This was beautiful. I love, love, love this!! I was one of those "chapel builders", both literally when I was young, and spiritually until the last fifteen years or so. Certainty, duty, don't question and so on. But that had to change as I came face to face with new information in publications from faithful sources, including the Saints volumes, and finally admitting that my own wonderful experience with our loving father in heaven didn't fit the narrative that I thought I had a very certain "testimony" about. I love to hear from people, like the Nortons and the Givens who are articulating what I've been feeling for the past 10+ years. This is so important! Thank you!
I cried and cried throughout this podcast. What a beautiful vision of what the church could be that truly showcases the gospel as it should be. Thank you!!!
Wow, what a wonderful couple. I could feel the spirit witness to me so strongly the love they have for the Saviour and the desire to help those in the church who are struggling. Thank you for your service.😊 from Canada
This episode was such a GIFT!! As much as I love all of the scholarly presentations which are largely cerebral and fill my doctrinal understandings, this episode had so much pure HEART. I wanted to continue tearfully listening to it over and over again. The Norton's provide a wisdom That's practical, beautiful, necessary, and so very christ-like. The spirit was bouncing off my walls during this episode and testified to me of the beautiful basic and often unappreciated truths they bore. No plebeians these. Saints in the highest degree!Thank you for this episode so so much!❤
Jen and Sam need to speak at General Conference. But until then, 😊 I am personally so grateful for their wisdom, love, and foresight. I have sent this conversation to many in my family because I think it’s a perspective that so many of us need to adopt. As always, Faith Matters is an enormous inspiration to me!
This was deeply inspiring. Thank you for having Jen and Sam on your podcast, they have beautiful spirits, and their meekness Christ-like souls have touched me and is life changing.♥️
Wow. This should be required listening for all Seminary teachers. I thought Clayton Christiansen's book made us re-think missionary work. This hits me as having the same impact of knowing where this generation of youth is coming from and how to approach them. It is quite critical, I think.
I was so happy to hear that the area seventy trusted Jen to make decisions for their particular circumstances. The church needs that more. Let the Spirit work how it may and leaders get out of the way.
I love this so much! Thank you for sharing! These experiences are inspiring and tender! ❤❤ Everyone needs to hear this and go forward with this love. I will try to be that love in my community.
This conversation is so enlightening! This feels like the direction we should all be leaning towards to keep our youth interested and involved. Thank you!
This conversation sparked so many inspiring ideas for me. I found myself scouring the scriptures for these themes and saw them in surprising new places. I know this is delicate work without one-size-fits-all answers - but I loved hearing how the Spirit's targeted guidance (and their own best efforts to apply it) yielded such remarkable results. Thank you for facilitating and sharing this conversation. Great work!
Brilliant interview - love the way they are facilitating a church culture among youth that is more inclusive and down to earth while also being theologically-grounded. Have them on again please. Would love to hear how they personally approach their faith and relationships to the church.
Inspiring episode, the topics they describe in discussing them with the youth are timely and needed and can bring the way we practice our faith to a higher level. Concerning the all in or all out approach in our faith community, I don't think this is going to go away any time soon unfortunately. On the contrary if someone does not fully conform with a Church standards, even if you do so from a place of integrity, you will still be seen as a broken thing who is not spiritually exemplary. For example, if a youth (or any member of the church) decides to have sex before marriage or drink coffee on a regular basis and even has worked this out with God for him/herself, most wards would never consider you spiritually whole or exemplary. You would not receive leadership positions, would possibly be bared from serving opportunities and many would not take your spiritually serious, cause mainly, despite all the good things you do, you are still a sinner in their eyes. In that sense there is no true spiritual diversity within the church and youth who don't comply with church standards will find out soon that it is difficult to find a respectable place within the church when you don't comply with all standards. I hope one day, our church will truly be a place of spiritual belonging and that people who make choices that are against church standards, but are done from a place of integrity, will still have a respectable place within the church without being looked down at or seen as broken.
I love this podcast so much. The God and Goddess who I believe in will welcome us with open arms. I do have a question, did you ask any stake relief society presidents how many members of their stake will make it to the celestial kingdom? I would love to know how their answers would differ from their priesthood counterparts.
Awesome interview. I’m a universalist too. I don’t think God sends anyone to ‘Hell’. What on Earth would he or we gain by that? I’m guessing that he may ask us what we have learned during our life and where do we want to go next. I cannot fathom why God would put a Veil of Forgetting in place and give us the gift of free choice and send his son to save us in the way that he did then punish us so damnably for making the wrong choices. Yes it makes more sense that we eternally progress, mortality is just one part of that process. In a sense, there is a Hell. Hell is the consequences of bad decisions made here in life but we live out those consequences here in the mortal world. They don’t follow us into the next. What happens in Fight Club stays in Fight Club. This theology gives me a much stronger incentive to live righteously. Scaring me to death with eternal damnation just makes me want to give up because I cannot measure up to perfection.
Eternal progression. .. (from seminary) "Here, then, is eternal life -- to know the only wise and true God and you have got to learn how to be gods yourselves, and to be kings and priests to God, the same as all gods have done before you, namely, by going from one small degree to another, and from a small capacity to a great one; from grace to grace, from exaltation to exaltation, until you attain to the resurrection of the dead, and are able to dwell in everlasting burnings, and to sit in glory, as do those who sit enthroned in everlasting power. . . . JS
Perhaps a substitute word for worthiness could be qualified. Worthiness seems like such a final state. Whereas qualified is what we are working towards. Sam's answer to the question of how many people will make it to the celestial kingdom is certainly a hopeful one but one I cannot agree with. I think a better answer is that everyone who wants to will enter the celestial kingdom. But there will be some who do not want to.
So many tears while listening to this conversation, yes, yes, yes!
This was beautiful. I love, love, love this!! I was one of those "chapel builders", both literally when I was young, and spiritually until the last fifteen years or so. Certainty, duty, don't question and so on. But that had to change as I came face to face with new information in publications from faithful sources, including the Saints volumes, and finally admitting that my own wonderful experience with our loving father in heaven didn't fit the narrative that I thought I had a very certain "testimony" about. I love to hear from people, like the Nortons and the Givens who are articulating what I've been feeling for the past 10+ years. This is so important! Thank you!
I cried and cried throughout this podcast. What a beautiful vision of what the church could be that truly showcases the gospel as it should be. Thank you!!!
Thoroughly helpful interview. Thank you.
I wish the 12 could watch this and apply these teachings. This is what the church should be.
THIS is the gospel of Jesus Christ!!
Amazing episode. So much love and understanding ❤️
Wow, what a wonderful couple. I could feel the spirit witness to me so strongly the love they have for the Saviour and the desire to help those in the church who are struggling. Thank you for your service.😊 from Canada
Jen and Sam 🥳🥳🙌🏼🇬🇧 made fsy special for me as a counsellor
This episode was such a GIFT!! As much as I love all of the scholarly presentations which are largely cerebral and fill my doctrinal understandings, this episode had so much pure HEART. I wanted to continue tearfully listening to it over and over again. The Norton's provide a wisdom That's practical, beautiful, necessary, and so very christ-like. The spirit was bouncing off my walls during this episode and testified to me of the beautiful basic and often unappreciated truths they bore. No plebeians these. Saints in the highest degree!Thank you for this episode so so much!❤
Yes! Yes! Yes! Bless you! Bless you! Bless you! ❤❤❤
Jen and Sam need to speak at General Conference. But until then, 😊 I am personally so grateful for their wisdom, love, and foresight. I have sent this conversation to many in my family because I think it’s a perspective that so many of us need to adopt. As always, Faith Matters is an enormous inspiration to me!
This was deeply inspiring. Thank you for having Jen and Sam on your podcast, they have beautiful spirits, and their meekness Christ-like souls have touched me and is life changing.♥️
Wow. This should be required listening for all Seminary teachers. I thought Clayton Christiansen's book made us re-think missionary work. This hits me as having the same impact of knowing where this generation of youth is coming from and how to approach them. It is quite critical, I think.
I was so happy to hear that the area seventy trusted Jen to make decisions for their particular circumstances. The church needs that more. Let the Spirit work how it may and leaders get out of the way.
I love this so much! Thank you for sharing! These experiences are inspiring and tender! ❤❤ Everyone needs to hear this and go forward with this love. I will try to be that love in my community.
This conversation is so enlightening! This feels like the direction we should all be leaning towards to keep our youth interested and involved. Thank you!
This conversation sparked so many inspiring ideas for me. I found myself scouring the scriptures for these themes and saw them in surprising new places. I know this is delicate work without one-size-fits-all answers - but I loved hearing how the Spirit's targeted guidance (and their own best efforts to apply it) yielded such remarkable results. Thank you for facilitating and sharing this conversation. Great work!
Brilliant interview - love the way they are facilitating a church culture among youth that is more inclusive and down to earth while also being theologically-grounded. Have them on again please. Would love to hear how they personally approach their faith and relationships to the church.
Jen and Sam for 🇺🇸president!
Can I give this a hundred thumbs up? "There has to be a wider lens." My wife and I have identical conversations.
Inspiring episode, the topics they describe in discussing them with the youth are timely and needed and can bring the way we practice our faith to a higher level.
Concerning the all in or all out approach in our faith community, I don't think this is going to go away any time soon unfortunately. On the contrary if someone does not fully conform with a Church standards, even if you do so from a place of integrity, you will still be seen as a broken thing who is not spiritually exemplary. For example, if a youth (or any member of the church) decides to have sex before marriage or drink coffee on a regular basis and even has worked this out with God for him/herself, most wards would never consider you spiritually whole or exemplary. You would not receive leadership positions, would possibly be bared from serving opportunities and many would not take your spiritually serious, cause mainly, despite all the good things you do, you are still a sinner in their eyes. In that sense there is no true spiritual diversity within the church and youth who don't comply with church standards will find out soon that it is difficult to find a respectable place within the church when you don't comply with all standards.
I hope one day, our church will truly be a place of spiritual belonging and that people who make choices that are against church standards, but are done from a place of integrity, will still have a respectable place within the church without being looked down at or seen as broken.
Spectacular podcast, great perspectives.
I love this podcast so much. The God and Goddess who I believe in will welcome us with open arms.
I do have a question, did you ask any stake relief society presidents how many members of their stake will make it to the celestial kingdom? I would love to know how their answers would differ from their priesthood counterparts.
Awesome interview. I’m a universalist too. I don’t think God sends anyone to ‘Hell’. What on Earth would he or we gain by that?
I’m guessing that he may ask us what we have learned during our life and where do we want to go next.
I cannot fathom why God would put a Veil of Forgetting in place and give us the gift of free choice and send his son to save us in the way that he did then punish us so damnably for making the wrong choices.
Yes it makes more sense that we eternally progress, mortality is just one part of that process.
In a sense, there is a Hell. Hell is the consequences of bad decisions made here in life but we live out those consequences here in the mortal world. They don’t follow us into the next.
What happens in Fight Club stays in Fight Club.
This theology gives me a much stronger incentive to live righteously.
Scaring me to death with eternal damnation just makes me want to give up because I cannot measure up to perfection.
👏👏👏👏👏
💜💜💜💜💜
Eternal progression. .. (from seminary)
"Here, then, is eternal life -- to know the only wise and true God and you have got to learn how to be gods yourselves, and to be kings and priests to God, the same as all gods have done before you, namely, by going from one small degree to another, and from a small capacity to a great one; from grace to grace, from exaltation to exaltation, until you attain to the resurrection of the dead, and are able to dwell in everlasting burnings, and to sit in glory, as do those who sit enthroned in everlasting power. . . . JS
Perhaps a substitute word for worthiness could be qualified. Worthiness seems like such a final state. Whereas qualified is what we are working towards. Sam's answer to the question of how many people will make it to the celestial kingdom is certainly a hopeful one but one I cannot agree with. I think a better answer is that everyone who wants to will enter the celestial kingdom. But there will be some who do not want to.
@Ramman1983
My bottom line is that none of us is qualified to pronounce the future damnation or exaltation of any individual.
Loved this. But What's the Grandpa episode they're referring to?