The Martian Deep Dive Breakdown
Вставка
- Опубліковано 15 вер 2024
- #tyandthatguy #reaction #review #themartian
THE MARTIAN DEEP DIVE BREAKDOWN
Ty Franck (one half of James S.A. Corey) and Wes Chatham ('Amos Burton' on The Expanse) finally listened to Producer Joe and our patrons. The guys are finally reviewing The Martian!
😄 Support us on Patreon: / tyandthatguy
🍎 Listen on Apple: podcasts.apple...
🔊 Listen on Spotify: open.spotify.c...
linktr.ee/tyan...
#moviereview #moviereviews #moviecritic #moviegeek #movielover #movieexplained #movieaddict #filmreview #filmreviews #filmcritic #filmlover #filmaddicts #react #cinephile #cinema #cinemareview #denisvilleneuve
Love this movie. When I had cancer 6 years ago and I was going through Chemo I read The Martian to keep me positive and provide inspiration through that rough time.
I too got through a very rough patch reading the Martian
biggest mis-step in this movie = Sean Bean's character survived.
Congratulations Captain Enoch!
That Storm Trooper mask is awesome. Definitely Samurai inspired.
Yaayyuuuhh
In other space news: we finally got to see Wes in Ahsoka last night! I'd have bet money that he'd play agent Kallus w/ some chunky spacemuttonchops. But still totally badass. Even if we didn't get to see his purdy face. Coolest enigmatic trooper since Captain Phasma.
I had to look up Enigmatic, lol. Very Japanese Samurai inspired. Loved it. Maybe the first Storm Trooper with an actual nose on the helmet
I hope Wes gets something good to do on it, I'm excited for it
How do we know that Capt. Enoch doesn't have those muttonchops under that helmet?
@@friedaha6857 excellent point! if we don't see them on the show, i'll see them in my dreams..
The plutonium heater is actually probably the simplest science in the movie ... radiation is hot (nuclear reactors are essentially the same as old timey steam engines, replace the coal shovelling with uranium and it heats up steam to drive a turbine... granted, theres a lot of clever science and engineering to control it but the basic principle is the same). Have a lump of radioactive plutonium near you, youre going to get toasty
Woo! Just saw Ahsoka episode 6. Absolutely loved it. I know you can't talk about it, strike rules and all, but we appreciate "that guy" in Star Wars. Those troopers have seem some bad shit and I'm here for it.
Hahaha. This is actually hilarious. I see the idea of Jessica throwing it a bit towards being able to guess the plot. But hey S Seagal did die in Executive Decision.
I always knew you were a cultured man ACG
Hey small world in my subscriptions 😂
Read the book before the movie the movie was really good adaptation.
The problem with soil on mars is that it contains calcium perchlorate which is poisinous to humans. Think of it as chlorine in salt form. It would potentially get into the water of the soil and then in the plant.
came here to say this, Wes probs thinking about this when suggesting the soil is radioactive perhaps ?
The Martian was written before the perchlorates were known to be a Mars issue. The movie script just rolled with it instead of trying to add a whole new problem solving sequence.
Also, perchlorate ingestion is a long-term problem that can be ignored in the short term and mitigated by water washing of the soil. If Wier had known about the perchlorates, then he would have had to be writing in the same time frame as NASA learning about the relatively large amounts of water available in Martian soil, which could have presented an avenue for addressing the perchlorates.
@@BlahVideosBlahBlah yeah, I'm not criticizing the book which I love. I'm just adding some context for the question that was asked.
The book title Ty was looking for was 'Hail Mary,' and it has been a long time since a book made me cry as hard and laugh as hard as that one did. There's also another one called 'Artemis,' which I also highly recommend.
Hail Mary is the best sci fi book I have read in at least a decade. It is a masterpiece of storytelling dynamics.
@@hopelessnecromantic2794 Yep, Hail Mary is fantastic. The Moon one? I couldn't even get part way into it. But he bounced back brilliantly with Hail Mary
Artemis is the moon one he was thinking of.
Wes, welcome to Star Wars! Captain Enoch is awsome!
Wes, real life hyper educated astronauts are as Ty says.
Not hyper emotional actors that goes way overboard with the emotions.
Watch any nasa things, they are always calm and controlled on job.
I don't think Wes disagreed with that. I know astronauts are like that and I'm like that myself, but I'm fully with Wes on what I think he was trying to get through: there was no real chemistry between the crew. It's not that they were calm, but that it all seemed artificial. If anything, they could have been even cooler on the job, but some more creativity could have been put into the writing & performance of their interactions.
@@Daneelro true, they could have gone a more "buddy" kinda way 🙂
But i kinda just thought it as natural since they was under so much pressure.
We tend to get more on the edge under pressure, and by distancing one self one could probably avoid stress triggered reactions by other ppl.
But on the other hand, we humans kinda works best when we are cooperating 😛
Honestly, I find it refreshing to have a movie that flows logically from beginning to end, not trying to constantly subvert my expectations.
I really really love yalls discussions! It's so rare to find people who might disagree but can still have a conversation. Like so nuanced yo. How unbelievable 😮😊
I interviewed Andy Weir on Pranakasha Productions a while ago. A great guy!!! Be sure to read his book Project Hail Mary---it is super good :)
I really enjoyed Ty & That Guy in the beginning because it was focused on one of my favorite SciFi series, the Expanse. When you had completed covering that series I was a bit dubious about how well it could continue. Some of the transitional shows that focused on acting were a bit too inside baseball for me, but I stuck with you and now I am happy to tell you I will continue watching as long as you want to keep podcasting. Great show!! Keep up the great work. Very interesting and informative. I have a suggestion - do a show on failed series that started out be great but just crapped out (Game of Thrones) vs ones that got better and better as they progressed (Breaking Bad and The Sopranos). (Incidentally, I loved the final episode of The Sopranos because it avoided "wrapping up" the series and just ended with Tony Soprano, his family, and the gang still carrying on.)
I’d love to see John Rogers on as a guest if that is ever in the cards. I found him through Leverage and really admire that he recorded his own commentary for every episode. Not sure what he might want to come on and talk about, but I’ve followed him on Twitter for years and he’s one of the few reasons I still check in over there at that Musky mess.
Sean Bean survived in that movie, so that’s a massive win
Also regarding the plutonium. That's an RTG. Think of it like a nuclear battery that works off of the decay heat of plutonium. Basically plutonium is hot and will be hot for a long time, they use that to make electricity. It's basically a battery that makes power for 50 years. The last two Mars rovers are powered by one. Voyager is powered by one. New Horizons probe is powered by one. In the movie/book he just used it to heat up the rover.
i think it did about 1500W of thermal power and 175W of electric power iirc.. and yes its safe as long as you dont open up the plutonium pellets and basically eat them
Ty is so correct... astronauts are painfully professional... they are not space truckers or military ground pounders.
They are selected to be super calm, professional, And unflappable.
They are not super personable on mission. Can't stress that enough.
Ty is correct about that, but I think he consistently missed Wes's point. The problem with the interactions of the crew wasn't that it wasn't lively enough, but that it seemed artificial, it seemed the writers & the actors were going through the motions instead of showing us all the little signs of a crew that has been working & living together and got used to each other over years.
@@Daneelro I got that.. but Wes also ignored Tys point that full time astronauts are generally different. They don't normally behave as Wes seems to want them to and how they depected normally.
They are not a squad of generic military guys or space truckers.
They tend to be VERY reserved and aloof with anything but the mission. Note how they are shown separated and doing their own thing when on personal time. And even relationships are kept on the very very down low.
I don't see this as a problem or at worst a different take. NASA has even looked into this and what type of personality has the right mix. Agreeable professional... NOT social.
@@taerog I think you misread Wes the same way Ty did. He emphatically did not bring up Alien as an example because he wanted them to behave as a squad of generic military guys or space truckers, he brought it up because the team dynamic in Alien looked real and not artificial.
I think Wes's problem was that he could not describe what made him feel the acting of the team dynamic is artificial in The Martian. But I have my own thoughts on that, and, in fact, I feel it was too boisterous: to me it seems there was too much reliance on American tropes (especially about the non-American characters) and there was a lazy attempt to amp up the "coolness" in their interactions. Compare, for example, how the comradeship of Fezzik &Indigo Montoya is established in The Princess Bride: that little scene with the rhymes is not some boisterous acts but it's unique, memorable and feels real.
@@Daneelro but it was supposed to be and would be very artificial. That's what I expect he didn't get or acknowledge.
What he wants to see is acting, dynamics, interpersonal relationships, etc since he is an actor...
But as Ty pointed out in reality sometimes this just not a thing but artificially designed not to be a thing.
Not a family in space (belters or firefly), not tradesman (space truckers) not a loose military like Star Trek, not even a cold tight military (mars navy or even Earth bound submariners.)
But a hand picked group with where social dynamics is to be a minimum and still functional.
Ty brought up Apollo 13 for a good reason.. if the movie was made realistically, Wes would have and should have the same reaction.
But that's the very rub.. Reality isn't good movie making! They didn't act as people would have expected and it would have seemed unnatural and artificial... but it was the reality. (atleast astronaut reality)
Wes very rightly prefers otherwise.
But if the author, Wier in this case, was pushing realism in his work over more theatrical character dynamics. That's his call. And when being true to the source media the movie did also.
Would the satisfaction of the performance less?... YES Wes is completely correct, was it also more realistic to what it actually would be YES also..
So it depends on the point of view you're coming from. Sad Realism or dynamic acting being portrayed in a movie pushing realism. IMO that makes it need to lean to the realism.
No great answer there. Just two points of view.
@@taerog Ummm, have you seen the film at all? You keep going on about how real astronaut behaviour is different from what you _think_ Wes thinks it is, but what you describe is completely different from what was in the film. Wes (and I) was criticising the acting in the film. You also seem to have the wrong idea about what acting is.
100% agree with Ty. Wes was expecting something that the source material was not telling.
I dunno... if they'd cast Sean Bean as Mark Watney, there might have been some suspense/tension about Watney making it back. ;)
I distinctly remember reading this on my phone when it came out while flying cross country. I was so engrossed in it. It’s was exactly what I wanted out of sci-fi but I didn’t know it until I read it. Definitely scratches a similar itch as watching The Expanse or playing Star Citizen.
Welcome back!!!
Hey Ty & Wes!
RE: The box of plutonium heater. This wasn't "radioactive waste", it was an RTG (radioisotope thermoelectric generator). It is a real thing used in real spacecraft. They are used because they are simple, with no moving parts, and incredibly energy dense and therefore small, but relatively low output and they run out eventually. Heat is literally how they work though (Plu238 is naturally unstable and decays passively, producing heat with the RTG using that heat to generate current based on heat differential) so sure, you could use it in a pinch for heat (as long as you don't mind a little radioactive aftertaste).
The heat output of the RTG in the movie is known (1400w) and someone has done the math to check the legitimacy of using it the way it is in the movie and it all checks out.
As I understand it, Andy Weir's 'Project Hail Mary' is going to be made into a Movie with Ryan Gosling in it, get that put on your to Review List, as the book is awesome.
Of course, Astronauts are going to SAY that they would *always* follow orders, *BUT* in the moment, would they or would they not go to save their comrade. I would like to think that they would be willing to risk their life is there is a possibility of saving their teammate.
(especially as more and more, mission specialists are not from a military background)
The plutonium wasn't nuclear waste, it was inside a device called a "radioisotope thermoelectric generator", or RTG. This is a simple device that uses decay heat from the plutonium to heat thermocouples to produce electricity. The plutonium is inside a shielded container which had radiator fins on it because it stays hot for decades. Deep space probes like Voyager use them. The movie makes it look like it's dangerous to be around it, but unless you cut it open it's not really dangerous. It does put off a lot of heat, though, which is why Watney uses it to stay warm. I can't remember if he also uses it to produce power or not, but that's what it's made for.
In the book he says something like if the thing produces 175W of electric power .. and arround 1500W thermal power..would had to go take a look at it..
One of my favourite Ridley Scott “under the radar” movies is Body of Lies. Really cool political thriller with Leonardo DiCaprio, Russell Crowe and Mark Strong.
“I need nailers, not hangers” that line was so overlooked.
I've been working in cybersecurity for the past three years, and hexadecimal still comes up.
Lez GOOOOO Captain Enoch baby
Legend should be in the bottom five. The Duelists should be in the top five. An honorable mention is the mostly overlooked Someone To Watch Over Me.
Hey guys, I really love your deep dive breakdowns. Here's some suggestions:
Robocop (the Verhoeven one)
Enemy Mine
Planes, Trains and Automobiles
The Abyss
Tombstone
Demolition Man
If I were to pick one, I'd say Robocop.
Cheers!
Plz oh plz tell us we get to see you face - oh and here’s to hoping Ahsoka doesn’t kill you. Or if you do die, I hope it’s not from a single shot blowing you backwards down a hole. May it be a glorious death!
Love this movie! The only big mistake was that thing with the strom.
How do you come from Plutonium to time machine? To much of "Back to the Future"? The heating is done by the "waste heat" of nuclear decay. He is digging out the RTG (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atomic_battery).
The Martian deep dive... also Alien(s) again😂
Love it guys
Enoch!
Wes, seriously, Chastain “Embodies” competence-porn… I re-watch “Miss Sloan” specifically because of that.
Also, how you discuss “coldness” (walking off) is what made her perfect in Crimson Peak- I thing Del Toro was masterful in his direction with her.
Pretty sure the Council of Elrond reference is in the book...
"The Martian "is such a great movie. I should read the book
This makes me realize I need to watch 1492 still.
How LONG is that conversation / debate about the crew 😂😂
The Martian reminded me a little of Moon. In Martian you get a lot of Matt Damon doing scenes alone. in Moon it's Sam Rockwell.
Tbf, I'm pretty sure NASA screens for idosyncrasies & compatibility & often crew members don't know each other well before working together. They are trained to be professional & have a certain by the numbers detached mindset. Since it was a routine mission that everyone had prepared & trained for & they are all people there for scientific reasons, I don't see why there would be any drama between them. The drama was the rescue & survival of Matt Damon's character. This wasn't a crew of misfits who had to take a job in space & hated The Company. Everyone wanted to be there.
Agree with Wes on the cast chemistry - a better comparison than Alien, though, might be Band of Brothers (although that's a rather extreme version of "real" chemistry".
I was actually on the fence for buying the book, having seen the movie.
Normally, reading the book ruins the movie for me. Good to know that Ty likes both. Gonna buy the book now.
Thanks for doing this.
Shed's death is the point in The Expanse is the point of subversion. That's where people buy into the next six seasons. Very interesting hearing your discussion on this.
I can't remember if I read the book or watched the film first. But I love both
This movie although that I love, it is essentially a remake of the 1964 movie Robinson Crusoe on Mars starring Paul Mantee. A bit dated to say the least and of course they had to throw aliens in as well, but I always liked the underline theme of gratitude. Every time the lead character overcame and obstacle he thanked God. ( I’m not preaching)
To give an illustration of what Wes was talking about concerning the actors feeling connected with one another and the set feeling lived in: take the International Space Station, when we see the astronauts/cosmonauts on board, we do see individualism, connection and a lived-in space.
Hey Wes, we get your point about comradery, but these were astronauts who may not have been together as long as the other examples. Also (and my wife is great at hitting me with this), just because you repeat a point or make it from a different angle doesn't mean they're ever going to agree with it.
The whole movie is basically McGyver for filmgoers. You have no doubt that the problem will be sorted but don't know how and get to enjoy watching a bunch of Earthbound wirdos & suits and a load of no nonsense astronaughts McGyver the shit out of the problems. The big 'twist' is that Sean Bean was cast in a film and gets to live - that is totally casting to throw you off right there. He also gets to take part in a coucil of Elrond with a straight face.
You guys should do a playthrough of the Telltale game together!
I have an idea!
Ty & That Guy
Film/series/book
Our two expert snugglers
Cast in a universe they know or at least contains stuff they talk about in the podcast
Not 'honey I shrunk the kids'
But 'conan + rick & morty'
And we all know who Rick is, right?
I would have liked that movie a lot more had they treated vacuum in a more realistic fashion. I still really liked it, but plastic sheeting and duct tape? Do the math on that.
grats on being Enoch Wes of course you would be a scary storm trooper
Wasn’t the USN or Martian vessel Mark Watney in the book/movie?
34:33 honestly here I think the word Wes may be looking for is “Numb” not cold… Ripley in Aliens is what Ty said, full of rage, and even more, also full of existential anger and despair-- however, because of the same trauma her character has gone through, exacerbated by the company’s actions that essentially calls her crazy and or a liar, and with the fact of missing out on both the life and death of her only child(after being lost in space for 57 year), Ripley is numb… and gives in to the numbness as much as she can to deal with all of that existential trauma-- in the first quarter of the film. Sigourney Weaver giving that performance of Ripley in that context, more than anything deserved that Oscar nomination for best actress… and solidified how that character is basically going through hell once more to get past the trauma she suffered from her past experiences; she progressively evolves from numb to full embracing her emotions as she tries to save her self, the marines that remain, and Newt(her surrogate daughter).
Is Wes drinking blue milk today in honour of a certain gold masked right hand villain? 🙂
For a great discussion on some great "realistic" (based-in-reality) sci-fi movies:
- "Sunshine" (2007)
- "Europa Report" (2013)
Would LOVE to hear your thoughts on these. :)
QUIZ: what do Keri Russel, Gwendolyn Christie and Wes Chatham have in common? :p
there actually was a movie in the 60s called Robinson Crusoe on Mars hehe
Moon. What about "Moon"?
Kudos to Ty for calling out 1492 as glorifying colonialism.
Oh, read the book!! Its a quick read, its hilarious and there is even more problem solving in the book they couldn't fit into the film!
Not every movie needs to be subverted!!! I hate this modern trend that everything has to be a subversion or a gotcha or a shock value etc. So many good stories get ruined because they do this sudden gotcha etc just because.
"Running Man" next? It's pretty much Holden's origin story isn't it?
I believe he was burning hydrazine.
This movie has such a good cast even if they aren't all used as much.
Not a comment on the Martian, but rather about the extras you used in the Expanse. I want to know if it was an oversight to cast the same extra to play the mean belter on the Weeping Somnambulis (s2/e9) and then again as the Martian thug that accosted Alex afer he investigated Souvettiere (s5/e5)?
oh yay, I love this movie! 👏🏻
I enjoyed the film, were there certain things that bugged me? Yes but I was able to forgive it. Prometheus on the other hand.....
The big plot hole in the movie, 1% of earth atmosphere will never blow hard enough to compromise the lander, other suff can and will go wrong but not that
He knew this and said straight out it was the main conceit of the book.
@@taerog so why was the canvas cover needed at the end. That whole thing just came across as stupid to an otherwise really good movie
@@ducktape160 the storm was the conceit to start the movie going.. This was already addressed and he already admitted doing this just for the fact that he didn't know what else to do at the time.. and most people didn't realize that.
The tarp was a completely different matter. Yes aerodynamics is still actually a thing.
Especially in this case when the rocket was going to be accelerating so quickly that the speeds achieved (fastest man alive, and The reason he passed out).. They needed to remove the nose for weight requirements . The second to last crisis in the movie.
Not having the nose would have created more drag and turbulence than was acceptable thus The fix with the tarp which would have been fine if it stayed in one place.
The lower density atmosphere made this a possibility!!! but it did not remove all of the risk.
Having it fixed a problem, having it come partially off created larger problem. The atmosphere was thin but up to and at Max q at up to12g acceleration was still a factor. Ie from helping the aerodynamics to becoming a "drag-chute" at those speeds would make a real difference regardless of the atmosphere. parachutes do actually still work.
Things do that...
All of this is in the realm of possibility. Unlike the destructive power of the storm.
For instance I have been on a Cessna with Both doors removed.. loud, windy but fine other than the additional drag.
A great "idea" was to leave one door on and cover the other door with plastic and duct tape (and cut it open for the parachuter when needed) less gas use and noise, more comfort.
This worked wonders till when they started cutting it and the wind caught it and ripped it open. It didn't rip free but held on creating surprising offset drag. Nothing dangerous but quite noticeable. It went from a boon to a detriment very quickly.
This is hardly a big plot hole.
Also if you considered the original storm a big plot hole then virtually all space sci-fi movies ever made are nothing but potholes.. Maybe you should rethink your criteria a bit?
A conceit to move the plot along isn't a plot hole unless it creates more problems than fixes.
Ie The Epstein drive or the spun up asteroid bases in the expanse. Both are conceits for the plot that aren't realistic but do not harm the plot (and actually enhance it)
Andy Weir himself acknowledged this.. he found out this after he had allready began publishing the chapters and wasnt practical anymore to go back.. but he says he would just find another emergency that made the crew leave in a rush giving him for death.. like an explosion in the (unseen) MDV or in the fuel producing plant (wich would be conected to the MAV so any potential fire or hazard on it would mandate to take off asap or lose the MAV and have the entire crew stranded there)
@ducktape160
There is a rather big difference between 200 400 miles per hour in the 1% atmosphere and 3600 plus.. probably enough to move a hastily secured tarp.
And definitely enough to hinder flight.
between this and arrival, hoping we get an Interstellar episode too! :O
Amos, fuckin Amos.... I was watchin "Ahsoka" just to see you there...Since before you were top cast....... I didn see you, wtf?
Is it just me or did Kristen Wiig look extra good in the Martian?
Honestly? Some of the best stuff in this movie is the people on Earth, Sean Bean and Jeff Daniels arguing over shit.
enoch
Why do some guys wear baseball caps backwards? It looks so stupid.
I think Sean Bean should have died in that movie. That's why it felt so off at times. :)
Oh yes! Immediate click!!!
In the book, every single character seemed to have the exact same personality. Some of that is the NASA culture, but reading it felt like Andy Weir was inserting himself into the story in every single role including the NASA administrator. Just a bunch of jokey, glib, smart-asses.
🥰🥰
I'm sure you hate the Alien prequels b/c they take a shit all over Alien. They turn the Alien world into Star Wars territory by making the world so small. David creating the xenomorph is as terrible as Anakin building C-3PO. It makes the entire universe as small as Iowa City. And NOBODY wanted to know the back story of the Space Jockey. And if you're gonna tell us anyway, why turn a 15-20 fossilized dead for eons alien skeleton into a race of eight foot tall roid-raged Albino Mr. Cleans wearing space suits that only give them the appearance of looking alien-ish? Not to mention the dumbest scientists in movie history. I hate both prequels so much.
My bottom film for RS is A Good Year. Unlikable main character and a boring film.
🔔👍🏻
OK...Wes isn't Wes "I AM that guy" Chatham anymore. From now on he will be known and referred to by me as Wes "FURIOUSLY MASTURBATING IN THE RAFTERS" Chatham.
If I ever get an autograph, I will ask him to sign it precisely this way.