I feel like the following seasons will be way more cool and awesome because while eye of the world is a good book the story for a tv show is just not that engaging as we have already seen this type of story play it in a much shorter run time(fellowship of the ring)
Also I lost some immersion post battle when Moraine said let's go and suddenly they are all on horse back and leaving. No scene of convincing parents and families the need for them to leave. No last minute advice or well wishes for simple village kids leaving.
I know this is the unpopular opinion here, but I liked that. It made me feel like they were trying to show Moiraine as someone who doesn't feel the need to explain herself and demands to be obeyed. **Soft Spoiler** It fits for who I always saw her as in the books, especially as her struggles with Rand later on when he starts to reject her. It was a subtle way of doing it, which I agree feels a little disjointed after the big battle.
Yeh, that struck me as probably the biggest example of the pacing problem. One line - 'we have to go!' 'OK, let's go. Goodbye accepting family who make no effort to persuade me otherwise'.
Dont worry, she was a dark friend. As noted by the fact she had her hammer raised to strike him, if not for his taveren instinct taking hold. Also the wolf in his dream later on, eating her as a zombie, re-enforces that she was bad for him. Update: My thoughts a couple weeks ago have not aged well. I no longer believe she was a dark friend. What changed my mind was Rand's dream where Perrin was hitting her with a hammer at the forge table. I see that event as a sure sign he was trying to repair the damage he had done.
@@albertaguy4817 ok. I am so glad to hear your interpretation and will rewatch to see it for myself. This is really the only change that I'm finding hard to swallow and this helps so much!
@@albertaguy4817 You know I was suspicious of why her arms were raised for an attack, but I thought it was bad choreographing to avoid him wacking off her arm. The implication that she may of actually attempted to strike him (as a Dark Friend) is more forgivable.
Perrin's wife was a masterful addition, imo. I'm incredibly glad they added her to flesh both Perrin as a 20 year old rural person AND the culture and setting.
Oh man you are not alone...I did the exact same thing....more then once...Da fudge was the point? Screw your cultural and rural crap. If you read the books you would know why is is single, massive and that he goes through alot of emotional hardships...He loses more then a wife for goodness sake's later on.
"Those super conservative values are not on display." But the Two Rivers WAS super conservative. Part of thr character development for all of them was to get over their country shyness. Throughout the whole book, few cultures viewed sex as casually as Rand and Eguene did in the first episode.
That was the point where I turned this off. Too much crap already before that and now they're casually having sex? Old country values. I'll go back to re-reading the books. I was worried this would turn out bad. Seems my worst fears weren't even close to how bad this has turned out!
@@shawnboundy3716 I was like: WTF!! In the books they're thinking about getting married. Now they're just banging around. No fucking way. And that scene with Moirane naked?! They're just trying so hard to look an adult show...
Seriously, in the books when the women's circle caught a couple being intimate the forced them to marry. There is no way Rand and Egwene screwing would be a thing...and then Nynaeve and Lan later...wtf?! Ruins the whole progression of their relationship and Lan having to push her away due to not wanting to make her a widow on her wedding day.
Beside Moraine's speech and convincing the others to leave missing, I was also sad they cut so much of Rand and Tam, especially 1) Tam's feverish talk about the boy he found, and 2) the most terrifying scene of the first book, the Fade sniffing for Rand alone on the forest road and Rand hiding in the woods hoping for Tom to stay quiet and not give them away. We didn't even got a scene when Tam is giving Rand his sword. Nothing.
And now mats father cheats on his wife and his mom is a neglectful drunk? Perrin already married and he accidentally kills her? WTF??? I was so damn disappointed with these episodes.
Possibly spoilers, but I liked the bit where he's just leaning against a building watching the trollocs make entrail spaghetti and casually shrugs and ducks off like 'oh man the Dark One is gonna give me so many rewards for this...'
I was not pleased when i saw the casting. When i saw him smile i was sold. He and the guy that plays valda will bring some real creep factor to the show!
the other issue with the cold open is getting Morraine to the two rivers. Like she just Knows they are there. If you had that knowledge of there being FOUR Ta'veren in the Two rivers. Why haven't you gone there yet. She just pulls the revelation out of nowhere. I don't get the feeling that she has been searching for 20 years.
Not to mention that Egwene isn't Ta'veren. Another unnecessary change that was kinda irritating was how they're trying to make it seem like one of the women could be the Dragon Reborn when it is KNOWN from prophecy that the Dragon Reborn would be male. The Dragon Reborn being a male channeler and thus destined to go mad is a big part of what people fear about him, not just what he represents with the Last Battle. That whole opening speech from Moiraine was so full of inaccuracies...
The cold open of episode 1 was really strange, and I absolutely don't get why they did not show Lews Therins Death. It is such an amazing prologue for EotW, and it would have been much more engaging than the hunt for some random male channeler.
They do talk about Lews Therin if you go to the bonus content. They have these little animated episodes that are like 3 mins long with backstory on some things
I'm hoping that they will eventually use that for a cold open in a later episode, because that prologue was what immediately hooked me when reading the book for the first time. I feel that "Winter Dragon" sort of ruined the ability to start the entire series with that.
Kind of weird they cut out the part where the trollocs attack their farm and rand is carrying the injured Tam on a sling to Emond's Field, during which Tam reveals some important info in his fever. But no, fuck all that lets ride into town, and have the wound instantly healed. -oh, you need to go with this rando magic lady to the white tower? -sure, have fun, take some horses.
@@georgevelis4651 the thing is that there is no need to make it a mystery. dude goes through a reinforced door tow episodes later. We now they are showing a bit of the Aiel war so I guess we will get a glimpse of Tam then.
@@damp2269 the showrunners had to do something to grab the viewers attention when covering a story that starts out pretty generic. Adding that mystery is a great way to do it and honestly one of the changes that I actually enjoy. You think it's obviously Rand because you *know* it's Rand, but for non book readers it is not that obvious, and there have been clues that point to other candidates as strongly as Rand.
Actually I'm pretty sure they're trying to make egwin the dragon ... That's why the casually dropped that line how there are four tavarian and the dragon could easily be a man or a woman
@@tzvigrossman1872 we know for a fact that they are not doing that. But even then it baffles me that people think the show would make a change like that... use your brain for 1 minute and realize that this would never happen
Did no one notice how OFF Perrin's marriage was? How awkward his wife was with him? How she was posed to strike Perrin when he killed her? Dark friend alert.
@@DocPicklez Riddle me this: why was she standing behind Perrin with her axe overhead, ready to chop down? The trolloc Perrin was fighting was already dead. Much dead. Perrin was basically making hamburger at that point. Who was she gonna chop? Hmmmmmmmmmmm?
Why does he even have a wife?? He's the same age as Rand and Matt maybe a year older... they were late teens in the first books... I mean they were still being called boys. The whole story has been wrecked.
And literally no reason not to. And, given the amount of source material we're dealing with, why oh why limit the series to 8 episodes a season? Can't we at least get 10 episodes to tell more of the story and maybe remain a bit more true to it? I think back on how rushed and truncated the last two seasons of Game of Thrones felt (6 and 7 episodes instead of 10) and it seems like the series is actually starting out that way.
SPOILERS: I was thinking about the same thing. Honestly if they had just spent 10-15 more minutes after Winternight it might have worked with some emotional goodbyes. We needed to see more of the mourning and trauma everyone was experiencing along with some protesting of letting the 4 leave with Moraine. So the town, the parents and the four are just going to allow them to leave with an Aes Sedai with no protest or skepticism? That just did not work for me.
It would have been much better if they would have done it more like the books. With Moiraine hiding that she’s Aes Sedai and not that really cheesy Inn scene in the stormy night. That was B level tv. Period. Also, like the books, Moiraine sneaking them out in the middle of the night would have been better. That leaving while the trollocs were coming down the mountain was so bad. Please. Overall though, I liked the shows. 7/10 episode 1. 8/10 episode 2. Haven’t seen ep 3 as well.
I'm pretty salty about Nynaeve's story about the previous wisdom. Am I wrong or did she say Aes Sedai didn't want her because she turned up looking rough? That goes completely against everything we know about them in the books which make a big deal about class not meaning anything when you enter The White Tower.
That REALLY bugged me. Like the White Tower is DESPERATE for new initiates, WTF they bring classist issues to the white tower, they have a whole wack of other internal struggles without adding random hatred of the "poors".
I hope that later they introduce that she wasn't just turned away but failed her tests or something more legitimate than "ew peasant girl" especially considering who the fucking Amyrlin seat is
@@TheOnlyWay2Go. LIKE ARRRRRRRRRG The freakin Amyrlin Seat is a fisher girl. ARRRRRG. So many choices in these first 3 episodes make me want to scream! lol
Clearly, this isn't the real reason she was turned away. She was probably simply too weak. But would Aes Sedai, from the high of their self-perceived importance, would even begin to explain that to a little girl? No. So, of course, this little girl would get the idea that she was turned away for the wrong reason.
The showrunner said in an interview that he got 11,000 notes from Amazon execs and it shows. The pilot episode definitely feels like a bunch of randos tampered with it.
Which I don’t understand! The world of the wheel of time is jam packed with strong female characters. There aren’t many fantasy series where half the protagonists and villains are women and very powerful women at that!! In the entire series of books women are shown to be smarter and as powerful as men and just as evil in their own way. This series stinks of clueless studio intervention.
The scene I’m most disappointed was cut from the book was where Rand drags Tam through the woods. Not only was it a great showcase of how innocent and unprepared Rand was at that point, it also contained a vital point of character development. Tam’s fevered mumblings and the questions they forced Rand to ask formed a crucial part of his character in the early books, and went a long way to explaining his near insane stubbornness. I understand why they cut it, as it relied so heavily on internal monologue that it would be almost impossible to adapt to the screen, but it was still disappointing. Seeing the full horror of the Trolloc attack was a good consolation prize though.
@@tyleredwards9799 They cover the first third of book one, sort of. They seem to be condensing the Matt and Rand storyline quite a bit, as well as Perrin and Egwene’s. At the same time, the whole storyline with Moirane and Logan is a new addition.
@@TheSjuris Yeah...but that's SUCH a stupid decision...there REALLY shouldn't be any mystery. At least not NEARLY as much as theya re giving it...it's just a silly baity hook.
What I find weird about episode 1 is that being a blacksmith is a huge part of Perrin's character. In the book whenever we are in his mind he relates almost everything to blacksmithing, but in the show we never see him doing anything in the forge. His girl is the one actually working in there. He visits her there once and goes there to pick up an axe during the attack. They should've at least had him working along side her at some point. It just feels off.
of course she is doing all the blacksmithing btw her character was 100% artificially added for no apparent reason other than well... it's as if you haven't lived in the world for the last X years
You know Michael McElhatton is good when he can portray a Roose Bolton that feels deceptive and treacherous and a Tam al'Thor that feels warm and protective without changing much of his appearance.
My biggest annoyance is the pacing issue in Ep 1 with Moiraine "convincing" them to leave...these are supposed to be the most stubborn people alive and they're just like "okey dokes, let's leave the village because you said we should".
At the end of some of the audiobooks, Robert Jordan mentions the themes he's exploring in the books. One of those themes is how unrealistic it is for an unknown person to walk into a country town and say "come with me on an adventure b/c I need you to save the world" and people just dropping everything to follow along. It's just another example of the show using a single ridiculous plot device to accelerate the story and that's what led to this weird rushed and hodge-podgy kind of feeling that is turning everyone off.
Read the books again son, Moiraine told everyone not to tell anybody they were leaving in person. Just leave a note is what she told Rand to do. Jesus.
Agreed. Robert Jordan literally said that was his intention. That these heroes wouldn't just be gun ho to be a hero. They would want to ditch her if they could.
The weirdest part about it all for me: "Phew, that Trolloc raiding party just really wrecked our village. Oh, there is an entire army of 300 of them coming over the ridge right now. Quick! You must leave with us!" "We?" "Yeah, like, only you four. Quick, before they are here and kill everybody you grew up with, while they just idly sit around in the town square." "Okey Dokey! Bye Dad! Bye Uncle Will! Die quickly! See ya!" That was the moment i decided an episode 2 wasn't worth my time. I mean, who the fuck wrote that shit?
Mat would never steal from a girl in the two rivers. You say that your favorite thing Mat does is bow to Egwene in the rebel camp because she's from the two rivers and no body puts Egwene in the cornor but stealing from one is alright. Unmarried sex in the two rivers. Wtf
Mat was honest, and a man of his word. Though he wasn't someone to run away from his responsibilities or even responsibilities by proxie ie when Tam gets the boys to unload the brandy in the books
I love how Robert Jordan specifically says in an interview for the audio books that country folk wouldn't just take off with some stranger just because they told them they were this prophesied figure... and then the show does this.
They did this in the book too man, why are people bothered by that. In the book moraine tells rand, mat and Perrin to come leave, and they do just, but egwene also joins them then.
@@vol94 they leave in the books not because Moiraine drops prophecy on them though. She tells them they are being hunted but doesn’t give them a reason and the boys rationalize it by asking around and finding out their homesteads where the only ones that were attacked directly.
@@Caedus696 bro, she might have given him a coin but here she singlehandely killed tons of trollocs. Dont you think that you would be quick to obey someone who just destroyed a throng of monsters by herself and her partner.
To be honest I don't like that they removed Rand carrying Tam to Two Rivers on Winternight scene bcs I feel like it's a huge characterization point for Rand, and also in the book he was so grateful when Moiraine healed Tam yet in the show he straight up accusing Moiraine without saying a word of thanks. I mean, Rand is woolheaded and stubborn but he's not an ungrateful ass :(
@Tom Ford upon rewatch I think they did it to keep up the Dragon Reborn mystery, so I understand. It's just, his desperation when Nynaeve said she couldn't do anything for his father made me cry when reading the book (also his relief after Moiraine healed him), it's one of my fav moments so I'm sad it's not in the show :'(
Yeah, to be honest, I also felt like they were pushing his character to be sort of a suspicious brat, maybe they want to give him space to grow from where he is right now... He's not just acting up with Moiraine, he's also being a douchebag to his friends, especially Egwene, he's hurt and revengeful.
I am okay with the omission with the caveat that it gives them the opportunity to use it as a flashback in a later episode. The cardinal sin was Tam being awake and watching them ride off away from town.
I'm not sure how you can say those are a good adaptation of the characters from the book. Moiraine is crafty, manipulative, authoritative, charismatic. She doesn't walk in announcing herself as an aes sedai. Lan is protective of his aes sedais honor, of her life. He's furtivity incarnate. He wouldn't let rand question her like that right after she saved his father. He wouldn't barge into an inn, standing like a dumbass in front of the open door to make sure everyone notices them. Mat is a prankster with a strong moral code. Not a thief. He has loving parents, and always dreamt of traveling, never wanting to go back home, with nothing attaching him there. Leaving his sisters to a couple of deadbeats that might as well let them starve is not something mat would do, and if he did, the only thing he would think about would be coming back. After all, mat is the guy would went to face the black ajah to help Elayne and nynaeve. Perrin is temperance incarnate. He would never swing in haste, as he knows a careless strike can ruin a whole day of work. Perrin is also a deeply loving man. The Perrin of the book would probably split his veins open if he killed his wife. He certainly would not start a new love story less than a year after killing his wife with his own hands. So are trey going to fuck up the story of Perrin and faile, or are they going to fuck up even more his personality. This is a massive trauma he needs to deal with. And one that is completely divorced from his arc. His arc being that he has to come to term with the wolf in him, wolf that overwhelmed him and made him act against his careful nature, killing whitecloak, and act that follows him for the whole story and make him dread this part of him that is so alien to who he is at the start. Rand's defining arc for the first few books is to come to term with what he heard tam say in his fever. But well, no fever, so, what is Rand's arc, then? Nynaeve is already aware that her listening to the wind is linked to the one power. Guess her arc for the first few books where she has to accept that is also gone, then. And now nynaeve is able to get rid of a trolloc by herself, unarmed? Sure... We all know nynaeve as a fearsome killer. That's who she is, someone who would kill at the drop of a hat. Thom's going with them because of his desire to help them deal with aes sedais like he couldn't help his nefew. But when they meet him, there's no aes sedais. So wtf? No Min? No mordeth? So what about Padan Fain's arc, then ? Because the Padan fain we know and love and fits so well the actor can only exist because of mordeth. Yeah, they might have some very surface level similarity with the characters of the book, but their essence has been stripped from them.
"One of you is the dragon!" - first thing she says to them!?. who thought that was a good idea? what gets me is all problems are story telling and screen writing. 10s of millions of dollars and excellent actors and craftsman and it's all in the garbage because of incompetent screen writing and poor pacing on the directors part. They literally tossed all the potential tension from the story into the waste bin first thing - and now the dragon is "supposed to save us". when they dumbed all this down for tv they also removed all the main drivers of mystery, and tension. The world also felt small to me despite all the sweeping panoramas - to little time with the characters traveling and toomuch jumping around from thing to thing to thing
@@TheWheelTurns wheel of time is the recipe for the best meal of your life. The show changed half the ingredients, forgot a few of the others, and halved the time in the oven.
@@TheAsmodha yeah but Tam was fighting the Mighty Narg! Seriously though Tam needs to get back into practice, good thing the other blademasters did not see that
"Lets go run away from a horde of monsters and leave the weapons here, so we can onyl relly on Lan, Moraine and maybe Rand" Not just Perrin not having his axe, but also Mat without his quarterstaff (eith which he could have saved his sisters from trollocs and then took them to safety), but also both of them lacking the longbows Two river area is famous for
@@timothycotner3492 [SPOILERS] IIRC Mat kept his original bow until leaving Ebou Dar and him losing it was quite an event. All three grew up accustomed to stalking in the forest and hunting small and big game. I think even the women were very good with slings, but not the bow. The longbow is one of the defining characteristics of the Two Rivers people and marks their origin when venturing into the wider world. Each character losing or neglecting the bow has some symbolic meaning.
I understand some changes (not liking them still), like cutting out Elyas, stopping at the first city and meeting Min there etc. due to limited screen time. Other changes were just stupid. Moraine not explaing the difference between saidar and saidin, how saidin is tainted and causes men that can channel going insane. Or even Perring mentioning it that Aes Sedai are going to try to catch a "False Dragon", before he causes another breaking. Cutting out the Dragons death causing the Breaking The idea that the Dragon reborn could be a woman. I mean WTF, the main thing about the danger regarding the Dragon reborn is that he is a man that can channel and could go insane before defeating the dark one. Tam al Thor not mummbling about Rand not being his son, not mentioning how he was a soldier. That wouldn't have taken much time. Healing having no effect on one getting healed by the One power. And with that Tam just staying in the village instead of going out with his son, since he is the most capable fighter in the Two rivers. Lan not noticing the heron marked sword and asking Rand how the heck did a farmer got a sword like that. Not mentioning or showing that the Two rivers is famous for its bows. They could just shown crows following them and getting killed by arrows with Lan mentioning that the vultures can be spies for the Dark ones, saying that he hopes they haven't already alerted a Fade of their location.And the only kills of Trolocs being made by a group of women with farming tools. And offcourse Perin. Him being a man that likes to drink with his budies, even when his pregnant wife is working ad a blacksmith. Her being a blacksmith and not him. I mean his whole arch is about transforming from a blacksmith and accepting being a leader. Together with him "growing up" and deciding to put down his battle axe he made and replacing it with his thrusted hammer, which can alsonmake things, not just kills
Also them saying that Dragon Reborn can be a woman and saying all 4 of them, including Egwene, are Ta'veren right away is giving me some bad vibes. Because they focused more on her than Rand. She had the most screentime in my opinion. She isn't ta'veren in the books, Robert Jordan Confirmed it. My theory is they might be trying to make Egwene the Dragon Reborn instead of Rand in the show "subverting our expectations" and fucking up the whole story. I don't know why but the lack of focus on Rand is giving me a bit of a bad feeling about this.
it's Amazon and it's 2021. this show never had a chance. they're basically pissing on Jordan's legacy at this point. and to think Mrs. Jordan signed off on this garbage. she saw the dollar signs and sold her, and her late husband's, souls.
@@leshtricity she didn't thought. Rafe talked a good game at first when they were buying the rights... but both Harriet and Brandon both are "Contributing Producers" and Brandon said they have absolutely zero influence on what happens in the show. They can make suggestions but Rafe decides what goes and he has already shown he has no problem at all ignoring suggestions like Brandon made to use the stories from the books to show the characters motivations and reasons for the decisions they make. Harriet is 82 and not as young and spry and she used to be so she can't be as hands on as I sure she would like to be. It's a shame really.
Agreed. Atheist it didn't take 8 seasons to let us down. But to be fair I'll watch it all. Lol. I'm too invested in the books to not watch it. Even if it's just a weird fan fiction cover of the books.
SPOILERS!!!: Okay, so I know the pinnacle display of Moiraine's power was throwing houses at trollocs, but ripping a trolloc in half with weaves of air was pretty hard core.
Hey remember when Peter Jackson’s lotr trilogy dropped and it was hailed as a masterpiece because it stuck to the books? Hey remember when game of thrones dropped and everyone was hooked because it stuck to the books? Hey remember when wheel of time dropped and they forgot what books were..perrins married,mats dads a drunk,mat now says `prick`,everyone’s the dragon reborn,iconic characters are cut (r.I.p senn bui),the skinny innkeeper is now a 20 year old university girl dark friend and the white tower now sends away the dishevelled?..
I’m honestly surprised you didn’t mention the conversation between Moiraine and Nynaeve. That was the part that REALLY got on my fuckin nerves. Not because of Nynaeve’s backstory (let’s just ignore the dumbassery of “oh, the Dragon could be a boy OR a girl, we don’t know”), but because of the previous Wisdom’s backstory. The Tower would *_never_* turn a woman away who wanted to be an initiate. For *_any_* reason. Siuan was just as poor if not poorer, and she’s the fucking Amyrlin Seat. Else Grinwell was a farmgirl who couldn’t even sense _saidar_ to save her life let alone touch it, and she was still accepted as a novice. The White Tower couldn’t *_afford_* to refuse anybody, dwindling in number as they were. Nynaeve was misinformed about what happened, or she outright lied, or Rafe Judkins fucked up the White Tower beyond all recognition. Those are the possibilities we’re left with.
I've seen one episode and I couldn't be more let down. The show looks great, the acting is great, special effects are decent for a show with budget constraints, but the story! Could they not have found writers that did more than just skim the fucking novels??
This was the biggest let down for me, aside from the Perrin's wife thing. I don't believe he had one in the beginning did he? I mean, where the hell did she come from? I know it's been a bit since I've read the first book, but what the fuckity...
So here's a speculation for you: Are you sure Nayneve told the truth? Better yet, are you sure the previous wisdom told the truth? You just assume that a character said it so it's solid hard fact. Exactly because of all the things you mentioned, I personally think it must be something we will learn to be a lei told by the old wisdom.
Moraine just announcing one of them is the dragon in the middle of the village actually made me pause and jump out out of my seat and say what the fuck.
Yeah that was odd to me as well. The dragon is supposed to be in many ways a despised figure who no one would want to be. "Whoever the dragon is" needs to be eased into that acceptance of their role, lest they hare off in some random direction (even more).
It was as dumb as her and Lan just busting into the inn like AES SEDA HERE YALL. And also as dumb as them knowing the shadowspawn were coming in advance.
Spoilers,. Period. We never got Tam‘s backstory, his fever dream, I think that was something lost, it’s part of Rands ark, how he learns, and struggles with who his father is,
This could be happenning later on, they can always show if they had a moment during their way from farm to emons field. What I didnt like was how Moreine healed Tam quickly and they all bailed right away.
Also spoilers: I'm pretty sure that'll come. It's tied to Rand's "origin" story and the prophecy. I think we'll get to know some of it when Moiraine or Lan notices the heron. They really, REALLY wanted the audience to see it.
A few things I really wish they would have done: 1. Start the show off the same as the book with Tam and Rand walking to Emond's Field. This would have explained a little of the town, the people, their relationships, and why Tam is no longer married. 2. The other thing I really wish they would have shown was the struggle Rand had getting Tam back to town after the attack. This would have helped show the significance of the Tam's sword and why Rand had to take it with him. In the show it wasn't even brought up and when they leave, Tam is in good health so Rand has no bond with the sword like he does in the books. 3. The episode should have ended with Rand and Tam arriving in a decimated town and the next episode could have started with showing the attack in town. 4. I also think Perrin's character got screwed in so many ways. He's married just to have her die? Is he a blacksmith? Where's Haral Luhhan? They could have spent two minutes showing him working in the forge and showing his strength and how he's really a gentle giant who doesn't know anything else other than the forge. I get what they're trying to do in the show, but I think it is unnecessary. The actors are great, the performances are great (give Perrin a little more dialogue/background), the settings are spectacular, and the trollocs are exactly as I imagined. They could have given a good foundation with a few changes, but I think if someone watches this without reading the books they will have no attachment to Emond's Field or have any care for the bond between Rand and the sword he carries. I have a feeling they are going to try to jam in the missing parts later and I think that's going to be a big mistake in the story telling.
Agreed. Also, to me, the characters don't feel the same as in the books. They feel older, more mature in a way. They don't exude that same small-town innocence and naiveté as in the books. Perrin, rather than feeling clumsy around women, is now a married man in what appears to be a less than stellar marriage. Rhand, rather than being the guy who's shy around women, especially around Egwene, is now having a sexual relationship with her. The only hope we have is that if they're leaving out this much good, they're probably leaving out a lot of the bad as well. Especially the eternal battle of the sexes with the women of the group regarding the men as clumsy oafs who can't be left to their own devices lest they get everyone into trouble, and the men believing the women to be naive and weak and in constant need of protection. Even though throughout the entire series both sexes have demonstrated their competence countless times by saving the others when things went south. Man, that blind stupidity really started to grate on me...
I see it as this the show would be really good if you havent read the books and expected certain things. The changes they made so far are to much for me to enjoy this as the wheel of time. I believe I am done watching. Ill give it one more chance next week but I find myself not enjoying it despite the good selection in actors and the phenomenal incorporation of magic which most shows/movies on magic fail utterly.
Honestly, Point 2 broken my interest in this show. This was such an important moment early on, they had no business excluding that scene from the show. If they treat important moments like that in such a way (Literally omitting it entirely), then I don't want to see what else gets omitted. I'm not going to tarnish my memory of this amazing series with this lol
@@A1phaz0ne After a few episodes, I understand why they kept it out. They are keeping the Dragon Reborn a secret from the viewers, unlike the books, so I get why they kept it out. Our memory of the books will never change, but I am still enjoying the show, I just wish they could have done 10-12 episodes each season to really flesh out the characters/locations.
They probably didnt do point 2 cause that would have given away the game so to speak about who the dragon is. It feels like some of the decisions in the show are driven by trying to trick new viewers/non book readers to who the dragon is. They seem to want to spent equal time with each of them to keep the mystery going even as book readers roll their eyes at it and it sacrifices key moments.
Episode 1 was rough for me. I honestly don't understand most of the changes they made like giving Perrin a wife only to kill her off. Changes to Mat made sense to me and I like that he his more like his self after the characterization. So far they've nailed Rand's personality. Overall though it seemed like a sloppy opening to me unfortunately. Episode 2 is the best of the three first episodes in my opinion however.
Sadly they made Mat a Zoomer Edgelord long before he found the dagger....I liked his character the most in the books, but the pretty much destroyed it in the series.
@@jacobyrassilon good point. I feel like all the characters are hurt by being aged up. And yet they seem more clueless about what's going on around them. And they're all extremely calm about the idea that one of them might be the equivalent to a doomsday weapon.
I agree I liked episode 2 the best and while I was fine with some of the changes, such as with matt and cutting some of details, some of the the changes really bothered me. Perrin wife said about 4 words before Perrin murders her. And yes that's a more interesting death than many others but really wasn't worth writing in a whole new character.
Personally I think Perrin’s change makes a lot of sense. Having accidentally killed his own wife in the fight makes it far more believable for him to be so reluctant about fighting later on, certainly much more believable and personal than him being torn up about killing some anonymous whitecloaks. It also give a plausibility to his general careful demeanor and fear of potentially harming others without having to go into the “big strong kid” backstory and him not really knowing his own strength.
No him having a wife and have him kill her is a really good way of showing the audience why he is slow and quite reserved. I think having him have a wife was an excellent decision
The problem I see with Egwene being Ta’veren is it takes away her agency. She was the only one among the Emond’s fielders to embrace the changes in her life and actively pursue them. While the others had agency in actively fighting their destinies, Egwene’s story was better that all the things she did was for herself and what she believed was right to do, not what the pattern wanted.
No they are more easily digested by woke people that way. Dont get me wrong i have nothing against woman taveren, Birgitta is one of my favourite characters but this is a disgusting implant to a beloved series of books to show how woke they are. Men are not reborn into female bodies in the wheel of time and its bullshit and before anyone refrences Demandred. He was not reborn as a women he was placed in a women's body by the dark one. I hate when adapters mess with the plots of my favourite books for the sake of condencing the material, but I hate it even more when they do it for the sake of gender identity. I mean come on these books are already filled to the brim with power drunk females who constantly shit on male counterparts for little to no more reason that they are lowly men. This was pretty damn woke way before the coin was termed and it seems like they are just going to keep pushing the envelope. I hate to say it but theres a good chance i wont continue watching if this crap keeps happening. I mean I almost wouldn't be suprised if they don't make Egwene the dragon reborn.
@@LordRahl2266 This was so hard to read. No one can discuss anything with you because you're sprouting off about power drunk women in the Wot universe. You're doing the too edgy for the Internet sthick and it's ooooooold. Pretty sure you're at the wrong channel, if that's how you think about media.
@@20storiesunder It's no sthick. It's the way I feel about the liberties taken with a great story from my childhood. It completely ruins my immersion when things like this get shoved into movies and shows just for the sake of gender identity. And yes if you have read any of the books you would know what I'm talking when I talk the role of feminine superiority in these books and how men are put down upon. I loved the books and though that particular part of them was ridden a bit too far in my opinion I also found it enduring as it was a large part of the universe that Jordan wove and thought of it as a sort of alternative history to own in regards to pre-modern society. But messing with a story I have read and reread for the last 15 year's just to push an agenda to show what chauvinistic pigs men were and how woke we need to be now to make up for it is just stupid. If you or anyone wants to write another woke book about another strong female protagonist and upholding strong feminist morals that more or may not hint a true meaning of superiority by making lowly men pay for the crimes their forefathers committed against against woman and who they themselves weren't even alive to see more power to you. I hope it sells a million copies, hell I might even read it myself and love it. But leave the legacy of one of the greatest fantasy literary artists who has managed to inspire the lives of millions of others alone.
Shout out to the actor playing Padan Fain. I feel he takes on the essence of the role well. I'm excited to see where it goes. I only seen one episode so far, but I really enjoyed it
Totally agree. The scene with the Reds chasing down the one fellow at the beginning and saying the power is for women only - that could be the Reds being arrogant, but they could have taken that moment to clarify the different sides of the power. Instead, she said it made the power stink. How would she know? 20 minutes in I turned it off. So many screw ups already.
@@shawnboundy3716 I thought about that reds scene as well. I chalked it up to it was the reds outlook. But I do agree they said it to be woke as well. Two birds one stone. Everything that comes out is corrupted with wokeness, it’s disappointing but not surprising.
It is and doesn’t make sense. She didn’t even know there was three tavavirin in the two rivers. She found that out there. She was only looking for a kid the right age range
I only caught that on my 2nd watch, but as for the post apocalyptic setting, I really dig that last shot of what looks like a ruined modern city with skyscrapers at the end of the cold open. Kind of subtle but it's totally there for those who still believe it's "medieval fantasy"!
It's near the Two Rivers, and no one goes there to investigate? The Two Rivers would be a hub for expeditions into the ancient but more advanced ruins. The breaking was highly exaggerated? It's a spectacle, looks cool, but ultimately doesn't really make sense in the context of the world. Maybe if it was in a different part of the world that would be cool. Near the Two Rivers, it makes no sense. When people say it's Medieval, they don't mean a specific time period, it's a stage in human organization and technological progress. I look at it more like the Renaissance Era, but again, that just refers to a stage of human progress. Everyone knows it's post apocalyptic if you read the books or even just listened to the dialog.
Me: oooh, what epic powers will Moiraine use to fight the last wave of the horde? Fire? More lightning? And earthquake? Moiraine- “I’m just gonna use this brick”
So, I get why they made Mat’s dad a bit of a scum bag. But It makes me sad. It is only forgivable in comparison to what they did to Bran al’Vere. A *SKINNY* inn keeper? Absolutely unacceptable. 1/10. Joking. But also serious.
@@dp9629 exactly! What they have done to the Cauthon's has really bothered me. At least with the other changes, I might not personally like them but I can kind of see the reasons they might have done it, but not this, it's so needless
@@M4tt888_ maybe I'm just taking it too personally lol it's just kinda hard not to be frustrated with it when a person has fallen in love with these characters and how they were written.
@@dp9629 I 100% agree, its mu favourite book series and for 20 years abel cauthon has been a stand up guy and overnight they've done a character assassination on him 😂 It makes me sad as well becasue now he probably can't be Tam's buddy on the run hiding in the woods from the white cloaks later on. Little things like that.
I have appreciated your reviews in the past, however what they did with Matt was stupid. Saving his sisters is good, but the books reference his parents as good people who he learned from and uses. It makes no sense. Then let's just give Perrin a wife and fridge her. This destroys one of my favorite parts of the books where the three boys constantly think the other ones understand women better. Just unnecessary changes.
100% agree. Spoilers ahead in case you made it to this comment without seeing any already somehow. The backstories to these main characters is so crucial to defining their characters and the changes with Mat's parents and Perrin's wife (and how HE is the one to kill her?!) make them feel like completely different people from the books. Standing in Perrin's shoes, I would be traumatized beyond repair, and now that is all I am going to see in him, that he is f____ed up enough to have murdered his own wife. I get that they want to display his struggle with blood lust, but that was not the way to do it, it feels like they broke him. And Mat's character is now kind of reversed in that his true good nature steeps from a desire to not be like his parents and his proclivity towards roguishness is due to the influence of his parents, rather than his true good nature being instilled in him by his solid parental upbringing and his roguishness being a character trait specific to him. Mat was my favorite character in the books but he feels...weaker...in the show. :(
Unnecessary changes but I think they did it to make you have sympathy for Mat, otherwise he's just a roguish character. The dynamic with his parents builds into his tenderness towards his sisters. I don't agree with it but I understand why they did it.
@Rheumattica I am actually enjoying all the other aspects of the show as it continues, I just absolutely hate these 2 main character backstory changes. There are going to have to be changes from the books for TV, that's unavoidable, but I think they are doing a pretty good job of it with those exceptions. EDIT: SPOILERS - after watching episode 8 I am so so so disappointed in the show which now feels like it has completely ruined the story. Rand uses an sa'angreal (incorrectly portrayed and used) rather than allowing him his protagonist level power...some accepted level nobody gets to steal his power flex on the tollocs...Nynaeve dies/burns out only to be immediately resurrected/healed by Egwene's tears and a trickle of unskilled Power...Lan cant track Moraine and Rand...Nynaeve tells him how he can yet he ends up doing nothing...Perrin...still does nothing...Loial apparently fake dies...Agelmar dies, thanks a lot ladies...the horn is already found and just stored away in the floor...Moraine is stilled/blocked?! The show is no longer even close to the "heart" of the story, just looking for cheap thrills and hollow fakeouts.
I’d rather have seen rand or mat find Perrin in the forge. And moraines “light give me strength”… should have shown her pull an angriel (preferably the one being folded in cloth at the start)
@@philip7922 yeah! She’s meant to have one! It’s a whole sub plot! “The tower wants its prized artefact returned” I wonder if the horse, carved, figurine will be one… Cause that will make nonsense
When Fain first appeared on screen my girlfriend (non book reader) said, " I can already tell I'm going to like this guy." I just kind of looked at her.
The show is a massive disappointment so far. There's no real gravitas, just tiresome ponderous worry about some vague evil. The plotting is thin and uninteresting, and the visual compositions are thoroughly television level rather than cinematic; you can see in many parts how badly this show wants to be "Lord of the Ring" and it's so far off. Worst of all, the characters have little-to-no personality.
I really missed Mordeth lol. Love the fact that we went to shadar logoth but man, Mordeth made that so creepy in the books, would've loved to see him.. other than that, i agree with most of the criticism on here, i hope they continue to improve as the series goes on, they showed some promise at least
Without Mordeth it's going to really dilute Faine's influence in the later books. The fact that Mordeth didn't make the cut but Paren gets a wife that didn't exist instead is driving me batty.
My only big problems were Moraines whole “Men thought they could cage darkness” because that’s just not really true, the whole 4 Ta’veren thing, Egwene already had such a huge story, she doesn’t need more and the idea that a woman can be the Dragon Reborn completely goes against the story. The whole reason everyone is scared of the Dragon Reborn is because he’s a man that can channel and they are bound to go insane. If a woman was the Dragon, theirs no fear of that. And then lastly the whole Perrin has a wife thing, seems unnecessary. That stuff being said, the scenery and acting was really really good. The show has some problems already but also lots of positives, and I think they will be able to fix it.
I feel like making Egwene Ta’veren feels like a consolation prize as well. “Oh here, you can be Ta’veren too.” It undercuts her character a bit and adds nothing because unless they change A LOT, her story isn’t going to change. I can get over it, I just wish I didn’t have to. Also to your comments about the dragon reborn, I agree completely. On the other hand, I think the show compensates for that by shifting the focus of fear from a man who can channel to the significance of the breaking. I don’t think it’s done well, but it’s still there and I wish they had just kept it the same as the books. I still really like the show cause the highs are HIGH, it’s just a lot of little stuff that could have easily been avoided.
Do other people feel like Egwene potentially being the Dragon is a huge change to story? Won't this impact not only the one power and how it works, but also An'greal and circles. I feel like this impacts the rules of the world which has impacted and created cultures and norms of society not to mention the prophecies!!!
They didn't think that far ahead they just needed a woman to add mystery to the dragon reveal. They even say (pretty awkwardly) that the dragon might be a man or woman, which makes no sense in the universe
This is really a thing that I can’t wrap my head around… Because it’s the core of the story that the Dragon Reborn is a man and that is the whole reason why men aren’t allowed to channel and that is why they are hunted etc etc. It feels like a ‘Gender equality’ step from Amazon and it bothers me a lot. Maybe I’m overthinking it? I don’t know.
@@Valywen I think a lot of this stuff now is just to stir up controversy and get people to talk. They don't believe in the story enough for it to stand on it's own so they manufacture real world drama for free advertising.
I mean I'm dealing with it but it's not a well thought out change. Part of the danger if the dragon is because he is certain to go insane even if he saves the world. The legend behind it makes no sense if a "good" dragon is a coin flip
@@liamhemmings9039 it is only an 8% increase in uncertainty of who it is from the original books. They could have easily made Matt's luck or Perrin's abilities with wolves seem related to the power. Or they just could have pushed Logaine as a possibility harder which they seemed to do anyway if they really wanted to keep it up in the air. None of these options would have changed a ton of the rules of the world.
Episode One was just bad. If I wasn't such a fan of the books I probably wouldn't have made it through the first 30 minutes. No connection to the characters at all, fundamental changes to core concepts, editing and music that made it feel like a CW show for tweens...I hope they step up their game because that was pretty bad.
I have to say... The FOUR ta'veren line in the cold open... And the fact the Dragon could be a man or woman? Like right away in episode 1 I am very concerned. Egwene has a great (if insufferable at times) arc. It adds nothing of value but social justice to add her in as potentially being the Dragon.
Also, I liked the changes to Matt and Perrin...but I thought the loss of the horror elements and the creepiness of the book. The mysterious rider that wind doesn't seem to touch, the midnight dragging of Tam with his fever dreams and the rider on the road. The mystery. These changes just gave it all away. Trollocs, fades, the dragon reborn, Aes Sedai being recognized by villagers. No mysterious strangers, no unknown horrors, no unexplained fleeing the town... And no Thom Merrilin!! Crazy! They should have had more faith with a three episode drop to actually have the three episodes build together. It's such a rush so far.
It adds a more compelling reason for her to leave the village. For someone who has never read the books it adds more intrigue to the story too, for them to think it could be her as well.
>The FOUR ta'veren line in the cold open... And the fact the Dragon could be a man or woman literally this fucking why, that was like one of the key themes of the world will they convert any other dragons reborn or false dragons to female as well?
I agree, and I read that as a sign of disrespect for the original material. Moraine announcing herself as Aes Sedai and making a big show of entering the inn when she's supposed to be "undercover" was also a very bad sign that the story isn't really being respected.
I agree. I can accept Egwene as Ta'veren (even if kinda break the theme of the Divine Male Trinity: the three are basically Thor, Odin and Tyr), but making her a possible dragon is just a bad decision. She doesn't need to be a possible Dragon Reborn to shine. And by adding a 50% chance of the Dragon being female they have to change drastically the whole world culture and folklore: they are making the coming of thei savior-destroyer looking less scary. But it is supposed to be scary: male channelers are seen as walking nukes! This is going to change much without truly adding anything. One of the major theme of the book is the balance between Masculinity and Femininity, on multiple levels (cosmic, social, personal...), and being a man or a woman as a strong relevance in the magic system. In this kind of story, changing the sex of a character is a big deal.
I feel like the cutting of Tam's rambling is partly them trying not to be too obvious about Rand. But it is so important for his self-doubt, so I do hope there's a flashback.
But it would have connected moraine questioning of the wisdom about not being from the 2 rivers. Also Moraine could have been passed out from battle and let the scene play as it did in the book... Nynaeve gets some puzzle pieces to chew over then the kids are missing the next day. The whole down in beside themselves on where they went. She sneaks off... good scene good tv, good way to show that she is smart, resourceful, and brave
But it would have connected moraine questioning of the wisdom about not being from the 2 rivers. Also Moraine could have been passed out from battle and let the scene play as it did in the book... Nynaeve gets some puzzle pieces to chew over then the kids are missing the next day. The whole down in beside themselves on where they went. She sneaks off... good scene good tv, good way to show that she is smart, resourceful, and brave
Also, Rand was able to just slump him over a horse instead of needing to make a makeshift sled and pull it himself...so they made the trip feel inconsequential. Also, there was no searching for a healer and the dred that his dad's going to die. Moraine just popped up and was like "oh, Trollic poison. Ok, he's cured"
It’s only a necessary change (that I don’t like as much as any of the rest) because of all the other changes they’ve made like Moraine being publicly named an Aes Sedai straight away and announcing for anyone to hear let alone the “4 of them” that one is the DR, something in the books that would have any of the 4 (3 really since it can’t be Egwene) losing their minds over just the mentioning of it along with half the town in ear shot.
Honestly, I was so let down. I love this book series and I hated how this show portrayed Mat's dad and mother. It was heartbreaking. I liked the innocence of the characters in the book and the molding and shaping of them through trials. There was no need to add or change so many elements. It was heartbreaking. The trollocs were impressive. I believe the shadow spawn were the most spot on element in the show. Also Padan Fain. I didn't feel like this show made any of the characters likeable. I don't have much hope for this show. It has inspired me to reread the series to enjoy how amazingly told this story is... in the books.... not this show.
I felt very let down by the previews where Moraine and Lan made that melodramatic entrance. and I think it's very uneven in the first 3 episodes, but there are great moments in episode 3 and I loved all of episode 4. Rosamunde Pike is perfect I think and a great actress. I live the actress playing Nyneave. I'm going to stick with it. Sophie Okenedo is a brilliant actress too so I have to at least get to Tar Valon. ;)
@@-6ix559 don't see it that way. A more robust series would be more engaging, attract more people. The story could engage more whereas at the moment its so rushed that won't happen
I think the worst thing about the first three episodes is how amazing Barney was and knowing he isn't coming back. It sucks so much to have such a flawless performance only to have it taken away. I am excited to see what Donal Finn does as well, but extremely nervous that he won't live up to how completely perfect Barney was for the role :(
Perrin’s change is a no. Hell no! F**k no! It was a stupid move. And Matt parents being what they are is garbage too. All three boys have a deep attachment to their families, parents included, which pays off multiple times in the books.
I have mixed feelings about the changes. I think Mat's backstory in the adaptation makes his character more compelling from the start but(spoilers) later when Mat defeats Galad and Gawyn in a duel at Tar Valon it wont make sense why he's so skilled with a quarter staff. In the book its explained that his father was masterful with the weapon and taught Mat but in the show I doubt his dad ever touched a staff the way they portrayed him.
I thought it was brilliant because it shows us why he might be afraid of fighting with weapons, which is a big part of his character but all conveyed internally in the books.
Perrin is one of my favourite characters and story arcs in WoT so it is going to take a lot to convince me these choices, both actor and background changes, are going to work. The wife story pissed me off, and not just because we all knew she was going to die but also because their relationship felt completely off… it didn’t feel like newly weds who were in love but two people forced to marry. In fact it felt like he was an abusive husband coming back to apologise. There also seemed very little emotion other than shock at what he’d done. I wonder if there was some backstory of her being pregnant and so forced into marriage, hence the tension between them and so much attention on her midriff, although that may just have been a spectacular display of intelligent foreshadowing 😂
@Tom Ford is that because you know where they’re going with it, or just feel it has merit as a plot device? Atm I just see it as a lazy way to try and explain Perrin’s character and future dislike of the axe. Don’t think the audience are able to understand a character? Change his backstory into one that is difficult to miss… but them don’t change the character enough to match!
I think it will ultimately prove to be a good change. It will help explain his constant guilt (as opposed to just offing a couple bastard Whitecloaks); it will add to his resistance toward taking up the axe; it lends to his struggle against his berserk animalistic side; and there’s even the theory that there is more to his wife’s story than we are getting here, which could be interesting.
Re-watch the scene, when he killed her she was holding the hammer over her head as if she was about to hit him? She doesn't say I love you too when Perrin says I love you, she says I know. So there might be something else with her character.
My biggest complaint in episode one, is I really feel like they did my boy Tam dirty. Even while rusty, a single trolloc shouldn't have been able to touch him. I recognize that for budget and time constraints, you can't really show him fighting off a dozen trollocs, but if we're going to see random townsfolk bring trollocs down, I don't know how one injures a blademaster.
That and how dirty they did Mat's dad. We didn't get much backstory for him in the books, but he wasn't terrible to his family like how they made him out to be in the show.
For anyone who's actually read the series, which I have, cover to cover 3 times since the 1990's , this show is an INSULT and an ABOMINATION. Mr. Rigby is sure to be screaming to return and kick the asses of every moron involved with this. I'm betting his wife is disgusted too.
The list of clumsy and stupid changes made to the story in an effort to "fix it" as opposed to translate it to the screen is what drove me away from this show. The efforts made to cover for every change is forced and pointless. The makers of this show were not people who loved Robert Jordans books, they appear to believe that they needed to save what they believe the story should have been.
Idk what you guys were expecting. Ppl who make tv shows/movies are usually 🤡.. They arent interested in making a good story, or retelling something that is good. 10 years of Wokeness should have alerted all of you to the distortion that would take place to classics like WOT. LOTR is next
@@KobraSnake0813 The show not being good has nothing to do with "wokeness" good god. Everyone loves the actors that were chosen and the power and influence that women have in the show is totally faithful to the books.
@@SugerSprinkledFun an hour ago, you stated that Jordan would be rolling in his grave because the show runners decided that the dragon can be female.. wtf are you on about?
I have to disagree on the change to Mat's family dynamic. Having a family that was prosperous and thus didn't rely on him to support them is what allowed him to be mischievous. He had the free time to go catch badgers in a sack, for example, or wile away hours goofing off because he wasn't the knot keeping his family together. He's always the reluctant hero in the books, trying to avoid fights and responsibility until he accepts his own importance...but not here. He stops his drunk mom from making a scene, he's playing the good big brother, etc. I understand that this was never going to be a direct translation from page to screen, but while Barney is doing a good job with the sarcasm, that just doesn't feel like Mat to me.
Also the fact that the womans circle would never let that happen with the mother and the dad would be thrown out of the village or put in his place and to top it off they made Matt a thief that really got me.
@@jephthahvanroekel2561 great point about the womens circle 👍 and I feel like they are ruining Matt's arc, the changes the dagger makes in him won't stand out as much now as being so out of character, and how will they square someone who never breaks a promise with someone whose ok with stealing from people
@@jephthahvanroekel2561 him being a thief is perfect. The people who love Matt do so because they know his character after book 3. Everyone who's read the books now gets to experience his character turnaround authentically again.
I'm surprised you're so positive about this, given the fact you're a longtime fan of the books. I only read the first book some years ago and I wasn't a fan of the show at all. It was all over the place in my opinion, from weird costume design to the awful CGI to the nonsensical writing and quite amateurish acting. Aside from Moirane and Lan I felt no chemistry between any of the characters. It also tries too hard to be "edgy" and violent when it's not needed, which to me is a cry to present itself as a new GoT when it's clearly not. I felt lost the whole time watching it. I don't understand what the target audience for this show is. It seems to shift between adult and YA, but based on these three episodes I'm gonna say it's YA moonlighting as adult.
Really feel like they would have benefited from having an extra episode to split the Emond's field stuff over two episodes (and maybe even add the prologue but I get why they cut it). Although, it's looking like a great decision to drop 3 episodes at the start - I think people would be much more negative on the show if we'd only gotten this episode this week.
I imagine they focus tested this and found that folks were more engage when they were able to start watching after the group split up and the story deepens.
@@Dochamb3rs I think that would have been a great prologue for the whole series. They didn’t have to do the exact prologue for the book but they could have done it way more epic.
The ending that Daniel mentioned even in this video goes directly against what RJ wanted to have in his books and said so in his own words in interviews where some outsider comes in and says "You're special you have to come with me." and everyone is just like "YEP!". RJ explains himself that he wanted to make it very much like how he saw people in his real life and if someone came into a small town where essentially everyone knows each other they would have looked at that person like they were out of their minds if not firmly, yet politely, asked them to move along. I tried so hard to go into watching this with an open mind that there would have to be concessions taken and not everything would be directly as the books, but I just flat can't get on board with with. WoT is by far one of my favorite series with as much detail as RJ put into it that you can draw a fairly clear picture on just abut anything in your mind and it's like Amazon just sort of went "I know what you want me to draw and exactly how it looks, but I'm going to draw Kermit the Frog." So many unnecessary changes that really could be fixed with a simple line of dialog and I have to disagree with the change to Mat's parents, with as much emphasis the books put on the Women's Circle (Which isn't every woman in the town, Egwene was never in that circle.) they never would have let someone openly cheat on their wife or be a total pos like his parents were. Yes, Mat caused trouble and they refer to them being switched for causing trouble when they were young, but Mat always had a strong moral code when it comes down to it. So much other super important things too, like Tam just sitting up after being healed like he could jump right back into the fight, Healing is supposed to be SUPER jarring to the person being healed, the book equates it to something like being suddenly dunked into the coldest water, and very taxing on the body. Unless you are having just minor stuff healed, which no Aes Sedai would heal something so minor, you don't just sit up from it. You need to eat and sleep and recover almost twice as much because you body has basically been sent into overdrive to heal so quick. *Edit for spelling*
I had exactly the same issues. Abel and Natti have been for me the complete family, and Mat a brat and spoiled for it. I am still unable to get over it. But I guess I have to swallow that part to go on. Mat has been my favourite character in the books and his playfulness had no edge to it , but now it's very edgy, so though I loved Barneys performance, and I am not too happy with him being recast, I just hope they somehow are able to keep the essence of Mat intact. Similarly with Tam just getting up from that wound as though it were a scratch.
I think one of the issues is that the Two Rivers is supposed to be an exception in the world, where it's a very straight laced, conservative community that values integrity, hard work, and community. That moral upbringing and sense of community and care was a pivotal foundation in all of the characters, which is reflected every time they think or talk about home. The dynamic between he sexes, which it's well represented between the Village Council and the Women's Circle is gone, instead turning the Wisdom into some kind of weird celibate priestess? No thanks.
@@vidhyasnair7810 I don't mind the cast actually, that was sort of one part that I didn't really have much issue with and recast stuff can happen for any number of internal reasons. I can see where Daniel is trying to give it the benefit of the doubt with saying it set up the type of character Mat is going to be, but even later in things he always has that sort of reluctance to get into heavy things unless it's dealing with someone he cares about. Not some sort of second parent to things and especially not some irresponsible gambler that would loose more than he had.
@@saintjst7 Yeah, that seemed a bit of a stretch and instead if letting things play out between Rand and Egwene like they do in the books they felt some need to shut it down quick. That all aside too that bit of exchange between Moiraane and Nynaeve where she says her mother was rejected from the tower at a young age (I think she said something like 15.) If they did turn her away they would have done so and said, "You can't channel, sorry." nothing mean about it or reason to hold a grudge. If she could channel they never would have turned her away, even if it was just a little bit, they stress so much in the books how anyone that can is taught how to keep themselves safe if they're not strong enough to become Aes Sedai. The whole setup is just weird.
@@alex-gc5fv I liked Barney Harris too. His acting was good. But I had loved the Cauthons in the book, and that didn't feel good to me. I do get the possible reasons, but regardless it's tough to swallow.
I think Rand and egwene having sex is seriously lessening the nature of their relationship, and it will make moments later on in the series lessened as well. I don’t know how Daniel doesn’t see this.
I woke up at 4am this morning with insomnia and watched the 1st episode, and my honest thought was that to really get into TWoT show will require me to really put my many, many, many, many times I've read the books aside and try to just accept the show on its own. But that will be hard because I spent a lot of time in the episode bogged down in all of the changes. And the changes feel big enough that it doesn't completely feel like the world I know (and love) from the books. The barebones plot was the same, but otherwise it felt like a slightly-off parallel universe of Robert Jordan's books. If I compare it to the LotR and Game of Thrones adaptations, while both made changes from their source material, they still fundamentally felt like very satisfying attempts to bring those worlds to film in ways that felt very like their books (to me, at least). I didn't get that with TWoT. I wondered why they seem to have completely dropped winter hanging on unnaturally long when it should be spring. This is a significant plot point in the first book. And why does Perrin have a wife (can't agree with your assessment of this here)? I can deal with changes that are necessary for an adaptation to work, but changes that don't seem to have any (good) reason always irritate me.
Things that you don't deem as necessary now does not mean they shouldn't be done. I perfectly understand why they gave Perrin a wife, they did it to give an onscreen reason as to why he is so broody, why he doubts himself, why he hates his axe. Don't forget that we don't get to live inside the characters heads like we do in the books. We need physical and visual representations to explain. Also, we are only 3 episodes in. Seems like there is a lot of judgement for a show that is 3 episodes into (hopefully) an 8 season long run. Give it time. And in regards to the world remember its never going to be as expansive as the books. GoT world worked because it is so small scale. Same for LOTR. They aren't massive fantasy worlds.
@@JediKnight20043 he hates his ax because he killed the white cloak and is a gentle giant. They didn't need to give him a wife to accidentally kill. What was she even doing? It looked like she was going to try to hit him with the hammer
@@JediKnight20043 8 seasons? No Fing way it makes it 8 seasons. This is terrible writing. I trust Daniel to do a better job as a writer on this. Or executive producer. These people do not care about the story, only how the IP can be used as a propaganda vessel for modern progressive politics. They made a huge mistake.
@@merc9nine Ahh your one of those. I mean choose not to watch it if you think its that bad. ;) weve had literally 3 episodes 🤣 but since you clearly are an expert in all things TV your opinion is clearly going to make such a difference.
@@JediKnight20043 Saying that LotR or GoT aren't massive fantasy worlds is patently ridiculous. GoT in particular has probably hundreds of character over 2 whole continents. My original statement about both of them compared to TWoT show stands, both LotR and GoT felt like faithful translations of those worlds to a visual medium, while TWoT just doesn't quite feel like the same world of Jordan's books.
Something I noticed that I would have loved to see them do is far more cut-aways. For example when Moraine is talking about Manetheren - would have been great to see that story actually visualised to some small degree. Instead we just look at the characters for 3 minutes and it doesn't do anything to build up the world (like you would see in the LOTR trilogy for example)
Or even get the prologue of The Eye of the World in there to establish exposition for who The Dragon actually was. That first scene FEELS like it was written with a TV/Film adaptation in mind; it would have been perfect. Plus it introduces Ishamael as a formidable foe instead of relying on Halloween Funhouse special effects to make Ba'alzamon seem scary.
I missed Thom in episode one, but if I had to choose Thom or Padan Fain, I would choose to introduce Fain in episode 1. Thoms introduction in episode 3, and his moments with Matt give promise to the character as a whole. There is only so much screen time available for each character, it has to be chosen carefully.
while true, they did get his internal sadness down PAT. sure its not the goofy over exatranat arrogance of thom, but...I think it's better for pacing. After all, Thom in the book, makes you wonder why he's helping them out when even lan doesn't trust him. Seeing his sadness in the show here...you know WHY he's helping them. and why his actions later in the book when he leaves makes more sense than him going "oh here's my backstory. k, bye"
I just watched the first episode and I feel like it was something entirely different from what you watched? Bearing in mind I haven't read the books, I found that none of the characters had any particular chemistry or personality and, Moraine seemed stiff awkward and out of place virtually any time she was on screen. I'm hoping they get better and I plan to watch the whole show, but most of the hype I felt going into this is gone.
I think they all look the part except maybe Perin, but the acting isn't really very good imo. The only exception to this is probably Rand, Tam, and Matt. Moraine is the worst culprit though. She's very stiff and her lines are very detached. Also when she weaves it just looks like overexaggerated interpretive dance. I was surprised she didn't have a swirling ribbon in her hand.
Bruh.. just read the books. The show is A-Typical garbage. The language used by the characters, the morality of the charcters.. nothing like the books. This isnt wheel of time, this is a GOT attempt with the title WOT.
My boyfriend hasn't read the books and said Exactly the same thing. Whether the show matches the books or not, it still needs decent acting and other elements to make it a good show.
I love the moment of Egwene fighting the river rapids at first in the Woman's Circle scene but then she realizes she needs to let go and let the river guide her instead of fighting it, just like how you use saidar.
Except Egwene was never I. The women's circle, the braiding of the hair is a coming of age thing, there is no rituals about it. It was all useless dumb trash.
It might have worked better as a flashback once she's receiving lessons in how to use the power. As it's presented, there's no context for someone new to the story to understand the idea being presented. In episode one, the time could have been much better used for character development or backstory.
I dislike that they portray the Two Rivers as being a hilly/mountainous area, when it's supposed to be fertile farmlands, with some areas being almost a swamp. Also, they do that for Egwene, but completely leave out The Flame and The Void with Rand? Why?
I was upset that they didn’t include the scene where Rand’s father, Tam, is having ‘fever dreams’ post-trolloc raid. The foreshadowing of Rand’s ancestry, and mystery of Tam’s past I felt added a lot of mystery in EOTW (when you’re still debating who from the 4 are going to be LTT)
That scene makes it very obvious who the Dragon Reborn is, so I get why they didn’t include it, but I do have hope for some flashbacks to that later on, because we don’t know it didn’t happen offscreen
@@KillerOfWhales And I think Rand's behavior after words would largely be explained by giving a flashback of that scene, because of dialogue choices he's become more critical of Moiraine then Mat, and we need to empathize with him early on so his transformation as the series goes on lands. Right now he isn't very sympathetic, whereas in the books his distrust of Moiraine is average for the 5 and he's got good reasons to distrust her.
I'm fairly confident the fever dreams scene will be added to the show as a flash back. If you check IMDB you'll see that the actor who plays Tam Al Thor acts in 2 EPISODES! Yet we know that after leaving the town we don't see him again till later books... So I'm entirely certain they'll show flashbacks of the fever dreams along with flashbacks of the Aiel War in later episodes where its revealed who the Dragon Reborn is (Episode 8 most likely)
My problems with the episode: 1) Four Ta'veren?¿ Egwene potentially being the dragon makes absolutely no sense, the entire reason people are so scared about the dragon is that they'll for sure be a male, and hence destroy the world 2) Moiraine just tells them "hey guys one of you four could be the dragon reborn, cool right" 3) The trolloc attack was just super random. If I remember correctly, they only attacked a few other locations apart from Rand's farm, so overall there wasn't so much damage and death. This also allowed Moiraine and Lan to deal with them more easily. But here the trollocs were just going wild attacking everything they could, so then what was the point of the Fade scouting the area and the other intel they already had??
Lan and Moiraine is there. Somehow they allowed half the people get eaten alive before finally showing up. It’s so dumb. And I agree, mentioning Egwene and allowing it to be “a girl or a boy” destroy the entire Saidin/Saidar element with madness/save the world on the balance.
I will say this... One thing D&D did not do is screw up source material when they had it. I really want to like this, but it looks to me like they're screwing this up from the start. This is not looking good.
@@paulnguyen6480 they just destroyed the reason why the saga is how it is. at minute 2 and a half in, first appereance of the Reds and the line "its a power that belong to women only". when? how? how can you trivialize so much the main concept of the story?
So is the dragon supposed to seem like a bad guy? Like it kinda confused me. I didn't pick up on any other bad guys outside of the dragon... I've also never read the books.
@@juanmartin4699 there is a male half and a female half to the power. The male half has been tainted by the dark one, hence any man that can channel the power will eventually go mad (as seen at the start of the first episode). The dragon is meant to be a man that can channel and prophecy says that this man will fight the dark one. But this also means he will lose his mind eventually. You might want to check out the animated short episode "the breaking of the world", it explains some of this stuff
To think Jordan wrote it wrong this whole time and we needed some director and producers to fix everything... Seriously though... the story is written already and they had one job...
It's hard not to feel pissed off. I've enjoyed the books for 20 years and have longed for a TV/Film adaptation. To see them fuck it up so much with the changes and (i hate to say it) woke casting made me turn off. I think i'll just go back and re-read the books.
Everyone keeps touting “film adaptation” like it makes it ok to destroy such an epic saga. It’s a cheap excuse, look at what happened with Star Wars Heir to the Empire - flawlessly executed by a discrete UA-camr DarthAngelus and it follows the books exactly! A good Director a good writer will truly adapt a book by putting in the effort and time instead of taking the easy way out like a high school student reading someone else’s report and embellishing it (poorly) to pass it as their own research and work. They destroyed everything beautiful about WOT, shame on everyone involved!
@@shadowglaive2309 I turned it off after 20 mins or so, when it was obvious Rand and Egwene had just done the nasty. This whole series belongs in the trash bin.
I think you would really have to care about the source material to try and adapt it as close to perfect as possible. I'm not sure anyone working on the show really did that.
Watch the first three episodes. I don't think I'll be continuing. I don't know what that was, but it's not Wheel of Time. Game of Thrones was best the first five seasons when it stayed on book. As the seasons went on and it deviated it got worse, until they finally went past the books and it turned into garbage. The WoT books are loved by many, and there is a reason. This show deviates so much from the books in just it's first episodes that I can't see it getting to a place that made the books so popular. Yes, I understand that things need to be adapted, but it seems that many of the changes didn't need to be. I'll close with my thought that the male leads couldn't be more unlikable if they set out to make it so.
Was thinking along these lines. I get that it is an adaptation but I simply hated the changes, especially Perrin being married and the "four ta'veren" line
The actor playing Rand was clearly doing an homage to Hayden Christensen. The dramatic deaths were pretty funny. Star Trek red shirts got more screen time.
@@chiisana-umi it isn't even the four that is the worst of it. Heard rumors? What nonsense is that? They're famous? What? I don't get the lantern thing either. It didn't even look good. They clearly added that just for the visual but it looked bad. The lanterns looked dingy and the background was too dark or too light. Or Moirain's entrance. Hello I am Aes Sedai.
I think one of my favorite scenes was nyneave teaching egwene to listen to the winds in the forest... It's one of the better displays of the power in the first episode. It just felt awe-inspiring and much more deeper and connected to the world than the scrambling cgi lines lol. I also feel like perhaps it might have been smart to have channeling initially invisible? As if we're seeing it from the perspective of non-channelers. Then they could have saved a little cgi $ and unveiled the look of weaves as certain character began learning to channel later on.
I mean there are parts where hits hidden, when the reds are goign after that man, we don't see the lines affecting the mountain, the wind. and most imporatlty, when rand busts down that door.
Great scene. And I totally agree with you that the channeling should be invisible. I love that in the books, our knowledge is limited by what the main characters know. In the show it seems like they are trying to show us everything before the characters learn about it.
I think you're exactly correct on the weaves - only show the actual weaves when we're seeing through a channeler's POV. Imagine how much cooler that would make when they start combining the two halves down the road and each can see the other's?
Since when is Egwene considered a ta’veren? EoTW pretty much explicitly says that she is reacting to the pattern swirling around Rand, Mat, and Perrin not another cause of the swirl. I started the books to get a good understanding for the show, and literally within 10 minutes they rewrite Jordan’s work. Makes me shudder to think what Amazon has done to Tolkien’s works…
I agree! I came looking in the comments for others appalled at how different the show is from the books! SO different. I don't understand why they take a successful thing and feel the need to change it so drastically.
I got this wierd feeling that they are going to make someone else the Dragon... lots of foreshadowing around Egwene. If I had to pick someone I would say she is the main character.
Am I the only one who found Moiraine's movements strange to the eye? When her and Lan fought the Trolloc's in Emond's Field, I was thrown off by the way she moved during combat half the time.
SPOILER: The fact that they have made Egwene a taveeren and implied that women can also be "the Dragon" is the worst case of forced inclusion I have ever seen, because it hugely contradicts the lore of the Wheel of Time. It's impossible for a woman to be the Dragon because the Dragon is supposed to weild the contaminated SAIDIN and become mad, it's impossible for a woman to weild saidin, women weild SAIDAR and that part of the true source is not contaminated which means they can't get mad. The people fear the Dragon because he is supposed to become mad and destroy the world, again impossible for a woman, it's just ridiculous. Also Perrin having a wife and killing her? WTF were they thinking?
it felt cheap to "develop" mat's character by making his dad a piece of shit just so his mom could drop the one liner of "you're gonna end up just like your father". Able was a stand up dude and Mat looked up to his father in the books. I get that Mat was really always trying to do the right thing but he had his own way of doing it. Just felt cheap. Perrin's arc was honestly the easiest way to explain his character on a time constraint. They missed the boat with Tam not murmuring at all. They wanted to keep the SJW alive with it being 4 when it was only 3 and very clearly a man that is the Dragon. Egwene needs no help with her story she's already got an awesome one ahead of her no need to sully it with sjw
Nah, 4 wasn't enough, it could be 1 of 5!!!!! For a story written in 14 books that was impossible to pare down, about 50% of the content is straight made up. Terrible CGI, terrible pacing and I am so confused by who I should care about. Noone has any rules or guidance, they run around doing whatever they feel like apparently. Plot holing itself. If they don't need their hands to channel, why does that white garbed guy cut off their hands and why don't they burn him toa crisp instead of letting him kill them? Lan wailing does it for me. For a mountain of a man with a face chiseled from granite with hard angles, with piercing blue eyes and the air of a wolf; he seems like a wuss.
@@SM-in1ov CGI was okay, story direction was giving me whiplash, pacing is shit as you said. They did Lan dirty as he almost never cried in the books (I can't remember a single scene of him crying or even wailing in grief, just stoic). And if I hadn't read the books, I'd be so confused as to who is who and why we should care about these characters that have had about 3 minutes exposition of why we should care about them.
IMO, Mats change is bad for the storytelling and for Rand. We dont need another serious character in this story. Having a light hearted comic relief would have been fine, and created better contrast for dagger Mat. Also, Mat is not a thief... stealing the bracelet is BS It also creates a problem because Rand cannot go along with his silliness at all, and he is coming off as a bad person- once again, creating an issue of contrast when Rand goes dark later. Not developing Rand and Tam's relationship is a big mistake IMO Though tropey, I like Perrin's change- it actually explains his character better. I dont understand why they made Nyn born outside the TR... was just... odd I have yet to see why Egwene is included The ta'veren rumour comment is just... odd af
I think they made Nyn born outside for two reasons: she might be the dragon and it gives some color to her backstory. In many ways nyn egwene and Mat had very little backstory in the books. They have gone far to add some ‘main character’ vibes to all of them. Perrins change imo explains his hesitation to use his strength latter on that the books never really got across well. It is problematic to say that the dragon might be female it causes to much dominos effects if applied logically to the world but they will probably just ignore that and gloss over it all once Rand is singled out as the likely dragon.
Absolutely agree regarding Mat’s writing. Not enough or the right character building to set his tue self up before Shadar Logoth. The audience is left thinking “finally getting to know Mat, and dude’s a jerk” after the dagger, and not thinking “This isn’t like him” which was kind of the *foundation of his arc*.
Also, is no one gonna mention Tam just casually using a match to light the lantern? Fire sticks are kinda a big deal. Like why is Perin using a flint later on when he should apparently just bust out of strike anywheres.
They are noticeably out of supplies when he and Egwene are separated. You don't just carry everything in your pockets, especially when you assumed safety and didn't expect to have to leave in a hurry
@@olorin3815 Yeah, I know. I wouldn't call them big, not compared to literal canons which are the more important of her (and Mat's) inventions later on to adapt.
THIS! I rewound it when I thought he used a match and thought "Well shit, RIP Aludra, I guess..." Of all the changes, I think this one bugged me the most.
Love how Nynaeve is being brought to screen. That being said, I hate that they fabricated this new origin for her just to make sure we understand why she doesn’t like Aes Sedai or Moiraine. Like it’s not enough that she’s super protective of her people as a Wisdom, which is her defining trait throughout the whole series. It could have been easily shown and relatable, but no. No, her 13 year old mentor walked a million miles and zzzzz.
@@Echidna23Gaming They turned away women who were too weak, yes. They never mention turning away women who are too poor or who have poor fashion sense. I imagine Siuan, who came from a small fishing village and whose father was a fisherman, was relatively poor and I know she cared nothing about fashion. And she became the Amyrlin Seat.
I love the Shadow Spawn. One improvement would make them perfect for me. I need to see some beaks, feathers, scales, and some trollocs that are more human looking. I know these types of trollocs are more rare, but I want to see a few in every hoard.
I didn’t like that Mat’s family life was bad, or that he was a thief. Makes him nefarious but with a tragic reason, rather than the happy go lucky trickster that he is in the books. I like lighthearted Mat more than coping with bad home life Mat.
But it will also make it feel better when he uses his luck in his favor. Some of the fans of the book *might* even think he could be the main character
I don’t like his back story, but we also know that he goes through probably the best hero arc in the whole story, so I am willing to be patient with how they deal with his story.
Mat just kinda sucks for like 3 whole books. I love this change because it gives him depth and makes us understand a lot of his insistence that he's not a hero and being protective of Olver and the wonder girls later.
You didn’t mention it but I thought the whole “trust the River” with egwene and her surrendering to it was a perfect set up/foreshadowing of the nature of Saidar
@@hanneshaasbroek6607 but it's not hidden anywhere, it makes no sense for Nynaeve to ever do that exercise because she, herself doesn't believe in letting go (yet) and her mother hen personality will prevent her from ever pushing Egwene off of a fucking cliff.
In a way I think they did down-power the Aes Sedai in that it took a lot longer to do anything. Moirane did a LOT of hand waving and drawing from around her to do anything. In the book it seemed a lot more instantaneous, especially how she laid about with the fire in the book. This makes her more susceptible to attack.
I'd understand the down-powering of every Aes Sedai if they had being intensely weaving for several minutes to a few a hours. Fatigue makes everyone slow and prone to mistakes. But being fresh from a rest and taking several seconds for a simple fireball weave? Ridiculous. Simply preposterous. Only Novices are that slow at the most basic of fire weaves. Moiraine is a seasoned Aes Sedai that has decades of experience, she knows how to weave fast. Though that scene at the end of the fight in episode 1, where she flung bricks from the buildings likely would've taken as long as it did in the show with how she had been going about it.
I keep pointing this out, but I love it: Padan Fain's smile literally flashes in the dark in the first few seconds of him appearing. It's chef's kiss. Someone else also pointed out he whistles when he enters, which overlaps the previous scene of the Fade. And then in episode 2 we hear that exact same whistle in shadar logoth, implying a very close pursuit/tracking of him.
When moirain said 4 ta'veren..i was like yeah might as well egwene be one too..cause her storyline has more conveniences than all the others combined..😂
True, but at the same time that's why I liked her not being a Ta'veren, because it gave her a lot more credit as a character with struggles and obstacles than just the universe giving you some plot armor
"I began writing the Wheel of Time because a great many notions had been bouncing around inside my head and they started to coalesce. I wondered what it was really like to be tapped on the shoulder and told you were born to be the savior of mankind. I didn't think it would be very much the way it is in so many books where someone pops up and says, "Hi, I was born to be the savior of mankind, and here's the prophecy," and everybody says, "Oh well, let's go then." I thought self interest would play a big part... .. And then finally there was the thought about something that happens in Tolkien and a lot of other places. The wise old wizard shows up in a country village and says, "You must follow me to save the world." And the villagers say, "Right then, guv, off we go!" Well, I did a lot of growing up in the country, and I've always thought that what those country folk would say is, "Oh, is that so? Look here, have another beer. Have two, on me. I'll be right back. I will, really." And then slip out the back door." - Robert Jordan 1997, Audiobook interview I think the show really missed this point which was the biggest thing that annoyed me about these first episodes. Overall I liked them though and still have high hopes for the rest.
I am glad that the Tolkien estate is really controlling. This crap is what happens when you let people do whatever they want. The dragon reborn can never be a woman. Two Rivers having a bunch of different races makes no sense. Robert Jordan’s worlds was already plenty diverse. I am just gonna say it. The entire cast is white. Egwene is white and Nynaeve is white. 3/5ths on the Edmonds Field group is cast as a POC. The books clearly describe what the character look like. But because they want to make it more modern it has to be diverse. Realism be damned. All Edmonds Fielders look the same. For people who will reply to me and call me racist. Screw you. I would be complaining about the same thing if a book said a character was black, Asian, white or whatever and they recast them as a race different form what was clearly described in the book.
Yea, they went too PC just to make the money. They should of stuck more in line of the story. If they needed to condense it for budget purposes. Just condense the amazing story it already has. Surprised there wasn't a Trans person and police brutality in the first episode just to pander.
@@erickalfaro8389 I hate to break it to you. It’s going to be worse and just like wheel of time, the reasons fans hate it will be seen as traditionalism and Pearl clutching. “The Half black bisexual trans Galadriel sex scene was beautiful, you effin bigot.”
I thought the first few minutes were really campy and awkward (also pissed they didn't start with a shot reimagining the Wind) but then it got to the last third and holy shiiiiiiiit
So glad to hear this. Only watched the first few mins before work to get the feel of it and it was so off putting. The chase and capture seemed so ridiculous (the way the rocks fell, his screams) and all I could think was why, being the character she is and pursuing this man for however long, was Liandrin wearing such perfectly applied lipstick. I read some reviews comparing it to Xena and that’s the feel I got too. Hopefully, when I watch it properly, it gets much better.
The problem with the wind is that to show it, you need to have something blowing in the wind... and to non-book readers that would just conjure up images of the beginning of Forrest Gump.
@@HeavyTopspin Idk if you've seen the drone shots on twitter that were made inside NFL (maybe NBA) stadiums. I imagined something like that, but faster. Like an accelerated drone shot. Which would look dope + the fans would recognize it.
@Aginor's Experiment Nonsense. You wouldn't have to have a single item blowing in the wind to convey the wind. We could start in the peaks of the Mountains of Mist. We see snow blowing and the wind howling. The camera pans down to the slopes where we see dead leaves blown and the limbs of trees shaking in the wind. The camera continues on to Emond's Field where we see the wind disrupting the villagers Winternight preparations. There are many things from the books that are going to be very hard to portray in a visual medium. The wind is not one of them. I'm a simpleton who's knowledge of cinematography is that I've watched movies and television and I came up with a way to portray it off the top of my head.
What are your opinions on the show?? PLEASE MARK SPOILERS! Not everyone binges :)
Excited to see your channel grow over the course of this show, best of luck to you Daniel!
Needed more braids XD
One word.....Disappointed
10 for me, I loved it so much. Nynaeve roaring in defiance at the trolloc was epic!
I feel like the following seasons will be way more cool and awesome because while eye of the world is a good book the story for a tv show is just not that engaging as we have already seen this type of story play it in a much shorter run time(fellowship of the ring)
I found it hilarious that everyone was waiting for Nynaeve to tug on her braid but a trolloc beat her to it.
That’s where she got the habit for tugging her braid.
I actually burst out laughing when I saw that
I don't think she has a braid. What she has are dreads.
@@FFFTonyo it’s 100% braided.
@@FFFTonyo they're two strand twists in a braid.
Also I lost some immersion post battle when Moraine said let's go and suddenly they are all on horse back and leaving. No scene of convincing parents and families the need for them to leave. No last minute advice or well wishes for simple village kids leaving.
I know this is the unpopular opinion here, but I liked that. It made me feel like they were trying to show Moiraine as someone who doesn't feel the need to explain herself and demands to be obeyed. **Soft Spoiler** It fits for who I always saw her as in the books, especially as her struggles with Rand later on when he starts to reject her. It was a subtle way of doing it, which I agree feels a little disjointed after the big battle.
i didn't mind it as much. but i did wish we could have seen tam giving rand the sword.
Yeh, that struck me as probably the biggest example of the pacing problem. One line - 'we have to go!' 'OK, let's go. Goodbye accepting family who make no effort to persuade me otherwise'.
Would have been better if they snuck out in the night…like the books!
They're also much older than in the books.
Sorry but the Perrins wife thing hit me in such a different way, I was alone in my living room going "WHAT THE FUCK!?!"
Dont worry, she was a dark friend. As noted by the fact she had her hammer raised to strike him, if not for his taveren instinct taking hold. Also the wolf in his dream later on, eating her as a zombie, re-enforces that she was bad for him.
Update:
My thoughts a couple weeks ago have not aged well. I no longer believe she was a dark friend. What changed my mind was Rand's dream where Perrin was hitting her with a hammer at the forge table. I see that event as a sure sign he was trying to repair the damage he had done.
@@albertaguy4817 ok. I am so glad to hear your interpretation and will rewatch to see it for myself. This is really the only change that I'm finding hard to swallow and this helps so much!
@@albertaguy4817 You know I was suspicious of why her arms were raised for an attack, but I thought it was bad choreographing to avoid him wacking off her arm. The implication that she may of actually attempted to strike him (as a Dark Friend) is more forgivable.
Perrin's wife was a masterful addition, imo. I'm incredibly glad they added her to flesh both Perrin as a 20 year old rural person AND the culture and setting.
Oh man you are not alone...I did the exact same thing....more then once...Da fudge was the point? Screw your cultural and rural crap. If you read the books you would know why is is single, massive and that he goes through alot of emotional hardships...He loses more then a wife for goodness sake's later on.
"Those super conservative values are not on display." But the Two Rivers WAS super conservative. Part of thr character development for all of them was to get over their country shyness. Throughout the whole book, few cultures viewed sex as casually as Rand and Eguene did in the first episode.
That was the point where I turned this off. Too much crap already before that and now they're casually having sex? Old country values. I'll go back to re-reading the books. I was worried this would turn out bad. Seems my worst fears weren't even close to how bad this has turned out!
@@shawnboundy3716 I was like: WTF!! In the books they're thinking about getting married. Now they're just banging around. No fucking way. And that scene with Moirane naked?! They're just trying so hard to look an adult show...
@@Vitor-dt1sc You mean like artistically "nude" or you mean like Game of Thrones "Naked."?
@@cbalan777 Dude, the scene Just does not make any sense.
Seriously, in the books when the women's circle caught a couple being intimate the forced them to marry. There is no way Rand and Egwene screwing would be a thing...and then Nynaeve and Lan later...wtf?! Ruins the whole progression of their relationship and Lan having to push her away due to not wanting to make her a widow on her wedding day.
Beside Moraine's speech and convincing the others to leave missing, I was also sad they cut so much of Rand and Tam, especially 1) Tam's feverish talk about the boy he found, and 2) the most terrifying scene of the first book, the Fade sniffing for Rand alone on the forest road and Rand hiding in the woods hoping for Tom to stay quiet and not give them away. We didn't even got a scene when Tam is giving Rand his sword. Nothing.
Maybe we will see Tam’s feverish talk in the flashbacks
When nynaeve shoves Egwene off that cliff that was foreshadowing to the viewers how the story was going to be treated the same way
Yeah that sucked. Also the hope the town was fine and finding that they were attacked as well.
And now mats father cheats on his wife and his mom is a neglectful drunk? Perrin already married and he accidentally kills her? WTF??? I was so damn disappointed with these episodes.
These showrunners have no idea what's important to the story, they only know what's important to wokeness
I think the casting of Padan Fain was top tier, just because of the actors smile, can't wait to see him go full .... well, spoilers.
I thought the same thing. He was perfect.
I can't wait for the end when he turns into a black fungus creeping across the battle field that no one will notice. Bad special effects
My husband has not read the books and when he smiled I went “OH SHIT!” and my husband was like “what?” and I had to say nvm hahaha
Possibly spoilers, but I liked the bit where he's just leaning against a building watching the trollocs make entrail spaghetti and casually shrugs and ducks off like 'oh man the Dark One is gonna give me so many rewards for this...'
I was not pleased when i saw the casting. When i saw him smile i was sold. He and the guy that plays valda will bring some real creep factor to the show!
the other issue with the cold open is getting Morraine to the two rivers. Like she just Knows they are there. If you had that knowledge of there being FOUR Ta'veren in the Two rivers. Why haven't you gone there yet. She just pulls the revelation out of nowhere. I don't get the feeling that she has been searching for 20 years.
Not to mention that Egwene isn't Ta'veren. Another unnecessary change that was kinda irritating was how they're trying to make it seem like one of the women could be the Dragon Reborn when it is KNOWN from prophecy that the Dragon Reborn would be male. The Dragon Reborn being a male channeler and thus destined to go mad is a big part of what people fear about him, not just what he represents with the Last Battle. That whole opening speech from Moiraine was so full of inaccuracies...
@@BlissfullWulf Was originally 4 and it fixes issues with Egwene being a mary sue later.
So what have Rand, Matt, Perrin, and Egwene done to make people suspect they are Ta’veren and then start rumors that have spread around the land?
@@DrumDoug1 we don’t know because we got no context…
@@BlissfullWulf I felt that men are so hated in WOT because the Dragon is known to be a man. Losing that motivation for the world hurts it.
As someone who is completely indifferent to the book series let me just say: Wheel of Time fans, you deserve much much better.
THANK YOU
It is a shame I can only like this comment once.
Thank you. We appreciate it
Most minor of minor gripes.
Why does no one say, "blood and bloody ashes"? Matt saying, "bollocks" just feels weird.
Not minor! One of my favorite swears of all time!!
Burn it! You're right!
@@mattstreit1116 Mother's milk in a cup! Watch your tongue!
I think it's a nod to the fact that this is a different turning of the Wheel than the book.
100% agree. Doesn't seem like asking for much
The cold open of episode 1 was really strange, and I absolutely don't get why they did not show Lews Therins Death. It is such an amazing prologue for EotW, and it would have been much more engaging than the hunt for some random male channeler.
They do talk about Lews Therin if you go to the bonus content. They have these little animated episodes that are like 3 mins long with backstory on some things
Spoilers for book... 8? Maybe later
I think they might save it for when Rand is going mad
I'm hoping that they will eventually use that for a cold open in a later episode, because that prologue was what immediately hooked me when reading the book for the first time. I feel that "Winter Dragon" sort of ruined the ability to start the entire series with that.
@@kylej3535 Really thanks!!
No body is going to show the prologue right off the bat after winter dragon 😬
Kind of weird they cut out the part where the trollocs attack their farm and rand is carrying the injured Tam on a sling to Emond's Field, during which Tam reveals some important info in his fever.
But no, fuck all that lets ride into town, and have the wound instantly healed.
-oh, you need to go with this rando magic lady to the white tower? -sure, have fun, take some horses.
they're trying to make the identity of the dragon a mystery, the fever dream would make it obvious
@@georgevelis4651 the thing is that there is no need to make it a mystery. dude goes through a reinforced door tow episodes later. We now they are showing a bit of the Aiel war so I guess we will get a glimpse of Tam then.
@@damp2269 the showrunners had to do something to grab the viewers attention when covering a story that starts out pretty generic. Adding that mystery is a great way to do it and honestly one of the changes that I actually enjoy. You think it's obviously Rand because you *know* it's Rand, but for non book readers it is not that obvious, and there have been clues that point to other candidates as strongly as Rand.
Actually I'm pretty sure they're trying to make egwin the dragon ... That's why the casually dropped that line how there are four tavarian and the dragon could easily be a man or a woman
@@tzvigrossman1872 we know for a fact that they are not doing that. But even then it baffles me that people think the show would make a change like that... use your brain for 1 minute and realize that this would never happen
Did no one notice how OFF Perrin's marriage was? How awkward his wife was with him? How she was posed to strike Perrin when he killed her? Dark friend alert.
But she was fighting the Trollocs.
@@DocPicklez Riddle me this: why was she standing behind Perrin with her axe overhead, ready to chop down?
The trolloc Perrin was fighting was already dead. Much dead. Perrin was basically making hamburger at that point.
Who was she gonna chop? Hmmmmmmmmmmm?
@@Gangerworld Perhaps she was just about to help with the Trolloc Perrin was going Ham on.
I thought they suggested that they either could not have a baby or lost one. Feels like some scene got cut.
Why does he even have a wife??
He's the same age as Rand and Matt maybe a year older... they were late teens in the first books... I mean they were still being called boys. The whole story has been wrecked.
Feels like this first episode could have been so much better if they went with an hour and a half premiere
100%
And literally no reason not to. And, given the amount of source material we're dealing with, why oh why limit the series to 8 episodes a season? Can't we at least get 10 episodes to tell more of the story and maybe remain a bit more true to it? I think back on how rushed and truncated the last two seasons of Game of Thrones felt (6 and 7 episodes instead of 10) and it seems like the series is actually starting out that way.
@@Ellis_Hugh at least 8 two hour episodes.
SPOILERS:
I was thinking about the same thing. Honestly if they had just spent 10-15 more minutes after Winternight it might have worked with some emotional goodbyes. We needed to see more of the mourning and trauma everyone was experiencing along with some protesting of letting the 4 leave with Moraine. So the town, the parents and the four are just going to allow them to leave with an Aes Sedai with no protest or skepticism? That just did not work for me.
It would have been much better if they would have done it more like the books. With Moiraine hiding that she’s Aes Sedai and not that really cheesy Inn scene in the stormy night. That was B level tv. Period. Also, like the books, Moiraine sneaking them out in the middle of the night would have been better. That leaving while the trollocs were coming down the mountain was so bad. Please. Overall though, I liked the shows. 7/10 episode 1. 8/10 episode 2. Haven’t seen ep 3 as well.
I'm pretty salty about Nynaeve's story about the previous wisdom. Am I wrong or did she say Aes Sedai didn't want her because she turned up looking rough? That goes completely against everything we know about them in the books which make a big deal about class not meaning anything when you enter The White Tower.
That REALLY bugged me. Like the White Tower is DESPERATE for new initiates, WTF they bring classist issues to the white tower, they have a whole wack of other internal struggles without adding random hatred of the "poors".
I hope that later they introduce that she wasn't just turned away but failed her tests or something more legitimate than "ew peasant girl" especially considering who the fucking Amyrlin seat is
@@TheOnlyWay2Go. which would be a great nod to the books where are forced to see things from multiple perspectives.
@@TheOnlyWay2Go. LIKE ARRRRRRRRRG The freakin Amyrlin Seat is a fisher girl. ARRRRRG. So many choices in these first 3 episodes make me want to scream! lol
Clearly, this isn't the real reason she was turned away. She was probably simply too weak. But would Aes Sedai, from the high of their self-perceived importance, would even begin to explain that to a little girl? No. So, of course, this little girl would get the idea that she was turned away for the wrong reason.
The showrunner said in an interview that he got 11,000 notes from Amazon execs and it shows. The pilot episode definitely feels like a bunch of randos tampered with it.
Yeah, I think a lot of weird dialog things like not using the Randland swears like blood and bloody ashes is 100% executive meddling.
Yes that's the huge thing. It feels like studio notes puked all over it
They had to make sure the show was stuffed full of WOKENESS !
Which I don’t understand!
The world of the wheel of time is jam packed with strong female characters. There aren’t many fantasy series where half the protagonists and villains are women and very powerful women at that!!
In the entire series of books women are shown to be smarter and as powerful as men and just as evil in their own way.
This series stinks of clueless studio intervention.
THe path for a success is ignoring 100% of everythign that comes from someone self named executive.
The scene I’m most disappointed was cut from the book was where Rand drags Tam through the woods. Not only was it a great showcase of how innocent and unprepared Rand was at that point, it also contained a vital point of character development. Tam’s fevered mumblings and the questions they forced Rand to ask formed a crucial part of his character in the early books, and went a long way to explaining his near insane stubbornness.
I understand why they cut it, as it relied so heavily on internal monologue that it would be almost impossible to adapt to the screen, but it was still disappointing. Seeing the full horror of the Trolloc attack was a good consolation prize though.
It's the most important scene in the beginning
They want to keep up the suspense about who is the Dragon Reborn. That scene gives it up right away.
Question... around where do episodes 1-3 track for the books?
@@tyleredwards9799 They cover the first third of book one, sort of. They seem to be condensing the Matt and Rand storyline quite a bit, as well as Perrin and Egwene’s. At the same time, the whole storyline with Moirane and Logan is a new addition.
@@TheSjuris Yeah...but that's SUCH a stupid decision...there REALLY shouldn't be any mystery. At least not NEARLY as much as theya re giving it...it's just a silly baity hook.
The funniest moment that I appreciated was the one Trollic comforting his maimed friend before gleefully gutting him.
Lol yep.
I was like "aww" which pretty fast turned to "lmao should've seen this coming"
Meh, everyone knows a Trolloc cooks his food in a pot before eating his friends while reading , "How to Serve Mankind".
"Orcs flesh he's feeding them" (LOTR book 2)
What I find weird about episode 1 is that being a blacksmith is a huge part of Perrin's character. In the book whenever we are in his mind he relates almost everything to blacksmithing, but in the show we never see him doing anything in the forge. His girl is the one actually working in there. He visits her there once and goes there to pick up an axe during the attack. They should've at least had him working along side her at some point. It just feels off.
of course she is doing all the blacksmithing
btw her character was 100% artificially added for no apparent reason other than well... it's as if you haven't lived in the world for the last X years
@@TheExai That was my thought, what the hell was the point in her?! Where the hell is Master lewyn ?
They got perrin into trash... That's real.
@@Jordan-Ramses dunno man, I can't agree with nynaeve choice, just too much out of place for me
@@aeow8859 make the show more Woke.
You know Michael McElhatton is good when he can portray a Roose Bolton that feels deceptive and treacherous and a Tam al'Thor that feels warm and protective without changing much of his appearance.
Yeap, he's out of place, but he's not the main problem with the show
He was absolutely amazing and showed how incredible he is as an actor.
Haha, I didn't even realize Tam was Roose. Awesome.
My biggest annoyance is the pacing issue in Ep 1 with Moiraine "convincing" them to leave...these are supposed to be the most stubborn people alive and they're just like "okey dokes, let's leave the village because you said we should".
At the end of some of the audiobooks, Robert Jordan mentions the themes he's exploring in the books. One of those themes is how unrealistic it is for an unknown person to walk into a country town and say "come with me on an adventure b/c I need you to save the world" and people just dropping everything to follow along. It's just another example of the show using a single ridiculous plot device to accelerate the story and that's what led to this weird rushed and hodge-podgy kind of feeling that is turning everyone off.
Read the books again son, Moiraine told everyone not to tell anybody they were leaving in person. Just leave a note is what she told Rand to do. Jesus.
Agreed. Robert Jordan literally said that was his intention. That these heroes wouldn't just be gun ho to be a hero. They would want to ditch her if they could.
The weirdest part about it all for me:
"Phew, that Trolloc raiding party just really wrecked our village. Oh, there is an entire army of 300 of them coming over the ridge right now. Quick! You must leave with us!"
"We?"
"Yeah, like, only you four. Quick, before they are here and kill everybody you grew up with, while they just idly sit around in the town square."
"Okey Dokey! Bye Dad! Bye Uncle Will! Die quickly! See ya!"
That was the moment i decided an episode 2 wasn't worth my time. I mean, who the fuck wrote that shit?
Mat would never steal from a girl in the two rivers. You say that your favorite thing Mat does is bow to Egwene in the rebel camp because she's from the two rivers and no body puts Egwene in the cornor but stealing from one is alright. Unmarried sex in the two rivers. Wtf
If Two Rivers Tinder encounters bother you, wait until you get to a conversation Rand has with an innkeeper in Episode 3.
Mat was honest, and a man of his word. Though he wasn't someone to run away from his responsibilities or even responsibilities by proxie ie when Tam gets the boys to unload the brandy in the books
I love how Robert Jordan specifically says in an interview for the audio books that country folk wouldn't just take off with some stranger just because they told them they were this prophesied figure... and then the show does this.
They did this in the book too man, why are people bothered by that. In the book moraine tells rand, mat and Perrin to come leave, and they do just, but egwene also joins them then.
@@vol94 they leave in the books not because Moiraine drops prophecy on them though. She tells them they are being hunted but doesn’t give them a reason and the boys rationalize it by asking around and finding out their homesteads where the only ones that were attacked directly.
@@Caedus696 bro, she might have given him a coin but here she singlehandely killed tons of trollocs. Dont you think that you would be quick to obey someone who just destroyed a throng of monsters by herself and her partner.
Exactly my issue, I was like oh ok so they are just going to go like nothings happened.... I guess that makes sense ....
@@vol94 The whole "one of you is the Dragon reborn thing" is insane too!
To be honest I don't like that they removed Rand carrying Tam to Two Rivers on Winternight scene bcs I feel like it's a huge characterization point for Rand, and also in the book he was so grateful when Moiraine healed Tam yet in the show he straight up accusing Moiraine without saying a word of thanks. I mean, Rand is woolheaded and stubborn but he's not an ungrateful ass :(
agree, I think these were the changes ( more like omissions I guess) that bothered me the most.
@Tom Ford upon rewatch I think they did it to keep up the Dragon Reborn mystery, so I understand. It's just, his desperation when Nynaeve said she couldn't do anything for his father made me cry when reading the book (also his relief after Moiraine healed him), it's one of my fav moments so I'm sad it's not in the show :'(
Yeah, to be honest, I also felt like they were pushing his character to be sort of a suspicious brat, maybe they want to give him space to grow from where he is right now... He's not just acting up with Moiraine, he's also being a douchebag to his friends, especially Egwene, he's hurt and revengeful.
I am okay with the omission with the caveat that it gives them the opportunity to use it as a flashback in a later episode. The cardinal sin was Tam being awake and watching them ride off away from town.
@Tom Ford you're an Amazon shill. Joined a week ago and nothing but positive things to say.
I'm not sure how you can say those are a good adaptation of the characters from the book.
Moiraine is crafty, manipulative, authoritative, charismatic. She doesn't walk in announcing herself as an aes sedai.
Lan is protective of his aes sedais honor, of her life. He's furtivity incarnate. He wouldn't let rand question her like that right after she saved his father. He wouldn't barge into an inn, standing like a dumbass in front of the open door to make sure everyone notices them.
Mat is a prankster with a strong moral code. Not a thief. He has loving parents, and always dreamt of traveling, never wanting to go back home, with nothing attaching him there. Leaving his sisters to a couple of deadbeats that might as well let them starve is not something mat would do, and if he did, the only thing he would think about would be coming back. After all, mat is the guy would went to face the black ajah to help Elayne and nynaeve.
Perrin is temperance incarnate. He would never swing in haste, as he knows a careless strike can ruin a whole day of work. Perrin is also a deeply loving man. The Perrin of the book would probably split his veins open if he killed his wife. He certainly would not start a new love story less than a year after killing his wife with his own hands. So are trey going to fuck up the story of Perrin and faile, or are they going to fuck up even more his personality. This is a massive trauma he needs to deal with. And one that is completely divorced from his arc. His arc being that he has to come to term with the wolf in him, wolf that overwhelmed him and made him act against his careful nature, killing whitecloak, and act that follows him for the whole story and make him dread this part of him that is so alien to who he is at the start.
Rand's defining arc for the first few books is to come to term with what he heard tam say in his fever. But well, no fever, so, what is Rand's arc, then?
Nynaeve is already aware that her listening to the wind is linked to the one power. Guess her arc for the first few books where she has to accept that is also gone, then. And now nynaeve is able to get rid of a trolloc by herself, unarmed? Sure... We all know nynaeve as a fearsome killer. That's who she is, someone who would kill at the drop of a hat.
Thom's going with them because of his desire to help them deal with aes sedais like he couldn't help his nefew. But when they meet him, there's no aes sedais. So wtf?
No Min?
No mordeth? So what about Padan Fain's arc, then ? Because the Padan fain we know and love and fits so well the actor can only exist because of mordeth.
Yeah, they might have some very surface level similarity with the characters of the book, but their essence has been stripped from them.
Thank you for elucidating why this show is garbage. I am too angry to type any more. Fuck this show.
"One of you is the dragon!" - first thing she says to them!?. who thought that was a good idea? what gets me is all problems are story telling and screen writing. 10s of millions of dollars and excellent actors and craftsman and it's all in the garbage because of incompetent screen writing and poor pacing on the directors part. They literally tossed all the potential tension from the story into the waste bin first thing - and now the dragon is "supposed to save us". when they dumbed all this down for tv they also removed all the main drivers of mystery, and tension. The world also felt small to me despite all the sweeping panoramas - to little time with the characters traveling and toomuch jumping around from thing to thing to thing
@@TheWheelTurns wheel of time is the recipe for the best meal of your life. The show changed half the ingredients, forgot a few of the others, and halved the time in the oven.
I guess we all know that Nynaeve should wield the Heron Mark Sword, since she could kill a single Trolloc all by herself, and Tam couldn't.
@@TheAsmodha yeah but Tam was fighting the Mighty Narg! Seriously though Tam needs to get back into practice, good thing the other blademasters did not see that
When Tam picks up his sword: "The Dragon sends his regards"
Narg: _"...Muther..."_
"Lets go run away from a horde of monsters and leave the weapons here, so we can onyl relly on Lan, Moraine and maybe Rand"
Not just Perrin not having his axe, but also Mat without his quarterstaff (eith which he could have saved his sisters from trollocs and then took them to safety), but also both of them lacking the longbows Two river area is famous for
To be fair on the longbow point, if i remember correctly they didn't gave them in the book either
@@timothycotner3492 Mat had the bow Rand the sword and Perrin the axe.
@@aybarra912 if a remember correctly, all three boys had a bow with them and also slingshots. Since they used both for hunting
@@timothycotner3492 [SPOILERS]
IIRC Mat kept his original bow until leaving Ebou Dar and him losing it was quite an event. All three grew up accustomed to stalking in the forest and hunting small and big game. I think even the women were very good with slings, but not the bow. The longbow is one of the defining characteristics of the Two Rivers people and marks their origin when venturing into the wider world. Each character losing or neglecting the bow has some symbolic meaning.
@@Lttlemoi It's been a few years since i read the books so i guess my memory of this isn't as sharp as it could be
I understand some changes (not liking them still), like cutting out Elyas, stopping at the first city and meeting Min there etc. due to limited screen time.
Other changes were just stupid.
Moraine not explaing the difference between saidar and saidin, how saidin is tainted and causes men that can channel going insane. Or even Perring mentioning it that Aes Sedai are going to try to catch a "False Dragon", before he causes another breaking.
Cutting out the Dragons death causing the Breaking
The idea that the Dragon reborn could be a woman. I mean WTF, the main thing about the danger regarding the Dragon reborn is that he is a man that can channel and could go insane before defeating the dark one.
Tam al Thor not mummbling about Rand not being his son, not mentioning how he was a soldier. That wouldn't have taken much time.
Healing having no effect on one getting healed by the One power. And with that Tam just staying in the village instead of going out with his son, since he is the most capable fighter in the Two rivers.
Lan not noticing the heron marked sword and asking Rand how the heck did a farmer got a sword like that.
Not mentioning or showing that the Two rivers is famous for its bows. They could just shown crows following them and getting killed by arrows with Lan mentioning that the vultures can be spies for the Dark ones, saying that he hopes they haven't already alerted a Fade of their location.And the only kills of Trolocs being made by a group of women with farming tools.
And offcourse Perin. Him being a man that likes to drink with his budies, even when his pregnant wife is working ad a blacksmith. Her being a blacksmith and not him. I mean his whole arch is about transforming from a blacksmith and accepting being a leader. Together with him "growing up" and deciding to put down his battle axe he made and replacing it with his thrusted hammer, which can alsonmake things, not just kills
They cut Elyas? So glad I stopped watching after "four Ta'veren".
i agree with u especially how they did perrins character and fridging his wife. That was straight dumb dumb.
I actually like perin having killed his wife with the axe which will ultimately lead him to hate the axe and change it to hammer
Yeah, the change with Perrin. They made him a married guy and a wife killer in just one episode. What the fuck!
Also them saying that Dragon Reborn can be a woman and saying all 4 of them, including Egwene, are Ta'veren right away is giving me some bad vibes. Because they focused more on her than Rand. She had the most screentime in my opinion. She isn't ta'veren in the books, Robert Jordan Confirmed it. My theory is they might be trying to make Egwene the Dragon Reborn instead of Rand in the show "subverting our expectations" and fucking up the whole story. I don't know why but the lack of focus on Rand is giving me a bit of a bad feeling about this.
I think “not surprised, but disappointed” sums up my thoughts so far.
it's Amazon and it's 2021. this show never had a chance. they're basically pissing on Jordan's legacy at this point. and to think Mrs. Jordan signed off on this garbage. she saw the dollar signs and sold her, and her late husband's, souls.
@@leshtricity she didn't thought. Rafe talked a good game at first when they were buying the rights... but both Harriet and Brandon both are "Contributing Producers" and Brandon said they have absolutely zero influence on what happens in the show. They can make suggestions but Rafe decides what goes and he has already shown he has no problem at all ignoring suggestions like Brandon made to use the stories from the books to show the characters motivations and reasons for the decisions they make. Harriet is 82 and not as young and spry and she used to be so she can't be as hands on as I sure she would like to be. It's a shame really.
Agreed. Atheist it didn't take 8 seasons to let us down.
But to be fair I'll watch it all. Lol. I'm too invested in the books to not watch it. Even if it's just a weird fan fiction cover of the books.
SPOILERS!!!: Okay, so I know the pinnacle display of Moiraine's power was throwing houses at trollocs, but ripping a trolloc in half with weaves of air was pretty hard core.
That was metal as hell and I loved it
That first weave we see her use on a trolloc was pretty sweet.
And cheap ) looked like SFX show from 10 years ago
@@salomaonplanetsaturn6038 agree
Hey remember when Peter Jackson’s lotr trilogy dropped and it was hailed as a masterpiece because it stuck to the books?
Hey remember when game of thrones dropped and everyone was hooked because it stuck to the books?
Hey remember when wheel of time dropped and they forgot what books were..perrins married,mats dads a drunk,mat now says `prick`,everyone’s the dragon reborn,iconic characters are cut (r.I.p senn bui),the skinny innkeeper is now a 20 year old university girl dark friend and the white tower now sends away the dishevelled?..
Mat and Nyneave are perfect in this for me.
But if Rand doesn’t unstring that goddamn bow I’m gonna lose it.
Right? As a hobby archer I found that to be quite annoying.
Oh, and yeah - Mat and Nyneave are the best.
@IdleBigots they’re probably gonna reveal that scene the episode after he is (SPOILER) revealed to be the Dragon, it would make a cool opening scene
@IdleBigots yes, most likely
Strung and kept in the kitchen! Plus two rivers bows are as tall as a man, these were shortbows.
I’m honestly surprised you didn’t mention the conversation between Moiraine and Nynaeve. That was the part that REALLY got on my fuckin nerves. Not because of Nynaeve’s backstory (let’s just ignore the dumbassery of “oh, the Dragon could be a boy OR a girl, we don’t know”), but because of the previous Wisdom’s backstory.
The Tower would *_never_* turn a woman away who wanted to be an initiate. For *_any_* reason. Siuan was just as poor if not poorer, and she’s the fucking Amyrlin Seat. Else Grinwell was a farmgirl who couldn’t even sense _saidar_ to save her life let alone touch it, and she was still accepted as a novice. The White Tower couldn’t *_afford_* to refuse anybody, dwindling in number as they were. Nynaeve was misinformed about what happened, or she outright lied, or Rafe Judkins fucked up the White Tower beyond all recognition. Those are the possibilities we’re left with.
I've seen one episode and I couldn't be more let down. The show looks great, the acting is great, special effects are decent for a show with budget constraints, but the story! Could they not have found writers that did more than just skim the fucking novels??
This was the biggest let down for me, aside from the Perrin's wife thing. I don't believe he had one in the beginning did he? I mean, where the hell did she come from? I know it's been a bit since I've read the first book, but what the fuckity...
No the tower turned women away if they were too old it was just reformed in the rebel camp later in the books
@@owenlewis6214 Yes, you are correct, my bad lol
So here's a speculation for you:
Are you sure Nayneve told the truth? Better yet, are you sure the previous wisdom told the truth?
You just assume that a character said it so it's solid hard fact. Exactly because of all the things you mentioned, I personally think it must be something we will learn to be a lei told by the old wisdom.
I was worried Lan was gonna be a blank slate too, I loved his shadar logoth monologue and may being like “yo this dude talks??” Shit was priceless
Moraine just announcing one of them is the dragon in the middle of the village actually made me pause and jump out out of my seat and say what the fuck.
Yeah kinda jarring and definitely rushed. I’m kinda glad they are toning down the ‘mysterious’ nature of the aes sedai. It was annoying at times.
Yeah that was odd to me as well. The dragon is supposed to be in many ways a despised figure who no one would want to be. "Whoever the dragon is" needs to be eased into that acceptance of their role, lest they hare off in some random direction (even more).
She announces THAT to the whole village but saves the story of Manetheren for later. I just don't get it...
It was as dumb as her and Lan just busting into the inn like AES SEDA HERE YALL. And also as dumb as them knowing the shadowspawn were coming in advance.
Spoilers,. Period. We never got Tam‘s backstory, his fever dream, I think that was something lost, it’s part of Rands ark, how he learns, and struggles with who his father is,
Always the chance it'll happen in a later episode
It would spoil everything.... if it's not already obvious.
This could be happenning later on, they can always show if they had a moment during their way from farm to emons field. What I didnt like was how Moreine healed Tam quickly and they all bailed right away.
Also spoilers: I'm pretty sure that'll come. It's tied to Rand's "origin" story and the prophecy. I think we'll get to know some of it when Moiraine or Lan notices the heron. They really, REALLY wanted the audience to see it.
A few things I really wish they would have done:
1. Start the show off the same as the book with Tam and Rand walking to Emond's Field. This would have explained a little of the town, the people, their relationships, and why Tam is no longer married.
2. The other thing I really wish they would have shown was the struggle Rand had getting Tam back to town after the attack. This would have helped show the significance of the Tam's sword and why Rand had to take it with him. In the show it wasn't even brought up and when they leave, Tam is in good health so Rand has no bond with the sword like he does in the books.
3. The episode should have ended with Rand and Tam arriving in a decimated town and the next episode could have started with showing the attack in town.
4. I also think Perrin's character got screwed in so many ways. He's married just to have her die? Is he a blacksmith? Where's Haral Luhhan? They could have spent two minutes showing him working in the forge and showing his strength and how he's really a gentle giant who doesn't know anything else other than the forge. I get what they're trying to do in the show, but I think it is unnecessary.
The actors are great, the performances are great (give Perrin a little more dialogue/background), the settings are spectacular, and the trollocs are exactly as I imagined.
They could have given a good foundation with a few changes, but I think if someone watches this without reading the books they will have no attachment to Emond's Field or have any care for the bond between Rand and the sword he carries. I have a feeling they are going to try to jam in the missing parts later and I think that's going to be a big mistake in the story telling.
Agreed. Also, to me, the characters don't feel the same as in the books. They feel older, more mature in a way. They don't exude that same small-town innocence and naiveté as in the books.
Perrin, rather than feeling clumsy around women, is now a married man in what appears to be a less than stellar marriage. Rhand, rather than being the guy who's shy around women, especially around Egwene, is now having a sexual relationship with her.
The only hope we have is that if they're leaving out this much good, they're probably leaving out a lot of the bad as well. Especially the eternal battle of the sexes with the women of the group regarding the men as clumsy oafs who can't be left to their own devices lest they get everyone into trouble, and the men believing the women to be naive and weak and in constant need of protection. Even though throughout the entire series both sexes have demonstrated their competence countless times by saving the others when things went south. Man, that blind stupidity really started to grate on me...
I see it as this the show would be really good if you havent read the books and expected certain things. The changes they made so far are to much for me to enjoy this as the wheel of time. I believe I am done watching. Ill give it one more chance next week but I find myself not enjoying it despite the good selection in actors and the phenomenal incorporation of magic which most shows/movies on magic fail utterly.
Honestly, Point 2 broken my interest in this show.
This was such an important moment early on, they had no business excluding that scene from the show.
If they treat important moments like that in such a way (Literally omitting it entirely), then I don't want to see what else gets omitted.
I'm not going to tarnish my memory of this amazing series with this lol
@@A1phaz0ne After a few episodes, I understand why they kept it out. They are keeping the Dragon Reborn a secret from the viewers, unlike the books, so I get why they kept it out. Our memory of the books will never change, but I am still enjoying the show, I just wish they could have done 10-12 episodes each season to really flesh out the characters/locations.
They probably didnt do point 2 cause that would have given away the game so to speak about who the dragon is. It feels like some of the decisions in the show are driven by trying to trick new viewers/non book readers to who the dragon is. They seem to want to spent equal time with each of them to keep the mystery going even as book readers roll their eyes at it and it sacrifices key moments.
Episode 1 was rough for me. I honestly don't understand most of the changes they made like giving Perrin a wife only to kill her off. Changes to Mat made sense to me and I like that he his more like his self after the characterization. So far they've nailed Rand's personality. Overall though it seemed like a sloppy opening to me unfortunately. Episode 2 is the best of the three first episodes in my opinion however.
Sadly they made Mat a Zoomer Edgelord long before he found the dagger....I liked his character the most in the books, but the pretty much destroyed it in the series.
@@jacobyrassilon good point. I feel like all the characters are hurt by being aged up. And yet they seem more clueless about what's going on around them. And they're all extremely calm about the idea that one of them might be the equivalent to a doomsday weapon.
I agree I liked episode 2 the best and while I was fine with some of the changes, such as with matt and cutting some of details, some of the the changes really bothered me. Perrin wife said about 4 words before Perrin murders her. And yes that's a more interesting death than many others but really wasn't worth writing in a whole new character.
Personally I think Perrin’s change makes a lot of sense. Having accidentally killed his own wife in the fight makes it far more believable for him to be so reluctant about fighting later on, certainly much more believable and personal than him being torn up about killing some anonymous whitecloaks. It also give a plausibility to his general careful demeanor and fear of potentially harming others without having to go into the “big strong kid” backstory and him not really knowing his own strength.
No him having a wife and have him kill her is a really good way of showing the audience why he is slow and quite reserved. I think having him have a wife was an excellent decision
The problem I see with Egwene being Ta’veren is it takes away her agency. She was the only one among the Emond’s fielders to embrace the changes in her life and actively pursue them. While the others had agency in actively fighting their destinies, Egwene’s story was better that all the things she did was for herself and what she believed was right to do, not what the pattern wanted.
Her accomplishments are more believable as a taveren however.
No they are more easily digested by woke people that way. Dont get me wrong i have nothing against woman taveren, Birgitta is one of my favourite characters but this is a disgusting implant to a beloved series of books to show how woke they are. Men are not reborn into female bodies in the wheel of time and its bullshit and before anyone refrences Demandred. He was not reborn as a women he was placed in a women's body by the dark one. I hate when adapters mess with the plots of my favourite books for the sake of condencing the material, but I hate it even more when they do it for the sake of gender identity. I mean come on these books are already filled to the brim with power drunk females who constantly shit on male counterparts for little to no more reason that they are lowly men. This was pretty damn woke way before the coin was termed and it seems like they are just going to keep pushing the envelope. I hate to say it but theres a good chance i wont continue watching if this crap keeps happening. I mean I almost wouldn't be suprised if they don't make Egwene the dragon reborn.
Yea
@@LordRahl2266 This was so hard to read. No one can discuss anything with you because you're sprouting off about power drunk women in the Wot universe. You're doing the too edgy for the Internet sthick and it's ooooooold. Pretty sure you're at the wrong channel, if that's how you think about media.
@@20storiesunder It's no sthick. It's the way I feel about the liberties taken with a great story from my childhood. It completely ruins my immersion when things like this get shoved into movies and shows just for the sake of gender identity. And yes if you have read any of the books you would know what I'm talking when I talk the role of feminine superiority in these books and how men are put down upon. I loved the books and though that particular part of them was ridden a bit too far in my opinion I also found it enduring as it was a large part of the universe that Jordan wove and thought of it as a sort of alternative history to own in regards to pre-modern society. But messing with a story I have read and reread for the last 15 year's just to push an agenda to show what chauvinistic pigs men were and how woke we need to be now to make up for it is just stupid.
If you or anyone wants to write another woke book about another strong female protagonist and upholding strong feminist morals that more or may not hint a true meaning of superiority by making lowly men pay for the crimes their forefathers committed against against woman and who they themselves weren't even alive to see more power to you. I hope it sells a million copies, hell I might even read it myself and love it. But leave the legacy of one of the greatest fantasy literary artists who has managed to inspire the lives of millions of others alone.
Shout out to the actor playing Padan Fain. I feel he takes on the essence of the role well. I'm excited to see where it goes. I only seen one episode so far, but I really enjoyed it
Thom Fain?
I 100% agree!!!! I think Padan Fain casting is one of the best casting choices so far...can't wait for Mordeith!!!
Padan Fain has gotten me steamy. It's about to get wild.
Moraine said she was looking for the dragon and could be a male or female. Isn’t that contradictory to the one power?
Totally agree. The scene with the Reds chasing down the one fellow at the beginning and saying the power is for women only - that could be the Reds being arrogant, but they could have taken that moment to clarify the different sides of the power. Instead, she said it made the power stink. How would she know? 20 minutes in I turned it off. So many screw ups already.
@@shawnboundy3716 I thought about that reds scene as well. I chalked it up to it was the reds outlook. But I do agree they said it to be woke as well. Two birds one stone. Everything that comes out is corrupted with wokeness, it’s disappointing but not surprising.
It’s a stupid unnecessary change that does nothing but stoke the anti woke patrol for exactly zero benefit to the story
It is and doesn’t make sense. She didn’t even know there was three tavavirin in the two rivers. She found that out there. She was only looking for a kid the right age range
@@ShiningWolf88 just more woke Propaganda that they slip into everything these days.
I only caught that on my 2nd watch, but as for the post apocalyptic setting, I really dig that last shot of what looks like a ruined modern city with skyscrapers at the end of the cold open. Kind of subtle but it's totally there for those who still believe it's "medieval fantasy"!
It's near the Two Rivers, and no one goes there to investigate? The Two Rivers would be a hub for expeditions into the ancient but more advanced ruins. The breaking was highly exaggerated? It's a spectacle, looks cool, but ultimately doesn't really make sense in the context of the world. Maybe if it was in a different part of the world that would be cool. Near the Two Rivers, it makes no sense. When people say it's Medieval, they don't mean a specific time period, it's a stage in human organization and technological progress. I look at it more like the Renaissance Era, but again, that just refers to a stage of human progress. Everyone knows it's post apocalyptic if you read the books or even just listened to the dialog.
I did like that nod to the lore.
Me: oooh, what epic powers will Moiraine use to fight the last wave of the horde? Fire? More lightning? And earthquake?
Moiraine- “I’m just gonna use this brick”
"I'm just gonna use this entire building worth of bricks"
lol I was a little underwhelmed at that too...absolutely no reason for her to resort to random debris when she has unfathomable abilities
You gotta think she was also quite drained by that point
@@dinosaldic4219 I wonder how they’ll portray magical stamina down the line if Moraine got this tired after the horde came in the Two Rivers
And a lot of green screen...
So, I get why they made Mat’s dad a bit of a scum bag. But It makes me sad. It is only forgivable in comparison to what they did to Bran al’Vere. A *SKINNY* inn keeper? Absolutely unacceptable. 1/10.
Joking. But also serious.
i love that everyone who read the books noticed Bran is skinny and it's BOTHERING US!
And mats mother is a neglectful drunk?? Like why the hell would they add this crap?
@@dp9629 exactly! What they have done to the Cauthon's has really bothered me.
At least with the other changes, I might not personally like them but I can kind of see the reasons they might have done it, but not this, it's so needless
@@M4tt888_ maybe I'm just taking it too personally lol it's just kinda hard not to be frustrated with it when a person has fallen in love with these characters and how they were written.
@@dp9629 I 100% agree, its mu favourite book series and for 20 years abel cauthon has been a stand up guy and overnight they've done a character assassination on him 😂
It makes me sad as well becasue now he probably can't be Tam's buddy on the run hiding in the woods from the white cloaks later on. Little things like that.
I have appreciated your reviews in the past, however what they did with Matt was stupid. Saving his sisters is good, but the books reference his parents as good people who he learned from and uses. It makes no sense. Then let's just give Perrin a wife and fridge her. This destroys one of my favorite parts of the books where the three boys constantly think the other ones understand women better. Just unnecessary changes.
100% agree. Spoilers ahead in case you made it to this comment without seeing any already somehow.
The backstories to these main characters is so crucial to defining their characters and the changes with Mat's parents and Perrin's wife (and how HE is the one to kill her?!) make them feel like completely different people from the books. Standing in Perrin's shoes, I would be traumatized beyond repair, and now that is all I am going to see in him, that he is f____ed up enough to have murdered his own wife. I get that they want to display his struggle with blood lust, but that was not the way to do it, it feels like they broke him.
And Mat's character is now kind of reversed in that his true good nature steeps from a desire to not be like his parents and his proclivity towards roguishness is due to the influence of his parents, rather than his true good nature being instilled in him by his solid parental upbringing and his roguishness being a character trait specific to him. Mat was my favorite character in the books but he feels...weaker...in the show. :(
Unnecessary changes but I think they did it to make you have sympathy for Mat, otherwise he's just a roguish character. The dynamic with his parents builds into his tenderness towards his sisters. I don't agree with it but I understand why they did it.
@Rheumattica I am actually enjoying all the other aspects of the show as it continues, I just absolutely hate these 2 main character backstory changes. There are going to have to be changes from the books for TV, that's unavoidable, but I think they are doing a pretty good job of it with those exceptions.
EDIT: SPOILERS - after watching episode 8 I am so so so disappointed in the show which now feels like it has completely ruined the story. Rand uses an sa'angreal (incorrectly portrayed and used) rather than allowing him his protagonist level power...some accepted level nobody gets to steal his power flex on the tollocs...Nynaeve dies/burns out only to be immediately resurrected/healed by Egwene's tears and a trickle of unskilled Power...Lan cant track Moraine and Rand...Nynaeve tells him how he can yet he ends up doing nothing...Perrin...still does nothing...Loial apparently fake dies...Agelmar dies, thanks a lot ladies...the horn is already found and just stored away in the floor...Moraine is stilled/blocked?! The show is no longer even close to the "heart" of the story, just looking for cheap thrills and hollow fakeouts.
You know, in retrospect, Kritter asking Marcus if he's aware that Perrin is considered the ideal husband is HILARIOUS and I'm screaming lol
Haha!
Hah! Ironic isn't it? 😂
🤣🤣🤣
Ooooh nooooo that's hilarious
Oof, that's a deep cut.
I’d rather have seen rand or mat find Perrin in the forge. And moraines “light give me strength”… should have shown her pull an angriel (preferably the one being folded in cloth at the start)
It's like someone read the books and then described them to the people who made the show as best they could.
is that the angry version of an angreal? ^^
Yea I was waiting for the angreal to come out, it would have been pretty easy to understand.
@@philip7922 yeah! She’s meant to have one!
It’s a whole sub plot! “The tower wants its prized artefact returned”
I wonder if the horse, carved, figurine will be one…
Cause that will make nonsense
@@maikawolf764 no that’s the I couldn’t be-arse-checking-the-proper-spelling version
When Fain first appeared on screen my girlfriend (non book reader) said, " I can already tell I'm going to like this guy." I just kind of looked at her.
The show is a massive disappointment so far. There's no real gravitas, just tiresome ponderous worry about some vague evil. The plotting is thin and uninteresting, and the visual compositions are thoroughly television level rather than cinematic; you can see in many parts how badly this show wants to be "Lord of the Ring" and it's so far off. Worst of all, the characters have little-to-no personality.
I really missed Mordeth lol. Love the fact that we went to shadar logoth but man, Mordeth made that so creepy in the books, would've loved to see him.. other than that, i agree with most of the criticism on here, i hope they continue to improve as the series goes on, they showed some promise at least
Thinking the same thing. I believe they also forgot abt the girl that sees when you die as well.
Without Mordeth it's going to really dilute Faine's influence in the later books. The fact that Mordeth didn't make the cut but Paren gets a wife that didn't exist instead is driving me batty.
They f~~~ing cut Mordeth out? Yeah, I'm not going back to the show ever. RIP
My only big problems were Moraines whole “Men thought they could cage darkness” because that’s just not really true, the whole 4 Ta’veren thing, Egwene already had such a huge story, she doesn’t need more and the idea that a woman can be the Dragon Reborn completely goes against the story. The whole reason everyone is scared of the Dragon Reborn is because he’s a man that can channel and they are bound to go insane. If a woman was the Dragon, theirs no fear of that. And then lastly the whole Perrin has a wife thing, seems unnecessary.
That stuff being said, the scenery and acting was really really good. The show has some problems already but also lots of positives, and I think they will be able to fix it.
I LOVED the way they did Mashadar too, that was sick, wish we’d seen Mordeth though
Agree completely
Agree completely!!
Agree with you there are some or more than "some" unnecesary changes to the story.
I feel like making Egwene Ta’veren feels like a consolation prize as well. “Oh here, you can be Ta’veren too.” It undercuts her character a bit and adds nothing because unless they change A LOT, her story isn’t going to change. I can get over it, I just wish I didn’t have to. Also to your comments about the dragon reborn, I agree completely. On the other hand, I think the show compensates for that by shifting the focus of fear from a man who can channel to the significance of the breaking. I don’t think it’s done well, but it’s still there and I wish they had just kept it the same as the books. I still really like the show cause the highs are HIGH, it’s just a lot of little stuff that could have easily been avoided.
When you looking forward to Daniel Greenes breakdown and opinions on the epsiodes almost as much as the show itself
Do other people feel like Egwene potentially being the Dragon is a huge change to story? Won't this impact not only the one power and how it works, but also An'greal and circles. I feel like this impacts the rules of the world which has impacted and created cultures and norms of society not to mention the prophecies!!!
They didn't think that far ahead they just needed a woman to add mystery to the dragon reveal. They even say (pretty awkwardly) that the dragon might be a man or woman, which makes no sense in the universe
This is really a thing that I can’t wrap my head around… Because it’s the core of the story that the Dragon Reborn is a man and that is the whole reason why men aren’t allowed to channel and that is why they are hunted etc etc. It feels like a ‘Gender equality’ step from Amazon and it bothers me a lot.
Maybe I’m overthinking it? I don’t know.
@@Valywen I think a lot of this stuff now is just to stir up controversy and get people to talk. They don't believe in the story enough for it to stand on it's own so they manufacture real world drama for free advertising.
I mean I'm dealing with it but it's not a well thought out change. Part of the danger if the dragon is because he is certain to go insane even if he saves the world. The legend behind it makes no sense if a "good" dragon is a coin flip
@@liamhemmings9039 it is only an 8% increase in uncertainty of who it is from the original books. They could have easily made Matt's luck or Perrin's abilities with wolves seem related to the power. Or they just could have pushed Logaine as a possibility harder which they seemed to do anyway if they really wanted to keep it up in the air. None of these options would have changed a ton of the rules of the world.
Episode One was just bad. If I wasn't such a fan of the books I probably wouldn't have made it through the first 30 minutes. No connection to the characters at all, fundamental changes to core concepts, editing and music that made it feel like a CW show for tweens...I hope they step up their game because that was pretty bad.
I have to say... The FOUR ta'veren line in the cold open... And the fact the Dragon could be a man or woman? Like right away in episode 1 I am very concerned. Egwene has a great (if insufferable at times) arc. It adds nothing of value but social justice to add her in as potentially being the Dragon.
Also, I liked the changes to Matt and Perrin...but I thought the loss of the horror elements and the creepiness of the book. The mysterious rider that wind doesn't seem to touch, the midnight dragging of Tam with his fever dreams and the rider on the road. The mystery. These changes just gave it all away. Trollocs, fades, the dragon reborn, Aes Sedai being recognized by villagers. No mysterious strangers, no unknown horrors, no unexplained fleeing the town... And no Thom Merrilin!! Crazy! They should have had more faith with a three episode drop to actually have the three episodes build together. It's such a rush so far.
It adds a more compelling reason for her to leave the village. For someone who has never read the books it adds more intrigue to the story too, for them to think it could be her as well.
>The FOUR ta'veren line in the cold open... And the fact the Dragon could be a man or woman
literally this
fucking why, that was like one of the key themes of the world
will they convert any other dragons reborn or false dragons to female as well?
I agree, and I read that as a sign of disrespect for the original material. Moraine announcing herself as Aes Sedai and making a big show of entering the inn when she's supposed to be "undercover" was also a very bad sign that the story isn't really being respected.
I agree. I can accept Egwene as Ta'veren (even if kinda break the theme of the Divine Male Trinity: the three are basically Thor, Odin and Tyr), but making her a possible dragon is just a bad decision.
She doesn't need to be a possible Dragon Reborn to shine.
And by adding a 50% chance of the Dragon being female they have to change drastically the whole world culture and folklore: they are making the coming of thei savior-destroyer looking less scary. But it is supposed to be scary: male channelers are seen as walking nukes! This is going to change much without truly adding anything.
One of the major theme of the book is the balance between Masculinity and Femininity, on multiple levels (cosmic, social, personal...), and being a man or a woman as a strong relevance in the magic system. In this kind of story, changing the sex of a character is a big deal.
I feel like the cutting of Tam's rambling is partly them trying not to be too obvious about Rand.
But it is so important for his self-doubt, so I do hope there's a flashback.
But it would have connected moraine questioning of the wisdom about not being from the 2 rivers. Also Moraine could have been passed out from battle and let the scene play as it did in the book... Nynaeve gets some puzzle pieces to chew over then the kids are missing the next day. The whole down in beside themselves on where they went. She sneaks off... good scene good tv, good way to show that she is smart, resourceful, and brave
But it would have connected moraine questioning of the wisdom about not being from the 2 rivers. Also Moraine could have been passed out from battle and let the scene play as it did in the book... Nynaeve gets some puzzle pieces to chew over then the kids are missing the next day. The whole down in beside themselves on where they went. She sneaks off... good scene good tv, good way to show that she is smart, resourceful, and brave
Also, Rand was able to just slump him over a horse instead of needing to make a makeshift sled and pull it himself...so they made the trip feel inconsequential. Also, there was no searching for a healer and the dred that his dad's going to die. Moraine just popped up and was like "oh, Trollic poison. Ok, he's cured"
It’s only a necessary change (that I don’t like as much as any of the rest) because of all the other changes they’ve made like Moraine being publicly named an Aes Sedai straight away and announcing for anyone to hear let alone the “4 of them” that one is the DR, something in the books that would have any of the 4 (3 really since it can’t be Egwene) losing their minds over just the mentioning of it along with half the town in ear shot.
Honestly, I was so let down. I love this book series and I hated how this show portrayed Mat's dad and mother. It was heartbreaking. I liked the innocence of the characters in the book and the molding and shaping of them through trials. There was no need to add or change so many elements. It was heartbreaking.
The trollocs were impressive. I believe the shadow spawn were the most spot on element in the show. Also Padan Fain.
I didn't feel like this show made any of the characters likeable. I don't have much hope for this show. It has inspired me to reread the series to enjoy how amazingly told this story is... in the books.... not this show.
I felt very let down by the previews where Moraine and Lan made that melodramatic entrance. and I think it's very uneven in the first 3 episodes, but there are great moments in episode 3 and I loved all of episode 4. Rosamunde Pike is perfect I think and a great actress. I live the actress playing Nyneave. I'm going to stick with it. Sophie Okenedo is a brilliant actress too so I have to at least get to Tar Valon. ;)
A little slower and incorporating more of the book story would improve the series a lot. Seems needlessly rushed.
@@ab4le277 well it kind of has to be rushed. They have limited budget and episodes
@@-6ix559 don't see it that way. A more robust series would be more engaging, attract more people. The story could engage more whereas at the moment its so rushed that won't happen
Couldn't agree more, if the show NEEDS sex and extreme violence to sell in episode one then it should not have been made.
I think the worst thing about the first three episodes is how amazing Barney was and knowing he isn't coming back. It sucks so much to have such a flawless performance only to have it taken away. I am excited to see what Donal Finn does as well, but extremely nervous that he won't live up to how completely perfect Barney was for the role :(
I kept thinking the same thing. Matt is definitely the best acted character through the first 3 episodes.
@@gameoftones77 Hmm I think it was Nynaeve tbh.
I don’t know, I feel like I’m in a definite minority but I wasn’t feeling Barney at all here. The way he was talking was just getting annoying to me.
I never did find out why they let him go
It really sucks he's not coming back, would have loved to see his Mat once everything starts going for that character...
Daniel: “Rand is just nailing…”
Me: “Egwene”
Daniel: “…that super innocent country kid”
Me: “Oh yeah, that as well.”
b-ruh 😂
Perrin’s change is a no. Hell no! F**k no! It was a stupid move.
And Matt parents being what they are is garbage too. All three boys have a deep attachment to their families, parents included, which pays off multiple times in the books.
I have mixed feelings about the changes. I think Mat's backstory in the adaptation makes his character more compelling from the start but(spoilers) later when Mat defeats Galad and Gawyn in a duel at Tar Valon it wont make sense why he's so skilled with a quarter staff. In the book its explained that his father was masterful with the weapon and taught Mat but in the show I doubt his dad ever touched a staff the way they portrayed him.
I thought it was brilliant because it shows us why he might be afraid of fighting with weapons, which is a big part of his character but all conveyed internally in the books.
@@toychristopher That scene also shows Perrin being Ta'veren if you missed it.
@@toychristopher don't defend it, it's fucking awful
Having Matt's parents portrayed the way they were sucked a lot of the innocence and charm out of the village. That was extremely disappointing.
Perrin is one of my favourite characters and story arcs in WoT so it is going to take a lot to convince me these choices, both actor and background changes, are going to work. The wife story pissed me off, and not just because we all knew she was going to die but also because their relationship felt completely off… it didn’t feel like newly weds who were in love but two people forced to marry. In fact it felt like he was an abusive husband coming back to apologise. There also seemed very little emotion other than shock at what he’d done. I wonder if there was some backstory of her being pregnant and so forced into marriage, hence the tension between them and so much attention on her midriff, although that may just have been a spectacular display of intelligent foreshadowing 😂
I'm just trying to ignore how bad it could go from here. I hope this background story will give Perrin some good development.
@Tom Ford is that because you know where they’re going with it, or just feel it has merit as a plot device?
Atm I just see it as a lazy way to try and explain Perrin’s character and future dislike of the axe. Don’t think the audience are able to understand a character? Change his backstory into one that is difficult to miss… but them don’t change the character enough to match!
Yeah my exact reactions.........what perrin has a wife? She's gonna die........ God damn it he killed her. I was legitimately shocked.
I think it will ultimately prove to be a good change. It will help explain his constant guilt (as opposed to just offing a couple bastard Whitecloaks); it will add to his resistance toward taking up the axe; it lends to his struggle against his berserk animalistic side; and there’s even the theory that there is more to his wife’s story than we are getting here, which could be interesting.
Re-watch the scene, when he killed her she was holding the hammer over her head as if she was about to hit him? She doesn't say I love you too when Perrin says I love you, she says I know. So there might be something else with her character.
My biggest complaint in episode one, is I really feel like they did my boy Tam dirty. Even while rusty, a single trolloc shouldn't have been able to touch him.
I recognize that for budget and time constraints, you can't really show him fighting off a dozen trollocs, but if we're going to see random townsfolk bring trollocs down, I don't know how one injures a blademaster.
That and how dirty they did Mat's dad. We didn't get much backstory for him in the books, but he wasn't terrible to his family like how they made him out to be in the show.
@@Animalace3 also no way the women's circle in the books would ever let him hear the end of it if he treated his wife like that.
if you're a purist on the book, it's like Thom Merrilin telling the epic story.
this though feel likes Padan Fain telling a twisted story.
For anyone who's actually read the series, which I have, cover to cover 3 times since the 1990's , this show is an INSULT and an ABOMINATION. Mr. Rigby is sure to be screaming to return and kick the asses of every moron involved with this. I'm betting his wife is disgusted too.
The list of clumsy and stupid changes made to the story in an effort to "fix it" as opposed to translate it to the screen is what drove me away from this show. The efforts made to cover for every change is forced and pointless. The makers of this show were not people who loved Robert Jordans books, they appear to believe that they needed to save what they believe the story should have been.
Idk what you guys were expecting. Ppl who make tv shows/movies are usually 🤡.. They arent interested in making a good story, or retelling something that is good. 10 years of Wokeness should have alerted all of you to the distortion that would take place to classics like WOT. LOTR is next
@@KobraSnake0813 The show not being good has nothing to do with "wokeness" good god. Everyone loves the actors that were chosen and the power and influence that women have in the show is totally faithful to the books.
@@SugerSprinkledFun an hour ago, you stated that Jordan would be rolling in his grave because the show runners decided that the dragon can be female.. wtf are you on about?
I have to disagree on the change to Mat's family dynamic. Having a family that was prosperous and thus didn't rely on him to support them is what allowed him to be mischievous. He had the free time to go catch badgers in a sack, for example, or wile away hours goofing off because he wasn't the knot keeping his family together. He's always the reluctant hero in the books, trying to avoid fights and responsibility until he accepts his own importance...but not here. He stops his drunk mom from making a scene, he's playing the good big brother, etc.
I understand that this was never going to be a direct translation from page to screen, but while Barney is doing a good job with the sarcasm, that just doesn't feel like Mat to me.
I agree.
Also the fact that the womans circle would never let that happen with the mother and the dad would be thrown out of the village or put in his place and to top it off they made Matt a thief that really got me.
@@jephthahvanroekel2561 great point about the womens circle 👍 and I feel like they are ruining Matt's arc, the changes the dagger makes in him won't stand out as much now as being so out of character, and how will they square someone who never breaks a promise with someone whose ok with stealing from people
@@jephthahvanroekel2561 him being a thief is perfect. The people who love Matt do so because they know his character after book 3. Everyone who's read the books now gets to experience his character turnaround authentically again.
This change was horrid
I'm surprised you're so positive about this, given the fact you're a longtime fan of the books. I only read the first book some years ago and I wasn't a fan of the show at all. It was all over the place in my opinion, from weird costume design to the awful CGI to the nonsensical writing and quite amateurish acting. Aside from Moirane and Lan I felt no chemistry between any of the characters. It also tries too hard to be "edgy" and violent when it's not needed, which to me is a cry to present itself as a new GoT when it's clearly not. I felt lost the whole time watching it. I don't understand what the target audience for this show is. It seems to shift between adult and YA, but based on these three episodes I'm gonna say it's YA moonlighting as adult.
It's because he's a shill
yeah he's literally an Amazon partner and these videos are basically advertisements. Amazon is ruining another beloved franchise.
At least looking at the romances it has a distinctly YA flavour, that's true.
Can't believe Daniel predicted how the Winternight scene would go XD
Really feel like they would have benefited from having an extra episode to split the Emond's field stuff over two episodes (and maybe even add the prologue but I get why they cut it). Although, it's looking like a great decision to drop 3 episodes at the start - I think people would be much more negative on the show if we'd only gotten this episode this week.
I imagine they focus tested this and found that folks were more engage when they were able to start watching after the group split up and the story deepens.
They kinda cover the prologue legend in the first origins X-ray animation, but it's not the actual scene
@@Dochamb3rs I think that would have been a great prologue for the whole series. They didn’t have to do the exact prologue for the book but they could have done it way more epic.
@@Dochamb3rs Oh my god, totally forgot to watch those. Thanks for the reminder :)
The ending that Daniel mentioned even in this video goes directly against what RJ wanted to have in his books and said so in his own words in interviews where some outsider comes in and says "You're special you have to come with me." and everyone is just like "YEP!". RJ explains himself that he wanted to make it very much like how he saw people in his real life and if someone came into a small town where essentially everyone knows each other they would have looked at that person like they were out of their minds if not firmly, yet politely, asked them to move along. I tried so hard to go into watching this with an open mind that there would have to be concessions taken and not everything would be directly as the books, but I just flat can't get on board with with. WoT is by far one of my favorite series with as much detail as RJ put into it that you can draw a fairly clear picture on just abut anything in your mind and it's like Amazon just sort of went "I know what you want me to draw and exactly how it looks, but I'm going to draw Kermit the Frog." So many unnecessary changes that really could be fixed with a simple line of dialog and I have to disagree with the change to Mat's parents, with as much emphasis the books put on the Women's Circle (Which isn't every woman in the town, Egwene was never in that circle.) they never would have let someone openly cheat on their wife or be a total pos like his parents were. Yes, Mat caused trouble and they refer to them being switched for causing trouble when they were young, but Mat always had a strong moral code when it comes down to it. So much other super important things too, like Tam just sitting up after being healed like he could jump right back into the fight, Healing is supposed to be SUPER jarring to the person being healed, the book equates it to something like being suddenly dunked into the coldest water, and very taxing on the body. Unless you are having just minor stuff healed, which no Aes Sedai would heal something so minor, you don't just sit up from it. You need to eat and sleep and recover almost twice as much because you body has basically been sent into overdrive to heal so quick. *Edit for spelling*
I had exactly the same issues. Abel and Natti have been for me the complete family, and Mat a brat and spoiled for it. I am still unable to get over it. But I guess I have to swallow that part to go on.
Mat has been my favourite character in the books and his playfulness had no edge to it , but now it's very edgy, so though I loved Barneys performance, and I am not too happy with him being recast, I just hope they somehow are able to keep the essence of Mat intact.
Similarly with Tam just getting up from that wound as though it were a scratch.
I think one of the issues is that the Two Rivers is supposed to be an exception in the world, where it's a very straight laced, conservative community that values integrity, hard work, and community. That moral upbringing and sense of community and care was a pivotal foundation in all of the characters, which is reflected every time they think or talk about home. The dynamic between he sexes, which it's well represented between the Village Council and the Women's Circle is gone, instead turning the Wisdom into some kind of weird celibate priestess? No thanks.
@@vidhyasnair7810 I don't mind the cast actually, that was sort of one part that I didn't really have much issue with and recast stuff can happen for any number of internal reasons. I can see where Daniel is trying to give it the benefit of the doubt with saying it set up the type of character Mat is going to be, but even later in things he always has that sort of reluctance to get into heavy things unless it's dealing with someone he cares about. Not some sort of second parent to things and especially not some irresponsible gambler that would loose more than he had.
@@saintjst7 Yeah, that seemed a bit of a stretch and instead if letting things play out between Rand and Egwene like they do in the books they felt some need to shut it down quick. That all aside too that bit of exchange between Moiraane and Nynaeve where she says her mother was rejected from the tower at a young age (I think she said something like 15.) If they did turn her away they would have done so and said, "You can't channel, sorry." nothing mean about it or reason to hold a grudge. If she could channel they never would have turned her away, even if it was just a little bit, they stress so much in the books how anyone that can is taught how to keep themselves safe if they're not strong enough to become Aes Sedai. The whole setup is just weird.
@@alex-gc5fv I liked Barney Harris too. His acting was good. But I had loved the Cauthons in the book, and that didn't feel good to me.
I do get the possible reasons, but regardless it's tough to swallow.
I think Rand and egwene having sex is seriously lessening the nature of their relationship, and it will make moments later on in the series lessened as well. I don’t know how Daniel doesn’t see this.
Agree. This means they have to change Rand's future relationships as well.
And it ruins one of my favourite scenes - the igloo.
Exactly. The igloo is for sure one of the best scenes.
That might be the case. He did get invited to that showing in London, at least.
I'm not familiar with him no. But it makes sense that they would offer people money for good publicity.
I woke up at 4am this morning with insomnia and watched the 1st episode, and my honest thought was that to really get into TWoT show will require me to really put my many, many, many, many times I've read the books aside and try to just accept the show on its own. But that will be hard because I spent a lot of time in the episode bogged down in all of the changes. And the changes feel big enough that it doesn't completely feel like the world I know (and love) from the books. The barebones plot was the same, but otherwise it felt like a slightly-off parallel universe of Robert Jordan's books. If I compare it to the LotR and Game of Thrones adaptations, while both made changes from their source material, they still fundamentally felt like very satisfying attempts to bring those worlds to film in ways that felt very like their books (to me, at least). I didn't get that with TWoT.
I wondered why they seem to have completely dropped winter hanging on unnaturally long when it should be spring. This is a significant plot point in the first book. And why does Perrin have a wife (can't agree with your assessment of this here)? I can deal with changes that are necessary for an adaptation to work, but changes that don't seem to have any (good) reason always irritate me.
Things that you don't deem as necessary now does not mean they shouldn't be done. I perfectly understand why they gave Perrin a wife, they did it to give an onscreen reason as to why he is so broody, why he doubts himself, why he hates his axe. Don't forget that we don't get to live inside the characters heads like we do in the books. We need physical and visual representations to explain.
Also, we are only 3 episodes in. Seems like there is a lot of judgement for a show that is 3 episodes into (hopefully) an 8 season long run. Give it time. And in regards to the world remember its never going to be as expansive as the books. GoT world worked because it is so small scale. Same for LOTR. They aren't massive fantasy worlds.
@@JediKnight20043 he hates his ax because he killed the white cloak and is a gentle giant. They didn't need to give him a wife to accidentally kill. What was she even doing? It looked like she was going to try to hit him with the hammer
@@JediKnight20043 8 seasons? No Fing way it makes it 8 seasons. This is terrible writing. I trust Daniel to do a better job as a writer on this. Or executive producer. These people do not care about the story, only how the IP can be used as a propaganda vessel for modern progressive politics. They made a huge mistake.
@@merc9nine Ahh your one of those. I mean choose not to watch it if you think its that bad. ;) weve had literally 3 episodes 🤣 but since you clearly are an expert in all things TV your opinion is clearly going to make such a difference.
@@JediKnight20043 Saying that LotR or GoT aren't massive fantasy worlds is patently ridiculous. GoT in particular has probably hundreds of character over 2 whole continents. My original statement about both of them compared to TWoT show stands, both LotR and GoT felt like faithful translations of those worlds to a visual medium, while TWoT just doesn't quite feel like the same world of Jordan's books.
Something I noticed that I would have loved to see them do is far more cut-aways. For example when Moraine is talking about Manetheren - would have been great to see that story actually visualised to some small degree. Instead we just look at the characters for 3 minutes and it doesn't do anything to build up the world (like you would see in the LOTR trilogy for example)
I agree. It would have been better. I wonder if it was a budget thing.
That’s actually a great critique, I didn’t think of that
@@anival9576 Trollocs be expensive.
Or even get the prologue of The Eye of the World in there to establish exposition for who The Dragon actually was. That first scene FEELS like it was written with a TV/Film adaptation in mind; it would have been perfect. Plus it introduces Ishamael as a formidable foe instead of relying on Halloween Funhouse special effects to make Ba'alzamon seem scary.
@@autiebleSam I think they will do it when the id of the dragon is revealed or maybe when he starts going crazy
not introducing thom in the first episode was a bad mistake imo . They took so much out of it his initial character development .
Agree but his intro in 3 is outstanding.
@@DanielGreeneReviews after the song was over I felt sad. And that's when I knew he was PERFECT!
I missed Thom in episode one, but if I had to choose Thom or Padan Fain, I would choose to introduce Fain in episode 1. Thoms introduction in episode 3, and his moments with Matt give promise to the character as a whole. There is only so much screen time available for each character, it has to be chosen carefully.
@@gameoftones77 His moment with Mat MADE that episode for me.
while true, they did get his internal sadness down PAT. sure its not the goofy over exatranat arrogance of thom, but...I think it's better for pacing. After all, Thom in the book, makes you wonder why he's helping them out when even lan doesn't trust him. Seeing his sadness in the show here...you know WHY he's helping them. and why his actions later in the book when he leaves makes more sense than him going "oh here's my backstory. k, bye"
I just watched the first episode and I feel like it was something entirely different from what you watched? Bearing in mind I haven't read the books, I found that none of the characters had any particular chemistry or personality and, Moraine seemed stiff awkward and out of place virtually any time she was on screen. I'm hoping they get better and I plan to watch the whole show, but most of the hype I felt going into this is gone.
Daniels review sounds like something Amazon wrote for him. It really is bad
I think they all look the part except maybe Perin, but the acting isn't really very good imo. The only exception to this is probably Rand, Tam, and Matt. Moraine is the worst culprit though. She's very stiff and her lines are very detached. Also when she weaves it just looks like overexaggerated interpretive dance. I was surprised she didn't have a swirling ribbon in her hand.
Bruh.. just read the books. The show is A-Typical garbage. The language used by the characters, the morality of the charcters.. nothing like the books. This isnt wheel of time, this is a GOT attempt with the title WOT.
I've read the first ten books and I can confirm that nothing in this series makes any sense and it's terrible.
My boyfriend hasn't read the books and said Exactly the same thing. Whether the show matches the books or not, it still needs decent acting and other elements to make it a good show.
I love the moment of Egwene fighting the river rapids at first in the Woman's Circle scene but then she realizes she needs to let go and let the river guide her instead of fighting it, just like how you use saidar.
I wish that had been the imagery they used for her training in the white tower... it would have made more sense there.
Except Egwene was never I. The women's circle, the braiding of the hair is a coming of age thing, there is no rituals about it. It was all useless dumb trash.
Timothy. No you dont. It sucked
It might have worked better as a flashback once she's receiving lessons in how to use the power. As it's presented, there's no context for someone new to the story to understand the idea being presented. In episode one, the time could have been much better used for character development or backstory.
I dislike that they portray the Two Rivers as being a hilly/mountainous area, when it's supposed to be fertile farmlands, with some areas being almost a swamp.
Also, they do that for Egwene, but completely leave out The Flame and The Void with Rand? Why?
I was upset that they didn’t include the scene where Rand’s father, Tam, is having ‘fever dreams’ post-trolloc raid. The foreshadowing of Rand’s ancestry, and mystery of Tam’s past I felt added a lot of mystery in EOTW (when you’re still debating who from the 4 are going to be LTT)
That scene makes it very obvious who the Dragon Reborn is, so I get why they didn’t include it, but I do have hope for some flashbacks to that later on, because we don’t know it didn’t happen offscreen
@@KillerOfWhales And I think Rand's behavior after words would largely be explained by giving a flashback of that scene, because of dialogue choices he's become more critical of Moiraine then Mat, and we need to empathize with him early on so his transformation as the series goes on lands. Right now he isn't very sympathetic, whereas in the books his distrust of Moiraine is average for the 5 and he's got good reasons to distrust her.
@@KillerOfWhales I agree, I had no doubts who the Dragon Reborn was as soon as I found out that Rand was adopted.
I'm fairly confident the fever dreams scene will be added to the show as a flash back. If you check IMDB you'll see that the actor who plays Tam Al Thor acts in 2 EPISODES! Yet we know that after leaving the town we don't see him again till later books... So I'm entirely certain they'll show flashbacks of the fever dreams along with flashbacks of the Aiel War in later episodes where its revealed who the Dragon Reborn is (Episode 8 most likely)
I’m still hoping that all 3 episodes are actually just Tam’s fever dreams…..
My problems with the episode:
1) Four Ta'veren?¿ Egwene potentially being the dragon makes absolutely no sense, the entire reason people are so scared about the dragon is that they'll for sure be a male, and hence destroy the world
2) Moiraine just tells them "hey guys one of you four could be the dragon reborn, cool right"
3) The trolloc attack was just super random. If I remember correctly, they only attacked a few other locations apart from Rand's farm, so overall there wasn't so much damage and death. This also allowed Moiraine and Lan to deal with them more easily. But here the trollocs were just going wild attacking everything they could, so then what was the point of the Fade scouting the area and the other intel they already had??
Lan and Moiraine is there. Somehow they allowed half the people get eaten alive before finally showing up. It’s so dumb. And I agree, mentioning Egwene and allowing it to be “a girl or a boy” destroy the entire Saidin/Saidar element with madness/save the world on the balance.
I will say this... One thing D&D did not do is screw up source material when they had it. I really want to like this, but it looks to me like they're screwing this up from the start. This is not looking good.
@@paulnguyen6480 they just destroyed the reason why the saga is how it is. at minute 2 and a half in, first appereance of the Reds and the line "its a power that belong to women only". when? how? how can you trivialize so much the main concept of the story?
So is the dragon supposed to seem like a bad guy? Like it kinda confused me. I didn't pick up on any other bad guys outside of the dragon... I've also never read the books.
@@juanmartin4699 there is a male half and a female half to the power. The male half has been tainted by the dark one, hence any man that can channel the power will eventually go mad (as seen at the start of the first episode). The dragon is meant to be a man that can channel and prophecy says that this man will fight the dark one. But this also means he will lose his mind eventually. You might want to check out the animated short episode "the breaking of the world", it explains some of this stuff
To think Jordan wrote it wrong this whole time and we needed some director and producers to fix everything...
Seriously though... the story is written already and they had one job...
It's hard not to feel pissed off. I've enjoyed the books for 20 years and have longed for a TV/Film adaptation. To see them fuck it up so much with the changes and (i hate to say it) woke casting made me turn off. I think i'll just go back and re-read the books.
100% I finished this episode 2 hours ago. It's 230 am here and I'm still to pissed to get any sleep.
Everyone keeps touting “film adaptation” like it makes it ok to destroy such an epic saga. It’s a cheap excuse, look at what happened with Star Wars Heir to the Empire - flawlessly executed by a discrete UA-camr DarthAngelus and it follows the books exactly! A good Director a good writer will truly adapt a book by putting in the effort and time instead of taking the easy way out like a high school student reading someone else’s report and embellishing it (poorly) to pass it as their own research and work. They destroyed everything beautiful about WOT, shame on everyone involved!
@@shadowglaive2309 I turned it off after 20 mins or so, when it was obvious Rand and Egwene had just done the nasty. This whole series belongs in the trash bin.
I think you would really have to care about the source material to try and adapt it as close to perfect as possible. I'm not sure anyone working on the show really did that.
Watch the first three episodes. I don't think I'll be continuing. I don't know what that was, but it's not Wheel of Time.
Game of Thrones was best the first five seasons when it stayed on book. As the seasons went on and it deviated it got worse, until they finally went past the books and it turned into garbage.
The WoT books are loved by many, and there is a reason. This show deviates so much from the books in just it's first episodes that I can't see it getting to a place that made the books so popular.
Yes, I understand that things need to be adapted, but it seems that many of the changes didn't need to be.
I'll close with my thought that the male leads couldn't be more unlikable if they set out to make it so.
Was thinking along these lines. I get that it is an adaptation but I simply hated the changes, especially Perrin being married and the "four ta'veren" line
The actor playing Rand was clearly doing an homage to Hayden Christensen. The dramatic deaths were pretty funny. Star Trek red shirts got more screen time.
@@chiisana-umi it isn't even the four that is the worst of it. Heard rumors? What nonsense is that? They're famous? What?
I don't get the lantern thing either. It didn't even look good. They clearly added that just for the visual but it looked bad. The lanterns looked dingy and the background was too dark or too light.
Or Moirain's entrance. Hello I am Aes Sedai.
My favorite Easter Egg for the readers, Marin Al'vere says one of Thom's quotes: "War is just fools kill other fools for foolish causes."
I think one of my favorite scenes was nyneave teaching egwene to listen to the winds in the forest... It's one of the better displays of the power in the first episode. It just felt awe-inspiring and much more deeper and connected to the world than the scrambling cgi lines lol. I also feel like perhaps it might have been smart to have channeling initially invisible? As if we're seeing it from the perspective of non-channelers. Then they could have saved a little cgi $ and unveiled the look of weaves as certain character began learning to channel later on.
I mean there are parts where hits hidden, when the reds are goign after that man, we don't see the lines affecting the mountain, the wind. and most imporatlty, when rand busts down that door.
I could have done without Nynaeve already knowing that listening to the wind is a facet of channeling.
Great scene. And I totally agree with you that the channeling should be invisible. I love that in the books, our knowledge is limited by what the main characters know. In the show it seems like they are trying to show us everything before the characters learn about it.
I think you're exactly correct on the weaves - only show the actual weaves when we're seeing through a channeler's POV. Imagine how much cooler that would make when they start combining the two halves down the road and each can see the other's?
@@stevenhedge2850 very true!!! And the bath tub hahaha
Since when is Egwene considered a ta’veren? EoTW pretty much explicitly says that she is reacting to the pattern swirling around Rand, Mat, and Perrin not another cause of the swirl. I started the books to get a good understanding for the show, and literally within 10 minutes they rewrite Jordan’s work. Makes me shudder to think what Amazon has done to Tolkien’s works…
I agree! I came looking in the comments for others appalled at how different the show is from the books! SO different. I don't understand why they take a successful thing and feel the need to change it so drastically.
Seeing Moiraine so powerful really makes me look forward to what the forsakens and Rand could do
I think nynaeve and egwene surpass her too
@@ShadowofGod616 Egwene is way strogner than her.. and Nynaeve is ABSURDLY more powerful
Dude…spoilers
@@silusnode I mean, in Eye of the World, we’re you really guessing who the Dragon Reborn was gonna be?
I got this wierd feeling that they are going to make someone else the Dragon... lots of foreshadowing around Egwene. If I had to pick someone I would say she is the main character.
Am I the only one who found Moiraine's movements strange to the eye? When her and Lan fought the Trolloc's in Emond's Field, I was thrown off by the way she moved during combat half the time.
Yeah it was kinda...goofy?
SPOILER:
The fact that they have made Egwene a taveeren and implied that women can also be "the Dragon" is the worst case of forced inclusion I have ever seen, because it hugely contradicts the lore of the Wheel of Time.
It's impossible for a woman to be the Dragon because the Dragon is supposed to weild the contaminated SAIDIN and become mad, it's impossible for a woman to weild saidin, women weild SAIDAR and that part of the true source is not contaminated which means they can't get mad.
The people fear the Dragon because he is supposed to become mad and destroy the world, again impossible for a woman, it's just ridiculous.
Also Perrin having a wife and killing her? WTF were they thinking?
it felt cheap to "develop" mat's character by making his dad a piece of shit just so his mom could drop the one liner of "you're gonna end up just like your father". Able was a stand up dude and Mat looked up to his father in the books. I get that Mat was really always trying to do the right thing but he had his own way of doing it. Just felt cheap. Perrin's arc was honestly the easiest way to explain his character on a time constraint. They missed the boat with Tam not murmuring at all. They wanted to keep the SJW alive with it being 4 when it was only 3 and very clearly a man that is the Dragon. Egwene needs no help with her story she's already got an awesome one ahead of her no need to sully it with sjw
Nah, 4 wasn't enough, it could be 1 of 5!!!!! For a story written in 14 books that was impossible to pare down, about 50% of the content is straight made up. Terrible CGI, terrible pacing and I am so confused by who I should care about. Noone has any rules or guidance, they run around doing whatever they feel like apparently. Plot holing itself. If they don't need their hands to channel, why does that white garbed guy cut off their hands and why don't they burn him toa crisp instead of letting him kill them? Lan wailing does it for me. For a mountain of a man with a face chiseled from granite with hard angles, with piercing blue eyes and the air of a wolf; he seems like a wuss.
@@SM-in1ov CGI was okay, story direction was giving me whiplash, pacing is shit as you said. They did Lan dirty as he almost never cried in the books (I can't remember a single scene of him crying or even wailing in grief, just stoic). And if I hadn't read the books, I'd be so confused as to who is who and why we should care about these characters that have had about 3 minutes exposition of why we should care about them.
They did Abell Cauthon dirty.
IMO, Mats change is bad for the storytelling and for Rand.
We dont need another serious character in this story. Having a light hearted comic relief would have been fine, and created better contrast for dagger Mat.
Also, Mat is not a thief... stealing the bracelet is BS
It also creates a problem because Rand cannot go along with his silliness at all, and he is coming off as a bad person- once again, creating an issue of contrast when Rand goes dark later.
Not developing Rand and Tam's relationship is a big mistake IMO
Though tropey, I like Perrin's change- it actually explains his character better.
I dont understand why they made Nyn born outside the TR... was just... odd
I have yet to see why Egwene is included
The ta'veren rumour comment is just... odd af
i had a problem with Mat stealing too, he's a scoundrel but he doesn't steal.
I think they made Nyn born outside for two reasons: she might be the dragon and it gives some color to her backstory. In many ways nyn egwene and Mat had very little backstory in the books. They have gone far to add some ‘main character’ vibes to all of them. Perrins change imo explains his hesitation to use his strength latter on that the books never really got across well. It is problematic to say that the dragon might be female it causes to much dominos effects if applied logically to the world but they will probably just ignore that and gloss over it all once Rand is singled out as the likely dragon.
Best comment on this thread. Changes for the sake of changes make no sense to me. I figured Amazon would screw this up and I wasn’t wrong.
Absolutely agree regarding Mat’s writing. Not enough or the right character building to set his tue self up before Shadar Logoth. The audience is left thinking “finally getting to know Mat, and dude’s a jerk” after the dagger, and not thinking “This isn’t like him” which was kind of the *foundation of his arc*.
@@anatandyaniv Wasn't Mat known for stealing pies or something?
Also, is no one gonna mention Tam just casually using a match to light the lantern?
Fire sticks are kinda a big deal. Like why is Perin using a flint later on when he should apparently just bust out of strike anywheres.
They are noticeably out of supplies when he and Egwene are separated. You don't just carry everything in your pockets, especially when you assumed safety and didn't expect to have to leave in a hurry
@@stephengrant4841 firestick are kinda big invention later in the books LUL they dont exist yet
@@olorin3815 Yeah, I know. I wouldn't call them big, not compared to literal canons which are the more important of her (and Mat's) inventions later on to adapt.
THIS! I rewound it when I thought he used a match and thought "Well shit, RIP Aludra, I guess..." Of all the changes, I think this one bugged me the most.
To be fair, Perrin isn’t using flint. He’s using a rock. That’s why he has trouble starting the fire.
Love how Nynaeve is being brought to screen. That being said, I hate that they fabricated this new origin for her just to make sure we understand why she doesn’t like Aes Sedai or Moiraine. Like it’s not enough that she’s super protective of her people as a Wisdom, which is her defining trait throughout the whole series. It could have been easily shown and relatable, but no. No, her 13 year old mentor walked a million miles and zzzzz.
Yea, like the tower would turn away any girl that could channel because she had "raggy clothes". Trash writing.
@@DeNamETae I mean they turned away all of the people who later joined that underground woman channeler group and anyone who was too weak like Morgase
@@Echidna23Gaming They turned away women who were too weak, yes. They never mention turning away women who are too poor or who have poor fashion sense. I imagine Siuan, who came from a small fishing village and whose father was a fisherman, was relatively poor and I know she cared nothing about fashion. And she became the Amyrlin Seat.
I love the Shadow Spawn. One improvement would make them perfect for me. I need to see some beaks, feathers, scales, and some trollocs that are more human looking. I know these types of trollocs are more rare, but I want to see a few in every hoard.
That would be cool
The trolloc design was pretty much the only thing I didn't hate about this show.
Yes. Trollocs are not just pig men. They are a horrible menagerie of creatures.
Yes, same here. But I did like them. They seemed guttural and ruthless. I liked them ones I've seen this episode so far.
The tub scene with Lan and Moraine freaked me out a bit for no reason
It was that sweet borderlands tooshie
lol. Did you not watch the Witcher?
I didn’t like that Mat’s family life was bad, or that he was a thief. Makes him nefarious but with a tragic reason, rather than the happy go lucky trickster that he is in the books. I like lighthearted Mat more than coping with bad home life Mat.
But it will also make it feel better when he uses his luck in his favor. Some of the fans of the book *might* even think he could be the main character
I don’t like his back story, but we also know that he goes through probably the best hero arc in the whole story, so I am willing to be patient with how they deal with his story.
Mat just kinda sucks for like 3 whole books. I love this change because it gives him depth and makes us understand a lot of his insistence that he's not a hero and being protective of Olver and the wonder girls later.
I disagree, I like this Matt way more. In the books he always annoyed me. This gives him more depth.
@@johnparker4484 I didn't get it when my friend who had read 8 books said Mat was his favorite. I'm with you, good change for Mat
You didn’t mention it but I thought the whole “trust the River” with egwene and her surrendering to it was a perfect set up/foreshadowing of the nature of Saidar
7th grade creative writing class. B-
It's literally shit and it goes against everything Ninaeve is.
It’s great honestly
I like that the guideline for channeling for women is also hidden in plain sight like the void and flame for men
@@hanneshaasbroek6607 but it's not hidden anywhere, it makes no sense for Nynaeve to ever do that exercise because she, herself doesn't believe in letting go (yet) and her mother hen personality will prevent her from ever pushing Egwene off of a fucking cliff.
In a way I think they did down-power the Aes Sedai in that it took a lot longer to do anything. Moirane did a LOT of hand waving and drawing from around her to do anything. In the book it seemed a lot more instantaneous, especially how she laid about with the fire in the book. This makes her more susceptible to attack.
I'd understand the down-powering of every Aes Sedai if they had being intensely weaving for several minutes to a few a hours. Fatigue makes everyone slow and prone to mistakes. But being fresh from a rest and taking several seconds for a simple fireball weave? Ridiculous. Simply preposterous. Only Novices are that slow at the most basic of fire weaves. Moiraine is a seasoned Aes Sedai that has decades of experience, she knows how to weave fast. Though that scene at the end of the fight in episode 1, where she flung bricks from the buildings likely would've taken as long as it did in the show with how she had been going about it.
What happened to Haral and Elsbet, did I blink and miss them? What happened to Rand unknowingly Healing his horse? I'm not convinced yet.
YEAH, Master Luhans talk with Perrin before the Last battle hit me soo hard.
@@matrimhelmsgaard Same, I just finished my third read.
@@Jesse-B Cenn Buie is missing too i just remembered
@@matrimhelmsgaard I also forgot to mention the Winespring Inn being demolished.
I keep pointing this out, but I love it: Padan Fain's smile literally flashes in the dark in the first few seconds of him appearing. It's chef's kiss.
Someone else also pointed out he whistles when he enters, which overlaps the previous scene of the Fade. And then in episode 2 we hear that exact same whistle in shadar logoth, implying a very close pursuit/tracking of him.
Apparently the whistle is also in ep3. Very cool stuff
holy shit I missed this. I need to go re-watch this a couple times and find some more Easter eggs
When moirain said 4 ta'veren..i was like yeah might as well egwene be one too..cause her storyline has more conveniences than all the others combined..😂
Yeah, if nothing else she's definitely more ta'veren than Perrin.
True, but at the same time that's why I liked her not being a Ta'veren, because it gave her a lot more credit as a character with struggles and obstacles than just the universe giving you some plot armor
I think the main problem with that is that egwene is almost always someone’s pawn, whereas Rand, mat and Perrin make people their pawns.
"I began writing the Wheel of Time because a great many notions had been bouncing around inside my head and they started to coalesce. I wondered what it was really like to be tapped on the shoulder and told you were born to be the savior of mankind. I didn't think it would be very much the way it is in so many books where someone pops up and says, "Hi, I was born to be the savior of mankind, and here's the prophecy," and everybody says, "Oh well, let's go then." I thought self interest would play a big part...
.. And then finally there was the thought about something that happens in Tolkien and a lot of other places. The wise old wizard shows up in a country village and says, "You must follow me to save the world." And the villagers say, "Right then, guv, off we go!" Well, I did a lot of growing up in the country, and I've always thought that what those country folk would say is, "Oh, is that so? Look here, have another beer. Have two, on me. I'll be right back. I will, really." And then slip out the back door."
- Robert Jordan 1997, Audiobook interview
I think the show really missed this point which was the biggest thing that annoyed me about these first episodes. Overall I liked them though and still have high hopes for the rest.
I am glad that the Tolkien estate is really controlling. This crap is what happens when you let people do whatever they want.
The dragon reborn can never be a woman. Two Rivers having a bunch of different races makes no sense. Robert Jordan’s worlds was already plenty diverse.
I am just gonna say it. The entire cast is white. Egwene is white and Nynaeve is white. 3/5ths on the Edmonds Field group is cast as a POC.
The books clearly describe what the character look like. But because they want to make it more modern it has to be diverse. Realism be damned. All Edmonds Fielders look the same.
For people who will reply to me and call me racist. Screw you. I would be complaining about the same thing if a book said a character was black, Asian, white or whatever and they recast them as a race different form what was clearly described in the book.
Yea, they went too PC just to make the money. They should of stuck more in line of the story. If they needed to condense it for budget purposes. Just condense the amazing story it already has. Surprised there wasn't a Trans person and police brutality in the first episode just to pander.
I really hate to break it to you. The LOTR prequel show is going to be worse and on the same level lol.
@@hamboneusmc9971 don't give me this news just as I finished the "wheel of time" wannabe series.
@@erickalfaro8389 I hate to break it to you. It’s going to be worse and just like wheel of time, the reasons fans hate it will be seen as traditionalism and Pearl clutching. “The Half black bisexual trans Galadriel sex scene was beautiful, you effin bigot.”
I thought the first few minutes were really campy and awkward (also pissed they didn't start with a shot reimagining the Wind) but then it got to the last third and holy shiiiiiiiit
exact same
So glad to hear this. Only watched the first few mins before work to get the feel of it and it was so off putting. The chase and capture seemed so ridiculous (the way the rocks fell, his screams) and all I could think was why, being the character she is and pursuing this man for however long, was Liandrin wearing such perfectly applied lipstick. I read some reviews comparing it to Xena and that’s the feel I got too. Hopefully, when I watch it properly, it gets much better.
The problem with the wind is that to show it, you need to have something blowing in the wind... and to non-book readers that would just conjure up images of the beginning of Forrest Gump.
@@HeavyTopspin Idk if you've seen the drone shots on twitter that were made inside NFL (maybe NBA) stadiums. I imagined something like that, but faster. Like an accelerated drone shot. Which would look dope + the fans would recognize it.
@Aginor's Experiment
Nonsense. You wouldn't have to have a single item blowing in the wind to convey the wind. We could start in the peaks of the Mountains of Mist. We see snow blowing and the wind howling. The camera pans down to the slopes where we see dead leaves blown and the limbs of trees shaking in the wind. The camera continues on to Emond's Field where we see the wind disrupting the villagers Winternight preparations. There are many things from the books that are going to be very hard to portray in a visual medium. The wind is not one of them. I'm a simpleton who's knowledge of cinematography is that I've watched movies and television and I came up with a way to portray it off the top of my head.
17:00 To me that long shot also read as foreshadowing Mats luck, in a way that was nicely buried by his earlier dice losses.