Drone Laying Queen-Unexpected Surprise
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- Опубліковано 16 жов 2024
- Folks, it's quite slow here in the bee yard, so I finally have time to get out and fix a few issues I'm seeing in a couple of hives. Come on out to the yard with me and let's see about a drone laying queen that I found a while back and let's check on a hive to see if they are finding any nectar. Hope you all enjoy the trip.
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Thanks for joining me in my bee yard here in Louisiana as I share how I maintain my beehives. My videos are not meant to be 'How To' videos, but simply me sharing my experiences in beekeeping as I learned it from my mentors, teachers, and studies.
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Thanks for the video.😊
You're welcome and thanks for watching!!
Roll with the punches Mike!!! Thanks!!
Yes indeed Rodney!!
Been watching you on youtube for years now and i have to say you always keep it real even the bad stuff like the freeze out you guys had hurting your nectar flow this year.All the hard work and mother nature decides to frown on you guys this year.I reckon ive been disappointed more times than not with my bees but you inspire me to keep on chugging along.As always Thank You Mike for doing what you do.
I appreciate that comment for sure. Thanks so much! Yep, keep on plugging along. It's day by day and season by season. Thanks so much for your support over the years!!
You just never know. I have rarely seen double queen colonies and for them to be in what has been a drone laying colony is something new for sure. What a strange year. Thanks for the shout out my friend.
Always welcome Bruce! Yes, this was something different yet again...LOL!!
I think you will find they were in the middle of replacing the old queen. They just hadn't axed her yet. So whichever half of your split has the old queen, I think they will make a new one. It is always fun to experiment and just see what will happen. Keep us updated.
Very well could be the case done the first queen looked so young. I’ll let everyone know what I find. Thanks for the comment.
the first one was a young Queen. I think you did the right thing making those nucs, that is the only way you will ever find out which one is the drone layer.
Thanks, I hope to look at them really soon.
A drone layer with two queens. Definitely a weird situation. Looks like a good plan to figure it out. I hope you get a good late flow. Enjoyed the video Mike. Take care.
Thanks Garry and I hope we get more than this initial flow. Only time will tell, but in the end, it's all good. Thanks as always for your continued support my friend!!
Thanks for video Mike! I had a hive that upon the first inspection after winter I found 2 queens, made a split with the one queen into a homemade long hive I have, within a month they were in the process of requeening the one I made the split with... They have ways of keeping things interesting!
You're welcome and thanks for watching!! Yes indeed, they can keep us running to and fro with their antics!!
You sort of explained what I was questioning about why the Bees have been backfilling the brood chamber.
Ed, I believe that is the case. Once the flow gets beyond consumption and becomes surplus, if they have space, they'll send it up to the supers. But with needing it for consumption and brood, if it's just a light flow, they keep it close, just like pollen.
Me and my wife decided to get in bees this spring. So far we have 4 swarms in our be yard in hives and have two swarm traps that have bees we have to retrieve this week after I make some more frames. Here in Arkansas it seems like we are having a good nectar flow we had to add a second med box on two of our hives. Thanks for all your how to advice. When we have a question we look at some of your videos till we figure it out. Thanks again look forward to seeing your next video.
I am so glad you enjoy the videos!! Thanks for the comment and hope your adventure goes well for you!! I know SE Missouri was having a good flow, so maybe its in that entre tri-state area.
Two and a half weeks ago I went down to Fourchon, got on a helicopter and went to work for two weeks. The day before I left, I checked my hives (all two deeps with no supers because of the lack of forage) and there was a good balance of nectar and brood. I got back home and opened them up this Wednesday and they were both jam packed with capped honey with virtually no where for the queen to lay. I was dumbfounded because there’s basically nothing in bloom around here except for tiny flowers that I never see them messing with. My point is this: hang in there because they can always throw you a curveball when you least expect it. I’m not too terribly far from you; I’m located just east of Mobile.
I think we saw a similar spurt, but not to that extent. Glad you guys filled some frames. I am holding off on any harvest and will be looking back at them soon to see if things are picking up any. Thanks so much for the encouraging comment!! Means a lot!
Great video Mike. Amazing how our plans can change once we open up a box? Beekeepers definitely have to be flexible and have a big "toolbox" to try and figure these bugs out. Still hoping for a good flow down your way!!!! Take care.
Thanks Keith!! Very exciting to see you guys rocking and rolling on the honey up there. SO happy for your great harvest so far. Keep the videos and the shorts coming!!
That was a surprise seeing 2 queens.
Surprised me for sure!!
Rockin out a bit Mike! \m/
Just a bit...LOL!!! Thanks for watching!
My guess is the flighty queen is the good one. Old worn out queens just waddle around. LOL Keep us informed if you get time Mike. Our Locust trees are blooming now and the bees seem to be on a good flow. Maybe I'll have to bring two jars of honey this winter to HL for you. Take care. Did you get a chance to make some creamed honey?
Mu thoughts too Russell. That bigger queen was slow and older. Her one wing was also damaged. I have not made the creamed honey yet. I have some more to sell of what I have and this week after a roof replacement, my truck bit the dust and I lost the motor to a Ford fluke. So I been working and problem solving and have put bees and honey on the back burner. The lack of flow has allowed me to have some time to get these other things done, so there's the silver lining in the 'low-flow' situation...LOL!
It makes for an interesting video if your day doesn’t go as planned haha! Thanks Mike
You got that right!
As a backyard BeeKeeper, I can't wait to see which Queen is the "Good" one. I'd love to follow something like that in my yard.
Yes, me too! I hope to look back at them in another week or so to give them a whole cycle. Thanks for watching!
Ha Mike good video so sorry for the flow Virginia is not so good either and I am having a lot of queen issues as well I hope you have a blessed day.
Thanks and sure hope you guys begin to see a good season. You have a blessed day as well!!
My guess is they are mother and daughter. The hive superseded the failing Queen. I would put them both back in the hive and let them do what they need to do. The bees know which Queen is good.
It's definitely a supersedure, but one original is definitely a drone layer, so I'd rather do the dispatch so there's no chance of an issue with going queenless this late in the summer. I know they most likely would sort it out, and I am showing how queens accepted will take care of competition in the next video, but in this case, it won't hurt to find out who is the culprit. I think I know, but they will probably pull a fast one on me just to humble me...LOL!! Thanks for watching and for the comment..
Put one in each box. Then put queen excluder between them and come back to check.
Either way works fine. I like the separate hives so there’s less lifting when I go back to check.
That was crazy
Yes indeed. They sprung a new one on me!!
@Mike Barry just when you have everything figured out...God laughs 😃
Thanks Mike, I’m curious to see which one is which, If I had to guess I’d say the old queen is the drone layer, but that’s just a guess. God Bless !
I agree, I think it's surely the old one. Thanks for the support!
They sure keep us guessing dont they? Interested in seeing what happens
Indeed they do Melvin!!
I hope you get the chance to film a follow up to this experiment.
I'm going to do my best for sure. Thanks for watching!!
Always something new in beekeeping keeping us on our toes. Thanks for the update Mike.
Yes indeed they do and My pleasure!!
Nice opening tunes, you ever listen to Chris Duarte? He's happening on the guitar! And things are happening here in central NH. I hived my first swarm day before yesterday, Wow, very exciting! And yesterday my friend ask me about a 'cup' and a ' queen cell', to which I asked, 'Peanuts or acorn caps?' He says 'peanuts'. We did a split today, Bees are happening! Thanks for sharing, take care
Thanks Brice and good to hear you guys are ripping and roaring up your way!!
@@MikeBarryBees OK, I'm bushed. I was painting nuc boxes this morning and putting bees in them this afternoon. Man, these bees have got me dragging ass...pardon the language. I got more bees now!
Making splits with swarm cells. I hope I broke them down enough...I've doubled my colonies, provided the queens mate successfully. that should be enough for this year. 3 more hives to go. maybe in 2 weeks they will be strong enough to swarm...wow, talk about hijacking my free time. Incredible bugs in a box. Thanks for sharing, I don't know how you guys find the time to share all you do. I hope your summer smooths out, peace and love, Take care
Hi Mike. Sometimes a queen can have a blocked tube inside so she can't fertilise eggs like she should be so those turn into drones, of course. This is different than a typical "drone layer" because she can lay some workers and some drones but not as she normally would be expected to.
Funny you have two queens. Two boxes then I guess. Will the real queen please step forward?
Hmm, I didn't think about that. I knew there could be some mixed brood, but I always thought that it automatically was done once she started laying only drones. I need to pay close attention in that case. Thanks for sharing that with me!!
@@MikeBarryBees I had a Kona do that straight out of the cage. $45 down the drain!
Good video Mike. I checked supers yesterdat that I put on 4/21 and they were untouched. The super below them were full. I'm in NE SC. That freeze really messed things up.
Thanks and hope you start seeing something more in the supers. At least the bottom supers are full. It's a problem everywhere in the SE.
Skinny Beeman showed me a trick for drone layers. Involves switching the colony to another place where field bees from a different colony are coming in to the drone layer box. The field bees will kill the drone layer in a couple of days. Then switch back & requeen.
That's an interesting tactic. Never heard of that. I like Joe pretty well. I'm currently trying another one of his tricks with pollen frames.
@@MikeBarryBees l tried it once & it worked that time. LTBL(Let there be light).
I would try to find Joe's you tube video on this tactic. I watched it years ago.
Location, location, location. Here in Central New York, it was warm early, and I was seeing nectar flow before the dandelions. Blackberries were starting to leaf out, and then a frost took them back to ground level. Now it's been dry for several weeks everything is blooming but not a lot of nectar flow.
Yes indeed. Location can be different even 10 miles apart. Rain, cold, heat, etc. affect it in so many ways and then throw in locations....whew, you just never know. Thanks for watching!!
I'll be interested to see what those two queens do in the two different boxes. Makes you wonder if just separating them will cure the issue. It might even be a natural thing that happens that we just don't understand. I hope you keep us up on the outcome, thanks for the video.
I am due to look at them in a few days. Just had some crazy weather every day after work. Curious to see how it goes.
I would have done a Queen excluder but same difference. That way they are used to both and you can easily recombine. Pretty crazy
Yea, that is a good idea too. I guess either way will give me a result, but excluder might've been easier once I figure who is who. Thanks for the comment.
@@MikeBarryBees thanks for the entertainment! Bees do what they want
It's another man that has them bee Castle boxes he bought 9 Queens and only two of them was laying. After 21 days
Yup, that is Bug Farmer, ua-cam.com/video/1PrfHMc_vDU/v-deo.html&ab_channel=BugFarmer
Yea, that was the Bug Farmer.
Hello Mike ya life just keeps throwing us a curve ball with every turn but if it did not we would think something was really really wrong so all we can do is just take one day at a time an deal with it as it comes. Just a note I have been watching Jake Moore out of Texas an it just happened he was talking about tallow the other day an he was saying he has a primary and a secondary flow . So if I understand him correctly there may still have some hope . I did not know if you guys ever get that down there or not . That was a good eye on seeing that other queen I probably would not have saw her after finding the first one because just not thinking about looking for one . Thanks for the update. THANKS
Yes it does, but we roll with it. I watch Jake too. He's got a great operation there with his dad doesn't he. I loved watching how they split their bees. His flow is just like ours, except he has one this year. We get those secondary blooms, but I've never seen them make a significant difference, but this season, what little they do throw our way, we all will take it. Thanks so much for always watching and supporting!!
Always a pleasure Mike to see you with your bees. I know it's frustrating with what you guys are having to face this year in Louisiana with bee keeping. This truly has been a very weird season for everyone. But Mike may God bless you this year with a load of honey but if not then I count it a blessing just to watch you with God little creations Mike. Thank you for your videos Mike truly a blessing. As always Mike may God bless you and keep up the amazing work.
Thanks so much for the kind comment Patrick and for sending the blessing!!
Bees will surprise heaps of bee keepers there would be so.e sort of a trickle of food for them could be low ground or could be top of tree canopy then if it warms up could find it get crazy again seen in my area that has been the go a few time's in my area.
I hope it picks up regardless of where they find it, but only time will tell. Thanks for watching!
@@MikeBarryBees cheers stay safe. Ps ever use that bee guardian entrance is it any good.
@@brettellis1837 Brett, I do not think, in my opinion, that it works. I have a beekeeing friend that did some trials on several entrances and restrictors, and honestly, the guardian did the worst of all of them. They get past those.
@@MikeBarryBees ok cheers for that still will get some and try the swiffer and goose neck guardian with Teflon cutting board 10mm one see if that works as well with round one's as well.
Would probably be best to give both queens a fresh frame of drawn comb (mark the frame) and then wait 10 days or so to see what type of brood cappings you get on those frames. Any other frames from the original hive might have eggs from one or the other or both queens.
That's a good point. I need to go in and check them and if I have any trouble identifying the brood, I will need to do that. I think the NUC has some good comb, but for the 10 frame, it's a lot of old drone cells.
I have a weird one for me. I have a 22 queen I pulled to a nuc cause they just keep trying to make more queen cells in the original hive so I left them with capped cells and moved her to a nuc. I checked the nuc a week later and I think I have her and a laying worker I saw cells with with 2 eggs in a single cell. I’m going to be checking it again to verify soon cause I just wasn’t sure what was up.
I wouldn't sweat two eggs in a cell here and there. Even though she's a 22 queen, they will still do that every now and again. But it shouldn't be too numerous or for too long. If you're still seeing it in a lot of cells, there's an issue. I would think it's her and not a LW doing it. Usually there is more than one LW, and also you will see multiple eggs in the cells and eggs stuck to the side-walls of the cells. And when I say multiple, like 5 to 10, eggs in each cell. Very unmistakable.
Why not put in a double screen board with one queen on top and one bottom and come back later to look at the cappings to determine which is the drone layer. Less shuffling equipment
That was an option as well, along with what others have mentioned, an excluder. Just happened to choose the NUC.
@@MikeBarryBees Understood. I was just checking or trying to learn if you had a reason not to use the DSB. As with a lot of beekeeping there are lots of ways to “skin the cat” and sometimes in the moment in the bee yard I do things that later I even ask myself…why didnt I do it another way that is simpler. Thanks for all you videos. Very helpful and practical.
@@jhulin9018 yessir, like you said, we look back and go, “why I didn’t try that?” 😁😁….if you would’ve been here with me and told me that, probably would’ve tried it. I also think after your comment and the excluder ideas, why didn’t I think of that😂😂😂. That’s what’s great about UA-cam and comments is I learn so much and I get a lot of great ideas from everyone.
I got a non bee keeping idea from todays video. My wife has been wanting a green house, after seeing the one behind you I am stealing that idea. Using hog panel fencing will be a lot easier that re purposing her old metal gazebo into one.
Yes, it's super easy and we love the little green house. I would suggest at least three panels though.
Load them up and come north and spend the summer near Lake Superior, better hurry though, berry flow is under way
I’m going to do everything you just said except load them up😁😁. Looking forward to my annual trip to the northshore. And might be cruising that WI coast too again.
@@MikeBarryBees WI is alright, but they all come north to the UP. Enjoy your time
@@TallPaul1288 the UP is in the plans based on passport renewal. Still waiting. Wanting to get to the north shore via Thunder Bay.
Had several drone laying queens this year... some were purchased queens who were poorly mated and others were early virgin queens from the apiary. With the apiary virgins the weather and timing didn't allow those virgins queens to go out and get mated in a timely fashion so they ended up drone layers. What a mess to clean up as all that freshly drawn WAX foundation comb was forever ruined as worker brood comb having been popcorned with drone brood. I could have saved those frames and used it as honey super comb but keeping track of that would be a pain so ended up melting it all down which was another time consuming mess. Never had this problem in ten years of beekeeping.
Wow! That's a big deal for sure. Now I see where your other comment came form on the actual comb and drones being laid.
Hey Mike, interesting seeing two queens in that colony, I’ve got a couple of drone laying queens myself that I need to deal with. Do you think it’s better to shake them out or try adding a frame of eggs?
To me it just depends on what your priorities are. Shaking them just lets them go join another colony on their own and is quick if you don’t want to search for the queen. But if you want to find the queen, it’s easy enough to pinch her and combine them. Or even put a cell in and let them start with a virgin. Drone layer colonies are easier to deal with than laying workers. So if you have the time and patience, you could pinch her and start them over.
Ok thanks I’ll see if I can find her
Split them into 2 hives. Set a frame of like day old eggs in each. chances are the drone layer they will kill off themselves and make a new Queen where as the good Queen they wont
Hey Matthew. Yea, that's another option too. I will see which gives me drone brood and pinch her myself and re-combine. Not like I'm really busy. Hope all is well, it's been a while.
@@MikeBarryBees Yes Sir, My health went to hell. A fight with Rona "No Hospital says" Then after that a mass weight lose due to cancer fight. Then my eye sight took a dive and i went blind. A doctor fixed that 2 weeks ago but again my weight is falling again so i go in for tests again this week. I have now lost 100lbs over the last 16 months without trying
About a month ago and all the virgins was hatching I forgot and left a queen rearing bar that would hold lights 30 cells and there was 13 that was hatching at the same time I found the main Queens then just waited to see what they would do
Yep, once they get to that point, let nature take it's course.
I would have separated them using a queen excluder and check in 10 days who is the drone layer
That is another approach as well. Two separate boxes is easier for me on that stand for now since I won't have to move one to check the bottom But when combining, the excluder idea would be easier. Either way seems good. Thanks for the comment.
Split it and put queen in each? Check in a week and squish the drone layer then recombine? Well, I jumped the gun and commented before you said what you were doing. 😂😂😂😂
Just jumping ahead there Lisa..LOL!!!
@@MikeBarryBees I’m good at that! 🤣🤣🤣 That dang ADHD of mine.
Not my business, would have just put an excluder in with on queen above one below. But, i think a nuc might be better idea
Yea, either way is a good way to do it. Excluder would be easier for re-combining, but two separate boxes is good for re-inspection so there's no lifting. Excluder didn't even cross my mind honestly, but its a good idea. Thanks for the comment.
Am I missing something A drone is a male honey bee. Unlike the female worker bee, that does have overlies and can turn into a laying worker bee if the hive is queenless for more than 3 weeks.
A “laying worker” can only produce drones as they don’t mate. A queen that only lays drones either means she didn’t get mated or there is a clog in the pipes.
I see you made the other comment, but just to add a quick note here. A colony will be queenless for much longer than three weeks before the workers begin to develop ovaries. A new queen in a lot of cases will not even start laying until the fourth week. So they will usually go at least 5 weeks before they become laying workers. not always, but in most cases I've had them queen less for quite a while. So I always wait 5 weeks after the bees build a cell before I consider the queen to have not gotten mated. Don't want to jump the gun if you run into a queenless situation. Thanks for watching and hope this and Michael's comment answered your question.
queen excluder between 2 boxes ,separate queens ?
That would’ve worked as well, but I wouldn’t have been able to separate the pheromones completely. But it would’ve worked, you’re right. I actually have a follow up coming out soon. Hope you’re able to check it out. Thanks for watching!!
That is too bad about your flow.
As far as not moving the honey into the supers, my thought is the hive doesn't have as many frames of brood and the hive is restricting the amount of brood to a manageable size. If there is nectar in the frame and the queen needs to lay she will drag her butt all around that area and the workers will then move the honey out of there. They wouldn't move capped honey but they'll move the nectar. Maybe I'm wrong??
Mid May I pulled out four frames of brood out of a hive and replaced them with drawn comb. They had been putting honey in the honey super. A week later all four frames were full of nectar with no brood and very little extra honey in the super. The next week most of the nectar was replaced with brood and they were back filling the super.
I have been taught and have heard that they move nectar, but I really think the issue in this case is similar to what we see end of February and into march. They have nectar to gather, but it's not a substantial amount Enough to stimulate, but not to make a crop off of. They keep it there and then either consume it or they do as you suggested and move it. It is there nearby to nurture the brood, make the bee bread, and consume. Just like stacking pollen around the nest and around the brood. Then if the flow picks up, they'll move it up as surplus if they are given space or space is already there. There needs to be a surplus for them to really begin to store it. That's why I tell new beekeepers down here to be very cautious just adding open space early in the spring thinking that will automatically keep them from swarming like the books say. The flow is so light, it doesn;t work most times.
ok I get it a queen that is not futile and laying drones only
Yes, that's correct. They get a bad mating flight or have insufficient eggs and they begin laying the drones. The colony is normally doomed.
Superseding gone wrong?
Could very well have been. Just not sure at this point, but that’s a good possibility.
I don't believed drone cannot egg He is male and only have male organ
It is a drone laying queen, not the drones laying the eggs. When she has a bad mating experience of a tube gets clogged, she can lay only drones.