I've been a member of the Fairfield Church of Christ in Centerville, TN for twelve years. I have learned a lot about God and Jesus and am so grateful that I found gbn. Thank you .
Great lesson !! As a former heavy drinker I have seen people close to me make so many excuses for drinking it saddens me to watch how alcohol controls people may God continue to bless your work
And because you were a drunk you look for excuses to ban alcohol when the Bible says no such thing the Bible tells you God himself in Deuteronomy 14 told the nation to buy it never trust a organization that denied the power of God and miracles on doctor
I was a drunkard and often found myself in psych wards before I obeyed the Gospel, people talk about just drinking a little, but I never hear them say it's okay to smoke a little crack, or use a little heroin
Very good lesson, I actually had many of those arguments myself and I can see my error. My only issue within the Church of Christ that I see on this subject is actually the focus on this subject over others. I've listened to many lessons on drinking, pridefulness, lying, and countless others. Yet just as much in proverbs as drunkenness is cautioned, gluttony is as well. I always believed the scriptures to be stating exactly as you said that you should be glorifying God with your actions and clearly being drunk prevents that as it can lead to sinful actions. Does gluttony not as well in this case? As our bodies are a temple and made in the image of God. I don't believe at my church gluttony has ever been preached about, as well as doing a quick search on GBN. Do you have any material on this subject that helps to explain it further or would you be able to conduct a video on it?
I guess according to y'all, if the Law says going 100 mph on an interstate hwy is against the law that the safest thing to do is get behind the vehicle and push it because stepping on the gas pedal can lead to speeding. If the CoC couldn't twist and turn scriptures inside out they wouldn't have an argument for any of their so called doctrines.
@dwbid42 with your analogy, according to scripture, we are to follow the law according to the government authorities put in place as they were elected because of God. So no, as long as we don't go 100 mph we are doing just fine. With your ending statement. The CoC doesn't follow their own doctrine. As in the name they follow the teachings of Christ and the apostles He elected. If you have issues with the scripture or how the CoC operates according to the scripture then you have issues with God, not the church.
@@zappiestmango6043 I guess I have to get out my crayons for another CoC member. The Bible nowhere prohibits drinking wine except that we shouldn't get drunk. - ok the Law says we can't go 100 mph (equivalent to getting drunk) but you're esteemed Bible twisters say that we shouldn't even start to drink so we don't get drunk (equivalent to first stepping on the gas because you could get to 100 mph and break the law) "So no, as long as we don't go 100 mph we are doing just fine." AS LONG AS WE DON'T GET DRUNK WE ARE DOING JUST FINE No matter how much they want the Bible to prohibit drinking it does not. Jesus turned water into wine and no matter how much they want that wine to mean grape juice it just doesn't (check any lexicon). All they do is twist and turn scriptures to attempt to make them say what they want them to say and if they didn't they wouldn't have anything to preach on..
I have no issue calling casual alcohol usage sin, but my issue is when it’s arrogantly used by church people who don’t consume alcohol at all to condemn people who do. Nobody is sinless.. the goal is just to sin LESS. The goal is to strive not to make a practice of sinning (I John 3:4). So if you are a casual drinker as a Christian, your goal should be to continuously practice drinking less. Continuously strive to be filled with the spirit as opposed to being drunk with wine, staying in prayer about it. Gluttony is also a sin, and a lot of people who are very vocally against drinking alcohol will go home and eat sweets that have no nutritional benefit. The only goal is to satisfy the flesh even though you know it is not good for your temple. That is also sin as well. I think we just need to be mindful about showing mercy in these conversations and judge like someone who is under the law of liberty like James says. “For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all. For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of the law. So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty. For judgment is without mercy to the one who has shown no mercy. Mercy triumphs over judgment.” James 2:10-13 NKJV
The reason u say social drinking is ok, is maybe u have never seen the effects alcohol has on people. What kind of influence r people having on others ifbthey social drink? They r simply saying it is ok. Then u lead that person to he'll by ur influence. Abstain from the APPEARANCE of evil. People drink because they want to no matter what God's word says.
@@wesleycrisp6523 I actually never said it was “ok” I called it sin and said that if you do it it’s something you should try to keep doing less and less. I’m just saying nobody is perfect and it’s no different than any other sin a Christian might struggle with such as anger, gluttony, coveting or gossip. I agree with what you said about having an influence on people which is why the qualifications of an elder include abstaining completely. You can’t lead the flock as a social drinker. However.. qualifications of a deacon say not given to “much” wine. I think that’s consistent with the idea of trying to do it less and less. If you’re a deacon who desires to be an elder then you should be phasing it out of your life, but also if you’re just a Christian who desires to follow God and grow spiritually. The word will prick you and cause you to practice righteousness and through prayer it’s something you can gradually let go of. Also yes I’ve seen the effects alcohol has on some people, but it impacts everyone different. Some people can have one drink, for other people a drink leads to a bottle. So there’s also the practical side of knowing yourself. I have a friend who doesn’t use Instagram because he knows he’ll be tempted to lust. That doesn’t mean no Christian should have an Instagram, but he prayed on it and knows himself enough to abstain completely.
The goal of a Christian is not to sin less it is to cut sin from our lives. Mat 5:29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell. Mat 5:30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.. If my sin is porn my goal is not to watch less porn it is to abstain completely. Likewise is my sin is drinking alcohol my goal is not to drink less but to cut it out of my life.
@@dsvet I think those scriptures in Matthew 5 are good examples of how we cannot avoid our sinful nature which is why we needed a savior. We would need to mutilate our flesh to stop from sinning completely which I think we can both agree isn’t the intent of that passage. If we were able to cut sin out of our lives completely then the sacrifices of animals would’ve sufficed and we wouldn’t need Jesus. Even those under the old covenant who thought they were keeping the law perfectly and living a sin free life were not actually free of sin. Right before that passage you quoted: “But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart.” Matthew 5:28 ESV “For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become guilty of all of it.” James 2:10 ESV I agree that our overall goal is to cut sin out of our lives completely, but that is just not possible. That’s why I say the goal is to sin less. God knows our hearts and when we are actively working to rid ourselves of sin. If your sin is porn then yes your goal is to cut it out of your life, but will that stop you from occasionally looking at a woman with lustful desires? Furthermore will God condemn us for slipping up if we are playful and repentant? Even if you stop watching porn you haven’t cut lust completely out of your life. Even if you are able to cut it out of your life, you are bound to fall somewhere else because that’s our human nature in the flesh. What I don’t like is when Christian’s act like certain sins are worse than others when we all sin and we all need God’s grace. That’s the main thing I’m speaking to. God bless.
Good explanation about social drinking. Thank you. I worship at the Sevierville church of Christ .
Great discussion!
I've been a member of the Fairfield Church of Christ in Centerville, TN for twelve years. I have learned a lot about God and Jesus and am so grateful that I found gbn. Thank you .
I should add that I've learned more in twelve years than in all my life since I'm 83 years old.
Great lesson !! As a former heavy drinker I have seen people close to me make so many excuses for drinking it saddens me to watch how alcohol controls people may God continue to bless your work
And because you were a drunk you look for excuses to ban alcohol when the Bible says no such thing the Bible tells you God himself in Deuteronomy 14 told the nation to buy it never trust a organization that denied the power of God and miracles on doctor
Great points brought out with scripture guidance.
How about gluttony/excess? I am concerned for many people's addictions to excess.
Yeah, that's definitely one no one talks about and it's a plague
Thank you for bringing up Pattons book of biblical wine.
I was a drunkard and often found myself in psych wards before I obeyed the Gospel, people talk about just drinking a little, but I never hear them say it's okay to smoke a little crack, or use a little heroin
Wasn't Bill heyward preaching in San Antonio at the harlandale church of Christ back in the 80s
Very good lesson, I actually had many of those arguments myself and I can see my error. My only issue within the Church of Christ that I see on this subject is actually the focus on this subject over others. I've listened to many lessons on drinking, pridefulness, lying, and countless others. Yet just as much in proverbs as drunkenness is cautioned, gluttony is as well. I always believed the scriptures to be stating exactly as you said that you should be glorifying God with your actions and clearly being drunk prevents that as it can lead to sinful actions. Does gluttony not as well in this case? As our bodies are a temple and made in the image of God. I don't believe at my church gluttony has ever been preached about, as well as doing a quick search on GBN. Do you have any material on this subject that helps to explain it further or would you be able to conduct a video on it?
I also would like info on this as well
I guess according to y'all, if the Law says going 100 mph on an interstate hwy is against the law that the safest thing to do is get behind the vehicle and push it because stepping on the gas pedal can lead to speeding. If the CoC couldn't twist and turn scriptures inside out they wouldn't have an argument for any of their so called doctrines.
@@dwbid42 I’m not sure what you mean, would you like to give an example of what scripture was twisted. I’m just simply trying to study God’s word…
@dwbid42 with your analogy, according to scripture, we are to follow the law according to the government authorities put in place as they were elected because of God. So no, as long as we don't go 100 mph we are doing just fine. With your ending statement. The CoC doesn't follow their own doctrine. As in the name they follow the teachings of Christ and the apostles He elected. If you have issues with the scripture or how the CoC operates according to the scripture then you have issues with God, not the church.
@@zappiestmango6043 I guess I have to get out my crayons for another CoC member. The Bible nowhere prohibits drinking wine except that we shouldn't get drunk.
- ok the Law says we can't go 100 mph (equivalent to getting drunk)
but you're esteemed Bible twisters say that we shouldn't even start to drink so we don't get drunk
(equivalent to first stepping on the gas because you could get to 100 mph and break the law)
"So no, as long as we don't go 100 mph we are doing just fine."
AS LONG AS WE DON'T GET DRUNK WE ARE DOING JUST FINE
No matter how much they want the Bible to prohibit drinking it does not. Jesus turned water into wine and no matter how much they want that wine to mean grape juice it just doesn't (check any lexicon). All they do is twist and turn scriptures to attempt to make them say what they want them to say and if they didn't they wouldn't have anything to preach on..
I'll say when it comes to consuming alcohol manissabling Cough syrup is a good Example
When a person focuses on drinking they lose sight of God.
I have no issue calling casual alcohol usage sin, but my issue is when it’s arrogantly used by church people who don’t consume alcohol at all to condemn people who do.
Nobody is sinless.. the goal is just to sin LESS. The goal is to strive not to make a practice of sinning (I John 3:4). So if you are a casual drinker as a Christian, your goal should be to continuously practice drinking less. Continuously strive to be filled with the spirit as opposed to being drunk with wine, staying in prayer about it.
Gluttony is also a sin, and a lot of people who are very vocally against drinking alcohol will go home and eat sweets that have no nutritional benefit. The only goal is to satisfy the flesh even though you know it is not good for your temple. That is also sin as well. I think we just need to be mindful about showing mercy in these conversations and judge like someone who is under the law of liberty like James says.
“For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all. For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of the law. So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty. For judgment is without mercy to the one who has shown no mercy. Mercy triumphs over judgment.”
James 2:10-13 NKJV
The reason u say social drinking is ok, is maybe u have never seen the effects alcohol has on people. What kind of influence r people having on others ifbthey social drink? They r simply saying it is ok. Then u lead that person to he'll by ur influence. Abstain from the APPEARANCE of evil. People drink because they want to no matter what God's word says.
@@wesleycrisp6523 I actually never said it was “ok” I called it sin and said that if you do it it’s something you should try to keep doing less and less. I’m just saying nobody is perfect and it’s no different than any other sin a Christian might struggle with such as anger, gluttony, coveting or gossip.
I agree with what you said about having an influence on people which is why the qualifications of an elder include abstaining completely. You can’t lead the flock as a social drinker. However.. qualifications of a deacon say not given to “much” wine. I think that’s consistent with the idea of trying to do it less and less. If you’re a deacon who desires to be an elder then you should be phasing it out of your life, but also if you’re just a Christian who desires to follow God and grow spiritually. The word will prick you and cause you to practice righteousness and through prayer it’s something you can gradually let go of.
Also yes I’ve seen the effects alcohol has on some people, but it impacts everyone different. Some people can have one drink, for other people a drink leads to a bottle. So there’s also the practical side of knowing yourself. I have a friend who doesn’t use Instagram because he knows he’ll be tempted to lust. That doesn’t mean no Christian should have an Instagram, but he prayed on it and knows himself enough to abstain completely.
The goal of a Christian is not to sin less it is to cut sin from our lives.
Mat 5:29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
Mat 5:30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell..
If my sin is porn my goal is not to watch less porn it is to abstain completely. Likewise is my sin is drinking alcohol my goal is not to drink less but to cut it out of my life.
@@dsvet I think those scriptures in Matthew 5 are good examples of how we cannot avoid our sinful nature which is why we needed a savior. We would need to mutilate our flesh to stop from sinning completely which I think we can both agree isn’t the intent of that passage. If we were able to cut sin out of our lives completely then the sacrifices of animals would’ve sufficed and we wouldn’t need Jesus. Even those under the old covenant who thought they were keeping the law perfectly and living a sin free life were not actually free of sin. Right before that passage you quoted:
“But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart.”
Matthew 5:28 ESV
“For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become guilty of all of it.”
James 2:10 ESV
I agree that our overall goal is to cut sin out of our lives completely, but that is just not possible. That’s why I say the goal is to sin less. God knows our hearts and when we are actively working to rid ourselves of sin. If your sin is porn then yes your goal is to cut it out of your life, but will that stop you from occasionally looking at a woman with lustful desires? Furthermore will God condemn us for slipping up if we are playful and repentant? Even if you stop watching porn you haven’t cut lust completely out of your life. Even if you are able to cut it out of your life, you are bound to fall somewhere else because that’s our human nature in the flesh.
What I don’t like is when Christian’s act like certain sins are worse than others when we all sin and we all need God’s grace. That’s the main thing I’m speaking to.
God bless.