To AlishmcMalishIl who said: "I like how they appear to be reading sheet music. Like there's actually some kinda logic to this." there is absolutely no chance or improvisation in this piece. Ligeti wrote it with perfect precision and details. It's clear like a Bach cantata.
I think my favorite part is when they turn the page in front of them. It amuses me that they have all of this written out and have to refer back to it. What does the paper say I wonder??
In the recordings, you can actually hear the 'cello delicately fiddling with the string, the hear the percussionist rip the paper SLOWLY. But I forgot how much theatre there was in this piece! All the non-sounding theatrics are written in the score. Solo singers reacting to each other's absurdity in absurd ways. Is there a conversation going on? Are they even *trying* to understand each other? The n'th degree in Musical Expressionism. And a bit of fun.
Dude, there are no more such restrictions on what counts as "respectable" composition nowadays. If you want to compose neo-romantic or tonal, go ahead and do it. It's no use complaining about what happened. On the contrary, I feel quite happy that the 2nd Viennese and Darmstadt schools happened - because now I can embrace tonality with a breath of fresh air, with no need of dragging the emotional baggage of Strauss, Mahler, and Wagner behind me.
I think the problem with atonal music is not that it's incomprehensible per say, but that it came about too quickly. I would imagine that the contemporary reaction to atonal music would be equivalent to the reaction of the public of Purcell's time if Wagner showed up and performed the Ring cycle, or if Stravinsky came with the Rite. The whole atonal movement was a veritable explosion of change. Even Beethoven didn't shake things up THAT much. If the development of atonality had kept up
Modern composers don't want to reach the level of Beethoven or Bach. They search to push the boundaries of what we know traditionally as music, and this is a perfect example.
Modern repertoire, vocal extremely difficult. BerlinPhil with Sir Simon Rattle "break paradigms" of traditional repertoires. Knowing the history of the universal music we understand that the work of Gyorgy Ligeti to the present day, as well as Stravinsky in contemporary music. Bravo! Congratulations, Greetings from Brazil.
the idea that the reason why tonality works and atonality doesn't is because tonality isn't some set of musical rules that just came arbitrarily out of nowhere, rather, it was the method of arranging pitches that arose and consolidated over time as composers wrote music which reflected the human condition (whether consciously or not). The idea of tension and release is crucial in music, because our lives are also composed of tension and release. Tension is often created through dissonance, but
Then I really am curious, what should have composers pursued instead? I understand that Schoenberg may have been a little premature with his pronouncement that tonality was dead, but he was right when he said that something new would have to follow. Mahler and Sibelius, by the end of their lives were pushing the boundaries of tonality; the fragments of Mahler 10 are almost atonal, and Sibelius's disjointed themes and heavy emphasis on silence are key characteristics of much atonal music.
(cont.) Personally, I think that if Mahler had lived to finish the 10th and had gone on to write an 11th (and perhaps a 12th) that by the end he would have wound up sounding a lot like Schoenberg and Berg. Also (I know you're not the one that said this, but still) Schoenberg didn't just decide one day to invent twelve-tone music just because he was bored and wanted to "invent something new." Twelve-tone technique was conceived to provide an organizational system to atonal music, which had...
Music is an art and should be universal. Not only for those few people lucky enough to spend years studying and apreciating music. So if I need to spend years listening to Bach and Mozart to apreciate that song, it doesn't make it a good song.
hear the Napoleon Hexachord, of course it's going to sound crazy and out of place. But if you heard that same chord and listened to it completely isolated and without any context or bias, you'd probably find it interesting and even beautiful! This opens doors enjoying a vast variety of music. Sure, Webern isn't Beethoven, but he doesn't pretend to be. They're attempting to achieve different things; they're two different aesthetics.
That wasn't my reasoning. Noone introduced me to music. But if you have any study to support your view about how people listen to Bach and Mozart in music class. In my class we learnt Nino Ferrer, Jean-Jacques Goldmann and Cher and I don't know any of my former classmate who still listen to one of them. And what about Gaga, Bieber and Jackson? How long do you need to hear them to consider they are bad musicians? Noone has the monopoly of good taste I think.
People should compose as they wish, in my opinion, even if it ends up being, at times, incomprehensible to many. Composition is a very personal thing and one shouldn't restrict their creativity because of people who stuck in previous centuries. I honestly don't see the appeal in this sort of music but I'm not going to say that its neccessarily bad music because to many people it is brilliant.
in mind. That's just me, but a lot of people would agree. I've always thought of music as a means of communication, and when I hear certain atonal pieces they always come off as very ivory-tower to me. Imagine if Shakespeare had written his plays in a cryptic language which no one but himself and a select few could understand, and that's what I see it akin to. It's interesting however, that you mention that dissonance is relative, because even Classical era sonata forms were intended to portray
Firstly, while it is true that composers "improve on what was already established", it's bizarre to say that "they didn't try to invent something new." Where did the Tristan chord come from? The scherzo form? Sonata form? Or even polyphony itself. Your statement is not merely historically incorrect; it's philosophically muddled. The fact is that composers improve on what was already established BY the very process of inventing something new. It's not a dichotomy.
When music is this avant-garde, I'm never sure if the composers and performers are serious or just having a laugh (maybe a bit of both) . If you want a more familiar introduction to Ligeti, try the score to 2001: A Space Odyssey v=ou6JNQwPWE0
(cont.) atonality is most certainly capable, just look at Berg's Wozzeck. Sometimes it is a combination of Atonality and tonality that makes the connection (like George Crumb! ex. "Ancient Voices of Children" and "Vox Balenae" or any piece by Berg). I would exhort thee to listen to more! It really is worth it. Once you get the idiom in your ear all the pieces that you thought were terrible before begin to open up. It's awesome :)
Transfer to the University of Miami!! Composition majors here write in tonal or atonal depending on their preferences, and there's a small faction of students who love tonality ;)
Well I agree with you that not all 12-tone music is awful, and that's not what I was trying imply. Although I haven't listened to much of it because I generally turn away from it as soon as I do, I actually like Webern's Symphony Op. 21 and Variations Op. 27. There are probably a number of other 12-tone pieces out there that I would enjoy if I heard them, but overall I feel that the 12-tone method is a less effective means of communication and expression than music composed with pitch hierarchy
You're right that it may be an exaggeration, because in a way it's not truly his fault that other composers continued to emulate and expand upon his style. I just wish that atonality hadn't become the "standard" of composition for so much of the 20th century to the point where it was non-respectable to compose in any other way
For some people who have spent many years listening, appreciating and studying Bach and Mozart and appreciated how great they are and how silly it would be to try to imitate them, they come to the conclusion that it would be better to try to forge your own style.
If I were in your situation though, I wouldn't be to bitchy about being forced to write atonal. Either transfer into a different school, or try your best to work within the constraints presented. For example, I wouldn't like being forced to compose in a pastiche 18th century style, but if I were forced to, I would give it a good shot in order to try to learn something. Sometimes being forced to express yourself in atonal terms is the key which makes you understand how it can be done.
Well, as I said to someone else, perhaps I was wrong to say that it was Schoenberg's "fault", in the sense that it's not his fault that he set the new standard for classical music composition for decades to come. The purpose of atonality (specifically serialism) was to disband the concept of hierarchy in music. To me, it's seems very Marxian, in that it seems like an excellent idea but just doesn't work in practice. I had a conversation with my conductor once about atonality and he purported
That's sad, because in a lot of other places strict atonality is a thing of the past. By the 1980s in the US minimalism had displaced serialism as the most popular compositional approach. Nowadays everyone writes in all kinds of different styles, even incorporating popular music influences into their art music. I actually find it quite frustrating that I am one of the few student composers in MY college (NE liberal arts) who actively embraces both tonality and atonality.
(cont.) total serialism [Boulez, Stockhausen]. That got pretty crazy, they serialized EVERY aspect of music, not just pitch. It made for some fascinating music, but not very emotional music (Boulez "Structures"). That movement didn't last very long, and most of the composers involved moved on to simply composing freely; the atmosphere now is a lot more like just before twelve-tone came about (Boulez "Repons" 1980's). I agree that 12-tone music is not the best for communicating emotion, free
Well that's fortunate, because practically no one uses 12-tone any more. Most of what could be done with it was done by the big 3 (Schoenberg, Berg, and Webern), and most of their output I stand by as being pretty darned good (have you heard Webern's Op. 28 or Berg's Lulu suite or Schoenberg's 4th piano concerto?) After them serialism got fairly weird :/ There were a few "traditional" twelve tone composers (Dallapiccola is really good!), but the vast majority of people went out for
Hmm... Well first of all I'm not one of those people who think atonal music is the only way forward in music. I know there was a lot of that with the Darmstadt (spelling lol xD) school in the 50's with Boulez (whom I love by the way); they were not at all justified in putting down other modes of expression, and most of that crowd has mellowed with age. As for the neoclassicists and impressionists, I like them just as much as I do Webern and Boulez (and I'm about the biggest Hindemith fan in
(cont.) been around for a while by then (and was itself a result of gradual expansion of the Wagnerian hyper-chromaticism of the turn of the century). I'm just curious, what about atonal music don't you like? Dissonance? Tonal disorientation? Dealing with a lot of that is just a matter of getting into the mindset of a different aesthetic. Also, do you not think Brahms is in the same category as Beethoven and Bach? I'm not trying to be sarcastic with any of these questions, I'm just curious :)
dissonance only works in context with consonance. Without consonance, pure dissonance is just senseless chaos. It's unrelatable to an extent because life and humanity are not constantly in a state of senselessness and chaos. Also, Mahler 10 isn't even close to being atonal, and I wouldn't call any of the works by Hindemith, Debussy, or Shostakovich to be atonal either because there is still a sense of hierarchy in the pitches. And no, I don't think Brahms is in the same category as Bach, Mozart
dissonance, although nowadays we associate them with the exact opposite. The idea of contrasting tonic and dominant key areas was supposed to create large scale dissonance, and perhaps back in Haydn's day it really did sound dissonant to hear music in the dominant key area move abruptly back to the tonic. Another example is the opening of Beethoven's first Symphony, which seems so harmonically tame from a modern perspective, but perhaps ludicrous during his time. So yes, perhaps dissonance is
I'd like to see the "notation" for this. It's a bit like the Three Stooges at the Opera. I usually like Ligeti's music. I wonder if his opera is similar to this piece.
discouraged because he didn't have the desire or vision to create new sounds. It's getting better, but I just wish that more academic circles would get over the idea of atonality being the standard for modern composition
Well, I will try to expose myself further to those types of compositions in hopes of developing a fondness for them. And to be honest, my beef with atonality isn't the concept itself so much as the way it became the standard of composing for so long. I'll reiterate that I can't even major in composition at my school because I don't want to compose atonally. I think that's messed up, and it used to be even worse. Glenn Gould is another who probably would have been a composer had he not felt
and Beethoven. I think if you set aside subjectivity when it comes to listening to music that it's hard to argue that they had any equals besides themselves (and I would call Bach #1). I can't really provide hard or compelling evidence to prove that they have no equals, but to me it really seems self-evident. Maybe that's just me
Well I don't typically let the composer's personality factor into my enjoyment for their music, so that's not really the issue. Atonalists could either be the snobbiest people on the planet, or the humblest, and it wouldn't affect my opinion of their music unless somehow either quality affected their actual composition. I go to FSU, and they're quite adamant about composition majors writing atonally.
(cont.) the state of Texas). Talking about Shostakovich and atonality gets fairly complicated. Of course his music isn't atonal, but is that because of Stalin or Shostakovich? That's a whole 'nuther can of worms. But lets stay in the can we already have open, shall we? :) As regards total dissonance, you are absolutely right. Total dissonance = chaos. The only problem is, atonal music is not totally dissonant. What makes, say, Schoenberg's Op. 31 sound atonal is not that it's completely
interesting and beautiful? It really is possible to get the tonal paradigm out of your head and hear the beauty even in those 7ths and tritones, even in every day sound for that matter (John Cage :D). People say that birdsong is beautiful, but actual birdsong is rather harsh and dissonant (Messiaen: Catologue d'Oiseaux). The truth is (and it took me a looong time to realize this) that dissonance is completely relative. Sure, if you're listening to a Beethoven piano sonata in C and you suddenly
relative, but even so I feel that music needs some sense of tonal hierarchy. Also, it's true that art doesn't have to be relatable, but I prefer it to be, because if a musical genius has something to say, I want to be able to understand it.
And by the way, this statement that "this is all Schoenberg's fault" is rubbish. Considering what Wagner and Mahler had done, Schoenberg was more or less inevitable. Read up again on your musical history.
To AlishmcMalishIl who said:
"I like how they appear to be reading sheet music. Like there's actually some kinda logic to this."
there is absolutely no chance or improvisation in this piece. Ligeti wrote it with perfect precision and details. It's clear like a Bach cantata.
I think my favorite part is when they turn the page in front of them. It amuses me that they have all of this written out and have to refer back to it. What does the paper say I wonder??
I love cranking this up when my baby is sleeping.
This is literally a note for note recreation of how I sound when I'm alone in the car.
best piece ever. Great performances y'all
If you don't like the music, at least you could try and appreciate it for how innovative and wild it is.
The guy who tears the sheet music should win an award.
In the recordings, you can actually hear the 'cello delicately fiddling with the string, the hear the percussionist rip the paper SLOWLY. But I forgot how much theatre there was in this piece! All the non-sounding theatrics are written in the score. Solo singers reacting to each other's absurdity in absurd ways. Is there a conversation going on? Are they even *trying* to understand each other? The n'th degree in Musical Expressionism. And a bit of fun.
Well, I think it is supposed to be funny and not to be taken too serious. And Ligeti succeeds. It's hilarious.
Dude, there are no more such restrictions on what counts as "respectable" composition nowadays. If you want to compose neo-romantic or tonal, go ahead and do it. It's no use complaining about what happened. On the contrary, I feel quite happy that the 2nd Viennese and Darmstadt schools happened - because now I can embrace tonality with a breath of fresh air, with no need of dragging the emotional baggage of Strauss, Mahler, and Wagner behind me.
I think the problem with atonal music is not that it's incomprehensible per say, but that it came about too quickly. I would imagine that the contemporary reaction to atonal music would be equivalent to the reaction of the public of Purcell's time if Wagner showed up and performed the Ring cycle, or if Stravinsky came with the Rite. The whole atonal movement was a veritable explosion of change. Even Beethoven didn't shake things up THAT much. If the development of atonality had kept up
this was fabulous. I'd love to see more of this.
SO NICE
This is beyond awesome.
wow. such profound music.
ART
+Meowkins :3 YES
CORRECT
1:09 This guy, made my day.
Modern composers don't want to reach the level of Beethoven or Bach. They search to push the boundaries of what we know traditionally as music, and this is a perfect example.
But it sounds like straight ass and you cant deny it
This is the most wonderful thing ever. Truly. :-)
wow ligeti ihr habt ja echt alles im programm
danke fürs hochladen
Who needs Bach, Mozart, Tchaikovsky or Shostakovich when there is such a brilliant music😂
0:47 rips up a paper bag!!!
Modern repertoire, vocal extremely difficult. BerlinPhil with Sir Simon Rattle "break paradigms" of traditional repertoires. Knowing the history of the universal music we understand that the work of Gyorgy Ligeti to the present day, as well as Stravinsky in contemporary music. Bravo! Congratulations, Greetings from Brazil.
Great Guillermo Anzorena!!!
the idea that the reason why tonality works and atonality doesn't is because tonality isn't some set of musical rules that just came arbitrarily out of nowhere, rather, it was the method of arranging pitches that arose and consolidated over time as composers wrote music which reflected the human condition (whether consciously or not). The idea of tension and release is crucial in music, because our lives are also composed of tension and release. Tension is often created through dissonance, but
Why have I not heard this on the radio?!?
what is this? Why am I in love with it? :)
I cannot breathe.
where can i find the asmr version?
Then I really am curious, what should have composers pursued instead? I understand that Schoenberg may have been a little premature with his pronouncement that tonality was dead, but he was right when he said that something new would have to follow. Mahler and Sibelius, by the end of their lives were pushing the boundaries of tonality; the fragments of Mahler 10 are almost atonal, and Sibelius's disjointed themes and heavy emphasis on silence are key characteristics of much atonal music.
Important singers doing such a silly bunch of things! It must have been a really amusing show...
If it sounds familiar, it's because it was used in the movie "2001: A Space Odyssey".
all music was once new
I don't understand this at all.
Doesn't stop me from liking it though! I like that I don't understand it. Is that weird?
(cont.) Personally, I think that if Mahler had lived to finish the 10th and had gone on to write an 11th (and perhaps a 12th) that by the end he would have wound up sounding a lot like Schoenberg and Berg. Also (I know you're not the one that said this, but still) Schoenberg didn't just decide one day to invent twelve-tone music just because he was bored and wanted to "invent something new." Twelve-tone technique was conceived to provide an organizational system to atonal music, which had...
Music is an art and should be universal. Not only for those few people lucky enough to spend years studying and apreciating music. So if I need to spend years listening to Bach and Mozart to apreciate that song, it doesn't make it a good song.
It's not supposed to be 'good' or a 'song'. Also you don't have to like it.
@@UlfilasNZ Good lord it was 9 years ago hahaha
hear the Napoleon Hexachord, of course it's going to sound crazy and out of place. But if you heard that same chord and listened to it completely isolated and without any context or bias, you'd probably find it interesting and even beautiful! This opens doors enjoying a vast variety of music. Sure, Webern isn't Beethoven, but he doesn't pretend to be. They're attempting to achieve different things; they're two different aesthetics.
That wasn't my reasoning. Noone introduced me to music. But if you have any study to support your view about how people listen to Bach and Mozart in music class. In my class we learnt Nino Ferrer, Jean-Jacques Goldmann and Cher and I don't know any of my former classmate who still listen to one of them. And what about Gaga, Bieber and Jackson? How long do you need to hear them to consider they are bad musicians? Noone has the monopoly of good taste I think.
This needs standing ovation..
People should compose as they wish, in my opinion, even if it ends up being, at times, incomprehensible to many. Composition is a very personal thing and one shouldn't restrict their creativity because of people who stuck in previous centuries. I honestly don't see the appeal in this sort of music but I'm not going to say that its neccessarily bad music because to many people it is brilliant.
in mind. That's just me, but a lot of people would agree. I've always thought of music as a means of communication, and when I hear certain atonal pieces they always come off as very ivory-tower to me. Imagine if Shakespeare had written his plays in a cryptic language which no one but himself and a select few could understand, and that's what I see it akin to. It's interesting however, that you mention that dissonance is relative, because even Classical era sonata forms were intended to portray
I would love to know what exactly I'm wrong about. Please elaborate.
Firstly, while it is true that composers "improve on what was already established", it's bizarre to say that "they didn't try to invent something new." Where did the Tristan chord come from? The scherzo form? Sonata form? Or even polyphony itself. Your statement is not merely historically incorrect; it's philosophically muddled. The fact is that composers improve on what was already established BY the very process of inventing something new. It's not a dichotomy.
in the beginning, it sounds the episode of spongebob: SB-129. When squidward is in the empty place.
When music is this avant-garde, I'm never sure if the composers and performers are serious or just having a laugh (maybe a bit of both) . If you want a more familiar introduction to Ligeti, try the score to 2001: A Space Odyssey v=ou6JNQwPWE0
No that is film music and represents an entirely different purpose
SO TRUE!
(cont.) atonality is most certainly capable, just look at Berg's Wozzeck. Sometimes it is a combination of Atonality and tonality that makes the connection (like George Crumb! ex. "Ancient Voices of Children" and "Vox Balenae" or any piece by Berg). I would exhort thee to listen to more! It really is worth it. Once you get the idiom in your ear all the pieces that you thought were terrible before begin to open up. It's awesome :)
1:00 "oh sh#t" anyone?
"vooh je"
@@sebastianzaczek I just heard a very angry "WOOOSH"
An exceptional performance. No doubt, this will cause allergy to the ultraconservative public
Wish the entire performance was available for free on UA-cam...
the only thing i want to know is what the hell kind of notes did the guy read of the music sheet that made him tear the newspaper!
Transfer to the University of Miami!! Composition majors here write in tonal or atonal depending on their preferences, and there's a small faction of students who love tonality ;)
Well I agree with you that not all 12-tone music is awful, and that's not what I was trying imply. Although I haven't listened to much of it because I generally turn away from it as soon as I do, I actually like Webern's Symphony Op. 21 and Variations Op. 27. There are probably a number of other 12-tone pieces out there that I would enjoy if I heard them, but overall I feel that the 12-tone method is a less effective means of communication and expression than music composed with pitch hierarchy
You're right that it may be an exaggeration, because in a way it's not truly his fault that other composers continued to emulate and expand upon his style. I just wish that atonality hadn't become the "standard" of composition for so much of the 20th century to the point where it was non-respectable to compose in any other way
For some people who have spent many years listening, appreciating and studying Bach and Mozart and appreciated how great they are and how silly it would be to try to imitate them, they come to the conclusion that it would be better to try to forge your own style.
Well, the part at 1:30 was cool!
Where is the carpet part ?
Can you get this on Itunes?
If I were in your situation though, I wouldn't be to bitchy about being forced to write atonal. Either transfer into a different school, or try your best to work within the constraints presented. For example, I wouldn't like being forced to compose in a pastiche 18th century style, but if I were forced to, I would give it a good shot in order to try to learn something. Sometimes being forced to express yourself in atonal terms is the key which makes you understand how it can be done.
Yes, indubitably
I tabbed away... this just got so much weirder 0_0
Well, as I said to someone else, perhaps I was wrong to say that it was Schoenberg's "fault", in the sense that it's not his fault that he set the new standard for classical music composition for decades to come. The purpose of atonality (specifically serialism) was to disband the concept of hierarchy in music. To me, it's seems very Marxian, in that it seems like an excellent idea but just doesn't work in practice. I had a conversation with my conductor once about atonality and he purported
That's sad, because in a lot of other places strict atonality is a thing of the past. By the 1980s in the US minimalism had displaced serialism as the most popular compositional approach. Nowadays everyone writes in all kinds of different styles, even incorporating popular music influences into their art music. I actually find it quite frustrating that I am one of the few student composers in MY college (NE liberal arts) who actively embraces both tonality and atonality.
(cont.) total serialism [Boulez, Stockhausen]. That got pretty crazy, they serialized EVERY aspect of music, not just pitch. It made for some fascinating music, but not very emotional music (Boulez "Structures"). That movement didn't last very long, and most of the composers involved moved on to simply composing freely; the atmosphere now is a lot more like just before twelve-tone came about (Boulez "Repons" 1980's). I agree that 12-tone music is not the best for communicating emotion, free
Well that's fortunate, because practically no one uses 12-tone any more. Most of what could be done with it was done by the big 3 (Schoenberg, Berg, and Webern), and most of their output I stand by as being pretty darned good (have you heard Webern's Op. 28 or Berg's Lulu suite or Schoenberg's 4th piano concerto?) After them serialism got fairly weird :/ There were a few "traditional" twelve tone composers (Dallapiccola is really good!), but the vast majority of people went out for
Hmm... Well first of all I'm not one of those people who think atonal music is the only way forward in music. I know there was a lot of that with the Darmstadt (spelling lol xD) school in the 50's with Boulez (whom I love by the way); they were not at all justified in putting down other modes of expression, and most of that crowd has mellowed with age. As for the neoclassicists and impressionists, I like them just as much as I do Webern and Boulez (and I'm about the biggest Hindemith fan in
it's like they're trying to tell me something, I KNOW IT!
(cont.) been around for a while by then (and was itself a result of gradual expansion of the Wagnerian hyper-chromaticism of the turn of the century). I'm just curious, what about atonal music don't you like? Dissonance? Tonal disorientation? Dealing with a lot of that is just a matter of getting into the mindset of a different aesthetic. Also, do you not think Brahms is in the same category as Beethoven and Bach? I'm not trying to be sarcastic with any of these questions, I'm just curious :)
Well it is undeniably great fun, but somehow I suspect not quite on par with lets say, the Mass in B minor. But then again, it doesn't pretend to be.
dissonance only works in context with consonance. Without consonance, pure dissonance is just senseless chaos. It's unrelatable to an extent because life and humanity are not constantly in a state of senselessness and chaos. Also, Mahler 10 isn't even close to being atonal, and I wouldn't call any of the works by Hindemith, Debussy, or Shostakovich to be atonal either because there is still a sense of hierarchy in the pitches. And no, I don't think Brahms is in the same category as Bach, Mozart
I cannot describe just how incredibly awkward this made me feel....
dissonance, although nowadays we associate them with the exact opposite. The idea of contrasting tonic and dominant key areas was supposed to create large scale dissonance, and perhaps back in Haydn's day it really did sound dissonant to hear music in the dominant key area move abruptly back to the tonic. Another example is the opening of Beethoven's first Symphony, which seems so harmonically tame from a modern perspective, but perhaps ludicrous during his time. So yes, perhaps dissonance is
How did sir simon rattle fall so deep???
What is this?
Bizard....musicos eran los de antes!
I'd like to see the "notation" for this. It's a bit like the Three Stooges at the Opera. I usually like Ligeti's music. I wonder if his opera is similar to this piece.
discouraged because he didn't have the desire or vision to create new sounds. It's getting better, but I just wish that more academic circles would get over the idea of atonality being the standard for modern composition
I'm in that part of youtube again...
I'm trying so hard to understand but I just don't...
Well, I will try to expose myself further to those types of compositions in hopes of developing a fondness for them. And to be honest, my beef with atonality isn't the concept itself so much as the way it became the standard of composing for so long. I'll reiterate that I can't even major in composition at my school because I don't want to compose atonally. I think that's messed up, and it used to be even worse. Glenn Gould is another who probably would have been a composer had he not felt
and Beethoven. I think if you set aside subjectivity when it comes to listening to music that it's hard to argue that they had any equals besides themselves (and I would call Bach #1). I can't really provide hard or compelling evidence to prove that they have no equals, but to me it really seems self-evident. Maybe that's just me
L'art est-il provocation, ou est-ce la provocation qui est art ?
You do realize this is all Schoenberg's fault
Well I don't typically let the composer's personality factor into my enjoyment for their music, so that's not really the issue. Atonalists could either be the snobbiest people on the planet, or the humblest, and it wouldn't affect my opinion of their music unless somehow either quality affected their actual composition. I go to FSU, and they're quite adamant about composition majors writing atonally.
(cont.) the state of Texas). Talking about Shostakovich and atonality gets fairly complicated. Of course his music isn't atonal, but is that because of Stalin or Shostakovich? That's a whole 'nuther can of worms. But lets stay in the can we already have open, shall we? :) As regards total dissonance, you are absolutely right. Total dissonance = chaos. The only problem is, atonal music is not totally dissonant. What makes, say, Schoenberg's Op. 31 sound atonal is not that it's completely
Movie noises?
OMG!!! This is 100 times better than all of Beethoven's symphonies combined. Unbelievably great!!!! More please.
I don't understand..
Ok... what is this?
interesting and beautiful? It really is possible to get the tonal paradigm out of your head and hear the beauty even in those 7ths and tritones, even in every day sound for that matter (John Cage :D). People say that birdsong is beautiful, but actual birdsong is rather harsh and dissonant (Messiaen: Catologue d'Oiseaux). The truth is (and it took me a looong time to realize this) that dissonance is completely relative. Sure, if you're listening to a Beethoven piano sonata in C and you suddenly
relative, but even so I feel that music needs some sense of tonal hierarchy. Also, it's true that art doesn't have to be relatable, but I prefer it to be, because if a musical genius has something to say, I want to be able to understand it.
"Great" is a relative term.
I wonder what their music that they're reading looks like..
And by the way, this statement that "this is all Schoenberg's fault" is rubbish. Considering what Wagner and Mahler had done, Schoenberg was more or less inevitable. Read up again on your musical history.
1:04 "skibidi"
This is what art is becoming.... hahaha I am disappoint.
I like the part where they take themselves seriously
There you go
Was it really?
im giving Pitbull 2 weeks to jump in and make the Remix version
It says so much by saying so little....