The most common joint in woodworking
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- Опубліковано 30 чер 2024
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I needed to cut some rabbets for a project I'm working on. So I figured I'd show you a few different methods you can employ, depending on your setup. Hope it's helpful friends.
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I usually make the L-cut with the vertical cut first. There's potential for kickback with the offcut, but I like the more stable feel of pushing the flat face on the table, rather than riding on a thin strip against the fence.
I did my first rabbet project this past weekend and came to the same conclusion.
Excellent video. Here in the UK, the use of a dado stack is not illegal. The Health and Safety Executive (our regulatory body) do not prohibit it but require all blades to have sufficient safeguards.
However, to the best of my knowledge, no UK-made table saws are made with an arbor long enough to take a dado stack. My presumption is that the manufacturers have decided that doing so will ensure that nobody could come back at them with any kind of negligence claim.
I cut rabbets or dados in 1 of 2 ways. Either, I use a standard flat-top tooth blade and just adjust the fence to get what I want. By using a shim equalling the width of the blade plus an offcut of the piece to be put in the rabbet or dado, I can achieve it quite easily.
The other way is on the router table but I rarely cut the dado or rabbet in one pass. I prefer to adjust height and fence several times to get the right fit.
Certainly using a good sharp bit or blade is critical - in this cut as all others. The real secret - which is no secret at all - is patience. Taking an extra 10 minutes on set up will save you time and money.
An interesting thing, the safety regulations. As the person who originally told me about the dado stack's demise in the UK was an owner of a production shop, I have to imagine he knew the minutia you bring up but didn't bother to articulate it fully to a 24 year old punk as I was 😂 thanks for the clarification!
@@ENCurtis @theofarmmanager267 is right in that their not illegal and my Dewalt 12" jobsite saw has an arbor long enough. The issue is that all hobby and semi-professional table saws sold in the EU have a requirement that the blade stops rotating by a certain time after it is turn off, to achieve this most saws have an electronic or mechanical motor brake. The extra weight and inertia of a dado stack can spin the arbor nut loose during braking, clearly not good. That is the reason its difficult to get a dado stack or find saws with arbors long enough!
The coolest coffee mug on the UA-cams makes yet another appearance 😂. I love how you actually showed the different ways instead of just telling folks there’s other ways. You’re an excellent teacher Eric.
Thank you!! And I love the love for the mug on here too bahaha
@@ENCurtis the mug should be the channel mascot. 😂
The timing of this video couldn’t have been any better. Can’t wait to see the piece completed.
Glad to hear it!
The rebate is just the extreme of any edge cut round over ,45 or any decorative edge cut in between. Square milled edge to rebate the outer extremes of edge cutting.
My friend, I love the way you think!
Thank you!
I love that you are using this one project to teach various different lessons. Very much looking forward to seeing that completed project.
Glad you're enjoying it so far! I'm excited to get this one to the client.
Me too! It looks like a superb chest in the making.
Howdy. I took apart every electronic device I could get my hands on as a kid and got in trouble for it on the regular. These days I count my lucky stars for that education because that curiosity has let to a lot of good things in my life. I have been binge watching your channel and love the format. I am fascinated by precision woodworking so am grateful to see you share your journey. Thanks for sharing!
A kindred spirit! You gotta do what you gotta do to quench the thirst of curiosity. Consequences be damned haha. Glad you're enjoying the videos!
I’m building my first floating shelves. I did the rabbet joint on the router table. Turned out better than I expected.
Common misconception. Dado stacks are not illegal anywhere in the European Union or the UK. What safety regulations have done there is mandate that saws under a certain size have short arbors that only allow a single blade to be fit onto it. The reasoning being fairly practical but of two different components.
1) Saws under their threshold are typically too small to have the mass or power to use a dado stack safely. They either don't have have enough power to spin the mass of a dado stack safely because the motors tend to be underpowered. This means that the saw could, and at some point will, bog down in the middle of a cut which could cause a dangerous kickback. Worse, or at least just as bad, the bogging down could lead someone to just push harder to get the wood through the saw which means a sudden release of tension when the wood does clear the blade leaving a good chance for fingers to go right into the blade. Even smaller saws might see their aluminum tops and/or frames twisting and flexing while being used under the tension being created.
2) Saws under the power threshold inevitably fall into the hobbyist and DIY owners category. This presents a problem as the people that own jobsite saws, contractor saws, hybrid saws and even the smaller end of cabinet saws tend to not be professionals. This also makes the naming of those types of saws a bit intellectually offensive but that's a whole different thing. Most people that own those types of saws are not professionals, have no real experience with power tools or making things with wood and these days likely only have UA-cam University education on the subject which is often even more useless than a degree from Trump University.
This presents a real danger as these people have no idea of the horrific amount of power they are now holding. There's a real social and economic benefit to minimizing the chances of these people doing something exceedingly stupid and dangerous that they don't realize is even really risky. It's the same thinking behind mandating seatbelts and air bags in cars. You remove as much danger as possible. Most people that buy let's say a jobsite saw to get into woodworking are going to make two or three projects before that little saw goes on a shelf in the garage to gather dust. Most people that try a new hobby never take it up permanently and that's fine. Those people have no business accessing tools that are just wildly dangerous when you have no idea how to use them properly. Case in point on the extreme end - DeWalt NEVER should have been allowed to release that tiny little jobsite saw that can take a dado stack. The people that do pick up woodworking permanently will have enough knowledge and experience by the time they decide to drop a giant pile of money on a good and very large table saw that they will be able to use a dado stack safely. The other group that would have access to saws that large are in an industrial setting where there are safety and training regulations to show people how to use those tools safely before they do so unsupervised.
I like cutting rabbits on the router table. I make boxes with the floating bottom design where I cut a rabbit on the bottom of the sides so the bottom fits inside it. I've seen other ppl cut a miter on the bottom to get the same effect but I don't like cutting miters when I don't have to. Stay awesome.
I've made many a box with a rabbeted bottom and it works perfectly every time. even gives an opportunity to lift the box slightly for a nice shadow line.
I recently found this channel and am so glad I did. You do a phenomenal job of teaching and educating.
Thank you so much!
that was great loved the examples. Tell tne eyeball his time is coming! Aww who am I kidding, love that little guy.
Haha he shall never surrender!
"Bare-faced Tenon" is the term I've seen here in the UK. I don't believe that Dado Stacks are strictly illegal here, but there are very few table saws that have an arbor that can accept one. Mine can't so I have to resort to the router table.
I like how you plant a seed in my mind. I get caught up in doing things that I am comfortable with and not thinking the way you do. For that I thank you! Love the coffee cup. The only thing missing was not seeing Huck. Thanks again!
Huckleberry shall return! You have my word.
Great video as always! Your story about the camcorder brought back memories of when my son took apart my garden tiller. I never got it back together because he lost most of the hardware to put it back together in the grass around where it was sitting. Thanks again for sharing your skills n knowledge of woodworking!
Thanks for all your time and effort.
My pleasure! Hope you enjoyed it.
Thank you for yet another great video. I enjoy learning from you and all the techniques you utilize. Thank you
Thanks for watching!
I have just discovered your channel; and, I am enjoying your videos very much! I appreciate your candor and your craftsmanship. Well done!
And then for an easy step-up from the rebate is the quarter-quarter or half-half joint, called that because if you're using 1/2" boards every measurement is 1/4", or half the thickness. You set up a 1/4" router bit or dado set 1/4" high and with 1/4" spacing from the fence. Run one board vertically against the fence to get a rebate, the other flat on the table to get a dado, and they'll interlock perfectly square and flush.
They aren't allowed in commercial settings as health and safety needs the over blade guard. In my garage, I do what I 😢want and have an imported stack 😊
Great video Eric! You’re an amazing craftsman and educator!
I appreciate that!
Great video, thank you. Oh how I laughed, as a kid (and still now) I loved taking things apart and not always managing to put them back together, now I have a grandson who does the same! On really small parts I will still use a rebate plane. Enjoying your channel, thanks from the UK.
Awesome piece. I love all that interlocking joinery. That’s going to be a nice relaxing glueup. 😊
I sure hope so! 😂
Thanks for the video Eric.👍👍
My pleasure!!
You find some awesome music for your videos.
I've been anticipating a new season of, "Instant Dream Home ", any peep, if you can spare.. Pretty please 😊
You have a lot of really cool high end electronic tools in your shop and so far, I have not felt one bit of GAS (Gear Acquistion Syndrome) watching your videos. That's teaching.
For me, it's a dado stack for cabinets and the router table for most furniture projects. If my shop was large enough for two table saws, I would love to have a dedicated dado saw. Even a small Dewalt jobsite saw would be awesome to have set up 100% of the time.
Agreed 100%. We've discussed getting a second dedicated dado saw... perhaps in time.
I'm guessing you set down that crazy cup as a way of having a sound marker to match your audio and video. And it's becoming iconic in your vids as I'm binging your content. Am I onto something? Keep up the classy work! 🍵
Thanks Erik!
Thank you!
A cow dog is commonly known as a Basset.
Nice video!
Impressive design and dry fit! I wish you had spent a bit more time on how you made your decisions on your joint choices for putting it all together. For instance, you could have used mitered joints for the corners of the box and rabbets to attach the box to the chest. There are many videos on cutting rabbets but there aren’t many woodworkers with your level of craftsmanship.
That's a great point. I'll do my best to cover that in the project build video! Thank you.
The most common joint? Hmm, possibly, will require some cogitation on that one. I'll have some time to think about it while I'm cutting the glass rabbets for the 30 awning windows I'm getting ready to make. Since I'm not working against a clock I'm going to use a rabbet plane. And a chisel, they're stopped rabbets. A router may come out after I've done a couple of batches. We'll see.
As to the camcorder disassembly, I think you may have discovered the best use for those things.
I'm getting intrigued with the box project. It's got just about the right amount of interesting parts.
Rabbets for 30 windows with a rabbet plane? My friend. I wish you well 😂
In the meantime, I hope a few silly youtube videos can keep you company!
Dado stacks are not illegal in the UK. Common misconception. Hard to find a newer saw with a long enough arbor to use any substantial sized dado stack however.
Interesting. I've had multiple professional cabinetmakers from the UK and Germany tell me they are illegal in production shops, but perhaps they were mistaken. Thanks for the insights!
I was sure they weren't as we used them in my first job making doll houses. We would run rebates and grooves through long lengths of ply before cutting to size.
@@ENCurtisI can confirm that they are not illegal in the EU/Europe. The machine just need to support it. Further, it needs to be distinguished what is allowed at a professional workshop and what is “allowed” by private persons.
The wood machining regs state that a riving knife must be used where applicable.
Sorry to hear that you don’t have a bottom yet 😄 On a serious note dado stacks aren’t illegal in Australia, but I don’t have one, so I usually have to nibble away at the joint 😁
Great educational vid !
The nibble method maybe the GOAT 🐐
A joint with one shoulder is called a bare faced...
There it is! Much obliged.
Another very informative and fun video! I have been thinking about the mug. I think it needs a name…
1, a tenonwith a single shoulder is a barefaced tenon, used a lot with rails and stiles = i use them in gate construction with T&G boards or panels.
2. Why is it so commonly stated in the US that in the “in the UK staked dados are illegal??” In industry they don’t comply with H&S (OSHA equivalent), but its actually the EU rules that make saws with long atrbours not comply with sale laws so - for individuals at least - its perfectly legal to use stacked blades, just you can’t buy the machines easily… they exist historically, but you can’t buy them new….. same with car sea belts, you can’t buy a car without seatbelts, but its not illegal to drive a car that never had them fitted… FYI the reason behind the rules relates to time it takes for the blade to come to a stop after the machine is turned off, stacked blades take longer, so hence they aren’t sold.
Your videos are great. Really enjoy them. Where did you get the extrusion on your table saw fence?
A zero-clearance insert / throat plate would also keep the small off-cuts from dropping down beside the table saw blade. :)
Absolutely would have!
I've heard that technically European tablesaws MUST have riving knives when in use. And since riving knives are usually removed with dado stacks, the arbors are shortened to discourage their use. But the actual law is regarding the riving knife. Rendering the dado stack "functionally" outlawed, but not technically outlawed
"Functionally outlawed" is an interesting way to put it, and perhaps what my teacher meant when he said as much. But good information to have. Thanks for the clarification.
Not so about the riving knife, my UK jobsite saw's knife come out with the pull of one handle, I've posted a reply above which sets out the real reason!
If I caught a cotton tail and lit him up, would that be a rabbit joint?? 😂😂
Seriously though, great content, very concise
*insert dad joke chuckle here 😂
I try to use rabbets whenever I can due to their simplicity. The only problem is they multiply like crazy and leave a lot of crap behind!
Ha. You skipped the joy that it is to change the brake out on the Sawstop :) That plus the blade set up makes me not ever want to bother putting on the dado blades.
Fair point! That SawStop break is a pain… but it does save many fingers.
thank yo u
Hi great job
You used something to hold your arbor nut just wondering if it was something you made or did you purchases it
Where did you get that mug? I want one too 😂
LoL, Erik, you post this the day after I finish my new hand tool, a 3-arm rabbet saw. I would be honored if you checked out the recent videos I have uploaded to my channel. Love your channel, and I am fascinated that we both have rabbets on the brain. I went old school though, made a tool that looks like it came from the late 1800’s.
Will do!
It's less about the legality of the dado, and more about the arbor length, I guess because some chucklehead somewhere thought it was a good idea to try to build a PTO on a 4000 rpm saw arbor. Remember; everything that's illegal is so because someone did something very, very dumb with that thing. :)
Truer words were never spoken haha. Interesting though!
Out of curiosity Erik, when you used the router table, why not change the bearing to get a defined 1/4" width? When I make rabbets of standard wdths, I perfer just changing the bearings because it's fast and easy and takes one variable out, and I focus on depth. Obviously, if the width needs to be some weirdo size, I use the fence.
Thanks for the great info. Can your next video cover the making of rebates? 😂
Absolutely could! Frankly it's only habit that I use the fence. Either way works just as well.
Thanks a lot for sharing, it's really nicely done. BTW, that's a really nice table saw, right? Harvey Alpha with the sliding table extension, sweet. I have the 2hp and enjoy making a lot of saw dust with it 🤣. Just one little thing: a Sawstop blade on a Harvey TS, really?!? Ya gonna supremely irritate a lotta people no matter what.... Just kiddin' 🤗🤗🤗
bahaha it was a leftover blade. It still cuts clean, so I'm gonna use it!
@@ENCurtis WTG Erik!
I learned to call it a "barefaced tenon", btw.
no dado stack are not illegal here in europe :)
Are all dado stacks flats top grind blades? I’ve never had a TS that accepted a dado stack. Always had the cheapo’s 😂
I believe so. Given the nature of the joint it wouldn't make much sense to have a raggedy bottom to the joint 😂
In the UK they are not ilegal, I know as I have one in my re-branded Harvey table saw
Before 2016 manufacturers were encouraged not to make arbors that can hold dado's
Interesting. Thanks for the insights!
hi 'love your programs but i think the tongue and groove joint is the most common, flooring is still wood working.
Are you a magician? I also have Harvey 4HP dovetail trunion Tablesaw. How are you locking the arbor to change blades? I need two wrenches...
hahaha there is a red arbor lock button to the left of the blade on my model.
@@ENCurtis What model?
@@clemoniii Alpha HW-110S I believe
Give me a dado stack any day it’s quick and easy to set up
Agreed for anything mid-sized and up!
CNC router...Damn showoff👍
I would love to learn WHY a dado stack is frowned upon in the EU. 🤔
Googled to find the answer to my own question. It's because you have to remove the blade guard and riving knife to use a dado stack. Hmmmm.
@@sgoldste02 There's another reason. A saw should be able to stop fast enough and with a dado stack most saws will keep spinning for far too long
I guess this is for the advance wood worker.
When an engineer try’s Manly things and ruins it with silly terms
Why in the world is a dado blade illegal in uk? Please don’t yell me it’s because they think they are dangerous 🙄
Or you can just be a real man and use a Plough plane..(hand tool).
Barefaced m&t