For more information see the following: Archetypes: ua-cam.com/video/8lxEVwG23R4/v-deo.html Magic 1 - Traditions and Schools: ua-cam.com/video/Iwxe4iYqpno/v-deo.html Magic 2 - Prepared vs. Spontaneous: ua-cam.com/video/lWcQ1z4PYK0/v-deo.html Magic 6 - Casting and Spell Attacks: ua-cam.com/video/AZsnTKZTVos/v-deo.html Magic Examples - Spell Attacks and DCs: ua-cam.com/video/84ctyubhluA/v-deo.html
There you go again, Dave, taking something that seems 😊complicated and making it relatively easy to understand. Thank you again for a great explanation with clear examples.
I'd love a series on commonly misread or problematic spells. Your reminder about Heal and Harm not adding the +8 for damage was very important to the Blood Lords campaign I'm running 😅 I'm sure there are some other problem children in the spell lists, especially given the design philosophy of having some general rules kept under traits, rather than repeated in every spell.
What about feats that interact with spell slots, without mentioning specifically [class] spell slots? For example, if a Witch with a Primal Sorcerer dedication gets the Primal Evolution sorcerer feat at level 8, it mentions that you gain an additional spell slot of your highest level to use for Summon Animal or Summon Plant or Fungus. It counts the highest level spell the Witch can cast? Or about a feature that doesn’t seem restricted to [class] spell slot too, like the Wizard’s Drain Bonded Item: it mentions that you gain the ability to cast one spell that you prepared and already cast, without spending a spell slot. So a Wizard could use this action to cast a spell gained from a Cleric dedication, if they prepared it and already cast it?
Sorry for the long comment! What about classes that can substitute spell components? Example: Magus with Wizard Multiclass Archetype What about spellcasting in combat where "handedness" matters? This is most applicable to Inorexable Iron Magus and maybe Sparkling Targe Magus with Weapon and Shield. - As an aside, Laughing Shadow will usually have a free hand, Starlit Span has a free hand before needing to fire the bow, and Twisting Tree can change hands as a free action if this becomes a problem. > Both classes have "Arcane Spellcasting" in their class feature. > Only Magus has the text that states they can draw sigils to replace material components using their weapon without needing a material component pouch. > Wizard has no such replacement (of course). My opinion is since both list "Arcane Spellcasting" as their class feature, the Magus' ability can apply to the spells cast from Wizard as well. What is your take on this? Thanks!
Would multiple sources of Alchemical Reagents work similarly? As in keeping seperate lists & pools. Or would it be a single pool once & only a few (4) extra formulae?
I have a Question If the druid takes "Fey Caller" to get illusory spells from the arcane list to it's primal list, can the sorcerer multiclass then learn these spells?
So does the mean a flame mystery oracle with an elemental sorcerer dedication would mesh well? Also how does blood magic work in the aforementioned case?
I actually have a couple questions I was hoping to get answers for that sadly weren't addressed in this video. They more so have to do with multiclassing two prepared classes, specifically when one has to learn spells. For example if there was a witch who was using the primal spell list and took the druid multiclass, would the witch technically then be able to use any and all primal spells with her witch spell slots as well since she technically now knows them all? If not, would she be able to spend the time teaching herself the druid spell as a witch? Similarly, would a Magus with the wizard archetype be able to cast spells he learned as a Magus with his wizard spell slots since they are both arcane and both in a spellbook.
No, the Witch side of her would not automatically gain access to all of the spells available to the druid side of her. Whether she could teach herself would be a GM call... personally, I wouldn't have much of a problem with that as long as appropriate downtime was invested. I believe the Magus/Wizard would be using the same spellbook and both sides would be able to prepare spells from it. I don't believe they would need to carry two separate spellbooks. In a somewhat similar vein, an Occult Sorcerer/Bard would still need to keep their spells separate, even though they're casting from the same spell list with the same proficiency level and the same ability modifier because they would need to maintain two repertoires -- one for Sorcerer and one for Bard, and would not be able to spend spell slots from one to cast spells from the other. You didn't ask that, but the scenario just popped into my head. :)
@@HowItsPlayed I didn't ask about the sorcerer bars scenario as they are both spontaneous so keeping the two repertoires separate makes a lot of sense. It's just the prepared ones that seem a bit odd to me, when one has access to the full spell list whenever and the other one does not, it seems weird having to teach yourself the spell lol.
@@kidthegeek The thing about the Witch/Druid scenario is the source of the spells. For the Witch, the spells are stored in their Familiar granted by their patron, while the Druid gains their spells by communing with nature every morning. Now, that said, if a player asked me if they could add a spell to their Familiar using their Druidic magic, I'd side with How It's Played here and let the player do that with the appropriate downtime activity. Basically instead of feeding the spell to your Familiar in a special ritual, you're channeling the energy and knowledge from yourself into the Familiar.
The Learn a Spell activity would allow you to teach your witch familiar the spell, using your Druid knowledge as the source. You'd still have to "write it down" like a witch normally would.
@@HowItsPlayed if I make an alias on here I run the risk of having a Tropic Thunder meltdown, "I know who I am, I'm the dude playing the dude disguised as another dude." Anyways, the two competing theories are that a basic spellcasting feat is a type of feat, and taking it a second time wouldn't stack, or, a cleric basic spellcasting is different than a sorcerer basic spellcasting, and would stack. I think the latter there makes more sense but I have no idea anymore. Either way, I love you, thanks for responding!!
@@LegendaryCMD I guess I see their point... but I'm fairly certain that each class's basic spellcasting feat is its own thing. Basic Sorcerer Spellcasting is wholly separate from Basic Wizard Spellcasting. Even the wording feels that way to me... "Usually gained at 4th level, these feats grant a 1st-level spell slot." "These feats"... plural. If there was only one Basic Spellcasting Feat, I think it would be worded as "this feat grants". Big fan of yours too! Drop me a note if you ever hear an official answer on this one!
Forgive the naive question but I thought there was no multiclassing in Pathfinder 2nd edition? There were only archetypes that worked a little bit like the second classes. Is this a Homebrew or an optional rule? Is this a different use of the term multi-class? Is this an archetype that gives features of other classes?
There is an archetype for each class. These archetypes are called "multiclass archetype", because you can't take a multiclass archetype of a class you already have. I think the multiclass archetypes of spellcasting classes are the only way to gain a spellcasting class feature that you don't already have, but I might be wrong as there are a lot of archetypes and I haven't read all of them.
@@chrizzlybear5565 There are a few non-multiclass archetypes which grant spell casting if you don't already have it. Eldritch Archer is one that comes to mind.
my question related with this is about Magus with Wizard multiclass... Do you need to have 2 spellbook or you can get away of using 1 spell book for both?
You just need one spellbook. The magus class feature "spellbook" states: "If you have a spellbook from multiple sources (such as being a magus with the Wizard Dedication feat), you can use the same spellbook for all your spells."
excellent discussion. is there no exception to this rule of keeping it separate? how about an occult sorc multiclassed with a bard? both have cha as their spellcasting ability. both are spontaneous casters. both cast spells from the occult tradition.
I would still keep them separate because each of them will have their own spell repertoires, and you won't be able to spend spell slots from Sorcerer to cast spells in the Bard repertoire or vice-versa. There may even be cases where you'll want to have the same spell included in both repertoires.
@@HowItsPlayed Thanks. I'm not sure if you take video requests but if you do i'd be interested in a deeper dive on illusory creature and the summoned/sustain mechanics. questions i'd have would be: 1. can illusory creature use their 2 actions once created? 2. do they have the summoned trait? 3. if they don't, can you sustain the spell once they are created so they can attack or do you have to wait until the next round to have them attack?
If you are a Bard with Sorcerer multiclass in an occult bloodline, everything is the same except that you have 2 lists of Known spells for each spontaneous spell slot group?
For more information see the following:
Archetypes: ua-cam.com/video/8lxEVwG23R4/v-deo.html
Magic 1 - Traditions and Schools: ua-cam.com/video/Iwxe4iYqpno/v-deo.html
Magic 2 - Prepared vs. Spontaneous: ua-cam.com/video/lWcQ1z4PYK0/v-deo.html
Magic 6 - Casting and Spell Attacks: ua-cam.com/video/AZsnTKZTVos/v-deo.html
Magic Examples - Spell Attacks and DCs: ua-cam.com/video/84ctyubhluA/v-deo.html
Thank you for this. I've been having trouble wrapping my head around multiclass spellcasting.
Fantastic video. Didn't think if both are of the same tradition they share the mastery. Good to know.
There you go again, Dave, taking something that seems 😊complicated and making it relatively easy to understand. Thank you again for a great explanation with clear examples.
Awesome -- glad the video was helpful!
I'd love a series on commonly misread or problematic spells. Your reminder about Heal and Harm not adding the +8 for damage was very important to the Blood Lords campaign I'm running 😅
I'm sure there are some other problem children in the spell lists, especially given the design philosophy of having some general rules kept under traits, rather than repeated in every spell.
Great video, you could make a part 2 on how this interacts with Innate Spellcasting as well as those gained from magic items like Spellhearts
What about feats that interact with spell slots, without mentioning specifically [class] spell slots?
For example, if a Witch with a Primal Sorcerer dedication gets the Primal Evolution sorcerer feat at level 8, it mentions that you gain an additional spell slot of your highest level to use for Summon Animal or Summon Plant or Fungus. It counts the highest level spell the Witch can cast?
Or about a feature that doesn’t seem restricted to [class] spell slot too, like the Wizard’s Drain Bonded Item: it mentions that you gain the ability to cast one spell that you prepared and already cast, without spending a spell slot. So a Wizard could use this action to cast a spell gained from a Cleric dedication, if they prepared it and already cast it?
I think the exception would be Wizard with a Witch multiclass with arcane patron, as the wizard Book and Wich familiar are cross compatible
I was wondering how this one would work.
Sorry for the long comment!
What about classes that can substitute spell components?
Example: Magus with Wizard Multiclass Archetype
What about spellcasting in combat where "handedness" matters? This is most applicable to Inorexable Iron Magus and maybe Sparkling Targe Magus with Weapon and Shield.
- As an aside, Laughing Shadow will usually have a free hand, Starlit Span has a free hand before needing to fire the bow, and Twisting Tree can change hands as a free action if this becomes a problem.
> Both classes have "Arcane Spellcasting" in their class feature.
> Only Magus has the text that states they can draw sigils to replace material components using their weapon without needing a material component pouch.
> Wizard has no such replacement (of course).
My opinion is since both list "Arcane Spellcasting" as their class feature, the Magus' ability can apply to the spells cast from Wizard as well.
What is your take on this? Thanks!
Would multiple sources of Alchemical Reagents work similarly? As in keeping seperate lists & pools.
Or would it be a single pool once & only a few (4) extra formulae?
I have a Question
If the druid takes "Fey Caller" to get illusory spells from the arcane list to it's primal list, can the sorcerer multiclass then learn these spells?
So does the mean a flame mystery oracle with an elemental sorcerer dedication would mesh well? Also how does blood magic work in the aforementioned case?
I actually have a couple questions I was hoping to get answers for that sadly weren't addressed in this video.
They more so have to do with multiclassing two prepared classes, specifically when one has to learn spells.
For example if there was a witch who was using the primal spell list and took the druid multiclass, would the witch technically then be able to use any and all primal spells with her witch spell slots as well since she technically now knows them all? If not, would she be able to spend the time teaching herself the druid spell as a witch?
Similarly, would a Magus with the wizard archetype be able to cast spells he learned as a Magus with his wizard spell slots since they are both arcane and both in a spellbook.
No, the Witch side of her would not automatically gain access to all of the spells available to the druid side of her. Whether she could teach herself would be a GM call... personally, I wouldn't have much of a problem with that as long as appropriate downtime was invested.
I believe the Magus/Wizard would be using the same spellbook and both sides would be able to prepare spells from it. I don't believe they would need to carry two separate spellbooks.
In a somewhat similar vein, an Occult Sorcerer/Bard would still need to keep their spells separate, even though they're casting from the same spell list with the same proficiency level and the same ability modifier because they would need to maintain two repertoires -- one for Sorcerer and one for Bard, and would not be able to spend spell slots from one to cast spells from the other. You didn't ask that, but the scenario just popped into my head. :)
@@HowItsPlayed I didn't ask about the sorcerer bars scenario as they are both spontaneous so keeping the two repertoires separate makes a lot of sense. It's just the prepared ones that seem a bit odd to me, when one has access to the full spell list whenever and the other one does not, it seems weird having to teach yourself the spell lol.
@@kidthegeek The thing about the Witch/Druid scenario is the source of the spells. For the Witch, the spells are stored in their Familiar granted by their patron, while the Druid gains their spells by communing with nature every morning. Now, that said, if a player asked me if they could add a spell to their Familiar using their Druidic magic, I'd side with How It's Played here and let the player do that with the appropriate downtime activity. Basically instead of feeding the spell to your Familiar in a special ritual, you're channeling the energy and knowledge from yourself into the Familiar.
The Learn a Spell activity would allow you to teach your witch familiar the spell, using your Druid knowledge as the source. You'd still have to "write it down" like a witch normally would.
Hey Dave, can you take basic spellcasting from two different class archetypes?
I don't see why not... but since you're the one asking, I'm now worried I may be wrong... LOL
@@HowItsPlayed if I make an alias on here I run the risk of having a Tropic Thunder meltdown, "I know who I am, I'm the dude playing the dude disguised as another dude." Anyways, the two competing theories are that a basic spellcasting feat is a type of feat, and taking it a second time wouldn't stack, or, a cleric basic spellcasting is different than a sorcerer basic spellcasting, and would stack. I think the latter there makes more sense but I have no idea anymore. Either way, I love you, thanks for responding!!
@@LegendaryCMD I guess I see their point... but I'm fairly certain that each class's basic spellcasting feat is its own thing. Basic Sorcerer Spellcasting is wholly separate from Basic Wizard Spellcasting. Even the wording feels that way to me... "Usually gained at 4th level, these feats grant a 1st-level spell slot." "These feats"... plural. If there was only one Basic Spellcasting Feat, I think it would be worded as "this feat grants".
Big fan of yours too! Drop me a note if you ever hear an official answer on this one!
Forgive the naive question but I thought there was no multiclassing in Pathfinder 2nd edition? There were only archetypes that worked a little bit like the second classes. Is this a Homebrew or an optional rule? Is this a different use of the term multi-class? Is this an archetype that gives features of other classes?
There is an archetype for each class. These archetypes are called "multiclass archetype", because you can't take a multiclass archetype of a class you already have.
I think the multiclass archetypes of spellcasting classes are the only way to gain a spellcasting class feature that you don't already have, but I might be wrong as there are a lot of archetypes and I haven't read all of them.
@@chrizzlybear5565 There are a few non-multiclass archetypes which grant spell casting if you don't already have it. Eldritch Archer is one that comes to mind.
my question related with this is about Magus with Wizard multiclass... Do you need to have 2 spellbook or you can get away of using 1 spell book for both?
You just need one spellbook. The magus class feature "spellbook" states: "If you have a spellbook from multiple sources (such as being a magus with the Wizard Dedication feat), you can use the same spellbook for all your spells."
excellent discussion. is there no exception to this rule of keeping it separate? how about an occult sorc multiclassed with a bard? both have cha as their spellcasting ability. both are spontaneous casters. both cast spells from the occult tradition.
I would still keep them separate because each of them will have their own spell repertoires, and you won't be able to spend spell slots from Sorcerer to cast spells in the Bard repertoire or vice-versa. There may even be cases where you'll want to have the same spell included in both repertoires.
@@HowItsPlayed Thanks. I'm not sure if you take video requests but if you do i'd be interested in a deeper dive on illusory creature and the summoned/sustain mechanics. questions i'd have would be:
1. can illusory creature use their 2 actions once created?
2. do they have the summoned trait?
3. if they don't, can you sustain the spell once they are created so they can attack or do you have to wait until the next round to have them attack?
Has this change due the remaster?
If you are a Bard with Sorcerer multiclass in an occult bloodline, everything is the same except that you have 2 lists of Known spells for each spontaneous spell slot group?
Yes. But since you have occult. both spell will be expert at level 7 following the bard mastery progression.
Yes, 2 separate repertoires, 2 separate pools of slots, and 2 separate lists of signature spells.
I like to believe that how it works highly depends on how one rolls...