Carlo Rovelli on white holes and the need for a ‘reasonable compromise’ in the Israel-Palestine war
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- Опубліковано 11 чер 2024
- Carlo Rovelli has devoted large parts of his life to explaining to the general public what appears on the surface to be the unexplainable - and his bestselling science books saw him dubbed 'the poet of modern physics’.
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But the quantum gravity researcher is as comfortable discussing his own work on black holes, as he is talking about recent politics such as the Israel-Palestine conflict, on the grounds that, like in scientific research, every issue has different facets and cooperation is key to finding a solution.
Today on Ways to Change the World, Carlo Rovelli tells Krishnan Guru-Murthy about his search for ‘white holes’ and how science can bridge different global narratives in the geopolitical arena.
Produced by Silvia Maresca.
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You can tell that someone is, dare I say, enlightened, when they will be the first person to admit that they have limits and that very likely other people know more than they. The more intelligent and well informed someone is, the more they realize how little they know. Rovelli seems to embody this.
How refreshing it is to hear that kind of humility in a world filled with talking heads claiming to be an expert in different things by way of clout chasing and inserting themselves into every issue simply because they want the recognition.
He’s also a quantum gravity researcher and by no means an expert in the matter of this conflict or conflicts in general.
@@calisti9308sometimes it just takes common sense and honesty . Problem is, Missy politicians lack both especially the second
False idol.
@@lucasamtab True, true.
This is brilliant. What an inspiring man. I think we need everyone on the planet to think like scientists! Especially in these hard times in terms of polarisation, misinformation and disinformation! I'm hopeful we'll have some star trek style federation one day! Hopefully, the sciences can keep helping us all get along better!
like THIS scientist
Stop idolising false idols.
the sciences also invented chemical, nuclear and biological weapons - the harbingers of destruction in the early 1900s, as carlo would no doubt be able to recount whilst he's retelling everyone the events leading up to the great war. indeed, many of the biggest challenges facing humanity, now and in the future, are posed by science and technology proceeding without a proper ethical or legalistic framework. i'm talking about AI, crispr cas-9 in biotech, and the ever-spiralling arms race. scientists need an ethical framework. in short: we need philosophy!
A profound perspective on where we are today, including many timeless aspects of life.
Phenomenal thinker and human being! Thank you for this interview. We need these great, interdisciplinary and multidimensional people as our teachers in this world, especially those who encourage us to remember that in every situation, one can trust, but also, there may still be something the greatest specialist at this point in time now doesn’t know. Therefore, keep an open mind.The biographical details were insightful as to his philosophy. I will be sharing this interview. Indeed, Carlo Rovelli is the “Poet of Modern Physics”.
Down with technocracy.
I normally would say I have a big view of life.. but this particular interview/guest has given me a bigger view to life and events. Thank you Channel 4
This channel is the only good thing i took from the situation in mid east. So good level of journalism, amazing.
Great guy - pleasure to listen to him. Balance and compromise though - a wonderful ideal but can't say there's too much hope of that at the moment.
Loved your White book!… an easy read that took me much further than I thought myself capable of.
great content - great learning - thank you
Thank you Krishnan - keep dancing but please don’t give up the day job coz we need you. Xx 👍😊
Very good points.
We are at another crossroads as a planet with potential nuclear annihilation & there doesn’t seem to be energy grown ups in positions of power. 😢
Nuclear Annihilation?? From who?? Russia?? 😂
@@TheAArmstrong Who ever feels it is their only choice either for ego, religious death cult thinking. It’s not who starts 😞
@@wendyhandy9065 I think you’re being a tad hysterical
@wendyhandy9065
I agree, Wendy. Nuclear weapons proliferation is a serious problem, esp. combined with political and religious extremism and the ease with which misinformation travels around the world...
@@aninewforest'This message was brought to you by the WEF'.
Interesting choice of speaker, as a physicist myself I feel like suggesting channel 4 to aim to interview Edward Witten (@witten271) as well: arguably the most influential theoretical physicist alive, who also has been quite active in promoting the two-state solution.
Arguably the compromise must come first with the idea the area is to be shared. Not Israel dismantled because that is not happening- ever
Israel and netenyahu will unravel themselves as all they do is hate and lie, Israel is doing the work of evil in this world and calling it the work of GOD woe to them
Why?
So, basically how it was before Israel was created? ✌️
Ofc but Israel has idefinitely occupied even the much shrunken areas allotted to the Palestinians with their ever encroaching settlements and apartheid rule in the recognized Palestinian areas. They've denied the Palestinians basic human dignity, freedom, opportunity to live normal prosperous lives, freedom of movement (even within the West Bank), and statehood! This is in Fatah controlled West Bank, not Gaza. Truth is there hasnt been a voice for compromise in Israeli leadership for 20 years. If there was a good faith effort such as those put forth by Yitzhak Rabin and Ehud Barak it would empower moderate Palestinians too
@@globalist1990 dream on
They say actions speaks louder than words and that every action has a reaction -- Israel has shown to have peace agreements for over 40 tears with Egypt and Jordan and now with more Arab countries these Palestinians DO NOT want peace
You have to go beyond the narrative mentioned that is the superficial narrative. Why did Egypt sign with Israel? Part of it was because Kissinger pushed Israel to sign to remove the largest Arab army out of the equation. Sadat didn't even want a war, he wanted a peace deal without a war, but Golda Meir was NOT INTERESTED in talking to him. Even New Israeli historians discuss it. I believe one such author was Yossi Melman.
The Palestinian issue is very different from making peace with Egypt. The Egyptians have the largest Arab army and did damage to Israel. That's the real reason why Israel made peace with Egypt. The Palestinians do not have a large army, and the Israelis consider that the lands are somehow Biblically theirs including the atheist founders like Herzl and Ben Gurion.
The peace with Egypt was giving up Sinai or all of Egypt's territory. The Palestinians asked for East Jerusalem, the West Bank and Gaza. Sadat actually asked Menachem Begin about peace for the Palestinians, autonomy. Begin said no way, and instead he launched war to fight the PLO which said they wanted the 1967 borders.
Also, you must keep in mind that Israel's governments are more unstable than Italy's governments speaking of Italians. Bcause of the Right in Israel trying to sabotage peace efforts, including the assassination of Rabin, Sharon not giving Arafat and Barak more time (on purpose) time to negotiate a final deal plus Hamas, it was hard to negotiate the last few details. Peace is not simply the Palestinians having to say yes at whatever the other side offers. The two sides have to negotiate until they're both at least satisfied. They almost reached that with Taba with Barak and Olmert almost had a deal, with Abbas, but Olmert's government didn't last long enough. Olmert did not blame Abbas. He said they were both close to a deal but the circumstances didn't work.
Also, Barak and Arafat were BOTH at fault for peace not working. Barak was spending too much chasing after an agreement with Syria without offering all the Golan, which Syria expected based on what things Rabin said. Barak wanted to keep some of it. Finally, Barak decided he had enough and came very late to negotiate quickly with Arafat, and Arafat was suspicious as Barak had ignored him for a while and hadn't withdrawn from some territory according to Oslo, so Arafat didn't respond quickly enough. Camp David was Barak trying to get as much as possible, which is understandable, and Arafat should have responded quicker just as Barak should have talked to Arafat quicker, so fault on both sides. Sharon,, anyway, sunk Barak's government, so they never got to get to an agreement.
That's an incredibly simplistic take. Which ignores a whole lot of pertinent information.
He expreses an uncomfortable truth about the declining influence of the West. I disagree with the implication that the world will therefore become more peaceful and equitable. There will simply be new powers, new conquerors, new oppressors--and new opportunities, I suppose.
His ideas about compromise instead of victory sound reasonable, until one realizes he probably wants that for Ukraine as well. This would mean rewarding and encouraging Russian incursions into sovereign territory. So unfortunately in practice his ideas will likely lead to further conflict and suffering.
I see your approach and my pessimistic side agrees with you but, for the little bit of optimism I have left, I would like to believe that Humanity could achieve that commitment to peace.
The future is not written...it depends on us
Yeah, is always horrible naive when people think that if Big Daddy USA disappears, the others Big Daddies (using his terminology)of the world are not going to take its place. Yes, people want a cease fire and compromise, but the problem is that we are dealing with malicious actors in both conflicts (even if their complexities are way different) that have made clear they are also far from being rational agents. In Palestine/Israel conflict, we have a terrorist organization vs a shitty government, neither wants compromise.
@@RafaelRamirez-bg7qvAnd you want it, the commitment? ... Because I do ... If the People realized the power they have, there would be no kings or dictators
....because let's be honest and face what we and all remotely intelligent individuals know very well to really be the truth. What the "declining influence of the West" actually portends is that the world will become more barbaric, less equitable, far less subject to the rule of Law and immensely more brutal, violent and arbitrarily oppressive.
@@Antrunu I don’t trust you. I saw you comments and I see a shallow commitment and understanding. You already failed.
*insert GIF of Cat from Red Dwarf saying "What is it?"
only the Palestinians are compromising...
Lol what? How? they refused every peace plan, even the ones with ridiculous concessions from the Israelis... And Hamas is not compromising at all in this conflict, to the point where they have food and fuel and won't even give it to the population they claim to support... Israel has compromised many many times - it always backfires.
It is easy to be in for all the good against all evil, it is hard to suggest realistic solutions that will work.
This scientist of physics should check the democracy index of the Economic by countries
Yasss 🎉
I thought blackholes become open-ended wormholes that tear down the fabric in distant places of the galaxies...maybe the whiteholes could be the way the opposite end of the blackhole appears...
Carlo Rovelli's musings about politics might be of some interest if he wasn't totally confused about his own research area, physics. Einstein explained why objects with event horizons can NEVER form back in 1939 with a cast iron mathematical argument. And, guess what, his theory of gravitation hasn't changed one bit since then, and mathematical proofs are valid forever.
Guess what quantum theory 🫨
24:22 powerful end statement, all be warned.
In Italy, he signed a political document for an initiative whose participants include representatives of terrorist organizations Hamas and Hezbollah (Evidence of that is available on X and Italian press/journalists and websites). He could not deny it when proven by the facts. Totally disqualified and demonstrated to be in bad faith.
I'm sorry but I think you haven't understood anything
Did he try to deny it? It seems to be consistent with what he's saying here.
@@ChrisAlbertH47 He cannot deny it because of the evidence. He could apologize for being mistaken. But he did not. My point is simple: I evaluate people by their actions not just by their words. Reliability and trust must be gained by being consistent. Sometimes the truth is unpleasant but we need to face the reality that false coins are being disseminated
@@lucatentellini5136 Then as I said, it seems consistent with what he's been saying that everyone should have a part in the conversation. He mentioned about the choice of wanting "victory" or "compromise". You can't reach compromise unless everyone is on the table, including your enemies.
Far as I'm concerned, he was being consistent and has nothing to apologize for.
So many people have initiatives with participants connected to Israel. Israel is a Zionist state. As early as 1895, or when Hitler was 6 years old, Herzl born in Austria like him said the people in Palestine - the Muslims and Christians should be ethnic cleansed. Having some participants from this or that doesn't disqualify unless you say both would. Also, how do you think the IRA and the Protestants made peace? You think only group should be included. Anyway, there was no Hezbollah until Israel's invasion of Lebanon. Israel has to have a just peace with the Palestinians instead of trying to wish them away. It doesn't work.
It's not the people, it's the governments. Arab and israelis live mostly peacefully together, also most Palestinian workers from gaza working here in israel are not terrorists, but both our government and hamas for sure, all have their own agenda of power and money
Hardly any HAMAS have been killed, only 15 IDF soldiers, but 9,000 civilians have died who cannot defend themselves 😢 5:25
Colateral damage...
I could be mistaken but I believe Hamas includes their own deaths in civilian deaths which means we don't actually know how many Hamas have been killed. Feel free to correct me if you saw something disproving that.
@conniedean3787
The death toll is likely higher than what's been reported, considering all the bodies still under the rubble.
Carlo seems like a nice guy, educated and probably very rich but somewhat out of touch with reality when it comes to the Israel Palestine conflict.
West in minority in UN?) The voting on the Russian envasion proved the opposite
He is wrong, right out of the gate.
on what? Are you a physicist?
But you, a random on the internet, know the truth, and have appointed yourself arbiter of same? OK.
Christ ones comment get deleted if they are pro palestine!
Common) Not “Russian put nucks in Cuba”, go to an elementary school please
To biased 😢
This man needs to be allowed to do psychedelics for the good of science.
I imagine he already has.
Krishnan Pedo-Murthy
Pure sophistry.
Pure arrogance.
So naive to talk about reason, when religion is the main reason for the whole conflict. The Palestinians are much more religious and irrational than the Israelis. They have to become more secular!
Why is he speaking so derogatively about jewish vaginas.
Great physicist. But when talking about politics and human affairs he is well meaning, but naive as if still a16-year-old. Or perhaps even younger.
Naive, bordering on complicit. Stick to physics Carlo.
BAD ENGLISH... 😂😂😂
What a wise person
Japanese gardens have as many stones as the number that represents completion in Zen Buddhism, 15, but from any one perspective only one perspective can be seen!
What a wise person
Japanese gardens have as many stones as the number that represents completion in Zen Buddhism, 15, but from any one perspective only one perspective can be seen!
What a wise person