Doing long operations with hunched back behind your AR sucks it sucks even more with heavy guns. Firing an AK is much more comfortable especially with the old doctrine where you constantly aim your weapon. With AR would defo do a high rise optic maybe a forward mounted optic as well. The most comfortable gun to shoot is a famas with red dot hands down. Personally like guns with a good solid high cheek weld and high optics. Alot of people forget how comfortable classic stocks are (M14 EBR, SKS, Steyr scot, K98)
BINGO. The lack of space to grab the AR charging handle under a conventional scope mounted without substantial risers needed to be dealt with RIGHT AWAY, as far as I was concerned...
Welcome to the club. The group that realizes every recruiter will tell you everything you want to hear to get you to sign up. They have quota's of inductees. Whatever it takes to get you to sign on that dotted line.
I'd imagine face shape and structure also plays a decent role in what people find comfortable, and ties into the "it depends" answer. Different strokes for different folks, but just gotta send it at the end of the day. Good video and discussion overall 👍
I wish we could still admit different races look different. Oakley used to have “asian fit” sunglasses which I bought because stupid white ppl sunglasses fall off my damn nose. True story
I’ve run everything from 1.54 to 2.26, it doesn’t matter. Get whatever you like and is comfortable for you. Go train and learn your holdovers. I think for me personally I just raise the rifle slightly in my shoulder and achieve whatever shooting stance I need to be “comfortable”
Great video! I’m newer to shooting AR’s but was in an accident and lost my right eye. The Unity and especially the GBRS Lerna with the 2.93 height made shooting from the right still possible by canting at a 45. Shooting left just sucks 😂.
I run a T2 on top of a TA02 ACOG and its right at 3.125". I'm 6'6" and have a pretty tall neck so it actually works well for me. HOB is no issue at CQB distances. Just hold a wallet length high like you demonstrated. And i run it hard doing drills like the xray alpha CQB assesment drill. And the ACOG is at a great height for shooing prone/off barriers for longer shots. If possible you should give it a try sometime. Or try mine. I'm in the PNW lol
I think the point about use case and perspective is kinda spot on and important. If you're not to worried about height over bore and wanna try a new setup then id say no harm in trying it out (if you can afford it) But if you're runnning competions and stuff, I do not recommend this, since I've seen great shooters lose spots mainly because there's too many holds to worry in a match so they miss or take significantly longer to make their shots. Have fun, be safe. give a friend a hug.
I have no service nor law enforcement experience so I find your videos very insightful. Thank you for your service and thank you for sharing your non bias and very easy to understand videos. God bless.
I "grew up" with absolute cowitness and lower 1/3rd, and as a dirty civilian shooter never really saw the need to go taller as i don't have to worry about nods or whatnot. Until i tried a 1.93, I'm a taller dude with a relatively long neck proportionally to my body so the taller mounts just make it so much easier to reliably acquire the dot because i don't have to scrunch up as hard
I find that after using Unity 2.26’s to trying the GBRS 2.91, I like a 0.5-0.75 inch cheek riser for consistency and comfort. I like high mounts to help with neck strain pain more than anything.
Training is what matters. Any time my guns go up, my eyes are already on sight. I went from cowitness to 2.26 and love it, I have standard sights with a FSB/rear sight and magpul pros front and rear
I recently made the switch to 2.26". So much better for me. I'm a Sasquatch, so the height works better for my freakishly long neck. Plus, arthritis and herniated disc. Height is many much more comfortable meow. Liked. Subscribed.
Something that isn't talked about enough is how different zeros work better at different sight heights. With a lower sight, I prefer a 50/200, but I like to do a 100 yard zero on the higher mounts.
@@seanoneil277 Yeah, typically my higher sights are on my shorter, "CQB" types. This way, I know my point of impact will be at or below my dot only(approximately). The higher optic starts with a 4" deviation from the dot at 0 already. For a more general purpose build, i will use a lower height sight and use the 50/200 because it's only a 4"ish spread from 0-250ish.
@@dmoo19 Yeah to me it's that 4" tube factor that argues for the 50 or even 36. But if you can neglect the close in stuff the 100 is easier out past 250/300. I wrestle with this question for my secondary red dot on rifles, holdover issue, or trajectory tube.
@@JayJay-qi9pk it depends on your setup. If you zero a taller mount at 36 then at 100 you’ll be at least 6” high at 100, depending on your barrel length and ammo selection
I prefer the 193 or a bit lower. Given that, I hate flip-to-side magnifiers. Because of this, and only because of this, I’m running a 226 unity on my main rifle. It’s higher than I prefer but it allows for a flip-to-center magnifier.
@@liamflanagan490 I shoot it fine and am comfortable finding a good solid position behind the optic. However it makes the rifle have a pretty big vertical foot print above the pic rail and it has a heck of a hold over that is not only greater than all of my guns but it persists at a greater distance than a lower mount. I also am not fond of the impact on bullet impacts at ranges (there is a good video out there but I forget who put it out). Like I said, I shoot it fine but if someone comes out with a flip-to-center that is lower I’ll probably adopt it.
@@mavrikmavrik3032yes it seems a 1.93” flip to center compatible magnifier mount would be ideal. Wonder if the EOTech G33 is small enough in diameter to work.
@@J.Young808I would love if they could do that. But with the 2.26 unity the magnifiers sit incredibly close to red dot window. I think with a 1.93 most magnifiers would partially cover the optic window. But I would like to see them make one cause I prefer 1.93 too.
No two people are alike and many forget this. I prefer my optics high enough to where I don't have to stretch or scrunch my neck. After that if I need cheekweld, a cheekpiece can always be added if needed. If people don't like the look, I'm ok with that. They can go admire their wall hangers at home while I train to be the best I can be.
I have a red dot fully cowitnessed with a A2 sight chopped off a carry handle and A-frame front sight. I cut the large aperture off the off the rear so it will flip down flat and clear view the optic. The optic puts a red dot on the tip of the front sight as an aid for the iron, not as a substitute. Everyone has their cool flip up backup sights that they never use and will fail them when they're needed. Im *always* using the iron, with the red dot aid. The result is Im almost as quick with iron as I am with glass and pinpoint accurate. Iron *always* works and is predictable as the sun, even if its misaligned or bent.
I am glad to see the variety in offerings coning out for carbines... I come from a competitive shotgun background, it is common to spend large amounts of time and money to get the right fit on a shotgun. Obviously with your eye serving as the "rear sight" repeatable and fast positioning of face and shoulder into stock is critical. 15 years ago there were minimal options to make a carbine "fit". Keep in mind not every setup will work well for every person, do tests and practice! Great video!
I could see getting used to it for close distance, to be always heads-up. But I can't do prone with anything above 1.6 or so. Neck starts complaining very fast, adds quiver to what should be a settled reticle. The chin weld works okay for square, oval, round faces. If your face tapers a lot from cheekbone to jaw, the higher it goes the more awkward it feels.
I like using standard cowitnessed mounts attached to a KDG sidelock. Gives roughly around a 2.26 height and gives you ability to remove one optic for another that is equipped with another sidelock riser. They are guaranteed to return to zero and they do!! I can have multiple optics zeroed for different ammo on the same rifle. So far I like it.
"Heads-Up" shooting is the new way to go & the best way with NGV - from my understanding. I don't have NVG (cue the sad horn music) and have no use nor need for the new way of shooting. I'm sticking with what I know and am experienced/comfortable with. That can all change if/when I acquire NVG & train in heads up shooting or I get a thermal optic for my rifle, going with a NVG monocular for movement.
Threw my risers out, not against em but was definitely something I wanted to try. It’s great when you get used to it, however having to make critical shots at full throttle leave too much room for error in my eyes. In those instances I like having the reticle as an actual frame of reference to place on a persons face box
Something that works really well for me is having a 1.54 mounted LPVO with a top mouted micro dot like the 509T or ACRO. The top dot ends up being at that height you love and the magnified optic is at that perfect height to really settle into the gun. A .25 cheek riser makes chin weld for the top dot perfect while also improving stability with the lpvo.
I'm looking at a similar build for my next AR. 14.5, 2-10 LPVO at around a 1.54 and 12 o clock mount for a holosun. I also run a .5 riser on my PWS MK111
I tried that high mount RDS with a PEPR mount and P4Xi, it didn't work for me as well as the 45deg offset does. I can rotate quicker to the dot than I can raise up and find the dot. I spent about equal time with both. I don't work LE or Mil or contract so I don't have the gas mask, NV, etc things to work around, that plays a part in not liking the higher mount I'm sure. Prone is another.
Delta Force Legend and Sheriff of Baghdad John "Shrek" McPhee said on Sean Ryan that height over bore doesn't matter. They're still going to be kill shots. Great video.
Thanks for the thinking process.. for the first time I've had to conceptualize shooting while wearing a motorcycle helmet, requiring setup specific sights 😄 potentially...
If you want to talk about heights and you know that based on the optics you end up with different heights with the same mount, bring a measuring stick. I'm not looking for a specific number since everyone's face is different but it makes the optic height comparable. If certain heights stink going prone you could test that for your audience.
One thing I’ve noticed is it’s popular to roast GBRS height but lots of folks will also claim a piggy back rds over scope is great. RMR height over scope optical center is 1.825 with a badger c1, on a 1.5 mount, that’s 3.3in! Too much for me, I sold my arc adapter.
You demonstrated optic height of optics for AR-15 systems. There are lots of non AR-15 systems in the intermediate sized rifle grouping. One of which is the Robinson Arms XCR-L rifle. The XCR-L is in the AR class size of rifles. It is well know to use low mounts. In other words, if it works on the H&K MP-5. You can use that particular mount on the XCR-L. Low is the way to go.
But realistically, apart from the range or competitions, when are we shooting through holes like those barriers outside of a combat zone? The average civilian or law enforcement guy is gonna be engaging out in the open or behind cover that they’re peaking around rather than shooting through per se. Not dismissing your statement, I just think it’s just a matter of usage. If you’re into competitions where you’ll be doing barrier and prone work, the GBRS mount is probably not going to work very well for you.
If you are setting up a rifle why would you hamper your ability in life and death situation? To dismiss shooting from certain positions is a poor way to enter a gun fight. @@XSV15
great content....i use the high mount on my rifle because I went blind in my right eye and I shoot right so the high mount lets me use my good eye when shooting with the m4.
YMMV. I find that lower 1/3 is the sweet spot for my body type. I feel like I have the best stability using my cheek on the stock with that height. The higher the optic the more wobbly the gun feels. I think it's very subjective though and every shooter is built unique.
If you like it and it works for you go for it. I think it's actually an answer to the mask/NODS thing but other than that it's not an issue for me. Neck strain and so forth is a non-issue. How long of a string of fire are you guys shooting to have neck strain issues?
I think it comes into play when you are spending long hours on the gun especially doing door kicking stuff.... In my civilian life it hasn't been an issue lol
I also bought a Scalarworks 1.93 for my patrol rifle due to the comfortable height, but then I realized there’s no cowitness at all with standard irons. You know of any solutions to this besides cheap risers for the irons, or the Scalarworks folding irons?
there really aren't any, only thing is that aimpoints are so damn reliable it's highly unlikely you will need irons. and the scalarworks QD mount makes it easy to take off in case of emergency. But it is still one of the trade offs of using a higher mount. @@MidnightRangersPB
The old adage of 'It Depends' In my personal opinion, it's a matter of finding comfort in the setup and also what you may be using that could actually make the experience in certain configurations better.
I run a tin can with a small hole punched on one end of the can, and a bigger hole punched in the other end. I can pretend it's a red dot for now. I then taped the tin can to the top of beer can that is laying on its side. I then taped the beer can to the top of my SKS that is missing the back half of the buttstock (used it to hammer some nails when fixing leaks in the roof). It seems to hold the fake red dot (tin can) at the right height. The splinters in my shoulder from the broken buttstock really suck, but you can't beat the ease of shot gunning your beer (about a 6" mouth relief) after a hot day on the range!!! HOOAH!!!
Cant tell if its my eyes being nearsighted with astigmatism on top, or the corrective glasses, but it feels like i have to drive my head further down without my glasses on to get in my lpvo's eyebox using a 1.79 optic hieght
Going prone is what kills high risers for me. I don’t go prone often but in the case I need to go prone, I don’t wanna have to crank my neck up high when I want to be flat.
For sure the height must support a good stock weld to anchor sight alignment whereby the eyeball is centered to the eyepiece. If this condition is not met then parallax will be an issue.
as a right handed guy who is left eye dominant, your video convinced me to try the high risers, if i can jsut dig my face in a little more to still use my left eye while firing right handed that would be amazing because i wear glasses and my right eye is total TRASH, i cannot rely on it for shooting at all what so ever.
You should base what hand you shoot woth based on your dominant eye. You can learn to shoot with either hand but your right eye will always be more dominant
Only reason I run a 2.26 is cuz they don’t make a flip to center magnifier for 1.93. That being said shooting someone else’s rifle with like a lower third or even absolute height optic feels uncomfortable, especially with over-ear ear protection/comms.
Mechanical offset in 5.56 really only has a significant impact in CQB. You CAN do some really interesting things with your zero on a high mounted optic, though. I run a top dot on my SPR, at +4.5" over bore, with mk262 in a 20" barrel, i run a 75 yd zero. The point of aim to point of impact with that zero out to 300 is incredibly flat.
High mounts or not it's important you practice the optic and the firearms it doesn't matter anyway it matter most is your dedication to practice to improve your markmanship skills
I feel like I am the only person on the planet that can use an Aimpoint T1 on the lowest mount on an AR, I just raise my shoulder like a half shrug when I present the gun. Never had issues. But I am not wearing a suit of armor or aiming for 5 hours straight. High cheek bones probably, everyone is different. Just get good with what feels good that is the important thing.
Imho the problems with high risers isn't the hold over, its the hold under when you get to 100-200yrds for these guys running 36yrd zeros or 25"ish" backyard zeros. The point remains, get out and use the gear.
I use a 1.9ish" mount now, because anything lower means I'm looking over the top of my glasses when I shoot. I kinda need them to see everything clearly.
I took a class several years ago with my night riffle rig, and it quickly became apparent that it was unusable in a class due to my being literally incapable of obtaining a cheek weld, or getting behind the optic around barriers, or prone. I was humiliated. 6 months later I'm purchasing a position for a fighting rifle class, and in *BOLD LETTERS IT SAID NO 1.93 ++ OPTIC MOUNTS* and it quickly became apparent to me this was an ongoing issue for anyone that isn't exclusively training on flat range. Now whenever I see someone advertise their fighting rifle, without IR it appears as if they're broadcasting *"I DO NOT TRAIN."* Idgaf honestly, but it should be exclusive to masks and NVG.
Shouldn't need a cheekweld if you've got the stock properly in your shoulder. Buffer tube recoils, should be in your shoulder. Wedged in between plate carrier and shoulder/bicep. Not high up to make it comfy. Mojo made a vid about it. "How to control recoil".
I have an absolute mount for my dot on the ultimak for my ak. Before when i had my sam7k and in line mounted brace it was perfer. I got the mount so i can still see my dot while using my light since i have a modbutton. So i basically accidentally found that i like taller mounts. Now that i have a 103 with the same stuff it sits a little higher but im still happy with it. I have a feeling once i do a jmac m4 stock adaptor and eventual eotech with magnifier on some side rail mount ill still have a nice height. For my ar im pretty sure ill go with a taller mount for the ta02 when i do get that rifle built out.
I think the reason why people don’t talk shit on the Cary Handel height vs say the GBRS riser is simply due to looks. Does it look goofy? Yes. Does it work? I’m sure ya.
The right eye dominant thing with the higher mounts was interesting. Since I had a decent astigmatism in both eyes until I had a multi retina tear and then cataract surgery in the left eye so the astigmatism is gone but I only have distance for vision and my right eye dominant has the contact and astigmatism. Trying to find a good overall optic for my zion 12.5
@@m.k.k.4931People confuse eye dominance and other vision issues all the time. There is ZERO reason to compensate for eye dominance with red dots, in fact that’s one of the main benefits of dots in the first place. You could even argue that cross eye dominance is a benefit for dot shooting, because it’s easier to stay target focused when your dominant eye isn’t looking through the optic.
I remember a thing we used to talk shit about guys with sights on top of the charging handle... Now we're mounting sights on 3" mounts.. All in all every single one of us here follows the trend.
Um… if the gun is making contact only with your bottom jaw, it’s not a cheek weld. Compromises may be desirable or necessary with NV and masks, but the fastest and most stable will always be a real cheek weld, with the stock snugged up under your cheek bone because it is stabilized in two directions. Can’t get that floating up high.
Shouldn't need a cheekweld if you've got the stock properly in your shoulder. Buffer tube recoils, should be in your shoulder. Wedged in between plate carrier and shoulder/bicep. Not high up to make it comfy. Mojo made a vid about it. "How to control recoil".
It helps quite a bit especially when moving and when tracking moving targets. Instagram has misled people Into forgetting that chin contact and sky high sites are exceptions and compromises for certain specific applications.
I bought the Hyrda with the intent to shit on it. After about two hours I was hooked. As soon as it was available I grabbed the magnifier mount as well. Now I run that gun from 7 to 600 in run-n-gun competitions. I really ate crow on this one.
I just bought the OMM (Optic Mount Modular) from Slade Cutrer's company Irregular Defense. Height over bore is 2.5" 😂 Sounds kinda goofy, but I'm excited to try it out. I have a long pencil neck and I think this will help with comfortability and keeping a heads-up stance when having the rifle shouldered.
AR guys: AK optics sit way too high! A chin weld, are you serious?!
also AR guys: Gimme dat 3" riser.
AK stocks are also typically lower than AR’s (with the exceptions of newer ones) so you actually want to use a lower mount on them lol
@@Clockwork0nions Indeed
To be fair, AK stock is lower so they won't feel the same
Doing long operations with hunched back behind your AR sucks it sucks even more with heavy guns. Firing an AK is much more comfortable especially with the old doctrine where you constantly aim your weapon. With AR would defo do a high rise optic maybe a forward mounted optic as well. The most comfortable gun to shoot is a famas with red dot hands down. Personally like guns with a good solid high cheek weld and high optics. Alot of people forget how comfortable classic stocks are (M14 EBR, SKS, Steyr scot, K98)
BINGO.
The lack of space to grab the AR charging handle under a conventional scope mounted without substantial risers needed to be dealt with RIGHT AWAY, as far as I was concerned...
Optic higher than me believing my recruiter telling me I’d be a mar/soc baddie with a Gucci kit and prime sleeping conditions
😂😂
Welcome to the club. The group that realizes every recruiter will tell you everything you want to hear to get you to sign up. They have quota's of inductees. Whatever it takes to get you to sign on that dotted line.
@@whomagoose6897 wow almost like you just broke down the whole joke woah
Isn’t it illegal to like that or no?
I'm confused man
I'd imagine face shape and structure also plays a decent role in what people find comfortable, and ties into the "it depends" answer. Different strokes for different folks, but just gotta send it at the end of the day. Good video and discussion overall 👍
Some individuals have a neck, some have no neck. Being able to adjust is a bonus.
asain people are known for having huge flat faces
Mr Potato head got problems
Gee Wizz😮 next, I missed because of my face shape or maybe structure or probably cause I didn't cross my toes.
I wish we could still admit different races look different. Oakley used to have “asian fit” sunglasses which I bought because stupid white ppl sunglasses fall off my damn nose. True story
I’ve run everything from 1.54 to 2.26, it doesn’t matter. Get whatever you like and is comfortable for you. Go train and learn your holdovers. I think for me personally I just raise the rifle slightly in my shoulder and achieve whatever shooting stance I need to be “comfortable”
Great video! I’m newer to shooting AR’s but was in an accident and lost my right eye. The Unity and especially the GBRS Lerna with the 2.93 height made shooting from the right still possible by canting at a 45. Shooting left just sucks 😂.
I do that but because I'm cross eye dominant. I have a prism with a piggy backed red dot which I use to aim like that
Eye patches give you +150 intimidation points though. 👌🏼
ive always been told cqb for HOB you just make them wear the reticle as a hat
100%
I absolutely look forward to MOJO videos more than anyone else on UA-cam. Stay up Mojo
I run a T2 on top of a TA02 ACOG and its right at 3.125". I'm 6'6" and have a pretty tall neck so it actually works well for me. HOB is no issue at CQB distances. Just hold a wallet length high like you demonstrated. And i run it hard doing drills like the xray alpha CQB assesment drill. And the ACOG is at a great height for shooing prone/off barriers for longer shots. If possible you should give it a try sometime. Or try mine. I'm in the PNW lol
Acog red got gang. I like it too. Also pnw ❤ I have a 509t on top works good for nv too
I think the point about use case and perspective is kinda spot on and important.
If you're not to worried about height over bore and wanna try a new setup then id say no harm in trying it out (if you can afford it)
But if you're runnning competions and stuff, I do not recommend this, since I've seen great shooters lose spots mainly because there's too many holds to worry in a match so they miss or take significantly longer to make their shots.
Have fun, be safe. give a friend a hug.
HOT TAKE: the optic height depends on the stocks cheek feel first. And also there are diminishing returns on the higher the mount.
If my optics not high enough for my buddy to aim from sitting on my shoulders its trash
I have no service nor law enforcement experience so I find your videos very insightful. Thank you for your service and thank you for sharing your non bias and very easy to understand videos. God bless.
This was really good and one of the best I've seen show shooting the different mount heights and their height over bore
I "grew up" with absolute cowitness and lower 1/3rd, and as a dirty civilian shooter never really saw the need to go taller as i don't have to worry about nods or whatnot. Until i tried a 1.93, I'm a taller dude with a relatively long neck proportionally to my body so the taller mounts just make it so much easier to reliably acquire the dot because i don't have to scrunch up as hard
I find that after using Unity 2.26’s to trying the GBRS 2.91, I like a 0.5-0.75 inch cheek riser for consistency and comfort. I like high mounts to help with neck strain pain more than anything.
Same
We'd love to see another video with good lighting and a short, organized summary of Pros & Cons of Mount Heights.
This seems like a lot of work. I’m not knocking it. If I was rich maybe I’d give it a shot. Whatever floats your boat. Mojo is the man.
You can buy all these hyped up mounts for $25-$50 online. Perfect replicas
Loved this one Mojo. Perfect timing also. Thank you!
Training is what matters. Any time my guns go up, my eyes are already on sight. I went from cowitness to 2.26 and love it, I have standard sights with a FSB/rear sight and magpul pros front and rear
I recently made the switch to 2.26". So much better for me. I'm a Sasquatch, so the height works better for my freakishly long neck. Plus, arthritis and herniated disc. Height is many much more comfortable meow. Liked. Subscribed.
Appeciate the video!
Navigating things like this to find what works best for you, as an individual, is important.
Something that isn't talked about enough is how different zeros work better at different sight heights. With a lower sight, I prefer a 50/200, but I like to do a 100 yard zero on the higher mounts.
Is that for the offset question (holdovers), or the trajectory issue? I'm guessing holdovers.
Best red dot zero is 36 yards tho
@@seanoneil277 Yeah, typically my higher sights are on my shorter, "CQB" types. This way, I know my point of impact will be at or below my dot only(approximately). The higher optic starts with a 4" deviation from the dot at 0 already. For a more general purpose build, i will use a lower height sight and use the 50/200 because it's only a 4"ish spread from 0-250ish.
@@dmoo19 Yeah to me it's that 4" tube factor that argues for the 50 or even 36. But if you can neglect the close in stuff the 100 is easier out past 250/300. I wrestle with this question for my secondary red dot on rifles, holdover issue, or trajectory tube.
@@JayJay-qi9pk it depends on your setup. If you zero a taller mount at 36 then at 100 you’ll be at least 6” high at 100, depending on your barrel length and ammo selection
I prefer the 193 or a bit lower. Given that, I hate flip-to-side magnifiers. Because of this, and only because of this, I’m running a 226 unity on my main rifle. It’s higher than I prefer but it allows for a flip-to-center magnifier.
Get a cheek riser for your stock so you maintain that same optic height to stock height ratio with the flip to center magnifier.
@@liamflanagan490 I shoot it fine and am comfortable finding a good solid position behind the optic. However it makes the rifle have a pretty big vertical foot print above the pic rail and it has a heck of a hold over that is not only greater than all of my guns but it persists at a greater distance than a lower mount. I also am not fond of the impact on bullet impacts at ranges (there is a good video out there but I forget who put it out). Like I said, I shoot it fine but if someone comes out with a flip-to-center that is lower I’ll probably adopt it.
@@mavrikmavrik3032yes it seems a 1.93” flip to center compatible magnifier mount would be ideal. Wonder if the EOTech G33 is small enough in diameter to work.
@@J.Young808that’s a really good question. Would love to hear from someone that tries it.
@@J.Young808I would love if they could do that. But with the 2.26 unity the magnifiers sit incredibly close to red dot window. I think with a 1.93 most magnifiers would partially cover the optic window. But I would like to see them make one cause I prefer 1.93 too.
No two people are alike and many forget this. I prefer my optics high enough to where I don't have to stretch or scrunch my neck. After that if I need cheekweld, a cheekpiece can always be added if needed. If people don't like the look, I'm ok with that. They can go admire their wall hangers at home while I train to be the best I can be.
I have a red dot fully cowitnessed with a A2 sight chopped off a carry handle and A-frame front sight. I cut the large aperture off the off the rear so it will flip down flat and clear view the optic. The optic puts a red dot on the tip of the front sight as an aid for the iron, not as a substitute.
Everyone has their cool flip up backup sights that they never use and will fail them when they're needed. Im *always* using the iron, with the red dot aid. The result is Im almost as quick with iron as I am with glass and pinpoint accurate. Iron *always* works and is predictable as the sun, even if its misaligned or bent.
I'm an AK guy......But I like that approach dude! Props!
I am glad to see the variety in offerings coning out for carbines... I come from a competitive shotgun background, it is common to spend large amounts of time and money to get the right fit on a shotgun. Obviously with your eye serving as the "rear sight" repeatable and fast positioning of face and shoulder into stock is critical. 15 years ago there were minimal options to make a carbine "fit". Keep in mind not every setup will work well for every person, do tests and practice! Great video!
I'm a huge fan of high mounts, all my weapons are SBR's or PDW's with lasers, so high mounts make it easy and smooth.
I could see getting used to it for close distance, to be always heads-up. But I can't do prone with anything above 1.6 or so. Neck starts complaining very fast, adds quiver to what should be a settled reticle.
The chin weld works okay for square, oval, round faces. If your face tapers a lot from cheekbone to jaw, the higher it goes the more awkward it feels.
So you’re gay and shoot no further than 25’ got it
@@Conan361i shoot SBRs out to 500 no problem. Sounds like you’ve got a skill issue
@@mattmurphy7030 where did I once type anything about sbrs were talking optic height genius
@@Conan361 wtf does optic height have to do with shooting to distance? Do you have any idea how trigonometry works?
Bro this is awesome. I couldn’t see myself spending $100-150 for a damn riser! Thank you!!
I like using standard cowitnessed mounts attached to a KDG sidelock. Gives roughly around a 2.26 height and gives you ability to remove one optic for another that is equipped with another sidelock riser. They are guaranteed to return to zero and they do!! I can have multiple optics zeroed for different ammo on the same rifle. So far I like it.
Mojo and Brian are absolute Ninjas.. hope they're on my team if/when the time ever arises.
Great video, wish you would have covered the prone position with the mount heights since that is the biggest concern for people running high mounts.
"Heads-Up" shooting is the new way to go & the best way with NGV - from my understanding.
I don't have NVG (cue the sad horn music) and have no use nor need for the new way of shooting.
I'm sticking with what I know and am experienced/comfortable with.
That can all change if/when I acquire NVG & train in heads up shooting or I get a thermal optic for my rifle, going with a NVG monocular for movement.
Miss your content homie. Happy to see this!
My favorite gun tube channel!!
Threw my risers out, not against em but was definitely something I wanted to try. It’s great when you get used to it, however having to make critical shots at full throttle leave too much room for error in my eyes. In those instances I like having the reticle as an actual frame of reference to place on a persons face box
Something that works really well for me is having a 1.54 mounted LPVO with a top mouted micro dot like the 509T or ACRO. The top dot ends up being at that height you love and the magnified optic is at that perfect height to really settle into the gun. A .25 cheek riser makes chin weld for the top dot perfect while also improving stability with the lpvo.
I'm looking at a similar build for my next AR. 14.5, 2-10 LPVO at around a 1.54 and 12 o clock mount for a holosun.
I also run a .5 riser on my PWS MK111
I tried that high mount RDS with a PEPR mount and P4Xi, it didn't work for me as well as the 45deg offset does. I can rotate quicker to the dot than I can raise up and find the dot. I spent about equal time with both. I don't work LE or Mil or contract so I don't have the gas mask, NV, etc things to work around, that plays a part in not liking the higher mount I'm sure. Prone is another.
@@seanoneil277 thats what the cheek riser helps with.
I just got my Hydra for my 13.7 and the Ridge wallet reference was golden. Im out of the country atm so i havent shot it yet but damn is that helpful
Delta Force Legend and Sheriff of Baghdad John "Shrek" McPhee said on Sean Ryan that height over bore doesn't matter. They're still going to be kill shots. Great video.
Thanks for the thinking process.. for the first time I've had to conceptualize shooting while wearing a motorcycle helmet, requiring setup specific sights 😄 potentially...
If you want to talk about heights and you know that based on the optics you end up with different heights with the same mount, bring a measuring stick. I'm not looking for a specific number since everyone's face is different but it makes the optic height comparable. If certain heights stink going prone you could test that for your audience.
One thing I’ve noticed is it’s popular to roast GBRS height but lots of folks will also claim a piggy back rds over scope is great. RMR height over scope optical center is 1.825 with a badger c1, on a 1.5 mount, that’s 3.3in! Too much for me, I sold my arc adapter.
Whoa nice set up Mojo! I’d love to see your truck and how you have that set up.
Mojo there something different about in this video that I couldn’t figure out, but I just did. It’s the mustache homie. You look 20 bro
You demonstrated optic height of optics for AR-15 systems. There are lots of non AR-15 systems in the intermediate sized rifle grouping. One of which is the Robinson Arms XCR-L rifle. The XCR-L is in the AR class size of rifles. It is well know to use low mounts. In other words, if it works on the H&K MP-5. You can use that particular mount on the XCR-L. Low is the way to go.
Make your own damn video then, Captain Special.
I like 1.93-2.06 for just a red dot and lower 1/3 for use with magnifiers. Anything above 2.26 sounds like it would take some getting used to.
Biggest issues I have with GBRS mount is shooting through holes in barriers and prone making the mount too much of a gimmick
But realistically, apart from the range or competitions, when are we shooting through holes like those barriers outside of a combat zone? The average civilian or law enforcement guy is gonna be engaging out in the open or behind cover that they’re peaking around rather than shooting through per se.
Not dismissing your statement, I just think it’s just a matter of usage. If you’re into competitions where you’ll be doing barrier and prone work, the GBRS mount is probably not going to work very well for you.
If you are setting up a rifle why would you hamper your ability in life and death situation? To dismiss shooting from certain positions is a poor way to enter a gun fight. @@XSV15
great content....i use the high mount on my rifle because I went blind in my right eye and I shoot right so the high mount lets me use my good eye when shooting with the m4.
Love the discussion fellas great video!!!
YMMV. I find that lower 1/3 is the sweet spot for my body type. I feel like I have the best stability using my cheek on the stock with that height. The higher the optic the more wobbly the gun feels. I think it's very subjective though and every shooter is built unique.
Anyone else feel like a kid on christmas every time mojo posts?
Good to hear from you brother always love the content
If you like it and it works for you go for it. I think it's actually an answer to the mask/NODS thing but other than that it's not an issue for me. Neck strain and so forth is a non-issue. How long of a string of fire are you guys shooting to have neck strain issues?
I think it comes into play when you are spending long hours on the gun especially doing door kicking stuff.... In my civilian life it hasn't been an issue lol
I use a scalarworks 1.93 for my T2. So much faster and more comfortable than a lower 1/3rd.
I also bought a Scalarworks 1.93 for my patrol rifle due to the comfortable height, but then I realized there’s no cowitness at all with standard irons. You know of any solutions to this besides cheap risers for the irons, or the Scalarworks folding irons?
there really aren't any, only thing is that aimpoints are so damn reliable it's highly unlikely you will need irons. and the scalarworks QD mount makes it easy to take off in case of emergency. But it is still one of the trade offs of using a higher mount. @@MidnightRangersPB
The old adage of 'It Depends'
In my personal opinion, it's a matter of finding comfort in the setup and also what you may be using that could actually make the experience in certain configurations better.
I run a tin can with a small hole punched on one end of the can, and a bigger hole punched in the other end. I can pretend it's a red dot for now. I then taped the tin can to the top of beer can that is laying on its side. I then taped the beer can to the top of my SKS that is missing the back half of the buttstock (used it to hammer some nails when fixing leaks in the roof). It seems to hold the fake red dot (tin can) at the right height. The splinters in my shoulder from the broken buttstock really suck, but you can't beat the ease of shot gunning your beer (about a 6" mouth relief) after a hot day on the range!!! HOOAH!!!
Cant tell if its my eyes being nearsighted with astigmatism on top, or the corrective glasses, but it feels like i have to drive my head further down without my glasses on to get in my lpvo's eyebox using a 1.79 optic hieght
Good stuff Mojo. I might have to give this a try 😊
Good info MOJO. Thanks for the video
What zero are you using for 2.26 and that higher gbrs? Had a 36yd before but found my hold overs were quite wide as far as poi box. Thanks
Going prone is what kills high risers for me. I don’t go prone often but in the case I need to go prone, I don’t wanna have to crank my neck up high when I want to be flat.
Never heard anyone say I had an aim point and graduated to a holosun😂
For sure the height must support a good stock weld to anchor sight alignment whereby the eyeball is centered to the eyepiece. If this condition is not met then parallax will be an issue.
I'm keeping my optics as low as comfortable. Exposing my head an extra inch high is the difference between being missed and being dead.
as a right handed guy who is left eye dominant, your video convinced me to try the high risers, if i can jsut dig my face in a little more to still use my left eye while firing right handed that would be amazing because i wear glasses and my right eye is total TRASH, i cannot rely on it for shooting at all what so ever.
You should base what hand you shoot woth based on your dominant eye. You can learn to shoot with either hand but your right eye will always be more dominant
The carry handle was ahead of its time
Keep up the great work brother!!
3:58 That was a clean transition
Hot take lower 1/3 or shorter is the worst optic height from a ballistic perspective. Just run a 64 moa circle dot for cqb holdovers
Only reason I run a 2.26 is cuz they don’t make a flip to center magnifier for 1.93. That being said shooting someone else’s rifle with like a lower third or even absolute height optic feels uncomfortable, especially with over-ear ear protection/comms.
Mechanical offset in 5.56 really only has a significant impact in CQB. You CAN do some really interesting things with your zero on a high mounted optic, though.
I run a top dot on my SPR, at +4.5" over bore, with mk262 in a 20" barrel, i run a 75 yd zero. The point of aim to point of impact with that zero out to 300 is incredibly flat.
High mounts or not it's important you practice the optic and the firearms it doesn't matter anyway it matter most is your dedication to practice to improve your markmanship skills
Legit quaity content please never stop
Damn bruh. That test hittin them vocal chords. Turning them Multicam black. 😂
I feel like I am the only person on the planet that can use an Aimpoint T1 on the lowest mount on an AR, I just raise my shoulder like a half shrug when I present the gun. Never had issues. But I am not wearing a suit of armor or aiming for 5 hours straight. High cheek bones probably, everyone is different. Just get good with what feels good that is the important thing.
Imho the problems with high risers isn't the hold over, its the hold under when you get to 100-200yrds for these guys running 36yrd zeros or 25"ish" backyard zeros. The point remains, get out and use the gear.
I run all high stuff due to neck issues. I zero at 70 yards. It has a 4inch spread up and down between 0-250 yards. Really easy.
@_Delta_P_ 100% testing the gear is the main point
Super helpful video. Thanks mojo
I use a 1.9ish" mount now, because anything lower means I'm looking over the top of my glasses when I shoot. I kinda need them to see everything clearly.
I took a class several years ago with my night riffle rig, and it quickly became apparent that it was unusable in a class due to my being literally incapable of obtaining a cheek weld, or getting behind the optic around barriers, or prone. I was humiliated. 6 months later I'm purchasing a position for a fighting rifle class, and in *BOLD LETTERS IT SAID NO 1.93 ++ OPTIC MOUNTS* and it quickly became apparent to me this was an ongoing issue for anyone that isn't exclusively training on flat range. Now whenever I see someone advertise their fighting rifle, without IR it appears as if they're broadcasting *"I DO NOT TRAIN."* Idgaf honestly, but it should be exclusive to masks and NVG.
Shouldn't need a cheekweld if you've got the stock properly in your shoulder. Buffer tube recoils, should be in your shoulder. Wedged in between plate carrier and shoulder/bicep. Not high up to make it comfy. Mojo made a vid about it. "How to control recoil".
Ran into your buddy Angel at a tint shop. Small world! Hope you're doing well handsome man!
I have an absolute mount for my dot on the ultimak for my ak. Before when i had my sam7k and in line mounted brace it was perfer. I got the mount so i can still see my dot while using my light since i have a modbutton. So i basically accidentally found that i like taller mounts. Now that i have a 103 with the same stuff it sits a little higher but im still happy with it. I have a feeling once i do a jmac m4 stock adaptor and eventual eotech with magnifier on some side rail mount ill still have a nice height. For my ar im pretty sure ill go with a taller mount for the ta02 when i do get that rifle built out.
My traps are too swole, risers help alot lol
Im intrigued..... I think I'll purchase one just to see if it's advantageous for me.
I liked the mil-spec mustache
“I don’t go prone.” 👀
I think the reason why people don’t talk shit on the Cary Handel height vs say the GBRS riser is simply due to looks. Does it look goofy? Yes. Does it work? I’m sure ya.
The right eye dominant thing with the higher mounts was interesting. Since I had a decent astigmatism in both eyes until I had a multi retina tear and then cataract surgery in the left eye so the astigmatism is gone but I only have distance for vision and my right eye dominant has the contact and astigmatism. Trying to find a good overall optic for my zion 12.5
Consider an lpvo not borderline red dot speed astigmatism doesnt matter
The astigmatism has nothing to do with eye dominance. Plus with red dots you don't shoot with any eyes closed. Stay target focused.
I love my 5x vortex prism
@@m.k.k.4931People confuse eye dominance and other vision issues all the time. There is ZERO reason to compensate for eye dominance with red dots, in fact that’s one of the main benefits of dots in the first place. You could even argue that cross eye dominance is a benefit for dot shooting, because it’s easier to stay target focused when your dominant eye isn’t looking through the optic.
“Imagining my wallet” might work for a shooting Superman, but for me height over bore is a real concern in an emergency situation.
I remember a thing we used to talk shit about guys with sights on top of the charging handle... Now we're mounting sights on 3" mounts.. All in all every single one of us here follows the trend.
I’ve always been a low mount kinda guy, but I’m gonna buy Slade’s OTT when it drops in Jan and try that out.
Its also easier to use gasmasks , NVG or thermal goggles with high mount optic its also easier to see boobytraps and tripwires
+1 for Towlie on the thumbnail
Um… if the gun is making contact only with your bottom jaw, it’s not a cheek weld.
Compromises may be desirable or necessary with NV and masks, but the fastest and most stable will always be a real cheek weld, with the stock snugged up under your cheek bone because it is stabilized in two directions. Can’t get that floating up high.
Shouldn't need a cheekweld if you've got the stock properly in your shoulder. Buffer tube recoils, should be in your shoulder. Wedged in between plate carrier and shoulder/bicep. Not high up to make it comfy. Mojo made a vid about it. "How to control recoil".
It helps quite a bit especially when moving and when tracking moving targets. Instagram has misled people Into forgetting that chin contact and sky high sites are exceptions and compromises for certain specific applications.
I bought the Hyrda with the intent to shit on it. After about two hours I was hooked. As soon as it was available I grabbed the magnifier mount as well. Now I run that gun from 7 to 600 in run-n-gun competitions. I really ate crow on this one.
It’s funny how stuff comes full circle the older dudes have been saying this but carry handle and carry handle high style optics are back baby
1.93 is where it’s at. Everything I have has been moved to 1.93.
I just bought the OMM (Optic Mount Modular) from Slade Cutrer's company Irregular Defense. Height over bore is 2.5" 😂
Sounds kinda goofy, but I'm excited to try it out. I have a long pencil neck and I think this will help with comfortability and keeping a heads-up stance when having the rifle shouldered.
That gbrs one looks ridiculously tall
I’m not satisfied until my optic mount reaches the heavens! HIGHER! MORE! ANOTHER SKYSCRAPER MOUNT! BUILD THE AIMPOINT TOWER OF BABEL!
I'll "dip my head" before estimating that much space from where my reticle is in rapidly evolving situations.
Love ya mojo! Keep it up bruh! WA Reppin