McDojo Breakdown: Grappling with Fake Martial Arts
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- Опубліковано 19 сер 2024
- In Todays McDojo Breakdown we check out a martial arts instructor by the name of Evan Pantazi who truly seems to believe in the power of chi and fake martial arts. Enjoy :)
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Just so we are clear, im 48 never trained any martial arts and I love your channel, even I can "smell what the rock is cooking here'" I love this channel for the pure entertainment. I do however challenge my 260lbs at 5'8" stature to any of these frauds, give me 3 months and I'll wip the shit out of any of them. Lest you think i am arrogant, its more my believe in me to get in shape and be ready to fight vs there years of delusion. at a min either way I win and they are a fraud, or they kick my ass and it proves they can beat a lame ass like my self. and to the question of the day, Michael Dudikoff should get some kind of royalties from every mcdojo and probably a bit from real dojos
lol i'm an old guy not good with social media, but for sure live in a med size town in Kentucky, and if anyone (mcdojos and even pentazole or any mcdojo ill give rob contact info upfront that he can post (don't want to call out my local mma gym as I'm not a member and never have but I would love to get i real shape for free) I will totally commit to what ever schedule they and rob provides to get in fighting shape in 3 months (best they can do) and win or lose, I care not for any publicity, in any way. Rob you can come film and blur my face. if any digital person thinks this is a shine, I'm in IT by trade, provide public ssl/pgp key an I'll encrypt all future and further comms to your for verification. Just so we are all clear, the win for me is getting in shape to avoid humiliation, vs any person who thinks I'll let the knock me out without touching me. I want know fame in this, I'll meet all parties improved for me to not benefit in any way, other than the natural help of getting in shape (which I'm hoping some local mma gym will invest in me as some promo stunt, that aside, I'll pay all fees' and ask for half and "only for half if I win from rob if no other party will pay the other half!. But I will cover all expenses up until fight and expect reimbursement only with in 90 days of win only" To be 100% clear, i want ot get in shape and the internet watching is a great motivator
Met even a few times. He was teaching nonsense to uechy schools in mass via seminar. He wanted to to assist him teaching bjj cause 25 years ago bjj was hot. I explained that bjj was legit and his shit was nonsense so I wasn’t interested.
Evan admitted his shit didn’t really work. Which surprises me.
But even back then he knew it was nonsense
It'd be really interesting to see you bring in a psychologist to talk about how these guys get their techniques to "work" on their students. My theory is that it's very similar to a stage hypnotist, or those Pentecostal preachers who can make their congregation "faint" with the holy spirit. Some kind of mix of placebo, peer pressure, and knowing someone is an "expert"
1. Placebo. Simple concept, you expect something to happen, so your psyche is on the lookout for symptoms. Seeing the effect "work" on your classmates makes this even more powerful.
2. Peer pressure. Deep down, psycological, you know it's gonna be super awkward and you'll likely be scolded or even ousted from your class if you don't allow the technique to work on you. Some of these students pay hundreds of dollars a month for these classes and attend them for years.
3. Thinking "he's an expert" and hearing these long, complex justification for why these techniques will "work" can act as another strengthening method of this placebo effect.
There's a very similar trick I've seen hypnotists do where they walk into a gym and find the biggest guy there, and talk to him for about 5 minutes. They use specific language, telling the strong guy that an object on the floor (pencil, book, small weight, etc.) cannot be lifted. Sure enough, the guy will reach down for it and be unable to pick it up. It's the same type of stuff.
If you have a regular guy walk right into the dojo with one of these fraudsters, the tricks don't work. If he sits there and watches an "expert" knock out 10 students in a row, often-times the mind-games kick in and the same stuff will happen to him.
Basically it's similar to religious indoctrination then. Get them ideally while they are young or if older, looking for something you can promise them. Talk with authority, have others confirm what you are saying then let their own mind do the rest. Pretty sure that's how so many of us ended up worshipping Lord Kha'fine, the god of the morning routine to function in life.
I'm have that masters degree of psychology you speak of.
It 100% is hypnosis. Although I prefer the term "suggestion". "Suggestion" is an umbrella term that includes more phenomenon than just hypnosis. I also includes the placebo effect e.g. It includes basically all of the effects that cause a human to surrender control over themselves to another.
I think your analysis is very good. You did a great job of separating the different mechanisms. Comments according to your numbering:
1) Placebo. I would just call these hypnosis tricks but they indeed work very much like a placebo. Specifically the sudden touch and sudden sound. Touch can be very strong placebo. A good example of this are Chiropractors, and Chinese medicine where they use bags of fake blood in the hands to do "operations" without cutting into skin. Very effective on the believer.
2) Peer pressure. I would use more the terms of mass hysteria here or mass psychosis. It is more than just peer pressure. It is the emotional, unconscious group rejection of reality. But here you correctly identify the importance of the group being there. Notice that with most hypnosis practices there are groups present. It works better when there is a group.
3) Expert: Here I would refer to the Milgram experiment that showed so well the overwhelming influence of authority figures. Milgram showed that it is enough to put on a white coat and give orders. Most people will instinctively fall in line.
I could add some other details but to be honest you've captured the main factors very well. I think it is awesome when people study this. It will protect you from being conned or hypnotized. Furthermore it can also allow you to protect others in certain situations; it's nearly impossible to drag out a true believer. But in the doubting phase you certainly have a chance to break the spell of the Guru/Crystalhealer/Sensei/Chiropractor/...
But mind you there are many forms of this suggestion that can be very beneficial to people. For example I know many people who visit e.g. Chiropractors. I don't go around trying to make them stop. Most often people really do get positive things from these fake healers. Just the attention you get, the touching like massage, going to the special place to take care of yourself. These all have beneficial effects that can be really important supports for a person.
Suggestion is a powerful tool. It can be used with great benefit to those around, or it can lead to great damage.
I use it every day at my work with institutionalized kids, but also with colleagues. One of the most important uses for me is calming people down. I have a whole bag of tricks I can try to e.g. stop a person from hyperventilating. You can take control over them without them really knowing. It's so powerful and helpful it's almost like magic if you don't understand it.
If you are more interested still I recommend some of Scott Adams' stuff from the persuasion angle, or Darren Brown's book about hypnosis which is excellent. He is a UK mentalist who does some amazing work while also low-key arming the public to protect against malicious suggestion.
@@TheQue5tion You should really watch the docu "Kumare". It will show you hilariously that people most often are actively looking for a guru to surrender to. It' is not hard at all to be a guru. All you need is some weird clothes and people will basically throw themselves and their money at you as you verbalize vague wisdoms and touch them in "magic" ways.
It is key to know that the action is most often more the believer making the guru, rather than the guru having to do much effort.
It's about getting the right victims. This is also the reason many gurus believe their own shit like the McDojos. They never planned to be a magic guru, but it is the students that push them further and further into the collective delusion. It is actually one could say accidental hypnosis.
That said I must add the following disclaimer: I am also a follower of the great Lord Kha'fine, ruler of the rising sun and the animals that dwell at night.
Look up Martial Arts Journey on youtube. He started in a McDojo doing Aikido, and he talked about the mentality he personally had when his instructors did fake tactics on him.
I think you're dead on, especially number 2. In a group where everyone is invested, people are afraid of being the one to humiliate their master and invite the scorn of your peers.
I once took a Tai Chi class when I was 19. The instructor grounded himself and told me to push him as hard as I could to prove I couldn't move him. I couldn't get past a mental barrier to truly push as hard as I could because I was afraid I'd be the one who ruined it for everyone.
Not to say Tai Chi is nonsense, maybe I couldn't have moved him, but my brain wouldn't let me give it my all because I didn't want to humiliate him.
It's honesty above all. A late work friend of mine was a 3rd dan Aikido black belt. Once I asked him how he would apply his knowledge "in the street"... he answered in very humble and honest way that it's very difficult to apply those techniques in real self defense situations, and that his aim in Aikido is to reach harmony and a peaceful and calm state of mind. Blessed his memory may he rest in peace
humility is the reason you never hear of a traditional martial artist geting killed in the streets since they avoid conflict ... the exact opposite ironically happens to be the case for mma and bjj clowns out there unable to swallow their fragile overgrown ego and ending up getting themselves killed ... Tiago Guma: DEAD, Leandro Lo: DEAD, Khabib's friend: DEAD, Jose Campuzano: HOSPITALIZED ... and yet, lowlives like Jocko Willink with an agenda and bias towards mma and bjj still have the audacity to claim "Jiu Jitsu is a SUPERPOWER, it HUMBLES you" ... I guess all these dead mma and bjj clowns must've forgotten at the moment of truth lol
Good old Evan Pantnazi... I was in his Kyusho International forums and a teenage yellow belt (I don't recall his style) asked the "senior ranks" what you should do if the techniques you try don't work. Evan and his band of cronies told this kid to, "Just keep hitting him until the attacker falls down." When I questioned that mode of thinking, and told them, I could get the same advice from the local boxing school, they kicked me out of the forum. They had a guy here in Melbourne Australia doing their stuff, and without notice or warning they dropped him like a hot rock in favour of one of our home grown shysters, named Frank Monea. Peas in a pod these 2 and crooked as the day is long, but that's a story for another time.
I would have to say, that as long as the potential student is not being lied to, then it really goes to what they want out of the martial arts. Not everybody wants to fight. Some just want to have a sense of Community. Some have physical benefits from training. It all boils down to what a person is looking to gain from studying martial arts and that the potential instructor is open and honest about the product they are offering.
Thank you for the good work you do!
Thank you for answering the question of the day.
A sense of community can be had through activities other than BS martial arts that might give them a false sense of security, though. But I think your last point is key, the instructor has to be honest about what they're teaching, and the practical usefulness of their techniques. Doing tai chi in the park once a week won't give you any fighting or self-defence ability, no matter how practical the techniques used to be 300 or 400 years ago.
Break the leg in the morning - Thats worthy of a T-shirt slogan
I can’t hear George Dillman’s voice with hearing’NING!!’ in my head.
Always 🤣 when I hear the "niiiing."
Niiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnngggggggg😂😂😂
Lol I was surprised at the sound he picked. I expected a clap, something sudden, but he choose to imitate a gong or sound bowl. Truly living the karate-kid fantasy. Also they are all fat lol.
I was eating goddamn 😂😂😂
That guy appeared on countless Black Belt magazine covers, even more than Dillman. I think that magazine has a great responsibility in disseminating these crazy things.
Black belt magazine was never about martial arts. It’s about making money, like any other business. They sell what people buy, and it’s no better than a tabloid.
Absolutely. I'm old enough that what we believed about martial arts back then was almost completely formed by TV, movies, books by publishers like Tuttle, and magazines like Black Belt and Inside Kung Fu. It's embarrassing, but I remember seeing Bloodsport shortly after it came out and believing it was actually based on Frank Dux's "kumite" story.
The Chu knockout technique explains why I always get lightheaded around trains.
and why sneazing can make you light headed - science
4:30 - Never go back-to-front.
back to front is only for those true of heart and at one with the galaxy.
Here we go
I first started training at the ripe old age of 4. I am 50 now. In all of this time, amongst various styles and teachers, i have never seen real proof of chi/ki. Ever. Does the body have certain spots that can be used to cause pain? Sure. Yet, the best advice I have ever gotten on pressure points was this "Just hit the SOB". That's it. No matter how good you are, in the middle of an altercation (with your adrenaline dumping), you aren't going to hit tiny targets. Even if those spots can cause more pain, you are not going to get there. Just hit the other person. Hit them first, fast, hard, and often. That's it.
Exactly right. The concept of "there are places in the body that are more vulnerable to being hit than others" isn't magical, it's just anatomy. It won't make you pass out, but a solid thump to the solar plexus will still hurt like hell. A slap to the ear will hurt more than a punch to the shoulder. The side of the jaw is more vulnerable than the forehead bone. And so on. It's not magic, just anatomy. But you do need to strike with force, a light press or touch won't do shit.
Well, a good strike to the chin, solar plexus, liver, spleen, knee, etc, it usually be effective, given that you apply enough power... Gichin Funakoshi explains in his book that a vital point is a point where a strike is relatively more effective , but a poorly performed technique is not going to work even there
Pressure points are very real. With just two fingers squeezing on the right spot, nobody is staying on their feet. Of course, it has nothing to do with "chi" and all that nonsense. More, it's impractical in most scenarios, making it little more than a fun gimmick.
@@Cailus3542 I promise you none of those points work on someone in an adrenaline rush. When the body is in flight/fight mode it will disable almost all pain signals and your pressure point will have ZERO effect.
It is only real in a sense that if you pressure the carotid artery with two fingers for long enough the person will pass out. But that isn't a pressure point. You are shutting off the bloodflow to the brain.
There is no proof of chi/ki. I remember a few researchers from UK tried hard to prove the existence of 'chi'. They traveled to China and tested 'chi' masters. One of the masters disappeared after the initial demonstration. The other was debunked.
I don't know what I consider legitimate in the martial arts industry - it's sometimes hard to know. As for knocking people out without touching them, I have been doing it for years. I even have a coffee mug that says "World Class Farter"...
All these McMasters need to be put in the ring together. That would be a great program I would watch, an arena where all the McMasters fight for the Mctrophy and fast food coupons.
There is a South Park Episode with psychics. Should be pretty close
I studied several systems briefly before I started training seriously in Karate. These days I study HEMA, because I like weapons and history. I think there is academic value in teaching styles that do not have realistic martial application, such as tai chi, most styles of aikido, etc., as long as the instructors are honest about what they are teaching. A lot of the insane screaming you see in competition videos actually comes from XMA, which as far as I am aware is a very SoCal thing meant for getting aspiring actors and stunt performers into Hollywood roles. I once attended a tai chi seminar where the instructor informed us that the forms he was teaching were meant purely for low-impact exercise and health, which made a lot of sense. Much of what I learned from Aikido was useful when I had to go hands-on as a security officer in a hospital setting as it allowed me to apply minimal amounts of force to prevent patients from harming others.
Honest presentation of the material is not a problem in my mind, but it is a problem when instructors try to pass off BS as legitimate martial arts training. I don't approve of woo or scammers
11:11 lol you gotta love the commitment to do that just anywhere lmao
The fake guys arm bar was hilarious😂
Well. You can certainly get knocked out by sound if it's very strong. The sound/pressure wave of a nearby explosion can definitely knock you out.... or also turn you into dust.
That video of Dillman saying the moon's gravitational pull makes it easier to break someone's leg is very funny, but let's be real - it's more likely that Pantazi split from Dilman over affiliation fees than because he suddenly realised Dillman's techniques don't work.
Absolutely, my comment was a joke
@@McDojoLife Yeah, that is what I assumed. I just can't resist pointing out that money is at the root of 90% of the BS in the world.
Anyway, this was one of the most entertaining videos I have seen from you in a while - you really knocked it out of the park. You should check what phase the moon was in when you posted it, so you can do it again next time.
@@hausdorffspace 😂 thank you for the support
The dude that contacted you to challenge you, just to back out is the best thing I've heard today.. definitely..😂
It happens way more often than I talk about. 😂
Don't punch me in the arm.. I don't want dysentery.. WTF???..😂😂😂
I think a martial art is legit if it works for the intended reason.. wether that be for tournament fighting, full on fighting or just for flashy demonstrations like some of the wushu Kung Fu stuff.. as long as the people being taught know exactly what they're being taught and if it can be applied in a fight or whatever.. because someone of the Kung Fu martial arts are legit styles that work in their own field but wouldn't hold up against a person who knows a few takedowns and been boxing for a few years ya know.. interested in seeing what Rob thinks of how I view it.. didn't think hard just first thoughts that came to me.. enjoyed the video immensely, thnx Rob if you see this..👍
It’s crazy how sure of themselves they are
I was like these guys when i was ten playing swords with my cousins. I had some legendary stick-swords.
Ning!!!
- never gets old!
*NI!*
Haha, he's going to make a heart skip a beat with some pepper... ya know a sneeze 😂
Legitimate in martial arts...
Context matters. If someone says they're teaching self defense or pugilism with pressure points or magic energy, nope. Illegitimate. But making room for martial arts outside of martial efficacy, I think there's room for that as long as the approach is honest. If you're practicing for fitness, as a form of socializing, aesthetics, tradition, I think space can be made. But, hopefully, practitioners understand what they're practicing.
Yes I think so, I do karate as I spend time with my eldest and feel better for the exercise but wouldn't think if I got attacked in the street or a pub that it would be effective, rather the best way to defend myself would be to kick, bite, punch etc
99.6k subs......congratulations in advance Rob!
One of my instructors has unfortunately fallen into the circles of the Dillman nonsense. I forget which "instructor" he was following but he was talking about himself and a fellow student hitting each other from a distance and other crazy Chi feats. He's even told us about how the Dillman students consider handshakes a threat
This is the first time I heard Dillman talk about what time of the day you should attack the lower vs the upper part of the body. Absolutely insane B.S.
What blows my mind the most is just how many people he has fooled
@@McDojoLife Has anyone tested the theory. There used to be set times for when an attack on an enemy was most successful. Basically the more uncivilised the time the less prepared the defenders are. Hence dawn and dusk are traditionally favoured. But in yoga they have something similar about the best period for sleep. It is still used for plants and lower order animals. So plant fertilization often follows the moon cycle. And with certain types of fish but the moon is related to tides so that may be the hidden variable. And we don't really respond to tidal changes. I don't know exactly why fertilisation if done manually follows the moon cycle but with climate change those are being put out of whack. I think there is a superstititous/spiritual element to it. Certainly for say chinese medicine practitioners they still follow something like Aristotle's elemental theory. But they have different names. And each element corresponds to a particular body part and time of day, day of the week and year. And the cycle then becomes complicated like biorhythms. Now he might have made it up. But my thing is somebody made up this stuff long ago. What's wrong with some american making up stuff for the modern era. Is it not true that many americans think western medicine and science are now politically motivated BS. So people shouldn't take vaccines or wear masks based on the political party they vote for. You could argue that kind of BS opens people up to more simple BS
The Dillman method of determining the sex of a pregnant woman's baby is about 50% accurate.
@@chbu7081 It is a practice still done in Chinese medicine. Generally westerners try eastern medicine only when western medicine has failed and there is no other option. But clearly the test's real evil was during hte one child per family law as parents preferred male children. It is illegal in India for any medical practitioner to inform parents of the sex of their child for this very reason.
As a 2nd Dan practitioner, I can tell you that, Ryu Kyu Kempo is a legitimate martial art. Historically, our founding masters were 19th century Okinowan (google Choki Motobu & Gichin Funakoshi), and from my research, it is the foundation of all modern Karate variants. It is sad that Dillman went into WooWoo Land with his "no touch KO", that is definitely BS but it is not a true reflection of the martial art.
I honestly don't know if that's true, as that's the first that I've heard this. I was under the impression that most modern variants originate elsewhere. I certainly hope that it is true, and I'll freely admit that my knowledge of 19th century Okinawan karate is lacking. I never really went beyond Wado-ryu's origins, stemming from Shotokan and Jujitsu.
Regardless, that nutjob has done immense damage to karate as a whole, and surely your style in particular. Glad to hear that folks like you are keeping it up.
@@Cailus3542 Oral history presentation was part of my Black Belt test. I did my own research through books (1999 internet wasn't the best resource) - so I'm fairly confident in my sources. Karate as we know it was to in Japanese schools to prepare kids for military service in the imperial army. The curriculum was written by the Okinowan masters, but made non-lethal (so kids don't hurt each other). After WW2 the US GI's were stationed in Okinowa and from there the form spread to the West. However, they only took Karate... This is the tip of the iceberg though.
The larger the moon the more dangerous it is....yeah, that's why it's called LUNACY.
TL;DR: Besides its specific association with Dillman and Oyata, Ryūkyū Kenpō is a synonym for Okinawan Karate.
Okinawa was part of the old Ryūkyū Kingdom prior to its annexation in the 1870's, hence the 'Ryūkyū'.
As per Kenpō, it means fist law/method, and generically refers to Chinese, Japanese, and Okinawan striking arts, aswell as Ed Parkers American Kenpō and its deliniations.
Great vid ... The problem is that sound can and does affect the human body in many ways ... They just pedal nonsense in the way sound plays a role in hand to hand combat it's horse-hockey
That arm technique is a Juji Gatame in Judo and it does work well when executed properly 🥋
Teaching people fake self-defense gives them a sense of confidence that can get them hurt for real.
"If I do this and say choo" (chew?)
nothing happens
awkward pause
*stares at pupil not yet collapsing*
student collapses slightly
"You can see the person has a problem with that as well"
Depends on the goals. If the goal is self defense / win in a street fight, then a small(ish) subset of martial arts is going to be legit. However something like tai chi may not be "legit" for those purposes, but is legit for things like joint health, staying active, mind-body connection, active/moving meditation and the like.
Rob you need to watch Shake hands- Boys from the Blackstuff. Dark English comedy from the late 80’s. 😂
Question of the day: Legit = stands up to pressure testing from non “members”.
The moon is the explanation of how Quinn Panganiban landed a choke on me while sparring 😂
To be legitimate it had to work on someone who isn’t a willing recipient of the technique. It must be pressure tested
Question of the day answer: I think "legitimate" is a bit of a loaded term, but the number one consideration for any practical martial art should be: does it work? If it does what it's said to do, and it does so consistently, reliably, in many different circumstances and against different people, and in a scientifically repeatable way, then it is legitimate. That's a different standard to "efficient" or "practical", in terms of say sparring or fighting, but that's why those words are different words.
I think a technique or style can be called legitimate if it is teachable and does what it claims. It can't be reliant on working 'some of the time', through luck, coincidence, superstitious thinking, or muddy mysticism. It needs to be demonstrable using scientific principles, reliably and consistently repeatable, and teachable to others. That last part is important, because if something works "for me" but I can't explain it or teach others how to do it, then it's worthless as a legacy technique or style. It may as well be magic, and if it can't be taught then trying or pretending to do so is a disservice to the students.
I once took some lessons from a ninja artist. It was basically all about how to create a diversion so you could get away. Lots of eye poking and palm strike to the nose and chin. Then run. 🏃♀️
Love your channel first of all. Secondly, not every technique will work on every person. For example, I train in both Aikido and 10th Planet Jiu Jitsu. I truly believe that GOOD Aikido (rare) will work against an untrained attacker of similar size. However, it won't be nearly as useful against a trained fighter who knows how to control their balance and understands how techniques work, hence why I started cross training. My point, to finally answer your question, if a technique works on some level, it is legit, if it only works if you pretend it works, it is not. My 2 cents. Thanks for the great content!
In regards to the arm bar. There is an acupuncture point between the thumb and first finger high in the web. I believe it's on the small intestine meridian. It will work for temporal headaches. and does hurt when compressed. Whether it will break a grip, I don't have a clue. I do arm bars the old-fashioned way lol
More Voodoo nonsense
Hi ,
Has anyone had negative experiences with ATA ( American Kwon Do Association) schools? I saw the BB's who were slow , used very few combinations and very inaccurate technique regarding timing and distance . Regarding testing for promotion I never saw anybody ever fail a student fail a promotion tests. Every belt has a 1/2 or even 1/4 pass mark . For example explaining this is when a student tests for green belt from orange belt one of three tthings would happen 1) you were promoted to green belt 2) the student receives from orange belt either orange belt with one stripe ( 1/4 of the way to green ) or orange belt with two stripes( 1😢/2 the way to green) or it was possible to go from orange belt to green belt.
Has anyone had similar experiences , is this 1/4 stripe a common TKD practice? Their BB were not very good . The BB were slow , and were trained for for TKD competition not self defense. During sparring colored belts were not allowed to use their hands ?? BB were finally allowed to use hand techniques but poorly trained on how to use hands in a potential conflicts.
The biggest issue I had with them was that they tried to sell memberships by the bely. The belt, they offered potential members to join the black belt club membership where you paid ( it was close to $ 1200.00 ) and you could train until you passed all belts ( I think belt test fees were included in the membership fee) including first Dan.
Does anyone have experience with ATA ? There are no ATA schools in my area anymore )not unsurprisingly).
I think actual fighting techniques like punching, kicking, throws and grappling is legitimate. Any sort of pressure point or voodoo stuff is just entertaining at best.
Except for jujutsu pressure points, because those are just nerve clusters that you can squeeze or hit to cause an inordinate amount of pain, not Dim Mak.The kind of thing that American police call pain compliance.
Ya don't say?!
Honesty with sanity is legit. Crazy people can be honest but it won't necessarily mean much.
It's all about honesty. My last martial arts instructor taught a mixed system designed for deescalation and self defence should that fail. Light pressure testing after drilling something so you can see if it actually works in concept, then heavier testing so you can learn to apply it under pressure. But he was honest about how combat sports makes better long match fighters, and emphasised the importance of hitting hard then fucking off to call the police, because a prolonged fight in a self defence scenario is just a bad idea. Now, if someone came to him but wanted to do something more combat sport focused like boxing or bjj, and wanted the conditioning and heavier sparring, he would recommend good coaches in the area to them, because he wasn't going to waste time teaching someone something they couldn't use. Same if someone wanted something that was basically just a fitness class with no pressure testing. So if an instructor says "this will work great in the ring/cage but not so well outside" or vice versa then you won't be wasting your time or money with them, because you know what you are getting.
Is there an isolated video of that Dillman clip where he talks about the moon? That's so bonkers that I need to send it to everyone I know.
And to answer the question, I think that a martial art is legitimate if it can be used effectively against a non-compliant person. I would also define a martial art as being something that is expressly presented as effective in a real fighting/self defense scenario. If the instructor is not claiming that his/her art is supposed to be used in a real fight, then they shouldn't be judged the same.
We did a short of it
@@McDojoLife Thank you.
Legitimacy in martial arts can be tested in one of two ways. Either by the martial aspect, or the artistic aspect. The martial component is scrutinized via pressure testing. MMA athletes know all about that. But the artistic aspect is an argument which I'd argue is much more subjective and interesting to talk about. In XMA, the aesthetics of the movement are important. Wushu is a perfect example, which is entirely performative, and integral to traditional Chinese theater. Or otherwise, more contemporary examples include the sport of tricking and acrobatics. If you can put on a good show with martial movements, that's enough to satisfy the artistic component.
Functional martial arts are kind of my baseline. Formal is fine as long as you're having fun and the instructor is being honest... but as far as what legitimately works... a small amount of formal stuff, and a large amount of functional stuff.
Rob, where is the film you were making?
Hi McDOjoLife. Unfortunately I bought DVD of Evan Pantazi. I invited him to Thailand (where I am living) to demonstrate the Kyusho Jitsu technique. It was pretty advanced with negotiations but I had some doubts and the Condi-19 didn't help. So, I've stopped the discussion. I even invited Mr. Brooks....
Do you consider that Kyusho Jitsu or Dim Mak as fake martial arts?
It is important to keep in mind, that many people seek martial arts instruction because they are emotionally vulnerable. While pressure point BS will never work on individuals who are athletic, or love to pressure test their athletic abilities, some individuals simply DO NOT want to see the truth. There are also those who have been injured, bullied, assaulted, abused, gaslit, etc. who sign up for martial arts classes to feel like they can once again regain control of their lives. Some people may be going through mental illness, anxiety, depression, loss, grief, fears, etc. These people want to feel safe and at peace. These are people who are not violent, have never had exposure to fighting, and may have never watched the UFC. They desperately want to find a sense of peace. This is where the manipulators strike. They mostly take advantage of the vulnerable. Their target ideal student is not a kid looking to fight in a cage or grapple. Their ideal customers (students) are not military, police, or a young guy who wants to compete. They don't even want people who are comfortable with physical contact of any kind. I am sure guys peddling "chi" classes, no touch KOs, or pressure points, are excited about having a football player sign up for classes. Brainwashing is a long process, and like stage hypnotists, subjects (students) are carefully selected.
I think for a technique to be legitimate in martial arts needs to have 1 factor in common. The intended effect to be done on the average person. Punches, kicks, chokes? Yes. No touch nonsense? No.
Great video!!!
"Martial arts" are about bowing, Asian characters on the wall, incense., and chi based mind-control techniques. Muay Thai, Wrestling/Grappling, and boxing are all spectator combat sports. There are some exceptions: Kick boxing and judo - more or less - grew out of something closer to the smells and spells side of martial arts, but quickly became spectator combat sports. Here and there, there has not always been a hard dividing line between the two.
Now we have MMA, the birth of which owes more to videogames and movies than the "traditional" arts, and is dominated by the spectator combat sports.
Seemed pretty easy to break my ankle at 1430 a couple of weeks ago. Done a proper job too. Been in hospital since and should l, with any luck have my second surgery tomorrow. 😂😂
Legitimate either works practically or conditions the body provably. Punching works, stretching and breathing does too.
"it goes to the internal body structure and cause sausages in the uranium"
It's legit if it works on someone trying to keep you from doing it.
I didn't know that GM George Dillman was a "Wacko!" Thanks McDojo! Lmfo...
I grew up thinking Bas Rutten was just theatrics but now know he's legit. Entertainment factor is important. "Ip Man" is fun. Chi Qi Xi is seemingly bogus. And my wife will agree... pulse doesn't actually predict gender.
Thanks, Rob. Great stuff.
I never really thought about it much.
I guess a legitimate martial art would be a set of techniques that are effective in self defense. Whether it be with the body or with weaponry.
Anything will knock someone down if they’re willing to fall over 😂😂😂
My wife’s voice (no martial arts training) has been sending me to sleep for years.
I have to pause this video to go take care of my bladder meridian.
Pressure points, chi, anything to do with planetary alignment.
It does have to work in a street fight for me because I use to be a childhood street fighter in the late 70s early 80s. However learning many styles of Martial arts has saved my life. I also don't believe in the belt systems in Martial arts. I have beaten black belts. So I think if it works and keeps me alive I'm okay with it. I don't believe in Chi beams of light but i know in Kempo & if taught & applied properly they do work. BUT I KNOW that you CAN'T knock people out with them. You can possibly immobilized temporarily, but you'll NEVER knock a person out with Pressure POINTS nuff said.
The time of day i believe is easiest to break a leg or stop a heart is to strike when they are sleeping. 😮
If you do not appease us, we will say “Niing
“ to you! Please no, knights of Niing!
If bros aren’t throwing chi air balls to each other, I don’t want it 😂
Oh, & only “LEGIT” martial arts GOTTA include the death touch 💀 (that’s how you know it’s real) 🤭
Great work as always! 💕
Hey!
Love your channel.
Just a heads up that Ryu Kyu 琉球, is the original name of Okinawa, so Ryukyu Kenpo refers to Okinawan kenpo. Just for your info :D
Doesn't change the fact that Dillman likely had no expertise in it, nor did he have the right or authority to be going around offering people 8th degree dans in it, lol
It does not have to work "in the street". It is fine, if you are training for competition or just for fitness. As long as nobody is telling you "this is how to shout at a random attacker and suddenly he will drop the knife" or "if you focus your Qi, the attackers bullets will make a 180" everything is fine. Heck... even Ki-Aikido is fine, as long as it is clear, that this stuff only works, because everybody in this room agrees, that this works. At some point we would have to discuss what defines the term "martial art" exactly, but for this, I stand by "As long as your are not being lied to, anything goes."
For the Q of the day, my answer is: something that is backed up by laws of physics, anatomy and geometry. Also, it needs to be effective both on the streets and as sport.
I disagree on that last point. There's nothing wrong with learning a martial art with a sport focus, so long there's honesty about what it's for.
I agree with that, and I didn’t mean to bash on martial arts that are only for sport; but my take is that if is good as a sport, is probably good in the streets too, unless it is something like tai chi or such. But you are right, as long as it is clear and honest, then is nothing wrong with it.
What's with the crossing of the legs?
Bowing to pictures, being forbidden to ask higher belts to roll, addressing a coach as professor ...
Did he say you cause blockages in the bladder?
Slight correction, Ryukyu karate isn't fake, it's the traditional style of Karate practised in the Ryukyuan Islands that is the basis for Okinawan karate and there are still legitimate practitioners of this martial art in Okinawa. Ryukyu Kempo is fake and the two shouldn't be conflated in any way. Pantazi simply adopted and twisted part truth into mostly lie. Just wanted to clear that up, so that people didn't mistake the traditional art for the bullshit. Especially as the Ryukyuan art was where modern Karate was developed from.
Dilman has the 3 point heart technique, which is even more impressive than Pei Mei's 5 point palm exploding heart technique.
That was a great video
And I wonder who made up the whole cross their legs and slap the back thing? Can u find that out Rob?
not sure it has any relation, in the 50s territorial wrestling thats how they would wake up people after the "sleeper hold" was applied, it was for drama only, no one was uncon and it was sort of a blood choke(not real), where you would want to elevate the feet.
I think effective is a good baseline. But there’s a whole lot of exceptions. Maybe effective for your goals is a better way to think about it.
Wushu generally doesn’t teach you to fight at all. I’d say it’s a very legitimate martial art practice though. And very few Wushu competitors probably think they’re learning the best way to fight. (Some probably do. I know)
So effective for your goal. Get in shape, learn to do a 540, learn to fight, compete, etc. Everyone has different things that interest them and I have no issue with martial arts that aren’t about fighting.
Misrepresenting what you’re doing is the big problem.
This is Fake???!!!!
OMG!!!! No way!!!!!
Glad you’re out there to show me these things! Hey is no touch ki master fake too? Is Frank Dux?
O!M!G!
He should get 6 Dillmans. 😂😂😂
One can be knocked out by sound but human vocal cords aren't powerful enough. You'd need a giant speaker & amp or set off an explosion or something but at that point the preassure wave would do more than just knock someone out. Lol
So does that noon to midnight fallow time zone or does it fallow Grimlin rules like from the movie?
7 out of 8 Dillman's. As for the legitimacy question, I think honesty is a large part, and being able to demonstrate to a neutral party. That should work if you are saying this is for sport, self-defense, or general fitness.
I think anything that gives a person a belief they are strong when they are not is dangerous. The countless stories about people getting really hurt because they thought their martial arts "training" could protect them is scary. Even if the teacher says, "this is fake but I'm going to teach you for fun". People buy into that shit. Like all the kids I grew up with that watched too much DBZ and thought they could use Ki. They get their head crushed in a real fight.
I guess what I would consider legit is anything that was actually used in battle weather it's China, Japan or wherever. Then there's the systems that are made up of legit stuff but that's what's called Mixed Martial arts nowadays. I liked parts of ninjitsu but trained in Kenpo since I was 8 and loved it!
To be legit it must have real world use ie the Martial aspect, as long as the myriad of ways to acquire that martial skill are toward that goal then they are also legit ie the art aspect, example would be meditation while not effective in a street fight it may be very effective in the process of acquiring martial skill. Chur from NZ
The "Ning" heard round the world
Take this Rob, NINNNNG
There really is a special form of energy that can be projected by a martial arts master to an attacker that will render them unconcious. It's called "kinetic energy" and is described by the symbols k = mv^2. The method of delivering this energy through the master's hand is called a "punch". When a martial arts student is punched enough times by the master, they learn to fall down before the hand touches them. This is called "stopping the abuse" or "playing to the master's ego". The name given to this mystic art is "bullshido" and it translates as "the way of bullshit." It is said that a true master of this art can fight an army of his own students and render them unconscious with a wave of his hand. This stops the master's desciples from starting their own schools that compete with the master. This is called "preserving the franchise". Schools that achieve this level of expertise in the art of "bullshido" are traditionally identified by the 2 letter prefix "Mc". A school or "dojo" that reaches this level of "bullshido" is called a "McDojo". When a martial artist from another style fights a "bullshido" master, the master demonstrates a highly effective self-defense technique by absorbing the attacker's punches with his face and falling down unconscious, thus stoppping the attack. This is a perfect demonstration of what the master teaches his own students. When attacked, fall down unconscious and the attacker will give up and stop hitting you. So, the master becomes the student and the circle is complete....
Martial Arts with a direct well respected lineage usually are good to go. I have solid provable lineage in Tai Chi, Kung Fu and BJJ. No cults here. Just good training.
This video doesn't really contain any new material. Just a compilation of other videos put together.
I’m not even mad at Dillman. I’m mad at the people who refuse to admit it’s fake. It’s like wrestling or golf, completely staged and dependent upon the audience.
Actually pro wrestlers are putting on a show knowing that the audience knows its scripted. There are countless videos and behind the scenes shots of the performers pulling back the curtain and breaking character. The clowns in this video are out to completely b.s their followers and convincing them that what they're doing is real.
A martial art is legit if the instructor is honest about their personal experience and knowledge and it does what it’s supposed to do.
Therefore, many traditional arts are 100% legitimate for continuing a tradition, as an art form, a lineage and history. Some of them are also legitimate for fighting and self defense, though less, and many of them teach concepts or ideas that could potentially work in a fight, but probably not if you only train in them (the perfect UA-cam example is Rokas, who left aikido because it didn’t work, learned MMA, and now actually CAN pull off both some aikido techniques, as well as larger aikido concepts).
I can't get enough of this stuff, it's bonkers. I think it's ok if instructors are honest, but otherwise it's certain mcdojoey