BETTER Worldbuilding : Warrior Societies & CULTURES

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  • Опубліковано 25 лис 2024

КОМЕНТАРІ • 68

  • @tedcruz212
    @tedcruz212 25 днів тому +111

    A little secret is that every society at one point was a warrior culture, every culture and people had ancestors who had to fight against nature and Against other peoples who wanted their land and resources. Some cultures lean into that part of themselves more or less than others, but it’s always there

  • @nate742
    @nate742 25 днів тому +69

    I think the biggest misconceptions people have about history’s “warrior societies, the biggest culprits being the Spartans Samurai and Vikings, is that they not only not take into the account the complexities of their beliefs and everyday life, but also why their systems began to decline. For example, Sparta’s policy of exceptionalism in its restrictive citizenship and its constant military campaigns and uprisings of its vassals meant that they eventually became diplomatically isolated and politically redundant in Ancient Greece, with their pool of military eligible citizens shrinking. It caused a lot of turmoil when certain Spartan kings or oligarchs tried to reform these policies to try to make more of their subjects citizens or to embrace a more Hellenic societal structure.

    • @dudewheresmylandspeeder8306
      @dudewheresmylandspeeder8306 24 дні тому +4

      Exactly, it’s all about nuance and context imo, otherwise you give up so many opportunities to showcase the cooler aspects of a culture compared to “hurrdurr, my guys are better than yours”. Especially when there’s so many examples in history you can look at, and said information being more accessible than ever.

    • @reactiondavant-garde3391
      @reactiondavant-garde3391 9 днів тому

      To be fair, Sparta collapsed because an earthquick killed a great amount of it's citisens and it was unbale to recover from it. Restricted citisenship was generally the norme in the time even in Athen, the real problem simply was thet Sparta was always really small so any natural disaster, as historicly happened, was able to weaken it into oblivion.

    • @nate742
      @nate742 9 днів тому

      @@reactiondavant-garde3391 maybe so, but by the Hellenic era, with the massive empires of the Diadochi all around them, Sparta was often at the mercy of their influence, hoping to gain some assistance to regain their position of power.

    • @reactiondavant-garde3391
      @reactiondavant-garde3391 9 днів тому

      @@nate742 Yes, but it was after the earthquick already. At the Hellenic era the era of the single city state system ended and most citise establish allainces (basicly city state confederations) with each other, good example for this is Epirus. The fact is, being exclusivist city state was not always detrimental, Rome only given citisenships for a very narrow part of the population and it's golden age was at the same time when it was exclusivist compered to the later imperial era when they started giving out citisenship like candy.

    • @nate742
      @nate742 9 днів тому

      @ that may be, though in Rome’s case there was times when being more open saved them from ruin. Like when Hannibal was ravaging Italy with Gauls and Mercenaries, and only the predominantly Greek. southern Italian region’s rose up to support him. The central Italian regions, while not fully Roman at that point, had been gradually building close ties with Rome, and saw Hannibal as not a liberator but an invader.

  • @theomegapotato370
    @theomegapotato370 25 днів тому +50

    Now that I think about it, Paladins in general make for an excellent warrior culture.

    • @thealaskanseparatist6786
      @thealaskanseparatist6786 25 днів тому +4

      Real, that's what I am trying to do with the cultures I am crafting

    • @jjhh320
      @jjhh320 25 днів тому +11

      They are based on knightly orders after all: Templars, Hospitallars, etc. The latter had to be doctors and knights, to provide healing to anyone traveling by their posts. Templars, as well, did not just exist in the Holy Land to fight for and protect pilgrims; and when the King of France ended their order with executions, they allegedly cursed him on the pyre, and sure enough, the the royal dynasty soon ended and a new one came about.
      Real life has some baller lore when it comes to inspiration for world building and paladins

  • @trollsmyth
    @trollsmyth 25 днів тому +20

    The big thing for me is, how is violence channeled to serve society? Japan's bushido was used to reinforce a stratified society while attempting to bind the warrior to a particular lord, which is very similar to the bond between Celtic warriors and their chieftains. Medieval Europe had a neat combination of feudalism, an economic and political system which allowed for the maintenance of professional heavy cavalry, with chivalry, which attempted to curb the dangers of that heavy cavalry within the bounds of Christendom. The British Regimental system of the Napoleonic Wars was also multi-faceted: it attempted to remove dangerous elements from city streets, create employment in an economy creeping towards the Industrial Revolution and urbanism, and bind the resulting tools of violence strictly under the power of the State. Why does this society need warriors? How does this society keep its warriors ready to do violence? And how does this society ensure that violence is pointed in the right direction?
    Nice video! Will absolutely be looking at more of your work. :D

  • @Cunnah101
    @Cunnah101 25 днів тому +36

    I think when talking about honour there is a common problem of inserting modern humanist morality into honour codes. Chivalry was originally a code that covered the rules of war, oath and status. Satisfying honour in some cultures can be as limited as ensuring you tick the correct boxes. Defending a nobel woman because of her status not because she is a woman.
    Interestingly however there are often commentry on those who go above and beyond honour both for and against. Something I haven't seen in a lot of media is also the act of suspition of someone going beyond what is required (try hards have always been a thing). Do they do it due to a higher moral understanding or is it manipulative, does bestowing the same care to a low born person insult a hight born person? etc... ideas of honour, oaths, and loyalty can be more of a minefield than I think modern people can understand.
    Warrior creeds can be in response to increasingly complex social structures. I follow my creed I do not need to think if it is right or wrong which is a valuable trait in soldiers and those who society requires to act decissivly. This can in stories be used the highlight or elevate the character of characters in a story. Do they follow an internal code more than what is demanded. Do they do the bare minimum and everyone knows it?

    • @danmorgan3685
      @danmorgan3685 25 днів тому +7

      The problem you describe has a term from Hollywood, Sand and Sandals. Those are movies that are set in the past but the characters (or at least the protagonists) have modern values. A modern example would be Gladiator. Russell Crow's Maximus is a man not of his times. He has a thoroughly modern set of values. The series Rome does a better job of capturing the values of the time.
      The movie "Alexander" also depicts a protagonist who's behavior more closely matches the ancient Greek's idea of a hero or at least the proper way a high status man should act. He has a goal and pursues it no matter what. He doesn't consider the well being of his family and kills, or otherwise defeats, those who would stand in his way.
      However, how Alexander accomplished that goal mattered as much as the goal itself. In the real history the rival Persian king was killed by traitors in his own inner circle. The real Alexander did not reward them for removing an enemy. He had them killed. You DO NOT turn on your king.

    • @BaldianOfIbelin
      @BaldianOfIbelin 20 днів тому

      Yeah Even though elements that we consider honorable did exist throughout history they were simply not considered to have a relationship with honor., honor as we know it did not come into existence until the 1800s.

  • @Tora58
    @Tora58 25 днів тому +31

    This is excellent again. As a long time L5R player, I have long sought something that hit the honorable warrior troupe as well without the baggage that comes with L5R. And thank you for providing your sources.

    • @TrillTheDM
      @TrillTheDM  25 днів тому +3

      Yeah, I think there's a good middle ground. Sometimes a simple warrior culture is all you need honestly but I think in the context of the whole picture there should be groups of varying complexity to enhance both the simple and the complex.

    • @EricVulgaris
      @EricVulgaris 23 дні тому

      I found my answer in mouseguard

  • @nathanielmarquardt
    @nathanielmarquardt 24 дні тому +10

    I know this channel is intended for DMs in DnD, but man does this apply to fiction as a whole. I hope TRILL's videos can help me better my own writing.

  • @alexandredesouza3692
    @alexandredesouza3692 25 днів тому +34

    Speaking alone about honorbound societies: there is practical value to honor in a social context that is otherwise lawless.
    It's why you hear "Honor among Thieves", "The Pirate Code", "The honorable Nomad" and whatnot. As an adventurer, you'll often find yourself where law cannot be enforced. The people who travel along these lands or seas, or who call them home require something else to ensure a sense of security and stability.
    That is honor. To do unto others, what you would accept being done unto yourself. If you go against your cultural code, you won't be charged with a crime, but you'll suffer stigmatization and open yourself up to retaliation.
    If your warrior society objects to killing children and the elderly, slaughtering one in battle might lead you to exile or execution.
    Rumors of you being a highway bandit might get you killed on sight, or in your sleep.
    Or, like, John Wick: killing a fellow guild assassin is fine so long as it's outside the hotel.

    • @ethanwesthoff7444
      @ethanwesthoff7444 20 днів тому +1

      While I agree with what you’re saying the saying is “NO Honor Among Thieves.”

    • @alexandredesouza3692
      @alexandredesouza3692 20 днів тому +3

      @ethanwesthoff7444 AH... thank you for correcting me. haha
      Still, there is historical precedent for the presence and need for honor during the mid-twentieth century among the Cosa Nostra, the Bratva, the Yakuza and such.

    • @reactiondavant-garde3391
      @reactiondavant-garde3391 9 днів тому

      @@alexandredesouza3692 I think the difference is thet this are highly organised crime syndicates. Cosa Nostra or Yakusa is traditionalist in a strange way as well. They developed strong in group and outgroup identity to defende agains traitors and subversion. Interestingly some argue thet the Cosa Nostra (and generally the sicilian maffia) origins are came from the sicilian lower noblity and the way they act is in fact an inherited trait from the past where loyalty, honor and family was above any approache.

  • @StiveGuy
    @StiveGuy 24 дні тому +14

    The 13th warrior in black/white hits different

  • @SirWhorshoeMcGee
    @SirWhorshoeMcGee 22 дні тому +3

    A great video, I wholeheartedly agree. To me, a core principle of warrior societies is duty. Be it Sparta, Athens, Rome, medieval Europe or Sengoku period Japan, warriors were not only the ones to wage war, but to rule and sacrifice their own lives to uphold their duties. Codes of honor are a byproduct of that - a set of virtues to guide those, who need to go above and beyond in the name of many.

  • @hardhoagie3809
    @hardhoagie3809 24 дні тому +3

    Sanderson’s Alethi in his Stormlight series is a fantastic example of warrior culture done right imo

  • @starhalv2427
    @starhalv2427 25 днів тому +20

    In my fantasy setting, orcs are seen by outsiders as brutal savages, but are actually a very complex society.
    Firstly, mercy is considered the biggest virtue in their society. When a captive of war or an opponent in a duel is spared, they are expected to repay this even with their lives, as such the following rituals were introduced into their society after decades of following this tradition:
    - when two nobles wish to marry, they arrange a duel between themselves to decide which one will hold the dominant position. Therefore there is no dominant gender, but each family still has only one person who legally owns their land and rights
    - when leaders of different communities rally behind a king or military commander, in order to ensure loyalty it is customary for each of them and the best of their champions to challenge that king to a duel and then immediatelly surrender, with the winner having an option to execute them (but usually and by custom giving mercy)
    - When an advisor disagrees with a decision of a leader who showed them mercy, they can only protest by taking their own life and the leader can only stop that suicide if they change their decision
    After mercy, the second biggest virtue to orcs is efficiency. By law the leader can order anybody who is repeatedly incompetent to commit suicide, and subjects in kind can refuse to follow orders from an incompetent ruler. But once again, giving mercy to those incompetent, for example by only demanding they give up their position, is seen as even more virtous. This is also the stereotype stems from that orcs think "might makes right", as most other societies know orcs mostly in war, and orcish warriors always strive to be the most efficient murder-machines possible, by building up muscles and showing off when they're stronger than others.

  • @ethanwesthoff7444
    @ethanwesthoff7444 20 днів тому +2

    I’m creating a “morally complex” world we’ll say, for my fantasy wargame. Each faction in said game has their own motivations, but it’s really all about perspective. The idea of honor or what is right is always subject to the character or group in question and how they view their and others’ actions. No one decision is purely good or evil and therefore no person or creature is either. It may be difficult or somewhat convoluted to write in this way, but I find it to be much more intriguing and gripping as well.

  • @sanddanglotka
    @sanddanglotka 25 днів тому +7

    Given that there are many types of warrior societies / orders to be inspired by from history / different cultures, I'd like to see more of them mixed with some magic or fantasy mysticism in them, rather than a million variations on European generic knights and Japanese inspired warriors. With your video and the launch of Dragon Age Veilguard , today is a good day for fantasy in my book!

  • @lucianorubio9129
    @lucianorubio9129 21 день тому +3

    Something I really like about this channel is that sometimes he will pin the most stupid comment to the video. It's always hilarious

  • @trevor7861
    @trevor7861 23 дні тому +3

    I might have to use some of this stuff for the Werewolf: the Apocalypse game I’m running. The Garou are definitely a warrior culture

  • @thealaskanseparatist6786
    @thealaskanseparatist6786 25 днів тому +7

    I am trying my hand at worldbuilding. I am trying to craft a warrior culture that's based on Knights of Round table and Christian militant. orders.

  • @DjigitDaniel
    @DjigitDaniel 25 днів тому +1

    Well done, sir. Again, impressive collection of sampled video clips. Thank you for including the videography/ film accreditation at the end.

  • @camdenthompson4307
    @camdenthompson4307 24 дні тому +1

    I have a few groups you could call warrior societies, but the main one I have surprisingly views several things, including combat, as a way to constantly improve themselves. Basically, if you have something that 1. benefits the group, and 2. you want to keep doing, then you should constantly find things to improve in that field. One of the most surprising examples even is in their (fairly logical) Gladiator arena's, which you'd think are actually covered in blood & gore, but 99% you'd actually live, if not 100% as long as you play fair. the only way someone would ever die in the arena is if the referee their deems you unfair (i.e. cheating, unbalanced fight, attacking bystanders, etc.), other than that, its usually just safer versions of Roman gladiator fights, with a mix of Advertising that some people do in the culture, such as using customized weapons made by blacksmiths that aren't exactly practical or players eating meals mid fight made by a cook to promote his/her business.

  • @tanimation4806
    @tanimation4806 21 день тому

    For worldbuilding in general the roles of Women in Warrior Societies is always pretty interesting, regarding that they in those Societies hypermasculine or not often have more rights and/or duties then in others. Either being able to become warriors themself or if they like what u meantioned at 8:36 are the noncombative part of the society and often have Administrative and Governing Roles

  • @dirgeman5764
    @dirgeman5764 25 днів тому +3

    Another banger as usual

  • @maxgonzalez2854
    @maxgonzalez2854 11 днів тому +1

    Warrior cultures need mundane reasons to exist and rituals.
    Knights are a good way to think about them. They were essentially a military/ruling caste at the top of the pyramid.
    Knightly orders were basically the military branch of religious organizations. They had religious and monastic vows/rituals, beat sticks, and did whatever the original religious org had been doing. Ex. Hospitallers were benedictine monks running a hospital that later hired knights to defend crusader holdings.

  • @Ruminastro
    @Ruminastro 11 днів тому

    When people criticize or choose to exclude warrior cultures they're usually speaking of monolithic fantasy cultured that are solely built around the warrior archetype. I haven't seen anybody criticizing or excluding warrior orders / classes unless they're building some pacifist utopia on purpose. The video is good though

    • @TrillTheDM
      @TrillTheDM  11 днів тому +1

      I think criticisms of monolithic warrior cultures are also overstated. Yeah you can do the work and make them intricate and interesting but sometimes they just are what they are. Not everything needs a ton of work.

    • @Ruminastro
      @Ruminastro 11 днів тому

      @TrillTheDM I mostly agree. One thing that I wish people explored more in depth is hierarchy and even exploitative relationships *within* the warrior culture. For almost as long as class society has existed there have been military elites with great prestige, and then conscripted commoners and foreign mercenaries. Considering the tensions between the three strata can help storytellers craft plot points revolving around demoralization, desertion, disagreements, and even independent armies and bands started by veterans. These beats are no less interesting in a context where the warriors are proud barbarians or templars than they are in a modern war movie.

  • @aliaatreides2714
    @aliaatreides2714 25 днів тому +2

    Knocked it out of the park again! :D

  • @the_mud_jumper6885
    @the_mud_jumper6885 18 днів тому

    Something notable about Sparta, arguably the most famous example of a “warrior culture” in western if not global history. Is the idea of the “Spartan Mirage”, can your warrior culture back up the reputation that they have built for themselves? How does this culture face itself should the mirage be broken, and do they start to believe their own propaganda and become almost a satire of themselves, as Sparta arguably did when it essentially became a tourist spot under the Roman Empire. Remember that Spartan diplomacy was just as much a reason for its prominence (but also its downfall), other societies might fear your warrior culture if all they do is fight but they need an element of diplomacy to be respected and not attacked by a coalition of angry neighbours.

  • @ZaxPBG
    @ZaxPBG 25 днів тому +1

    Good thoughts. A more concrete model would be helpful.

  • @mauriciokenway9922
    @mauriciokenway9922 8 днів тому

    Something worth mentioning is that warriors are not brutes that swing wildly a weapon... fighting effectively takes a lot of time, discipline, strenght and swiftness of mind... During training you must push through pain and being tired, you must have clarity of mind even when you feel like you cant breathe and your muscles are so sore that you can barely stand, every movement is done with a strategy that must constantly adapt and that is something that not every fool can do or is willing to do.
    If you look at world champions today, they train their bodies but also their minds... so please dont turn your warrior cultures into a bunch of ungas boonking each other.

  • @KylerTuttle
    @KylerTuttle 2 дні тому

    A great example can be the fire nation and air nations of Avatar one an example of focusing too much on power and the other being too passive leading to their extinction

  • @danielward7747
    @danielward7747 25 днів тому +1

    You nailed it except for the magic angle. Just like today with technology, magic will affect what the top level of society value ,
    When the rulers are mages instead of warriors the need for loyalty will remain but the need for bravery will be absent. The warrior culture will be a minority culture within the military.

    • @TheAchilles26
      @TheAchilles26 24 дні тому +1

      Magic is highly unlikely to have the same widespread effect as technology, since only a small minority can actually use magic, but anyone can use technology.

    • @Jfk2Mr
      @Jfk2Mr 23 дні тому +1

      @@danielward7747 disagree - while sure, magic will have an effect on how society works and what it values, by same coin it will change how warrior culture works to fit circumstances - it's a process that never catches up, but nonetheless evolves

    • @danielward7747
      @danielward7747 23 дні тому

      @@TheAchilles26 Anyone can use a magic item. Unlikely to be that few that are able to make magic items.

    • @TheAchilles26
      @TheAchilles26 23 дні тому

      @@danielward7747 neither of those statements is correct. Many magic items in various settings can only be used by people who can use magic independently of the item, and the ability to make magic items is often rarer than the ability to use magic directly.

    • @AndrewJohnson-n3m
      @AndrewJohnson-n3m 15 днів тому +1

      depends on the magic in question/how hard it is to learn. Is the magic capable of leveling the battlefield but takes decades to master then you will see it in nobility but you will have men at arms under them to make sure they don't get swarmed and overwhelmed by another noble and their men. Is it powerful divination that allows you to see the future they might not even be in the political system but might come with the land after all if you can see the future why die with your lord just you will always be useful to somebody. If its not hard to learn why would the warrior not use it as another weapon in their arsenal.

  • @eliassammoury1203
    @eliassammoury1203 23 дні тому

    What films does he use as reference? I'd love to see the one with the zwiehander

  • @grinningtiki220
    @grinningtiki220 22 дні тому

    What is the thumbnail picture from?

  • @montycobra7340
    @montycobra7340 10 днів тому

    what movie were the first couple scenes from?

  • @Rockstar-bq5fm
    @Rockstar-bq5fm 22 дні тому

    Should I be worried I’ve seen near all the movies and shows in this video 😅

  • @sleeplesswakeless4721
    @sleeplesswakeless4721 25 днів тому

    What scene is that at 6:01?

    • @DjigitDaniel
      @DjigitDaniel 25 днів тому +1

      It's the final battle scene from the movie Flesh + Blood (Verhoeven,1995) if you're referring to the grim medieval melee sequence with the archer and spear throwing mounted warrior.
      The list of films used in the video is included at the end.

  • @baconsinatra8837
    @baconsinatra8837 25 днів тому +2

    I think witchers are a terrible example here.
    They are not any sort of power balancing order. They're a nearly extinct, chronically broke group of exterminators.

    • @TrillTheDM
      @TrillTheDM  25 днів тому +7

      If you're only considering the modern age version of them sure, but that isn't the entirety of their lore. They absolutely were at a time a power balancing order. Not directly but the existence of them served well enough.
      It'd be like saying "well the Crusaders orgs are all just Christian charities these days what a bad example"

    • @DjigitDaniel
      @DjigitDaniel 25 днів тому +1

      ​@@TrillTheDM, this. Especially if you read the books rather than only reference the lore mentioned in the games (or God forbid the absurd live action small screen abomination).

    • @Jfk2Mr
      @Jfk2Mr 24 дні тому

      ​@@DjigitDanielby abomination you mean 1999 or 2019 series? Neither are good, but I feel that older (which curiously had writer himself going from its proponent to opponent) is narratively less bad

    • @DjigitDaniel
      @DjigitDaniel 24 дні тому

      @@Jfk2Mr , I care little for either.