One of the best conversations I’ve ever heard about the subject. And I have been to a significant amount of mental health training. As a newer cop, this is an issue I’ve been putting a lot of thought into lately with the increase we are seeing in mental health issues and I really appreciate your guys’ approach.
I'm completely blown away by this discussion. It begs the question: what is the solution? You did a great job highlighting your limitations as police. Scott gave a scenario where he empathizes, but leaves. I get it. But it still leaves the people with the crisis. So what's the solution? Where does the change come in? There's a mental health crisis in the US, I think we can all agree. But no one is taking responsibility for fixing it. Billy mentioned having a mental health team, with a social worker. I like that idea. But not a social worker. They are overworked, unqualified, etc. (Think about Josh Powell.) Maybe just ONE police dpt should implement a specialized mental health team that has the following: say 2 patrol officers (too many can agitate the patient) a psychologist and medic Let them work in conjunction to solve the problem. And see how that goes. If it works it can spread to other departments. It could even be a specialized team created by retired cops, if the department does not want the extra liability. But somewhere someone has to do something. What about tranquilizers? We use them in zoos right? If you have family on scene who can inform the shooter of existing conditions, then he can prepare a tranquilizer. No? Sleeping gas? There HAS to be a solution. I hope you talk about this topic again, not so much from a liability perspective, but from a human perspective. If you do, please see if you can get Dr Kirk Honda (from the Psychology in Seattle podcast) to guest star. He's talked about the US mental health crisis before and how many crimes could have been avoided if the people had just gotten the help they needed. About suicides. I believe Kirk has talked about this before - if a person is suicidal, they are also capable of murder and mass murder. Often spree killings and school shootings start with the person wanting to commit suicide. Then they decide, "if I go I'm going to make a statement". So to me, it's just bananas that cops might walk away from a potential suicide. That person can absolutely go and shoot up a school. But if you can get Dr Kirk in, I'm sure you guys could have an interesting discussion. I would love for law enforcement, the justice system and psychology to marry and create something better. This is a very important topic. Thanks for talking about it. I hope you'll talk about it again and maybe throw out some solutions.
I have seen the same thing happen around here in Pennsylvania. I noticed the biggest problem is a lot of the cops are not trying to be human. When dealing with the situation they continue to want to be a cop. Sometimes you have to bring yourself down to their level and talk to them as if their family And a good portion of the time they stop and listen I had one person ended up crying on my shoulder because I used my own personal situation as an example of what I deal with and he flat out said he’s never met someone in uniform that actually comes out and admits to dealing with personal issues they’re like the robots. I turned around I told the guy sometimes it’s better to admit that you’re human and not a guy wearing a badge that follows everything by the book. Sometimes you have to come down off your high horse and understand where they’re coming from.
I work for government assisted low income housing where I do investigations for criminal activity and fraud plus some security response (Former LEO). I deal with multiple calls for residents with mental issues. Often I try to get them assistance with mental health agencies, but sometimes it doesn't always help. Often I call for LE/EMS assistance because its unfair for the other residents that live in these complexes to have to continually deal with these people too. Low income housing has secretly become the new mental hospitals of the country. i worked overnight hospital security prior to LE and saw the effects of mental hospitals shutting down. There are no mental health teams welling to not be protected by LE and there are not funds to make this ideal a reality. So if LE agencies stop responding to this calls then assaults and maybe even murder will happen more often then suicide in my experience.
You also got to keep in mind no one wants to do work with mental health anymore because it’s doesn’t sustain a piece of income. There’s no money in the mental health aspect of a career so people are starting to walk away from it. I deal with PTSD and I’ve been through five different therapists dealing with PTSD. Because of them leaving the field because there is no money in that field.
Not sure if this is the same episode as the podcast regarding not responding to 5150 calls with possible suicidal subjects. I would be appalled if LEOs would stop responding to these calls. Being a survivor of multiple suicide attempts I desperately needed someone to intervene because doctors had me misdiagnosed for many years and the medications would make me suicidal. I’m now properly diagnosed and with weekly therapy I’m a lot better. My family is extremely grateful for all responding agencies who helped me by administering narcan or talking me out of following through with ending my life. I would hope and pray that all law enforcement agencies be trained in the approach of saving individuals trying to end their life when all they needed was help realizing they do matter and have a promising future. God bless and stay safe.
Thank you for including us in this important discussion. For more information on the training course we discussed, please go to savagetraininggroup.com/courses/response-non-criminal-barricade/
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One of the best conversations I’ve ever heard about the subject. And I have been to a significant amount of mental health training. As a newer cop, this is an issue I’ve been putting a lot of thought into lately with the increase we are seeing in mental health issues and I really appreciate your guys’ approach.
Great vid. The special contract was entered when pd’s and sheriff’s accepted tax money for funding. Just a thought.
I'm completely blown away by this discussion.
It begs the question: what is the solution?
You did a great job highlighting your limitations as police.
Scott gave a scenario where he empathizes, but leaves. I get it. But it still leaves the people with the crisis. So what's the solution?
Where does the change come in? There's a mental health crisis in the US, I think we can all agree. But no one is taking responsibility for fixing it. Billy mentioned having a mental health team, with a social worker. I like that idea. But not a social worker. They are overworked, unqualified, etc. (Think about Josh Powell.)
Maybe just ONE police dpt should implement a specialized mental health team that has the following:
say 2 patrol officers (too many can agitate the patient)
a psychologist
and medic
Let them work in conjunction to solve the problem. And see how that goes. If it works it can spread to other departments.
It could even be a specialized team created by retired cops, if the department does not want the extra liability. But somewhere someone has to do something.
What about tranquilizers? We use them in zoos right? If you have family on scene who can inform the shooter of existing conditions, then he can prepare a tranquilizer. No?
Sleeping gas?
There HAS to be a solution.
I hope you talk about this topic again, not so much from a liability perspective, but from a human perspective. If you do, please see if you can get Dr Kirk Honda (from the Psychology in Seattle podcast) to guest star. He's talked about the US mental health crisis before and how many crimes could have been avoided if the people had just gotten the help they needed.
About suicides.
I believe Kirk has talked about this before - if a person is suicidal, they are also capable of murder and mass murder. Often spree killings and school shootings start with the person wanting to commit suicide. Then they decide, "if I go I'm going to make a statement".
So to me, it's just bananas that cops might walk away from a potential suicide. That person can absolutely go and shoot up a school. But if you can get Dr Kirk in, I'm sure you guys could have an interesting discussion.
I would love for law enforcement, the justice system and psychology to marry and create something better.
This is a very important topic. Thanks for talking about it. I hope you'll talk about it again and maybe throw out some solutions.
I have seen the same thing happen around here in Pennsylvania. I noticed the biggest problem is a lot of the cops are not trying to be human. When dealing with the situation they continue to want to be a cop. Sometimes you have to bring yourself down to their level and talk to them as if their family And a good portion of the time they stop and listen I had one person ended up crying on my shoulder because I used my own personal situation as an example of what I deal with and he flat out said he’s never met someone in uniform that actually comes out and admits to dealing with personal issues they’re like the robots. I turned around I told the guy sometimes it’s better to admit that you’re human and not a guy wearing a badge that follows everything by the book. Sometimes you have to come down off your high horse and understand where they’re coming from.
I work for government assisted low income housing where I do investigations for criminal activity and fraud plus some security response (Former LEO). I deal with multiple calls for residents with mental issues. Often I try to get them assistance with mental health agencies, but sometimes it doesn't always help. Often I call for LE/EMS assistance because its unfair for the other residents that live in these complexes to have to continually deal with these people too. Low income housing has secretly become the new mental hospitals of the country. i worked overnight hospital security prior to LE and saw the effects of mental hospitals shutting down. There are no mental health teams welling to not be protected by LE and there are not funds to make this ideal a reality. So if LE agencies stop responding to this calls then assaults and maybe even murder will happen more often then suicide in my experience.
Great response and you’re right. Thank you for sharing and supporting our channel!
You also got to keep in mind no one wants to do work with mental health anymore because it’s doesn’t sustain a piece of income. There’s no money in the mental health aspect of a career so people are starting to walk away from it. I deal with PTSD and I’ve been through five different therapists dealing with PTSD. Because of them leaving the field because there is no money in that field.
Good stuff!!
👊
What is your opinion on the officer that punched his K9 for biting him instead of jumping on the suspect that was running away. (leg bail)
Not sure if this is the same episode as the podcast regarding not responding to 5150 calls with possible suicidal subjects. I would be appalled if LEOs would stop responding to these calls. Being a survivor of multiple suicide attempts I desperately needed someone to intervene because doctors had me misdiagnosed for many years and the medications would make me suicidal. I’m now properly diagnosed and with weekly therapy I’m a lot better. My family is extremely grateful for all responding agencies who helped me by administering narcan or talking me out of following through with ending my life.
I would hope and pray that all law enforcement agencies be trained in the approach of saving individuals trying to end their life when all they needed was help realizing they do matter and have a promising future. God bless and stay safe.
If not them than who? The world is imperfect and expects what it is unable to provide done by those it disdains.
Kyle for sure is keeping his guys on a short leash. 😂
Have to keep them in line 💁♂️
@@shotsfiredpodcast50 somebody’s got to do it🤙🏻
I’m good with cops staying away from mental health calls. All they can do is arrest or kill.
If LE doesn’t respond,nobody will. Great discussion guys.
Thanks Jeff! 👊
Exactly.
Thank you for including us in this important discussion. For more information on the training course we discussed, please go to savagetraininggroup.com/courses/response-non-criminal-barricade/