@Nigel Green Probably a case of having to get the actors to sign up for multiple seasons from the start rather than having to constantly renew contracts. Look what happened with the supposed fourth movie after Beyond - The actors were asking for so much they couldn't actually afford to make a fourth movie! Star Trek 09 made 386 mil worldwide, Into Darkness made 467 mil worldwide, Beyond made 335 mil worldwide which wasn't even enough to pay back its production budget of 185 mil - At this point they know they can't make a Star Trek movie for less than 160 mil and probably another 50-100 mil on top of that for marketing. That means they need to make approx a minimum of 420 mil worldwide just to break even and probably more likely 520 mil plus which none of the three most recent Trek movies have done and including inflation only ONE Trek movie has ever done {The Motion Picture inflates to approx 575mil worldwide}. - With Disco they probably locked in Sonequa Martin-Green's pay for the entire 5 seasons from the start!
and bad shows is why YT has taken off in recent years.... we escaped cable for streaming and now we escape streaming to watch/listen to channels who speak our language....
I've always assumed that television executives largely assume that their audience is predominantly composed of imbeciles. Sometimes, they're probably not wrong. 🙃
Buffy is a great example of not necessarily being of quality but still worked. It was a bit hokey but not bad. It had a nice niche audience which allowed it too thrive for years when it should've been canceled early on. Remember it was way before the Vampire phase too
Hokey isn’t necessarily a problem if it’s done intelligently and with self-awareness. More than half the stuff Groucho Marx said was hokey but he knew how to nail you to the wall with it. That’s true comedic talent.
@@TheDuckofDoom. The Buffy movie was NOT successful. Not even close. That's why there were never any sequels. It would be entirely forgotten today without the TV series.
@@CallMeChato Figures. It's a shame. Ultimately the reason CBC dies is because it has had to push the Progressive Message (TM) since the 80s and quality is an afterthought while competing with $$$$$ south of the border
As a Gen Xer, I really do miss the 3 network format that I grew up with in the 70's and 80's. There are many shows that would have gotten axed if not for some studio honcho coming in and tweaking things during the first season. Mannix is a great example. The network wanted to cancel it after the first season but none other than Lucille Ball came in as head of Desilu and demanded the show be retooled and it became one of the best loved Private Eye shows ever.
Again, this is a great video to teach us how things actually work. Network Execs are strange and fickle beasts, but I understand them greenlighting things better now.
About 12 years ago I was acting in films for a weekly series of weekend TV movies for family viewing, produced by a few individual teams. The series was very popular and people were coming up with all sorts of stories. One month I was part of a film about a young vampire boy whose vampire parents hid him in a crate in shipping port to protect him from us nasty werewolves. He then grows up with adopted mortal parents only to learn at the age of 10 who he really is, and by coincidence so do those pesky werewolves. Simple, yes. Fun, absolutely. During production we were so excited about the film that the executive producer requested a sequel, and the director changed the ending so that the werewolves could come back rather than meet a final end. Then the producer of the movie said she wanted to make it into a spin-off series, as another film had done, rather than just a sequel. I was excited because at last I was going to have steady income. I bought a new TV, I started looking at condos... The director said, "Wait to see how the film does first." Well... it flopped. Years later I met some young students at a puppet festival and workshop that I was working at. They asked about my work and when I mentioned that film they told me they remembered it and loved it. A few years after that someone told me they'd just seen me on TV playing a werewolf-it seemed the network had been re-airing it. During Covid one of the stars, a much beloved comedian in this country, died sending shockwaves through the nation and his huge body of work started to be played again in tribute, and I was touched to hear that our vampire movie was one of the titles that was played again. The point is: it wasn't the story or the film itself that was bad, it was the timing and the demographic being monitored. Adults, who in this country were not familiar with vampires and werewolves, couldn't relate to the film, but younger audiences, some of which had been watching Twilight, did understand; but nobody listens to kids. I keep telling the director it's time for us to make that series, but nobody listens to me either.
Don't worry. I don't think anyone who has seen anything which came out of Hollywood in the past 10 years has any illusions that greenlighting has anything to do with quality control. If it fits the agenda, (the Message), it gets the thumbs-up.
A big part of getting a show green lit is your relationship with the broadcaster. If they know you and trust you, from either producing shows in the past, or pitching to them several times, or from shmoozing with them at parties and events, then you have a much better chance at getting green lit, as opposed to a total stranger... even if that stranger has the most brilliant idea for a show ever. Also, you have to be a good pitch person, charismatic, charming, and friendly. I've worked with some producers that could sell you a dog turd they found on the sidewalk just because they are such good pitchmen. And you are correct, the quality of the show is subjective and not much of a factor when pitching a show. Also, not all broadcasters are the same. I work in animation, pitching to Teletoon is not like pitching to PBS, which is not like pitching to Netflix, which is not like pitching to the Cartoon Network, and so on. Sometimes the stars just have to align, and that is a rare thing indeed. I've worked on terrible shows that were not even fully fleshed out when they were pitched, and they got greenlit. I've also worked on shows that were literally pitched for ten years, before a broadcaster finally greenlit it. And I've seen brilliant show ideas get rejected, much to the bewilderment of the producers and creators. There are a million factors to consider when pitching a show to a broadcaster: are they looking for something in the age group or genre of your show? Do they have a working relationship with anyone involved, someone they trust? Different broadcasters want to see different things, (in animation) some want to see a storyboard, some don't, some want to see a script, some don't, some want to see a sizzle reel, some don't. Some broadcaster love it when you act out and stand on the conference room table... most do not. It takes persistence and hard work and lots of luck.
Well.. that's how they greenlit 5 years ago. Now its "Do you fit our diversity quotas?" "Are you towing 'the message'?" "Do you lack anything traditional that would make it a great show?" "Do you have lead producers/writers who have failed time and again, but are woke?" Great you are green lit!
I knew where Chato was going with Brandon Tartikoff but I still got a chuckle with "...but he's dead." RIP, Mr. Tartikoff and thanks for some great tv shows.
The basic premise of TV shows getting aired are from the facts that advertisers are willing to buy time, and pay the going rate, of what the TV network charges for the commercial spots. If advertisers don't step up to buy time in the airtime of a specific TV show, the TV show is axed.
J. Michael Straczinski {JMS}, creator of the science fiction TV show *BABYLON 5,* once said something [if-I-remember-correctly] about what it means to work in network television. JMS said it was like slowly climbing a giant pile of dung to pluck one perfect rose sitting at the top of that pile. By the time you get to the top of the pile -- and reach the one rose -- you find you have lost your sense of smell.
Got it. Producers and VPs-In-Charge of money require certain things to be checked off. And the checkoff, doesn't presuppose quality or direction. Got it. So, if there's a failure despite a green light, then there's something wrong with the checklist. The checklist needs to be revised because checking off whatever is an expectation of making money, right? Revise the check list.
That makes total sense on what has been put on for the past 30 years. I’ve never liked sitcoms and network TV stopped telling the news about what actually happened. So, I stopped watching TV 25 years ago. The Super Bowl and World Series and a few major golf tournaments is all the I watch now.
I’ve always though that, back in the day (your TV Guide reviews, I think, show it) it was part “throw as much against the wall to see if it sticks” and “I think this might work!” Would some of those TV shows we have seen that were dumped after nine episodes been more successful if they had different actors/actresses? Or (as in some cases) is the concept so bad nothing could save it? So many variables go into these things.
1st season of TNG had to make network executives nervous giving when they greenlit the 2nd season as the show first season was really rocky. and giving it was a sci fi show most likely expensive, but it somehow survived the ax and build up an audience.
@@Marveryn After the writer's strike in 1988, STNG really improved. Also during the strike, Jonathan Frakes (Riker) had grown a beard, so when they resumed they decided to keep it.
Thanks for setting me straight! Based on my knowledge of the backstory to the Star Trek TOS pilots, I mistakenly presumed that "Green Lighting" a project meant you watched one or two pilots and assuredly gave it a thumb's up and a go ahead. In reality, it's more stressful - like betting on a lousy pre-flop starting hand in Texas Hold 'Em bluffing on a 2 and a 9. If the gods smile on you, you end up winning the pot with a low straight flush and you'll be praised by everyone as a keen and brilliant Cincinnati Kid with born-gut instincts for the racket, but if the project lays an egg you'll end up on skid row muttering, "...that’s all I need -- this ashtray, the remote control, the paddle game, this magazine and the chair... that's all I need." :p
Former high school science teacher here - listening to this made think we need a new "counter" culture show. I'm thinking of a combination of Three's Company and All in the Family. Set in Seattle you have a male and two females sharing an apartment. All three are "unsure" of their "identity". They go through experiences that make them realize their preconceived notions of how the world works are not correct. For example, they destroy some pieces in an art gallery in protest and get kicked out of college. Maybe they are all excited about the new "living wage" and then get laid off. They might celebrate the defunding of the police only to end up having to pay protection money to the gangsters down the street. The possibilities are endless. The theme music for the show should be the Byrds' song Turn,turn, turn or some other 60s counter culture song like Buffalo Springfield's What it's Worth. Also get some out of work actors to make regular appearances - how about Michael Richards, Rosanne, or Paul Reubens. How about that review of "The Prisoner"?!?
Somebody at AMC knows what they are doing- being the only company to pick up the critically acclaimed 'Mad Men', they went one better with being the only company who picked up 'Breaking Bad', another show that every other broadcaster rejected. 🍄
Network execs though about who the show would appeal to?! What about the writers sexuality or skin colour? It was not just a lazy self-insert and pop culture regurgitation?!😮 Crazy Times 😂
Another very entertaining and informative episode. The distinction you make between “quality” and “standards” is very useful. Explains (e.g.) “Friends”.
Adam Carolla had a great insight on how Hollywood works. He was shooting a pilot and the kid who would play his son was hired sight unseen. They flew him in and he was terrible. After arguing with the producers they brought another kid in and they went to the execs to solidify a cast. One of the producers said they were going to the execs with options instead of just the kid they liked. Guess which kid they picked? The terrible kid. They shot the pilot and the same exec said "well we have to get rid of the kid." ....at least this is the fuzzy recollection of his story and it's amazing anything becomes successful.
I added perceived value to this UA-cam video by leaving a comment. That way the algorithm perceives value through the amount of "engagement" it has - even if all of the comments were about something TOTALLY different like the Swedish Rectal Tuba Championships...
Russell Crowe said it best as his character of Maximus in the film, "Gladiator," when he said, "Are you not entertained?" Sometimes....MOST of the time.....we're NOT entertained. That comes with the gig.
Man you could do whole videos on shows that were hits but networks didn't want them. I've heard so many stories: Star Trek, Gilligan's Island, Greatest American Hero, Married With Children, Third Rock From the Sun. All were successful shows and delivered respectable if not great ratings but people behind the scenes, at the networks, really didn't want them on the air. NBC hated Rodenberry, CBS hated Sherwood Schwartz, ABC management changed on Stephen J. Cannel and fundamentally disagreed with the premise of GAH, FOX disliked the content on MWC, has any reason ever been revealed regarding 3rd Rock? All interesting stories indeed.
I think that must be the worse job on the planet. I'd rather wash dishes and clean toliets, change cat boxes and clean the chicken coop all the in same day!
I would love to hear your take on Firefly. It seemed as though the network had a gigantic chip on its shoulder for that series right from the start. Horrible time slot. CHANGED the time slots without any information to the audience. Showed the episodes wildly out of order. Not only that, but the shows own creator now acts as though it never existed and refuses to speak about it... Seems quite odd. The people who did get to see it adored it, though.
The perfect example is "Survivor" ... Running at over 20 seasons now. It's been unwatchable garbage, in my opinion, since it was conceived, but it's kept going because it's so amazingly cheap to produce and even in its current out-played state is still a money maker.
William Goldman’s ‘Adventures in the Screen Trade’ established the best rule for why some properties get sought, while others are ignored: NO ONE KNOWS ANYTHING. Seriously.
The smother brothers show controversy is such an interesting story that I think few people know about these days. I’m Gen X and I only know about it because my parents loved the smothers brothers and a couple of 80’s specials that referenced the controversy
This definitely explains the early years of Fox. Another UA-cam channel, "Good Bad Flicks" does a series on failed / one season shows and some of the problems that popped up like finances, behind-the-scenes drama, production woes and that for every _Married with Children_ there were many others that didn't last one season that first year of Fox's existence.
Excellent commentary as usual. All this time I thought new shows were the result of those involved sacrificing their souls to Cthulhu! Ia! Ia! Cthulhu ftagn!
I imagine the rules are quite different with streaming. No advertising to appeal to, no opposition on another channel. I wonder what the new criteria will be?
How did you deal with the stress of making decisions when audience preferences (and thus your outcomes) can be so arbitrary and fickle? I get locked into decision paralysis just deciding which necktie goes with what shirt pants and jacket.
4:08 That seems like everything that's coming through right now though. Approaching this from the other direction, I can understand that some shows need to be green lit, however when you see a script, or even a concept that the target audience has been complaining about for the last decade, wouldn't you try something or anything new?
I was watching this hoping to find some reason as to why so much garbage is being green-lit and made for streaming services today. However streaming does not have the same constraint as a a TV channel, a streaming service doesn't have timeslots. For a TV channel with an empty timeslot, they're pushing dead air for a half an hour or more. For a streaming service, is a far less conspicuous as people don't actually see the empty slot. I don't understand why all the streaming services pump out so much trash. It's so easy to spend more time surfing through the menu looking for something worth watching between the pages of worse-than-B movies, sitcom reruns, bad comic shows etc. than actually watching content for me. Quality Control is an art.
And the shows like Firefly should have had 16 seasons get killed. Meh. I don’t watch TV anymore except the weather. You know they are just guessing, but you also know they won’t be cancelled.
You always impart so much nuance, realism and good sense in your videos, Paul, and I deeply resent it! "How dare you" try to make me smarter! My poor brain, argh!
Growing up I always hated the way networks put similar shows against each other. I logically-which is not a concept welcome in the corporate mindset-believed that if one channel had a hit medical drama at a certain time, another channel could scoop up all the people who don't like medical dramas. Needless to say, I was laughed at for such a foolish idea. Similar to the way audiences laughed during The Smothers Brothers as it went up against an old-fashioned trope TV western like Bonanza. Another great example of networks getting it wrong is Gilligan's Island. The network hated it, was sure it would fail, and were annoyed that it was so popular that it ran for 3 seasons and based on ratings should have had at least a 4th; and it remained hugely popular in syndication for at least another 20 years. The Harlem Globetrotters never visited Bonanza in a later TV movie. I was always perplexed that my father was unable to see the difference between a show shot on film and one shot on tape. He asked how you could tell the difference. I said, "The same way you can tell the difference between a drawing done in pencil and one in crayon."
It's even worse in Canada, where the government mandates that so much of the shows on television have to be produced in Canada, meaning these Canadian productions don't really have to try to be good because they'll make it to air anyways.
I remember the Smothers Brothers comedy hour. I was too young to get some of the racier material, but the music was so good, the show was fresh and different. My parents and everyone hated it. I don't think they understood many of the references or they wouldn't let me watch it. I only could watch it because the family had purchased their first color TV that year, and the old vacuum tube B&W fell into my possession. So I could watch it while everyone else watched Bonanza. I also loved Rowan & Martin's Laugh-in that started a year later. I don't know if NBC thought they needed a Smother's brothers competitor or not. I think it was opposite Gunsmoke. I never had the chance to watch either show in color until years later. I really would have loved it then if I had a color way to view it.
I was thinking about traditional TV vs. UA-cam. Some of the biggest UA-cam channels would probably not have been greenlit (kids playing with toys, etc.).
@CallMeChato, if green lightning, scheduling is nothing to do with quality.... can make a video/series putting yourself in the head of network executives that made what in hindsight is objectively bad decisions like in the cases of TOS, firefly,Lucifer, etc. I really love to figure out what goes through these decision-makers heads when they leave money on the table like this..
Another very good entry in the how the fundamentals work category. As with the other videos in this group worth watching more than once. For anyone who might read this comment that has not been watching Call me Chato regularly I suggest you go back through the channel's uploads and search for these nuggets of insight and knowledge. All of them are worth watching more than once if you are interested in how the television sausage is made.
I'd add we perceive quality differently at different times as well. You never really know if a show is good until its out there and the audience reacts.
Married with Children being a good example- can you imagine anyone being brave enough to make that show today? They'd receive that many death threats from every blue-haired landwhale on the Internet that they'd have to go into hiding literally forever! 🍄
@@kilgortrout3432 Yes- Michael Moye, but fortunately for him, no-one born after 1975 has any fucking idea who he is, so he's practically bulletproof, and well under the radar of the blue-haired Twatterati. I just wish there were other brave men of his ilk around now, because his kind of bravery has been bastardised into the 'stunning and brave' "bravery" that passes for executive decision making in entertainment these days. Offending people is dead- *long live offending people!!* 🙂 🍄
😂 Yes! Even More Confused! The only thing I think I understood is that as an exec you green light because you have to. But that bit at the end about the Smothers Brothers Comedy Hour (which I love) blew my mind!! Thanks for a terribly interesting vid.
I'd be interested in seeing your take on laugh tracks. I note that M*A*S*H was broadcast in the UK without laugh track, but in the US they broadcast it with laugh track (thereby ruining every tender serious moment)
The Bad Shows getting the greenlight doesn't baffle me.
The Worse ones getting a Season 2 is where I am at a lost for words.
@Nigel Green Probably a case of having to get the actors to sign up for multiple seasons from the start rather than having to constantly renew contracts.
Look what happened with the supposed fourth movie after Beyond - The actors were asking for so much they couldn't actually afford to make a fourth movie!
Star Trek 09 made 386 mil worldwide, Into Darkness made 467 mil worldwide, Beyond made 335 mil worldwide which wasn't even enough to pay back its production budget of 185 mil - At this point they know they can't make a Star Trek movie for less than 160 mil and probably another 50-100 mil on top of that for marketing.
That means they need to make approx a minimum of 420 mil worldwide just to break even and probably more likely 520 mil plus which none of the three most recent Trek movies have done and including inflation only ONE Trek movie has ever done {The Motion Picture inflates to approx 575mil worldwide}.
-
With Disco they probably locked in Sonequa Martin-Green's pay for the entire 5 seasons from the start!
How the f*** did Velma get greenlit for another season?
@@andrewthorpe3219 excellent question. There is probably no explanation in the universe to justify renewing that bs
Rings of Power and Velma come to mind.
@Nigel Green Cheaper in the long run. You can set a salary for the cast and crew and not have to renegotiate every new season.
My guess is Bad TV shows are the ONLY TV shows produced in these days of the Wokepocalypse
If THESE ideas get greenlit, I don't want to know what the rest of them looked like.
@@Mediados good point!
and bad shows is why YT has taken off in recent years....
we escaped cable for streaming and now we escape streaming to watch/listen to channels who speak our language....
There have always been bad shows, more bad than good, since tv was invented. It has jack shit to do with any so called 'wokeness'.
hopefully today we are churning through the back 10. And some exects will see the diminished returns and decide to bet on a new trend.
I've always assumed that television executives largely assume that their audience is predominantly composed of imbeciles.
Sometimes, they're probably not wrong. 🙃
80% of the time it's right every time.
@@SierraSierraFoxtrot
Executive Panther, by Odeon.
Explains Bigfoot shows.
half of all people are below average IQ
Given the popularity of cat Videos on YT and just about everything on Tik Tok says the Executives weren't the first to figure this out.
I love learning from someone who knows their trade, and Chato clearly put context to what actually happened when shows aired.
Buffy is a great example of not necessarily being of quality but still worked. It was a bit hokey but not bad. It had a nice niche audience which allowed it too thrive for years when it should've been canceled early on. Remember it was way before the Vampire phase too
Hokey isn’t necessarily a problem if it’s done intelligently and with self-awareness. More than half the stuff Groucho Marx said was hokey but he knew how to nail you to the wall with it. That’s true comedic talent.
Buffy was also playing off of a successful movie.
@@TheDuckofDoom. The Buffy movie was NOT successful. Not even close. That's why there were never any sequels. It would be entirely forgotten today without the TV series.
@@robertodell9193 If you say so. It returned a fair net margin and most people I know never watched the show but have seen the movie.
@@TheDuckofDoom. The movie picked up a small cult following later on, but the theatrical release was not profitable.
The reason this man didn't last at the CBC:
1) He is actually funny
2) He doesn't prostrate himself before political correctness
Ha thanks. Actually, they cut the CBC budget so I couldn't green light any new shows but they wanted me to stick around to read scripts. I declined.
@@CallMeChato Figures. It's a shame. Ultimately the reason CBC dies is because it has had to push the Progressive Message (TM) since the 80s and quality is an afterthought while competing with $$$$$ south of the border
Now a days if a show has messages. The current approved messages. If they have that, the gree lights are as bright as the sun.
As a Gen Xer, I really do miss the 3 network format that I grew up with in the 70's and 80's. There are many shows that would have gotten axed if not for some studio honcho coming in and tweaking things during the first season. Mannix is a great example. The network wanted to cancel it after the first season but none other than Lucille Ball came in as head of Desilu and demanded the show be retooled and it became one of the best loved Private Eye shows ever.
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Again, this is a great video to teach us how things actually work. Network Execs are strange and fickle beasts, but I understand them greenlighting things better now.
Good, I'm glad it was clear.
The quality of television shows in the past seems directly correlated with the amount of coke involved.
Don't forget the casting couch
Comedy is subjective...
laughing is objective...
And TV is depictive.
..And then the extra studio checkbox & messaging requirements reared their heads.
Further narrowing the field.
About 12 years ago I was acting in films for a weekly series of weekend TV movies for family viewing, produced by a few individual teams. The series was very popular and people were coming up with all sorts of stories. One month I was part of a film about a young vampire boy whose vampire parents hid him in a crate in shipping port to protect him from us nasty werewolves. He then grows up with adopted mortal parents only to learn at the age of 10 who he really is, and by coincidence so do those pesky werewolves. Simple, yes. Fun, absolutely. During production we were so excited about the film that the executive producer requested a sequel, and the director changed the ending so that the werewolves could come back rather than meet a final end. Then the producer of the movie said she wanted to make it into a spin-off series, as another film had done, rather than just a sequel. I was excited because at last I was going to have steady income. I bought a new TV, I started looking at condos... The director said, "Wait to see how the film does first." Well... it flopped.
Years later I met some young students at a puppet festival and workshop that I was working at. They asked about my work and when I mentioned that film they told me they remembered it and loved it. A few years after that someone told me they'd just seen me on TV playing a werewolf-it seemed the network had been re-airing it. During Covid one of the stars, a much beloved comedian in this country, died sending shockwaves through the nation and his huge body of work started to be played again in tribute, and I was touched to hear that our vampire movie was one of the titles that was played again.
The point is: it wasn't the story or the film itself that was bad, it was the timing and the demographic being monitored. Adults, who in this country were not familiar with vampires and werewolves, couldn't relate to the film, but younger audiences, some of which had been watching Twilight, did understand; but nobody listens to kids.
I keep telling the director it's time for us to make that series, but nobody listens to me either.
Don't worry. I don't think anyone who has seen anything which came out of Hollywood in the past 10 years has any illusions that greenlighting has anything to do with quality control. If it fits the agenda, (the Message), it gets the thumbs-up.
A big part of getting a show green lit is your relationship with the broadcaster. If they know you and trust you, from either producing shows in the past, or pitching to them several times, or from shmoozing with them at parties and events, then you have a much better chance at getting green lit, as opposed to a total stranger... even if that stranger has the most brilliant idea for a show ever. Also, you have to be a good pitch person, charismatic, charming, and friendly. I've worked with some producers that could sell you a dog turd they found on the sidewalk just because they are such good pitchmen. And you are correct, the quality of the show is subjective and not much of a factor when pitching a show. Also, not all broadcasters are the same. I work in animation, pitching to Teletoon is not like pitching to PBS, which is not like pitching to Netflix, which is not like pitching to the Cartoon Network, and so on. Sometimes the stars just have to align, and that is a rare thing indeed. I've worked on terrible shows that were not even fully fleshed out when they were pitched, and they got greenlit. I've also worked on shows that were literally pitched for ten years, before a broadcaster finally greenlit it. And I've seen brilliant show ideas get rejected, much to the bewilderment of the producers and creators. There are a million factors to consider when pitching a show to a broadcaster: are they looking for something in the age group or genre of your show? Do they have a working relationship with anyone involved, someone they trust? Different broadcasters want to see different things, (in animation) some want to see a storyboard, some don't, some want to see a script, some don't, some want to see a sizzle reel, some don't. Some broadcaster love it when you act out and stand on the conference room table... most do not. It takes persistence and hard work and lots of luck.
Yep.
All hail the Mighty Cop Show! Praised be the Almighty Medical Drama!
It's not about the money
It's about _sending_ _a_ _message_
-HBO Max Execs regarding Velma
Streaming/cable is different.
and the removal of Raised By Wolves. (AI wanting to wipe out religion while making humans into mindless communal slaves for the algorithms).
Well.. that's how they greenlit 5 years ago.
Now its
"Do you fit our diversity quotas?"
"Are you towing 'the message'?"
"Do you lack anything traditional that would make it a great show?"
"Do you have lead producers/writers who have failed time and again, but are woke?"
Great you are green lit!
We live in a dimension in which somebody though The Human Centipede was something the world needed. Several times.
Everything can get greenlit.
They need product - it is as simple as that. And the fun is seeing what hits big.
Chato: "Actors need to be audible"
Nolan: "Hold my sound design"
"...Crazy! I mean like so many positive waves maybe we can't lose! ..."
Thoroughly Confused, but entertained and educated none the less.
Ah, St. Elsewhere. Loved that show.
All quite familiar, it makes me think back to those days of pitch meetings with those giant marker boards.
If one was luck there was free lunch.
I knew where Chato was going with Brandon Tartikoff but I still got a chuckle with "...but he's dead." RIP, Mr. Tartikoff and thanks for some great tv shows.
The basic premise of TV shows getting aired are from the facts that advertisers are willing to buy time, and pay the going rate, of what the TV network charges for the commercial spots.
If advertisers don't step up to buy time in the airtime of a specific TV show, the TV show is axed.
Because they have the right message.
J. Michael Straczinski {JMS}, creator of the science fiction TV show *BABYLON 5,* once said something [if-I-remember-correctly] about what it means to work in network television.
JMS said it was like slowly climbing a giant pile of dung to pluck one perfect rose sitting at the top of that pile. By the time you get to the top of the pile -- and reach the one rose -- you find you have lost your sense of smell.
interesting look on how the TV sausage is made, thanks for sharing.
Got it. Producers and VPs-In-Charge of money require certain things to be checked off. And the checkoff, doesn't presuppose quality or direction. Got it. So, if there's a failure despite a green light, then there's something wrong with the checklist. The checklist needs to be revised because checking off whatever is an expectation of making money, right? Revise the check list.
That makes total sense on what has been put on for the past 30 years. I’ve never liked sitcoms and network TV stopped telling the news about what actually happened. So, I stopped watching TV 25 years ago. The Super Bowl and World Series and a few major golf tournaments is all the I watch now.
In short. We green light the least stinky cow pie because it's the highest quality cow pie we have.
Yep.
@@CallMeChato What horrors must have been left on the floor when "Sharknado" was green lit.
"Dusty copy of their broken dreams"... 👍 Quotable, you are.
Sometimes I surprise myself.
Common Sense and Business Sense Do Not Walk Hand In Hand. Something I learned a Long Long Time Ago.
Ah Bonanza, memories of Sunday afternoons in front of the TV.
Thanks for the description. Sounds like real work and stress. No wonder millennials and Gen K's can't produce anything worthwhile.
I’ve always though that, back in the day (your TV Guide reviews, I think, show it) it was part “throw as much against the wall to see if it sticks” and “I think this might work!” Would some of those TV shows we have seen that were dumped after nine episodes been more successful if they had different actors/actresses? Or (as in some cases) is the concept so bad nothing could save it? So many variables go into these things.
Yep, it was a numbers game.
1st season of TNG had to make network executives nervous giving when they greenlit the 2nd season as the show first season was really rocky. and giving it was a sci fi show most likely expensive, but it somehow survived the ax and build up an audience.
@@Marveryn After the writer's strike in 1988, STNG really improved. Also during the strike, Jonathan Frakes (Riker) had grown a beard, so when they resumed they decided to keep it.
Thanks for setting me straight! Based on my knowledge of the backstory to the Star Trek TOS pilots, I mistakenly presumed that "Green Lighting" a project meant you watched one or two pilots and assuredly gave it a thumb's up and a go ahead. In reality, it's more stressful - like betting on a lousy pre-flop starting hand in Texas Hold 'Em bluffing on a 2 and a 9. If the gods smile on you, you end up winning the pot with a low straight flush and you'll be praised by everyone as a keen and brilliant Cincinnati Kid with born-gut instincts for the racket, but if the project lays an egg you'll end up on skid row muttering, "...that’s all I need -- this ashtray, the remote control, the paddle game, this magazine and the chair... that's all I need." :p
“But he’s dead” 😂 RIP but that quick quip made me laugh
Former high school science teacher here - listening to this made think we need a new "counter" culture show. I'm thinking of a combination of Three's Company and All in the Family. Set in Seattle you have a male and two females sharing an apartment. All three are "unsure" of their "identity". They go through experiences that make them realize their preconceived notions of how the world works are not correct. For example, they destroy some pieces in an art gallery in protest and get kicked out of college. Maybe they are all excited about the new "living wage" and then get laid off. They might celebrate the defunding of the police only to end up having to pay protection money to the gangsters down the street. The possibilities are endless. The theme music for the show should be the Byrds' song Turn,turn, turn or some other 60s counter culture song like Buffalo Springfield's What it's Worth. Also get some out of work actors to make regular appearances - how about Michael Richards, Rosanne, or Paul Reubens. How about that review of "The Prisoner"?!?
Somebody at AMC knows what they are doing- being the only company to pick up the critically acclaimed 'Mad Men', they went one better with being the only company who picked up 'Breaking Bad', another show that every other broadcaster rejected.
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Don't forget Walking Dead 2010s were crazy good for AMC the true golden age of tv
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Good point!
(although, I'd have to contend your last statement with 'the true golden age of TV ended with the 20th century'...)
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Network execs though about who the show would appeal to?! What about the writers sexuality or skin colour?
It was not just a lazy self-insert and pop culture regurgitation?!😮
Crazy Times 😂
Another very entertaining and informative episode. The distinction you make between “quality” and “standards” is very useful. Explains (e.g.) “Friends”.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Adam Carolla had a great insight on how Hollywood works. He was shooting a pilot and the kid who would play his son was hired sight unseen. They flew him in and he was terrible. After arguing with the producers they brought another kid in and they went to the execs to solidify a cast. One of the producers said they were going to the execs with options instead of just the kid they liked. Guess which kid they picked? The terrible kid. They shot the pilot and the same exec said "well we have to get rid of the kid." ....at least this is the fuzzy recollection of his story and it's amazing anything becomes successful.
Decades TV is having a Mod Squad marathon this weekend!
I always appreciate these glimpses behind the scene.
Hey now, Conan: The Barbarian is a FANTASTIC film.
I was referencing acting. :-)
I added perceived value to this UA-cam video by leaving a comment. That way the algorithm perceives value through the amount of "engagement" it has - even if all of the comments were about something TOTALLY different like the Swedish Rectal Tuba Championships...
As a denizen of Chatoland, we must pay taxes in the form of a like on every video. 👍🏼
Russell Crowe said it best as his character of Maximus in the film, "Gladiator," when he said, "Are you not entertained?" Sometimes....MOST of the time.....we're NOT entertained. That comes with the gig.
Man you could do whole videos on shows that were hits but networks didn't want them. I've heard so many stories: Star Trek, Gilligan's Island, Greatest American Hero, Married With Children, Third Rock From the Sun. All were successful shows and delivered respectable if not great ratings but people behind the scenes, at the networks, really didn't want them on the air. NBC hated Rodenberry, CBS hated Sherwood Schwartz, ABC management changed on Stephen J. Cannel and fundamentally disagreed with the premise of GAH, FOX disliked the content on MWC, has any reason ever been revealed regarding 3rd Rock? All interesting stories indeed.
Chato: Actors need to be audible.
Christopher Nolan: Hold my beer.
I think that must be the worse job on the planet. I'd rather wash dishes and clean toliets, change cat boxes and clean the chicken coop all the in same day!
Commercial television, it is all about making money and/or not costing money. BTW... I see "dog chew shirt collar" has returned!
Yes, the dog chewed it.
I loved hearing you talk about an old TV show like The Smothers Brothers as an insider.
I would love to hear your take on Firefly. It seemed as though the network had a gigantic chip on its shoulder for that series right from the start.
Horrible time slot.
CHANGED the time slots without any information to the audience.
Showed the episodes wildly out of order.
Not only that, but the shows own creator now acts as though it never existed and refuses to speak about it...
Seems quite odd.
The people who did get to see it adored it, though.
I can't believe the smothers brothers had Cream and Steve martin. It was out of my viewing window as a kid
That explains so much.... And so little at the same time!!
The perfect example is "Survivor" ... Running at over 20 seasons now. It's been unwatchable garbage, in my opinion, since it was conceived, but it's kept going because it's so amazingly cheap to produce and even in its current out-played state is still a money maker.
Yep
William Goldman’s ‘Adventures in the Screen Trade’ established the best rule for why some properties get sought, while others are ignored: NO ONE KNOWS ANYTHING.
Seriously.
Yep.
The smother brothers show controversy is such an interesting story that I think few people know about these days. I’m Gen X and I only know about it because my parents loved the smothers brothers and a couple of 80’s specials that referenced the controversy
60’s CBS seemed to have a fetish for canceling successful shows just because the boss didn’t like them.
Success and viewership are literally the opposite of quality.
This definitely explains the early years of Fox. Another UA-cam channel, "Good Bad Flicks" does a series on failed / one season shows and some of the problems that popped up like finances, behind-the-scenes drama, production woes and that for every _Married with Children_ there were many others that didn't last one season that first year of Fox's existence.
what you didn't like homeboys in outer space?
Excellent commentary as usual. All this time I thought new shows were the result of those involved sacrificing their souls to Cthulhu!
Ia! Ia! Cthulhu ftagn!
No, just to the executives. Haven't you seen the video where Chato shows off his collection of souls like Ursula?
I imagine the rules are quite different with streaming. No advertising to appeal to, no opposition on another channel. I wonder what the new criteria will be?
How did you deal with the stress of making decisions when audience preferences (and thus your outcomes) can be so arbitrary and fickle? I get locked into decision paralysis just deciding which necktie goes with what shirt pants and jacket.
If you have to pick 5 each year you just pick the best 5 you got. End of story.
I understand the concept. I greenlit perhaps dozens of women before I eventually landed my wife. She was a hit. On to 100K!! Hail Chato!
Ha. Thanks. I don't want to hear how bad your failures were.
Thoroughly confused. 👍🏼
Thanks Paul 😳
Confused. Thank you!
Because on paper it sounds good.
But the execution and the finished product is another matter
4:08 That seems like everything that's coming through right now though.
Approaching this from the other direction, I can understand that some shows need to be green lit, however when you see a script, or even a concept that the target audience has been complaining about for the last decade, wouldn't you try something or anything new?
oh funny you mention the smothers brothers. their classic episode with the who was the stuff of legend if you what I mean. LOL
Perfect use of visuals.
Miss things like Automan or even Full House... Those kind of shows were fun to watch!
I was watching this hoping to find some reason as to why so much garbage is being green-lit and made for streaming services today. However streaming does not have the same constraint as a a TV channel, a streaming service doesn't have timeslots. For a TV channel with an empty timeslot, they're pushing dead air for a half an hour or more. For a streaming service, is a far less conspicuous as people don't actually see the empty slot.
I don't understand why all the streaming services pump out so much trash. It's so easy to spend more time surfing through the menu looking for something worth watching between the pages of worse-than-B movies, sitcom reruns, bad comic shows etc. than actually watching content for me.
Quality Control is an art.
And the shows like Firefly should have had 16 seasons get killed. Meh. I don’t watch TV anymore except the weather. You know they are just guessing, but you also know they won’t be cancelled.
They have to greenlight something? Say no more! I'll dust off my script about a dog who commands a nuclear submarine!
You always impart so much nuance, realism and good sense in your videos, Paul, and I deeply resent it! "How dare you" try to make me smarter! My poor brain, argh!
Sorry.
This video is a good companion to your T.V. Guide episodes.
Yep. Just confirmed that network tv is analogous to the programming division from Purgatory.
Hoping to see you break that 100,000 ceiling soon! Just keep it up and on track!
Growing up I always hated the way networks put similar shows against each other. I logically-which is not a concept welcome in the corporate mindset-believed that if one channel had a hit medical drama at a certain time, another channel could scoop up all the people who don't like medical dramas. Needless to say, I was laughed at for such a foolish idea. Similar to the way audiences laughed during The Smothers Brothers as it went up against an old-fashioned trope TV western like Bonanza. Another great example of networks getting it wrong is Gilligan's Island. The network hated it, was sure it would fail, and were annoyed that it was so popular that it ran for 3 seasons and based on ratings should have had at least a 4th; and it remained hugely popular in syndication for at least another 20 years. The Harlem Globetrotters never visited Bonanza in a later TV movie.
I was always perplexed that my father was unable to see the difference between a show shot on film and one shot on tape. He asked how you could tell the difference. I said, "The same way you can tell the difference between a drawing done in pencil and one in crayon."
It's even worse in Canada, where the government mandates that so much of the shows on television have to be produced in Canada, meaning these Canadian productions don't really have to try to be good because they'll make it to air anyways.
I remember the Smothers Brothers comedy hour. I was too young to get some of the racier material, but the music was so good, the show was fresh and different. My parents and everyone hated it. I don't think they understood many of the references or they wouldn't let me watch it. I only could watch it because the family had purchased their first color TV that year, and the old vacuum tube B&W fell into my possession. So I could watch it while everyone else watched Bonanza.
I also loved Rowan & Martin's Laugh-in that started a year later. I don't know if NBC thought they needed a Smother's brothers competitor or not. I think it was opposite Gunsmoke. I never had the chance to watch either show in color until years later. I really would have loved it then if I had a color way to view it.
SB was very anti-Vietnam war. This caused many issues.
Paul, you're a gem.
I was thinking about traditional TV vs. UA-cam. Some of the biggest UA-cam channels would probably not have been greenlit (kids playing with toys, etc.).
I imagine getting yellow post it notes all day from the money people doesn't help.😂
They are horrible.
This is real UA-cam content right here.
@CallMeChato, if green lightning, scheduling is nothing to do with quality.... can make a video/series putting yourself in the head of network executives that made what in hindsight is objectively bad decisions like in the cases of TOS, firefly,Lucifer, etc. I really love to figure out what goes through these decision-makers heads when they leave money on the table like this..
TOS and Firefly were not attracting advertisers. They did not have a crystal ball. Did not have champions within the networks.
I don't watch American shows. I gave up on Hollywoke. I actually watch Korean dramas. Holly cow! They are such as good writers
Another very good entry in the how the fundamentals work category. As with the other videos in this group worth watching more than once. For anyone who might read this comment that has not been watching Call me Chato regularly I suggest you go back through the channel's uploads and search for these nuggets of insight and knowledge. All of them are worth watching more than once if you are interested in how the television sausage is made.
I thoroughly agree.
I'd add we perceive quality differently at different times as well.
You never really know if a show is good until its out there and the audience reacts.
Married with Children being a good example- can you imagine anyone being brave enough to make that show today?
They'd receive that many death threats from every blue-haired landwhale on the Internet that they'd have to go into hiding literally forever!
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@@the_unrepentant_anarchist. Can you imagine anyone being brave enough to greenlight Married with Children in 1987. 😉
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Yes- Michael Moye, but fortunately for him, no-one born after 1975 has any fucking idea who he is, so he's practically bulletproof, and well under the radar of the blue-haired Twatterati.
I just wish there were other brave men of his ilk around now, because his kind of bravery has been bastardised into the 'stunning and brave' "bravery" that passes for executive decision making in entertainment these days.
Offending people is dead- *long live offending people!!*
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My goodness. What does a former network executive have to do to get 100K subs?
Come on people, give the man his due.
Yeah!
This kind of insight is your USP. Thanks for sharing.
My pleasure!
😂 Yes! Even More Confused! The only thing I think I understood is that as an exec you green light because you have to. But that bit at the end about the Smothers Brothers Comedy Hour (which I love) blew my mind!! Thanks for a terribly interesting vid.
I'm still waiting for someone to explain why shows like Knight Rider and Bionic Woman got rebooted
A fascinating video essay. Once again.
I'd be interested in seeing your take on laugh tracks. I note that M*A*S*H was broadcast in the UK without laugh track, but in the US they broadcast it with laugh track (thereby ruining every tender serious moment)
All shows were delivered with a separate laugh track that the local broadcaster could choose to turn on or off.