The Hardest Math Problem | Po-Shen Loh and Lex Fridman

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  • Опубліковано 15 тра 2021
  • Lex Fridman Podcast full episode: • Po-Shen Loh: Mathemati...
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    GUEST BIO:
    Po-Shen Loh is a mathematician at CMU and coach of the USA International Math Olympiad team.
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  • Наука та технологія

КОМЕНТАРІ • 209

  • @jcglez9491
    @jcglez9491 3 роки тому +341

    You can tell Po-Shen understands math so well he can visually see what he’s explaining with his hand movements

    • @guyavn5504
      @guyavn5504 3 роки тому +13

      Its just a type of math person. I'm the same, I flail my hands around while learning the subject, because thats just how my brain works. doesnt make me better than my non hand-wavy peers. this is especially true with mathematics because there is no single way to do it. there is no "abstract mathematics" part of the brain, so different people develop different mental processes to work through math. some are visual, some are more grammatic and formal, almost programming like... both make good mathematicians sometimes.

    • @jaidenmuschett5667
      @jaidenmuschett5667 3 роки тому +2

      Representing abstract thought spatially may be a universal thing. ua-cam.com/video/gmc4wEL2aPQ/v-deo.html

    • @habibsspirit
      @habibsspirit 3 роки тому +1

      @@jaidenmuschett5667 Damn that's a very cool seminar. Thanks for sharing Jaiden!

    • @brigadierharsh1948
      @brigadierharsh1948 3 роки тому

      It’s sort of like he’s thinking faster than he can talk as well. I once worked with a chemist that would always get mixed up with his words because he couldn’t talk fast enough to keep up with his thought.

    • @onerelic1337
      @onerelic1337 Рік тому

      @@guyavn5504 There is this notion of a spatial and an analitical thinker in mathemathics and STEM in general. Its some form of dimorfism for mathemathicians haha. Spatial types will excell in topology and calculus, analytical thinkers prefer number theory and stuff like that. Its pretty interesting.

  • @grahamvandyke
    @grahamvandyke 3 роки тому +154

    I've seen him in other math videos before, and I love how enthusiastic he is. You can tell math is absolutely his life.

  • @abztract1
    @abztract1 3 роки тому +487

    I dont know wtf they are talking about but I find it fascinating.

    • @NurmemetAbliz
      @NurmemetAbliz 3 роки тому +3

      Same feeling .

    • @niggemann118
      @niggemann118 3 роки тому +2

      Lmao

    • @joedoe2770
      @joedoe2770 3 роки тому +16

      Take a few computer science courses and you will know exactly what they mean. Don’t need to be a genius, just need to be exposed to it

    • @derekrogers1984
      @derekrogers1984 3 роки тому +4

      Find his teeth fascinating

    • @abztract1
      @abztract1 3 роки тому

      @@joedoe2770 Too bad we can't post memes here because this is a great spot for that "It was a joke" meme.

  • @jas.digitalnative
    @jas.digitalnative 3 роки тому +12

    I love these types of conversations. It actually makes having a Comp Sci background and going through all that fucking hell that is conceptual/discrete mathematics.... feel somewhat interesting & fun to use in application

  • @francesfuego6950
    @francesfuego6950 3 роки тому +26

    The english auto translated text at 02:05 reads "USE OUR OTHER RED WING PUB PROOF A DOODLE MOOR" i think that sums up how confused we all are on this subject.

  • @zourdy697
    @zourdy697 3 роки тому +4

    having a math teacher like him is a blessing

  • @sly11benal7
    @sly11benal7 3 роки тому +28

    This guy is inspiring! He loves what he does n even enjoys talking about mathematics 💯✔

  • @robertbordevik5072
    @robertbordevik5072 3 роки тому +48

    I’m a simple man. I enjoy listening to smart people speak. I don’t have a clue what they talk about 🤷‍♂️

    • @dompit9535
      @dompit9535 3 роки тому

      not everyone has the time or passion to learn these things

    • @faux4780
      @faux4780 3 роки тому +3

      @@dompit9535 or competency

    • @dompit9535
      @dompit9535 3 роки тому

      @@faux4780 or circumstance

    • @faux4780
      @faux4780 3 роки тому

      @@dompit9535 not if you have internet access

    • @dompit9535
      @dompit9535 3 роки тому

      @@faux4780 yeah digital products do make it much easier nowadays, anyone can master high school - university math with effort. I don't know this mathematician btw.

  • @stephensullivan1011
    @stephensullivan1011 3 роки тому +77

    Haha "how the heck did anyone think of that" 😂

    • @godtrader6102
      @godtrader6102 3 роки тому +4

      It shows you that he has the same problems as us mere mortals when he says that lol.

    • @popkornking
      @popkornking 3 роки тому +1

      It's honestly so true though. When you read some proofs you forget that some guy back in the 1700s or 1800s probably worked on the problem for months to get to that proof, and so when you just see it presented in its final form, all the failed attempts it took to get there are hidden and the chain of "insights" as PSL puts it seems ludicrously unintuitive.

  • @pureveganheart
    @pureveganheart 3 роки тому

    This Pod cast is amazing!

  • @sd2645
    @sd2645 3 роки тому +10

    Very insightful: breaking a problem into subproblems with inputs and outputs (sockets), for which one knows solutions. Of course, one is as powerful as the number of subproblems he/she has in their inventory.

    • @kukuricapica
      @kukuricapica 3 роки тому

      I've posted something similar but I've called that connections which in your case would be "sockets". So I think what makes any problem hard is the number of sockets in a problem to which I would add that complexity of those sockets would play major role there too.

  • @adrianqx
    @adrianqx 3 роки тому +8

    I'm laughing at myself imagining finding myself in this conversation and they both wait for my input !

  • @Damstraight68
    @Damstraight68 3 роки тому

    Remarkable! The vinacular is on point!

  • @richcaputo2929
    @richcaputo2929 3 роки тому +1

    Brilliant way of thinking about difficulty

  • @dbamman123
    @dbamman123 3 роки тому +1

    The two problems I’ve encountered of this idea comes from proving 1) first part of Fundamental Theorem of Calculus (3 insights) and 2) in statistics, the sample mean and the sample variance are independent (4 insights)

  • @FonsecaLA
    @FonsecaLA 3 роки тому +3

    This man is extraordinary ! The Math is beautiful!

  • @kukuricapica
    @kukuricapica 3 роки тому +2

    I'm not smart by any means, but I'm kinda happy that he said that he learn math the way he did because I did that since I was 15yo. I remember because I once asked teacher that annoying questions why and how and she couldn't tell me. She was cool about it and even give me assignment to find out these questions. That's when I learned that fundamental problem with learning something from someone is that if they know something, some equation for example, they will just repeat over and over and over until they forgot why it is the way it is. That the difference between knowing thing and understanding things. I'm not the brightest and I personally doesn't go into detail in things I don't feel I need to, but I do understands what I know enough so when someone ask me about it I'm able to explain them what the problem is and why it is even though it's abstract concept. I will try and find some analogy that I understand and I could apply in real life and you would be surprised how many people are interested after to know more.
    I wish our teachers could have good analogies, real life uses or even made up bs stories about how the problem was discovered and how it was solved. And that's what he's doing naturally by himself by doing proofs he's able to understand the nature of the problem.
    My point is that what I think he was trying to say was, *what makes math problem hard is the number of connections you have to make in your mind in order to solve the problem.*

  • @duudleDreamz
    @duudleDreamz 3 роки тому

    Brilliant haha, all maths students need to watch this clip

  • @Amlantube1
    @Amlantube1 3 роки тому +6

    I only know that plugs go inside socket.

  • @Yzjoshuwave
    @Yzjoshuwave 3 роки тому

    What constitutes an insight in the way that Lex and Po-Shen are using it here? Is it one “Ah ha!” moment? A spontaneous intuition of resolution - not necessarily of a final solution, but to a branch point of junction that gives you something useful to work from? That’s how I’m hearing it… What’s a little confounding to me about it is that ostensibly everything in math is layered with innumerable, embedded insights. It’s that the human mind computes a concrete direction, so the fan of all possible directions collapses into a discrete progression - like that page in a math text book. How many embedded rabbit holes exist within that stream of logic? Anyway, the potential for nonlinear inference strikes me as stupendous. People who compete in the math olympiads have my undying respect.

  • @Jgrande113
    @Jgrande113 3 роки тому +5

    This man broke it down so beautifully 🙏🏽❤️🔥

  • @unousuck4613
    @unousuck4613 3 роки тому +1

    Mathematics is simply understanding

  • @ericlaufer5804
    @ericlaufer5804 3 роки тому

    Very smart answer

  • @sweardog
    @sweardog 3 роки тому +2

    So, the difficulty of a problem is directly proportional to the number of insights that have to be made to solve it?

  • @alpineflauge909
    @alpineflauge909 3 роки тому

    thank you

  • @dannyweaver7322
    @dannyweaver7322 3 роки тому +59

    I couldnt even do the math in his explanation

    • @nihaarshah7982
      @nihaarshah7982 3 роки тому +3

      there isn’t any math in his explanation

    • @RoryAbcoe
      @RoryAbcoe 3 роки тому +8

      @@nihaarshah7982 Exactly

    • @joeruiz8077
      @joeruiz8077 3 роки тому +1

      😂 fr

    • @Jake-bt3fc
      @Jake-bt3fc 3 роки тому

      @@nihaarshah7982 0:55 How is this not math, lol.

    • @faux4780
      @faux4780 3 роки тому

      @@Jake-bt3fc hes not working with values like you would in math, hes working with ideas

  • @rob9953
    @rob9953 3 роки тому +1

    Is he saying that each "line" he sees on the page is an "insight" aka an equation his mind is going to have to make? so for instance, he used the page in his math book as sort of a cheat sheet to know if he was going to have to do a ton of "insights" or just a few. Is this what he was saying?

  • @Dev-In-Denver123
    @Dev-In-Denver123 3 роки тому +1

    What they're talking about it is exactly why I scared myself out of engineering and switched to business. It probably wasn't as hard as I thought; I should have stuck with engineering and toughed it out.

  • @ryunosukefuriya3748
    @ryunosukefuriya3748 3 роки тому +6

    I am so confused. Thank you.

  • @andrewroberthook3310
    @andrewroberthook3310 3 роки тому

    Points of view
    And how many can you access to see what you are looking at
    This is where the saying. Comes
    What’s your angle

  • @capnbroozyxl9928
    @capnbroozyxl9928 3 роки тому +1

    Brilliant

  • @troystreacker8829
    @troystreacker8829 3 роки тому +1

    Rule one of calculus. Make sure you know algebra, geometry and trigonometry first. Those are just the prep steps for the calc, you can do the calc perfectly but if the algebra, geometry and trig are wrong, everything will be wrong.

  • @slimsleazy1529
    @slimsleazy1529 3 роки тому +1

    Good weed brought me here, glad I came, dudes a genius

  • @teamspeak9374
    @teamspeak9374 3 роки тому

    so its like if 1+1=2 but then 2+2=4 you can divide 4/4 to go back to 1 or you can multiply by 2 to go to 8 and then do -7 =1

  • @luvillan4641
    @luvillan4641 3 роки тому

    Got it 👍🏼

  • @kerrypooley406
    @kerrypooley406 3 роки тому

    Makes sense.

  • @hernancontreras-it4ol
    @hernancontreras-it4ol Рік тому

    For math table of vision of art of stairs in many ways

  • @shandoticwa
    @shandoticwa 3 роки тому +2

    Grant Sanderson and him talking would be fun

  • @babbotfinklestein9513
    @babbotfinklestein9513 3 роки тому +21

    Ive watched it 4 times and im more confused than the 1st time

    • @tux1968
      @tux1968 3 роки тому +11

      Don't feel too bad. It's a three-insight video.

    • @joeruiz8077
      @joeruiz8077 3 роки тому +1

      😂😂😂

    • @baloog8
      @baloog8 Рік тому

      Keep watching and look up each part via google

  • @expensivetechnology9963
    @expensivetechnology9963 3 роки тому +13

    I absolutely love this video. In particular the part where Lex questions Po-Shen’s claim that difficulty can be measured linearly in the proof. Lex objects which demonstrates that he’s a colleague not just a fan. They engage in a negotiation over nothing but P.O.-Shen’s use of linear here. They land on a new compromise: if reviewing proofs is performed in a single text (to eliminate style differences) you could reasonably say that the length of a proof was a linear representation of the difficulty. You guys are nerds, but you knew that!

  • @harvuk7729
    @harvuk7729 3 роки тому +1

    I wonder if the insight gained from each level of insight completed would help to negate the multi level expotential factor

  • @gackerman99
    @gackerman99 Рік тому

    that Po-Shen calls it a "search space" is really interesting to me. It suggests that doing math is a lot like playing chess, I guess, and that innate ability has something to do with how wide/deep somebody's internal search space is.

  • @Kaslor1000
    @Kaslor1000 3 роки тому +2

    "... and yes, everything here is true, but how the heck did anyone think of that?!" - literally everyone throughout their math education

  • @achtranquillo
    @achtranquillo 3 роки тому +11

    I need to find the English translation for this video.

  • @amshuchitrakar4424
    @amshuchitrakar4424 3 роки тому +1

    two plus two is four, minus one that's quick mafs!

  • @BenDoverII
    @BenDoverII 3 роки тому +3

    Ohhhhh...It`s a Rubik`s Cube wrapped up in a math equation?
    I`M OUT!!!

  • @spacesuitor
    @spacesuitor 3 роки тому +5

    ........i couldn't have said it better myself. 👍

  • @basicworkoutsrecipes2796
    @basicworkoutsrecipes2796 3 роки тому

    So yes...

  • @_Gamble_
    @_Gamble_ 3 роки тому +2

    The exponential possibilities gives me a headache.

    • @ernievid
      @ernievid 3 роки тому

      He’s saying that the total number of possible ways to solve the problem that you will have to try can be calculated as follows: take the number of possibilities you will have to try for each sub-problem (what he calls a leap or re-framing) and multiply that number by itself n times, where n is the number of sub-problems. So if each sub-problem has 5 possibilities to try, and there are three sub-problems, then the total number of possibilities to try is 5 x 5 x 5 = 125. it’s really on approximation, since each sub-problem is unlikely to have the same number of possible solutions to try.

  • @djlethal
    @djlethal 3 роки тому +1

    this guy is cool as hell

  • @hernancontreras-it4ol
    @hernancontreras-it4ol Рік тому

    I focus on them all idk it was side waysb

  • @farobotics3821
    @farobotics3821 3 роки тому

    The most difficult problems(in general) must be those which arent proveable, and where you can't prove if they are not proveable (the nightmare of mathematicians - love and hate to Gödels). At least those problems could be good generators of new math insights :D

  • @blaisexrusso
    @blaisexrusso 3 роки тому +1

    I hate math but this guy makes math seem doable

  • @SoldierPrince
    @SoldierPrince 3 роки тому

    Haha, exactly guys, I feel ya... hilarious.

  • @imonek101
    @imonek101 3 роки тому +3

    He is satoshi!!!

  • @TrippyTheShroom
    @TrippyTheShroom 3 роки тому

    Math really is its own language.

  • @jordanreynolds3101
    @jordanreynolds3101 3 роки тому +1

    This guy is so likeable!

  • @g.l.5072
    @g.l.5072 3 роки тому +1

    I don't get it...

  • @Parallelwurlds
    @Parallelwurlds 3 роки тому +7

    I feel marginally smarter

  • @TheGeorx
    @TheGeorx 3 роки тому +2

    a math prodigy says math textbooks are nonsense. finally

  • @FacadeMan
    @FacadeMan 3 роки тому

    Lex is my gateway to know the genius ones. @Genius-Google

  • @samsamix20
    @samsamix20 3 роки тому +3

    Fits all the stereotypes.. Asian math genius wearing glasses

  • @lloyddobbler1884
    @lloyddobbler1884 3 роки тому +1

    (Voice of Ogre): "NNEEEERRRRDSS!!"

  • @mynameisgnew
    @mynameisgnew 3 роки тому

    after listening all i got is headache

  • @occxxxy
    @occxxxy 3 роки тому

    Here for the culture

  • @luca-wt7dy
    @luca-wt7dy 3 роки тому

    I dont understand it, but i like mc escher

  • @Hjgfrfjufdetivjiu
    @Hjgfrfjufdetivjiu 3 роки тому

    As the British would say, “mafs”

  • @BobbyHil
    @BobbyHil 3 роки тому +1

    That bloke with glasses is clearly so very intelligent. Bless.

  • @floridastreethockey
    @floridastreethockey 3 роки тому

    Lex needs a discussion about how the twin towers were a controlled demolition

  • @inotherwordsiloveyou9562
    @inotherwordsiloveyou9562 3 роки тому +1

    Lex do a video or podcast or Lucid dreaming!

  • @darko7227
    @darko7227 3 роки тому

    What?

  • @koopk1
    @koopk1 3 роки тому +1

    po-shen potion

  • @jamessullivan4391
    @jamessullivan4391 3 роки тому

    If you are on the Left, it is 2+2.

  • @westham5047
    @westham5047 3 роки тому

    I came I'm here thinking it was gonna be 8×12 or something

  • @Ruleta
    @Ruleta 3 роки тому +1

    I hate when Lex does this, doubting the guest instead of trying to understand where he's right. Luckily in this clip he was absolutely out matched as his guest persisted.

  • @Dystisis
    @Dystisis 3 роки тому

    The funny thing is that this explanation itself puts "mathematical problems" into a single form of representation, where what makes for the hardness of mathematical problems is precisely the fact that each of the "steps" he mentions requires a leap out of *any* given form of representation.
    What makes mathematical problems hard is the fact that there is no preconceived answer to this question.

  • @gordoboy18
    @gordoboy18 Рік тому

    Nerds are awesome

  • @nothing3859
    @nothing3859 3 роки тому

    It's too bad I didn't have somebody like this in my math class.. Could have cheated off him and passed

  • @justins5756
    @justins5756 3 роки тому

    I would rather learn how math works by trying it than reading a textbook or watching the teacher

  • @chrish5733
    @chrish5733 3 роки тому

    The answer is 4 unless it is Friday when the answer is 4 1/2.

  • @Itsahmadworld
    @Itsahmadworld 3 роки тому +1

    Why am I laughing right now

    • @thatisabsolutelykooooge2211
      @thatisabsolutelykooooge2211 3 роки тому

      Because you’re a kharrcuss

    • @Itsahmadworld
      @Itsahmadworld 3 роки тому

      @@thatisabsolutelykooooge2211 oi UA-cam newbie
      Know your place or show your face
      Cowardice isn’t tolerated here

    • @thatisabsolutelykooooge2211
      @thatisabsolutelykooooge2211 3 роки тому

      @@Itsahmadworld oh ho ho eerra sico; a kharcuss talking about cowardice LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!!

    • @thatisabsolutelykooooge2211
      @thatisabsolutelykooooge2211 3 роки тому +1

      @@Itsahmadworld I don’t show my face to people with duck face photos 👍🏿

    • @Itsahmadworld
      @Itsahmadworld 3 роки тому

      @@thatisabsolutelykooooge2211 so you don’t show it to your mama?
      Boy why you hate yourself so much
      Find the happiness within and you wouldn’t have to spout nonsense under some shitty alias on the net big man

  • @user-qp6vg9ho8u
    @user-qp6vg9ho8u 3 роки тому +5

    But does he know the square root of 16?

    • @Sealed_Chamber
      @Sealed_Chamber 3 роки тому +1

      Only minds rooted in the fifth dimension could answer such a riddle as that.

  • @drunkmasta69
    @drunkmasta69 3 роки тому

    Pretty sure that guy's an alien.

  • @SurrealScotsman
    @SurrealScotsman 3 роки тому

    Honestly not sure I understood a single thing that was said there?

  • @Mehrdadkh87
    @Mehrdadkh87 3 роки тому

    He is kind live in 4th dimention

  • @xDMrGarrison
    @xDMrGarrison 3 роки тому

    Yes. We need more trashing of math textbooks. Those things are fucking trash.

  • @katok9938
    @katok9938 3 роки тому

    Interviewer: what makes a hard math problem?
    The guy: I could quantify it by the numbers of leaps of insights,Ok so this is a very theoritical computer science bit....
    Me, a dumb 1st year computer science student: Hol up....

  • @beatonthedonis
    @beatonthedonis 3 роки тому

    Humans think metaphorically, not literally.

  • @holymolly2232
    @holymolly2232 3 роки тому +1

    I think I understand the language but have no idea what the heck he is saying..

  • @danielyuan9862
    @danielyuan9862 3 роки тому

    OMG IT'S THE ALMIGHTY PO-SHEN LOH NOTICE ME!!

  • @JakeAllen3
    @JakeAllen3 Рік тому

    P

  • @OgpBosnia
    @OgpBosnia 3 роки тому

    Omg wtf did i just watch....where the hos at tho?

  • @Arizona9001
    @Arizona9001 7 місяців тому

    meh all easy stuff here, i have the solutions but Po-Shen told me not to help him. also, water is wet.

  • @Godsfavouriteidiot_
    @Godsfavouriteidiot_ 3 роки тому

    I’ve never felt more of an ape than I do now

  • @Twink5
    @Twink5 3 роки тому

    What the fuck is a leanier

  • @AlwaysDiamonds
    @AlwaysDiamonds 3 роки тому

    I dumb

  • @RagingBullNuts
    @RagingBullNuts 3 роки тому

    Yea Yea, okay, mmhmm, I see. Yea totally. I agree mmhmm mmhmm

  • @timemechanicone
    @timemechanicone 3 роки тому

    Math isn’t factually precise, formulas in Python or physics all have infinites = incomplete sums. Hence no answers derived from incomplete math are answered. Math is the wrong tool being used incorrectly. We need new ways to think..... ASAP.

  • @PlanetJigobotTV
    @PlanetJigobotTV 3 роки тому

    Hold up, this man just say taught his self math in college? He tried to back peddal but I think that's what he did.

  • @WorriedBubble
    @WorriedBubble 3 роки тому +2

    Skinny in body, fat in brain

    • @WorriedBubble
      @WorriedBubble 3 роки тому +1

      @@juliocesarsalazargarcia6872 indeed