that distraction, that we would have fulfilled the great commission and be ready to hand it over to the Lord Jesus as a completed assignment doesn't seem very likely. Humanity has never been very effective in doing things without God's help, I'm not sure that we are expected to start that now. Almost sounds like a works based situation. God works in mysterious ways, if He had wanted us to KNOW, He would have told us explicitly. 🙏✝️🙏
The catching up to meet the Lord in the Air is in fact Biblical. This event takes place at the LAST trump as noted in Corinthians: 1 Corinthians 15 51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. The LAST trump in Greek is the furthest one out. That is the 7th Trump in Revelation. That is the END of the tribulation. In the Book of Jude it describes this event as well. Jude Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, 15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him. The Lord's coming is at the end of the tribulation, we are changed into our spiritual bodies and meet the Lord in the air (as noted in Jude: the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints). The Lord descends to earth, he doesn't ascend to Heaven. The Lord's return marks the millennial reign of Christ. There is no millennium without the Lord (see Matthew 24: 29-30).
@@stephenszucs8439 Hebrews 12:1, Jude 1: 14-15 offer assurance of those coming with the Lord Jesus Christ when He returns. Those of us on the Earth in the days the Lord returns will be transformed in our spiritual bodies (described in 1 Corinthians 15:51) we will meet the Lord in the air (Revelation 1:7), He does not ascend to Heaven, but to the earth to destroy the Antichrist (1 Thessalonians 4: 15-18; 2 Thessalonians 2:8). Believers get mistaken thinking we are taken up in a rapture to Heaven to avoid the tribulation on the earth. While it is true we are changed into our spiritual bodies and caught up with our Lord in the air we do not go up to Heaven, but gather with the Lord as He descends to earth. This happens at the LAST trump (described in 1 Corinthians 15:51). This trump is the last event in Revelation before the vial and final judgments where our Lord returns.
@@TruthisCalling I agree completely, except that I debate the Spiritual body part. I think we are given the bodies that Adam and Eve had before the fall. Our own bodies, but without entropy. A reversion to what was before the "kill switch" in every cell was activated. A perfectly healthy body, but still our own. I imagine we will look as we look now since we will be known and know others...but maybe we will look better than we do now?
I appreciate you giving us scripture the problem is most people are still going to claim that they are tribulation Saints they will completely look past these verses or make some kind of excuse for them
Paul wrote and said in no way will the living precede the dead, that the dead in Christ shall rise first, and then those who remain will be caught up at the last trumpet. The last trumpet is the 7th trumpet. Yeshua told the decilpes when you see Jerusalem compassed with armies, Luke 21:20. Immediately after the tribulation, Matthew 24:29, Mark 13:24. Ezekiel 13:20-23 tells us God hates the fly away doctrine false prophet preachers preach.
Lets fact check his claims...... Here's some quotes by the early church fathers for a pretrib rapture...compliments of Ken Johnson's book "Ancient Church Fathers.” These quotes come long before Darby. Irenaeus, AD 170 Against Heresies 5.29 - When in the end that church will suddenly be caught up from this, it is said, “There will be tribulation such as not been since the beginning, nor will be.” Ephraim the Syrian, AD 373 On The Last Times 2- ...because all saints and the elect of the LORD are gathered together before the Tribulation which is about to come and be taken to the LORD... Tertullian, AD 207 Against Marcion 5.16 - He [Paul] says those who remain unto the coming of Christ, along with the dead in Christ, will rise first, being “caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.” ...By the mouth of Isaiah, it was said long ago “who are these who fly like clouds unto me, as doves with their young ones?” One quote from the author of the Shepherd of Hermas, two quotes by Cyprian, and one quote by Ephraim the Syrian reveal that at least some of the ancient church fathers were Pretribulationists. Shepherd of Hermas The Shepherd of Hermas was written about AD 150. It describes a dream and gives the interpretation of it. The church (bride clothed in white) escapes the Great Tribulation because of the promise of the Lord. This is not to be considered Scripture, but it does show that many second century Christians believed in a Pretribulational Rapture. Shepherd of Hermas, AD 150 Shepherd of Hermas 2.2-6 - Go therefore and declare to the Elect of the Lord His mighty deeds and say to them that this beast is a type of the Great Tribulation which is to come. If ye therefore prepare yourselves and with your whole heart turn to the Lord in repentance, then shall ye be able to escape it, if your heart is pure and blameless… the golden color stands for you who have escaped from this world… Now ye know the symbol of the Great Tribulation to come. But if ye are willing, it shall be nothing. Cyprian Cyprian was bishop of Carthage about AD 250. Notice he did not teach we must endure the time of the Antichrist, but we will be “delivered” from it. He tells his readers that the coming resurrection was the hope of the Christian, and points out that the Rapture should motivate us as we see the last days approaching. Cyprian, AD 250 Treatises of Cyprian 21-26 - We who see that terrible things have begun, and know that still more terrible things are imminent, may regard it as the greatest advantage to depart from it as quickly as possible. Do you not give God thanks, do you not congratulate yourself, that by an early departure you are taken away, and delivered from the shipwrecks and disasters that are imminent? Let us greet the day which assigns each of us to his own home, which snatches us hence, and sets us free from the snares of the world, and restores us to paradise and the kingdom. Epistle 55 - The Antichrist is coming, but above him comes Christ also. The enemy goes about and rages, but immediately the Lord follows to avenge our suffering and our wounds. The adversary is enraged and threatens, but there is One who can deliver us from his hands. Ephraim the Syrian This next quote is from a work entitled Pseudo-Ephraim. It has the title pseudo, not because anyone doubted the sermon, but because when quoted later, two historians said it was Ephraim the Syrian who wrote it, and one historian said it was Isadore of Seville. Whether this was written by Isadore or Ephraim, the sermon was always accepted as genuine. It clearly teaches a Rapture before the Tribulation occurs.
Great job in your presentation! Keep up the great work you are doing! Keep preaching the everlasting gospel! Men must keep their eyes on Jesus not a gospel of men that Scofield and Darby preached. Stay faithful to Him and I'll see you on the other side! Blessings.
In the words of Jesus, "You are mistaken, not understanding the Scriptures nor the power of God." I know you mean well but the road to hell is paved with good intentions. First of all, right or wrong, how is this rapture doctrine "Dangerous"? Unless you tie it to salvation, which you seem to be doing, in which case you are in error again. Salvation is 100% dependent on the cross and a gift of God lest anyone should boast. Saved by grace alone. Reading a few scripture references does not make you a scholar any more than a few "Google" searches on a topic makes you an authority on the subject. The "Rapture" and "The Second" are two separate events. As Paul states, the rapture is when Jesus comes for His bride, "The Church" before the Tribulation as we are not destined for God`s wrath. The Tribulation is God`s wrath upon the wicked world. After this, the church or the bride of Christ is no longer mentioned. But people will be saved during the Tribulation as God would have all to come to a saving knowledge of His Son and not perish. They are referred to as the "Tribulation saints". Although saved, they must go through and endure Tribulation. Jesus keeps warning us..."do not be deceived". So what team are you playing for? If you want to go through the Tribulation, be my guest. But if you truly are an honest born again christian, you will not have a say. When He comes for us, you will be taken and the others left as the scriptures declare. You are robing people of the joy and the hope they have in Christ. May He have mercy on your soul because you know not of what you speak. Please do your homework before you open your mouth. There are many scripture references that support the rapture of the church. You really should read them.
Dear brother or sister you are no scholar either, You say, "The Tribulation is God`s wrath upon the wicked world." No, it isn't. The Greek word for tribulation is 'thilipsis' it means to "squeeze" or put pressure on, and is also translated 'affliction'. The Greek word for wrath is 'orge' and means 'anger'. Never once in the Scripture is the word thilipsis applied to anyone but Christians. Jesus promised we, the church, would have tribulation and persecution, affliction. To equate wrath and tribulation is a deception and in a sense a lie, since the words mean two different things and are translated into English in two different ways. If you doubt me, go to a searchable Bible and see where the word tribulation is sued throughout Scripture. We do not suffer God's wrath, but we are promised tribulation. Just as God protected Noah, and Jonah, and Daniel, and the Hebrew boys in the fiery furnace, just as he protected the Saints and his brethren throughout history, he can protect us through tribulation, even great tribulation. The Lord sent his wrath on the Egyptians, while he perfectly preserved and physically protected the Hebrews in captivity there. Our joy in Christ is not dependent on a doctrine (pretrib rapture) that has no direct basis in Scripture but is instead the result of a 'system' of theology. Our joy in Christ is that he is Way, the Truth, and the Life. He is our Rock and our Salvation. Our joy is everlasting and eternal life through his shed blood, not the idea that we are going to miss tribulation we were promised to experience for his name, that we ought to count as joy.
Of course the text doesnt say tribulation saints after the rapture just saint that undergone persecution by the Anti Christ no rapture timeline is given nor is the word rapture in the Bible separated within the context of the second coming you are interpreting scripture but inserting words its just saints and just the second coming that’s it of course there are the saints being caught up during the second coming it does not say during the rapture but rather the last day.
@@lilwaynesworld0 I heard a sermon that there are [4 types of Saints]: 1-The Old Testament Saints ; 2-The Church Age Saints; 3-The Tribulation Saints; 4-The Millennial Saints; The Tribulation Saints: REVELATION 7 9 After this I looked and there before me was a [great multitude that no one could count], from every nation, tribe, people and language, standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands. 10 And they cried out in a loud voice: "Salvation belongs to our God, who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb." 11 All the angels were standing around the throne and around the elders and the four living creatures. They fell down on their faces before the throne and worshiped God, 12 saying: "Amen! Praise and glory and wisdom and thanks and honor and power and strength be to our God for ever and ever. Amen!" 13 Then one of the elders asked me, "These in white robes--[who are they, and where did they come from]"? 14 I answered, "Sir, you know." And he said, "These are they who have [come out]of the [great tribulation]; they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 15 Therefore, "they are before the throne of God and serve him day and night in his temple; and he who sits on the throne will spread his tent over them. 16 Never again will they hunger; never again will they thirst. The sun will not beat upon them, nor any scorching heat. 17 For the Lamb at the center of the throne will be their shepherd; he will lead them to springs of living water. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes."
@@TheMistysFavs You may have heard a preacher claim that they are "different kinds of saints" but that is unbiblical in the extreme. There is no distinction made in the Bible, and in fact, making distinctions is forbidden. Especially forbidden is the urge for gentile Christians to act superior to Jews. Paul warned the church pretty sternly about that.
There are an equal amount of scriptures both in the Old & New Testaments which support the Pre, Mid & Post Tribulation scenarios. It is not wise to argue and debate about something that God has NOT REVEALED BY THE REVELATION OF HIS SPIRIT. A perfect example of this is found in Matthew 16 when Jesus asks His Disciples, "Whom do 'men' say that I am ?" The Disciples answered, "SOME SAY you are John the Baptist, SOME SAY you are Elijah, SOME SAY you are Jeremiah, & SOME SAY you are one of the other Prophets." The point is this, they were ALL WRONG & DIVIDED about who Jesus was because they did NOT receive those answers FROM GOD "personally" BY REVELATION, but only received those answers from "Men", or even maybe by a "private" interpretation from the Old Testament scriptures, which is the Word of God in "seed" form to the reader, NOT REVELATION or the Word of God Reveled in HARVEST FORM. We must understand that the Word of God on "paper" is in "seed" form, and is NOT THE FINAL REVELATION, or the HARVEST OF THAT WORD WHEN IT COMES TO PASS. Just as the "Fruit" is a completely different manifestation than the "seed" is, but yet agrees with, supports, & confirms the "seed" which was planted. The Word of God on "paper" is in "seed" form, and UNTIL God brings that "seed" to FULL MATURITY, which is when we "Hear" the Voice of God, NO ONE WILL KNOW WHO IS RIGHT or WRONG, ALL WILL BE DIVIDED ON THIS SUBJECT, JUST LIKE THE MEN WERE ABOUT WHO JESUS WAS, UNTIL GOD REVEALS IT BY HIS SPIRIT TO THE CHURCH.
@@stephenszucs8439 When you acknowledge that you read my full post above and that you understand what I have written,, THEN, I will give you scriptures from both Old & New Testaments that support Pre-Trib. But like I stated in my post, the Word of God on "paper" is a DIFFERENT MANIFESTATION than the Word of God REVEALED and COME TO LIFE. So the scriptures I give you won't help you in the least. YOU MUST HEAR FROM GOD PERSONALLY ON THIS SUBJECT BY HIS SPIRIT, IF NOT, IT WILL NOT BE TRUTH TO YOU "Personally", making the argument NULL & VOID.
@@7Truth7Wins7 I read and understand what you think is true, but the Bible is the authority, and the men who received special knowledge from the clear, sure word of the Lord were verified as legit by the other prophets, by the things they predicted coming to pass, and by other passages in the Bible. On the other hand, you have a vast number of insane claims all over YuselessTube, TV, and every other place you can go all proclaiming that "God told me" some nonsense that is patently unbiblical. We are *commanded* to test every spirit and every message. How to test it? Compare it to Scripture. God literally inspired the Bible. He will not contradict it. So, what I see here is another person who believes a thing that is not in the Bible claiming that they are right anyway because they are just so close to God that he lets them see what he has hidden from the entire church for centuries, and therefore "I don't have to show you my evidence."
1 Thessalonians 4:15-16-17-18 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Wherefore comfort one another with these words.
The first 3 chapters of Revelations mention's the Church and it is not mentioned again until the 2nd coming in chapter 19 (The Church is misssing from 4-19 because they are gone)
Excellent layout of the truth of God's Word, dealing with the Rapture Myth. I live in the Baptist South and the rapture theory is ingrained here. People think one belongs to Satan if you tell them the Rapture is total bunk. - The birth of the rapture theory reminds me of the Mormon story where Joseph Smith put some river rocks in his hat, stuck his face in the hat, and God revealed Mormonism to him. Good Grief!
I put all my trust and faith in Jesus Christ and him crucified. Exclusively. Knowing that nothing I do can influence my Salvation. Only my trust and faith in the right object, can help me to get to heaven. Praise God. Hallelujah to the Lamb. Glory to God.
Amen! It is our Guide for our return to our 'Father'. Read John 17 'our 'Lord's Prayer verses 14-19. Let the 'Sprit' Speak to you on 'Christ's Word. Hopefully, we will get into what happened ...in the beginning and why we are in this temporary life in the flesh.
Lets fact check his claims...... Here's some quotes by the early church fathers for a pretrib rapture...compliments of Ken Johnson's book "Ancient Church Fathers.” These quotes come long before Darby. Irenaeus, AD 170 Against Heresies 5.29 - When in the end that church will suddenly be caught up from this, it is said, “There will be tribulation such as not been since the beginning, nor will be.” Ephraim the Syrian, AD 373 On The Last Times 2- ...because all saints and the elect of the LORD are gathered together before the Tribulation which is about to come and be taken to the LORD... Tertullian, AD 207 Against Marcion 5.16 - He [Paul] says those who remain unto the coming of Christ, along with the dead in Christ, will rise first, being “caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.” ...By the mouth of Isaiah, it was said long ago “who are these who fly like clouds unto me, as doves with their young ones?” One quote from the author of the Shepherd of Hermas, two quotes by Cyprian, and one quote by Ephraim the Syrian reveal that at least some of the ancient church fathers were Pretribulationists. Shepherd of Hermas The Shepherd of Hermas was written about AD 150. It describes a dream and gives the interpretation of it. The church (bride clothed in white) escapes the Great Tribulation because of the promise of the Lord. This is not to be considered Scripture, but it does show that many second century Christians believed in a Pretribulational Rapture. Shepherd of Hermas, AD 150 Shepherd of Hermas 2.2-6 - Go therefore and declare to the Elect of the Lord His mighty deeds and say to them that this beast is a type of the Great Tribulation which is to come. If ye therefore prepare yourselves and with your whole heart turn to the Lord in repentance, then shall ye be able to escape it, if your heart is pure and blameless… the golden color stands for you who have escaped from this world… Now ye know the symbol of the Great Tribulation to come. But if ye are willing, it shall be nothing. Cyprian Cyprian was bishop of Carthage about AD 250. Notice he did not teach we must endure the time of the Antichrist, but we will be “delivered” from it. He tells his readers that the coming resurrection was the hope of the Christian, and points out that the Rapture should motivate us as we see the last days approaching. Cyprian, AD 250 Treatises of Cyprian 21-26 - We who see that terrible things have begun, and know that still more terrible things are imminent, may regard it as the greatest advantage to depart from it as quickly as possible. Do you not give God thanks, do you not congratulate yourself, that by an early departure you are taken away, and delivered from the shipwrecks and disasters that are imminent? Let us greet the day which assigns each of us to his own home, which snatches us hence, and sets us free from the snares of the world, and restores us to paradise and the kingdom. Epistle 55 - The Antichrist is coming, but above him comes Christ also. The enemy goes about and rages, but immediately the Lord follows to avenge our suffering and our wounds. The adversary is enraged and threatens, but there is One who can deliver us from his hands. Ephraim the Syrian This next quote is from a work entitled Pseudo-Ephraim. It has the title pseudo, not because anyone doubted the sermon, but because when quoted later, two historians said it was Ephraim the Syrian who wrote it, and one historian said it was Isadore of Seville. Whether this was written by Isadore or Ephraim, the sermon was always accepted as genuine. It clearly teaches a Rapture before the Tribulation occurs.
@Orange6921 Thank you for taking the time to consider the video and offer your thoughts. The information you provided does not give any definitive notion the early fathers believed in a pre-trip rapture. For example, your first statement - Tertullian, AD 207 Against Marcion 5.16 - He [Paul] says those who remain unto the coming of Christ, along with the dead in Christ, will rise first, being “caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.” ...By the mouth of Isaiah, it was said long ago “who are these who fly like clouds unto me, as doves with their young ones?” The catching up to meet the Lord in the Air is in fact Biblical. This event takes place at the LAST trump as noted in Corinthians: 1 Corinthians 15 51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. The LAST trump in Greek is the furthest one out. That is the 7th Trump in Revelation. That is the END of the tribulation. In the Book of Jude it describes this event as well. Jude Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, 15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him. The Lord's coming is at the end of the tribulation, we are changed into our spiritual bodies and meet the Lord in the air (as noted in Jude: the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints). The Lord descends to earth, he doesn't ascend to Heaven. The Lord's return marks the millennial reign of Christ. There is no millennium without the Lord (see Matthew 24: 29-30). The quotes you are providing discuss the return or Christ and are gathering together to Him. There is no indication of a rapture where believers leave earth and return at a later time.
@@TruthisCalling There is ZERO basis whatsoever to claim the "Last Trump" is the 7th judgment trumpet of Revelation. The "last trump" is in a letter written to the Corinthians in the 50's AD. Its just silly and rather absurd to then pretend the context here for the Corinthians was the 7th judgement trumpet of Revelation, a book not even written and revealed for another 40 years. Not to mention the fact that there are another 1000 years of trumpets being blown on the earth after the tribulation in the 1000 year Kingdom. None of that logic makes any sense at all. You also seem completely unaware that there is this VITAL thing called the "FEAST OF TRUMPETS" in the OT law and those 7 feasts symbolize the entire work of Jesus at His first coming and 2nd coming. They include the Passover, Unleavened bread, the Firstfruits, the Pentecost, Feast of Trumpets, Day of Atonement and Tabernacles. The final trumpet blast on the feast of trumpets is called "THE LAST TRUMP". Its has always been understood by the Jews as being directly connected of the Resurrection of the Saints. When people connect the "Last Trump" to the 7 judgment Trumpets of Revelation, it sounds like they are not reading their OT hardly at all, and no awareness of the 7 feasts and what the Last Trump" was already know to be when Paul wrote this letter. Not even Paul know of the book of Revelation and the 7 judgments there, but he knew full well what the LAST TRUMP was when he pinned that letter, as well as the people he wrote it to. And it had nothing on earth to do with a book not even written for another 40 years that does not even have the words "LAST TRUMP" in it, nor does it show any Resurrection at the end of the 7 judgments there..
Good presentation of pertinent info. I always think of Jesus telling martha right before He called Lazarus from the grave that He is the resurrection and the life and asked her if she believed Him. she said yes I believe my brother will be raised on the last day. That sounds like she means the last day and Jesus didn’t correct her with another time other than the last day.
Like it, the last (human) day in Scripture is called 'the day of the Lord', (and 1 Cor. 15: 52 takes place)'Christ's return which ushers in the 1,000 year Reign of 'Christ' - Rev 20:4. When our 'Lord' Talks about the dead He means spiritually dead - those who never had the opportunity to know Him, 'God's Word - the 1,000 reign ALL will Know Him.
@@CommStudies good points. I’m pushing 70 and probably the most important thing I’ve been given is that I’m never to old to learn. Most of my time is spent hungering and thirsting after righteousness, listening and searching the scriptures and asking for revelation from what I read.
It is a salvation issue because pre tribbers are in denial of the events happening now and will or have taken the mark already because they are blind to the reality of scriptures and when they take Thier mark they are unredeemable!!! They show no respect to the sufferings and persecution of the saints since Christianity begun until this present day.....self seeking lovers of selves and total wimps !
2 Thessalonians 2: 7. For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way.
Very good. Now study the 7th day Sabbath. Constantine thought he could change Yah’s Sabbath to Sunday - but we do not bow down to the teachings of men. Pray about it people. Once you understand the truth about Sabbath, you will understand the mark of the beast.
Thank you for this truth - the meek won't be so meek when they witness against the antichrist through the 'Holy Spirit' - Luke 12: 11-12. Meek in Greek means humble and when 'Jesus' Returns we will all be humbled.
Ok. Mathew Chapter 24 is the second coming of Christ. It isn't the Rapture. If you read in that chapter it talks about people fleeing Judea. That is for the Jews. We don't live in Israel. Actually,it isn't the Tribulation. It is called Jacob's Trouble found in Isaiah 30:7. God said that we as Born Again Christians are not appointed unto weath!!! You just showed the scripture where we will be caught up to meet the Lord in the air. Also,read Revelation chapter 5. It says that the Angeks are in Heaven and in Mathew Jesus told the Saducees that when we die,we neither marry or are given in marriage but are as the Angels Of God. Furthermore,if you read Revelation Chapter 6,Jesus opens the first seal andxthe Rider on the White Horse is released. This is the Anti-Christ!! We are in Heaven when the Anti-Christ is released!!! You have to rightly divide the word of God!!! There is a Rapture and then there us the second coming of the Lord!!! I am looking for Jesus Christ not the Anti-Christ!!! Stop lying and deceiving people!!! You are telling them that there isn't a Rapture!!! You are Lost!!!
Matthew 24 (Pay attn: to the Sun) 29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Is Dave MacPherson your only resource? Ugh! Not much research here... Jude 14-15 cf., Zechariah 14:5; Revelation 19:11ff - Certainly the Return of the reigning Christ ~ Matthew 13:24-30 cf., Matthew 24:40-41 - where are the "Angels" in Matthew 13:24-30 referenced??? You didn't finish 2 Thessalonians 2... Revelation 12 is not a "rapture" passage ~ You show Luke 21:27ff but failed to incorporate the context. Verses 20-23 mention the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem in 70 A.D., while v. 24 notes the "trodden underfoot" of the Gentiles UNTIL the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled. This is specific to a time frame. Next up (at the conclusion of the times of the Gentile's fulfillment), there will be signs in the Sun... This all leads up to Christ's glorious return but has nothing to do with the Rapture doctrine, nor is it directed at the Church. Notice that at vv. 20 & 24, Jesus specifically directs the hearer's attention to "JERUSALEM," not the Church. This is important if you are going to interpret the word of God correctly ~
if the resurrection happened at only one second coming,the saints would descend in their spirits from Heaven,get their bodies from the grave,and then ascend again to Heaven to seat on white horses ,then descend again at Armageddon all within a day. Thats three trips :Down,up,down in one day! Then the last trumpet and last day are terms for two dispensations.The last day being raised is like the last trumpet,it is the day of the Lord, and covers the rapture,tribulation,and second coming down on earth. Last day (of the church age,and last day for the redemption of israel and the world) and last trumpet refers to both second comings' last day and last trumpet all wrapped up in one term.That is like a gap in a way.Exactly how God works in some prophecies seem to describe an event as if it were one event in same time period but its separated in a gap. The wheat and weeds of the church age are different from the wheat and weeds of the tribulation. Jesus said not to pluck out the weeds first in the tribulation because it would pull out the wheat's chance to grow and learn in the tribulation,meaning if they rapture in first trib or mid trib,then the harvest of new believers would not grow in having more believers come to faith since the unrighteous as potential new converts would have no time to convert if they are destroyed earlier and it would affect the wheat harvest,and an early judgment would cause the trib saints already alive to face death too early if the last bowl judgment happened too early. Those who are taken at the second coming are the wicked into judgment,captured by warring angels like vultures. The resurrected old testament saints and trib saints at the final 2nd coming will not ascend but will be gathered from 4 winds remaining on the land and summoned to the judgment of the righteous sheep in jerusalem.
Jimmy Evans is confused & a victim of the Pretrib rapture false doctrine. Jonah2:8 KJV "They that observe lying vanities forsake their own mercy." Lying vanities=false doctrines.
No need to listen to anyone but Jesus and He said He would return after the Tribulation. And yet humans want to argue about it because of indoctrination.
I thought the catching away where we meet the dead in Christ in the air was told by Paul ? Paul is about the rapture & Revelation is 2nd coming. Only Paul spoke about the “ rapture” by the instruction of the Lord.
The event you are referring to takes place at the end of Revelation. It is also mentioned in the Book of Jude. We are gathered with the Lord in the air, but He DOES NOT take us out of here, but continues to descend to the earth, destroy the Antichrist, and restores the earth. Then comes the millennial reign of Christ.
You thought correctly. You're best off learning about dispensational theology rather than following the erroneous interpretations of this so called "truth" teller. He probably also believes God replaced Israel with the Church. He doesn't understand the distinction between the Church age and then the 70th week of Daniel, also known as the Time of Jacob's Trouble, aka the Day of the Lord, aka The Great Tribulation, the time in which God completes his promises to Israel and reins on the throne of David over all the nations for 1000 years. The Church will not be present during the Tribulation (see Rev 3:10 and John 14). Many will come to a saving knowledge during this period and they will surrender their lives (Tribulation Saints). Much more could I tell you. Stay away from Reformed theology which is also the default position of the Roman Catholic Church (minus the doctrine of salvation through faith).
takinittotheheatandstreet, DANIEL taught about the "Rescue" of the ones who are in the Book of Life. AFTER the Abomination is set up and great Tribulation happens. It matches the statements of Jesus and Paul.
@@Jammaster1972 Or he could just read the Bible that plainly states in Rev 20:4-5 that the FIRST rapture includes those who were beheaded, who refused to worship the beast or accept his mark. So clearly the very first resurrection includes those killed in the tribulation. Then Thess plainly states the dead in Christ rise first, THEN we who are alive and remain will be caught up. Since the first resurrection includes the martyred tribulation saints and we can't be raptured prior to the first resurrection, the rapture takes place after the tribulation. As stated so many other times about enduring to the end, after ALL these things Christ returns, etc, etc. Not one verse says we will be raptured prior to the tribulation. NONE as that would directly contradict the plainly stated passages referenced above. The only verses the pre-tribbers have that they claim support the pre-trib ALL require reading hidden meaning into the text.
This understanding of the “end times” doesn’t seem quite right to me. Don’t we need to determine if the Church and Israel are different or actually one and the same? If “Israel” of the New Testament is uniquely the people of the blood line of Jacob, the book of Revelation, in particular, makes more sense at the literal/physical level of interpretation. And His prophecies are all fulfilled as written. Consider the Olivet discourse of Matthew 24 and 25, Mark 13, and Luke 21. It seems to speak of the Rapture of the Church. The Discourse’s reference to “stars falling” and “powers of heaven … shaken” may actually be the “war in heaven” described in Revelation 12: with the devil and his angels (the “stars”) being thrown down to Earth. Thus, with heaven having been swept clean of the enemy, i.e., the “Accuser of the brethren,” the time will have arrived - with the “fulness of the Gentiles” also at this point having been reached -- to receive the Church into Heaven through the Rapture. National Israel then enters into the “time of Jacob’s trouble,” the 7 year tribulation; and the 144,000 of the tribes of Israel take center stage as Israel is severely tested. The end result is that “all Israel (the remnant) will be saved.” The reality of the “stars” falling -- with all the attendant terrors will begin the 7 years of wrath on Earth as the devil knows his time is short. We do need to keep watching, looking up, praying “always, that we may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.” We need to be ready to go - like Lot from Sodom -- without hesitation. “Remember Lot’s wife!” Several UA-cam channels including “The11:11Sign” and “Dave Kull” make abundant sense to me. ... But most likely we'll probably all be amazed by the way He unfolds His perfect plan! Praise God!
Have you watched Chuck Missler, he explains pre trib and how the Bible supports this. Why would Jesus put his children through this? Tribulation is for the Jewish people.
Just a suggestion to those who dispute the rapture,go listen to Roger Price vids called ,,Will the church go through the tribulation,, and Daniels 70wks ,and The Rapture,, he uses hebrew ,greek and he also uses the fores and againsts ,if you are truly seeking the truth of Gods word then go have a listen with bible in hand,or are you just here to argue
Another video...another heresy. Dude! Read Revelation and find the 4-5 times it tells us that no Christians will survive the Tribulation and the antichrist. Therefore there will be no Christians there to welcome the return of the Lord. There will be nobody who is "alive and remains". That scripture you show must therefore mean something else...like a pre-trib rapture .
WHO IS GOD? See to it that no one misleads you. Perhaps the greatest crime ever conceived of by the identity thief: From the encyclopedia Americana, 1945 Edition: "GOD (god, gawd): Common Teutonic word for personal object of religious worship, formerly applicable to super-human beings of heathen myth; on conversion of Teutonic races to Christianity, the term was applied to Supreme Being." Read YashaYahu (Is.) 42:8, and another 6,822 times Yahuah told us His Name in an interlinear Hebrew - English translation. The Prefaces of most translations admit removing the true Name and inserting the "device:" LORD. This is the English word used for the definition of the Hebrew word BAAL (H1167). Read your Preface to verify what they have done to deceive the whole world. #GOD
We must be born again! Then Jesus has baptized you with the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit do not let you sin anymore!!! To become born again you have to repent and ask Jesus forgiveness for your sins or ask Jesus in your heart! A really born again Christian has no future sins!! He is perfect, righteous and the light of the world
@@Nonexistent10people will sin but there's a difference right between the righteous and the unrighteous both sin The difference is this the righteous seeks forgiveness confession etc The unrighteous do not reorient or ask for forgiveness:) God bless :) 🙏
Reasoning from the scriptures: A pre tribulation ESCAPE in the natural body is utterly scriptural. Luke17:28-32 Matthew 24 :15-21 Revelation chapter twelve Eagles Wings Ezekiel 34:11-16 Ezekiel 20: 33-35 Psalm 124 the bird.....Eagles Wings Isaiah 35
The people who insist that the church will go through the tribulation do understand who and what the church is as the body and bride of Christ neither do they understand the purpose of Daniels 70th week(the time of Jacobs trouble). 1 these. Tells us that we(the church) have been delivered from the wrath to come.Also, if there are going to be several hundred million Christians on the earth during this time why the 144,000?
The Bible does not say that we are transformed into "spiritual" bodies. It says "incorruptible" bodies. In other words, we will always be physical, but it will flourish to perfection as God intended when Christ returns.
Unfortunately much of what he’s saying is innacurate. To say this wasn’t preached till the 1800’s is false. The rapture was THE eschatological belief of the early church. The original evidence for this is located in Thessalonians where the believers thought they had been left behind. The major problem of this belief is there is no place to put the marriage supper of the Lamb or the Bema Seat. Secondly without going into long details there are 5 distinct differences between the passages that describe His return. The simplest one is right here in his talk. Jesus comes, we meet Him in the air and clearly He doesn’t set His feet in the ground. He is taking these passages and merging them and making them fit a belief instead of objectively allowing scripture to explain scripture (which he says he’s doing here but isn’t). So he teaches that we go up to meet Christ and then do a “loopy loop” and come right back down with Him. This makes no sense scripturally. There is no other interpretation outside of a pre-wrath rapture of the Church. I would compare this talk with teachings by Churkc Kidsler, John Barnett or John MacArthur. A comparison of these will make this too clear.
Do not generalize because you are going to fool yourselves , if you generalized John 3:16-21 (ESV) For God So Loved the World 16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. 18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. 19 And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil. 20 For everyone who does wicked things hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his works should be exposed. 21 But whoever does what is true comes to the light, so that it may be clearly seen that his works have been carried out in God.” Contrary to popular perception , John 3:16 is not a general statement which apply to all the people of the world as a whole , rather , this declaration is dedicated only and exclusively to the chosen man of God , he being the recipient of the word...did all the people of the world receive the "only begotten sonship of God"?...If so , then every person you meet in the world is the Christ...if all the people of the world were the "christs" , then the doctrine of believing in a Christ and being saved by that Christ is nullified because everyone is already the "Christ" , if that declaration in John 3:16 is applied to all of us , then that means , we are all the messiahs or the Christs-who are we going to save then , if there were no believers left because all of us were the christs...therefore , beware of reading the texts and giving them a generalized meaning and application...you are going to distort the whole truth if you do that... Now , Genesis 1:26 like John 3:16 should not be generalized-it refers only to the Christ for Christ was the only begotten created in the image and likeness of God...there is but one Christ and every man is a believer...the believer must believe in the "image and likeness of God" which is Christ...if one say that he also was created in the image and likeness of God , then he is declaring that he too was the Christ or the messiah...if Genesis 1:26 can be applied to all people of the world , then everybody is the savior and lord messiah , which is a distortion of the truth...what would happen to the whole world , if all of us are christs or the messiahs?...
There's NO Problem believing in Pre Trib, Mid or Post Rapture. Its not a Major Theological issue concernin Salvation!! Just have Faith in God thru Jesus and be sealed by the Holy Spirit.🎉
Proof of A Pre trib Rapture. Pay Attention to the Cloud and Clouds Jesus appears In and With. Acts chapter 1 verses 9 10 11 Cloud. In Red Luke chapter 21 verses 27 and 28 Jesus is coming In A Cloud the Rapture. In Revelation chapter 1 verse 7 Jesus is coming With the Clouds when he comes back to the Mt of Olive the second coming KJV.
Iger am a Catholic, and do not believe in the rapture. For me, it is like a fairy tale. We shall have to pass through tribulation, unless we die first, so our faith shall be put to test. If teh rapture occurred, Christ would come three times not two. Besides this thing has been discussed it was about to occur eleven years ago, and nothing happened. So, I no do nof believe in that.
As an Orthodox Christian, I am in the same boat as you on this on. If the rapture was real one or more of the fathers would have mentioned it clearly and unambiguously. There were enough end-time heresies in the first millennium that if it was true some father or synod would have used it to squash a heresy.
I've been saying for some time that liberal theology, the feel good theology so popular today, and the pre-Trip Rapture teachings, were all going to resort in the falling away prophesied in the New Testament. Nothing would be more discouraging to a young believer than to watch the world fall apart in front of their eyes, when they were taught they wouldn't see it, and then the persecution which followed. Pre-Tribbers also gloss over a lot how believers have been persecuted - to death - for two thousand years. Why were they allowed to be slain if we're too precious to go through such terrible tribulations? Jesus promised us persecution. The apostles considered it an honor to suffer persecution, and taught that we must all be ready for it, since to belong to God is to become an enemy of the world. We need to be prayed up and prepared for whatever the Lord has for us to go through in these Last Days.
The problem with that line of thinking is that you need to revive Billy Graham from the dead, because he saved thousands of souls, but he didn't live long enough to go through the persecution of the saints. So I'm not sure if he is in heaven right now. Maybe he could get a second chance somehow.
@@seanc2788 Sorry, that makes no sense. Salvation is as simple as it gets. You accept Jesus as your Savior, and you go to Heaven. Persecution is something that happens in this world because the Devil and the world hate God, and because we belong to Him, they hate us too.
@@stryker1999 But your own words just proved the point. "Pre-Tribbers also gloss over a lot how believers have been persecuted - to death - for two thousand years. Why were they allowed to be slain if we're too precious to go through such terrible tribulations? Jesus promised us persecution. " Billy Graham didn't suffer persecution. He lived a pretty straightforward life in America and never once saw what the early church had to go through. So does God work in different dispensations? Clearly Christians have lived in America for hundreds of years and have never suffered anything close to what those in China, Iran, Egypt, Russia, pick a country. So why does God allow for several hundred years of people living and dying naturally in America? And what changes for the "Tribulation" that makes it any different? Are you saying there is going to be a different dispensation for the 7 year Tribulation? All of a sudden people are going to start being persecuted again like the early church? Why would God reverse course from what he has allowed for the past hundreds of years? NO logic.
@@seanc2788 Dude, people are being persecuted TODAY like the early Church, even being beheaded like they were, and HAVE been for many, many years. Just because we Americans live in a society that kind of frowns on "most" barbarism, unless it's the left and some ethnic groups doing it, has nothing to do with how people have to try to live on the rest of the planet. MOST of the planet. This isn't rocket science, for pete's sake...
@@seanc2788 Billy Graham did not save a single soul. Only the LORD can save. Only the Holy Spirit draws one to the Lord. Humans are used by God to bring the truth to people, but they cannot save. Also, Billy Graham was a Universalist. He was very pro RCC, and Robert Schuller adored him for his "Inclusiveness that he brought to the family of God." Inclusiveness? Billy Graham said that there are people who are in the family of God that do not even believe in God. So, is he in Heaven today? I wouldn't want to assume that he is. Also, your entire comment is a non sequitur.
The Rapture is real and true, and it's NOT about Zechariah 14:4-5 at all. I don't use ANY of the FAMOUS references that people use for both proving or refuting the rapture. That's too easy, and it becomes a circular argument and nothing gets accomplished on proving or disproving, and everyone walks away minds not changed. Therefore, I like to go OUTSIDE of the famous proof texts. I don't know if many realize this, but the 6th Seal of Revelation 6 is something that is of extreme importance in the timeline that can be verified by the Olivette Discource, as well as Acts 2 Pentecost, in which both the discourse, and Peter in Acts 2 references side by side events of Revelation chapter 7. Many don't even know what the 6th Seal even is, but once they do, then go back to the Discourse, and Acts 2. Then you can prove from that alone that the believers are NOT here for the 7th Seal. Jesus does not mention one word about any event in the 7th Seal. But he does mention the 6th Seal...and WHAT AFTER THAT? Rapture (Last half of Revelation 7). Now, regarding Peter. He references Joel, who discusses the 6th Seal. BUT WHY? He's putting a context as to why the Jews who just got the Holy Spirit were speaking in tongues. He's telling them that THIS WILL HAPPEN AGAIN, when the 144000 gets SEALED with the Holy Spirit. There is no other reason that Peter would bring in Joel, other than to put a TIMELINE of back to back events from Revelation 6 of the 6th Seal to the 144000. And from the 6th Seal from the Discourse, it's EASY to prove a RAPTURE just by the back to back events of the 6th Seal that can be verified by the discourse, and Peter at Pentecost in Acts 2. with the 6th Seal of Revelation 6, continuing through all of Revelation 7. Put the timeline together with those. I don't see anyone at all anywhere connecting the dots like that to put a timeline together, and put this to bed once and for all time. Matthew 24 Sixth Seal: Matthew 24:29 Rapture: Matthew 24:30-31 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. Mark 13 Sixth Seal: Mark 13:24-25 Rapture: Mark 13:26-27 26 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory. 27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven. Luke 21 Sixth Seal: Luke 21:25-26 Rapture: Luke 21:27 27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. Now, that’s the END of the story in all of the end times chapters of the gospel. And Jesus did not mention one word about the 7th Seal. I challenge anyone to prove me wrong. Where did Jesus mention the 7th Seal events? He didn't. But from all of those references about the rapture that I mentioned, what does Revelation chapter 7 say about that? 13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they? 14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 15 Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them. The VERY NEXT CHAPTER begins the 7th Seal, and we are NOT HERE FOR IT, because we are at THE THRONE OF GOD. Use that 6th Seal as a connect the dots! Rapture is true. 16 They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. 17 For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes. Jesus does not come back until... Revelation 19:14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. Revelation 19:19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army. Zechariah 14:4-5 4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south. 5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee. Now, there is a LONG distance between Revelation chapter 7 and chapter 19...dontcha think? And...how can we COME BACK with him, if we weren't first taken TO him in a rapture first? Rapture in the clouds comes before return of Christ on land. It's hard to fathom the complete resistance in believing in a rapture. What's up with that?
@@seanc2788 You don't even know how to read. Amazing. I gave several references to it, from Joel, to Peter, to Jesus (Matthew, Mark, Luke), as well as John in Revelation 6. It's the most mentioned seal of all, mentioned by a lot of people.
@@seanc2788 1/2 Job 9:8 Which alone spreadeth out the heavens, and treadeth upon the waves of the sea. Isaiah 40:22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in: Isaiah 42:5 Thus saith God the Lord, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein: Psalm 104:2 Who coverest thyself with light as with a garment: who stretchest out the heavens like a curtain: Isaiah 42:5 Thus saith God the Lord, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein: Isaiah 45:12 I have made the earth, and created man upon it: I, even my hands, have stretched out the heavens, and all their host have I commanded. Isaiah 51:13 And forgettest the Lord thy maker, that hath stretched forth the heavens, There are many more references to stretched and spreads... SCIENCE agrees that the universe is EXPANDING...next...
@@seanc2788 2/2 Isaiah 34:4 And all the host of heaven shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll: and all their host shall fall down, as the leaf falleth off from the vine, and as a falling fig from the fig tree. Revelation 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. SCIENCE believes that at some point, the universe will STOP expanding, and may IMPLODE. It is known as THE BIG CRUNCH. Chaos will be happening in the universe if that happens. Isaiah 34:4 tells us about it.
First of all, the Bride is NOT the church. The Bride is Israel (a good read can be found here: bereanbiblesociety.org/the-bride-of-christ/). The Church is already in Christ, which is arguably a better position (Romans 12:5; 1 Corinthians 12" 12-13 & 27 to name a few places where this is noted) . There are numerous examples throughout Scripture of Israel, the prophets, and the Apostles going through tribulation in some way, shape, or form. Moses, Abraham, David, Daniel, to name a few in the Old Testament. The Apostles in the New Testament. Some of them gave their lives up for the sake of the Gospel. In Revelation 13 verse 10, we have this passage: “If anyone is to go into captivity, into captivity they will go. If anyone is to be killed with the sword, with the sword they will be killed.” This calls for patient endurance and faithfulness on the part of God’s people." We also have many other passages describing the patience of the Saints in tribulation. Revelation 14:12 among many other passages: Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus. In closing, I would like to add that we as Christians are called to reason from the Scriptures (as is the example of the Apostle Paul in Acts 17:2). I welcome a sound response with Scriptural evidence in order for us to discuss God's Word in love, patience, and understanding as fellow Christians should. In this video and in my response I have provided Scripture to support this understanding of God's Word. I see you chose insulting language and not one single Biblical passage to support your view. Both of these approaches are unbecoming of a Christian.
Sorry there is a Rapture of the Church Daniel 21.1 and so your wrong but not one person or minister points to it. Because they don't have the HOLY SPIRIT GUIDANCE and so your telling me you don't have it. As I don't want to be misled by someone who is Deceived. MPK.
Michael: you reference Daniel 21:1, but the book of Daniel only has 12 chapters. Then you go on to say we are misleading when you cite a chapter that does not exist. If this was an error, please clarify. We are interested in reasoning from the Scriptures with fellow Christians (Acts 17:2).
Hi, Wesley - there are a number of examples in Scripture where God encourages believers to pray to keep them from a particularly trying moment, but that does not mean they are removed from a situation. For example, Matthew 26:41 the Lord tells the disciples to pray that they are kept from temptation. He also prays for Peter to be strengthen during the specific attacks by Satan noted in Luke 22: 31-32. Additionally, there is an ends times prayer our Lord implores, where He states, "pray that your flight not take place in the winter, For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be (Matthew 24: 20-21). The Our Father is a prayer for deliverance from the Evil one and to be kept from temptation. In all of these instances, you see believers going through a testing or trial or hardship and praying to God for strength. This is also true for prayers during the time of Revelation.
The comment above is good. We are commanded to be watchmen(women) what are we watching for - Scripture to be full filled and it is our duty not only to see 'God's Divine Plan activated among us but a watch person also has to warn others - watch and warn. A comment above concerned the slaughter of Christians worldwide that is happening as we speak - Scripture being full filled the 5th Seal - 'Christ's 1st warning in Matt 24, Mark 13, Luke 21 on the events of the end of days, Revelation,. 'Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in My Name saying I am 'Christ' and shall deceive many. Who are they spiritual leaders claiming to represent 'Christ', His Word. And the consequence? What we have been talking about rapture and no rapture - these are the rapture leaders claiming this is 'God's Word whereby half of the Christian world are lead astray by these spiritual impostors.
You should be leary of a title that purports 'The Rapture" is dangerous. How? And that it is deceptive? How? There is nothing wrong with believing in the blessed hope. If you wan't to enter the tribulation ... go ahead.
People believe in the Rapture and provide scripture, people don’t believe in thenRapture and provide scripture. Me personally I remember a scripture saying we will be caught up in the clouds in The New Testament (HOLY BIBLE KJV).
It doesn't get any clearer than Matthew 13:49 in the KJV. This completely and instantly destroys all this rapture doctrine. Ok, so what are we having for lunch? 🤷 😅
While the pre-trib rapture is a false doctrine, to then extend that into there is no such thing as the rapture is also false. There will be a rapture. It will occur at some point during the 2nd half of the 70th week of Daniel, when the time of great tribulation is cut short for the sake of the elect. The same day that this occurs will be the start of the Day of the Lord, when God pours out His wrath on a wicked and unrepentant world. We do not know how long this will last as we are given the duration of only the 5th trumpet. Aside from that, we know it must be accomplished by the end of the 70th week. Matt 24:31 and Rev 7:9-17 are both the rapture. Rev 8:1, the 7th seal is broken and God's wrath can now be poured out.
The word rapture as you know is not in the Bible, I know harpazo. How about we call it "our gathering together unto him"? 2Thessalonians2:1. Many will be deceived when the son of perdition, anti(Greek=instead of)Christ/satan sitteth in the temple of God looking like our perception of & saying that he is God/Jesus. Greatest spiritual deception of all time. Pretribbers think they're going to be gone before this takes place. A very sad state of affairs.
Revelation 14.14 is the rapture then the wrath of God comes down. We are clearly here for the tribulation. I personally think the seals have started to open
@@Jammaster1972 one question about Revelation 3:10, is the church of Philadelphia still here ? That scripture is speaking of the apostasy that began in AD250
@@Nonexistent10 No, you're wrong. The apostasy was present from the beginning. Why do you think most of the NT was written? ---to address the heresies and apostasies. However, Paul speaks of an end times Apostasy that occurs prior to the Rapture and before the day of Christ (aka His 2nd Coming). See 2 Thess 2:1-3.
Charles Russell. Joseph Smith. John Nelson Darby. John Calvin. If you're following the deviations of any of the above you're following cultic doctrines. The former may be more deviant than the latter, but all are cultic nonetheless.
Why are you saying taking a verse and blowing it out of proportion it's like reading about under his wings you shall seek refuge does God have wings like big bird no ! So understanding what scripture says and understanding it's context it's important so you ref John 14 but are you min interrupting it's understanding ! God bless
1) "Many mansions" is a terrible translation. Many rooms, apartments, or dwellings is a better translation 2) The only way you can see this as a rapture promise is by adding things not in evidence, and by making assumptions that are not in the text. a) Assumption 1: "My Father's House" means Heaven. Not so. EVERY SINGLE TIME the term is used in the Bible, it refers to the Temple. Temple means House of a God. This is further proven by the fact that John saw the New Jerusalem (with a Temple that is described in the OT) coming DOWN from Heaven. The Temple in Jerusalem had apartments for the ones who labored there. b) Assumption 2: "I will come again and receive you" means I will take you away, rather than I will come to be with you. It doesn't say He comes to take us away. He comes to be here with us. c) Assumption 3: Saved people live in Heaven. Nowhere does the Bible say that. It says that the souls of the dead in Christ rest there until the resurrection. d) Assumption 4: That this verse says anything about the TIMING of the rapture. It does not. e) Jesus will be in Heaven, so we will too. God said that he will tabernacle with man. He said that the son of David would rule forever. FROM Jerusalem.
A day of the 'Spirit', the Hebrew tradition declares our spirit becomes refreshed in 'God' on Holy Days - a time dedicated to communion with our 'Father'. And 'God's Command, keep holy the Sabbath, Exodus 20.
It's real simple, as you mentioned in Thess, it clearly states the dead in Christ rise first, THEN we who are alive and remain will be caught up. So we know from just that one verse that the rapture is AFTER the resurrection. Fortunately in Rev 20:4-5 it plainly states the FIRST resurrection includes those who were beheaded, those who didn't worship the beast or accept his mark. So if the FIRST resurrection includes those who were killed in the great tribulation for not worshipping the beast, then it's impossible for the rapture to take place before the tribulation. People claim there are just as many verses that support the pre-trib as the post-trib, but although there are SOME verses that COULD be used to support the idea of the pre-trib, none actually state it. You can't take an interpreted or extrapolated meaning of a scripture and use it to override a plainly stated text, or you make the Bible contradict itself. ALL pre-trib rapture verses require reading hidden meaning into the text, or taking the promise to one specific church from 2000 years ago and applying it to yourself as an individual today. Notably NOT taking the word to the 6 other churches and applying them to you. Meanwhile these two passages alone spell out the order. Then there are numerous passages that all confirm it, like the PROMISE we WILL have Tribulation. Or that he who endures to the end will be saved. Or AFTER all these things, THEN the Lord comes etc. But the pre-tribbers like to claim there are now TWO second comings of Jesus, one secret and silent before the trib and then another AFTER the Trib. First, that's made up completely out of thin air. Second, both Thess and Corinthians plainly state it's with a shout and a trumpet that Jesus returns and we are caught up. So hardly secret or silent.
2 Timothy Chapter 4 3For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. Rapture deception huh don't you know this prophecy here in 2 Timothy chapter 4 came to pass years ago and you call the catching away a doctrine of the Scriptures a lie. Do yourself a favor and repent of as well as stop listening to the lies of that wicked tempter who tempted the Son of God years before.
Bible says earth is flat. It's simply not a credible document. New Testament says the devil took Jesus to a high mountain to view "all the kingdoms of the world" Only possible on a flat earth. Only way out of this corner is to claim the passage is metaphorical. But it's not marked as a metaphor. But if you arbitrarily claim this or that passage is metaphorical than ANY passage can be interpreted as metaphorical.
Pre Rapture is False Doctrine . If you believe in this Curse then you do not believe in God. If you Preach it you will be held accountable for leading God's Children away.. the Small g god of this world is responsible for this Lie. Thank you to Channels like this one for speaking the Truth .. .. .
What you are saying not true or Biblical. it was taught before Darby and widely held in the young church. The tribulation is for Christ rejecting Israel and anyone else that wont take the free gift of salvation. Revelation 3:10 Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come on the whole world to test the inhabitants of the earth. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. God bless you and i hope you study closer to the real truth than can only be by way of our Savior Jesus!
The rapture has always seemed to me as a cop-out! An easy way out of the tribulation period! Here's your exemption card, you don't have to face the tribulation period! A benevolent God will take some people and leave the rest to suffer! It's like they're the Chosen One's! They're going to be Pre-Judged by Jesus before the 2nd coming? It doesn't make sense!
I will take a look at this. However, there are other Scriptures that discuss the return of the Lord and when taken together tell us unequivocally that the Lord returns after the tribulation.
Then how can anyone explain the millions of people including 1.5 year old's having rapture visions and dreams? Some waking up sobbing. Others waking up excited to tell their mothers. I am so confused. I am listening to the millions having these dreams. How do you explain all of this? Many saying he is coming soon, etc.
Who is asking the important question, who are slewping in Christ ? Everyone reads n thinks literally, yet thw literal is of the finite, the body, the flesh.. not of the spirit. False Christians abound. No one wants to afmit thay but it id a reality. Thus the dead in Christ arw those who have actually died n been renorn, those remaining, still alive, arw those who never actually dien n got reborn, but will eventualky be caught up with Christ at the end if they do indeed endure to the end. The saints are the jews in Israel... who will be encompassed. Stop beong so sure of yourselves. Repent, get reborn, and then you will see nothing but false Christians from wall to wall... and th4n you will understamdvwhat the phrase "sleeping in Christ" means. Amen.
You do error: Christ is not talking to “Christians “ but rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. Christ sends Paul to teach Christians the mystery of the gospel of grace. This is why you are in error. His disciples: Mat 10:6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. Jesus himself: Mat 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel. This is the reason: Mat 23:37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Mat 23:38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate. Mat 23:39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord. Jer 30:6 Ask ye now, and see whether a man doth travail with child? wherefore do I see every man with his hands on his loins, as a woman in travail, and all faces are turned into paleness? Jer 30:7 Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble; but he shall be saved out of it. (Not Christians) this is the mystery Paul reveals. Behold I show you a MYSTERY. Luk 20:17 And he beheld them, and said, What is this then that is written, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner? Luk 20:18 Whosoever shall fall upon that stone shall be broken; but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder.
Not everything in the Bible applies directly to us! The Old Testament concerned only the people that God called out of the nations that became his chosen, Israel. Likewise almost 100% of the so-called, New Testament (or New Covenant which never came about btw) is about God’s relationship with Israel (not us)! You might know that God married Israel when she was born in the Red Sea but she was unfaithful with pagan gods so he divorced her in Hosea. He sent his Son to Israel to propose a remarriage and that’s what’s going on in the gospel ministry of Jesus, and it was ONLY to the lost sheep of the house of Israel (Matthew 15:24 KJV)! He barely spoke with Gentiles at all - they were unclean dogs! So stop thinking he’s talking to you in the four gospels! After he ascended, the apostles were sent out to continue proposing remarriage with God to ISRAEL - not YOU, so nothing in Acts - or in any of the epistles written during Acts - applies to anyone living today! So STOP thinking they do! Yes, there were Gentiles in the Acts churches (the Greeks) but they were part of Israel’s Old Testament prophecy (Deuteronomy 32:21 KJV) and God used them to try to make his ex-wife Israel jealous! Romans 11:11 KJV! This is important so listen up! None of us living today would have been ALLOWED into any of the churches in Acts (and probably even after Acts) because again we would have been considered filthy unclean dogs! The Jews in all of the Acts churches and after were still obeying the Law of Moses even though they knew they were saved by God's grace. The Law was their very identity so they' would have felt lost without it! The Greeks were given ordinances to obey by the Jerusalem Council to make them just kosher enough to study with Jews in the synagogues where Paul held his churches! There’s no Jerusalem Council today, no Greeks like those were, no ordinances, the Greeks were warned they could be cut off (Romans 11:22 KJV) if they did not “abide” (while WE pagans saved later have ETERNAL SECURITY (Ephesians 4:30 KJV) so WHY would you want to be them? 🤔. Stop applying things God said to OTHER PEOPLE to yourself! It’s insulting to him and what he has given us! Jesus broke his promise to return before his followers in Israel DIED, remember? Matthew 16:28 KJV! He wouldn’t break a promise that important for NO GOOD REASON! It’s time for intelligent believers to realize that Israel, because she kept saying NO to God’s offer of the Marriage Supper of the Lamb, received a final notice of PERMANENT DIVORCE in Acts 28:28-31 KJV…” Acts” - AX, get it? And just like that, everything changed. You didn’t notice? Savages called the Scythians suddenly heard about Jesus and got saved even though lawless pagans were never allowed to be saved before! They didn’t know an “ordinance” or a law from a hole in the ground and no one was ordering them to obey any! And even weirder, at that moment in time, God had Paul announce that from then on, God would see EVERYONE as the SAME! Colossians 3:11 KJV Why doesn’t anyone notice that? It doesn’t matter at all that some people are saying that they’re Israel, because God doesn’t see them as that! Eternal life is now being offered to everybody on a perfectly equal basis in the free gift of Ephesians 2:8&9 KJV! We’re not living in a parentheses in Daniel 9; all of those prophecies were canceled by the divorce in Acts 28:28-31 because God is done with his stuck-up ex-wife forever!!! How do I know? Because there’s new end time prophecy (according to the mystery of Ephesians 3:9) that has a new second coming called the appearing, Colossians 3:4 KJV; and a new kingdom called by Jesus’s name - not Israel’s- in Colossians 1:13, the last book of the Bible to be written, Col 1:24-25 KJV, so it supersedes all that has gone before! Ephesians is the second to last book written and it says in Eph 2:15 that we and the saints of time past are “the one new man” that will live in Christ’s kingdom! Does that sound like anyone will be raptured to heaven? We sleep in the grave until Jesus calls us forth! Humans were not created to dwell in heaven! God created the earth as a place where HE could dwell with us! People are so mixed up about the Scriptures that it’s SAD! Don’t let all that nonsense being said and done by FAKE Jews over in FAKE Israel deceive you! Satan is using them to deceive you and it’s only going to get worse! And don't be conned by the phony rapture theory because as I proved above, the scriptures they use to prop it up are ones that not only about the actual second coming to earth of Jesus, but they did not apply to us at all as at that time Gentiles like us were not able to be saved anyway. And now the second coming to Israel is canceled, and a new appearing has taken its place! Looking for that blessed hope, the appearing of our Lord and Saviour, Jesus Christ! 🤗
Only one Gospel: The Gospel of Reconciliation. Jesus Christ came into THEIR kingdom to reconcile fallen angels unto Himself. We are the fallen angels kept in DNA chains of darkness. If you do not confess being a fallen angel in Lucifer's kingdom, then you are an unbeliever. Unbeliever = those that claim to be made in the image of God.
Mathew 13:30 "Let both grow together until the harvest"
The harvest is on the last day, NO pre trib rapture.
"The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.
The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."
They Lied to You About The Pre-Trib Rapture - Lee Brainard ua-cam.com/video/r5r374e659I/v-deo.htmlsi=EubtpoICYfBYnvKl
if the rapture takes place on the last day of the trib then there are no physcial bodies to populate the millenium. Sheep go to heaven goats go to hell.
The harvest is verses 49 to 50. We must note that verse 30 is part of the Parable of. the tares beginning with verse 24. What is special about this parable is our 'Lord' explains it in private to His disciples in verses 36-40.
The depth of this parable is tremendous and concerns the teachings of the Church of Smyrna Rev 2, verse 2:9 and the Church of Philadelphia, Rev 3, verse 3.9, those who claim to be of the tribe of Judah but are impostors.
The only way you can get this parable to disprove a pre-trib rapture it to totally ignore the context of the parable for the sake of putting all focus on the order of the gathering. Because if you _do_ take the context of the parable into consideration it actually supports the pre-trib view.
What this parable illustrates is the fact that false doctrines will spread throughout the Christian world as the tribulation period approaches.
With that in mind, let's take a look at the verse in question:
"Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.’" (Matthew 13:30)
Yes, the weeds are gathered first and then the wheat, but what exactly is it that represents the tribulation?
Quite obviously it is the actual burning that takes place _after_ the weeds and wheat have been separated.
So think about it! If this verse proves a post-trib rapture then wouldn't you expect BOTH the weeds and the wheat to be thrown into the fire? Instead we see that _only_ the weeds are destined to be burned whereas the wheat is placed in the barn so that it _won't_ be burned!
So how do we explain the weeds being gathered _before_ the wheat?
As far as I can see this only makes sense if we take the context of the parable into consideration. Since the parable concerns false doctrines, the "bundling" of the weeds most likely represents how people gather around false teachers and false doctrines.
So the sequence of events from a pre-trib perspective is this:
1. the weeds are bundled (into cults and other religious groups)
2. the wheat is take to the barn (the rapture event)
3. the weeds are then burned. (the tribulation)
Thanks so much for this! I am surrounded by wonderful believers at my church who ALL wholeheartedly believe they're going to be whisked out of here before ANYthing bad happens! I didn't get saved until I was 27, and when I learned of this rapture before the tribulation, I wanted to know more about it and started reading. And I was like "wait a minute, that's NOT what this says!". Unfortunately, the people who adamantly believe in and defend the mythical pre-tribulation rapture are TOTALLY UNPREPARED spiritually for coming events. If the devil wanted to come up with ONE thing that would PACIFY THE LARGEST GROUP OF FREE CHRISTIANS IN THE WORLD, and leave them totally unprepared for his coming onslaught, even take them out of the fight before it's even started, he'd be hard-pressed to come up with something BETTER than the "pre-tribulation rapture".
You illustrated the dangers of the rapture doctrine eloquently. We actually featured your comment in our Bible study class.
@@TruthisCalling Thanks - that made my day! God bless you.
Lets fact check his claims......
Here's some quotes by the early church fathers for a pretrib rapture...compliments of Ken Johnson's book "Ancient Church Fathers.” These quotes come long before Darby.
Irenaeus, AD 170
Against Heresies 5.29 -
When in the end that church will suddenly be caught up from this, it is said, “There will be tribulation such as not been since the beginning, nor will be.”
Ephraim the Syrian, AD 373
On The Last Times 2-
...because all saints and the elect of the LORD are gathered together before the Tribulation which is about to come and be taken to the LORD...
Tertullian, AD 207
Against Marcion 5.16 -
He [Paul] says those who remain unto the coming of Christ, along with the dead in Christ, will rise first, being “caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.” ...By the mouth of Isaiah, it was said long ago “who are these who fly like clouds unto me, as doves with their young ones?”
One quote from the author of the Shepherd of Hermas, two quotes by Cyprian, and one quote by Ephraim the Syrian reveal that at least some of the ancient church fathers were Pretribulationists.
Shepherd of Hermas The Shepherd of Hermas was written about AD 150. It describes a dream and gives the interpretation of it. The church (bride clothed in white) escapes the Great Tribulation because of the promise of the Lord. This is not to be considered Scripture, but it does show that many second century Christians believed in a Pretribulational Rapture.
Shepherd of Hermas, AD 150 Shepherd of Hermas 2.2-6 -
Go therefore and declare to the Elect of the Lord His mighty deeds and say to them that this beast is a type of the Great Tribulation which is to come. If ye therefore prepare yourselves and with your whole heart turn to the Lord in repentance, then shall ye be able to escape it, if your heart is pure and blameless… the golden color stands for you who have escaped from this world… Now ye know the symbol of the Great Tribulation to come. But if ye are willing, it shall be nothing.
Cyprian Cyprian was bishop of Carthage about AD 250. Notice he did not teach we must endure the time of the Antichrist, but we will be “delivered” from it. He tells his readers that the coming resurrection was the hope of the Christian, and points out that the Rapture should motivate us as we see the last days approaching.
Cyprian, AD 250 Treatises of Cyprian 21-26 -
We who see that terrible things have begun, and know that still more terrible things are imminent, may regard it as the greatest advantage to depart from it as quickly as possible. Do you not give God thanks, do you not congratulate yourself, that by an early departure you are taken away, and delivered from the shipwrecks and disasters that are imminent? Let us greet the day which assigns each of us to his own home, which snatches us hence, and sets us free from the snares of the world, and restores us to paradise and the kingdom. Epistle 55 - The Antichrist is coming, but above him comes Christ also. The enemy goes about and rages, but immediately the Lord follows to avenge our suffering and our wounds. The adversary is enraged and threatens, but there is One who can deliver us from his hands. Ephraim the Syrian This next quote is from a work entitled Pseudo-Ephraim. It has the title pseudo, not because anyone doubted the sermon, but because when quoted later, two historians said it was Ephraim the Syrian who wrote it, and one historian said it was Isadore of Seville. Whether this was written by Isadore or Ephraim, the sermon was always accepted as genuine. It clearly teaches a Rapture before the Tribulation occurs.
Ephraim the Syrian, AD 373
On The Last Times 2-
...because all saints and the elect of the LORD are gathered together before the Tribulation which is about to come and be taken to the LORD...
I think we can clealry put to be the lie that pretrib began with Darby, its been around for 2000 years.
@@ExperienceEric The problem is that it doesn't matter what the early Church fathers believed - and a lot of that doesn't sound like they believe a pre-Trib Rapture at all. What matters is what the Scriptures say.
The biggest problem with those espousing a pre-Trib Rapture is that there is no verse that states the Church will be Raptured out before the Tribulation. And any good Bible scholar knew of two people who never saw death, who were caught up to be with the Lord while alive, and they were Enoch and Elijah. Of all of the teachers in the New Testament, Jesus would have known about them both - He was probably the one who caught them both up. They were perfect examples to use for God taking the Church up before anything went seriously wrong on Earth. Paul would have used those examples himself, being one of the most brilliant earthly minds of that time, and the apostle to the Gentiles, as a friend of mine liked to point out.
But they didn't. Instead, we have Jesus speaking of the believers being gathered after the tribulation of those days, at the Last Trump. Paul writing about the Antichrist coming first in II Thessalonians 2. When the Bible makes direct statements on a subject, that's the last word.
Great job. Many pastors love teaching a Pre-Tribulation Rapture because it keeps their pews full of people. If they deviated, there'd be much less people in attendance.
They Lied to You About The Pre-Trib Rapture - Lee Brainard ua-cam.com/video/r5r374e659I/v-deo.htmlsi=EubtpoICYfBYnvKl
Our hope is in Jesus Christ….not a rapture
Thank you.
Amen!
Who do you think is coming for us at the Rapture? 🤦♂️ 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 KJV #Rapture #CaughtUp #Harpazo
@@scottdunn2178 people put their hope in being evacuated…..not Jesus Christ…
@@polskigirl8547 We put our BLESSED HOPE in being taken home by our Lord and Savior - Jesus Christ.
Biggest problem with both sides of this issue is that philosophy is used to define what you all are interpreting from scripture. All I am saying is "Watch and pray" stop judging who is saved and who isn't. Lets make sure that we aren't hanging on to vain philosophy and playing a side game created by the devil himself. We are to occupy until his return no matter how we interpret scripture. Its when we start interpreting non-scriptural conclusions, (From both sides) the devil laughs at our divisive arguments and how we go on the warpath towards each other with "Pride" marching out in front. Shame on all of us. We are all supposed to be the body of Christ! And lately all we do is attack each other over things that have nothing to do with the spreading of the gospel of Christ. Instead we have one side standing in line retired from the active body waiting for the pre-trib rapture, (which could happen). It just isn't clear enough for a true call and the other side is saying Hey! Your living a dream! People keep naming dates and so far the bible is true on that. Jesus said only the Father knows the time and the hour. I for one would love to see the pre-trib rapture but I'm not counting on it. And both sides of this issue needs to stop condemning the other side. We are all supposed to be one body with one accord. God is in total control and I trust Him to do as His word proclaims. If there are grey areas, they should be treated with Godly wisdom with pride (which He hates) nowhere in the room. Are we taking this to the throne? Or are we playing games that are being refereed by the devil himself.
Spreading the gospel doesn't mean leaving out the part that may scare people. We can't just preach the comfort zone. We need to preach the character zone and that only comes thru adversity. While works don't save us and salvation is only thru the blood, works do prove us. We can't be silent about the truth just to get along with other believers. The truth is Revelation 12:11 tells us they overcame by the blood of the Lamb, the word of their testimony and that they loved not their lives to the death.
Very well said. And I bet yer fangers are sore now👍😇🤣( from texting)Godspeed
Jesus doesn't know the time day or hour but he knows when he tells us in John ch6 vs 39,40,44,54 he tells us 4 times that he will raise us up at his return at the last day that's when the dead in Christ will rise and be with him forever the dead in Christ rises at the last day of the tribulation not the beginning its the last day at the last trumpet at the 2nd coming of Christ that's why its called the 2nd coming it's as plain as day right out of Jesus's mouth straight out of the bible not a left behind books or the great late planet earth book that the pretrib rapture system is taught from because it's not what the bible teaches. The resurrection of the dead in Christ as said by the pretrib rapture believers say that the dead in Christ will be raised up at the beginning of the tribulation. The bible says it will happen at the last trumpet at the last day at the 2nd coming of Christ. Lazarus sister came to Jesus saying master if you were here my brother would be alive. Jesus said that he is sleeping and Martha said I believe that he is sleeping and will be raised up at the resurrection of the dead at the last day. No one taught a resurrection of the dead at any other time but the last day.
They Lied to You About The Pre-Trib Rapture - Lee Brainard ua-cam.com/video/r5r374e659I/v-deo.htmlsi=EubtpoICYfBYnvKl
Well said
Thank you for dispelling the “Evacuation” ……if these believers don’t wake up to the lie they will be part of the great apostasy
The "great apostasy" started around 250 AD. All the Christian Church is a part of the Great Whore Babylon.
First, I love your name, Polski Girl. I'm actually a Ski, but had to change over to Sky because of sign on issues in the past. Now here I go - The Great Apostasy is already here. Proof? Just watch all these prosperity preachers and their congregations. They speak gibberish claiming they're speaking in tongues, bark like dogs, uncontrollable body movements, fake healings claiming it's true, saying we're all little gods, that Jesus spent the three days and nights when He died on the cross that He was battling as well as being taunted by Satan and his demons and after the three days and three nights that He was reborn, etc. Then you have so-called churches like Bethel as well as Hillsong which aren't even churches in the true sense, etc. And this is just the church. We have devils for politicians pushing children to be transgendered, drag queens telling stories to kindergarten children, the murder of children AFTER they're born. I'm on a rant, true. The points being, the apostasy isn't in the future, it's here now. Walk with the King and be a blessing.
Exactly
They Lied to You About The Pre-Trib Rapture - Lee Brainard ua-cam.com/video/r5r374e659I/v-deo.htmlsi=EubtpoICYfBYnvKl
You score 100%; 2 Thessalonians 2 verses 1-4. The apostasy those believing the antichrist, Satan is the 'Christ' -'the falling away first, those who believe in the rapture. And as the 'Spirit' explains through Paul - "let no man deceive you.. 'Christ's 2nd Advent Will not come until that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition which is another handle, name of Satan.
What comes out of the antichrist's mouth - I have come to rapture you....
I've been telling many about this false doctrine for years
me, too
They Lied to You About The Pre-Trib Rapture - Lee Brainard ua-cam.com/video/r5r374e659I/v-deo.htmlsi=EubtpoICYfBYnvKl
I have found this same situation telling my Christian brothers and sister - but they are like the Jews of old 'stiff necked, hard hearted' and their response when I ask them to read the Word with me - they get up and leave in a huff.
My heart goes out to so many believers that have put most of what they believe based on a 'pre-trib' rapture. I've often wondered if the 'great falling away' will include many of that group that believed everything would be just like the 'left behind' movies or the many pre-trip books that came out in the 60's and early 70's. I will admit that I was once a pre-trip proponent and then started reading the 'Whole-Word' and not just the part that met my early belief. I trust that this teaching, and prayerfully many others with the whole 'truth', will go out to the masses. Thank you.
The rapture and when literal hell breaks loose out of the pit will most likely cause it.... I mean Jesus literally says he will raise some up at the last day LAST DAY
No need to wonder if a Christian brother or sister believes in ((>>Pre-Tribulation, Mid-Tribulation, Post Tribulation>>)) if you truly LOVE Jesus with ALL your Heart, Soul and Mind it should not make a difference on anyone’s belief on the RAPTURE.
If you are praying, ready and studying the word of God (DAILY) and worshipping God in Spirit & in Truth and sharing the gospel with a (lost and dying world) you are doing your part for the kingdom of heaven.
Philippians 2:12-13 “Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, (work out your own salvation with fear and trembling), for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure.”
@@natureocean9466 God is not a God of confusion. To casually say it doesn't matter whether scripture says this or that (Pre, Mid or Post) is no different than the Muslim saying we all pray to the same God. As you said, worship God in Spirit and In Truth. God spirit leads us to "The Truth" (Sign that you are being led by God's Holy Sprit) so we are not decieved in any shape or form. You fall for "A Lie" you will likely fall for "Many Lies"...
2nd Thessalonians chapter 2 as you read to verse 12 is tied to the deception of believing (NKJV)"The Lie" on in the KJV "A Lie"
The mindset of not adhering to the word of God but believing doctrines of men is why God sends a strong delusion... it's addressing the Church.
People will fall away because they put their trust and hope in a belief of being taken away, when it doesn't happen there will be those who's faith in this false teaching get shattered. They will question everything. I pray they turn to scripture to see the truth and notmlose hope.
@@Kubs777
You know something we really do not know, only God knows, that’s why we “live each day as if it were our last”.
The Great Commission: To spread the gospel to a (lost and dying world). 🙌🙌🙌🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼
@@natureocean9466
Yes, we must be ready at all times as no one is promised tomorrow.
Like you and many others, I used to think it doesn't matter to know the truth about the end of the age as it relates to Christ's return. Then I sought God with my whole heart, he showed me like he showed others who desire the truth.
The gathering of the saints and meeting Jesus in the air, is clearly stated in scripture regarding the gathering of the saints at the end of The Tribulation.
I choose to believe a lie that i was taught from the pulpit, on TV and many well renowned Christian leaders.
You see its that same mentality not seeking the Truth out Satan exploits, as he does with many in the church, especially life long believers...
Most are not prepared in their hearts for what is about to happen. Their faith is about to be tested. Choose this life or Christ. It will cost many their lives. As its stated in scripture (Mark of the Beast)
We have a few years left before the Son of Perdition comes after every believer...
If they are not prepared some will fall away from the faith. As it was written in 2nd Thessalonians 2 & 1Timothy 4:1
Bible says we shall be caught up in the air and will be with the Lord forever. Your deception is amazing! Jesus comes back with his saints that are caught up into heaven. we come back with Jesus after the 7 years tribulation.
Gary Moore
Thats truth, we are not appointed 2 wrath
Do you know where the air is?
@@john316kjbtribulation and wrath are two different definitions…..look it up….
False teacher. Jesus returns with his angels from heaven after the tribulation, not the saints.
Matthew 16:27
For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and will then repay every man according to his deeds.
Matthew 25:31
“But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne.
Mark 8:38
For whoever is ashamed of Me and My words in this adulterous and sinful generation, the Son of Man will also be ashamed of him when He comes in the glory of His Father with the holy angels.”
2 Thessalonians 1:7
and to give relief to you who are afflicted and to us as well when the Lord Jesus will be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in flaming fire
@@john316kjbwrath (the day of the Lord) occurs after the tribulation.
Thank God for your boldness and truth. So many are afraid to loose subscribers!!!
Our concern, and I mean all of ours is 'God's Truth - it is the 'Holy Spirit' that generates our boldness - as you are with your reply - those who want to know 'Christ's Oracle in John 18:37 - 'God's Truth - know the wicked will flee from it - Proverb 28:1.
We gotta endure til the end! We gotta suffer thru tribulation period then we gone rule with Christ! I study at home with friends and family!!!! Shalom
Endure sounds like work . The gosepl for the body of a Christ is salvation by grave theough faith , NOT of works ....avoiding the mark of the beast sounds like alot of work....explain that
Amen
Learn Scriptures. The UNKNOWN DAY of the Rapture …The KNOWN DAY of his coming , the Second Coming . The Church is not mentioned on earth after Revelation chapter three, she is in Heaven at the Wedding Feast of the Lamb. The Church cannot be overcome, in the Tribulation Judgment of seven years AntiChrist is given power to overcome the Tribulation Saints.
@briancharters8720 so you're saying the 12 that followed Jesus, and the Christians of the other countries didn't face tribulation and die for their beliefs by being persecuted? Are we more special than them? America doesn't go through the tribulation other countries do nor the people in the past. We will see the tribulation.
@@7Logik Enduring is just not rejecting God when things get hard. You may think it's work, but work is what you do to earn something. Enduring is what you do not do so that you do not earn punishment.
FAI studios is doing a wonderful breakdown series on why pre trib is not biblical they are a wonderful ministry with great resourses based in israel. They also have an end times summet in dallas texas coming up its time the church and ministries start speaking on these topics and the urgency of endurance of the saints
I will share this information with my Bible group. Thanks for letting us know about this! God Bless.
REv. 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. At no time in history has the church in Philidelphia been kept from any world wide hour of tempation! Hence a future event, Hence a pre-trib rapture! Easy!
FIA STUDIOS ARE EXCELLENT
@@edkay3601 - However, the entire Tribulation is not the wrath of God poured out on the world. That begins after the antichrist sits in the rebuilt Jewish temple proclaiming himself to be God. The false prophet causes an image of the antichrist to be setup and forces people to worship the image. But does the entire world worship the image? Of course not! How in the world will the entire population of the earth manage to go to Jerusalem to worship this image? Collectively impossible. Example: How would people living in the northern most parts of Russia that only get about two hours of sunlight per day with the rest of the day actually being dark manage to make a trip to Jerusalem to worship the image of the antichrist? Only in Israel and the surrounding countries in the Middle East can this occur. I actually love blowing holes through the false teachings of ministers who believe in a Pre-Trib Rapture. The Book of Revelation is primarily geared to events that will happen surrounding Israel and Jerusalem, not some Revived Roman Empire (the ten nations of Europe as many claim). However I don't write off a microchip or whatever in the right hand or forehead for people here in America. Afterall, people wouldn't have to travel to Jerusalem to physically worship the image of the antichrist. They just have to take the mark to show allegiance. But overall, the focus is involving the Middle East, not the so-called European Union, or the world divided into ten regions. If anyone believes that, then I should believe the Easter Bunny actually exists.
They don't rightly divide the text , so they're doctrine is flawed tremendously.
The Truth is Answering: oh, here we go again, "the Pre-Trib didn't begin until 18th Century Darby argument." Actually, if you open your eyes, Paul spoke directly on this topic in the 1st century AD in the 1st letter to the Thessalonians. And then he clarifies the difference between the Rapture and the Day of the Lord in the 2nd letter to the Thessalonians. You and your followers should be aware that there have been many other church documents discovered which confirm that it was taught well into the 3rd century. You're argument is myopic, not to mention it directly contradicts the plain text of Scripture.
Paul was simply restating what Jesus and Daniel said!
They Lied to You About The Pre-Trib Rapture - Lee Brainard ua-cam.com/video/r5r374e659I/v-deo.htmlsi=EubtpoICYfBYnvKl
*crickets* lol
Yep, and according to the early English bibles: Tynedale, Coverdale, Matthew and Geneva. They use the word "departing", not "falling away". This utterly clears up 2 Thessalonians 2:3
You talk a good talk - but give us the Scripture, words undocumented.
Revelation, chapter 20, verses 4-5!
This represents the best single evidence to refute a pre-trib rapture! That and the Christians dying for the sake of the gospel in the Middle East as we speak!
YES, that passage is the nail in the coffin when combined with Thess where it says the dead in Christ rise first. So resurrection FIRST, THEN Rapture.
Rev 20:4-5 specifically states it's the FIRST resurrection, so impossible for rapture to take place before the FIRST resurrection, but then it spells out that the saints who refused to worship the beast or take the mark will be part of the first resurrection. So no way the rapture can take place before the tribulation, when the first resurrection includes those killed in the Tribulation.
@@cryptojihadi265
Exactly!
I couldn't have put it better!😇
@@jacob.tudragens I had to respond, because I can't tell you how many videos I've watched and comments I've read about the post-trib rapture timing and NONE of them mention that verse, and as I mentioned it's THE verse that nails it down.
Now I would argue the Corinthian verse that spells out it's at the LAST trump, would clearly indicate it can't happen before the 7th Trumpet, which is the last trumpet mentioned in the Bible, but the Pre-tribbers are so slippery. They just claim the last Trump refers to a feast and not the actual last trump in the Bible. An absurd rationalization, but that's what they do. It's all they've got. THIS verse however can't be argued.
@cryptojihadi265
They also misunderstand the 'wedding feast', thinking it is the bride and groom that is eating when revelation 19:17-18 says something different!
@@jacob.tudragens WOW! We must really be on the same page. I thought I was the only one that caught that. Haven't even shared it with anyone, but yes, from Rev 19 it REALLY seems to indicate the Wedding Feast is the dead bodies of the wicked being fed to the birds of the air.
Regardless, it does mention the wedding feast in Rev 19 at a time that makes it IMPOSSIBLE for the Wedding Feast to take place during the 7 year tribulation period, which is a core tenant of the pre-tribbers, that we are all up in heaven having a 7 year party, LOL
First clue, she said she felt something dark and mysterious coming over her. Dark and mysterious usually means it's from the Devil
EXACTLY, Right!
Wow! Exactly.
Thanks for exposing the pre-trub rapture for its inconsistency with scriptures pertaining to Jesus' return. If a secret rapture was true, then the angels present at Jesus' assention didn't know what they were talking about and Jesus would be returning two more times.
Thanxs I look that verse up! 🙏
They Lied to You About The Pre-Trib Rapture - Lee Brainard ua-cam.com/video/r5r374e659I/v-deo.htmlsi=EubtpoICYfBYnvKl
Noted, thank you for your boldness - speaking out. My personal view is personal and I am thinking we are abandoning our Hebrew brothers and sisters to take on the antichrist singularly - that bothers me. 'Christ' gives us faithfully what we will go through as stated above in Matt. 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21 - and he admonishes 5 of the 7 Christian churches in Rev 2 and Rev 3 - for correction. These are the Christian communities that will be present during the tribulation period of the antichrist.
BUT READ REV 3 VERSE 10, FOR THOSE WHO ARE BOLD ENOUGH TO SPEAK - 'Jesus' takes care of us...
I think this rapture business is gonna cause some of the great falling away Paul talks of not sure but possibly tho.. that and when all hell breaks loose literally and people won't be able to stand.
No doubt about it & they will be deceived when 2Thessalonians2 takes place.
I agree. The Pretribulation Rapture narrative is only taught in Churches in Western Civilizations; America, Europe, Australia, and parts of South America. You will not find this teaching in third world countries or in Asia. Corrie Ten Boom warned people about this false teaching. Just google "Corrie Ten Boom and the Rapture" to see her letter she wrote before she died.
I believe, as you do, that when tribulation unlike what Western Civilization has seen. Tribulation Christians have endured in the Middle East, parts of Africa, India, and China is something Christians in America and Europe are wishing to avoid.
The apostasy started in 250AD
@@Nonexistent10 what makes you say that?
Actually the rapture is God's "Scared Straight Program" for delinquents. People who hang around church but don't really believe the message. They are all going to get straightened out once the Tribulation begins. That's why Matthew 24:30 says the people that are left on the planet when Jesus returns are in mourning. Not rejoicing.
I understand why they think that, if you look at Noah and Lote, they where saved before the danger came.
You don’t think spending 7 years building a boat and being stuck on it with your in laws for a whole year doesn’t constitute tribulation?
Coming out to everything you knew and loved wiped out completely?
They do not understand correctly. During the time of Noah the world was filled with sin, pride and evil (tribulation) and then came the wrath of God and destroyed evil. The same with Sodom. In both cases they were living in the tribulation and then removed before Gods wrath. It's the same in the book of Revelation. It's Satan and the evil in man that brings about the tribulations and then believers are removed (like Lot and Noah) then Gods wrath will destroy the evil. We will live during tribulation and be removed before Gods wrath, just like Noah and Lot. I don't know why people can't see that.
Proverbs 16 18 Pride goes before destruction,
And a haughty spirit before [f]a fall.
@@kingsolomon3175 Not to mention the way geologists have examined the way the world is and worked back to the cause. A worldwide flood where "the fountains of the deep" burst would cause multiple, massive, and unimaginable tsunamis. The continents would rip apart, volcanos would emerge and erupt, the water gushing up would hit the upper atmosphere and return as huge hailstones, frozen to sub-zero by the atmosphere they would freeze rivers and lakes and bring on an ice age.
In Matthew ch13 in the story of the wheat and tares we see that the wicked and the righteous are harvested at the end of the world both together at the same time. The angels came to Jesus saying master there are tares/wicked growing among the wheat/righteous let us go and gather up the tares/wicked. Jesus said no let them both grow together until the harvest and il tell my angels to first gather up out of my kingdom all who offend and do iniquity and bind them and burn them then gather up the righteous and bring them to me. We see its not the righteous who are taken away its the wicked because Christ kingdom is here on earth. Jesus tells us in Matthew ch 24 that the end of the world will be as the time of Noah people were eating and drinking and marrying until the flood came and took them away so shall it be at the end of the world. Noah day its the flood that took the wicked away and at the last day its the angels who take the wicked away. Noah and his family were left on earth and Lots family were left and the wicked were taken away. The one taken and another left its the wicked who were taken away and the righteous who were left plan as day. Lazarus sister came to Jesus saying master if you were here my brother would be alive. Jesus said that he is sleeping and Martha said I believe that he is sleeping and will be raised up at the resurrection of the dead at the last day. Paul said that we will be changed in a twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet. The last trumpet is at the last day at his return the 7th trumpet at the second coming. Revaluations ch20 tells us that the people who didn't worship the beast or his image and didnt take the mark and died for their testimony of Christ are raised at his return and rule with Christ a thousand years. Blessed who has part in the 1st resurrection the 2nd death have no power over them who have part in the 1st resurrection. If the church is resurrected at the beginning of the tribulation why isn't it mentioned and why isn't it called the 1st resurrection but Jesus never mentioned it and Jesus only taught one resurrection at the last trumpet on the last day at his return John ch6 vs 39,40,44,54 .
Thank you finally someone teaching truth God bless you
Bless you for being bold, speaking out, the 'Spirit' within you.
Wm: our concern is half of the Christian peoples on the planet are rapture advocates and half are not - if there are 2 billion Christians then we should be concerned about 'God's Biblical Truth because the consequences to half is severe & written in REV 14: 9-11 - shouldn't we be concerned about each other.
If you read it real carefully what Jesus said in Matthew 24 and you contrast that with what Paul says in 1st Corinthians and 1st thessalonians is like they are basically saying the same thing except Paul is going to go a little bit In detail into the whole trumpet sound
The problem is people twist by putting Jesus' words in context with Paul in 1 Theselonians. But when Pauls words put in Context with Jesus' words, you find the truth.
They Lied to You About The Pre-Trib Rapture - Lee Brainard ua-cam.com/video/r5r374e659I/v-deo.htmlsi=EubtpoICYfBYnvKl
Our 'Lord' lays out the end of days events in Matt 24, and Mark 13 in private to 4 Apostles and earlier that day to the multitude gathered in the Temple courtyard, Luke 21, gathered to hear our 'Lord' Preach and Teach THESE TEACHINGS DISCLOSE THE 6 SEALS THE EVENTS THEREIN.
Jesus tells us when he will raise us from the dead in John ch6 vs 39,40,44,54 Jesus tells us that he will raise us up at the last day is when the dead in Christ will be resurrected at his return at the last day. Paul tells us in 1st Corinthians ch15 vs 52 that we'll be changed in a moment of a twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet. At the last trumpet is the 7th trumpet at his return at the last day. 1st Thessalonians ch4 vs 15,16,17 is the same event in Matthew ch24 at the 2nd coming. They both have Christ appearances and both have the shout of the Arch angel both have the trumpet blast both have the resurrection of the saints it's the same event. Jesus only taught one resurrection of the dead and he said it will happen at the last trumpet at the last day at his 2nd coming. Jesus never taught a resurrection of the dead in Christ before the last day. If he did I'd like to see it.
In one passage Jesus meets us in the air and in the other Jesus comes down to Earth in his second coming. That tells me there is a rapture and then the 2nd coming.
@brianbandy4483 can you please provide the two passages you are referring to? I want to make sure we are discussing the same thing.
brianbandy4483,
No, all of the prophesies line up perfectly. They all tell the same story but focus on different details.
Read it again, in context. Read them side by side.
There are atheists who comb the scriptures looking for "Errors." Bart Ehrman is good at finding "errors."
The "errors" are often such things as when a gospel writer mentions a person at an event that the other writers failed to mention.
This actually proves that they are telling what they saw, and not just copying from the others. When 2 witness tell the police the exact same story the police assume that they are lying. That's because we all process what we see differently.
At a recent Bible class there were 4 women and 3 men. Now, if I told someone about the class I might say, "Robert, Pastor Sachs, and I were there." My friend might say to someone else that "Diana, Karen, Jill, and Colleen were there."
Were we at two different meetings?
This is the "logic" pretribbles use when they claim that the fact that the Bible calls the body of believers a church, but individual believers "saints" or "elect" means something earthshaking and proves the pretrib rapture!
This is also the basis for your comment. Jesus, Paul, John, and Daniel all told the same story. They were each individuals, they each told the story from their own point of view.
@@TruthisCalling
He's hasn't been studying in the Bible
We meet him in the air in his second coming, in that coming the dead in Christ are resurrected and together with the living righteous they reign with Christ in heaven for 1000 years, after the thousand years in which Satan is bound on earth Christ returns to earth and before descending with the new Jerusalem on the Mount of Olives, the wicked are resurrected to be judged along with Satan and the fallen angels in the final judgment and are consumed in the lake of fire and sulfur, this is the second death, eternal death, then all things are made new and we will reign with Christ in the new Jerusalem on earth for eternity
They're the same event. We meet Jesus in the air and stay here on earth for the millennial reign.
The Dead Are Raised First [1 Thess 4:15] We who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will not precede those who have died. Therefore, the Rapture cannot take place before the dead are raised. The Bible tells us WHEN the dead are raised [1 Cor 15:52] "at the Last Trumpet". Also, we are told this takes place on "the Last Day" [John 11:24, 6:39, 6:40, 6:44, 6:54,12:48]. Finally, we are also told this takes place after the tribulation [Matt 24:29, Mark 13:34]. Also, "saints" in Jude 1:14 and 1 Thess 3:13, is a reference to "angels" (holy ones - Strong's G40 Hagios) - not human saints, but "angels" are also called "saints" or "holy ones" (Deut 33:2, Ps 68:17). The Rapture cannot take place before the dead are raised - the dead shall rise first. Therefore you cannot have a Rapture (of the living believers) until the dead are raised first, placing the timing of the Rapture after the dead are raised, at the Last Trumpet, on the Last Day, after the tribulation...just like the Bible explains it. We must not contradict these Scriptures as so many have done. We need to embrace and understand these plain statements from the Bible. Please share this with everyone. With thanks to Jesus our Savior. Amen.
@gospeltrax 2513
The slerping in Christ may well be those with a perfect faith. Those crippled wirh soubt may be the ones who remain.
Still alive may mean those who have not died n been reborn.
@DaemonZodiac the ones who are still alive are the 144,000 who are in the mountains of Judea being nourished for 42 months while Satan is persecuting the Saints. Once the saints are killed *Revelation 6:9-11 *Revelation 12 and 13 then God pours out His Wrath upon the whole world👈 Then Jesus comes back with those😅 saints, the last trumpet is sounded *1 Corrinthians 15:52 Matthew 24:3, the dead rise and 144,000 are caught up to meet the Lord in the air, and destroy all those surrounding Israel and throws Satan in the pit, along with the Beast and the false prophet. Satan is released after 1,000 years for a short season to attempt one last time as the world repopulates more humans to weed out the goats and spare the sheep all who are called to serve God👈💯🤌
@@johnlenox5036 yes but i was talking about the sleeping in Christ, not the 144000. thank you for your input.
The greatest problem with believing in the pretrib rapture is that when the Antichrist comes, they will risk failing to recognize him for who he is. They will say, "It can't be him bc we are still here." They will end up risking following the Antichrist with all his charisma who will tell them everything they want to hear, and no matter how vile he be they will excuse him as "just a poor sinner like us." Pretrib rapture is a massive deception from the enemy himself so that when his Antichrist comes, he will deceive many. I hope, when that time comes, that their eyes will be opened and that God will show them their error so that they WILL recognize him
this is exactly why when people say its no big deal, i tell them its a huge deal and major false doctrine that sets up the church for the great falling away.
I don't really know, and to a certain extent don't care, as long as the Lord Jesus comes back, as He will, it's all good.
My view has always been along the lines of -- the dead rise, and then the believers are caught up (this certainly implies a rapture, yeah, I know, but WHEN?) To meet the Lord Jesus in the air -- doesn't say He's going to land -- YET. But assuming this happens at the end when Jesus does return to earth, at the end of the great Tribulation -- Paul said we are not destined for wrath, okay, maybe Paul was speaking of the judgement, however, the church believers are the bride of Christ, so is the Lord planning on His bride going through all of the horrific things laid out in Revelation? This hardly seems like a nice engagement. But I'll admit it might be part of the program. It just seems a bit strange, not to mention stressful.
One thing to consider, a good Bible teacher I've come across, Les Feldick, said (and I'm not saying he's right, but it makes sense) is that there's (in a way) two gospel messages, to two different audiences. Primarily, the first is the gospel of the Kingdom, focused to Israel and the Jews, delivered mainly by Jesus and most of the Apostles, except for Paul, who preached the gospel of salvation to the gentiles.
What Mr. Feldick said was you should consider who was speaking, to whom were they speaking, and what they were trying to say. Basically that the Kingdom message was to the Jews, and the salvation by grace and believing in Christ Jesus was to the gentiles. Similar results for both groups, but different methods and messages.
I can't help but wonder if most of the Jewish believers that will be saved, will occur after the church has been removed from the stage so the children of Abraham can once more take center stage.
I know that there's some teachers that think the rapture, and particularly a pre trib rapture is somehow harmful to the church and it's work, but the opposite view, that if the church didn't have that distraction, that we would have fulfilled the great commission and be ready to hand it over to the Lord Jesus as a completed assignment doesn't seem very likely. Humanity has never been very effective in doing things without God's help, I'm not sure that we are expected to start that now. Almost sounds like a works based situation.
God works in mysterious ways, if He had wanted us to KNOW, He would have told us explicitly. 🙏✝️🙏
How do we come back w/Jesus to wage war on satan, if were not in Heaven before this happens?Come back means we were here but not then.
The catching up to meet the Lord in the Air is in fact Biblical. This event takes place at the LAST trump as noted in Corinthians:
1 Corinthians 15
51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
The LAST trump in Greek is the furthest one out. That is the 7th Trump in Revelation. That is the END of the tribulation. In the Book of Jude it describes this event as well.
Jude
Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,
15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.
The Lord's coming is at the end of the tribulation, we are changed into our spiritual bodies and meet the Lord in the air (as noted in Jude: the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints). The Lord descends to earth, he doesn't ascend to Heaven. The Lord's return marks the millennial reign of Christ. There is no millennium without the Lord (see Matthew 24: 29-30).
What makes you think that the saints were in Heaven when they accompany Jesus as he marches to Jerusalem?
@@stephenszucs8439 Hebrews 12:1, Jude 1: 14-15 offer assurance of those coming with the Lord Jesus Christ when He returns. Those of us on the Earth in the days the Lord returns will be transformed in our spiritual bodies (described in 1 Corinthians 15:51) we will meet the Lord in the air (Revelation 1:7), He does not ascend to Heaven, but to the earth to destroy the Antichrist (1 Thessalonians 4: 15-18; 2 Thessalonians 2:8). Believers get mistaken thinking we are taken up in a rapture to Heaven to avoid the tribulation on the earth. While it is true we are changed into our spiritual bodies and caught up with our Lord in the air we do not go up to Heaven, but gather with the Lord as He descends to earth. This happens at the LAST trump (described in 1 Corinthians 15:51). This trump is the last event in Revelation before the vial and final judgments where our Lord returns.
@@TruthisCalling I agree completely, except that I debate the Spiritual body part. I think we are given the bodies that Adam and Eve had before the fall. Our own bodies, but without entropy. A reversion to what was before the "kill switch" in every cell was activated. A perfectly healthy body, but still our own. I imagine we will look as we look now since we will be known and know others...but maybe we will look better than we do now?
Christ will establish his kingdom on earth we’re not gonna be raptured anywhere at any time
If people really read Ellen McDonald’s dream, it is not really describing a pre trib rapture. Darby and others misinterpreted her dream.
You got that right because her 1st impression was it seemed evil.
I appreciate you giving us scripture the problem is most people are still going to claim that they are tribulation Saints they will completely look past these verses or make some kind of excuse for them
Daniel 12:4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end:
I've known this for 25 years but I don't know of any churches that believe this way except for cults.
Hang in there Tim again post the Scripture - read Mark 13:23, your questions are answered Biblically.
CHRISTIANS IN THE Catholic Church BELIEVE THERE IS NO RAPTURE.
Paul wrote and said in no way will the living precede the dead, that the dead in Christ shall rise first, and then those who remain will be caught up at the last trumpet. The last trumpet is the 7th trumpet. Yeshua told the decilpes when you see Jerusalem compassed with armies, Luke 21:20. Immediately after the tribulation, Matthew 24:29, Mark 13:24. Ezekiel 13:20-23 tells us God hates the fly away doctrine false prophet preachers preach.
Thanks for taking the time to watch and respond. Your comment makes me think you are a fellow student of the Shepherd's Chapel. Is that right?
I am. Thank God for Shepherds chapel who teaches God's word chapter by chapter and verse by verse like God said to do.
Amazing well prepared and delivered and received thank you very much
Respectfully
Thanks, Ryan!
Lets fact check his claims......
Here's some quotes by the early church fathers for a pretrib rapture...compliments of Ken Johnson's book "Ancient Church Fathers.” These quotes come long before Darby.
Irenaeus, AD 170
Against Heresies 5.29 -
When in the end that church will suddenly be caught up from this, it is said, “There will be tribulation such as not been since the beginning, nor will be.”
Ephraim the Syrian, AD 373
On The Last Times 2-
...because all saints and the elect of the LORD are gathered together before the Tribulation which is about to come and be taken to the LORD...
Tertullian, AD 207
Against Marcion 5.16 -
He [Paul] says those who remain unto the coming of Christ, along with the dead in Christ, will rise first, being “caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.” ...By the mouth of Isaiah, it was said long ago “who are these who fly like clouds unto me, as doves with their young ones?”
One quote from the author of the Shepherd of Hermas, two quotes by Cyprian, and one quote by Ephraim the Syrian reveal that at least some of the ancient church fathers were Pretribulationists.
Shepherd of Hermas The Shepherd of Hermas was written about AD 150. It describes a dream and gives the interpretation of it. The church (bride clothed in white) escapes the Great Tribulation because of the promise of the Lord. This is not to be considered Scripture, but it does show that many second century Christians believed in a Pretribulational Rapture.
Shepherd of Hermas, AD 150 Shepherd of Hermas 2.2-6 -
Go therefore and declare to the Elect of the Lord His mighty deeds and say to them that this beast is a type of the Great Tribulation which is to come. If ye therefore prepare yourselves and with your whole heart turn to the Lord in repentance, then shall ye be able to escape it, if your heart is pure and blameless… the golden color stands for you who have escaped from this world… Now ye know the symbol of the Great Tribulation to come. But if ye are willing, it shall be nothing.
Cyprian Cyprian was bishop of Carthage about AD 250. Notice he did not teach we must endure the time of the Antichrist, but we will be “delivered” from it. He tells his readers that the coming resurrection was the hope of the Christian, and points out that the Rapture should motivate us as we see the last days approaching.
Cyprian, AD 250 Treatises of Cyprian 21-26 -
We who see that terrible things have begun, and know that still more terrible things are imminent, may regard it as the greatest advantage to depart from it as quickly as possible. Do you not give God thanks, do you not congratulate yourself, that by an early departure you are taken away, and delivered from the shipwrecks and disasters that are imminent? Let us greet the day which assigns each of us to his own home, which snatches us hence, and sets us free from the snares of the world, and restores us to paradise and the kingdom. Epistle 55 - The Antichrist is coming, but above him comes Christ also. The enemy goes about and rages, but immediately the Lord follows to avenge our suffering and our wounds. The adversary is enraged and threatens, but there is One who can deliver us from his hands. Ephraim the Syrian This next quote is from a work entitled Pseudo-Ephraim. It has the title pseudo, not because anyone doubted the sermon, but because when quoted later, two historians said it was Ephraim the Syrian who wrote it, and one historian said it was Isadore of Seville. Whether this was written by Isadore or Ephraim, the sermon was always accepted as genuine. It clearly teaches a Rapture before the Tribulation occurs.
Great job in your presentation! Keep up the great work you are doing! Keep preaching the everlasting gospel! Men must keep their eyes on Jesus not a gospel of men that Scofield and Darby preached. Stay faithful to Him and I'll see you on the other side! Blessings.
They Lied to You About The Pre-Trib Rapture - Lee Brainard ua-cam.com/video/r5r374e659I/v-deo.htmlsi=EubtpoICYfBYnvKl
In the words of Jesus, "You are mistaken, not understanding the Scriptures nor the power of God." I know you mean well but the road to hell is paved with good intentions. First of all, right or wrong, how is this rapture doctrine "Dangerous"? Unless you tie it to salvation, which you seem to be doing, in which case you are in error again. Salvation is 100% dependent on the cross and a gift of God lest anyone should boast. Saved by grace alone. Reading a few scripture references does not make you a scholar any more than a few "Google" searches on a topic makes you an authority on the subject. The "Rapture" and "The Second" are two separate events. As Paul states, the rapture is when Jesus comes for His bride, "The Church" before the Tribulation as we are not destined for God`s wrath. The Tribulation is God`s wrath upon the wicked world.
After this, the church or the bride of Christ is no longer mentioned. But people will be saved during the Tribulation as God would have all to come to a saving knowledge of His Son and not perish. They are referred to as the "Tribulation saints". Although saved, they must go through and endure Tribulation. Jesus keeps warning us..."do not be deceived". So what team are you playing for? If you want to go through the Tribulation, be my guest. But if you truly are an honest born again christian, you will not have a say. When He comes for us, you will be taken and the others left as the scriptures declare. You are robing people of the joy and the hope they have in Christ. May He have mercy on your soul because you know not of what you speak. Please do your homework before you open your mouth. There are many scripture references that support the rapture of the church. You really should read them.
Dear brother or sister you are no scholar either, You say, "The Tribulation is God`s wrath upon the wicked world." No, it isn't. The Greek word for tribulation is 'thilipsis' it means to "squeeze" or put pressure on, and is also translated 'affliction'. The Greek word for wrath is 'orge' and means 'anger'. Never once in the Scripture is the word thilipsis applied to anyone but Christians. Jesus promised we, the church, would have tribulation and persecution, affliction. To equate wrath and tribulation is a deception and in a sense a lie, since the words mean two different things and are translated into English in two different ways. If you doubt me, go to a searchable Bible and see where the word tribulation is sued throughout Scripture. We do not suffer God's wrath, but we are promised tribulation. Just as God protected Noah, and Jonah, and Daniel, and the Hebrew boys in the fiery furnace, just as he protected the Saints and his brethren throughout history, he can protect us through tribulation, even great tribulation. The Lord sent his wrath on the Egyptians, while he perfectly preserved and physically protected the Hebrews in captivity there.
Our joy in Christ is not dependent on a doctrine (pretrib rapture) that has no direct basis in Scripture but is instead the result of a 'system' of theology. Our joy in Christ is that he is Way, the Truth, and the Life. He is our Rock and our Salvation. Our joy is everlasting and eternal life through his shed blood, not the idea that we are going to miss tribulation we were promised to experience for his name, that we ought to count as joy.
Of course the text doesnt say tribulation saints after the rapture just saint that undergone persecution by the Anti Christ no rapture timeline is given nor is the word rapture in the Bible separated within the context of the second coming you are interpreting scripture but inserting words its just saints and just the second coming that’s it of course there are the saints being caught up during the second coming it does not say during the rapture but rather the last day.
@@lilwaynesworld0
I heard a sermon that there are [4 types of Saints]:
1-The Old Testament Saints ;
2-The Church Age Saints;
3-The Tribulation Saints;
4-The Millennial Saints;
The Tribulation Saints:
REVELATION 7
9
After this I looked and there before me was a [great multitude that no one could count], from every nation, tribe, people and language, standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands.
10
And they cried out in a loud voice: "Salvation belongs to our God, who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb."
11
All the angels were standing around the throne and around the elders and the four living creatures. They fell down on their faces before the throne and worshiped God,
12
saying: "Amen! Praise and glory and wisdom and thanks and honor and power and strength be to our God for ever and ever. Amen!"
13
Then one of the elders asked me, "These in white robes--[who are they, and where did they come from]"?
14
I answered, "Sir, you know." And he said, "These are they who have [come out]of the [great tribulation]; they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
15
Therefore, "they are before the throne of God and serve him day and night in his temple; and he who sits on the throne will spread his tent over them.
16
Never again will they hunger; never again will they thirst. The sun will not beat upon them, nor any scorching heat.
17
For the Lamb at the center of the throne will be their shepherd; he will lead them to springs of living water. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes."
AMEN!!!!!!
@@TheMistysFavs You may have heard a preacher claim that they are "different kinds of saints" but that is unbiblical in the extreme. There is no distinction made in the Bible, and in fact, making distinctions is forbidden. Especially forbidden is the urge for gentile Christians to act superior to Jews. Paul warned the church pretty sternly about that.
There are an equal amount of scriptures both in the Old & New Testaments which support the Pre, Mid & Post Tribulation scenarios. It is not wise to argue and debate about something that God has NOT REVEALED BY THE REVELATION OF HIS SPIRIT.
A perfect example of this is found in Matthew 16 when Jesus asks His Disciples, "Whom do 'men' say that I am ?"
The Disciples answered, "SOME SAY you are John the Baptist, SOME SAY you are Elijah, SOME SAY you are Jeremiah, & SOME SAY you are one of the other Prophets."
The point is this, they were ALL WRONG & DIVIDED about who Jesus was because they did NOT receive those answers FROM GOD "personally" BY REVELATION, but only received those answers from "Men", or even maybe by a "private" interpretation from the Old Testament scriptures, which is the Word of God in "seed" form to the reader, NOT REVELATION or the Word of God Reveled in HARVEST FORM.
We must understand that the Word of God on "paper" is in "seed" form, and is NOT THE FINAL REVELATION, or the HARVEST OF THAT WORD WHEN IT COMES TO PASS.
Just as the "Fruit" is a completely different manifestation than the "seed" is,
but yet agrees with, supports, & confirms the "seed" which was planted.
The Word of God on "paper" is in "seed" form, and UNTIL God brings that "seed" to FULL MATURITY, which is when we "Hear" the Voice of God, NO ONE WILL KNOW WHO IS RIGHT or WRONG, ALL WILL BE DIVIDED ON THIS SUBJECT, JUST LIKE THE MEN WERE ABOUT WHO JESUS WAS, UNTIL GOD REVEALS IT BY HIS SPIRIT TO THE CHURCH.
7 Truth7Wins,
Name one passage that promises a pre-trib escape?
@@stephenszucs8439 When you acknowledge that you read my full post above and that you understand what I have written,, THEN, I will give you scriptures from both Old & New Testaments that support Pre-Trib.
But like I stated in my post, the Word of God on "paper" is a DIFFERENT MANIFESTATION than the Word of God REVEALED and COME TO LIFE.
So the scriptures I give you won't help you in the least.
YOU MUST HEAR FROM GOD PERSONALLY ON THIS SUBJECT BY HIS SPIRIT, IF NOT, IT WILL NOT BE TRUTH TO YOU "Personally", making the argument NULL & VOID.
@@7Truth7Wins7 I read and understand what you think is true, but the Bible is the authority, and the men who received special knowledge from the clear, sure word of the Lord were verified as legit by the other prophets, by the things they predicted coming to pass, and by other passages in the Bible.
On the other hand, you have a vast number of insane claims all over YuselessTube, TV, and every other place you can go all proclaiming that "God told me" some nonsense that is patently unbiblical.
We are *commanded* to test every spirit and every message. How to test it? Compare it to Scripture. God literally inspired the Bible. He will not contradict it.
So, what I see here is another person who believes a thing that is not in the Bible claiming that they are right anyway because they are just so close to God that he lets them see what he has hidden from the entire church for centuries, and therefore "I don't have to show you my evidence."
1 Thessalonians 4:15-16-17-18
For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
Wherefore comfort one another with these words.
The first 3 chapters of Revelations mention's the Church and it is not mentioned again until the 2nd coming in chapter 19 (The Church is misssing from 4-19 because they are gone)
Excellent layout of the truth of God's Word, dealing with the Rapture Myth. I live in the Baptist South and the rapture theory is ingrained here. People think one belongs to Satan if you tell them the Rapture is total bunk. - The birth of the rapture theory reminds me of the Mormon story where Joseph Smith put some river rocks in his hat, stuck his face in the hat, and God revealed Mormonism to him. Good Grief!
I put all my trust and faith in Jesus Christ and him crucified. Exclusively. Knowing that nothing I do can influence my Salvation. Only my trust and faith in the right object, can help me to get to heaven. Praise God. Hallelujah to the Lamb. Glory to God.
Bible prophecy is given for preparation for his people!
Amen! It is our Guide for our return to our 'Father'. Read John 17 'our 'Lord's Prayer verses 14-19. Let the 'Sprit' Speak to you on 'Christ's Word. Hopefully, we will get into what happened ...in the beginning and why we are in this temporary life in the flesh.
Lets fact check his claims......
Here's some quotes by the early church fathers for a pretrib rapture...compliments of Ken Johnson's book "Ancient Church Fathers.” These quotes come long before Darby.
Irenaeus, AD 170
Against Heresies 5.29 -
When in the end that church will suddenly be caught up from this, it is said, “There will be tribulation such as not been since the beginning, nor will be.”
Ephraim the Syrian, AD 373
On The Last Times 2-
...because all saints and the elect of the LORD are gathered together before the Tribulation which is about to come and be taken to the LORD...
Tertullian, AD 207
Against Marcion 5.16 -
He [Paul] says those who remain unto the coming of Christ, along with the dead in Christ, will rise first, being “caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.” ...By the mouth of Isaiah, it was said long ago “who are these who fly like clouds unto me, as doves with their young ones?”
One quote from the author of the Shepherd of Hermas, two quotes by Cyprian, and one quote by Ephraim the Syrian reveal that at least some of the ancient church fathers were Pretribulationists.
Shepherd of Hermas The Shepherd of Hermas was written about AD 150. It describes a dream and gives the interpretation of it. The church (bride clothed in white) escapes the Great Tribulation because of the promise of the Lord. This is not to be considered Scripture, but it does show that many second century Christians believed in a Pretribulational Rapture.
Shepherd of Hermas, AD 150 Shepherd of Hermas 2.2-6 -
Go therefore and declare to the Elect of the Lord His mighty deeds and say to them that this beast is a type of the Great Tribulation which is to come. If ye therefore prepare yourselves and with your whole heart turn to the Lord in repentance, then shall ye be able to escape it, if your heart is pure and blameless… the golden color stands for you who have escaped from this world… Now ye know the symbol of the Great Tribulation to come. But if ye are willing, it shall be nothing.
Cyprian Cyprian was bishop of Carthage about AD 250. Notice he did not teach we must endure the time of the Antichrist, but we will be “delivered” from it. He tells his readers that the coming resurrection was the hope of the Christian, and points out that the Rapture should motivate us as we see the last days approaching.
Cyprian, AD 250 Treatises of Cyprian 21-26 -
We who see that terrible things have begun, and know that still more terrible things are imminent, may regard it as the greatest advantage to depart from it as quickly as possible. Do you not give God thanks, do you not congratulate yourself, that by an early departure you are taken away, and delivered from the shipwrecks and disasters that are imminent? Let us greet the day which assigns each of us to his own home, which snatches us hence, and sets us free from the snares of the world, and restores us to paradise and the kingdom. Epistle 55 - The Antichrist is coming, but above him comes Christ also. The enemy goes about and rages, but immediately the Lord follows to avenge our suffering and our wounds. The adversary is enraged and threatens, but there is One who can deliver us from his hands. Ephraim the Syrian This next quote is from a work entitled Pseudo-Ephraim. It has the title pseudo, not because anyone doubted the sermon, but because when quoted later, two historians said it was Ephraim the Syrian who wrote it, and one historian said it was Isadore of Seville. Whether this was written by Isadore or Ephraim, the sermon was always accepted as genuine. It clearly teaches a Rapture before the Tribulation occurs.
YES EXACTLY. Thank you for providing these. I made reference to these but could not compilate them.
WRONG.
@@Nonexistent10 Um, no. Please explain where we are wrong.
@Orange6921 Thank you for taking the time to consider the video and offer your thoughts. The information you provided does not give any definitive notion the early fathers believed in a pre-trip rapture.
For example, your first statement -
Tertullian, AD 207
Against Marcion 5.16 -
He [Paul] says those who remain unto the coming of Christ, along with the dead in Christ, will rise first, being “caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.” ...By the mouth of Isaiah, it was said long ago “who are these who fly like clouds unto me, as doves with their young ones?”
The catching up to meet the Lord in the Air is in fact Biblical. This event takes place at the LAST trump as noted in Corinthians:
1 Corinthians 15
51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
The LAST trump in Greek is the furthest one out. That is the 7th Trump in Revelation. That is the END of the tribulation. In the Book of Jude it describes this event as well.
Jude
Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,
15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.
The Lord's coming is at the end of the tribulation, we are changed into our spiritual bodies and meet the Lord in the air (as noted in Jude: the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints). The Lord descends to earth, he doesn't ascend to Heaven. The Lord's return marks the millennial reign of Christ. There is no millennium without the Lord (see Matthew 24: 29-30).
The quotes you are providing discuss the return or Christ and are gathering together to Him. There is no indication of a rapture where believers leave earth and return at a later time.
@@TruthisCalling There is ZERO basis whatsoever to claim the "Last Trump" is the 7th judgment trumpet of Revelation. The "last trump" is in a letter written to the Corinthians in the 50's AD. Its just silly and rather absurd to then pretend the context here for the Corinthians was the 7th judgement trumpet of Revelation, a book not even written and revealed for another 40 years. Not to mention the fact that there are another 1000 years of trumpets being blown on the earth after the tribulation in the 1000 year Kingdom.
None of that logic makes any sense at all.
You also seem completely unaware that there is this VITAL thing called the "FEAST OF TRUMPETS" in the OT law and those 7 feasts symbolize the entire work of Jesus at His first coming and 2nd coming. They include the Passover, Unleavened bread, the Firstfruits, the Pentecost, Feast of Trumpets, Day of Atonement and Tabernacles. The final trumpet blast on the feast of trumpets is called "THE LAST TRUMP". Its has always been understood by the Jews as being directly connected of the Resurrection of the Saints.
When people connect the "Last Trump" to the 7 judgment Trumpets of Revelation, it sounds like they are not reading their OT hardly at all, and no awareness of the 7 feasts and what the Last Trump" was already know to be when Paul wrote this letter.
Not even Paul know of the book of Revelation and the 7 judgments there, but he knew full well what the LAST TRUMP was when he pinned that letter, as well as the people he wrote it to. And it had nothing on earth to do with a book not even written for another 40 years that does not even have the words "LAST TRUMP" in it, nor does it show any Resurrection at the end of the 7 judgments there..
Good presentation of pertinent info. I always think of Jesus telling martha right before He called Lazarus from the grave that He is the resurrection and the life and asked her if she believed Him. she said yes I believe my brother will be raised on the last day. That sounds like she means the last day and Jesus didn’t correct her with another time other than the last day.
Like it, the last (human) day in Scripture is called 'the day of the Lord', (and 1 Cor. 15: 52 takes place)'Christ's return which ushers in the 1,000 year Reign of 'Christ' - Rev 20:4. When our 'Lord' Talks about the dead He means spiritually dead - those who never had the opportunity to know Him, 'God's Word - the 1,000 reign ALL will Know Him.
@@CommStudies good points. I’m pushing 70 and probably the most important thing I’ve been given is that I’m never to old to learn. Most of my time is spent hungering and thirsting after righteousness, listening and searching the scriptures and asking for revelation from what I read.
I disagree. But thankfully this is not a salvation issue, which you seem to imply. In addition, we are not appointed unto wrath. Thanks for sharing.
It is a salvation issue because pre tribbers are in denial of the events happening now and will or have taken the mark already because they are blind to the reality of scriptures and when they take Thier mark they are unredeemable!!! They show no respect to the sufferings and persecution of the saints since Christianity begun until this present day.....self seeking lovers of selves and total wimps !
God's wrath and the tribulation are 2 different things; different words
I agree rapture is a false doctrine
2 Thessalonians 2: 7. For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way.
Very good. Now study the 7th day Sabbath. Constantine thought he could change Yah’s Sabbath to Sunday - but we do not bow down to the teachings of men. Pray about it people. Once you understand the truth about Sabbath, you will understand the mark of the beast.
Yes indeed.
I keep telling people it says the meek shall inherit the earth. Why eould we escape without that being fulfilled?
Thank you for this truth - the meek won't be so meek when they witness against the antichrist through the 'Holy Spirit' - Luke 12: 11-12. Meek in Greek means humble and when 'Jesus' Returns we will all be humbled.
Ok. Mathew Chapter 24 is the second coming of Christ. It isn't the Rapture. If you read in that chapter it talks about people fleeing Judea. That is for the Jews. We don't live in Israel. Actually,it isn't the Tribulation. It is called Jacob's Trouble found in Isaiah 30:7. God said that we as Born Again Christians are not appointed unto weath!!! You just showed the scripture where we will be caught up to meet the Lord in the air. Also,read Revelation chapter 5. It says that the Angeks are in Heaven and in Mathew Jesus told the Saducees that when we die,we neither marry or are given in marriage but are as the Angels Of God. Furthermore,if you read Revelation Chapter 6,Jesus opens the first seal andxthe Rider on the White Horse is released. This is the Anti-Christ!! We are in Heaven when the Anti-Christ is released!!! You have to rightly divide the word of God!!! There is a Rapture and then there us the second coming of the Lord!!! I am looking for Jesus Christ not the Anti-Christ!!! Stop lying and deceiving people!!! You are telling them that there isn't a Rapture!!! You are Lost!!!
Basically I am pretty much alone with my post tribulation rapture.
Hi, Tim: you are not alone! There are many that are seeing the Biblical truth of this as you do, including us : ) Keep fighting the good fight!
Hey let's post Scripture, chapter and verse and talk it out.
Matthew 24 (Pay attn: to the Sun)
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from
heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the
tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31And he shall send his
angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Is Dave MacPherson your only resource? Ugh! Not much research here...
Jude 14-15 cf., Zechariah 14:5; Revelation 19:11ff - Certainly the Return of the reigning Christ ~
Matthew 13:24-30 cf., Matthew 24:40-41 - where are the "Angels" in Matthew 13:24-30 referenced???
You didn't finish 2 Thessalonians 2...
Revelation 12 is not a "rapture" passage ~
You show Luke 21:27ff but failed to incorporate the context. Verses 20-23 mention the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem in 70 A.D., while v. 24 notes the "trodden underfoot" of the Gentiles UNTIL the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled. This is specific to a time frame. Next up (at the conclusion of the times of the Gentile's fulfillment), there will be signs in the Sun... This all leads up to Christ's glorious return but has nothing to do with the Rapture doctrine, nor is it directed at the Church. Notice that at vv. 20 & 24, Jesus specifically directs the hearer's attention to "JERUSALEM," not the Church. This is important if you are going to interpret the word of God correctly ~
if the resurrection happened at only one second coming,the saints would descend in their spirits from Heaven,get their bodies from the grave,and then ascend again to Heaven to seat on white horses ,then descend again at Armageddon all within a day. Thats three trips :Down,up,down in one day! Then the last trumpet and last day are terms for two dispensations.The last day being raised is like the last trumpet,it is the day of the Lord, and covers the rapture,tribulation,and second coming down on earth. Last day (of the church age,and last day for the redemption of israel and the world) and last trumpet refers to both second comings' last day and last trumpet all wrapped up in one term.That is like a gap in a way.Exactly how God works in some prophecies seem to describe an event as if it were one event in same time period but its separated in a gap. The wheat and weeds of the church age are different from the wheat and weeds of the tribulation. Jesus said not to pluck out the weeds first in the tribulation because it would pull out the wheat's chance to grow and learn in the tribulation,meaning if they rapture in first trib or mid trib,then the harvest of new believers would not grow in having more believers come to faith since the unrighteous as potential new converts would have no time to convert if they are destroyed earlier and it would affect the wheat harvest,and an early judgment would cause the trib saints already alive to face death too early if the last bowl judgment happened too early. Those who are taken at the second coming are the wicked into judgment,captured by warring angels like vultures. The resurrected old testament saints and trib saints at the final 2nd coming will not ascend but will be gathered from 4 winds remaining on the land and summoned to the judgment of the righteous sheep in jerusalem.
Bro you left out all the important scriptures about the rapture. Listen to Jimmy Evans he has the rapture down.
Jimmy Evans is confused & a victim of the Pretrib rapture false doctrine. Jonah2:8 KJV "They that observe lying vanities forsake their own mercy." Lying vanities=false doctrines.
So which are the important texts?
No need to listen to anyone but Jesus and He said He would return after the Tribulation. And yet humans want to argue about it because of indoctrination.
I thought the catching away where we meet the dead in Christ in the air was told by Paul ? Paul is about the rapture & Revelation is 2nd coming. Only Paul spoke about the “ rapture” by the instruction of the Lord.
The event you are referring to takes place at the end of Revelation. It is also mentioned in the Book of Jude. We are gathered with the Lord in the air, but He DOES NOT take us out of here, but continues to descend to the earth, destroy the Antichrist, and restores the earth. Then comes the millennial reign of Christ.
You thought correctly. You're best off learning about dispensational theology rather than following the erroneous interpretations of this so called "truth" teller. He probably also believes God replaced Israel with the Church. He doesn't understand the distinction between the Church age and then the 70th week of Daniel, also known as the Time of Jacob's Trouble, aka the Day of the Lord, aka The Great Tribulation, the time in which God completes his promises to Israel and reins on the throne of David over all the nations for 1000 years. The Church will not be present during the Tribulation (see Rev 3:10 and John 14). Many will come to a saving knowledge during this period and they will surrender their lives (Tribulation Saints). Much more could I tell you. Stay away from Reformed theology which is also the default position of the Roman Catholic Church (minus the doctrine of salvation through faith).
takinittotheheatandstreet,
DANIEL taught about the "Rescue" of the ones who are in the Book of Life. AFTER the Abomination is set up and great Tribulation happens. It matches the statements of Jesus and Paul.
@@Jammaster1972 Or he could just read the Bible that plainly states in Rev 20:4-5 that the FIRST rapture includes those who were beheaded, who refused to worship the beast or accept his mark. So clearly the very first resurrection includes those killed in the tribulation.
Then Thess plainly states the dead in Christ rise first, THEN we who are alive and remain will be caught up.
Since the first resurrection includes the martyred tribulation saints and we can't be raptured prior to the first resurrection, the rapture takes place after the tribulation. As stated so many other times about enduring to the end, after ALL these things Christ returns, etc, etc.
Not one verse says we will be raptured prior to the tribulation. NONE as that would directly contradict the plainly stated passages referenced above.
The only verses the pre-tribbers have that they claim support the pre-trib ALL require reading hidden meaning into the text.
This understanding of the “end times” doesn’t seem quite right to me.
Don’t we need to determine if the Church and Israel are different or actually one and the same? If “Israel” of the New Testament is uniquely the people of the blood line of Jacob, the book of Revelation, in particular, makes more sense at the literal/physical level of interpretation. And His prophecies are all fulfilled as written.
Consider the Olivet discourse of Matthew 24 and 25, Mark 13, and Luke 21. It seems to speak of the Rapture of the Church. The Discourse’s reference to “stars falling” and “powers of heaven … shaken” may actually be the “war in heaven” described in Revelation 12: with the devil and his angels (the “stars”) being thrown down to Earth. Thus, with heaven having been swept clean of the enemy, i.e., the “Accuser of the brethren,” the time will have arrived - with the “fulness of the Gentiles” also at this point having been reached -- to receive the Church into Heaven through the Rapture. National Israel then enters into the “time of Jacob’s trouble,” the 7 year tribulation; and the 144,000 of the tribes of Israel take center stage as Israel is severely tested. The end result is that “all Israel (the remnant) will be saved.”
The reality of the “stars” falling -- with all the attendant terrors will begin the 7 years of wrath on Earth as the devil knows his time is short. We do need to keep watching, looking up, praying “always, that we may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.” We need to be ready to go - like Lot from Sodom -- without hesitation. “Remember Lot’s wife!”
Several UA-cam channels including “The11:11Sign” and “Dave Kull” make abundant sense to me.
... But most likely we'll probably all be amazed by the way He unfolds His perfect plan! Praise God!
Have you watched Chuck Missler, he explains pre trib and how the Bible supports this. Why would Jesus put his children through this? Tribulation is for the Jewish people.
Just a suggestion to those who dispute the rapture,go listen to Roger Price vids called ,,Will the church go through the tribulation,, and Daniels 70wks ,and The Rapture,, he uses hebrew ,greek and he also uses the fores and againsts ,if you are truly seeking the truth of Gods word then go have a listen with bible in hand,or are you just here to argue
Another video...another heresy. Dude! Read Revelation and find the 4-5 times it tells us that no Christians will survive the Tribulation and the antichrist. Therefore there will be no Christians there to welcome the return of the Lord. There will be nobody who is "alive and remains". That scripture you show must therefore mean something else...like a pre-trib rapture .
WHO IS GOD? See to it that no one misleads you.
Perhaps the greatest crime ever conceived of by the identity thief:
From the encyclopedia Americana, 1945 Edition:
"GOD (god, gawd): Common Teutonic word for personal object of religious worship, formerly applicable to super-human beings of heathen myth; on conversion of Teutonic races to Christianity, the term was applied to Supreme Being."
Read YashaYahu (Is.) 42:8, and another 6,822 times Yahuah told us His Name in an interlinear Hebrew - English translation.
The Prefaces of most translations admit removing the true Name and inserting the "device:" LORD. This is the English word used for the definition of the Hebrew word BAAL (H1167).
Read your Preface to verify what they have done to deceive the whole world. #GOD
Actually the doctrine of the Rapture goes back to 200=300AD. Real Bible Believers channel has some incredibly in depth study of the matter.
We must be born again!
Then Jesus has baptized you with the Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit do not let you sin anymore!!!
To become born again you have to repent and ask Jesus forgiveness for your sins or ask Jesus in your heart!
A really born again Christian has no future sins!! He is perfect, righteous and the light of the world
Amen brother!
Nonsense. One can most certainly sin after the receiving of the Holy Ghost.
@@Nonexistent10
That’s a big lie. You don’t have the love of God when you still sin
@@Nonexistent10people will sin but there's a difference right between the righteous and the unrighteous both sin
The difference is this the righteous seeks forgiveness confession etc
The unrighteous do not reorient or ask for forgiveness:)
God bless :) 🙏
We will ALWAYS sin...read 1 John. Repent is a change of mind = from unbelief in Christ to believing the Gospel, not sin!
Reasoning from the scriptures:
A pre tribulation ESCAPE in the natural body is utterly scriptural.
Luke17:28-32
Matthew 24 :15-21
Revelation chapter twelve Eagles Wings
Ezekiel 34:11-16
Ezekiel 20: 33-35
Psalm 124 the bird.....Eagles Wings
Isaiah 35
The people who insist that the church will go through the tribulation do understand who and what the church is as the body and bride of Christ neither do they understand the purpose of Daniels 70th week(the time of Jacobs trouble). 1 these. Tells us that we(the church) have been delivered from the wrath to come.Also, if there are going to be several hundred million Christians on the earth during this time why the 144,000?
I don't believe all you Rapture-people are going to be MIA leaving the Hebrew (Rev 7) people to stand against the anichrist.
The Bible does not say that we are transformed into "spiritual" bodies. It says "incorruptible" bodies. In other words, we will always be physical, but it will flourish to perfection as God intended when Christ returns.
we are not appointed to wrath .
Exactly
Unfortunately much of what he’s saying is innacurate. To say this wasn’t preached till the 1800’s is false. The rapture was THE eschatological belief of the early church. The original evidence for this is located in Thessalonians where the believers thought they had been left behind. The major problem of this belief is there is no place to put the marriage supper of the Lamb or the Bema Seat. Secondly without going into long details there are 5 distinct differences between the passages that describe His return. The simplest one is right here in his talk. Jesus comes, we meet Him in the air and clearly He doesn’t set His feet in the ground. He is taking these passages and merging them and making them fit a belief instead of objectively allowing scripture to explain scripture (which he says he’s doing here but isn’t). So he teaches that we go up to meet Christ and then do a “loopy loop” and come right back down with Him. This makes no sense scripturally. There is no other interpretation outside of a pre-wrath rapture of the Church. I would compare this talk with teachings by Churkc Kidsler, John Barnett or John MacArthur. A comparison of these will make this too clear.
Do not generalize because you are going to fool yourselves , if you generalized
John 3:16-21 (ESV)
For God So Loved the World
16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. 18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.
19 And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil.
20 For everyone who does wicked things hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his works should be exposed.
21 But whoever does what is true comes to the light, so that it may be clearly seen that his works have been carried out in God.”
Contrary to popular perception , John 3:16 is not a general statement which apply to all the people of the world as a whole , rather , this declaration is dedicated only and exclusively to the chosen man of God , he being the recipient of the word...did all the people of the world receive the "only begotten sonship of God"?...If so , then every person you meet in the world is the Christ...if all the people of the world were the "christs" , then the doctrine of believing in a Christ and being saved by that Christ is nullified because everyone is already the "Christ" , if that declaration in John 3:16 is applied to all of us , then that means , we are all the messiahs or the Christs-who are we going to save then , if there were no believers left because all of us were the christs...therefore , beware of reading the texts and giving them a generalized meaning and application...you are going to distort the whole truth if you do that...
Now , Genesis 1:26 like John 3:16 should not be generalized-it refers only to the Christ for Christ was the only begotten created in the image and likeness of God...there is but one Christ and every man is a believer...the believer must believe in the "image and likeness of God" which is Christ...if one say that he also was created in the image and likeness of God , then he is declaring that he too was the Christ or the messiah...if Genesis 1:26 can be applied to all people of the world , then everybody is the savior and lord messiah , which is a distortion of the truth...what would happen to the whole world , if all of us are christs or the messiahs?...
There's NO Problem believing in Pre Trib, Mid or Post Rapture. Its not a Major Theological issue concernin Salvation!! Just have Faith in God thru Jesus and be sealed by the Holy Spirit.🎉
You speak truth
Proof of A Pre trib Rapture. Pay Attention to the Cloud and Clouds Jesus appears In and With. Acts chapter 1 verses 9 10 11 Cloud. In Red Luke chapter 21 verses 27 and 28 Jesus is coming In A Cloud the Rapture. In Revelation chapter 1 verse 7 Jesus is coming With the Clouds when he comes back to the Mt of Olive the second coming KJV.
Iger am a Catholic, and do not believe in the rapture. For me, it is like a fairy tale. We shall have to pass through tribulation, unless we die first, so our faith shall be put to test. If teh rapture occurred, Christ would come three times not two. Besides this thing has been discussed it was about to occur eleven years ago, and nothing happened. So, I no do nof believe in that.
As an Orthodox Christian, I am in the same boat as you on this on. If the rapture was real one or more of the fathers would have mentioned it clearly and unambiguously. There were enough end-time heresies in the first millennium that if it was true some father or synod would have used it to squash a heresy.
I've been saying for some time that liberal theology, the feel good theology so popular today, and the pre-Trip Rapture teachings, were all going to resort in the falling away prophesied in the New Testament. Nothing would be more discouraging to a young believer than to watch the world fall apart in front of their eyes, when they were taught they wouldn't see it, and then the persecution which followed.
Pre-Tribbers also gloss over a lot how believers have been persecuted - to death - for two thousand years. Why were they allowed to be slain if we're too precious to go through such terrible tribulations? Jesus promised us persecution. The apostles considered it an honor to suffer persecution, and taught that we must all be ready for it, since to belong to God is to become an enemy of the world.
We need to be prayed up and prepared for whatever the Lord has for us to go through in these Last Days.
The problem with that line of thinking is that you need to revive Billy Graham from the dead, because he saved thousands of souls, but he didn't live long enough to go through the persecution of the saints. So I'm not sure if he is in heaven right now. Maybe he could get a second chance somehow.
@@seanc2788 Sorry, that makes no sense.
Salvation is as simple as it gets. You accept Jesus as your Savior, and you go to Heaven. Persecution is something that happens in this world because the Devil and the world hate God, and because we belong to Him, they hate us too.
@@stryker1999 But your own words just proved the point. "Pre-Tribbers also gloss over a lot how believers have been persecuted - to death - for two thousand years. Why were they allowed to be slain if we're too precious to go through such terrible tribulations? Jesus promised us persecution. "
Billy Graham didn't suffer persecution. He lived a pretty straightforward life in America and never once saw what the early church had to go through. So does God work in different dispensations? Clearly Christians have lived in America for hundreds of years and have never suffered anything close to what those in China, Iran, Egypt, Russia, pick a country. So why does God allow for several hundred years of people living and dying naturally in America? And what changes for the "Tribulation" that makes it any different? Are you saying there is going to be a different dispensation for the 7 year Tribulation? All of a sudden people are going to start being persecuted again like the early church? Why would God reverse course from what he has allowed for the past hundreds of years? NO logic.
@@seanc2788 Dude, people are being persecuted TODAY like the early Church, even being beheaded like they were, and HAVE been for many, many years. Just because we Americans live in a society that kind of frowns on "most" barbarism, unless it's the left and some ethnic groups doing it, has nothing to do with how people have to try to live on the rest of the planet. MOST of the planet. This isn't rocket science, for pete's sake...
@@seanc2788 Billy Graham did not save a single soul. Only the LORD can save. Only the Holy Spirit draws one to the Lord. Humans are used by God to bring the truth to people, but they cannot save.
Also, Billy Graham was a Universalist. He was very pro RCC, and Robert Schuller adored him for his "Inclusiveness that he brought to the family of God." Inclusiveness? Billy Graham said that there are people who are in the family of God that do not even believe in God.
So, is he in Heaven today? I wouldn't want to assume that he is.
Also, your entire comment is a non sequitur.
The Rapture is real and true, and it's NOT about Zechariah 14:4-5 at all.
I don't use ANY of the FAMOUS references that people use for both proving or refuting the rapture. That's too easy, and it becomes a circular argument and nothing gets accomplished on proving or disproving, and everyone walks away minds not changed. Therefore, I like to go OUTSIDE of the famous proof texts.
I don't know if many realize this, but the 6th Seal of Revelation 6 is something that is of extreme importance in the timeline that can be verified by the Olivette Discource, as well as Acts 2 Pentecost, in which both the discourse, and Peter in Acts 2 references side by side events of Revelation chapter 7.
Many don't even know what the 6th Seal even is, but once they do, then go back to the Discourse, and Acts 2. Then you can prove from that alone that the believers are NOT here for the 7th Seal.
Jesus does not mention one word about any event in the 7th Seal. But he does mention the 6th Seal...and WHAT AFTER THAT? Rapture (Last half of Revelation 7).
Now, regarding Peter. He references Joel, who discusses the 6th Seal. BUT WHY?
He's putting a context as to why the Jews who just got the Holy Spirit were speaking in tongues.
He's telling them that THIS WILL HAPPEN AGAIN, when the 144000 gets SEALED with the Holy Spirit.
There is no other reason that Peter would bring in Joel, other than to put a TIMELINE of back to back events from Revelation 6 of the 6th Seal to the 144000.
And from the 6th Seal from the Discourse, it's EASY to prove a RAPTURE just by the back to back events of the 6th Seal that can be verified by the discourse, and Peter at Pentecost in Acts 2. with the 6th Seal of Revelation 6, continuing through all of Revelation 7.
Put the timeline together with those. I don't see anyone at all anywhere connecting the dots like that to put a timeline together, and put this to bed once and for all time.
Matthew 24
Sixth Seal:
Matthew 24:29
Rapture:
Matthew 24:30-31
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Mark 13
Sixth Seal:
Mark 13:24-25
Rapture:
Mark 13:26-27
26 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.
27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.
Luke 21
Sixth Seal:
Luke 21:25-26
Rapture:
Luke 21:27
27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
Now, that’s the END of the story in all of the end times chapters of the gospel. And Jesus did not mention one word about the 7th Seal. I challenge anyone to prove me wrong.
Where did Jesus mention the 7th Seal events? He didn't.
But from all of those references about the rapture that I mentioned, what does Revelation chapter 7 say about that?
13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
15 Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them.
The VERY NEXT CHAPTER begins the 7th Seal, and we are NOT HERE FOR IT, because we are at THE THRONE OF GOD.
Use that 6th Seal as a connect the dots! Rapture is true.
16 They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat.
17 For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.
Jesus does not come back until...
Revelation 19:14
And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
Revelation 19:19
And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.
Zechariah 14:4-5
4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.
5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.
Now, there is a LONG distance between Revelation chapter 7 and chapter 19...dontcha think?
And...how can we COME BACK with him, if we weren't first taken TO him in a rapture first?
Rapture in the clouds comes before return of Christ on land. It's hard to fathom the complete resistance in believing in a rapture. What's up with that?
You don't even know what the 6th seal is. Amazing.
@@seanc2788 You don't even know how to read. Amazing. I gave several references to it, from Joel, to Peter, to Jesus (Matthew, Mark, Luke), as well as John in Revelation 6. It's the most mentioned seal of all, mentioned by a lot of people.
@@chapmaned24 So tell me what makes the "heavens roll like a scroll?" And what causes every mountain and island to be removed from its place?
@@seanc2788 1/2
Job 9:8
Which alone spreadeth out the heavens, and treadeth upon the waves of the sea.
Isaiah 40:22
It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:
Isaiah 42:5
Thus saith God the Lord, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:
Psalm 104:2
Who coverest thyself with light as with a garment: who stretchest out the heavens like a curtain:
Isaiah 42:5
Thus saith God the Lord, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:
Isaiah 45:12
I have made the earth, and created man upon it: I, even my hands, have stretched out the heavens, and all their host have I commanded.
Isaiah 51:13
And forgettest the Lord thy maker, that hath stretched forth the heavens,
There are many more references to stretched and spreads...
SCIENCE agrees that the universe is EXPANDING...next...
@@seanc2788 2/2
Isaiah 34:4
And all the host of heaven shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll: and all their host shall fall down, as the leaf falleth off from the vine, and as a falling fig from the fig tree.
Revelation 6:14
And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
SCIENCE believes that at some point, the universe will STOP expanding, and may IMPLODE.
It is known as THE BIG CRUNCH. Chaos will be happening in the universe if that happens. Isaiah 34:4 tells us about it.
So Jesus Christ abandons His Bribe to be beheaded???
I remember in 2nd opinions 2 when ID10T did that to his bride as written in the word of man.
First of all, the Bride is NOT the church. The Bride is Israel (a good read can be found here: bereanbiblesociety.org/the-bride-of-christ/). The Church is already in Christ, which is arguably a better position (Romans 12:5; 1 Corinthians 12" 12-13 & 27 to name a few places where this is noted) . There are numerous examples throughout Scripture of Israel, the prophets, and the Apostles going through tribulation in some way, shape, or form. Moses, Abraham, David, Daniel, to name a few in the Old Testament. The Apostles in the New Testament. Some of them gave their lives up for the sake of the Gospel. In Revelation 13 verse 10, we have this passage:
“If anyone is to go into captivity, into captivity they will go. If anyone is to be killed with the sword, with the sword they will be killed.” This calls for patient endurance and faithfulness on the part of God’s people."
We also have many other passages describing the patience of the Saints in tribulation. Revelation 14:12 among many other passages:
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
In closing, I would like to add that we as Christians are called to reason from the Scriptures (as is the example of the Apostle Paul in Acts 17:2).
I welcome a sound response with Scriptural evidence in order for us to discuss God's Word in love, patience, and understanding as fellow Christians should.
In this video and in my response I have provided Scripture to support this understanding of God's Word. I see you chose insulting language and not one single Biblical passage to support your view. Both of these approaches are unbecoming of a Christian.
Sorry there is a Rapture of the Church Daniel 21.1 and so your wrong but not one person or minister points to it. Because they don't have the HOLY SPIRIT GUIDANCE and so your telling me you don't have it. As I don't want to be misled by someone who is Deceived.
MPK.
Michael: you reference Daniel 21:1, but the book of Daniel only has 12 chapters. Then you go on to say we are misleading when you cite a chapter that does not exist. If this was an error, please clarify. We are interested in reasoning from the Scriptures with fellow Christians (Acts 17:2).
What are we to pray and watch to escape from??
Hi, Wesley - there are a number of examples in Scripture where God encourages believers to pray to keep them from a particularly trying moment, but that does not mean they are removed from a situation. For example, Matthew 26:41 the Lord tells the disciples to pray that they are kept from temptation. He also prays for Peter to be strengthen during the specific attacks by Satan noted in Luke 22: 31-32. Additionally, there is an ends times prayer our Lord implores, where He states, "pray that your flight not take place in the winter, For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be (Matthew 24: 20-21).
The Our Father is a prayer for deliverance from the Evil one and to be kept from temptation.
In all of these instances, you see believers going through a testing or trial or hardship and praying to God for strength.
This is also true for prayers during the time of Revelation.
@@TruthisCalling ,, Aaaah, you've not answered my question😀. Anyways, thanks much 👍
@@wesleyouma6064 God Bless, keep fighting the good fight.
Asante,,, 🙂😌
The comment above is good. We are commanded to be watchmen(women) what are we watching for - Scripture to be full filled and it is our duty not only to see 'God's Divine Plan activated among us but a watch person also has to warn others - watch and warn. A comment above concerned the slaughter of Christians worldwide that is happening as we speak - Scripture being full filled the 5th Seal - 'Christ's 1st warning in Matt 24, Mark 13, Luke 21 on the events of the end of days, Revelation,. 'Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in My Name saying I am 'Christ' and shall deceive many. Who are they spiritual leaders claiming to represent 'Christ', His Word. And the consequence? What we have been talking about rapture and no rapture - these are the rapture leaders claiming this is 'God's Word whereby half of the Christian world are lead astray by these spiritual impostors.
You should be leary of a title that purports 'The Rapture" is dangerous. How? And that it is deceptive? How?
There is nothing wrong with believing in the blessed hope. If you wan't to enter the tribulation ... go ahead.
Jesus will send Hes Angels to gather the elect we are not floating up to meet the Lord in the air we will be caught up by the Angels
People believe in the Rapture and provide scripture, people don’t believe in thenRapture and provide scripture.
Me personally I remember a scripture saying we will be caught up in the clouds in The New Testament (HOLY BIBLE KJV).
It doesn't get any clearer than Matthew 13:49 in the KJV. This completely and instantly destroys all this rapture doctrine. Ok, so what are we having for lunch? 🤷 😅
While the pre-trib rapture is a false doctrine, to then extend that into there is no such thing as the rapture is also false.
There will be a rapture. It will occur at some point during the 2nd half of the 70th week of Daniel, when the time of great tribulation is cut short for the sake of the elect. The same day that this occurs will be the start of the Day of the Lord, when God pours out His wrath on a wicked and unrepentant world.
We do not know how long this will last as we are given the duration of only the 5th trumpet. Aside from that, we know it must be accomplished by the end of the 70th week.
Matt 24:31 and Rev 7:9-17 are both the rapture. Rev 8:1, the 7th seal is broken and God's wrath can now be poured out.
The word rapture as you know is not in the Bible, I know harpazo. How about we call it "our gathering together unto him"? 2Thessalonians2:1. Many will be deceived when the son of perdition, anti(Greek=instead of)Christ/satan sitteth in the temple of God looking like our perception of & saying that he is God/Jesus. Greatest spiritual deception of all time. Pretribbers think they're going to be gone before this takes place. A very sad state of affairs.
Revelation 14.14 is the rapture then the wrath of God comes down. We are clearly here for the tribulation. I personally think the seals have started to open
That means we have less than 6 years!!!!! Yikes.
@@bob-pr8ye good this world is in sore need of correction SORE NEED!
That's not what Revelation 3:10 states.
@@Jammaster1972 one question about Revelation 3:10, is the church of Philadelphia still here ? That scripture is speaking of the apostasy that began in AD250
@@Nonexistent10 No, you're wrong. The apostasy was present from the beginning. Why do you think most of the NT was written? ---to address the heresies and apostasies. However, Paul speaks of an end times Apostasy that occurs prior to the Rapture and before the day of Christ (aka His 2nd Coming). See 2 Thess 2:1-3.
Charles Russell.
Joseph Smith.
John Nelson Darby.
John Calvin.
If you're following the deviations of any of the above you're following cultic doctrines. The former may be more deviant than the latter, but all are cultic nonetheless.
Yes!!!! This makes sense
The Rapture doctrine was started by the God/man called Jesus Christ...see John 14:1-3
Why are you saying taking a verse and blowing it out of proportion it's like reading about under his wings you shall seek refuge does God have wings like big bird no ! So understanding what scripture says and understanding it's context it's important so you ref John 14 but are you min interrupting it's understanding !
God bless
1) "Many mansions" is a terrible translation. Many rooms, apartments, or dwellings is a better translation
2) The only way you can see this as a rapture promise is by adding things not in evidence, and by making assumptions that are not in the text.
a) Assumption 1: "My Father's House" means Heaven. Not so. EVERY SINGLE TIME the term is used in the Bible, it refers to the Temple. Temple means House of a God. This is further proven by the fact that John saw the New Jerusalem (with a Temple that is described in the OT) coming DOWN from Heaven. The Temple in Jerusalem had apartments for the ones who labored there.
b) Assumption 2: "I will come again and receive you" means I will take you away, rather than I will come to be with you. It doesn't say He comes to take us away. He comes to be here with us.
c) Assumption 3: Saved people live in Heaven. Nowhere does the Bible say that. It says that the souls of the dead in Christ rest there until the resurrection.
d) Assumption 4: That this verse says anything about the TIMING of the rapture. It does not.
e) Jesus will be in Heaven, so we will too. God said that he will tabernacle with man. He said that the son of David would rule forever. FROM Jerusalem.
What about keeping his holy days
We should follow His commandments.
@@Nonexistent10 keeping His Holy Days is a commandment
We are not Jews!
A day of the 'Spirit', the Hebrew tradition declares our spirit becomes refreshed in 'God' on Holy Days - a time dedicated to communion with our 'Father'. And 'God's Command, keep holy the Sabbath, Exodus 20.
It's real simple, as you mentioned in Thess, it clearly states the dead in Christ rise first, THEN we who are alive and remain will be caught up. So we know from just that one verse that the rapture is AFTER the resurrection.
Fortunately in Rev 20:4-5 it plainly states the FIRST resurrection includes those who were beheaded, those who didn't worship the beast or accept his mark.
So if the FIRST resurrection includes those who were killed in the great tribulation for not worshipping the beast, then it's impossible for the rapture to take place before the tribulation.
People claim there are just as many verses that support the pre-trib as the post-trib, but although there are SOME verses that COULD be used to support the idea of the pre-trib, none actually state it. You can't take an interpreted or extrapolated meaning of a scripture and use it to override a plainly stated text, or you make the Bible contradict itself.
ALL pre-trib rapture verses require reading hidden meaning into the text, or taking the promise to one specific church from 2000 years ago and applying it to yourself as an individual today. Notably NOT taking the word to the 6 other churches and applying them to you.
Meanwhile these two passages alone spell out the order. Then there are numerous passages that all confirm it, like the PROMISE we WILL have Tribulation. Or that he who endures to the end will be saved. Or AFTER all these things, THEN the Lord comes etc.
But the pre-tribbers like to claim there are now TWO second comings of Jesus, one secret and silent before the trib and then another AFTER the Trib. First, that's made up completely out of thin air. Second, both Thess and Corinthians plainly state it's with a shout and a trumpet that Jesus returns and we are caught up. So hardly secret or silent.
2 Timothy Chapter 4
3For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
4And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
Rapture deception huh don't you know this prophecy here in 2 Timothy chapter 4 came to pass years ago and you call the catching away a doctrine of the Scriptures a lie. Do yourself a favor and repent of as well as stop listening to the lies of that wicked tempter who tempted the Son of God years before.
Bible says earth is flat. It's simply not a credible document. New Testament says the devil took Jesus to a high mountain to view "all the kingdoms of the world" Only possible on a flat earth.
Only way out of this corner is to claim the passage is metaphorical. But it's not marked as a metaphor. But if you arbitrarily claim this or that passage is metaphorical than ANY passage can be interpreted as metaphorical.
The 70th week od Daniel is for ISRAEL not the church
The Great Falling Away began in the first century. Gnosticism and pagan idols that all mixed in with Christianity. It is ongoing not future.
Pre Rapture is False Doctrine . If you believe in this Curse then you do not believe in God. If you Preach it you will be held accountable for leading God's Children away.. the Small g god of this world is responsible for this Lie. Thank you to Channels like this one for speaking the Truth .. .. .
You are correct in your doctrine. Keep preaching and teaching.
They Lied to You About The Pre-Trib Rapture - Lee Brainard ua-cam.com/video/r5r374e659I/v-deo.htmlsi=EubtpoICYfBYnvKl
What you are saying not true or Biblical. it was taught before Darby and widely held in the young church. The tribulation is for Christ rejecting Israel and anyone else that wont take the free gift of salvation. Revelation 3:10 Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come on the whole world to test the inhabitants of the earth. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. God bless you and i hope you study closer to the real truth than can only be by way of our Savior Jesus!
The rapture has always seemed to me as a cop-out! An easy way out of the tribulation period! Here's your exemption card, you don't have to face the tribulation period! A benevolent God will take some people and leave the rest to suffer! It's like they're the Chosen One's! They're going to be Pre-Judged by Jesus before the 2nd coming? It doesn't make sense!
Research the Jewish wedding customs in Jesus’ day and you will understand the rapture, where the bridegroom comes for his bride.
I will take a look at this. However, there are other Scriptures that discuss the return of the Lord and when taken together tell us unequivocally that the Lord returns after the tribulation.
Then how can anyone explain the millions of people including 1.5 year old's having rapture visions and dreams? Some waking up sobbing. Others waking up excited to tell their mothers. I am so confused. I am listening to the millions having these dreams. How do you explain all of this? Many saying he is coming soon, etc.
Do you think only God gives visions?
I believe in the rapture. I too have had dreams.
Who is asking the important question, who are slewping in Christ ?
Everyone reads n thinks literally, yet thw literal is of the finite, the body, the flesh.. not of the spirit.
False Christians abound. No one wants to afmit thay but it id a reality. Thus the dead in Christ arw those who have actually died n been renorn, those remaining, still alive, arw those who never actually dien n got reborn, but will eventualky be caught up with Christ at the end if they do indeed endure to the end.
The saints are the jews in Israel... who will be encompassed.
Stop beong so sure of yourselves. Repent, get reborn, and then you will see nothing but false Christians from wall to wall... and th4n you will understamdvwhat the phrase "sleeping in Christ" means. Amen.
when you all have it all figured out "for sure" let me know, LOL
Read Rev. 7:13
Daniel 7:21
Rev. 13:7
Rev. 20:4
You do error: Christ is not talking to “Christians “ but rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. Christ sends Paul to teach Christians the mystery of the gospel of grace. This is why you are in error.
His disciples: Mat 10:6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Jesus himself: Mat 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
This is the reason: Mat 23:37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
Mat 23:38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.
Mat 23:39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.
Jer 30:6 Ask ye now, and see whether a man doth travail with child? wherefore do I see every man with his hands on his loins, as a woman in travail, and all faces are turned into paleness?
Jer 30:7 Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble; but he shall be saved out of it.
(Not Christians) this is the mystery Paul reveals. Behold I show you a MYSTERY.
Luk 20:17 And he beheld them, and said, What is this then that is written, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner?
Luk 20:18 Whosoever shall fall upon that stone shall be broken; but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder.
Shall we crucify your king?
We have no king but Caesar!
That’s why.
Not everything in the Bible applies directly to us! The Old Testament concerned only the people that God called out of the nations that became his chosen, Israel. Likewise almost 100% of the so-called, New Testament (or New Covenant which never came about btw) is about God’s relationship with Israel (not us)! You might know that God married Israel when she was born in the Red Sea but she was unfaithful with pagan gods so he divorced her in Hosea. He sent his Son to Israel to propose a remarriage and that’s what’s going on in the gospel ministry of Jesus, and it was ONLY to the lost sheep of the house of Israel (Matthew 15:24 KJV)! He barely spoke with Gentiles at all - they were unclean dogs! So stop thinking he’s talking to you in the four gospels!
After he ascended, the apostles were sent out to continue proposing remarriage with God to ISRAEL - not YOU, so nothing in Acts - or in any of the epistles written during Acts - applies to anyone living today! So STOP thinking they do! Yes, there were Gentiles in the Acts churches (the Greeks) but they were part of Israel’s Old Testament prophecy (Deuteronomy 32:21 KJV) and God used them to try to make his ex-wife Israel jealous! Romans 11:11 KJV! This is important so listen up! None of us living today would have been ALLOWED into any of the churches in Acts (and probably even after Acts) because again we would have been considered filthy unclean dogs! The Jews in all of the Acts churches and after were still obeying the Law of Moses even though they knew they were saved by God's grace. The Law was their very identity so they' would have felt lost without it! The Greeks were given ordinances to obey by the Jerusalem Council to make them just kosher enough to study with Jews in the synagogues where Paul held his churches! There’s no Jerusalem Council today, no Greeks like those were, no ordinances, the Greeks were warned they could be cut off (Romans 11:22 KJV) if they did not “abide” (while WE pagans saved later have ETERNAL SECURITY (Ephesians 4:30 KJV) so WHY would you want to be them? 🤔. Stop applying things God said to OTHER PEOPLE to yourself! It’s insulting to him and what he has given us!
Jesus broke his promise to return before his followers in Israel DIED, remember? Matthew 16:28 KJV! He wouldn’t break a promise that important for NO GOOD REASON!
It’s time for intelligent believers to realize that Israel, because she kept saying NO to God’s offer of the Marriage Supper of the Lamb, received a final notice of PERMANENT DIVORCE in Acts 28:28-31 KJV…” Acts” - AX, get it? And just like that, everything changed. You didn’t notice?
Savages called the Scythians suddenly heard about Jesus and got saved even though lawless pagans were never allowed to be saved before! They didn’t know an “ordinance” or a law from a hole in the ground and no one was ordering them to obey any! And even weirder, at that moment in time, God had Paul announce that from then on, God would see EVERYONE as the SAME! Colossians 3:11 KJV
Why doesn’t anyone notice that? It doesn’t matter at all that some people are saying that they’re Israel, because God doesn’t see them as that! Eternal life is now being offered to everybody on a perfectly equal basis in the free gift of Ephesians 2:8&9 KJV! We’re not living in a parentheses in Daniel 9; all of those prophecies were canceled by the divorce in Acts 28:28-31 because God is done with his stuck-up ex-wife forever!!! How do I know? Because there’s new end time prophecy (according to the mystery of Ephesians 3:9) that has a new second coming called the appearing, Colossians 3:4 KJV; and a new kingdom called by Jesus’s name - not Israel’s- in Colossians 1:13, the last book of the Bible to be written, Col 1:24-25 KJV, so it supersedes all that has gone before! Ephesians is the second to last book written and it says in Eph 2:15 that we and the saints of time past are “the one new man” that will live in Christ’s kingdom! Does that sound like anyone will be raptured to heaven? We sleep in the grave until Jesus calls us forth! Humans were not created to dwell in heaven! God created the earth as a place where HE could dwell with us! People are so mixed up about the Scriptures that it’s SAD!
Don’t let all that nonsense being said and done by FAKE Jews over in FAKE Israel deceive you! Satan is using them to deceive you and it’s only going to get worse! And don't be conned by the phony rapture theory because as I proved above, the scriptures they use to prop it up are ones that not only about the actual second coming to earth of Jesus, but they did not apply to us at all as at that time Gentiles like us were not able to be saved anyway. And now the second coming to Israel is canceled, and a new appearing has taken its place!
Looking for that blessed hope, the appearing of our Lord and Saviour, Jesus Christ! 🤗
Only one Gospel:
The Gospel of Reconciliation.
Jesus Christ came into THEIR kingdom
to reconcile fallen angels unto Himself.
We are the fallen angels kept in DNA chains of darkness.
If you do not confess being a fallen angel in Lucifer's kingdom, then you are an unbeliever.
Unbeliever = those that claim to be made in the image of God.
@@qwerty-so6ml You have my deepest sympathy.