Swoletenders and Spookies!: Dawntrail Expert Dungeons
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- Опубліковано 12 вер 2024
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Square: *Makes a fun little spooky haunted-house style dungeon*
Mike: "Is this SILENT HILL?"
If you completed the beast tribe quest in Shadowbringers in the Raktika area you’ll understand why the worm serpent boss in tender valley is cool. Can also get it as a mount in Shadowbringers.
Not even society quest but one of the ather current side quest chains
@@Marpfie oh I guess it’s been awhile 😆
I did tender valley today, omg, my boi!
6:45 it's not exactly the hitbox, it's the game lying to you about where projectiles are on the screen and this happens with every travelling projectile in the game, as far as I know(not a tech guy) it's because of the netcode. You can test it yourself, if you're in front of the projectile, in its path, it'll hit you before it actually touches your character, but if you approach if from behind you can basically be inside it and be fine. It's also true for the hearts in M2 and why I don't like those mechanics in ffxiv specifically.
Seems like you solved it though by just dodging behind them 👀
The hitboxes are simply in front of them. Always has been.
so I don't have access to the code or anything, but as far as I can tell as someone in the field yeah, you're basically right, except if you watch closely, the hearts feel far more fair than the dolls. I believe the reason is that the hearts hitboxes are smaller than they 'should be', because it ends up feeling about right in motion. The problem is it's dependent on ping, because visuals in ffxiv are updated by frame irrespective of actual mechanic resolution that communicates with the server (this is the same process that causes snapshotting to work how it does). Just another reason that I think individual instances are all handed out to people on the team and then designed on their own, which means newer members of the team repeat old mistakes like this. If that's true though, then I am happy at least they're hypothetically hiring more people
@@snizzle6174 That's a good spin on it honestly, hopefully their testing team gets a nice boost, some of these class changes have been somewhat questionable so far.
The way I saw it is them having to build upon the janky code of 1.0 and not being able to reasonably fix this. This usually isn't a problem in savage since that content is much more tailored about timing and specific movement, rather than reacting to random, overlapping patterns. They still want to put them in because those can be very fun and hectic and normal/dungeons are the perfect place for it
@@baklazan777 we've seen a lot of inconsistency overall in DT, so I think it's reasonable to say, especially given the freedom of design that's enabled all the amazing stuff they put out.
The training wheels are off, but we'll have to wait to see the team build up to that high consistency
I'd love if Yoshi p talked about this some
The last boss for tender valley is tied to the gathering beast tribe in SHB and has waaay bigger lore implications than first noted.
I actually struggled with the bomb boss a fair bit too. I actually needed to see a dungeon guide video to tell me about the squares and circles also, which I was just NOT seeing before. So don't feel bad Mike, you're not the only one to be made a fool of with that mechanic. lol
My first time I was tanking, could not understand it for the life of me, had seven vuln stacks by the end of it, gave my friend stress since they were the healer.
I watched the VOD when he did the spooky dungeon. Holy shit the clutch tank LB save was hype as hell and it was just a normal ass dungeon.
Glory be to the Scree!
ok, good to know I'm not hallucinating with the first boss adds in Deadwalk. Now I just need to get better with tracking the cups on the second boss and I'll be good.
For the adds on the benoggin boss, I kinda feel like the intent of the devs was that they grab you, so the hitbox for them is a bit in front of them anyway (because they're grabbing you) compared to typical projectiles, rather than the hitbox meaning "you ran into them" like people are expecting. Not to say that XIV doesn't have weird snapshots sometimes, but I think that might be why this mechanic specifically is something people have issues with.
Yeah they kinda lunge a bit and grab you. I’m totally fine with it and it’s easy to get used to.
Tender valley is easily one of my favorite dungeons now. The first and second bosses are amazing.
Träumerei might be my favourite single dungeon boss ever, or at least close to it. Absolutely love the mechanics. As for the Calcabrina dolls, I feel like they keep bringing them back specifically because they're such an iconic FF design, despite only being in a couple of games.
The Greatest Serpent is comparatively a little underwhelming mechanically, I agree - though the maze part is one of the best mechanics they've done in a while. I think even if it just did that a second time I might be satisfied enough.
I loved both of the ex dungeons, they were so cleverly done. Wonderfully styled, great boss design, fun all around. And a nice challenge if you're healing!
I just thought "Ghostbusters" right away from the Slimer inspired ghosts to the final boss mechanic being "Fleshbuster" and "Ghostcrusher" lol.
Fleshbuster and Ghostduster :x
Honestly, I also wish they leaned into the creepy stuff more, between that dungeon and things we've had in the past from ShB, even the Voidsent, I kind of hope they lean into that aesthetic for another expansion, that could be a fun departure from the aggressive cheery childishness of DT while still being kind of whimsical. If they ever add Juggler as a job, I'd hope for more spooky circus, dollhouse stuff.
the thing about moving objects in this game is that their hitbox is actually ahead of them. you can be basically touching them from behind and it not trigger, but be even somewhat in the realm of close in front and be hit
I'll admit the dolls make me uncomfortable. Even as healer when those 2 schmucks start slapping the floor terror just sets in. Very thankful there isn't a debuff that increases damage. Would have made them terrifying.
hehehehe preach got tricked by "missiles" in xiv, where they are further along their path server side then they are client side.
I'm quite interested in whether they'll explain any of the First/Source Parallels. We already had the Amdapor statues looking like Sin-eaters and now we have the Rhonka constructs, and architecture in the Tender valley.
regarding your feeling that they restrain themselves in the horror-spooky dungeons: I really hope Yoshi-P didn't over-correct because of the reception of FFXVI. That was obviously dark and more dark with a big helping of dark and I remember Yoshi saying in an interview that he is done with dark storylines for now.
If you look back just at dungeon stories in FFXIV, Haukke Manor, the Edda story, blood sacrificing cultists in Tam-Tara, allusions to slavery in Sastasha... I would also like for the dark to return a bit in FFXIV, especially after the happy-go-lucky MSQ in DT.
One thing that became irrelevant as more people got gear, to the point I'm sure Mike didn't even notice, was how they added packs with massive AoE right before the last boss. Those headbanging dolls caught so many healers by surprise in the first 2 weeks it was really refreshing seeing everyone in the party have to use their mits or otherwise risk wiping to a mob pack. I kinda wish the expert damage stayed relevant for at least until Capped Tomestone or Savage gear.
If Mike can do EX, anyone can after seeing him do the Expert dungeons.
7:26 its not a dawntrail thing, its a game engine thing because the actual hitbox of attack that move like the first boss are always about a half second infront of the direction they're going. It's a bigger problem now because the actual movement of the projectiles are faster so the half second is further in front., not because they haven't exist before.
Regarding hit boxes pretty sure its more of a netcode issue, if you look at UCOB it reminds me of Tenstrike orbs
Scree
I remember where was an interview with YoshiP where he discussed how FF16 was really dark and heavy, and wanting to work on some lighter stuff. I don't know if that's strictly in relation to other games, but if it's how he feels, then it's hardly a surprise that they didn't go as hard as they could have with a lot of this expansion.
The first boss in the second expert you mentioned feels like an old school WoW boss.
Coulrophobia is the fear of clowns. I hate them so much but I loved the dungeon
Gotta treat these missile mechanics as if their hitboxes are huge then you’ll be gucci
The thing with horror is that while the theme of the game were pushing the limits, it's still a teen rated game and they are literally limited with what can be made. I have no doubt that if they could they would push further like they did with the Tesleen cutscene
I refer to the ghost dungeon as "Luigi's Mansion"
Agree on wishing they'd go darker still. The moments they went real fuckin dark in ShB and EW were amazing and I want to see more.
In terms of the bombs going into those holes... don't worry. I was doing the same thing, Preach. I was going off of the colors as well.
I was going off where the holes were leading back towards the cannons and thinking that each hole was tied to a specific cannon, not the entire wall. Was really screwing with me also. Needed a dungeon guide afterwards to point out the circles and squares. lol
One of my raid leaders can't handle strayborrow due to the dolls.
Every time I get Strayborough, I immediately put Creepy Doll by Jonathan Coulton on and just repeat it all throughout the dungeon. I feel it fits.
I'm not sure if this is worth anything (and I'm not justifying the jank) but any adds with moving hitboxes in FFXIV are essentially ahead of their model.
Ive always imagined them as having a square infront if their model, whether its a dragon head, missile, circle, or creeply doll.
This also means you can move behind the back of the model, even oass through it. Try it with the missiles in Guardian.
Doesnt justify, but hope it helps.
Hitboxes for moving objects in FFXIV have always been weird. The lesson for any of these mechanics is to move sooner than you think. And assume they are bigger than they look.
I always wonder how much guidance they get to ensure they stay T for teen
Spooky take
Not a fan of horror not surprised that you like the horror one more. I prefer texas dungeon.
You know why they're holding back on being creepy.
I don't really agree at all about the hitboxes, anyone can go and look and see themselves but when he said that the hitboxes were wonky he had literally just been standing completely still as two of the mobs walked straight into him lol.
He probably just didn't notice and I don't think most ppl who complain about it do either and then they blame the game.
I've had no issues slipping through tights gaps between the mobs when they march I think people are just failing and then get salty about it.
I do think they could have circle markers underneath them to make it more clear like the hearts in the bee raid but I don't think the hitboxes are actually a problem.
Even in games known for having amazing hitboxes people will still blame them when they fail too..
Nah due to how the game is designed and the adds hitboxes work. The design of those hitboxes are awful. If you have ping higher than 80ms or have some fps issues its literally impossible to not get hit even once. Otherwise I love the boss and think its fun but the hitboxes need adjustments cause they are not optimized for majority of peoples' playing conditions.
@@FakeFrost1 "if you have a bad internet connection or your computer can't handle the game you'll do badly at the online videogame" hot take
instantly knew you are describing fucking ghosts.
Fuck that boss.
@@FakeFrost1 It's hard if... if... if... no, it isn't. Not even close. Just break out of melee if you can't/aren't sure how to dodge the mechanic. You can see them coming across the arena. Just don't tunnel vision.
imo strayborough can go die in a fire XD too cartoony horror for me, boss 1 is a mess and boss 2 and can never figure out the freaking ghost in cups...
I play on NA from Ireland with a constant 170ms ping. Coupled with the dogshit hitboxes on the puppets on the first boss of deadwalk makes that fight an absolute NIGHTMARE!
I basically have to entirely stop DPSing just to make sure I don't get hit by anything, and often, one of the puppets will fucking divebomb me from 3 full character lengths away, because its hitbox on the server was further forward than my client showed. I think if they removed like 1/3 of the puppets, that fight would be so so so much better
That's the whole point of the fight. Get good. DPS is optional in dungeons anyway
Extremes? You haven't even talked about the normal raids yet!
Coulrophobia is the name of clown phobia.
Hear me out.
Last boss of Strayborough
Emet-Sack
7:00 skill issue
my go to for the last boss of Tender Valley is 'Scree-haw"
I prefer “Chadtuar”
Ya, I agree. I feel like the first boss in a couple dungeons should have been the last boss. The last boss being the hardest makes the most sense since you've had time to play with this group and get an idea of what people's play style is like. Starting with something harder can be demoralizing and start fights if there's wipes.
You say you like Strayborough Deadwalk... now try tanking it. It's way harder.
It’s easy as tank? Skill issue I guess
What exactly makes it harder as a tank? Tanks are immortal in the current state of the game
There's literally nothing in that dungeon that makes it harder as a tank lmao.
tanking is extremely easy in ff14
Deadwalk 1st boss, the hitboxes are off. You'll be trapped before lunge animation happens with pink clothed catheads gap close you. It's very janky yeah.