All channels have to start from somewhere, but thanks for bringing some attention to our channel and this video of the presentation at the show. It was a great presentation to experience in person.
I'm very impressed with the project's progress myself so far. Not only is hardware design in itself a total bitch and a half to pull off successfully, manufacturing it is a whole other debacle on top of that. And I think they're doing a great job all things considered, and they've kept it mostly 100% on track as-designed and didn't end up as some hackey half-baked product. Dave has discussed his disappointment with the sound chip he was forced to use (watch his video on that, the chip they ended up with is not what they originally intended because they couldn't reliably source the original YM chip he had in mind - but it works, they made it work well). Im impressed with to be honest
I haven't checked the exact model of the ESP32 used on the card. But I think it doesn't have 2MB of RAM. Otherwise it can probably run the entire system (excluding the VERA) in emulation.
@@andyhu9542 No they're a Harvard architecture, so use 4MB to 16MB of Flash + 520KB RAM. So it's essentially more than 2MB of RAM if referring to the amount of space for code, but less if you have little code and a huge amount of data (unusual, unless doing some extreme number crunching - probably not something you'd do on an 8-bit CPU :) ) You can actually emulate an old DOS+Windows 3.0 PC on the ESP32 :)
Yes. That's what the gen2 is referring to. It even has some of the features cut from it. However, for most people the price is the biggest issue with the current generation. So a cost-reduced X16 does make sense.
I would like to know when the software for the SMC hardware is going to be updated. Currently, it is stuck at v45.1 while the VERA and BIOS are at v47. The emulator is at 47 for everything.
I'm a fan of pushing original hardware to new heights but not really big on the x16 or any modern 8-bit arms race. The 80's nerd in me still loves the content and following it's progress.
The 2nd gen unit would seem to be suitable only for those that want to run games (i.e., boring. The current X16 is far more suitable for actual retro computing enthusiast
Well one can argue that most of today's retro computer/console enthusiasts are gamers. These people will bring in the critical money flow to sustain the project.
If someone developed an ASIC for the Game Gear I'd be more interested: everyone would be better off creating (new) 8-bit systems that have backward compatibility, even if you want to facilitate new software that takes advantage of some better capabilities (higher resolution or something) without "breaking" the 8-bit aesthetic.
He's detailed the "Elon strategy" before in previous videos. Make the big expensive board for early adopters and software makers, then gradually move down to a tiny FPGA\emulator for mass adoption.
People can accept low quality graphics... so long as you have an Epic sound and music experience behind it. Nothing ruins an experience more, than Poor / Generic sounds and music. The sound chip they decided to put in this thing (from the limited stuff I heard)... seems to be very Generic and Bad sounding. Midi capability doesnt make it any better. (Good "Mod" files, always sounded infinitely better than generic Midi) One of the strongest and most unique features of the C64, was its Synth chip. It lacked some capabilities.. but overall, it gave the system a very unique sound experience, compared to anything else of the Era (and often, well beyond it). IMO... they should have chosen a far more Capable FM synth chip... Something in line with the Chip that was used in Marble Madness (arcade), the Yamaha DX7, or maybe reuse the Sega Genesis sound chip. Nothing beats good FM Synth sounds. And as Ive said... nothing Ruins a good experience, like Bad Midi Generica. Also... Sound effects are another issue for an 8bit system. If you are relying on audio "Samples", you will tend to quickly run out of data space. Where as, if you have a great Synth... you can create an Algorithm for the effect, that takes up almost no data space at all... AND... sounds 1000x better than a highly compressed audio sample.
@@GavinPetty I think he's talking about 2 things: 1 is composing. It is almost hardware irrelevant. People wrote great music with 2 square waves and a triangle wave on the NES. 2 is flexibility to enable that creativity. It's not just more channels or better instruments, it's more control and effects. The VERA has 16 channels of PSG, but none of that includes a envelope or LFO. The Yamaha chip is better, but currently people don't seem to utilize the more advanced features.
Developing software for the X16 is the world's most time-wasting, counterproductive hobby, _within_ the world's most time-wasting, counterproductive hobby: a cage within a cage.
All channels have to start from somewhere, but thanks for bringing some attention to our channel and this video of the presentation at the show. It was a great presentation to experience in person.
Thank you for this update. Much appreciated.
I'm very impressed with the project's progress myself so far. Not only is hardware design in itself a total bitch and a half to pull off successfully, manufacturing it is a whole other debacle on top of that. And I think they're doing a great job all things considered, and they've kept it mostly 100% on track as-designed and didn't end up as some hackey half-baked product. Dave has discussed his disappointment with the sound chip he was forced to use (watch his video on that, the chip they ended up with is not what they originally intended because they couldn't reliably source the original YM chip he had in mind - but it works, they made it work well). Im impressed with to be honest
The funny thing is that the ESP32 "WiFi card" is FAR more powerful than the entire rest of the system :)
Kind of the way it is for anything able to run a modern networking stack
I haven't checked the exact model of the ESP32 used on the card. But I think it doesn't have 2MB of RAM. Otherwise it can probably run the entire system (excluding the VERA) in emulation.
@@andyhu9542 No they're a Harvard architecture, so use 4MB to 16MB of Flash + 520KB RAM. So it's essentially more than 2MB of RAM if referring to the amount of space for code, but less if you have little code and a huge amount of data (unusual, unless doing some extreme number crunching - probably not something you'd do on an 8-bit CPU :) ) You can actually emulate an old DOS+Windows 3.0 PC on the ESP32 :)
OtterX is also available pre-assembled for an additional cost, if you contact the creator Joe Burks/Wavicle
I just confirmed with Joe that it is still true. You need to buy from Tindie, not Vector Head Arcade as shown in the video.
This is a great summary. You should consider doing more "news" videos from time to time. :)
I was present for the presentation and the midi board is the thing I was the most excited about.
I thought David said before that a “gen2” would just be a cost-reduced version…no added features.
Yes. That's what the gen2 is referring to. It even has some of the features cut from it. However, for most people the price is the biggest issue with the current generation. So a cost-reduced X16 does make sense.
C64 Studio also has some X16 sprite support
It's such an amazing project. I wish I knew it earlier.
I would like to know when the software for the SMC hardware is going to be updated. Currently, it is stuck at v45.1 while the VERA and BIOS are at v47. The emulator is at 47 for everything.
THANK YOU for this video. Very informaive.
I'm a fan of pushing original hardware to new heights but not really big on the x16 or any modern 8-bit arms race. The 80's nerd in me still loves the content and following it's progress.
How do you feel about the SuperCPU module for the C64? It is a properly old device but runs at 20MHz and has 16MB of RAM space.
Love to see a new video from you
The 2nd gen unit would seem to be suitable only for those that want to run games (i.e., boring. The current X16 is far more suitable for actual retro computing enthusiast
Well one can argue that most of today's retro computer/console enthusiasts are gamers. These people will bring in the critical money flow to sustain the project.
Someone makes an adapter PC board that will allow you to plug an 65c816 into a 65c02 socket.
That's great. I want to try it someday.
If someone developed an ASIC for the Game Gear I'd be more interested: everyone would be better off creating (new) 8-bit systems that have backward compatibility, even if you want to facilitate new software that takes advantage of some better capabilities (higher resolution or something) without "breaking" the 8-bit aesthetic.
A pi pico USB card is doable. I thinks its more Dave not knowing what is possible.
Well, I think Zeal8bit computer (based on real Z80 CPU) has done a better work. It is not so expensive, with a active community!
Second Gen? Are they trying to Osborne themselves? JK!
He's detailed the "Elon strategy" before in previous videos. Make the big expensive board for early adopters and software makers, then gradually move down to a tiny FPGA\emulator for mass adoption.
@@JimmyCougar That's right I forgot about that.
And C128 themselves, too. Game devs WILL target the lowest common hardware.
80-90 era games is too old for you ;-)
Maybe not. Before I started playing Minecraft and stuff I spent a bunch of time playing SMB and Jackal on a Famiclone.
People can accept low quality graphics... so long as you have an Epic sound and music experience behind it. Nothing ruins an experience more, than Poor / Generic sounds and music. The sound chip they decided to put in this thing (from the limited stuff I heard)... seems to be very Generic and Bad sounding. Midi capability doesnt make it any better. (Good "Mod" files, always sounded infinitely better than generic Midi) One of the strongest and most unique features of the C64, was its Synth chip. It lacked some capabilities.. but overall, it gave the system a very unique sound experience, compared to anything else of the Era (and often, well beyond it). IMO... they should have chosen a far more Capable FM synth chip... Something in line with the Chip that was used in Marble Madness (arcade), the Yamaha DX7, or maybe reuse the Sega Genesis sound chip. Nothing beats good FM Synth sounds. And as Ive said... nothing Ruins a good experience, like Bad Midi Generica.
Also... Sound effects are another issue for an 8bit system. If you are relying on audio "Samples", you will tend to quickly run out of data space. Where as, if you have a great Synth... you can create an Algorithm for the effect, that takes up almost no data space at all... AND... sounds 1000x better than a highly compressed audio sample.
The X16 literally uses the exact same sound chip as the Marble Madness arcade board...
@@GavinPetty I think he's talking about 2 things: 1 is composing. It is almost hardware irrelevant. People wrote great music with 2 square waves and a triangle wave on the NES. 2 is flexibility to enable that creativity. It's not just more channels or better instruments, it's more control and effects. The VERA has 16 channels of PSG, but none of that includes a envelope or LFO. The Yamaha chip is better, but currently people don't seem to utilize the more advanced features.
Developing software for the X16 is the world's most time-wasting, counterproductive hobby, _within_ the world's most time-wasting, counterproductive hobby: a cage within a cage.
No mention of the Second Reality scene demo port on the X16?? *sadface* Google "second reality x16 youtube"