20july1944 That he would save any of us is pure grace. We all deserve eternal punishment. He created good and evil and does what he will. We cannot say that anything he does isn’t good because we are the ones with the flawed and sinful minds. He is perfect beyond our comprehension. How can we decide what is the right thing for God to do? I thank God every day for plucking me from death for reasons that I will never understand on this earth. God is good. Whether a sinner sees that or not doesn’t change his goodness.
Mat: But God creates the nonelect out of cruelty (i.e. the pleasure of causing them punitive suffering), right? In thanking God for plucking you from death, do you consider your fellow vermin who aren't so lucky?
20july1944 I know how hard it is to get to the point where you accept that there are things we can’t understand about God. “For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, declares the Lord. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts.” Isaiah 55:8-9 We have to understand that God does what is perfectly right regardless of how it may seem to our narrow minds. God doesn’t find pleasure in damning people. There will not be anyone in hell that does not deserve to be there and there will not be anyone in heaven that deserves to be there. “For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,” Ephesians 2:8 We cannot fathom how God can choose people to live and people to die, but that is not for us to understand. God in his infinite wisdom does what is right. We are to merely obey his word and trust in him completely. If you are struggling currently with your relationship with God because you cannot understand his ways, I encourage you to pray to him and ask that he reveal to you in his word everything that you can fathom and then rest in the fact that he is sovereign and you will not worry about what we can’t understand. I’m praying for you, my friend!
Mat: _"We cannot fathom how God can choose people to live and people to die, but that is not for us to understand."_ Are your fellow vemin who are nonelect worthy of love? Do you love them?
No one understands God’s 100%, He is endless, infinite, unconditionally graceful but sovereign over everything in Christ, thru Christ, because of Christ~ so Christ is not an option to believe! Thank you JP
In Jeremiah 19:5 God says, “They have built the high places of Baal to burn their children in the fire as offerings to Baal-something I did NOT COMMAND or mention, nor did it enter my mind.” 2nd Peter 3:9 says, “The Lord is…not willing that ANY should perish but that ALL should come to repentance.” and yet, it also has Jesus saying, "Broad is the road that leads to destruction (hell) and many are on it, but straight and narrow is the road that leads to life (Heaven) and few ever find it."
We MUST read ALL of Romans, NOT just Romans 6 and 7 which, when read by themselves, can make a christian think they will always be controlled by the flesh. The answer is found next door in Romans chapter 8. Romans 8:12-13 tells us we are no longer under obligation to the flesh once we are saved. Paul said in 1 Corinthians 15:31, "I die daily." It's a choice everybody.
@Mason Lindskog Only one who is OF Christ will persist till the last day. Because of God awakening me, do I choose Him daily. No foundation can be made against God, whom has chosen some over others before the foundation of the world. Only those who can choose, whom persist, whom the Father knew before the foundation of the world, will be with Him to glorify Him, as none have the foundation to stand against His judgement. Non-Calvinists often don't like the fact that God is in absolute control over EVERYTHING. Often the criticism of "I wouldn't want to worship a God who 'arbitrarily' chooses whom to save" is the point. From our own choice, we wouldn't choose God. The choice TO choose Him, is BECAUSE of God Himself. All glory to God MEANS "ALL" glory to God. Else those who won the lottery, a random chance, a roll of the dice, did anyone get saved, not because of God, but you just got lucky. Sad world view of a false Gospel.
The gospel was made plain and simple so that even the simplest person could understand it... Christ came to redeem us and to show us our need for him. He pointed out the evil in our heart compared to His goodness and His holiness. He died to take our punishment upon himself. But death could not have victory over him, rather he overcame death. And because He has overcome death we too have been given that victory. If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, YOU WILL BE SAVED!! It doesn’t mean that the next day you’ll wake up a brainwashed person “programmed” to do only good things. But what it means is that a work has started in your heart. You are being restored into the image that God originally intended for you. Stop scaring people and giving them anxiety about their salvation by telling them they might not being one of God’s elect... He said “behold I stand at the door and Knock,” he isn’t knocking at the door of some, but he is knocking on all our hearts, we can either ignore it or open it. God will hold us accountable for our CHOICES!! Love is a CHOICE, it’s soooo plain, and it’s sooo simple to understand! Christ already won the victory, we can either accept his victory or reject! And in the end he will hold us accountable for our choices. I simply don’t see how God could hold you or me accountable for something we didn’t have the ability to choose... I like John Piper but this is one video that I have to disagree with 🤔
What has come to be known as "Calvinism" came from Augustine's attempt to explain how infants could become the "elect" through water baptism. Since the child had not come to faith, it must be based on the will of another. It could have nothing to do with the will of the child. See the following from Dr. Ken Wilson's research of the writings of Augustine on Leighton Flowers UA-cam channel. "Was Augustine the first to introduce "CALVINISM" into the Church?" ua-cam.com/video/BnOMORGM2Qw/v-deo.html .
@@SpotterVideo I knew about halfway through that you sounded like Leighton. Dang. No offense, brother, but that man spends his life denigrating calvinism instead of edifying the body. Augustine is not the founder of Calvinism. In fact, what you call Calvinism, I call the entire teaching of John, Paul, and Peter. If you take any of the epistles, and you attempt to map out "who is doing, has done, or will do", you will arrive at the reformed position of sotereology. It's very easy to swallow, by a simple plain reading of the text. Also, if you just simply look at God's sovereignty in the OT... the way in which He called Israel, how He uses nations to pass judgement, how His decisions are fixed in eternity past... read the Psalms. Read Job. Read Exodus. Read Judges, Chronicles, Kings... you cannot escape the absolute sovereignty of God in the world. Yet, you also cannot overlook the responsibility that God also places on evil men and women. Why does He do it that way? You don't know. I don't know. The best answer is that you, a creation, do not have the right to ask the Creator why He made you the way He did (Rom 9:20). If He wants to make a vessel for honor and vessels for wrath, He's God. You simply have to look in awe and tremble at the absolute grace of God to save anyone at all. Leighton will not deal with these texts because he can't. Just look at his debate with James White on Romans 9 and how he dances from text to text, never addressing the debate topic. I do not care if you are a calvinist or not. I want people to know and love Christ to the utmost. Read ephesians 1, particularly focus on WHY God chose us before the foundation of the world (Eph 1:4) and predestined us to adoption through Jesus Christ (v. 5). It's ALL due to the kind intention of His will (v.5), and for His glory alone (v. 6). Verses 11 and 12 come to the same conclusion as well. I'm assuming you're a brother in Christ. If so, let's find the things that unify us and stop letting the world see us all bickering over our faith. If you're a believer, you believe that Christ saved you by grace, through faith (Eph 2:8). Lovingly, if you're having a hard time believing that we "calvinists" are fellow brothers, I would challenge you to a plain reading of the first 3 chapters in Ephesians. There are plenty other long blocks of Scripture that lay out the reformed position, but nowhere else is the gospel so plainly, yet beautifully explained, in such a concise 3 chapter block.
@Ghost In The Shell's The Laughing Man you're born headed to hell. Can you boast if you've made a better choice than someone? If you "get it" and others don't? "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast." Ephesians 2:8-9
@Ghost In The Shell's The Laughing Man @Ghost In The Shell's The Laughing Man with respect brother, where are you getting your theology from, in the Scriptures? I'm giving you some texts to look at and you're giving me the stuff I heard rationalized to me when I was young, but I can't find that in the Bible. Just real quick, go read Romans 9. Read Ephesians 1-2. Read John 6, John 15. John 10:26, John 8:47, John 17. Jesus did not die for everyone to come to repentance. His death means that people from every nation, tribe and tongue can be saved. Anyone who calls on the name of Christ can be saved. However, “There are some of you who do not believe.” (For Jesus knew from the beginning who those were who did not believe, and who it was who would betray him.) And he said, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.” (John 6:64-65). I think you may be thinking of John 12:32, where Jesus says that he draws all people to himself? Well, actually no, it doesn’t say that. It says more literally, “I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all to myself” (John 12:32). Which could mean all people who are “my sheep” (John 10:16, 27) or all people who are “the children of God” (John 11:52) or all people who belong to the Father (John 17:6). Look into these things. You were dead in your sins, but God. Not a salvation issue but it does provide greater awe of the glorious Triune God
@@dmeek20 we've just been having this same conversation with this person on another post. The provided nothing from scripture, in fact highlighted that they have a limited understanding of it.
Forget all the terminology “Calvinism” “reformed” … what JP is talking about is just what scripture teaches us. Our choice to put faith in Christ is a very important part of the process but it’s not to belittle how God is great and worked in our hearts. If you reject the predestination of a Holy and Soverign God in this process, you reject scripture. It’s beautiful and should give all believers assurance and as a young believer it is incredibly comforting to me knowing that it’s not just my will that saves me because I sin all the time. it’s his grace and Love. To God be the glory!
Change your mind about how you are living, Repent of sin first then you show evidence of faith to believe Go on to be water baptized and recieve the Holy Spirit. Anyone who claims repenting of sin is works will die in unrepentant sin. Revelation 21:7 Nothing impure will ever enter it, nor will anyone who does what is shameful or deceitful, but only those whose names are written in the Lamb’s book of life
Calvinism is dangerous. It has another god, another christ, and another gospel. I was a Calvinist for over 20 years and now i reject Calvinism and its false teachers. T-Totally confusing U-Unfounded assumptions L-Lack of biblical authority I-Idolatrous philosophy P-Perversions of the Gospel This is how Calvinism rejects the authority of Scripture This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires ALL PEOPLE to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom FOR ALL, which is the testimony given at the proper time. (emphasis added) 1 Timothy 2:3-6 Sadly, the Bible is not the Calvinists authority, Calvinism is the Calvinist's authority. So when they come across 1 Timothy 2:3-6, they must ignore what the Bible actually says and play Calvinist word games to tell you what the Bible meant to say, because apparently God is so stupid that He can't communicate, so it takes a Calvinist to tell us what the Bible really means. So to the Calvinist, when the Bible clearly and explicitly says that "God desires ALL PEOPLE to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth" what God really means is that God desires only the elect to be saved and come to knowlege of the truth. And when the Bible clearly and explicitly says, "Jesus Christ gave Himself as a ransom FOR ALL," what God really means is that Jesus Christ gave Himself as a ransom for the elect. [The Bible-God's Word] This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires ALL PEOPLE to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom FOR ALL, which is the testimony given at the proper time. (emphasis added) 1 Timothy 2:3-6 [Calvinism-Man's philosophy] This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who DECREED BEFORE THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD FOR THE ELECT to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and THE ELECT, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for THE ELECT, which is the testimony given at the proper time. (emphasis added) 1 Timothy 2:3-6 Do you see how Calvinism just carelessly throws the authority of Scripture under the bus and replaces God's Word with the vain philosophy and empty words of Calvinism? Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. Colossians 2:8 This is another example, and there are many, of how Calvinist's must throw Scriptural authority under the bus in order to defend Calvinism and not God's Word. This is what the Bible says..... [Bible-God's Word] For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 3:16 KJV According to the Calvinist, this is what John 3:16 means to them [Calvinism-Man's philosophy] For God so loved THE ELECT, that he gave his only begotten Son, that THOSE CHOSEN FOR SALVATION BEFORE THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD, should not perish, but have everlasting life, AFTER THEY ARE EFFECTUALLY CALLED AND GIVEN THE ABILITY TO HAVE FAITH. John 3:16 Do you see the difference between God's Word and Calvinism? In the Bible, God loves everyone and wants everyone to be saved, Christ died for everyone, and we can choose to accept or reject God's gift of salvation made available to all. That's what the Bible says. But Calvinists don't care what the Bible says, and wrongly teaches that God loves some and hates others, that we have no free will to choose God's gift of salvation, that God doesn't want everyone to be saved, and Christ didn't die for everyone. As i mentioned before, Calvinism has a different god, a different christ, and a different gospel. I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel- not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed. Galatians 1:6-9 Since rejecting Calvinism ive since adopted the Provisionist view of Soteriology, elucidated by Leighton Flowers from Soteriology 101. It is the view most faithful to Scriptural authority and God's character. I suggest anyone to visit his channel
I dissagree only with the last part of John's statement hete about the freewill. Election and freewill do not contradict oneanother, they are the same from different perspectives. When Pharoah's heart was hardened by God he was not like a robot with no freewill. So, he could not say to God, it wasn't my fault because you predestined my response. The clay does not instruct the potter. This is the awe inspiring majesty of God and the mystery of his ways which are much higher than the ways of man.
Nagy Calvinism, like all reformed routes, don't trust in works. Maybe read Calvin's institutes to discover what how much God you'll find and how little devil is in there.
@Nagy Erno I'm a Calvinist, I can't talk for others but in general no we do not. We don't even take credit for anything we do good because that all belongs to God and He deserves every drop of glory.
In Jeremiah 19:5 God says, “They have built the high places of Baal to burn their children in the fire as offerings to Baal-something I did NOT COMMAND or mention, nor did it enter my mind.” 2nd Peter 3:9 says, “The Lord is…not willing that ANY should perish but that ALL should come to repentance.” and yet, it also has Jesus saying, "Broad is the road that leads to destruction (hell) and many are on it, but straight and narrow is the road that leads to life (Heaven) and few ever find it."@@HearGodsWord
All the Good things comes from God , wisdom , knowledge , love , mercy , faithfulness , forgiveness , patience all good in us is from God nothing ours. All bad things is from us hate , lust , lieing, curruption, jealousy, envy , desires of body etc.. Nothing good in us we are useless. Praise the God for Giving us all of this, but not all have it. So praise Him for giving your goodness in you coz its not your own but God's. We are His chosen sheeps, lets go astray no more and glorify His name in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. Who gave His life on the cross in behalf of us so that we the lost sheeps of the God will become righteous and He became sinner in behalf of us. The innocent Holy being came on earth to die for our sins as God's Lamb so that we will live eternity in His and our Father presence forever and ever in His Holy promise land. Amen
Time Stamp 4:57 - 5:22 God has NO Needs. He is NOT needy. Thus God would have No need to create millions of people ( possibly billions of them ) so as to damn them in eternal suffering & torment. He can have No need of it for He is Self-Sufficient and Complete within Himself. He can have No wants either because wants only reveal need. God would have had all the glory that was indeed possible within Himself throughout all of eternity past. Calvinism / Reformed Theology makes No sense Rationally Nor Morally. To create "specific people" so as to only damn them for all of eternity future - for trillions and trillions and trillions of years ad infinitim is unspeakably Immoral and Unnecessary. It is far too easy to show why Calvinism is Immoral. It is far too easy to show why Calvinism is False.
bshurdhi9491 Well, Romans 8:29 says God foreknew all of us who would be saved, thus he knew us personally and loved the elect unconditionally(since of course God knew everybody who would ever exist before creation started and is not suggesting EVERYONE is saved), so He predestined us to salvation.
I sat there waiting and waiting for an answer . just say calvinism is the belief in _________ . just fill in the blank . reads half the bible and I'm still lost.
I’m a Christian. But if God forces me to love Him and gives no free will. I do not want to serve Him. And yes, that is my free will talking. The free will He loved me enough to give. The free will in which I choose to love Him with as well.
I’m glad your a Christian first off. John 8:34 [34] Jesus answered them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, whoever commits sin is a slave of sin. Surely you’ve sinned as well as all of us have. How free is your free will when the Bible claims you’re a slave to sin ? Yet as a Christian you are now a slave to righteousness. Romans 6:18 [18] And having been set free from sin, you became slaves of righteousness. Can a slave to sin opt not to sin? Can a slave of righteousness opt to not serve God righteously? You sound as if your free will trumps your slavery to sin or righteousness and you can opt out of either anytime you want? Let me prove your free will ain’t so free, choose not to sin if you think you can…when you realize you can’t stop sinning you’ll realize just how little free will you have.
@@Mattissaved Even after one becomes a Christian (calvinist or not) you still struggle with self control and discipline. A calvinist doesn't magically have his struggles settled, you still have to make an effort.
@@luke31ish No doubt Luke…I think the only man to ever have true Libertarian free will was Jesus. He had no capability to speak falsehoods or believe in something not true ( you & I do possess this capability ) I also believe the definition of Free will is not the power of contrary choice. Jesus didn’t have the ability of contrary choice because he was truly free…he could not attain to any falsehoods or speak lies, he was indeed free….you & I are a mixed bag, we can & do grievous sins and errors and yet we can also attain to the truth of Gods Word & learn from it ( sanctification )
The one thing I will say is, God does not create anyone and send them to Hell. We seem to think as humans that no one deserves Hell. That is where we are mistaken, we all deserve Hell. We have forgotten that none are good, we were completely without hope without the grace of God. The unfair thing isn’t the fact that one gets into Heaven and one doesn’t, the true unfair thing is that any get into Heaven because all are undeserving. Why God would “choose” someone whatever that may be, God can do whatever He pleases and He is still good! Rather we have complete free will in our salvation or rather we are chosen, God is still good and is the only reason salvation is possible
Thank you for letting my eyes see the TRUTH. I was a recently reborn Christian and I was even questioning God's Righteousness, a fool of me, a sinner who even dares questions His Mercy and Grace. Thank you so much for clearing my mind with questionable thoughts. ❤
I think we have all been there right beside you in questioning Gods infinite wisdom and grace!!! But praise Him for his forgiveness! Keep your head up and keep pressing on!! Love you in Christ Jesus our Lord!
Lol I know. There is no such thing actually. If you summarize it then it sounds ridiculous, but if you take two hours to explain it then it sounds “deep”. I guess it comes down to this question though; what are we responsible for in our salvation? What do you take credit for in that process? The Calvinist would say I didn’t do anything, it was all Gods grace. then others would say they had free will and did the work to make the choice to be saved, then God saved them. The other points in Calvinism are easy other than that.
Calvinism is the belief that God, before creation, in his total sovereign control over everything, arbitrarily decided who he would save from hell and who he wouldn’t. He ordained the fall so he could do this. Why? So that he could display all of his perfections, including mercy, justice, wrath, love, etc... Is Calvinism correct Christianity? No.
According to this, I'm not saved. No matter how bad I want to trust Christ, believe, accept, call on and ask Jesus to save me, I'm going to burn in Hell. I'm not free from my sins. I continue to commit the same sin over, and over again. So it's a good thing I don't believe in Calvinism. I'm not Armenian either. I'm a "Whosoever will may come", and a "God is not willing that any should parish, but that all should come to repentance" type of guy.
Straw man argument. We are all completely dead in our sins, no one desires God, no not one. Not one person is gonna say on judgement day, "I wanted to come to you but I couldn't." Those people loved their sin and cherished it; they hate God and did not want his gift of salvation
In Jeremiah 19:5 God says, “They have built the high places of Baal to burn their children in the fire as offerings to Baal-something I did NOT COMMAND or mention, nor did it enter my mind.” 2nd Peter 3:9 says, “The Lord is…not willing that ANY should perish but that ALL should come to repentance.” and yet, it also has Jesus saying, "Broad is the road that leads to destruction (hell) and many are on it, but straight and narrow is the road that leads to life (Heaven) and few ever find it."@@fireflames3639
That sounds like the Scripture to me. Why is the Scripture labelled as Calvinism? Schism? That's all YaHuWaH's Word 🙌🏾🙌🏾 Though Calvin may have been used of God in the past, he was not perfect; not 💯. So I'd rather see Scripture through Christ's point of view, and be labelled as His. We have His Spirit, and we have His mind ("the mind of Christ"). He's our common ground, and the source of our unity.
I agree. I think Calvinism are a subset of explanations of doctrines. I think the reason it is distinguished is because they're so controversial and so many people don't believe it. So I don't call myself a Calvinist but I agree with all 5 points.
Since we don't need to believe Calvinism and follow it to be SAVE (only born again Christians from ALL denominations will be saved) then I guess we NON CALVINISTS were predestined (if God has DECREED ALL THINGS , according to Calvinism, then God has DECREED our rejection of Calvinism AS WELL) by Jehovah God to reject both Calvinism and Arminianism and YET BE SAVED.I am a 1-saved by the blood of the Lamb and His resurrection by Grace through Faith 2- bible believing Christian 3-NON_CALVINIST AND NON ARMINIAN AND PROUD OF IT.
I'm personally not a calvinist because I feel like God died for the sins of the whole world. God loved me while I was yet a sinner and we are to love others that hate us just like God did when we were yet evil.
John 1:29 says Jesus died for the sins of the world. Calvinists believe this. Dig deeper into their history and writings. Matthew Henry’s commentary would good to see what they say. Even Calvin himself it might surprise you because they do believe that Jesus died for the sins of the world but only the elect (believing ones) are saved through propitiation. The Bible teaches the complete sovereignty of God in all things His providence is woven through all of creation and human actions but we make real choices and decisions that we’re responsible for. There’s a tension there but the Bible teaches both and when you can accept that for what it is it makes things very practical for life and application to the believer. I can give you many examples if you want proof.
Question, So at one point The teachings of Calvanism didn't exist?? It all started with John Calvin? What was taught before about free will and Salvation ??
No John Calvin did not invent the ideas he taught. St. Augustine (4th century) taught the same doctrine. John Calvin admired Augustine a lot. The biblical understanding of our will is found in Romans 3, and 1 Corinthians 1 & 2.
There sure are lots of people in this comment section calling the theological beliefs of their Brethren wicked. Let's not be so quick to throw around weighty words. And on the flip side, let's not inject our American, western, individualistic culture into soteriology. There are extremely valid arguments for reformed theology and against the arminian stance. Keep perspective and major in the majors... Christ! Sadly, my brothers in the reformed camp do the same to y'all, but guys, we agree that whosoever believes will not perish. These debates and discussions should seek to edify the body and glorify Christ. You say our theology is wicked, but it could truly be boiled down to simply this: we believe it is all of Christ. If we claim Christ then we should continuously pray for discernment. We should pray for our brothers. We should beg Christ to teach us new things from Scripture each day. And we should remain humble in dealing with those brothers on the other side.
@@alredesmit3560 sorry... that's not at all what JMac believes. He believes in Christ alone, by grace alone, through faith alone. You have to be familiar with one's entire body of work to represent them well. He is obviously talking about the evidence/fruit of one's faith. Check out James 2 verses 17-18 and then verse 26. Sorry, I've listened to and read tons of John MacArthur and this is not at all a fair representation of what he believes actually saves someone. What he's getting at is the idea that one may say "the sinner's prayer" (which is a made up, non-biblical idea), and enter heaven 50 years later just because of that prayer. Your life - the taking off of the old man, and the putting on of the new - is the assurance of your salvation. Did you get baptized when you were 9, then live a life of debauchery for 70 years? You're not saved. Your actions prove your salvation. That is the exact stance John MacArthur would take. Again, let's not be so quick to destroy the unity that the Holy Spirit has given us through our common salvation. We should be fighting against liberalism, health and wellness gospel, therapeutic gospel, gay "marriage", etc., instead of misrepresenting brothers who have done more for the faith than we could ever dream. That's not displaying the fruit of the spirit. Check out ephesians 4 and contrast the Gentiles (old life) with the new life. Christianity is not reduced to a dunking at age 9, it's evidenced by a life of submission to Christ where our obedience to His commands proves that we are in right relationship with Him
Your comment is a year old, but it's the most Christlike one I've seen browsing through the others posted. So much mudslinging and so many accusations of heresy does nothing to edify. We all have brothers and sisters in Christ on both sides of this issue. I've grown in the grace and knowledge of Christ over the past year, studying the Word, and come to think of myself as Reformed more and more, but I would never want to condemn anyone without good reason. If we have common ground in the core doctrines of the faith, we are in the body. God hates this sort of divisiveness.
@@mortified_penguin2355 yes! Common ground in the core doctrines. There is a time to push back against heresy, but not everything we disagree with is heresy. I hope you are well. Continue in the faith, brother.
Thanks for your comments, Mike and Daniel. I'm a babe in Christ yet, not sure what I believe. Freewill when contrasted with prophesy, foreordination, and God's Sovereign Will seems rather paradoxical to me. Oh, how unsearchable are His ways. God is truly great. Praise Christ!
Calvinism is just wrong. Pastor John skated around the point. There are NO elect and predestined. Christ died for ALL and all are called but few are chosen because only a few actually say yes! Not all get saved but that’s their choice not their fate. Calvinism is very unbiblical and is heresy.
Thank you. I agree to wha you say. God gave his only Son Jesus so that everybody who believes in Jesus can be saved (John 3,16). It's a choice by free will. I admit that it is too complex for me to understand because I am living in the western world. We do at least have churches, free churches, access to bible, you could have religion in school and some other stuff. Other countries don't have that at all. I hope and want to believe that God is just and merciful and that everybody who wants to get saved, will get the opportunity to do so. I strongly dislike the thought of some people being predestined and preselected. Even if you could make the biblical case / find arguments that God knows who will be saved and who won't etc., I think this thought construct drives people further away from the loving God. Nobody likes arrogant people. Nobody likes people who consider themselves the select over others. I personally think that i shouldn't think that I was preselected because I am something special or whatever I could think I am. I should believe that God saved me through his Son Jesus by grace alone. And that I'm no better than other people and I didn't deserve salvation more than others. In my case, I "simply" was a bit lucky despite all the traumatic events that some aspects of my life lead me to finding the truth. But as we all know, one can live his entire life of like 60 or 80 years without ever doing any research if God exists, if the bible is right, what is the meaning of life, if there is judgement after death and all the many "standard" question you can ask yourself. A man can go from being lost to being saved.
@@SavedByGrace_CitizenEmperorユウ yes! Ur absolutely right...anyone who calls upon His name for salvation shall be saved. I dnt understand the predestination argument. So someone who confesses their sins and repents and does everything the Bible says might not be saved bc they aren’t part of the elect? So everything the Bible says is a lie. It does not say “you shall be saved IF you are part of the elect” no it says “you shall be saved.” And God tells us to love our enemies and to love everyone. Does God require something of us that He does not even do Himself? Bc I have had calvinists tell me God doesn’t love everyone equally. There are so many flaws with their theory it boggles my mind how a true Christian could believe this nonsense. It’s sad really. Imagine going through life thinking that you are part of a special group that God loves more than everybody else. How entitled and obnoxious! How do these ppl even reconcile that they are truly one of the elect? How could they know... maybe they’re not.
According to the Bible, Jesus died for them who believes in him not for all. If your saying he died for all your saying there are people in hell who sins were paid for and that the blood of christ wasn't enough to save them. Cause we are not saved by our work but by his grace, Jesus sacrifice.
When you said that God can do as He pleases and He is sovereign when He does it, I think I felt a degree of doubt and thus, some degree of offense and in this I cry out. Because I hate the idea that I think God isn't sovereign as He is. God forgive me...
How is it that God has given EVERYONE the ability to have faith in someone or something. Has given everyone the ability to worship. Has made it very clear how He hates idol and false god worship. Yet our Creator, who created everyone with a soul in HIS own image, who LOVES His creation. Who is a jealous God has made it impossible for most to come to Him, to believe in Him, to place their faith in Him, to trust and obey Him. In limit atonement God never provided a Savior for most souls. But Jesus says He came to save the lost. He became a ransom for all, He didnt just die for our sins but for the whole world. Love in gentle never forced. God loves His creation so dearly. He gave His only Son. He will never force us to love Him back. He has provided a Savior for all, Jesus is always knocking on the door, but He will not force Himself in. The gift of salavtion is avalible to everyone. The sad truth, not all want to be saved. Seek and you will find
Revelation 22:17 says, “Whosoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.” Calvinism, however says it actually means: The ones I (God) chose, will take of the water of life. John 3:16 says, “For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.” Calvinism, however says this verse actually means: For God so loved the ones He chose, that He gave His only begotten Son, that those He chose WILL have everlasting life. Joshua 24:15 says, “…choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve…But as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.” Calvinism, however says this verse actually means: There is no choice, rather, God will decide whether or not one will serve the Lord. 2nd Peter 3:9 says, “The Lord is…not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.” Calvinism, however, says this verse actually means: The Lord is not willing that any of the ones He has chosen should perish, but that all of the ones He has chosen should come to repentance. Matthew6:8-10 says, “…therefore, pray: Our Father in heaven, Hallowed be Your name. Your kingdom come. Your will be done.” This is a prayer. If God’s will was already being done as per Calvinism, then why do we need to pray that it will happen? Hebrews 3:12-14 says, “Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; but exhort one another daily, while it is called “Today,” lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end…” This is a call to not harden our hearts and depart from the living God, and to hold our confidence in Christ steadfast until the end. According to Calvinism, we can’t make that decision; God has already decided. John 1:29 says, “The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, “Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!” Calvinism, however says this verse actually means: The Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the few that God has chosen. 1st Timothy 1:15 says, “This is a faithful saying …that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners…” Calvinism, however says this verse actually means: Jesus came into the world to save (ONLY) the sinners God has already chosen. 1ST John 19 says, “If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” Calvinism says, this verse really means, the ones He has chosen WILL confess their sins, and He is faithful and just to forgive them their sins and to cleanse them from all unrighteousness. Calvinism calls confession a synergistic work; meaning a work of faith added to what God has already done. Also, there is no IF in Calvinism. Revelation 3:20 says, “Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me.” Calvinism says, this verse really means, “…when the one I have chosen hears my voice, he will open the door…” Luke 13:3 says, “…unless you repent, you too will all perish.” It doesn’t say, “it doesn’t matter if you repent UNLESS I have already chosen you.”
Sun Flowery it says that those whom God foreknew He predestined so God predestined those who He knows choose Christ. The real question is why would God waste time on people He knows won’t ever bow to Christ Jesus? He knows all that was is and will be.
Yes little Johnny! Let me tell you about the Calvinists god.... We love you, little Johnny, but we accept the fact that God might not love you, and that He may have plans to send you to hell for your future sins. If you do find yourself one day burning in hell because He hasn’t elected to save you, just remember that we will always love you, even if God hates you. Take comfort knowing that we are not like God. We will be in heaven forever only because we were unconditionally chosen for salvation before we were born. That would be the only reason that we won’t be in hell with you if you find yourself there. It won’t be because of anything we did. So also take comfort in knowing that. It may not seem fair, but who are we to judge God? So again, if you find yourself in hell, remember that we will always love you as we forever worship the God who loved us but who hated you, the God who sent His Son to die for us but not for you. Please, we ask, don’t let it bother you-if you find yourself in hell-that we love the God who hated you and showed you no mercy. We must accept the fact that God is sovereign, and He does what He pleases. I know as Calvinists parents we should be more grateful for our own salvation! It’s like, ‘as long as our eternal destiny is secure, as long as our life is all planned out and taken care of by God, we shouldn’t give a damn about family, friends or anyone else!’ After all, the lost hate God because God first hated them. We as Calvinist parents should hate what god hates, but it is so hard, because we can’t help but love you little Johnny and our families and neighbours! John Calvin Institutes proof texts: “ God arranges all things by his sovereign counsel, in such a way that individuals are born, who are doomed from the womb to certain death and are to glorify him by their destruction.( John Calvin Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 23, Paragraph 6 “…salvation is freely offered to some while others are barred from access to it.” (John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 21, Paragraph 5) “We call predestination God’s eternal decree, by which he compacted with himself what he willed to become of each man. For all are not created in equal condition; rather, eternal life is fore-ordained for some, eternal damnation for others.” (John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 21, Paragraph 5) “…we say that God once established by his eternal and unchangeable plan those whom he long before determined once for all to receive into salvation, and those whom, on the other hand, he would devote to destruction…he has barred the door of life to those whom he has given over to damnation.” (John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 21, Paragraph 7) “The devil, and the whole train of the ungodly, are in all directions, held in by the hand of God as with a bridle, so that they can neither conceive any mischief, nor plan what they have conceived, nor how muchsoever they may have planned, move a single finger to perpetrate, unless in so far as he permits, nay unless in so far as HE COMMANDS, that they are not only bound by his fetters but are even FORCED to do him service” (John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 1, Chapter 17, Paragraph 11) John Piper states it plainly: Quote from John Piper: "God . . . brings about all things in accordance with his will. In other words, it isn’t just that God manages to turn the evil aspects of our world to good for those who love him; it is rather that he himself brings about these evil aspects for his glory (see Ex. 9:13-16; John 9:3) and his people’s good (see Heb. 12:3-11; James 1:2-4). This includes-as incredible and as unacceptable as it may currently seem-God’s having even brought about the Nazis’ brutality at Birkenau and Auschwitz as well as the terrible killings of Dennis Rader and even the sexual abuse of a young child . . . Truth in Love Warning to those who promote the CANCER of Reformed 5-point Calvinism Galatians 1:8-9 8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to what we have preached to you, he is to be accursed! 9 As we have said before, so I say again now, if any man is preaching to you a gospel contrary to what you received, he is to be accursed!
Faith is not a gift of God, it's a response to God's grace. Calvinism is trying to turn this response into a work, a merit, but it absolutely isn't. Do I have anything to boast about, because I accepted a gift based on what God did on the cross? Of course not! Piper is such a bright man and I love him, but it amazes me that he can't see this.
Sorry faith is a gift from God. Eph 2:8 says so. Faith is one of the fruit of the s Spirit. Phil 1:29 days it had been granted you to believe and suffer.
@@HearGodsWord Calvinism gives people the greatest excuse of all time to reject God. Instead of we can love God because he first loved us, it is we reject God because he first unilaterally rejected us before the foundation of the world.
@@Isaaaaac so no examples then. Man has rejected God because man loves darkness. God does however call some, just look at Abraham, Moses, David, the Prophets, the Apostles, Paul...
Saying man rejected God because man loves darkness, without saying why they love that darkness is deceiving. Why did man love darkness? Because God made them that way with no option otherwise other than to hope they were chosen by him? Is that not wicked? Creating every being with no hope and no way out, only striving after darkness and never seeing a hand reaching out because God blinded them? Is that a good God? I do not think so. Is that wrong?
this "once saved always saved" theology is heresy, If once saved always saved is what a Calvinist lives by then theres no reason to consistently ask for forgiveness let alone follow Jesus because if your once saved always saved then that means whatever you do, wont affect your salvation. Meaning that you can go sin as much as you want and live by your own terms since you cant lose your salvation than everything is permitted.
My question would be is. What do you not understand about the word eternal?Webster define it as everlasting enduring through ALL TIME. perpetual CONTINUING FOREVER.And no it's not a licence to steal.It does mean that you don't have to wonder if you'll lose what you didn't pay for Ephesians 2:8-9.
Johnny Hutto but if its “once saved always saved” then In a way Whatever sin you do, it pretty much doesnt matter since Your already have attained your salvation you can sin as much as you want without any moral Consequence. So No Once Saved Always Saved Is just not true because Sin is Still Active You can Still Sin and Sin is what separated man in the first place.
To believe in OSAS and then think they can go on with Their life and sin however they want has truly misunderstood this doctrine. Someone with that kind of logic has missed the beauty of OSAS and is showing evidence of someone with an unregenerated heart.
In Jeremiah 19:5 God says, “They have built the high places of Baal to burn their children in the fire as offerings to Baal-something I did NOT COMMAND or mention, nor did it enter my mind.” 2nd Peter 3:9 says, “The Lord is…not willing that ANY should perish but that ALL should come to repentance.” and yet, it also has Jesus saying, "Broad is the road that leads to destruction (hell) and many are on it, but straight and narrow is the road that leads to life (Heaven) and few ever find it."
So crazy! Why God predestined some people to Heven and the most for..hell.??....Very crazy!...What this man is talking, is not the Bible! God did NOT predestined sin, He ask us to repent..!...
Calvinism is theology taken from scripture, re-injected back into the Word of God in a wicked way by wicked people. Take words like "Election, Pre-destination, determined" and give them your own definitions, then go back and apply them to God's Word and God's attributes and you will get Calvinism. I am not saying they aren't trying to be biblical, and I am not saying they aren't right about a LOT of stuff, and I am not saying it isn't Biblical, because it is but it's basically a theology that starts with God's Sovereignty and Power mixed with Man's wickedness. You can start anywhere, but what a weird place to start. Why not start with God's Love or God's Creativity? 1 Corinthians 13 also doesn't exist in Calvinism. It's removed from the Bible (lol) Calvinists also have the problem of putting the weakest portions of theology over the best of man's philosophy %100 of the time, since the Bible is better than the imagination of man. The Bible being authoritative is fine... but man's reading of the Bible being authoritative is a bit of a stretch I believe that the Bible is the Word of God, but it's not "perfect" because of the people reading it. It's also not Deity. I have a strict Christ>Bible theology. Sure it's perfect if it's translated perfectly, but a lot of verses are pretty mysterious and people smarter than me are really confused about a lot of stuff. R.C. Sproul used to talk about how stupid he was about EVERYTHING in the Bible, regardless of the fact he was smarter than everyone else reading it. If our smartest people are wrong about their interpretation of scripture, then it's safe to assume that the Bible is filled with "errors" or "half truths", and that's okay. In John 2 19 Jesus Christ talks about how he will "destroy this temple and build it up in 3 days". Contextually, it's clear to %99.9 of people reading it that he will destroy a temple (a building) and build it up in 3 days (he is a carpenter). However, I may take a "Minority" view on a passage like this and say "maybe he is being a smart-ass and is referring to himself, and it's an esoteric thing to say." Amazingly, the %0.1 view was correct in this passage, as the "theologian nerds" made a mistake; God literally died and rose again 3 days later! The Temple was himself, and the building back up was also himself. Interesting. I didn't see that coming. Oh wait, yes I did. This is also the case with the word "Pre-destination". In the Greek pre-destination just means to destinate something before hand. If I want to go to New York next week, I can pre-destine myself to go there today. God pre-destined everyone to Heaven, as it's clearly written in 2 Peter, but Calvinists get around it with word play. What if pre-destine was actually a 150 word definition in God's eyes, not what the original Greek says? What if by Pre-destine God actually loaded a lot of awesome entropy layers of love and creativity into it? Would the Calvinists care? Would the Calvinists think it's possible? An analogy God gave me weeks ago was this A letter comes down from the sky and it says from God "I want you 3 to run to the store and pick up some milk." They have 15 minutes to interpret it John interprets this to mean that we should all get into the car and go to SAFEWAY Amy says that we should drive to LUCKY's (another store) James (a Calvinist) is pissed. In the Greek the word "Run" means "to use one's legs to travel distance". James insists that we should run to the store, not drive. Let me guess, we should also pick up the milk too? Like literally, pick it up? I mean it doesn't say "buy" the milk does it? In reality, God is laughing, as the correct interpretation is this: I want you guys to LOVE each other... and LOVE me... God's interpretation of Scripture is so much better! Notice how God has a really loose view of HIS OWN WORD?? Wow... All of his verses should be viewed in the light of Love and Justice, and not just justice, and not just love. Hell is really bad, but it's not as bad as it should be because of God's mercy MIXED IN with his Justice. When Adam sinned, he should of went to hell, but he was given a promise, and when Lucifer sinned, he should of been immediately punished, but he was given a world to be god over through God's mercy and creativity. God is so merciful, and regardless of man's wicked theology injected into the Bible (Calvinism), God will stay like that. Sure God is anti-evil, but he isn't infinite in his anti-evil the way he is infinite in some of his other attributes. "Free Will" is an ongoing debate, and I take a hard stance that all sides are wrong, but I lean Free Will. Check this out: Right this second, we are in the presence of the Imagination of Jesus Christ. I hope that makes you feel better. Calvinism closes doors that shouldn't be closed in order to protect God's maximums while denying philosophical brilliancies that might be onto something. The God of Calvinism is very literal and very black and white. We know that God isn't that cool because the Bible says the Bible says the Bible says the Bible says John Calvin talked about singular pre-destination theories that will boggle the mind (in the worst ways). They aren't creative and makes this life out to be a Movie that God scripted and is watching and can't/won't change. Human Life is closer to a complex sporting event between God's Justice and God's Mercy where we are the Athletes and he is the coach, fan, referee, and Owner than it is a Calvinistic puppet show with "no maverick molecules". God is a loving, gracious, creative, infinitely awesome meticulous artist, but he isn't a psychotic power hungry egotistical control freak too. Not entirely.
When I contemplate the sovereignty of God I see the absolute ability to give full sovereignty over to created beings in His image. God not pre-determining who shall be saved by divine fiat is a greater sovereignty level than Calvinistic extrapolations. We are after all *poof! You Exist! ex nihilo hence the frightening level of hate that atheists extend to God because they were even made. Their thinking is... "if I can't eat of all the fruit that I want however I want and I still have to make this ultimate eternal life threatening decision to accept and love God yet if I don't I'm damned!? Then I hate God for even making me!" that's their reasoning. I was an enemy of God as well until he drew me to Himself. It has taken twenty years and I even went back to MN while you, John, were still at Bethel. Yet I chose to be the servant and seek a heavenly home. Why cannot the unbeliever believe like me? Because God picked me outta a bunch? Nah! Maybe. I love the paradoxical rendering of eternity starting from a certain point as a being just born on the edge of infinity. However the paradox of free will isn't one I will concur with you on.
*WHY IS THE DOCTRINE OF DECREES SO OFTEN OBFUSCATED?* That doctrine which is *DISTINCTIVE* of Calvinism - was clearly enunciated by John Calvin himself. The doctrine decrees John Calvin -quote The creatures...are so governed by the secret counsel of god, that NOTHING HAPPENS but what he has knowingly and willingly decreed. (Institutes, 1, Chp 16, Par. 3) Thus Adam was NOT PERMITTED to NOT eat the fruit - because NOT eating the fruit was NOT knowingly and willingly decreed Calvinist Robert R. McLaughlin -quote "god merely *PROGRAMMED* into the divine decrees all our thoughts, motives, decisions and actions"(The Doctrine of Divine Decree pg 4) Thus Adams thoughts, motives and decisions were limited to an infallible *PROGRAM* which permits no ALTERNATIVE thoughts, motives, and decisions. Paul Helms -quote Not only is every atom and molecule, *EVERY THOUGHT AND DESIRE* kept in being by god, but every twist and turn of each of these is under the *DIRECT CONTROL* of god (The Providence of God pg 22) Thus the thoughts and desires within Adam's brain were determined by a mind external to his - who granted *NO ALTERNATIVE* thoughts and desires - because the infallible decree by definition - permits no ALTERNATIVES of itself. It doesn't take much to understand - why the doctrine of decrees - which is the KEY DISTINCTIVE of Calvinism - is OBFUSCATED within explanations of "What is Calvinism"
While I absolutely believe God causes/ordains/determines some things. I don’t believe He causes everything to happen. In Jeremiah 19:5 God says, "People built places to sacrifice their children (in fire) to foreign gods, and He (God) says, "I did NOT COMMAND this, nor did it enter my mind." My contention is with people like John Piper who says, every single thing that happens on planet earth is caused by God. He gives the example of tiny dust particles in a beam of light. Piper says God controls the very movement of each tiny particle. Or James White who has said, "If a man brutally rapes a young girl, God caused it. If not, then it was a meaningless, random act." Jeff Durbin says, God is not partially sovereign, He is not half-sovereign, He is sovereignly sovereign. Meaning, like Piper and White, every single thing that happens is caused by God. If you follow that logic through, you have God saying to Adam and Eve, "Do not eat from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil..." and then He causes them to do that very thing. You have God saying, "Have no other gods before me." AND then He makes countless billions worship Allah, Buddha, or one of the three hundred million Hindu gods. Again, if you carry this through, you have God, who is LOVE, who is Holy and Righteous, causing, murder, rape, child molestation, drugs, alcohol, prostitution, human trafficking, not to mention, the belief in atheism. Allowing something to happen, UNTIL it is dealt with on Judgment Day, is NOT the same as causing it to happen.
Calvinism is a doctrine that was developed to keep the door open to the Catholic way of salvation (baptismal salvation), they just add a predestined/elected flavour. I grew up in Dutch Reformed family, and broke free the tulip web. It is sad how people choose such perversions above the plain gospel message of by believing who Jesus is, how He saved you, and following Him. FYI: the Armenian straw man was set up by Calvinists to make it look like the better option.
I now attend a Dutch reformed Church and very happy to be in it. Calvinism is definitely biblical after much research. It's Calvinism that gets very easily misunderstood not to mention the countless straw men against it. Reformed theology does not teach baptismal regeneration.
so John, God picks and chooses who is saved or not? That is what most hear and it seems to sound like to me when I ponder Calvinism. That seems to be limited in God's sovereignty: That he could not create a being like him with complete free will. Faith as tiny as a mustard seed does flourish into a giant tree given enough time, but our will is sovereign as well. Image like, however, not being God, we are to submit to the Most High and nurture what we were by grace given.
If Calvin's God is completely sovereign and powerful then he can change his own character at will. He can choose to lie and be dishonest and call it "good" and force his weak followers to agree. He could write a book full of lies and tell people it's true. By definition, we can't trust Calvin's god. He does what he wants like a Divine narcissistic man-child. No thanks.
Nothing could be more clear and ultimately liberating than what the Scriptures teach about God’s sovereignty and His unconditional and beautiful grace in our salvation! Glory to God!
Mark Savin He’s full blown Calvinist. Probably one of the most consistent ones. He would say that God is controlling our every move. Even a child rapist only does what God ordains him to do and had no choice in the matter. I know. It’s a super wicked doctrine. God bless
Marty Blackman Maybe we could check out scripture to test all things and hold fast to that which is good. Does regeneration precede faith according to Calvinism?
@Ghost In The Shell's The Laughing Man one that's been faithfully translated. A lot of translations say servant instead of slave because translators didn't like the word, but the original word meant slave. The word is used around 150 times in the New Testament so it's important to understand it correctly, irrespective of the denomination you're following.
First John 2:2 And He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only, but for the sins of the whole world. First Timothy 2:4 God is not willing that any should perish, but that all would come to the knowledge of the truth and be saved. Second Peter 3:9. John 3:16-18 For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, Jesus, that WHOSOEVER, believeth in Him, should not perish but have everlasting life. Jesus said it, we believe it, and that settles it. John Piper is a false teacher. Matthew 7:15-23. The gospel. First Corinthians 15:1-4. That Christ died for our sins, according to the scriptures, that he was buried and rose again on the third day, according to the scriptures. When we believe that gospel we are sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise. Ephesians 1:13-14. Our guarantee of eternal life. Galatians 1:6-9 Though we or an angel from heaven preach any other gospel unto you that that we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I again. If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received from us, let him be accursed. Calvinism is a false gospel of works salvation. Not the free gift of God by faith alone in Jesus finished work on the cross alone apart from our works which can not save sinners. Romans 6:23 Ephesians 2:8-9. First John 5:13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God, that ye may KNOW YE HAVE ETERNAL LIFE. Gods word.
No, we are commanded to believe the gospel. First Corinthians 15:1-4. And then love one another. Colossians 2:13 We have been forgiven all trespasses. John 3:18. John 6:40. And this is the will of Him who sent me, that ALL that seeth the Son, and believeth on Him, may have everlasting life, and I will raise him up on the last day.
What a good God he is.
Really, Mat?
Is God good to the nonelect?
20july1944 That he would save any of us is pure grace. We all deserve eternal punishment. He created good and evil and does what he will. We cannot say that anything he does isn’t good because we are the ones with the flawed and sinful minds. He is perfect beyond our comprehension. How can we decide what is the right thing for God to do? I thank God every day for plucking me from death for reasons that I will never understand on this earth. God is good. Whether a sinner sees that or not doesn’t change his goodness.
Mat:
But God creates the nonelect out of cruelty (i.e. the pleasure of causing them punitive suffering), right?
In thanking God for plucking you from death, do you consider your fellow vermin who aren't so lucky?
20july1944 I know how hard it is to get to the point where you accept that there are things we can’t understand about God. “For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, declares the Lord. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts.”
Isaiah 55:8-9
We have to understand that God does what is perfectly right regardless of how it may seem to our narrow minds. God doesn’t find pleasure in damning people. There will not be anyone in hell that does not deserve to be there and there will not be anyone in heaven that deserves to be there. “For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,”
Ephesians 2:8
We cannot fathom how God can choose people to live and people to die, but that is not for us to understand. God in his infinite wisdom does what is right. We are to merely obey his word and trust in him completely. If you are struggling currently with your relationship with God because you cannot understand his ways, I encourage you to pray to him and ask that he reveal to you in his word everything that you can fathom and then rest in the fact that he is sovereign and you will not worry about what we can’t understand. I’m praying for you, my friend!
Mat:
_"We cannot fathom how God can choose people to live and people to die, but that is not for us to understand."_
Are your fellow vemin who are nonelect worthy of love?
Do you love them?
No one understands God’s 100%, He is endless, infinite, unconditionally graceful but sovereign over everything in Christ, thru Christ, because of Christ~ so Christ is not an option to believe! Thank you JP
www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Doctrines/Lordship%20Salvation/macarthur_mormon.htm
I was predestinated before the foundation of the world not to be a Calvinist and I use my free will to reject Arminianism
This is the best comment wver
Haha awesome indeed!
And yet that proves Calvinism.
So are you antinomian?
In Jeremiah 19:5 God says, “They have built the high places of Baal to burn their children in the fire as offerings to Baal-something I did NOT COMMAND or mention, nor did it enter my mind.” 2nd Peter 3:9 says, “The Lord is…not willing that ANY should perish but that ALL should come to repentance.” and yet, it also has Jesus saying, "Broad is the road that leads to destruction (hell) and many are on it, but straight and narrow is the road that leads to life (Heaven) and few ever find it."
We MUST read ALL of Romans, NOT just Romans 6 and 7 which, when read by themselves, can make a christian think they will always be controlled by the flesh. The answer is found next door in Romans chapter 8. Romans 8:12-13 tells us we are no longer under obligation to the flesh once we are saved. Paul said in 1 Corinthians 15:31, "I die daily." It's a choice everybody.
Mason Lindskog amen
The question is how does one die daily? By the grace of God.
Exactly. As my dad would say, move your thumb and keep reading.
Galatians 2:21, “I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.”
@Mason Lindskog Only one who is OF Christ will persist till the last day. Because of God awakening me, do I choose Him daily. No foundation can be made against God, whom has chosen some over others before the foundation of the world. Only those who can choose, whom persist, whom the Father knew before the foundation of the world, will be with Him to glorify Him, as none have the foundation to stand against His judgement. Non-Calvinists often don't like the fact that God is in absolute control over EVERYTHING. Often the criticism of "I wouldn't want to worship a God who 'arbitrarily' chooses whom to save" is the point. From our own choice, we wouldn't choose God. The choice TO choose Him, is BECAUSE of God Himself.
All glory to God MEANS "ALL" glory to God.
Else those who won the lottery, a random chance, a roll of the dice, did anyone get saved, not because of God, but you just got lucky. Sad world view of a false Gospel.
The gospel was made plain and simple so that even the simplest person could understand it... Christ came to redeem us and to show us our need for him. He pointed out the evil in our heart compared to His goodness and His holiness. He died to take our punishment upon himself. But death could not have victory over him, rather he overcame death. And because He has overcome death we too have been given that victory. If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, YOU WILL BE SAVED!! It doesn’t mean that the next day you’ll wake up a brainwashed person “programmed” to do only good things. But what it means is that a work has started in your heart. You are being restored into the image that God originally intended for you. Stop scaring people and giving them anxiety about their salvation by telling them they might not being one of God’s elect... He said “behold I stand at the door and Knock,” he isn’t knocking at the door of some, but he is knocking on all our hearts, we can either ignore it or open it. God will hold us accountable for our CHOICES!! Love is a CHOICE, it’s soooo plain, and it’s sooo simple to understand! Christ already won the victory, we can either accept his victory or reject! And in the end he will hold us accountable for our choices. I simply don’t see how God could hold you or me accountable for something we didn’t have the ability to choose... I like John Piper but this is one video that I have to disagree with 🤔
What has come to be known as "Calvinism" came from Augustine's attempt to explain how infants could become the "elect" through water baptism. Since the child had not come to faith, it must be based on the will of another. It could have nothing to do with the will of the child. See the following from Dr. Ken Wilson's research of the writings of Augustine on Leighton Flowers UA-cam channel. "Was Augustine the first to introduce "CALVINISM" into the Church?" ua-cam.com/video/BnOMORGM2Qw/v-deo.html
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@@SpotterVideo I knew about halfway through that you sounded like Leighton. Dang. No offense, brother, but that man spends his life denigrating calvinism instead of edifying the body. Augustine is not the founder of Calvinism. In fact, what you call Calvinism, I call the entire teaching of John, Paul, and Peter. If you take any of the epistles, and you attempt to map out "who is doing, has done, or will do", you will arrive at the reformed position of sotereology. It's very easy to swallow, by a simple plain reading of the text. Also, if you just simply look at God's sovereignty in the OT... the way in which He called Israel, how He uses nations to pass judgement, how His decisions are fixed in eternity past... read the Psalms. Read Job. Read Exodus. Read Judges, Chronicles, Kings... you cannot escape the absolute sovereignty of God in the world. Yet, you also cannot overlook the responsibility that God also places on evil men and women.
Why does He do it that way? You don't know. I don't know. The best answer is that you, a creation, do not have the right to ask the Creator why He made you the way He did (Rom 9:20). If He wants to make a vessel for honor and vessels for wrath, He's God. You simply have to look in awe and tremble at the absolute grace of God to save anyone at all.
Leighton will not deal with these texts because he can't. Just look at his debate with James White on Romans 9 and how he dances from text to text, never addressing the debate topic. I do not care if you are a calvinist or not. I want people to know and love Christ to the utmost.
Read ephesians 1, particularly focus on WHY God chose us before the foundation of the world (Eph 1:4) and predestined us to adoption through Jesus Christ (v. 5). It's ALL due to the kind intention of His will (v.5), and for His glory alone (v. 6). Verses 11 and 12 come to the same conclusion as well.
I'm assuming you're a brother in Christ. If so, let's find the things that unify us and stop letting the world see us all bickering over our faith. If you're a believer, you believe that Christ saved you by grace, through faith (Eph 2:8).
Lovingly, if you're having a hard time believing that we "calvinists" are fellow brothers, I would challenge you to a plain reading of the first 3 chapters in Ephesians. There are plenty other long blocks of Scripture that lay out the reformed position, but nowhere else is the gospel so plainly, yet beautifully explained, in such a concise 3 chapter block.
@Ghost In The Shell's The Laughing Man you're born headed to hell. Can you boast if you've made a better choice than someone? If you "get it" and others don't?
"For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast."
Ephesians 2:8-9
@Ghost In The Shell's The Laughing Man
@Ghost In The Shell's The Laughing Man with respect brother, where are you getting your theology from, in the Scriptures? I'm giving you some texts to look at and you're giving me the stuff I heard rationalized to me when I was young, but I can't find that in the Bible. Just real quick, go read Romans 9. Read Ephesians 1-2. Read John 6, John 15. John 10:26, John 8:47, John 17.
Jesus did not die for everyone to come to repentance. His death means that people from every nation, tribe and tongue can be saved. Anyone who calls on the name of Christ can be saved. However, “There are some of you who do not believe.” (For Jesus knew from the beginning who those were who did not believe, and who it was who would betray him.) And he said, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.” (John 6:64-65).
I think you may be thinking of John 12:32, where Jesus says that he draws all people to himself? Well, actually no, it doesn’t say that. It says more literally, “I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all to myself” (John 12:32). Which could mean all people who are “my sheep” (John 10:16, 27) or all people who are “the children of God” (John 11:52) or all people who belong to the Father (John 17:6).
Look into these things. You were dead in your sins, but God. Not a salvation issue but it does provide greater awe of the glorious Triune God
@@dmeek20 we've just been having this same conversation with this person on another post. The provided nothing from scripture, in fact highlighted that they have a limited understanding of it.
Forget all the terminology “Calvinism” “reformed” … what JP is talking about is just what scripture teaches us. Our choice to put faith in Christ is a very important part of the process but it’s not to belittle how God is great and worked in our hearts. If you reject the predestination of a Holy and Soverign God in this process, you reject scripture. It’s beautiful and should give all believers assurance and as a young believer it is incredibly comforting to me knowing that it’s not just my will that saves me because I sin all the time. it’s his grace and Love. To God be the glory!
❤well said pastor
Now that you have told what Calvinism is, will you tell now what is christianity?
Christianity is the belief and faith that the Bible is true.
Calvinism theology is from the Bible.
Change your mind about how you are living, Repent of sin first then you show evidence of faith to believe
Go on to be water baptized and recieve the Holy Spirit.
Anyone who claims repenting of sin is works will die in unrepentant sin.
Revelation 21:7
Nothing impure will ever enter it, nor will anyone who does what is shameful or deceitful, but only those whose names are written in the Lamb’s book of life
Thanks for the free books on your website!
Calvinism is dangerous. It has another god, another christ, and another gospel. I was a Calvinist for over 20 years and now i reject Calvinism and its false teachers.
T-Totally confusing
U-Unfounded assumptions
L-Lack of biblical authority
I-Idolatrous philosophy
P-Perversions of the Gospel
This is how Calvinism rejects the authority of Scripture
This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires ALL PEOPLE to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom FOR ALL, which is the testimony given at the proper time. (emphasis added)
1 Timothy 2:3-6
Sadly, the Bible is not the Calvinists authority, Calvinism is the Calvinist's authority. So when they come across 1 Timothy 2:3-6, they must ignore what the Bible actually says and play Calvinist word games to tell you what the Bible meant to say, because apparently God is so stupid that He can't communicate, so it takes a Calvinist to tell us what the Bible really means.
So to the Calvinist, when the Bible clearly and explicitly says that "God desires ALL PEOPLE to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth" what God really means is that God desires only the elect to be saved and come to knowlege of the truth.
And when the Bible clearly and explicitly says, "Jesus Christ gave Himself as a ransom FOR ALL," what God really means is that Jesus Christ gave Himself as a ransom for the elect.
[The Bible-God's Word] This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires ALL PEOPLE to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom FOR ALL, which is the testimony given at the proper time. (emphasis added)
1 Timothy 2:3-6
[Calvinism-Man's philosophy] This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who DECREED BEFORE THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD FOR THE ELECT to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and THE ELECT, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for THE ELECT, which is the testimony given at the proper time. (emphasis added)
1 Timothy 2:3-6
Do you see how Calvinism just carelessly throws the authority of Scripture under the bus and replaces God's Word with the vain philosophy and empty words of Calvinism?
Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
Colossians 2:8
This is another example, and there are many, of how Calvinist's must throw Scriptural authority under the bus in order to defend Calvinism and not God's Word.
This is what the Bible says.....
[Bible-God's Word] For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
John 3:16 KJV
According to the Calvinist, this is what John 3:16 means to them
[Calvinism-Man's philosophy] For God so loved THE ELECT, that he gave his only begotten Son, that THOSE CHOSEN FOR SALVATION BEFORE THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD, should not perish, but have everlasting life, AFTER THEY ARE EFFECTUALLY CALLED AND GIVEN THE ABILITY TO HAVE FAITH.
John 3:16
Do you see the difference between God's Word and Calvinism?
In the Bible, God loves everyone and wants everyone to be saved, Christ died for everyone, and we can choose to accept or reject God's gift of salvation made available to all. That's what the Bible says. But Calvinists don't care what the Bible says, and wrongly teaches that God loves some and hates others, that we have no free will to choose God's gift of salvation, that God doesn't want everyone to be saved, and Christ didn't die for everyone. As i mentioned before, Calvinism has a different god, a different christ, and a different gospel.
I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel- not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.
Galatians 1:6-9
Since rejecting Calvinism ive since adopted the Provisionist view of Soteriology, elucidated by Leighton Flowers from Soteriology 101. It is the view most faithful to Scriptural authority and God's character. I suggest anyone to visit his channel
You lost all credibility sir when you brought up choice meats open theorist Leighton to table
I dissagree only with the last part of John's statement hete about the freewill. Election and freewill do not contradict oneanother, they are the same from different perspectives. When Pharoah's heart was hardened by God he was not like a robot with no freewill. So, he could not say to God, it wasn't my fault because you predestined my response. The clay does not instruct the potter. This is the awe inspiring majesty of God and the mystery of his ways which are much higher than the ways of man.
Calvinism meaning......Some lives matter. Jesus according to John Calvin
Jesus meaning......All lives matter. Jesus according to Jesus
Nagy Calvinism, like all reformed routes, don't trust in works. Maybe read Calvin's institutes to discover what how much God you'll find and how little devil is in there.
@Nagy Erno I'm a Calvinist, I can't talk for others but in general no we do not. We don't even take credit for anything we do good because that all belongs to God and He deserves every drop of glory.
@intothekey Amen All Glory To God! Thank You Jesus! ✝️ 🙏
In Jeremiah 19:5 God says, “They have built the high places of Baal to burn their children in the fire as offerings to Baal-something I did NOT COMMAND or mention, nor did it enter my mind.” 2nd Peter 3:9 says, “The Lord is…not willing that ANY should perish but that ALL should come to repentance.” and yet, it also has Jesus saying, "Broad is the road that leads to destruction (hell) and many are on it, but straight and narrow is the road that leads to life (Heaven) and few ever find it."@@HearGodsWord
@@Mike-qt7jp not sure why you're addressing me
All the Good things comes from God , wisdom , knowledge , love , mercy , faithfulness , forgiveness , patience all good in us is from God nothing ours. All bad things is from us hate , lust , lieing, curruption, jealousy, envy , desires of body etc.. Nothing good in us we are useless. Praise the God for Giving us all of this, but not all have it. So praise Him for giving your goodness in you coz its not your own but God's.
We are His chosen sheeps, lets go astray no more and glorify His name in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. Who gave His life on the cross in behalf of us so that we the lost sheeps of the God will become righteous and He became sinner in behalf of us. The innocent Holy being came on earth to die for our sins as God's Lamb so that we will live eternity in His and our Father presence forever and ever in His Holy promise land. Amen
Amen Thank You Jesus! ✝️ 🙏❤️
Time Stamp 4:57 - 5:22
God has NO Needs. He is NOT needy.
Thus God would have No need to create millions of people ( possibly billions of them ) so as to damn them in eternal suffering & torment.
He can have No need of it for He is Self-Sufficient and Complete within Himself.
He can have No wants either because wants only reveal need. God would have had all the glory that was indeed possible within Himself throughout all of eternity past.
Calvinism / Reformed Theology makes No sense Rationally Nor Morally.
To create "specific people" so as to only damn them for all of eternity future - for trillions and trillions and trillions of years ad infinitim is unspeakably Immoral and Unnecessary.
It is far too easy to show why Calvinism is Immoral.
It is far too easy to show why Calvinism is False.
how about i use the Bible and prove how false it is . and how it is in error ?
TheMirabillis AMEN
Matheus Borges Have you read the Bible lol
bshurdhi9491 Well, Romans 8:29 says God foreknew all of us who would be saved, thus he knew us personally and loved the elect unconditionally(since of course God knew everybody who would ever exist before creation started and is not suggesting EVERYONE is saved), so He predestined us to salvation.
Are you teaching Christians about authentic Calvinism or New Calvinism?
Dude can you just say what calvinism is..
I sat there waiting and waiting for an answer . just say calvinism is the belief in _________ . just fill in the blank . reads half the bible and I'm still lost.
@@migueliniguez9145 that’s John Piper in a nutshell for you
No, he can’t.
I’m a Christian. But if God forces me to love Him and gives no free will. I do not want to serve Him. And yes, that is my free will talking. The free will He loved me enough to give. The free will in which I choose to love Him with as well.
I’m glad your a Christian first off.
John 8:34
[34] Jesus answered them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, whoever commits sin is a slave of sin.
Surely you’ve sinned as well as all of us have. How free is your free will when the Bible claims you’re a slave to sin ?
Yet as a Christian you are now a slave to righteousness.
Romans 6:18
[18] And having been set free from sin, you became slaves of righteousness.
Can a slave to sin opt not to sin?
Can a slave of righteousness opt to not serve God righteously?
You sound as if your free will trumps your slavery to sin or righteousness and you can opt out of either anytime you want?
Let me prove your free will ain’t so free, choose not to sin if you think you can…when you realize you can’t stop sinning you’ll realize just how little free will you have.
@@Mattissaved Even after one becomes a Christian (calvinist or not) you still struggle with self control and discipline. A calvinist doesn't magically have his struggles settled, you still have to make an effort.
@@luke31ish
No doubt Luke…I think the only man to ever have true Libertarian free will was Jesus. He had no capability to speak falsehoods or believe in something not true ( you & I do possess this capability )
I also believe the definition of Free will is not the power of contrary choice. Jesus didn’t have the ability of contrary choice because he was truly free…he could not attain to any falsehoods or speak lies, he was indeed free….you & I are a mixed bag, we can & do grievous sins and errors and yet we can also attain to the truth of Gods Word & learn from it ( sanctification )
we're all slaved to something
What about Molinism?
The one thing I will say is, God does not create anyone and send them to Hell. We seem to think as humans that no one deserves Hell. That is where we are mistaken, we all deserve Hell. We have forgotten that none are good, we were completely without hope without the grace of God.
The unfair thing isn’t the fact that one gets into Heaven and one doesn’t, the true unfair thing is that any get into Heaven because all are undeserving. Why God would “choose” someone whatever that may be, God can do whatever He pleases and He is still good!
Rather we have complete free will in our salvation or rather we are chosen, God is still good and is the only reason salvation is possible
Thank you for letting my eyes see the TRUTH. I was a recently reborn Christian and I was even questioning God's Righteousness, a fool of me, a sinner who even dares questions His Mercy and Grace. Thank you so much for clearing my mind with questionable thoughts. ❤
I think we have all been there right beside you in questioning Gods infinite wisdom and grace!!! But praise Him for his forgiveness! Keep your head up and keep pressing on!! Love you in Christ Jesus our Lord!
So what's the short summary of Calvinism
Lol I know. There is no such thing actually. If you summarize it then it sounds ridiculous, but if you take two hours to explain it then it sounds “deep”.
I guess it comes down to this question though; what are we responsible for in our salvation? What do you take credit for in that process? The Calvinist would say I didn’t do anything, it was all Gods grace. then others would say they had free will and did the work to make the choice to be saved, then God saved them.
The other points in Calvinism are easy other than that.
@@criticaltheist3992 thank you for that
Calvinism is the belief that God, before creation, in his total sovereign control over everything, arbitrarily decided who he would save from hell and who he wouldn’t. He ordained the fall so he could do this. Why? So that he could display all of his perfections, including mercy, justice, wrath, love, etc... Is Calvinism correct Christianity? No.
God is completely sovereign and does what He wants and what He wills. He has mercy on whom He wills. He saves whomever He desires to save.
Calvinism:
1. God accomplishes all his purposes.
2.Salvation is of the Lord.
Could you please explain what is dispensationalism?
According to this, I'm not saved. No matter how bad I want to trust Christ, believe, accept, call on and ask Jesus to save me, I'm going to burn in Hell. I'm not free from my sins. I continue to commit the same sin over, and over again. So it's a good thing I don't believe in Calvinism. I'm not Armenian either. I'm a "Whosoever will may come", and a "God is not willing that any should parish, but that all should come to repentance" type of guy.
Straw man argument. We are all completely dead in our sins, no one desires God, no not one. Not one person is gonna say on judgement day, "I wanted to come to you but I couldn't." Those people loved their sin and cherished it; they hate God and did not want his gift of salvation
I'm a year late, but do you still think you're not saved?
In Jeremiah 19:5 God says, “They have built the high places of Baal to burn their children in the fire as offerings to Baal-something I did NOT COMMAND or mention, nor did it enter my mind.” 2nd Peter 3:9 says, “The Lord is…not willing that ANY should perish but that ALL should come to repentance.” and yet, it also has Jesus saying, "Broad is the road that leads to destruction (hell) and many are on it, but straight and narrow is the road that leads to life (Heaven) and few ever find it."@@fireflames3639
Thanks God! You are so beautifull.
Galatians 2:21, “I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.”
That sounds like the Scripture to me. Why is the Scripture labelled as Calvinism? Schism? That's all YaHuWaH's Word 🙌🏾🙌🏾
Though Calvin may have been used of God in the past, he was not perfect; not 💯. So I'd rather see Scripture through Christ's point of view, and be labelled as His. We have His Spirit, and we have His mind ("the mind of Christ"). He's our common ground, and the source of our unity.
I agree. I think Calvinism are a subset of explanations of doctrines. I think the reason it is distinguished is because they're so controversial and so many people don't believe it. So I don't call myself a Calvinist but I agree with all 5 points.
Since we don't need to believe Calvinism and follow it to be SAVE (only born again Christians from ALL denominations will be saved) then I guess we NON CALVINISTS were predestined (if God has DECREED ALL THINGS , according to Calvinism, then God has DECREED our rejection of Calvinism AS WELL) by Jehovah God to reject both Calvinism and Arminianism and YET BE SAVED.I am a 1-saved by the blood of the Lamb and His resurrection by Grace through Faith 2- bible believing Christian 3-NON_CALVINIST AND NON ARMINIAN AND PROUD OF IT.
I'm personally not a calvinist because I feel like God died for the sins of the whole world. God loved me while I was yet a sinner and we are to love others that hate us just like God did when we were yet evil.
John 1:29 says Jesus died for the sins of the world. Calvinists believe this. Dig deeper into their history and writings. Matthew Henry’s commentary would good to see what they say. Even Calvin himself it might surprise you because they do believe that Jesus died for the sins of the world but only the elect (believing ones) are saved through propitiation. The Bible teaches the complete sovereignty of God in all things His providence is woven through all of creation and human actions but we make real choices and decisions that we’re responsible for. There’s a tension there but the Bible teaches both and when you can accept that for what it is it makes things very practical for life and application to the believer. I can give you many examples if you want proof.
Question, So at one point The teachings of Calvanism didn't exist?? It all started with John Calvin? What was taught before about free will and Salvation ??
No John Calvin did not invent the ideas he taught. St. Augustine (4th century) taught the same doctrine. John Calvin admired Augustine a lot.
The biblical understanding of our will is found in Romans 3, and 1 Corinthians 1 & 2.
There sure are lots of people in this comment section calling the theological beliefs of their Brethren wicked. Let's not be so quick to throw around weighty words.
And on the flip side, let's not inject our American, western, individualistic culture into soteriology. There are extremely valid arguments for reformed theology and against the arminian stance. Keep perspective and major in the majors... Christ!
Sadly, my brothers in the reformed camp do the same to y'all, but guys, we agree that whosoever believes will not perish.
These debates and discussions should seek to edify the body and glorify Christ. You say our theology is wicked, but it could truly be boiled down to simply this: we believe it is all of Christ.
If we claim Christ then we should continuously pray for discernment. We should pray for our brothers. We should beg Christ to teach us new things from Scripture each day. And we should remain humble in dealing with those brothers on the other side.
www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Doctrines/Lordship%20Salvation/macarthur_mormon.htm
@@alredesmit3560 sorry... that's not at all what JMac believes. He believes in Christ alone, by grace alone, through faith alone. You have to be familiar with one's entire body of work to represent them well. He is obviously talking about the evidence/fruit of one's faith. Check out James 2 verses 17-18 and then verse 26. Sorry, I've listened to and read tons of John MacArthur and this is not at all a fair representation of what he believes actually saves someone.
What he's getting at is the idea that one may say "the sinner's prayer" (which is a made up, non-biblical idea), and enter heaven 50 years later just because of that prayer. Your life - the taking off of the old man, and the putting on of the new - is the assurance of your salvation. Did you get baptized when you were 9, then live a life of debauchery for 70 years? You're not saved. Your actions prove your salvation.
That is the exact stance John MacArthur would take.
Again, let's not be so quick to destroy the unity that the Holy Spirit has given us through our common salvation. We should be fighting against liberalism, health and wellness gospel, therapeutic gospel, gay "marriage", etc., instead of misrepresenting brothers who have done more for the faith than we could ever dream. That's not displaying the fruit of the spirit. Check out ephesians 4 and contrast the Gentiles (old life) with the new life.
Christianity is not reduced to a dunking at age 9, it's evidenced by a life of submission to Christ where our obedience to His commands proves that we are in right relationship with Him
Your comment is a year old, but it's the most Christlike one I've seen browsing through the others posted. So much mudslinging and so many accusations of heresy does nothing to edify. We all have brothers and sisters in Christ on both sides of this issue. I've grown in the grace and knowledge of Christ over the past year, studying the Word, and come to think of myself as Reformed more and more, but I would never want to condemn anyone without good reason. If we have common ground in the core doctrines of the faith, we are in the body. God hates this sort of divisiveness.
@@mortified_penguin2355 yes! Common ground in the core doctrines. There is a time to push back against heresy, but not everything we disagree with is heresy. I hope you are well. Continue in the faith, brother.
Thanks for your comments, Mike and Daniel. I'm a babe in Christ yet, not sure what I believe. Freewill when contrasted with prophesy, foreordination, and God's Sovereign Will seems rather paradoxical to me.
Oh, how unsearchable are His ways. God is truly great. Praise Christ!
Describe Calvinism as simply as possible, * Proceeds to ramble for 10 minutes.
Calvinism is just wrong. Pastor John skated around the point. There are NO elect and predestined. Christ died for ALL and all are called but few are chosen because only a few actually say yes! Not all get saved but that’s their choice not their fate. Calvinism is very unbiblical and is heresy.
Thank you. I agree to wha you say. God gave his only Son Jesus so that everybody who believes in Jesus can be saved (John 3,16). It's a choice by free will. I admit that it is too complex for me to understand because I am living in the western world. We do at least have churches, free churches, access to bible, you could have religion in school and some other stuff. Other countries don't have that at all. I hope and want to believe that God is just and merciful and that everybody who wants to get saved, will get the opportunity to do so.
I strongly dislike the thought of some people being predestined and preselected. Even if you could make the biblical case / find arguments that God knows who will be saved and who won't etc., I think this thought construct drives people further away from the loving God. Nobody likes arrogant people. Nobody likes people who consider themselves the select over others.
I personally think that i shouldn't think that I was preselected because I am something special or whatever I could think I am. I should believe that God saved me through his Son Jesus by grace alone. And that I'm no better than other people and I didn't deserve salvation more than others. In my case, I "simply" was a bit lucky despite all the traumatic events that some aspects of my life lead me to finding the truth.
But as we all know, one can live his entire life of like 60 or 80 years without ever doing any research if God exists, if the bible is right, what is the meaning of life, if there is judgement after death and all the many "standard" question you can ask yourself. A man can go from being lost to being saved.
@@SavedByGrace_CitizenEmperorユウ yes! Ur absolutely right...anyone who calls upon His name for salvation shall be saved. I dnt understand the predestination argument. So someone who confesses their sins and repents and does everything the Bible says might not be saved bc they aren’t part of the elect? So everything the Bible says is a lie. It does not say “you shall be saved IF you are part of the elect” no it says “you shall be saved.” And God tells us to love our enemies and to love everyone. Does God require something of us that He does not even do Himself? Bc I have had calvinists tell me God doesn’t love everyone equally. There are so many flaws with their theory it boggles my mind how a true Christian could believe this nonsense. It’s sad really. Imagine going through life thinking that you are part of a special group that God loves more than everybody else. How entitled and obnoxious! How do these ppl even reconcile that they are truly one of the elect? How could they know... maybe they’re not.
Amen
Nope lol
According to the Bible, Jesus died for them who believes in him not for all. If your saying he died for all your saying there are people in hell who sins were paid for and that the blood of christ wasn't enough to save them. Cause we are not saved by our work but by his grace, Jesus sacrifice.
When you said that God can do as He pleases and He is sovereign when He does it, I think I felt a degree of doubt and thus, some degree of offense and in this I cry out. Because I hate the idea that I think God isn't sovereign as He is. God forgive me...
www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Doctrines/Lordship%20Salvation/macarthur_mormon.htm
this is so confusing...I just read the bible and love Jesus!!! why are there so many different theories to Jesus's love? T_T
How is it that God has given EVERYONE the ability to have faith in someone or something. Has given everyone the ability to worship. Has made it very clear how He hates idol and false god worship.
Yet our Creator, who created everyone with a soul in HIS own image, who LOVES His creation. Who is a jealous God has made it impossible for most to come to Him, to believe in Him, to place their faith in Him, to trust and obey Him. In limit atonement God never provided a Savior for most souls. But Jesus says He came to save the lost. He became a ransom for all, He didnt just die for our sins but for the whole world.
Love in gentle never forced. God loves His creation so dearly. He gave His only Son. He will never force us to love Him back. He has provided a Savior for all, Jesus is always knocking on the door, but He will not force Himself in. The gift of salavtion is avalible to everyone. The sad truth, not all want to be saved. Seek and you will find
Revelation 22:17 says, “Whosoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.” Calvinism, however says it actually means: The ones I (God) chose, will take of the water of life.
John 3:16 says, “For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.” Calvinism, however says this verse actually means: For God so loved the ones He chose, that He gave His only begotten Son, that those He chose WILL have everlasting life.
Joshua 24:15 says, “…choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve…But as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.” Calvinism, however says this verse actually means: There is no choice, rather, God will decide whether or not one will serve the Lord.
2nd Peter 3:9 says, “The Lord is…not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.” Calvinism, however, says this verse actually means: The Lord is not willing that any of the ones He has chosen should perish, but that all of the ones He has chosen should come to repentance.
Matthew6:8-10 says, “…therefore, pray: Our Father in heaven, Hallowed be Your name. Your kingdom come. Your will be done.” This is a prayer. If God’s will was already being done as per Calvinism, then why do we need to pray that it will happen?
Hebrews 3:12-14 says, “Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; but exhort one another daily, while it is called “Today,” lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end…” This is a call to not harden our hearts and depart from the living God, and to hold our confidence in Christ steadfast until the end. According to Calvinism, we can’t make that decision; God has already decided.
John 1:29 says, “The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, “Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!” Calvinism, however says this verse actually means: The Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the few that God has chosen.
1st Timothy 1:15 says, “This is a faithful saying …that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners…” Calvinism, however says this verse actually means: Jesus came into the world to save (ONLY) the sinners God has already chosen.
1ST John 19 says, “If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” Calvinism says, this verse really means, the ones He has chosen WILL confess their sins, and He is faithful and just to forgive them their sins and to cleanse them from all unrighteousness. Calvinism calls confession a synergistic work; meaning a work of faith added to what God has already done. Also, there is no IF in Calvinism.
Revelation 3:20 says, “Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me.” Calvinism says, this verse really means, “…when the one I have chosen hears my voice, he will open the door…”
Luke 13:3 says, “…unless you repent, you too will all perish.” It doesn’t say, “it doesn’t matter if you repent UNLESS I have already chosen you.”
Why would God choose someone else and not me ? That needs to be explained ?
Sun Flowery it says that those whom God foreknew He predestined so God predestined those who He knows choose Christ. The real question is why would God waste time on people He knows won’t ever bow to Christ Jesus? He knows all that was is and will be.
Valor Above All okAy i get it
Who are you, o human, to answer back to God
Yes little Johnny! Let me tell you about the Calvinists god....
We love you, little Johnny, but we accept the fact that God might not love you, and that He may have plans to send you to hell for your future sins. If you do find yourself one day burning in hell because He hasn’t elected to save you, just remember that we will always love you, even if God hates you.
Take comfort knowing that we are not like God.
We will be in heaven forever only because we were unconditionally chosen for salvation before we were born. That would be the only reason that we won’t be in hell with you if you find yourself there. It won’t be because of anything we did.
So also take comfort in knowing that. It may not seem fair, but who are we to judge God?
So again, if you find yourself in hell, remember that we will always love you as we forever worship the God who loved us but who hated you, the God who sent His Son to die for us but not for you.
Please, we ask, don’t let it bother you-if you find yourself in hell-that we love the God who hated you and showed you no mercy. We must accept the fact that God is sovereign, and He does what He pleases.
I know as Calvinists parents we should be more grateful for our own salvation! It’s like, ‘as long as our eternal destiny is secure, as long as our life is all planned out and taken care of by God, we shouldn’t give a damn about family, friends or anyone else!’
After all, the lost hate God because God first hated them. We as Calvinist parents should hate what god hates, but it is so hard, because we can’t help but love you little Johnny and our families and neighbours!
John Calvin Institutes proof texts:
“ God arranges all things by his sovereign counsel, in such a way that individuals are born, who are doomed from the womb to certain death and are to glorify him by their destruction.( John Calvin Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 23, Paragraph 6
“…salvation is freely offered to some while others are barred from access to it.” (John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 21, Paragraph 5)
“We call predestination God’s eternal decree, by which he compacted with himself what he willed to become of each man. For all are not created in equal condition; rather, eternal life is fore-ordained for some, eternal damnation for others.” (John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 21, Paragraph 5)
“…we say that God once established by his eternal and unchangeable plan those whom he long before determined once for all to receive into salvation, and those whom, on the other hand, he would devote to destruction…he has barred the door of life to those whom he has given over to damnation.”
(John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 21, Paragraph 7)
“The devil, and the whole train of the ungodly, are in all directions, held in by the hand of God as with a bridle, so that they can neither conceive any mischief, nor plan what they have conceived, nor how muchsoever they may have planned, move a single finger to perpetrate, unless in so far as he permits, nay unless in so far as HE COMMANDS, that they are not only bound by his fetters but are even FORCED to do him service” (John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 1, Chapter 17, Paragraph 11)
John Piper states it plainly: Quote from John Piper:
"God . . . brings about all things in accordance with his will. In other words, it isn’t just that God manages to turn the evil aspects of our world to good for those who love him; it is rather that he himself brings about these evil aspects for his glory (see Ex. 9:13-16; John 9:3) and his people’s good (see Heb. 12:3-11; James 1:2-4). This includes-as incredible and as unacceptable as it may currently seem-God’s having even brought about the Nazis’ brutality at Birkenau and Auschwitz as well as the terrible killings of Dennis Rader and even the sexual abuse of a young child . . .
Truth in Love
Warning to those who promote the CANCER of Reformed 5-point Calvinism
Galatians 1:8-9 8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to what we have preached to you, he is to be accursed! 9 As we have said before, so I say again now, if any man is preaching to you a gospel contrary to what you received, he is to be accursed!
Faith is not a gift of God, it's a response to God's grace. Calvinism is trying to turn this response into a work, a merit, but it absolutely isn't. Do I have anything to boast about, because I accepted a gift based on what God did on the cross? Of course not!
Piper is such a bright man and I love him, but it amazes me that he can't see this.
Sorry faith is a gift from God. Eph 2:8 says so. Faith is one of the fruit of the s Spirit. Phil 1:29 days it had been granted you to believe and suffer.
Calvinism is wicked.
Examples?
@@HearGodsWord Calvinism gives people the greatest excuse of all time to reject God. Instead of we can love God because he first loved us, it is we reject God because he first unilaterally rejected us before the foundation of the world.
@@Isaaaaac so no examples then.
Man has rejected God because man loves darkness. God does however call some, just look at Abraham, Moses, David, the Prophets, the Apostles, Paul...
Saying man rejected God because man loves darkness, without saying why they love that darkness is deceiving.
Why did man love darkness? Because God made them that way with no option otherwise other than to hope they were chosen by him? Is that not wicked? Creating every being with no hope and no way out, only striving after darkness and never seeing a hand reaching out because God blinded them? Is that a good God? I do not think so. Is that wrong?
@@Isaaaaac it's not deceiving, it's short-hand. I'm sure you didn't want me to spoon-feed instead?
this "once saved always saved" theology is heresy, If once saved always saved is what a Calvinist lives by then theres no reason to consistently ask for forgiveness let alone follow Jesus because if your once saved always saved then that means whatever you do, wont affect your salvation. Meaning that you can go sin as much as you want and live by your own terms since you cant lose your salvation than everything is permitted.
One cannot earn their own salvation. Read Romans 3
Michael Nixon Salvation isnt Earned its Given by Grace, John 3: 16-17
My question would be is. What do you not understand about the word eternal?Webster define it as everlasting enduring through ALL TIME. perpetual CONTINUING FOREVER.And no it's not a licence to steal.It does mean that you don't have to wonder if you'll lose what you didn't pay for Ephesians 2:8-9.
Johnny Hutto but if its “once saved always saved” then In a way Whatever sin you do, it pretty much doesnt matter since Your already have attained your salvation you can sin as much as you want without any moral Consequence. So No Once Saved Always Saved Is just not true because Sin is Still Active You can Still Sin and Sin is what separated man in the first place.
To believe in OSAS and then think they can go on with Their life and sin however they want has truly misunderstood this doctrine. Someone with that kind of logic has missed the beauty of OSAS and is showing evidence of someone with an unregenerated heart.
In Jeremiah 19:5 God says, “They have built the high places of Baal to burn their children in the fire as offerings to Baal-something I did NOT COMMAND or mention, nor did it enter my mind.” 2nd Peter 3:9 says, “The Lord is…not willing that ANY should perish but that ALL should come to repentance.” and yet, it also has Jesus saying, "Broad is the road that leads to destruction (hell) and many are on it, but straight and narrow is the road that leads to life (Heaven) and few ever find it."
This is not explaining Calvinism as much as an advocation for Calvinism...
So crazy! Why God predestined some people to Heven and the most for..hell.??....Very crazy!...What this man is talking, is not the Bible! God did NOT predestined sin, He ask us to repent..!...
Why did he pick the Israelites to be his people and not others in the old testament. It's not a new principal
Calvinism is theology taken from scripture, re-injected back into the Word of God in a wicked way by wicked people.
Take words like "Election, Pre-destination, determined" and give them your own definitions, then go back and apply them to God's Word and God's attributes and you will get Calvinism.
I am not saying they aren't trying to be biblical, and I am not saying they aren't right about a LOT of stuff, and I am not saying it isn't Biblical, because it is
but it's basically a theology that starts with God's Sovereignty and Power mixed with Man's wickedness. You can start anywhere, but what a weird place to start.
Why not start with God's Love or God's Creativity?
1 Corinthians 13 also doesn't exist in Calvinism. It's removed from the Bible (lol)
Calvinists also have the problem of putting the weakest portions of theology over the best of man's philosophy %100 of the time, since the Bible is better than the imagination of man. The Bible being authoritative is fine... but man's reading of the Bible being authoritative is a bit of a stretch
I believe that the Bible is the Word of God, but it's not "perfect" because of the people reading it. It's also not Deity. I have a strict Christ>Bible theology. Sure it's perfect if it's translated perfectly, but a lot of verses are pretty mysterious and people smarter than me are really confused about a lot of stuff. R.C. Sproul used to talk about how stupid he was about EVERYTHING in the Bible, regardless of the fact he was smarter than everyone else reading it. If our smartest people are wrong about their interpretation of scripture, then it's safe to assume that the Bible is filled with "errors" or "half truths", and that's okay. In John 2 19 Jesus Christ talks about how he will "destroy this temple and build it up in 3 days". Contextually, it's clear to %99.9 of people reading it that he will destroy a temple (a building) and build it up in 3 days (he is a carpenter). However, I may take a "Minority" view on a passage like this and say "maybe he is being a smart-ass and is referring to himself, and it's an esoteric thing to say." Amazingly, the %0.1 view was correct in this passage, as the "theologian nerds" made a mistake; God literally died and rose again 3 days later! The Temple was himself, and the building back up was also himself. Interesting. I didn't see that coming. Oh wait, yes I did. This is also the case with the word "Pre-destination". In the Greek pre-destination just means to destinate something before hand. If I want to go to New York next week, I can pre-destine myself to go there today. God pre-destined everyone to Heaven, as it's clearly written in 2 Peter, but Calvinists get around it with word play. What if pre-destine was actually a 150 word definition in God's eyes, not what the original Greek says? What if by Pre-destine God actually loaded a lot of awesome entropy layers of love and creativity into it? Would the Calvinists care? Would the Calvinists think it's possible?
An analogy God gave me weeks ago was this
A letter comes down from the sky and it says from God "I want you 3 to run to the store and pick up some milk."
They have 15 minutes to interpret it
John interprets this to mean that we should all get into the car and go to SAFEWAY
Amy says that we should drive to LUCKY's (another store)
James (a Calvinist) is pissed. In the Greek the word "Run" means "to use one's legs to travel distance". James insists that we should run to the store, not drive.
Let me guess, we should also pick up the milk too? Like literally, pick it up? I mean it doesn't say "buy" the milk does it?
In reality, God is laughing, as the correct interpretation is this: I want you guys to LOVE each other... and LOVE me...
God's interpretation of Scripture is so much better! Notice how God has a really loose view of HIS OWN WORD?? Wow... All of his verses should be viewed in the light of Love and Justice, and not just justice, and not just love. Hell is really bad, but it's not as bad as it should be because of God's mercy MIXED IN with his Justice. When Adam sinned, he should of went to hell, but he was given a promise, and when Lucifer sinned, he should of been immediately punished, but he was given a world to be god over through God's mercy and creativity. God is so merciful, and regardless of man's wicked theology injected into the Bible (Calvinism), God will stay like that. Sure God is anti-evil, but he isn't infinite in his anti-evil the way he is infinite in some of his other attributes. "Free Will" is an ongoing debate, and I take a hard stance that all sides are wrong, but I lean Free Will. Check this out: Right this second, we are in the presence of the Imagination of Jesus Christ. I hope that makes you feel better.
Calvinism closes doors that shouldn't be closed in order to protect God's maximums while denying philosophical brilliancies that might be onto something. The God of Calvinism is very literal and very black and white. We know that God isn't that cool because the Bible says the Bible says the Bible says the Bible says
John Calvin talked about singular pre-destination theories that will boggle the mind (in the worst ways). They aren't creative and makes this life out to be a Movie that God scripted and is watching and can't/won't change.
Human Life is closer to a complex sporting event between God's Justice and God's Mercy where we are the Athletes and he is the coach, fan, referee, and Owner than it is a Calvinistic puppet show with "no maverick molecules".
God is a loving, gracious, creative, infinitely awesome meticulous artist, but he isn't a psychotic power hungry egotistical control freak too. Not entirely.
When I contemplate the sovereignty of God I see the absolute ability to give full sovereignty over to created beings in His image. God not pre-determining who shall be saved by divine fiat is a greater sovereignty level than Calvinistic extrapolations. We are after all *poof! You Exist! ex nihilo hence the frightening level of hate that atheists extend to God because they were even made. Their thinking is... "if I can't eat of all the fruit that I want however I want and I still have to make this ultimate eternal life threatening decision to accept and love God yet if I don't I'm damned!? Then I hate God for even making me!" that's their reasoning. I was an enemy of God as well until he drew me to Himself. It has taken twenty years and I even went back to MN while you, John, were still at Bethel. Yet I chose to be the servant and seek a heavenly home. Why cannot the unbeliever believe like me? Because God picked me outta a bunch? Nah! Maybe. I love the paradoxical rendering of eternity starting from a certain point as a being just born on the edge of infinity. However the paradox of free will isn't one I will concur with you on.
*WHY IS THE DOCTRINE OF DECREES SO OFTEN OBFUSCATED?*
That doctrine which is *DISTINCTIVE* of Calvinism - was clearly enunciated by John Calvin himself.
The doctrine decrees
John Calvin
-quote
The creatures...are so governed by the secret counsel of god, that NOTHING HAPPENS but what he has knowingly and willingly decreed. (Institutes, 1, Chp 16, Par. 3)
Thus Adam was NOT PERMITTED to NOT eat the fruit - because NOT eating the fruit was NOT knowingly and willingly decreed
Calvinist Robert R. McLaughlin
-quote
"god merely *PROGRAMMED* into the divine decrees all our thoughts, motives, decisions and actions"(The Doctrine of Divine Decree pg 4)
Thus Adams thoughts, motives and decisions were limited to an infallible *PROGRAM* which permits no ALTERNATIVE thoughts, motives, and decisions.
Paul Helms
-quote
Not only is every atom and molecule, *EVERY THOUGHT AND DESIRE* kept in being by god, but every twist and turn of each of these is under the *DIRECT CONTROL* of god (The Providence of God pg 22)
Thus the thoughts and desires within Adam's brain were determined by a mind external to his - who granted *NO ALTERNATIVE* thoughts and desires - because the infallible decree by definition - permits no ALTERNATIVES of itself.
It doesn't take much to understand - why the doctrine of decrees - which is the KEY DISTINCTIVE of Calvinism - is OBFUSCATED within explanations of "What is Calvinism"
While I absolutely believe God causes/ordains/determines some things. I don’t believe He causes everything to happen. In Jeremiah 19:5 God says, "People built places to sacrifice their children (in fire) to foreign gods, and He (God) says, "I did NOT COMMAND this, nor did it enter my mind."
My contention is with people like John Piper who says, every single thing that happens on planet earth is caused by God. He gives the example of tiny dust particles in a beam of light. Piper says God controls the very movement of each tiny particle. Or James White who has said, "If a man brutally rapes a young girl, God caused it. If not, then it was a meaningless, random act." Jeff Durbin says, God is not partially sovereign, He is not half-sovereign, He is sovereignly sovereign. Meaning, like Piper and White, every single thing that happens is caused by God. If you follow that logic through, you have God saying to Adam and Eve, "Do not eat from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil..." and then He causes them to do that very thing. You have God saying, "Have no other gods before me." AND then He makes countless billions worship Allah, Buddha, or one of the three hundred million Hindu gods. Again, if you carry this through, you have God, who is LOVE, who is Holy and Righteous, causing, murder, rape, child molestation, drugs, alcohol, prostitution, human trafficking, not to mention, the belief in atheism. Allowing something to happen, UNTIL it is dealt with on Judgment Day, is NOT the same as causing it to happen.
Calvinism is a doctrine that was developed to keep the door open to the Catholic way of salvation (baptismal salvation), they just add a predestined/elected flavour. I grew up in Dutch Reformed family, and broke free the tulip web. It is sad how people choose such perversions above the plain gospel message of by believing who Jesus is, how He saved you, and following Him. FYI: the Armenian straw man was set up by Calvinists to make it look like the better option.
I now attend a Dutch reformed Church and very happy to be in it. Calvinism is definitely biblical after much research. It's Calvinism that gets very easily misunderstood not to mention the countless straw men against it. Reformed theology does not teach baptismal regeneration.
so John, God picks and chooses who is saved or not? That is what most hear and it seems to sound like to me when I ponder Calvinism. That seems to be limited in God's sovereignty: That he could not create a being like him with complete free will. Faith as tiny as a mustard seed does flourish into a giant tree given enough time, but our will is sovereign as well. Image like, however, not being God, we are to submit to the Most High and nurture what we were by grace given.
I dare anyone to prove pastor J. wrong!😣🙏
But this contradicts Leighton Flowers teachings on the Sovereignty of man 😂
Flowers manages to even contradict himself!
Flowers is a heretic
Flowers is incompetent. People have tried to correct him to no avail
If Calvin's God is completely sovereign and powerful then he can change his own character at will. He can choose to lie and be dishonest and call it "good" and force his weak followers to agree. He could write a book full of lies and tell people it's true. By definition, we can't trust Calvin's god.
He does what he wants like a Divine narcissistic man-child. No thanks.
Amen to that, God is a father not a dictator.
What a bunch of nonsence
Nothing could be more clear and ultimately liberating than what the Scriptures teach about God’s sovereignty and His unconditional and beautiful grace in our salvation! Glory to God!
Is John Piper a Calvinist or does he agree with it to some extent?
Mark Savin
He’s full blown Calvinist. Probably one of the most consistent ones. He would say that God is controlling our every move. Even a child rapist only does what God ordains him to do and had no choice in the matter.
I know. It’s a super wicked doctrine.
God bless
Marty Blackman
Maybe we could check out scripture to test all things and hold fast to that which is good.
Does regeneration precede faith according to Calvinism?
@Ghost In The Shell's The Laughing Man you don't believe "anything" about Calvinism is true? Feels very much like a dramatic over-exaggeration.
@Ghost In The Shell's The Laughing Man the Bible says we're slaves for Christ.
@Ghost In The Shell's The Laughing Man one that's been faithfully translated. A lot of translations say servant instead of slave because translators didn't like the word, but the original word meant slave. The word is used around 150 times in the New Testament so it's important to understand it correctly, irrespective of the denomination you're following.
First John 2:2 And He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only, but for the sins of the whole world. First Timothy 2:4 God is not willing that any should perish, but that all would come to the knowledge of the truth and be saved. Second Peter 3:9.
John 3:16-18 For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, Jesus, that WHOSOEVER, believeth in Him, should not perish but have everlasting life. Jesus said it, we believe it, and that settles it.
John Piper is a false teacher. Matthew 7:15-23. The gospel. First Corinthians 15:1-4. That Christ died for our sins, according to the scriptures, that he was buried and rose again on the third day, according to the scriptures. When we believe that gospel we are sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise. Ephesians 1:13-14. Our guarantee of eternal life.
Galatians 1:6-9 Though we or an angel from heaven preach any other gospel unto you that that we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I again. If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received from us, let him be accursed. Calvinism is a false gospel of works salvation. Not the free gift of God by faith alone in Jesus finished work on the cross alone apart from our works which can not save sinners. Romans 6:23 Ephesians 2:8-9.
First John 5:13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God, that ye may KNOW YE HAVE ETERNAL LIFE. Gods word.
What pastors do you recommend?
Hank Lindstrum. Yankee Arnold. Robert Breaker. IAMSaintJay. They all have you tube videos. Andy Woods. Great on prophesy.
@@jimkraft9445 do you believe we are commanded to love ourselves before we can love others ? Aka self love ?
No, we are commanded to believe the gospel. First Corinthians 15:1-4. And then love one another. Colossians 2:13 We have been forgiven all trespasses. John 3:18. John 6:40. And this is the will of Him who sent me, that ALL that seeth the Son, and believeth on Him, may have everlasting life, and I will raise him up on the last day.
@@jimkraft9445 amen I agree
Calvin was a lawyer and made up an entire tradition of men with his heretical tulip nonsense.
Theosis > 5 points
Where was the love of all the world in this predestination load of crap.