Who's right? Baptized in the Holy Spirit at salvation or afterward?

[@bornagaingg6223]

You should upload more on here. Your lectures are brilliant

[@CraigKeenerPhD]

Thanks!

[@JD-xh3ex]

completely agree!

[@ChurchinnameofJESUSCHRIST]

@@CraigKeenerPhD what do I do to receive the holy ghost with power and tongues signs wonders

[@barrycharlesbrebner]

you must be born again by grace through faith in Jesus. This is the moment that Jesus baptizes you in the Holy Spirit that you receive the Holy Spirit. ❤

[@barrycharlesbrebner]

"But we have all been baptized into one body by one Spirit, and we all share the same Spirit." 1st corinthians 12:13 ❤
In other words we become members of the body of Christ when we are baptized by Jesus in the Holy Spirit. This is when we recieve the Holy Spirit that we share. Read the scripture.

[@barrycharlesbrebner]

Baptism in Fire is for refining, purifying.

[@hetzbarrur68]

The confusion that Dr. Keener attempts to address arises largely from a misleading interpretation of the term "conversion." Dr. Keener's slide at about 00:42 sec asks flawed questions: the first is whether or not the experience of being "baptized with the Holy Spirit" (this should not be understood as "baptized 'in' the Holy Spirit") occurs "at conversion" or "after conversion." Since Dr. Keener has not defined "conversion" then controversy will continue to abound.
I've just searched my Accordance software for "conversion" in modern English translations of the NT and in the various English versions I have, it only appears in Acts 15:3 -- the "conversion" of the Nations - but nowhere else in the NT. Surely in this context of Acts 15:3 the term "conversion" is used broadly, to intend the full reception of all New Covenant blessings available, including all the descriptive aspects of the invasive-indwelling, palpable reception of the Holy Spirit. That would mean that "conversion" would include being baptized with the Holy Spirit, whether that occurred as an instantaneous experience or whether the process extended over minutes, hours or even some days, as we read in Acts.
Beyond that, the word "conversion" is evidently derived from Latin, and it was used to translate the Greek word ἐπιστροφή, while "convert" was used to translate the word επιστρεφω, even though both of those Greek words have to do with "turning back" or "returning." Then Dr. Keener subtitles his video with "at salvation or afterward" implying that "salvation" has been carefully defined, when, IMHO, it has not been defined properly either. The Greek word for "salvation" also means "healed," or "made whole."
So, IMHO, "conversion" and "salvation" includes all New Covenant blessings, including the palpable, powerful invasive-indwelling experience being baptized with the Holy Spirit, whether that takes a minute, an hour, or a few days. That means both the typical "subsequence" teaching of many Pentecostal churches is flawed, as well as the Cessationist idea of unwittingly receiving the fullness of the Holy Spirit even though the person has no awareness of an invasive-indwelling presence of the Almighty Holy Spirit.
Finally, the extended sense of "baptizein" in many passages in the NT is for "purification" not merely inert engulfment in water. So, in Acts 1:5 Yeshua repeats the contrast introduced by Yohanan son of Zechariah, that Yohanan "purifies" with water, but the Coming One will "PURIFY" with the "HOLY" Spirit. Since Christian Civilization eschews "Judaism," there has been a major deficiency in understanding that Acts 1:5 basically means that even though Yohanan's water purification for Israel was the most outstanding washing for Israel, to enter the Kingdom, it is supremely surpassed by the greatest PURIFICATION of humanity, transforming fallen sinners into the image of the crucified and risen, Holy and Pure Messiah. That realization, finally, was the lightbulb clicking on for Peter in Acts 11:16, that the gentiles of Cornelius's house did not need water purification, since they'd already received the transformative, everlasting purification of their hearts through the Holy Spirit (compare Acts 15:9).
Best wishes.

[@showtime5372]

congratulations on 2000 subscribers!

[@randaldavid7685]

Craig, I love your videos. I do however somewhat disagree about the concept of baptism in fire. Many, such as myself believe in progression into Christlikeness. We believe that God does baptize us in fire, a refining fire. The old testament refers to being refined like silver, I welcome the fire of the Holy Spirit purging and burning up the dross in my life.

[@tomtemple69]

quick question: is it right to say Jesus comes back to save and to condemn in His second coming?

[@barrycharlesbrebner]

That is correct baptism in fire is purifying and refining! ❤ And there is maybe even more words can be used to describe it.

[@tomtemple69]

@@barrycharlesbrebner where in the old testament does it say baptism of fire is like refining silver? fire is almost always a sign of judgement...

[@tomtemple69]

where in the old testament does it say that?

[@barrycharlesbrebner]

@@tomtemple69 take note of what John said: “I baptize with water those who repent of their sins and turn to God. But someone is coming soon who is greater than I am-so much greater that I’m not worthy even to be his slave and carry his sandals. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire."
Notice he said: He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire. He did not say, Jesus will baptize some with the Holy Spirit and others with fire.
He said, He will baptize you with...
Who? you.
A side note: Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego were immersed in fire extremely hot and the Lord was with them. i mention this to you because this came to mind as being meaningful. i hope this will be of help to bring about some clarity for you. ❤in Jesus name Amen

[@Noteworthy2024]

Umm why you don’t have more followers is beyond me!

[@HopeDesigns]

Amen! Luke's narrative certainly supports diversity 😊

[@CraigKeenerPhD]

🙂

[@MarkGreaves007]

So if we havent experienced the Holy Spirit in this way, similar to your experience, then what are we doing wrong?

[@barrycharlesbrebner]

Jesus said you must be born again...this is an act of God by grace through faith in Jesus. This is when Jesus baptizes in Holy Spirit and Fire. If and when this happens you will receive the Holy Spirit. Maybe you have already i do not know, but God knows. ❤ i hope this us helpful to you.

[@stevecampanelli6009]

You have very little understanding of the holy ghost many of us have had Jesus come to us had visions before ever speaking in tougues etc ​@@barrycharlesbrebner

[@stevecampanelli6009]

​@@barrycharlesbrebnerthere's different levels of annoiting of the spirit within the soul

[@barrycharlesbrebner]

​@@stevecampanelli6009 the anointing is of the Holy Spirit, and if a person is anointed by the Holy Spirit, that is all that is needed for the Holy Spirit to do what it does. "levels" of the Holy Spirit sounds to me like a made up thing. God knows, so what the truth is, that is what i want to believe and be in agreement with: not with any false thing.❤Does it say in the Bible that there are levels of the Holy Spirit?

[@showtime5372]

not alot of people get that,especially in our pentecost circle,that the fire part of the baptism is not a good thing or for believers yet they claim the fire as empowerment lol...

[@SlavicUA]

Hi Craig! What do you think of David Pawson's book The Normal Christian Birth? If you haven't read it, would you please read it and give us a short video on what you think about it?

[@gregbooth123]

How come Larry King is baptizing that lady? I thought he was Jewish...