The Last Jedi: A Hate Letter to Star Wars and its Fans (Analysis with SPOILERS)
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- Опубліковано 21 вер 2024
- I give my analysis of the latest star wars movie, The Last Jedi, in which writer/director Rian Johnson tells a nihilistic story that attempts to deconstruct all elements of the star wars mythos and destroy the attachments of the audience to Star Wars' characters, themes, and mythos.
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Hello all! I've gotten thousands of comments in the last few days, so if I don't respond to your comment, it's not because I don't care or have something to say, but because I simply am overwhelmed with the feedback.
Dont worry David, TLJ ruined star wars for a lot of people and honest people like yourself (not those lying shills at places like Collider) are what people need now. You are a beacon of light in these dark times.
I have a comment, who are you and why should I care?
Unsubscribed because 9/11 was an inside job and I don't trust that guitar at all, looks like a CIA bug to me.
I agree with Ankokukishi. I've unsubscribed from a lot of movie reviewers I usually tune into religiously after their positive take on this film. Since I've been wandering towards people on UA-cam who feel like I do. We need the smaller more personal reviews of this film so we don't allow the culture that is around us, the culture that either doesn't understand or care about the Star Wars universe, to cloud our own perceptions.
I also think there are a lot of popular reviewers who are going to see a distinct dip in their subscriptions because of their stance over this film as people reposition their viewing habits and gravitate towards what they feel are more honest reviews from the perspective of real fans, and not just people who pretend to fans for the clicks.
+FX Lord Agree x10000000000000
David Stewart
Thanks for the video
"If the characters had acted like normal humans the entire plot wouldn't have happened."
That really says it all.
This phrase defines Arrow and Civil Wars.
That shows what RJ, KK and company are.
What if the people at disney acted like humans? Oh wait...that's ll never happen!
This can be applied to the whole Prequel Trilogy XD
Doesn't that kind of indicate that Rian Johnson isn't a real human? I think he must be from some weird planet out there, an alien in disguise, and he's trying to pass as human, but can't quite manage it!
As disappointing as this sad nonsense was to me and I think it's fair to say most fans, I feel more pity for Mark Hamill who, in the aftermath of the premiere, looked like he'd been hoodwinked with 30 pieces of silver to have his life-defining role and legacy permanently flushed down the toilet.
I bet in years to come we hear more from Mark about what really went on behind the scenes to make such a train wreck. I've already seen clips where he dumps on the whole modern way these movies are made. Clearly he wants to say more, but likely won't for a long time.
mapesdhs He should have said no and taken the law suit.
Mark is the real deal. I feel sorry for him
@@miguelpereira9859 yeah I really feel bad for him I just feel like they did Star Wars wrong.
They showed no respect for the old characters and it just seems like Rey's character gets everything that she wants so easily
@@meggrotte4760 It boggles my mind how much of an issue making Luke the protagonist of this trilogy was to JJ and the other idiots at Lucasfilm. Did they not expect us to like this character? Luke Skywalker is the face of this franchise. They should have made him the focus point of at least the first movie and introduce a new trio. Maybe make him heroicly sacrifice himself at the end of the second film to inspire the new crew. But that would make too much sense.
Not saving the slave children was even worse because Rose said she used to be one.
Notice how one was force sensitive. They'll probably save them in the next film.
Thinking back to young Anakin as a slave, didn't they have some sort of device fitted that would kill them if they tried to escape? Only explanation I can think of.
Darren Munsell I hate that stupid character.
Not even that, Finn himself was taken from his family, and forced into serving the first order. He's BEEN through this. Why is she explaining these morals to Finn of all people? He, out of anyone in the resistance, should be the one guy to already know this lesson.
She's monologue-ing to the entire wrong character, Finn should be the one explaining this to others, not have this be told to him by someone else.
They're shoehorning animal rights, anti capitalism, and grey morality into a movie that's not about it.
They do it badly, they save the animals, but leave the kids behind, they leave it up in the air what happens next, the kids who helped them will probably get punished, and the weirdly anthropomorphized space horses will likely get captured again. What did they accomplish? Some mild property damage? These people are all rich, they're probably insured or something.
And they're preaching these clunkily delivered lessons to entirely the wrong character on top of that.
Who cares about kids? We don't eat them and skin them for clothing. Only animals are important.
SPOILER: The moment Luke tossed Anakin's old lightsaber over his shoulder was, at least to me, symbolic of the new owners throwing out the fundamental ideas established in the previous works of the saga. While it may be a move to introduce new ideas and make the brand feel more like their own/fresh, it comes at the cost of confusing and alienating all types of fans (from the casual to the die-hard). Just an observation as both a lover of Star Wars and a critical film watcher.
Yep it was just like the Christmas special of Doctor Who where they took the first doctor and the 12th and basically said these Doctors are gone! Here comes our SJW BS shut up and accept it.
Rayford Matthew if Luke had simply dropped the saber and walked away there wouldn’t have been such an outcry. For me the problem was the flippant silly attempt at humour by having him toss it over his shoulder for a laugh. Rian Johnson definitely doesn’t understand Star Wars humour.
amen
If luke didn't want anything to do with it he wouldn't have accepted if off her - he would have just turned and walked away refusing to take it.
Isn't it funny how "he didn't want to be found", "he wanted to die there", and yet he lefts clues, a map to find him. Quit trying to defend this turd of a movie, with its equally turdish writer director.
I have the perfect idea for episode 9. Luke wakes up screaming, and we hear that episode 7 and 8 were just a nightmare. Then we get a propper Star Wars movie.
This is the only way to fix Disney's mess.
I can accept 7 but I'll never accept 8. I watched 8 once and I'll never watch it again.
TFA might have worked if TLJ would have answered some things. For example, Rey could still be a "nobody", as Anakin also was a "nobody", born to a slave from the force (and possibly with some help of a Sith Lord) and was only discovered by Qui-Gonn due to circumstances. If he hadn't been discovered he never would have been trained. Anyway, from there you could have gone on in the story and shown that she had force training as a child by, possibly, Luke and that he, due to a vision, mind wiped her and gave her false memories (if that is even possible with the force) or that she got lost on a space cruise, injured and suffered amnesia. That, at least, would have explained some things. Rey, born through the force like Anakin, trained by Luke (the then only Jedi master) and lost her memory, but being able to use the force once reminded of it, by feeling its effects. Still wouldn't explain her quick learning as a pilot or engineer that knows the ins and outs of the Falcon better than Han.
No, stop whining about nonsense.
I wish that would happen. If the old TV show Dallas could do it, why not Ep. 9?
They should open episode 9 with Finn waking up and realizing episode 8 was all a really bad dream.
They should open episode 9 with Finn waking up and blowing his own head with a blaster. Period.
I m laughing with tears..😂
This is honestly the best pitch I've heard to fix the direction johnson has decided to take the franchise.
It was all a dream. I used to read Word Up magazine.
I'd rather Luke wake up and it's the night after the Empire fell, and he's still in the Ewok village recovering from the party and musing that he had too much to drink and had really weird dream.
fan: TFA was bad, but it wasn't quite Transformers bad.
Rian Johnson: Hold my latte
*soy latte
I liked TFA. If you didn’t, then why did you even bother going to this movie?
Em Hu that’s an extremely dumb question. “Oh boy the series I’ve been fan of for years made one movie I didn’t like because (reasons) I won’t watch the next one because I know for a fact that they won’t improve it” that’s just a stupid question people will want to see it because it’s there favorite thing and to see if it’s better than the last one. Sequels are supposed to be better
With this movie Disney told me that star wars is no longer for everyone. I will tell them what I think about that with my wallet when episode 9 comes out.
As will I but not even to make a point. This last episode deconstructed any attachment I had for the story or Star Wars universe. I am out and hope the younger kids enjoy their Marvels super hero movies known as Disney Star Wars.
Boycott the hell out of SJW Star Wars!
I was a fan of Star Wars since 1978. I played with the toys . I saw the Original Trilogy. Over 50 times by now. And this dumpster fire of a movie has destroyed. All interested I had in this new Trilogy. If they want me to see episode 9. That movie better start with this movie being a fucked up fever dream Rey has at Luke's Jedi Academy.
No one will notice. It will make a ton of money and be in the Top 20 all-time and no one will even care that you were ever a "Star Wars" fan, because it will move along without you with a new generation of fans. We are all just numbers. People whom they wish to separate from their hard earn chump change. You will stay away, but there will two or more to fill your shoes. That's how real life works.
2K16 If it doesn't fail, the Solo and episode 9 will fail. Boycotts is a bitch when studios betray it's fan base that built it up in the first place. Ask 2016 Ghostbusters, Sony will tell you!
I feel like Rian Johnson destroyed Star Wars for the same reason ISIS destroys ancient cultural relics.
For the domination of the global caliphate? Interesting thought; I hadn't considered that.
Never saw part eight... Darth Disney is to blame, in my view.
Bopkins Plays Doom Because they're Satanic assholes
It figures that the Marxists, nihilistis, and sjw's are in league with the muslims to destroy Western Civilization.
He's a clout chaser
I have seen FAN films a thousand times better than TLJ
Desmond Akkari
Pretty sure I made better ones with a VHS camcorder, a friend and a couple of makeshift Jedi robes, when I was 10.
Well, these new Disney films ARE essentially just fan films.
With million dollar budgets.
To Know A Jedi was a better fan film than TLJ
Seems more ppl hate this than ep 7. Good job Disney
Chris Terry How about an original storyline. Like let's say we replace the First Order with Mandolorians invading republic space. Disney gets to keep their armored soldiers so things don't get get graphic so double plus. Let's say Ben Solo wants to confront the invading Mandolorians through force and Luke cautions saying the Jedi are not warriors and should not readily jump into conflict. This will be your main conflict in the story. Some of Luke's students agree with Ben and some agree with Luke and thus you get your split. Let's say the Mandolorians inadvertently kill Leia and Ben Solo goes blind with rage and goes rampage mode. This will be the start of his decline.
The main triology will be a story of failure and then ultimately redemption. It'll mimic the OT in message while supplying a unique and interesting story into canon. Also Mandolorians could make a more intimidating enemy that could actually stand up to Jedi.
Kris Dickson I personally dont like star wars cause of the 'story' I loved the banter of the characters. These new characters have this marvel forced humor style and I haaaate it. and yeah the story is blaaahhhh and thats coming from someone who doesnt give a shit bout story usually.
54% RT, 4.9 on metacritics (more negatives reviews than positives), 7.7 in IMDB (only better than the prequels, 0.1 above Episode III) and it keeps dropping. I don't think it'll make a difference to the box office of TLJ, but it'll maybe have some negative effects for the next ones (specially the spin-offs).
Imagine if Kylo kills Snoke and reveals that all he has done was because he had a vision of a huge threat (something like the Vong's). That would had brought some new ideas and directions for SW.
TLJ is not "different" and "original film". It is Ep.5 mixed with 6, look at these plot points:
-Rebels (yes, now Rebels, not even "Resistance") on the run, because First Order strikes back, after Death Star-killer was destroyed;
-some of them go to exotic rich place called Bespin... I mean Bight, Canto Bight, although unlike Bespin, it doesn't lead to much at all (traitor included);
-protagonist goes to teacher, then leaves undertra... well in this case untrained at all ("sit down and feel the Force" doesn't count), also the dark cave with Force visions;
-protagonist and fallen Skywalker go to deformed old man in a robe, who shows the Rebels being defeated;
-protagonist is about to be killed, but fallen Skywalker unexpectedly kills the old deformed dude, saving protagonist;
- "Join me and together we will blah, blah, blah...";
-Rebels vs walkers on not Hoth, that is covered in white not snow, they even point out, guys, it's not snow, it's salt, it's different.
The only truly "new" stuff is ether pointless or craps all over previous films.
That scene in which Rose stopped Finn from sacrificing himself to save the others was completely nonsensical. First, Rose tells Finn something like, "You don't win a war by killing the people you hate but by saving the ones you love." In other words, Rose is telling Finn that his action is wrong even though what he wanted to do was save everyone he loved by sacrificing himself. However, think back to a previous scene in which Vice Admiral Holdo (purple-hair lady) decided to sacrifice herself by hyperspacing the ship into Snoke's ship while the others flew away on the transports. Was that labeled a wrong action by Leia? No. And given all of the ultra-feminist stuff going on in the film, I really feel like that was a way of saying that if a woman wants to sacrifice herself, it's a brave act that's about saving people, but if a man wants to sacrifice himself, it's a stupid act that's only about killing the enemy. All through the film, men were made to seem like idiots unless they listened to a woman. I guess that's the reason Holdo's sacrifice was okay, because another woman was okay with it.
Seriously, the writing in this movie was just completely piss poor and inconsistent.
Right - he was doing exactly the same thing she had just done but on a larger scale - he was trying to destroy the weapon and not even trying to kill anyone. Made zero sense.
hahaha omg never thought of that lol
ReuWil
Yeah, and Holdo's sacrifice did kill the enemy because she actually sliced through a ship with people on it. Like you said, Finn was targeting only the First Order's door-busting weapon. No one would've gotten hurt from him destroying it. Rose should've spoken that line to Holdo, not Finn.
Sam DeRenzis
I'm sure there's more stuff that I haven't thought of yet. Seriously, CinemaSins should be able to spend more than hour with TLJ.
Gabriel360LIVE Good point.
How big of a failure must you be to be suprised and murdered by a guy whose mind you are reading?
Vahagn Mkhikian false.
Nice try though.
Doesn't that just show how powerful Kylo actually is? He basically pulled a Jedi mind trick on Snoke. Not bad.
Vahagn Mkhikian Well in the truce at bakura novel (legends) Luke is having skeletal calcification due to the Emperors lightning and is dealing with the effects and pain the whole book.
So it might not have been shown in Jedi but in the Old EU it addressed that.
Palpatine wasn't going full blast, he was essentially playing with him. Torture before the kill, which makes perfect sense for the character.
Purposefully destroying SW characters and the hero's journey theme means (the foundation of SW) means there is no reason to watch or read it anymore. They are going to pump out serial dreck and use it to sell toys and shirts.
LOL, funny but some of us still had some hope that they could be decent. But it seems that, that is not the case. Not all of us are strong in the force or have Yoda's wisdom and foresight, but then he never saw the Sith coming either until it was too late.
Well the overriding theme I saw was nihilism and killing the past. The plot holes in this episode were many and senseless. This was because they took everything JJ setup and threw it out the window. The whole Rose/Finn line could have been cut out since it was pointless and preachy, and you would still have the slowest, stupidest chase scene ever created. Space Balls was a better movie.
Except the toys aren’t selling.
@Seofthwa - You still have Legends ;)
Pinnochio had a hero's journey.
The best way to go now for JJ is to begin episode IX by Rey having a Force nightmare vision and come to and still be there standing on Ahch-To handing Luke his lightsaber and just forget The Last Jedi ever happened.
And even then that'd be considered a back-handed motion from JJ by anyone who will still openly defend this train-wreck of a film by the time Ep.IX rolls around.
Or just redo episode VIII... Dragonball did it with Dragonball Super vs Dragonball GT, it just said "nah, GT never happened we are going to start from here..."
They made their money from making this mess they need to redo this episode with JJ if they want to save this in the future; better to do this than destroy a 4 billion dollar investment. Do you really think ANYONE will show up to "Yoda" or "Solo" after seeing what they did to Luke? Get real!
Eric Lincoln Honestly, I had the same thought tonight. They've done that in TV shows many times as an eraser for plot and character problems. It's a cheap tactic but they use it solve those problems. I would thoroughly endorse that here. Let it be some kind of vision/nightmare and begin again on the island. TLJ is an awful mess and needs an extreme fix for these problems to make things right again. The dream sequence is the quickest and easiest way to do it.
That is the best idea I've read on the internet in a long long time. Petition!!! I'd whole-heartedly get behind that idea!
+Billy Raymond Nah, they'd be behind anything DIsney does. Shills gonna shill, man.
"A Hate Letter to Its Fans" what a perfect way to describe it...have a Merry Christmas David!
I personally call it a troll movie
I still find that notion ridiculous because you only want what you wanted and this deviation is now considered "hate" to the "fans" who thought they knew a character for 4 years of his life in his 20's who is now nearly 60.
no I think the notion is pretty fair, as they did nothing in the movie to explain why he got to where he is and what they did give makes no bloody sense
Star Wars is turning into Transformers, and Fast and the Furious style movies.
Sounds about right. Big, loud, brain-dead, full of contrived moments, "humor" and just plain awful plotting.
Dick Deepinsideher George Lucas is the OG Michael Bay.
ANH was all spectacle, zero substance.
Dick Deepinsideher You know nothing of any of those franchises if you believe that.
Naftul Zvi... He means in the way they look and the way they are put together. He's completely right.
HydroBud98 Just flashy movies to appease the casual viewer. The movies have no heart and soul or meaning behind them.
Critics are judging the movie by their desire not to be blacklisted by the studio for bashing the studio's multi billion dollar property. I guarantee if a critic totally bashes a major high budget film that critic will no longer be invited press junkets or prescreenings for future films.
THX 1138 They don't even have to do that. They now own half of Hollywood, they do massive add buys across the country. If a "critic" ever dared to write something that could even remotely annoy disney, their boss would make sure it never touch paper.
Hence why having all the entertainment owned by Disney is such a bad thing, having a monopoly leads to no honest criticism being possible. The gaming media has a similar problem by the way.
noticed this with a bunch of youtubers as well. big UA-cam's who bashed the movie all of a sudden make a re release video.
I totally agree, THX 1138 ...and cool screen name, btw. ;-)
Disney just bought Fox Studios and is one step closer to owning all of Hollywood. Critics know YOU DON'T BITE THE HAND THAT FEEDS YOU.
Star Wars is dead for me. I didn't agree with Ep 7 but was willing to accept it depending on how Ep 8 turns out. Now, I'm deleting Ep 7 & 8 from my mind and for me Star Wars ended with Ep 6. As it should be.
I will always cherish George Lucas's well-done risk-taking & creative direction with the Star Wars saga.
I'm with you. I saw this shitpile of a movie once and I will never watch it again for the rest of my life.
At least the prequels make sense
How quickly you forget. Lucas had people, including the actors, willing to reign him in and tell him "No" in episodes 4, 5, and 6. The original script he wrote is famous for being laughably bad. This wasn't the case in episodes 1, 2, and 3, where his complete hubris was on full display with awful pacing and some of the worst dialogue in the history of cinema, because instead of "George Lucas, aspiring writer and director", those movies were written by "George Lucas, cinematic legend."
Say what you will about the prequels, but at least they had Ewan MacGregor as Obi Wan, Liam Neeson as Qui-Gon, Samuel L Jackson as Mace Windu, Christopher Lee as Dooku, Darth Maul being badass as shit, and a fight between Yoda and Palpatine.
After episode 8, episode 9 is going to have to be a masterpiece to end the sequels at the level of the prequels.
Arshad Mahmud "well-done risk-taking" Well I'd say that's only half-correct.
Also, Poe Dameron is actually the smartest, most capable leader in the movie. The cruiser he got people killed fighting had to go. If Poe hadn't lead that attack, they rebels and their base would have been destroyed. Because of Poe, they survived.
Later, Poe wants to know what the plan is. The vice admiral won't tell him. He isn't willing to let his people die, so takes charge.
Bladezeromus Wife and I just watched it again last night and were very off put about how secretive purple hair was. Kept the entire crew in the dark apparently just to keep the audience in suspense.
Man this movie upset me more than force awakens did and I didn't think that was possible.
steven wilson if you live long enough you'll find everything can and will get worse. Episode 9 is probably going to be even worse than last jedi too.
J M4Y lol theyll have an open ending so they can keep pushing em out
I feel you brother.
If you hated The Force Awakens that much then why did you expect to like The Last Jedi. And you are probably gonna hate Episode 9 too. There isn't going to be a huge change dude.
TFA is a solid, enjoyable film. TLJ is eye aids.
I won't be watching Episode IX. Rian Johnson has single handedly destroyed the Star Wars franchise.
PKRT 4 If you want just make sure you watch a boot leg copy
PKRT 4 watch it for free on a website. Dont give the Mouse any money lol.
Same. I'm not a hardcore fan of Star Wars, but I've always liked the series and watched all the films, but now I just don't care anymore. Rian Johnson managed to erase all reason to care what happens from here on. I'm not going to hate boycott Star Wars or anything, I'm just done with it.
NO NO JJ did that with that horrible remake they lied and told everyone was a sequel TFA. Rian Johnson just finished it off and made the writing clearly on the wall for all of us that Disney hates us and does not want us part of the universe anymore....
I never thought I would truly despise a Star Wars movie. Really sad
Sucks for you.
Naftul Zvi Sucks for anyone who used to be a Star Wars fan.
Nate Lightning Fanatics*
Naftul...sucks for you too, but you're too stupid to know it...
Boycott Star Wars and Disney!
This is in reply to a user named Simon Paul who cowardly and pathetically deleted his comment before I could get a chance to respond to him. But I don't want my effort to go to waste.
Simon Paul Why was taking down the Empire important? In 20 years, the Republic fell again to a new dark lord. Evehething they fought, suffered and died for came to absolutely nothing. And since we know nothing about Snoke or the FO, I say it's better to go with the Devil you know that the one you don't. Taking down the Empire was meaningless.
Why was Luke becoming a Jedi important if he'll just abandon the order and be convinced that it needs to die, rather than brining new life and ideals to it? His journey was pointless.
Why? Her world was destroyed and the ideals she fought all her LIFE to defend came to nothing, as the Republic fell in less than a day. What would have been the point of destroying the Nazis, had another Nazi Army came from, let's say Argentina, and overpowered Europe once again. Why resist the inevitable at that point? The same will be true in 20 years after the fall of the FO. In a century, this Galaxy will have had more government changes than the French and the Australians combined.
Yes, it does. If you end up fighting the exact same people for the exact same ideas, then everything you worked for was POINTLESS. You don't need a perfect ending, but you need an ending that has SOME payoff. Why build a Republic when they fall faster than dominoes?
Really? Those are the only ones? In that case;
Why would Luke hide in a Jedi temple if he hates the Jedi?
Why does he hide somewhere with a map to it?
Why did he ever think that Ben was going to Turn? At all?
Why did he give up after ONE failure?
Why did he become a coward?
Why did he abandon the Republic, Galaxy and Family he fought to protect in the OT?
Why is Rey perfect at everything she does?
How could Rey best Luke in a duel?
Why does Kylo Ren care so much about her?
Why did he betray his master?
Why did he turn to the dark side in the first place?
How the fuck did the First Order manage to conquer the Galaxy?
Where does the FO get its funds from?
Why is Snoke so respected?
If he's so powerful, why didn't he overthrow Palpatine?
If he's so easily killed, how hasn't someone done it before?
What is the point of Rose?
What was the point of Casino World?
What was the point of Finn?
What was the point of Caltrain Phasma?
Why did Kylo Ren give up being Vader's fanboy so easily?
Why did Kylo decide he wants to be Supreme Leader all of a sudden?
How did Hux become a General in this organisation?
How THE FUCK could Rey BEAT half a platoon if trained, well armed Praetorian guards with no training?
How did Leia survive in Space?
How did Leia open the door without sucking everyone else out?
Why is the Vice-Admiral second In command, instead of War Veteran, Admiral Ackbar?
How did she become Vice-Admiral without any obvious battle experience, or military demeanour?
On that, why are they called "The Resistance?" Who are they fighting against? The FO were insurgents in TFA. Why aren't they part of the Republic Navy? Are they even Republican? Is Leia a Separatist in effect?
Why wouldn't a Vice-Admiral share critical information with an impulsive and reckless hit head who could do something drastic and dangerous?
Why doesn't she explain the plan even when the mutiny begins?
Why was Poe forgiven for insubordination so quickly?
Why did she wait so long to sacrifice herself?
Who the fuck is Snoke?
This isn't an exhaustive list, by any means, but all the cardinal sins are here.
And I've heard the same pathetic, childish defences of this movie over and over, and refuted it handily.
If we could see th rich story to which you allege, I assure you, we would accept it. But your arrogance blinds you and you refuse to see this garbage for what it really is.
Because our personal ideas are so much better. Every idea every fan has come up with has been a million more times more interesting than what Disney actually produced.
It doesn't have to "align" with our view, merely be good and entertaining. Alas, it is not.
What has it done?
It took one of the most hopeful, optimistic heroes in the galaxy and turned him into a bitter, old coward.
It took a triumphant victory over an Evil Empire and rendered it meaningless.
It took an established universe, and shat all over it, as per the request of Lord Mickey.
And if you cannot see what an abomination this really is, then that's on you.
If by "richened," you mean "debauched."
Do you know and love them? If you think this is how any version of Luke would EVER react, then you must not understand his character very well.
But they only fail. And they will continue to fail, as their victories are hollow.
And if YOU can't see what a plothole ridden, incoherent, badly structured, contradictory, antithetical to everything Star Wars excuse of a movie this travesty is...then that's on you, my friend. Not us.
May the Force be with you.
Holy shit dude, I agree with everything you just said.
The worst part is that people will defend anything at this point...
What we have got this far in this "new trilogy" can not just be hand waved away as mistakes or simple lore ret-cons, like the prequel movies, this is obvious hatred for everything that those movies stood for, with what the creators think is a thin veil of contemp for us the fans.
My sentiments exactly. Bottomline is we got a shit president for Lucasfilm who only cares about making money and stoking her own ego, and a sniveling ass writer director who has no clue (and apparently no writing talent) that panders to her fetishes (and hence gets handed the keys to the new trilogy). One way us fans can do something is by boycotting the movies until we get someone who truly cares about our franchise. I bet George never saw this coming when he sold his company to Disney
Surely this is a joke? No one writes comments this long about a film that is made for family fun. Smh thought you were above this bud
Holy shit! This is the longest comment I've ever seen. Bro you have got to get a hobby. They killed Star Wars, let it RIP and move on lol
It's Personal funny ur name is "it's personal" and fail to see how personal some ppl took this movie. Imagine if your favorite hobby got hijacked by souless money grabbers. Wouldn't that be a bit personal?
The director even failed at deconstruction of Star Wars. Terrible story telling.
KotOR II was the best deconstruction thus far of Star Wars.
Needless to say I won't be watching Episode 9: The First Mary Sue
stinkopants I'll watch it on putlocker once it gets a good DVD quality version. I won't be giving them any more money for the Star Wars franchise.
You will. We all will.
stinkopants cmon man you know it will be Children of the Force lol
I haven’t seen this one... nor the next.
I hear the prequels are better!!
Episode IX 50 Shades of Rey
I said the same thing. Star Wars was the heroes journey which is a romantic notion. Post modernists don’t believe in romantic notions. That’s why Luke basically said nothing matters, Jedi, Sith, whatever. The movie also says there’s no heroes.
This is why things like original Star Wars and the lord of the rings will never meet their equals again...shame
Lol @ Disney for trying to add shades of grey to fucking Star Wars. What a bunch of morons.
covcomm1 There's nothing wrong with shades of grey, as that's actually what Luke alludes to real late in the Star Wars legends. That there is no light or dark side powers, that the use of the Force is based on the intent of the user. I'm not trying to defend the new SW though by any stretch, because it really does just destroy everything we already loved with it.
Ironically the original movie came out at the time when cinema was way too much into post modern and realist cinema. The Vietnam War and the cold war was going on. Yet a classic hero's tale of star wars became beloved because it gave people a fun, universal and hopeful message during a dark period in American history.
Agreed. I also think there is the simple idea of teaching right and wrong which is important for children to learn. There were no male figures that any child could look up to in this movie.
Totally agree. Felt like a hostile attack on Star Wars and fans
"fans" who had false expectations.
Naftul Zvi yes I expected a decent movie not garbage
It felt like it because it was. Horrid mess of Hutt vomit.
SJWs is attacking everything we love in life. We are under attack and we need to take the fight back to them, we need to boycott the SJW shit and let the companies know that if they go down the SJW route in making males weak and pathetic and do crappy shitty scripts, annoying CGI creatures, all of it, we will rain down hell itself on them and make them wish they was never born!
Or you are just overly sensitive and perceived it that way. I have loved Star Wars my whole life and viewed it as an attempt to finally ACTUALLY expand the universe a little bit and give us some new things to chew on.
I compare this movie to modern art, in order to subvert expectations it abandons what makes art good.
genkimachina - agreed. Most post-modernism is nothing but garbage. Hopefully though movies won’t continue down the post modernism trap to the point they forget how to make actual art, like art schools who fail to teach the fundamentals and have forgotten even how to sketch the human body.
Worse, it's deliberate destruction of art. It's the equivalent of buying Whistler's Mother to rub out the face and draw a stick figure! TLJ is the Mr Bean movie in real life!
I believe you don't know a thing about modern art, it's the only reason you would say that. Modern art starts in 1850 and ends in 1960, includes realism, impressionism, expressionism, cubism, futurism, dada, surrealism, abstract expressionism and a lot more and it's the most revolutionary and interesting period in art history
The most intellectual analysis of that abomination called "The Last Jedi". Thanks a lot!
No.
I'm calling it now. These are going to be the new Resident Evil movies. Different directors, different visions, not following previous versions story threads and so on.
To every Rian Johnson apologists who say that SWTLJ's poor rating comes from haters who can't let go of their childhood and can't deal with change. Reality Check. Imagine if Disney commissioned Rian Johnson to do a sequel to Da Vinci's painting “The Last Supper”. Then Rian Johnson took a can of spray paint and drew a big smiley face...OVER THE ORIGINAL canvas...“F@%k Composition. F@%k Art as a Discipline. F@%k the Subject. F@%k Contemplation. F@%k Masterful Story Telling. The Last Supper was overrated.”... but still needs the popularity of Da Vinci's original series to sell his shitty version.
Rian Johnson is actually The Joker......”all you people care about is story logic. This story deserves total nonsense and I’m gonna give it to ya”
Perseus Wong yeah , I heard shit like that when I absolutely had my heart broken by the Prequels. I proved them all wrong when TFA appeared and I loved it, followed by Rogue One which is decent. I rate films as I see them!
This one is entertaining but an absolute disaster for Star Wars
Perfectly Said...And what the hell is wrong with good memories of childhood?
Strange. I think that analogy sucks. Because the original trilogy was far from masterful. The Problem is you don#t hold the new movie to the standard of the old movies. They almost have the exact same "flaws". But oh no TLJ was soooo much worse. Because nostalgia.
What "flaws" are we talking about here? Could you elaborate further? Because i have seen thousands of other comments peddling this exact talking point before and 90% of the time it's idiots who never saw the original films regurgitating what they read off of some "news" website.
I'm really tired of everyone saying this was all about "expectations" etc. No, the movie is just not very good. Character decisions don't make sense, main characters we've known previously don't act like they should even though we aren't given a realistic expectation as to why, subplots go nowhere, the story treads water, mysteries are set up and then just dismissed, etc. etc. Tired of this bullshit narrative.
For me it was about "expectations"...
...I expected it to be good.
Brace Yourself Exactly.
Brace Yourself Totally agreed. There are far too many apologists for mediocrity.
Well, see, _you_ expected it to _make sense_ . Well _SURPRISE_ !
I've had so many people try to say that TFA was NEVER trying to set up and arcs, mysteries, intrigue, or questions to be answered in TLJ, and that it's just our own extrapolations on the film. Completely ridiculous.
What we received was Disney telling us to forget knowledge gained from the past and that old books should be burned.... sounds like a wonderful path to follow and idolize. And what do they offer us in return for destroying the past??? SJW themes and non-existent character development.
DigitallyTwisted Review what will happen instead, is that people will burn episodes 7 and 8, boycott 9 and stick with the originals.
I'll keep those around as an example of what no to do to a film franchise.
lol. You're cute. What do you call "I want to burn books Luke and Yoda?" Is that enlightenment themes. Nope.
Why were the books shown in a drawer on the Falcon? I'm not sure if I watched the real movie, but Rey was reverent about history (referring to Luke as a legend, and how that could be useful in the present). She keeps wanting to know about her own past (via her parents), and she's loyal to THE GOOD GUYS! Kylo was the main voice of not caring about the identity of someone's parents, or getting hysterical about destroying one particular ship (the one associated with his dad), and then he also ordered all of the guns to fire at Luke. He represents ... THE BAD GUYS. It kind of makes sense, doesn't it? Preserving history = the Resistance/Rebellion/Rey. Pretending the past didn't happen = Kylo Ren.
You know you have a weak argument when you have to put your main points in bold, right? Ok, while there is some truth in your statements you have blatantly ignored mine. That Luke and Yoda were more than willing to burn books (that's symbolism for destroying the past) and Luke wanted the Jedi to die. Yoda enthusiastically agreed and that the Jedi ways were flawed. Interesting, as seeing how Yoda lived and followed the Jedi ways his entire life, and that the Jedi strived to archive the past and its teachings. But let's not mention the obvious theme of "Here's your new Disney Princess and she is perfect in every way, so throw away the old ways of having to work for your talent."
To anyone who liked the Last Jedi and chastise OT fans for having “incorrect” expectations, let me ask this... If Rey decided to leave the Resistance in Ep 9 and go live in a mud-hut on a mud planet in Act 1; you’d be okay with this? If Poe wants to take up smuggling bootleg Resistance decoder rings and not be a pilot anymore... you’d be okay with this? Please.
This is hilarious comment!
If I could ask Ryan Johnson one question it would be :
How difficult was it to make the 8th installment in a series of films that you've never seen before?
Ask JJ that question, he's responsible for the mess that Rian had to work with.
Rian threw everything JJ built out the window which is unfortunate because while TFA wasn't a good movie, it could have been made better if TLJ followed through with the developments of the 1st film. I could have accepted Rey's meteoric rise in power in TFA if she had a special heritage or prior training, but nope she doesn't at all and her development looks dumber than ever.
well said
Confusion now has after that he has spoiled 40 years of movies. He must be a hired assassin sent from the future to do this.
malbowz 125
While I think Abrams went a bit too far in trying to ask shocking questions in TFA (Was it really necessary to bring back Luke's original lightsaber and leave that as a question to be answered as to how it was recovered?), I do agree with you that what Abrams brought into TFA could've been answered in satisfying ways. I think Johnson simply lacked the creativity to do it, or he didn't want any fan theory to be correct. If it turned out that Rey was previously trained and had lost her memory somehow, I would've been completely fine with that, and my view of TFA would've become much different and more accepting than it is now.
This analysis closely matches my theory, that this movie is actually a joke, a joke from someone who hates starwars and it's fans and whants to showe into our face like:
"haha, silly stupid starwars nerds see what I have done to your beloved franchise!".
So you're finally catching up on disney?
well I guess someone at disney saw that coming, but no one hat the balls to pull the plug.
This explains for me why they interfered with EA on the BF II bullshit, they now sucessfully enraged two communities.
In the end pissing off the fans results in less money, I don't think thats disneys intent, unless they are really really stupid.
It’s not the writer or directors job in any movie to cater to what you want. News flash, what you want is not important sorry to tell you.
That's an interesting approach to selling a product.
well and I thougt the goal of the big blockbuster movie business is to make tons of money, completly ignoring what the suspected audiance expects seems to be a bold move, it's it ?
Well maybe I am wrong and this isn't a "big blockbuster" movie, maybe its an artmovie cleverly disguised with a star wars label.
Luke didn't just have a moment of weakness. He thought about killing him, armed himself, walked all the way to Ben's tent, broke in and then engaged his lightsaber. Those are several moments, premeditated.
The real Luke walked into certain death just because he could detect a sliver of good in Darth Vader. He literally kicks Vader's ass, yet refuses to kill him. He throws his lightsaber aside, even.
This is an evil doppelganger not Luke Skywalker.
Mephilis 78 lol
Mephilis 78 Mark Hamill said that he had to pretend he was playing "Jake Skywalker" cause Luke was so different
Luuke Skywalker
Yes, evil doppelganger named Jake Skywalker.
Luuuke Skywalker maybe?
11:00 Worse, they actually recruit those children to be child-soldiers in the war by using their super cool, totally rad secret decoder rings (available soon at a Walmart near you!)
And remember, Rose was electrocuting any diserters who tried to escape the doomed ship.
This is the first time I've ever left a theatre after seeing a Star Wars film feeling like my money had been stolen from me.
I wont be going to the cinema to watch anymore star wars movies. I was a massive fan for many years.
Your loss, this was the first SW film since ANH where we don't actually know what's going to happen next.
There is a difference between being surprised be a movie and it being being ludicrous. The movie was not star wars, this movie is not my cannon. I will no longer be supporting Disney and Star Wars, their films are poor at best. The movie reeks of political agendas.
Agree 100% and same here.
We need to boycott the hell out of this SJW Star Wars shit! Star Wars is dead!
Naftul Zvi No not our loss, you can take this shit and put it between Spiderman 3 and The Room in your crappy collection. You know the one with 2016 GB! You can buy it with your new copy of The Labyrinth as you warn out your VHS copy staring at David Bowie's ball sack!
Everyone knows this film was total crap and everyone should of demanded their money back so that they couldn't claim this shit was in the top 20 of greatest films ever. It is not, it is shit!
My BIG question is why? Why make a film that screws over everything the fans like be about it?
I think I know why. They thought that a younger cast would help them sell more action figures. But they wanted the old cast for promotion reasons, and then they had to ridicule them so that they would not steal the spotlight from the younger case. Of course that made the plot nonsensical but they thought that the people are stupid and will fall for everything with the Star Wars logo. The good reception that TFA got (where all of this shit started, with Luke disappearing etc) gave them the idea that they can do whatever they want. This what happens when board executives make the story and not a proper story writer....
It's because Disney is trying to replace the older, long-term fans with new fans who have no idea wtf Star Wars actually is. The first step they took was declaring the EU non-canon (despite the fact that one of the characters in it was voted to be more popular than fucking Darth Vader. RIP Darth Revan). Then they cancel the wildly popular and successful TCW cartoon, replacing it with the vastly inferior and wildly mixed Rebels cartoon.
Then they pull this crap, undoing EVERYTHING to make a clean slate that they can spout whatever bullshit they want to tell merchandise to clueless youngsters, thinking that they can also feed in the usual SJW social commentary too. But they fucked up. They didn't learn from EA's mistake, which is to NEVER fuck with Star Wars in such a way. Now, literally every non-paid-by-Disney review is calling TLJ crap, and people believe the independent reviewers more than the shills under the producer's pockets any day. Everyone is discouraging others from watching TLJ and buying any merchandise. Hell, TLJ's screening rates have dropped by almost 70% since opening day purely because it was that bad. So bad that people felt compelled to warn others to not watch it.
A good deconstruction still respects what came before. Last Jedi is just some bullshit.
Deconstructionism is disrespectful in and of itself.
Or feigns being disrespectful until the last moment, where it shows its true love of the source material. I'm thinking of Unforgiven, and how it tries for most of the movie to show disrespect for tropes of the western genre ("It doesn't matter who draws faster", "Killing ain't that easy", etc.)... and at the last moment turns 180° with a beautiful scene that is a homage to classic westerns, monologue and all (the last cantina scene, "I've killed just about everything that walks or crawled at one time or another.")
It's like, it deconstructs the genre only to build it again within the same movie.
Perfectly said. Roses sister sacrifices herself, purple hair sacrifices herself, Rose thinks dooming everyone is better than Finn sacrificing himself
I was hoping Ray was Lord Palpatine's daughter. Hidden from Sidious for Ray's protection or by him as a back up plan.
Palpatine wouldn't limit himself to affection or relationship. And he'd definitely want all powerful Rey over hermit Luke.
Couldn't be Palpatine's daughter since she is too young (over 30 years since the events of ROTJ). Wookieepedia has her being born 11 years after the Battle of Endor for what that's worth. Granddaughter perhaps...or even great-granddaughter since Palps could have had a child way back before he was even recruited by Plagueis.
Rey is a skywalker, she is the child of Leia and Jabba (conceived while Leia was a slave at Jabbas palace). Rey's nose is actually a prosthetic, underneath she has gross jabba nostrils. This is why Rey never breathes through her nose.
I wouldn’t of cared who’s descendent she was, as long it was an explanation for why she was so over powered.
ian dick nice guess
Dear fans all over the world, I know next movie can't possibly be worse than Last Jedi, and you all, just like me, want to see it, but I beg you not to do that. Lets show Disney what part of their audience they are going to lose, and that we matter too.
Definitely not on opening weekend, at least.
Honestly, no. I don't want to see the next film. Saying that makes me sick, I watched every damn prequel and TFA in the theatres, opening night, stayed right through Attack of the Killer Tomatoes, er, Clones. This was the last straw. This movie left me depressed not so much with Luke's fate but with the distinct message that Disney doesn't want me to see the next film because I remember too much of what made Star Wars great.
ESB which had a pretty downer ending but which left a couple of compelling plot threads that all but guaranteed you'd show up again. This movie basically crapped all over Luke's character and then killed him, the next one doesn't have Leia even if I gave much of a crap what happens to her character, doesn't have Han anyway, and doesn't have a single new character who has a personality, actor, or characteristic I could give a shit about. Even if they paid Mark Hamill twice what he got in TLJ and brought him back as a Force ghost it wouldn't convince me to show up, not even if they gave him half an hour of screentime or more ... because it wouldn't make up for this shit film, and never will.
I promise you mate, I will not see it. I am 40 years old, and I knew all the dialogue of the original trilogy by heart before I knew how to speak English... I was watching them every weekend through primary and high school and then every once in a while until now. Prequels included.
I don't think I'll see it either, then again Matinee here is 4.75 so I didn't pay much for this crap. We'll see in a few years
It can get worse. It can always get worse.
Disney and Rian Johnson made me think the phantom menace is a great movie lol
eduvicino they assured me that Attack of The Clones is a very well made movie. This is a huge feat by Disney / Ryan Johnson
It made me think the holiday special is a good movie.
talk about overreacting
lucas didnt make the prequels for money??!!! hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
eduvicino I honestly think this film is as bad as the Phantom Menace, the only worse Star Wars film is Attack of the Clones!
There's an old bit of advice for authors: "write what you know." For years now it's been painfully apparent that none of the writers - or creators or screenwriters or directors or producers or actors - in Hollywood know what heroism actual is. They simply don't get as they've never experienced it in their lives and don't know anyone personally who has either. The entertainment industry in general is not a system that rewards heroic behavior - otherwise vermin like Harvey Weinstein would be the rare exception instead of the actual norm that they are.
Thus they can't handle anything to do with actual heroism. At best they can only portray "heroes" as the broken, dysfunctional, neurotic, craven things they see all around them who are called heroes strictly for publicity purposes - and who are terrified of their lie being exposed.
Hence Hollywood's turning all the heroes of Battlestar Galactica into nihilistic assholes in the "reimagined" reboot of that series. Hence Hollywood's turning the heroes of Star Wars into what we just saw on the screen with "The Last Jedi." None of those screenwriters or directors could handle the Luke Skywalker that was courageous enough to have destroyed the Death Star. Nor could they have handled the Luke Skywalker who was strong enough and dedicated enough to have defeated Darth Vader - DARTH VADER - in single combat and came within a hair's breadth of killing him. Nope, they couldn't deal with that.
So, they made that actual heroic character into this craven neurotic sniveling emo thing. It was so bad that even Mark Hamill has publicly declared how wrong it was - but went along with it due to all the money he was being paid and thereby demonstrating that there really aren't any heroes in Hollywood.
If you look at the writeups and statements made by the directors and producers of the new Star Wars films it's all about "diversity" and "representation" and "women's empowerment" - the full "social justice warrior" dogma. That was far more important than telling good stories or having great acting up on the screen. This, to the point that they've willfully ignored Carrie Fisher's doing all that back in the 70's with the first Star Wars film. Her actions and her role however, don't matter now because she didn't do all that for today's "social justice warrior" ideology. She just gave that performance in that role because it was good acting of a good character. Unless the whole point of it was to show how properly "woke" you are then it just doesn't matter.
So, once again the nihilism that infests these "social justice" types has destroyed yet another cultural icon. It seems that's all they're able to do.
Spot on. But it's not just a sort of contempt for heroism. They hate the pure light-hearted way that people enjoy these films. They secretly dislike the fans and the naive, suspension of disbelief that comes with these films.
The new disney Star wars trilogy are basically the complete opposite of the prequels. As films they are superior, better acted, directed, visuals and on the surface look better. However, if you dig deeper into the core of the prequels you find a strong passion and foundation of a story and build in to a greater story.
As for the new trilogy if you dig into the core you find nothing, it is empty, rather than building onto the universe they have repeated all of the same ideas with more dated characters and themes, they have no idea where they are going, different writers with different visions trying to write their own movies instead of sequels and continuations without any consideration to what came before.
Therefore as films the new trilogy are better, but as star wars stories and part of the larger universe as well as creatively, the prequels will have more substance to them than anything JJ or Rian have given us.
Storymaker2 agreed. To a degree. I think the editing and direction wasn't better as it's overly long (as well as shit for a host of other reasons).
Only visual... It can't be a good directed film if it wasn't even a film. It was a bunch a beautiful images that made no sense together.
valid point
Since TFA & TLJ has glaring plot holes and character development, i cannot agree that these are better movies. If they were just empty but at least logical , i would agree.
Valid point, I was talking more in terms of visuals, acting and such , you could drive a train through the plot holes
1. The First Order must have unlimited wealth to rebuild after Starkiller base is destroyed. (It must have had unlimited money to build that base at all.)
2. They must pay their soldiers extremely well - why would you join them? Why would anyone join them after the fall of Starkiller base?
3. 1-800-henchme(n) must have an unlimited number of storm trooper replacements.
4. The First Order is able to build itself up to the point of creating Starkiller without the Republic preemptively striking, or stopping the organaization with military action.
5. For some reason, there are still "rebels" running around, instead of a Republic fleet that is orders of magnitude more powerful than a fledgling First Order could muster.
6. We have no idea what the source of the First Order's wealth is. They can simply buy unlimited star destroyers from greedy capitalists... The Empire could tax the galaxy, but the First order was not an established goverment.
7. General Hux is not dead. How is he not dead when serving Snoke and failing that badly? I mean, he lost Starkiller base!
These are just preliminary problems with the story, before getting into the issues issues with mechanics, plot, and and complete lack of believability of the characters. What's unbelievable about them?
1. Rey is a Mary Sue.
2. Poe cannot be killed and can dismantle every turbo cannon on a star destroyer.
3. Luke is a bitter old man who wants to die, when he was anything but that when we last saw him. He is weak and easily dispatched by Rey, who has never practiced swordsmanship.
4. Chewy just goes to find Luke with Rey, like Han never died, and is a comedy relief sidekick, for all intents and purposes.
5. Hux is so dumb he doesn't know what we've all known since episode 4: smaller fighters evade turbo cannons and you have to scramble your fighters.
6. Snoke is killed so easily, when he should have heard the lightsaber moving, felt its vibrations, or read it in Kylo's mind. He's super powerful, but the source of his abilities are never explained.
7. No one can explain why Kylo chose the Darkside, what he's conflicted about, or why he follows Snoke at all. Why do Snoke's guards fight Kylo to the death after he killed Snoke? Why do they care?
8. Why would Laura Dern's character refuse to answer a direct question, from an officer, about the plan? And, how are she and Leia on the same page? And, why don't she and Poe know eachother?
9. How did Leia gain the ability to fly and survive space? Why would she be mad at Poe for losing bombers when she has zero issue losing the entire fleet and all its ships to escape and hide? Why doesn't Leia get the Republic to act to prevent Starkiller base from being made in the first place?
The Last Jedi Was Almost A Star Wars Movie
- We Almost got to see a Lightsaber Duel
- Those jokes were Almost funny
- There was Almost an exciting chase through space
- Somebody Almost sensed a disturbance in the Force
- We Almost got dialog that fit the Star Wars universe
- That Almost looked and moved like Yoda
- Supreme Leader Snoke Almost foresaw that coming
- Two people Almost said "May the Force be with you" to each other
- We Almost heard someone say "I have a bad feeling about this"
- We Almost found out that Rey's parents were important
- Those Almost weren't the Droids we were looking for
- It was Almost the Star Wars Holiday Special
- It was Almost a script Mark Hamill agreed with
- Rian Johnson Almost deserves an Academy award
- Let's hope JJ Abrams doesn't Almost make a Star Wars movie with the next one
The 'Almost' Was Strong With This One. It was Almost a Star Wars movie, but close only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades.
I Almost liked it.
If George Lucas made this same exact movie fans would shit on him. This is a sad excuse for a Star Wars film.
I agree. Although George would never make TFA or TLJ, he's too creative for making a rehash of own films. It required true imaginative "talents"... or lack of.
Brandon Lane I actually think Lucas would have made a terribly dull film but at least he’s seen he films before it and would have tried to have some progression from 7. This entire film was like the ‘Midichlorians!’ which ruined The Force, but applied en masse
intruder313
Allow me to disagree about Midi-Chlorians. Even in the very first film (A New Hope now) it was said that Force is stronger with some people than others. When Luke found out that Leia is his sister he came to conclusion that she "has that power too", because they have the same father. He was right, so biology does have something to do with it.
Now. Force is still this energy binding the galaxy. Midi-Chorians are just micro organisms, so like living organisms, they also are connected to the Force. When they work together with the host, the Force connection is stronger, so host can use "Force powers". Like having one person trying Force, against 1000 people focusing it. But you need training to do it most effectively.
This theme was better explored in Darth Plagueis novel, which I recommend, since it's amazing.
In new films you just use the Force I guess. No training, just be strong in Force... and use it. How? Why? Who knows. So Midi-Chlorians make more sense than new films.
David is DEAD-ON with the "deconstructionist" theme...they used it to destroy Luke's legacy of OT heroism, and they used it to virtue signal about income inequality on the Casino planet, voiced by the horrible and utterly pointless character 'Rose.'
How? We know practically nothing about Luke, we see 4 years of his mid 20's in the OT and that's it. He spent decades alone as the last of his kind and when he tried to become a mentor and expand his kind it was burned down by a force of his own creation.
Virtue signaling about income inequality? Wtf? You're TRYING to see that. All they did was give us a perspective of the SW universe that we've never seen on the big screen, profiting off of war even if it's supporting a dictatorship. Rose is that faceless rebel officer we see running around in the OT and gave us again another perspective we haven't seen before.
They deconstruct Star Wars
We deconstruct the money we would pay for the tickets and merchandise
Naftul Zvi Dude I read your comments in the other section. You ended your comments by claiming everyone who hated it was a Whit supremacist NAZI. It's clear you don't see anything other then that.
What sucks is that a good deconstruction can revitalize a genre or franchise by reinforcing its messages. This just destroyed star wars and added nothing.
I've watched better fan films...in fact, going forward, I hope fans keep making more films. Some might be bad, some will be good, but most will be better than TLJ.
Agreed - those films may be poorly produced but they usually are designed to be respectful to the established storyline rather than disrespectful.
The only expectation I had was to watch a good movie. That was it. Instead, I handed my money over to watch a horrible movie that seemed driven only to make money, and shit on everything that was established in the prior films.
And worse, I and many others have been straight up attacked for not liking it, and ridiculed for voicing their opinions and feelings about this horrible movie.
I paid to see the fucking thing, Disney made their money off of me and I feel I paid to vocalize and express my opinion.
If you liked it fine, but fuck anyone who feels the need to criticised the folks that didn't.
YES! And from what I see recently, the whole media is agaisnt those who didn't like the new SW. Like: "Why you are retarded if you are one the FEW who didn't liked the new SW". Thats basically what I'm reading in some articles.
That is the whole SJW mode of operation though. Crap on your lawn and call you inept for turning your nose up at it. I've literally read posts calling Star Wars fans a cancer to Star Wars.
By that same token, fuck anyone who feels the need to criticize the folks that did like it. I find that way more tiring. Very nice people who liked it get unnecessarily attacked for just liking a fucking movie.
Star Wars Episode 9 PLOT LEAK REVEAL!
Princess Leia dies offscreen due to a wicked First Order plot led by General Hux, who then retires & becomes a clown in a travelling circus.
Ray, Rose & Finn develop a love triangle. Rose becomes pregnant, & everyone is happy until Rose & Rey decide they dont need a man in their life. The baby is born, and grows up with 2 Mummies. Rose tells Finn he must return to the planet Canto Bight & turn them from their terrible ways.
Finn spends an hour of screen time preaching the way of love & pacifism to the residents of Canto Bight & fails to convert a single person as they are all so terrible. The mission is hailed as a great success.
Ray finally pursuades Kylo Ren to turn to the Lightside. He orders the disarming of the First Order, and they become the Galaxys Peace Corps. rebuilding everything they have destroyed.
Poe comes out of the closet after Finn marries Rose, and unable to live in a future so empty of everything he loves (War & Finn), kills himself. Nobody notices except BB8, who goes "Boo-hoo-doop".
C3PO & R2D2 become servants of the Canto Bight Institution for Cute orphans & entertain the kids in 30 seconds of screen time.
Chewbacca (now a Vegetarian) becomes a farmer on Kashyyk.
Scientists discover a way to make every new baby become female.
Ray, having ended war in the Galaxy is elected President of the Union of Galactic Planets & presides over a time of peace & happiness for ever, as the Force makes her Immortal & gives her the power to change the mind of anyone who disagrees with her, as they are obviously wrong.
THE END.
I forgot to add, Captain Phasma sneaks into Finns house to get revenge, steps on a squeaky wheeled toy Bantha & impales herself on her own spear, thus accomplishing nothing in 3 screen outings.
lol this is brilliant. Well done!
"Ray finally pursuades Kylo Ren to turn to the Lightside. He orders the disarming of the First Order, and they become the Galaxys Peace Corps. rebuilding everything they have destroyed."
It would not surprise me if this would really happen
Wow I was thinking what if they decide to make Rey and Rose, like Kora and Asami from the legend of Korra since there's been talk about gay characters appearing in Star Wars, nothing will surprise me anymore. Some of this my actually happen.
Dude, forgot that it's got to be a singing musical like Moana too.
The biggest mistake made was trying to lecture the audience politically. One of the reasons the original was so successful is it was myth and fantasy at a time when all movies were trying to force a political opinion post Vietnam war. All was guilt and negativity. Stars Wars reminded us that pure fun was what was missing from the movies.
waslurkinginspace now its a part of that political cynicism
Umm do you not think there's a political message in a story about a war between a huge authoritarian military empire and a group of idealistic freedom fighters???
On point. Definitely intentionally done by Disney.
SoCal Native Why would Disney _intentionally_ do this though? Isn’t that counter-productive to the brand they’re trying to squeeze every last cent out of?
Perhaps the bottom line is not as important as using this franchise to spread their political messages
don't kid yourself. rian johnson told us exactly what he was doing in the movie: "let the past die. kill it if you have to."
he effectively killed the past. he thinks by doing that, he could make the movie that was meant to be.
Androth Brilliant observation...
Androth it does look that way. Either that, or he and KK just don’t really know or understand Star Wars. Rian says he’s a Star Wars fan, but of course he’s going to say that, imagine the outcry if he said he wasn’t. And I doubt KK has seen the original trilogy more than a few times. So a mix of that, and the Disney agenda to kill the past and move forward looks like what’s going on.
"Let the past die, kill it if you have to"....and replace it with....what? Cardboard characters with no connections to family and barely any to each other? A universe where now the Force is not special anymore (to borrow from the Incredibles, when everyone is (potentially) special, no one is)? A story that is now 2/3rds finished and there are no clear goals or obstacles other than "survive" for the heroes?
Disney has botched this big time. They had no plan, they've admitted that publicly, and it sure does show. The brainchild of George Lucas, which grew and was honed over many years and many, many story drafts is now just a playground for hot-shit of the moment directors to come and fart around in - one and done. Fail to plan, plan to fail. And Kathleen Kennedy said she would "protect and honor George's creation" or words to that effect. Shame.
This is a mess from a storytelling position, which hey, newsflash Disney, actually matters. You can't just rehash a prior episode (A New Hope -The Force Awakens) and then destroy that rehashed narrative by ignoring it and many important previous events and character types (like who Luke IS) in The Last Jedi. They've given us two turkeys now - the first one leftovers, the second one jive. They ought to release them at Thanksgiving instead of Christmas.
This was the greatest and most beloved cinematic story in movie history, and they don't even see that they've failed it in a few fundamental ways. Just mind boggling and incredibly sad.
indeed. this movie is so bad that i would rather watch a jar jar binks compilation on repeat for 2 hours rather than sit through it again.
don't kid yourself. his intention was to kill the past and start over with a blank slate. this is exactly what we see in this turd of a movie.
Say what you will about the prequels they gave us Revenge of the Sith which is a masterpiece. Revenge of the Sith had depth, heart, action, light saber battles, and a coherent compelling story. The Lost Jedi lacks so many of these qualities
I agree
Revenge Of The Shit was not a masterpiece.
Revenge of the Sith was merely watchable, inlike the execreble TLJ. It was hardly a masterpiece.
+Remote Prophecy Productions The Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones were just as good.
@@CelestialWoodway It is, compared to most movies today.
They really did screw up Star Wars. The Force Awakens was bad, but this makes me not want to watch a new Star Wars film again. Especially the way they handled Luke. I agree with Mark Hamill when he was saying that he disagreed with what they did with his character. Was not good and was a slap in the face of all he accomplished in the original trilogy. Luke is my favorite character in Star Wars and now he’s been made a loser... great. The character development that essentially made it as if he was going to build a better Jedi Order and do the best in making sure what happened to the old Order didn’t happen again. But this trilogy says “No, he just failed like the other Jedi’s before him.” I really wish Lucas’s stories were used and he was involved in the creative process as a consultant. Whatever you want to say about George Lucas, there’s no denying he crafts some of the best stories in the film industry. He should’ve made sure a clause was in place in his agreement or contract made up when he signed everything over to Disney for all that to be implemented no matter what. But I guess that’s hindsight for you.
Jared Wignall TFA made me not want to watch another Star Wars movie. Luke and Han's character destruction was accomplished there. The nonsense of The First Order's name, existance and Power in the face of the Republic's ignorance of it's existance made a logical sequel impossible,
Anyone who says TFA is bad opinion holds no merit
Cool argument Hoopers.
Meh. Each to their own. I like TFA. Yeah the 'ANH plot rehash' criticism is definitely valid, but I think after 3 divisive prequels they just wanted to get of to a solid start and then build upon it. So in TFA I enjoyed the freshened upgrade on classic visuals, the new characters and the best thing I liked was the intriguing questions and plots that were potentially being layed out.
Unfortunately. TLJ wasted, ignored, or dropped most of these questions. 😑
In Luke's most dramatic moment in his life he confronts Vader,
learns he is his father
and loses an arm
...yet as a TRUE Hero he doesnt give up and in the next movie he comes back & ends up defeating the Emperor and the Empire.
....and now this uncreative director "Rian Johnson" says Luke went deppressed just because they took down his Jedi temple and some of his students
.....Yeahhh right,
Luke is StarWars, Luke is the Symbol of Good, Hope, the Jedi, the Good side,
The Real Luke would have never quitted.
This Rian Johnson rookie director made a winking, funny, drinking space cow milk Luke, a more " Mark Hamill Luke"
We absolutely love Mark Hamill and his awesome personality
...But we didnt ask for a "Mark Hamill Luke"
We want a Luke Skywalker Luke.
Thats why we don't accept his error, mistake representation of the Real true warrior Luke that we fans met in the Original Triology.
The original trilogy was created on a blank canvas, so mysteries (like who is the Emperor) were normal and used in service of the story. The 'Last Jedi' was made based on the mythology of 40 years. So the audience who spend 2billion on 'Force Awakens' (some of them went to the theater more than once) have expectations. As a result 'The Last Jedi' treats the audience like buffoons and the reactions are completely rational. Mind you the reactions this time are not coming from canon expert fan-boys, but also from normal audience who have simply seen all or some of the Star Wars movies..
Agree - you can't watch the previous seven chapters in a row and get to this 8th chapter and get the impression you are continuing the same story...my impression was "what is this???" They didn't "take the story in a different direction" as they are spinning - they started telling a different story and destroyed the established story.
Andy Dufresne Then fuck your expectations, your expectations aren't an excuse to drag down a movie. What's your point?
Naftul Zvi What's wrong with expectations? Star Wars has a huge fan base, and they have expectations. Why shouldn't they? Who is this movie targeted for, if not the fans? Would TFA have made 2 billion without the fans?
So I can give you a few rational expectations that the MAJORITY of fans and normal spectators had for this sequel: 1. Treat old characters honourably and give them a honorary closure. 2. Answer questions and mysteries that remain ananswered from TFA. 3. Make new characters interesting and give them fulfilling arks 4. Make a good movie.
TLJ fails spectacularly at ALL of the above. So it's normal that the audience and fans will react. Get over it.
Yeah, fuck expectations. They can make Episode 9 take place in 1643, rural England, the civil war of the roundheads and cavaliers. Just start calling random characters Chewie or Luke and it's fine.
"What's your point?" The point was that the 8th chapter in a saga is supposed to be the continuation of the same story being told in the previous 7 chapters of the same exact saga. What is so crazy in your mind about expecting that?
The Last Jedi is a Deconstruction of the Star Wars Franchise and this is not a good idea. Ex. the Force is changed to magic. A little kid can do it, and apparently others who do not have any Jedi training.
That's how it was in the OT before the prequels made it convoluted. This is literally a franchise made for children (according to Lucas himself).
Naftul Zvi No? Luke had no idea of his force abilities until he came across Obi wan. Wtf are you even talking about? Have you even seen the original movies?
The last jedi was the worst star wars movie ever. I did not think it was possible after watching rogue one, the prequels and even the christmas special.
David you got yourself a subscriber. An excellent analysis of TLJ, thank you for expressing what many experienced after watching TLJ. Rian Johnson's intent was purposeful in everything he scripted, the proof is on the screen. Disney is complicit as well as is Kennedy. TLJ was a propaganda film through and through, written with hubris, narcissism and arrogance. The mis-direction of the trailers were planned with careful thought to fleece us of our money. In Rian Johnson's Star Wars universe, good doesn't prevail over evil but instead capitulates past good deeds so that evil has a fair shot at winning. Upon closer examination, Rian Johnson's TLJ is an open window to his inverted held beliefs and his contempt for good. The Last Jedi = The Anti Jedi
To think people couldn't predict this after they gave us the big "fuck you" in The Force Awakens.
I knew this movie was gonna be garbage after they put out the Force Awakens. I pirated it today and was not surprised. The Last Jedi is an INSULT to Star Wars fans.
Three months ago they gave us post modern Star Trek, today we have the post modern Star Wars. At the center of both is Abrams. Social nihilism is now all there is in media.
And the postmodern Alien.
Post-modernist are a cancer to society
The biggest fears of Star Wars fans has came true. The mouse killed our favorite thing. We saw it coming when Lucas sold out!
Just for your information, when Lucas sold Lucasfilm, he also sold the scripts for SW 7-9. Kathleen Kennedy promised in front of the camera that she would use the scripts and turn them into movies. Then as soon as Lucas left the room she threw the scripts in the bin. Since then she is lying in every promotion event. And Lucas gave almost all the money he took from selling SW to charities and to help kids with cancer. I would not call him a "sold out". They guy deserves some respect IMO
Dean Cory He is the creator of Star Wars. He can do with it as he pleases. But do you really think he doesn't care? He had ideas of how to continue the franchise. Those ideas got discarded because they don't care about the world and stories he created. All they care is about money. He should have never sold it to Disney but perhaps he was a little naive by thinking they wouldn't rape his legacy. Still it's not his fault that current works are awful.
chrichtonsworld
I can't help but think Lucas is getting a kick out of the backlash.
George Lucas was a wunderkind with special effects, but he was a terrible screenwriter. Watch episodes 1, 2, and 3 again to get a reminder and realize that those were his unadulterated vision. There was no one this time with the stones to reign him in or fix his "brilliance" in the editing room. While the original trilogy had some real pros with latitude to right the ship, those other three are pure Lucas.
George Lucas deserved to sell out. If I had some object sitting on my kitchen counter collecting dust and I had no intentions of ever dusting it off and using it... guess what? I’d absolutely sell it for a shit load of money.
"you know what, I have purple hair, I'll do the kamakaize"hahaa pure gold
16:06 Whatever I want to call it? Well, I think Johnson's ego is so big he poisoned Star Wars and expects us to applaud.
18:10 "They free the horses but not the children".... That's such an excellent observation. What does that tell us about the makers of this 'Star Wars'?
Actually they used "horses" to escape and free them by the way. And what were they supposed to do after freeing children? Leave them in the wilds like "horses"? Take them to the war zone? It seems really like nitpicking to me. Slavery is sad but usual thing in Star Wars universe.
But why introduce this into the movie in the first place? Are they going to waste screen time going back to casino planet in the future and free the slave kids?
It was just there to say "Look at how evil these rich people are. They even have slave kids." Why did the story have it? No reason. It was just a thinly veiled quasi-political message that made my brain want to die. They could have just as easily not had slaves to the same effect story wise.
Oh I'm sure there is a reason. Kids sitting in the movie theater, that's why. Those kids came out of left field, so don't be surprised if they return in a spin-off. The name of the game is money, not making the best movie you can make.
underscoopfire.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/spaceballs-2-the-search-for-more-money.jpg
Strip away all things Star Wars and this film would be nothing but a brutally awful and broken amateur attempt at writing. The level of insult to me cuts deeper than the damage to the Star Wars legacy or characters but more to the general insult to it's own viewers intelligence. The entire 2nd act was not just a complete waste of time it was an INTENTIONAL waste of time. That to me tells me the writers of this film intentionally crafted it to waste the viewers time with marketing garbage that served no purpose in any way shape or form. Insulting your audience is not the best way to go about crafting a film.
Furthermore the failure of the Disney era Star Wars is a complete and utter lack of long term vision outside of abject profit. I'm a businessman so don't mistake my belief in profit but where so many modern film franchises fail is no long term perspective or grounding goal. JJ Abrams rocketed to stardom with a TV show Lost that failed here specifically. A unique show with an extremely intriguing premise that kept you coming back only to watch it fall apart and eventually die in a far off corner of the world where any sensible story crafter would wager was in no way logical. The writers of Lost finalized the story in a manner which showed they never had any coherent direction. I remember vividly conversations with fans who vehemently denied the show had no direction or vision. Instead they defended JJ as a genius taking you on a magical journey only for that reality to fall flat on its face. Lost is equally a great example of JJ abandoning story lines and ignoring uncomfortable plot elements without conscience. Star Wars fails in the same manner. Not only is it brutally obvious these films are being written on a whim with no underlying vision. Instead it "reads" like a dozen Disney executives handed the authors a list of mandatory fan service moments and casting decisions and then demanded they cram it all into some kind of story.
The Force Awakens in true JJ Abrams fashion beat fans over the head with specific plot devices designed to drive intrigue. Who is Snoke, who is Rey, what happened to Luke, why did Kylo turn and who are the Knights of Ren? etc etc etc. Then in the very sequel they deliberately abandoned these story lines in such an insulting fashion is not only a poor business decision but just flat out amateurish. It's the film comparison of fake holding a dog treat in your hand to tease your dog then opening your hand empty in front of them. It's a pathetic story device to intentionally tease an audience then insult them for caring about it and instead tell them it's stupid and meaningless.
Frankly this is what killed the movie for me. I dont care about all the feminist junk or the precious Star Wars arguments. This is a bad film period that will only survive because it is Star Wars. It shouldn't be that difficult to make an intriguing Star Wars film today that serves both new and classic fans adequately but they seem to have zero interest in doing this. Instead the Last Jedi came off feeling like a social experiment about how hard a popular pop culture franchise can insult their core customer base and still retain their business.
I think I'm going to watch the room now. Much better film.
Fangornmmc shots fired...
What a story, Mark!
IM TIREEEERRRRDDD I’m wasted... I love you Darling...
Look up "Star Wars With Tommy Wiseau." It was hilarious ahead of TLJ's release, now it's both hilarious and sad at the same time.
You are tearing me apart Rian Johnson!
Rather then skillfully and cleverly confound audience expectations in an interesting way; it is a blatant and ruthless attack on audience expectations. Expectations aside the movie generally sucks it looks nice and that is about it.
Who the fuck makes a movie with audience expectations in mind? God you people have your heads so far up your own asses.
Naftul, have you ever read a connected series of books? Or watched a number of movies with connected plots? Have you watched any T.V. shows with a long running, non-episodic story? If you have, I feel like the idea of audience expectations in this context should make perfect sense. Imagine Lord of the Rings. Do you think there was no expectation that Frodo would have a long tough journey to Mordor? Or that there would be some confrontation with Saruman and Sauron? Imagine if Saruman died of a heart attack, Frodo had no difficulty trying to take the ring to Mordor, and Sauron never tried to have his huge armies attack anywhere. These were set up in the narrative of The Fellowship of the Ring book/movie for the audience to expect, the Fellowship of the Ring created audience expectations through the events and characters contained in the story. If it unfolded like the above examples, the story would be disappointing largely because people were expecting clashes and struggles, character growth and questions answered, that were set up in the first tale of a trilogy. What happened to Gandalf and the Balrog? How will the fellowship survive being split? What struggles will Frodo overcome? What will Aragorn do about his heritage?
The Force Awakens raised mysteries: "Who are the knights of rin? How is Rey so powerful? What is Luke doing, it's probably significant since he left a map, and no one has heard from him, and that last cliffhanger scene was intense and will have some dramatic payoff after that big set-up. Who is Snoke and how did the First Order get so strong, and how can they recover from their main base and most powerful weapon being destroyed? Who are Rey's parents?" These, along with several others, were set up to be important plot points by TFA. When you literally have millions of fans openly talking about expectations surrounding these plot points, which undoubtedly RJ picked up on, you are fairly obligated to do something with that knowledge if you want to please your audience. What he chose to do was to subvert and ignore them, which is the main cause of fan uproar at this film.
Ian Schoen We know who the knights of Ren are, we know why Rey is powerful, we saw visions of Luke in TFA of him on the ground looking defeated with a burning building in the background, they literally rule the universe they are gigantic like the Empire, Rey's parents were never relevant and they never hinted at anything, the fans and fanatics went into fanficing, it was never set up as an important plot point.
"When you literally have millions of fans openly talking about expectations surrounding these plot points, which undoubtedly RJ picked up on, you are fairly obligated to do something with that knowledge if you want to please your audience."
Why? Why is that a thing? Why are you as a special snowflake need your ego's stroked and your fanfiction seen on screen? Why is that an obligation? How do you sift through millions of voices?
Okay, since you ignored my main point about how sequenced stories create audience expectations, how can I better answer you? I honestly don't intend to disrespect you (though you seem fairly keen on insulting others), but I'm not understanding why you think it's ridiculous for people to be upset when they have arcs and expectations built up, then thrown away, or how you seem to think that TFA had no intrigue or raised
no questions that the audience might want answered. How was Rey's parents not a mystery, particularly combined with her prodigious connection with the force that dwarfs every other known force user when they were starting out? How was Snoke not a character with mystery, and tons of power, that we wanted to know more about? To our knowledge, the sith were wiped out in episode VI, so who is this guy?
As for millions of voices, I never said that they were expected to copy and paste whatever fan theory was most popular, but rather recognize that, since TFA created so many expectations of drama and intrigue, that people were looking for some narrative payoff that was deeper than "Rey's parents are no one, she's just the best that ever was with the force." Or "Snoke? We don't have any answers to his identity, or how the First Order rose to power, we're just going to kill him without a fight." Surprising? Certainly. Satisfying? For many, no. Entertainment is subjective, and I'm not saying that one thing will please everyone. I am saying, however, that had they capitalized, not bastardized, the expectations for drama, interesting reveals, and story progression, that I honestly don't think are even a tiny stretch to say were set up in TFA, there would be many less people so upset with this film.
Also, did you read my example about LotR? You didn't really respond as to whether or not you still think sequenced stories can set up expectations (which aren't fanfic!), and the impact that can have.
"ruthless attack" LOL...It's a movie, dude. No one was attacking you. No one gave you a second thought. No one cares about your expectations. Movies are not about your expectations or making sure your feelings are not hurt. Movies are about exploring characters and worlds and telling a story and not worrying about whether you are in a "Star Wars" safe space and whether all the spots are marked off on your "What *I* think this movie should do" checklist. They finally took a few chances and gave us something relatively fresh for the first time since Return of the Jedi. It wasn't perfect, but it was at least interesting and stirred discussion.
The film is already 13th all-time in Worldwide Box Office despite all the crying and raging by nerds. "Star Wars" will move along without you and make gobs of money and gain a new generation of fans and no one will even know nor care that you jumped ship or that your feelings were hurt.
I think you are spot on. i was actually going as far as to say that this is a post modern parody. That will explain the love of the critics, as they love that kind of BS. It seemed Ryan was obssessed with two things, and he actually says it through the characters when Luke says "it's not going to go as you think", and Kylo says that thing about "killing the past". I actually read an , interview with Ryan, and regarding rey's parents he said that giving her a legacy would be the easy way out, it would be giving the audience what they want (imagine that...). I think the core of the dissapointment is the fact that this film was made under Disney, certainly a company that is not famous for not giving the audience what they want...
At first i thought it was just lazy writing, but now i am convinced that this was indeed a premeditated attack, which is much worse.
Disney's $$$ will explain the love of the critics.
Premeditated attack? Who are you kidding? Who makes a movie with audience expectations in mind? Why does Rey being a normal person matter? Why would it be better if she followed the same formula we've seen for 40 years? How is this complete nobody who was chosen by the force with the task of fight the last remaining male Skywalker not good? How is Disney relevant at all in any of this? How is pandering to an audience with thousands of theories and wants going to work?
דרור ויסוצקי based Jew has spoken
Naftul Zvi "who would make a movie with audience expectations in mind?", well... that would be disney (at least up till now). This ip has created a whole world for the heavier fans, in this world that was crafted by lucas, there are some given "rules", these don't have to be realistic, but they have to consistance. The greek philosopher aristotle in his work "poetics" estsblished that princple, stating that in order for a narrative to work, the charecters must be consistance, and if they are not, they should be consistably inconsistance. The established "world" that the old fans are used to, includes such concepts as the jedi being a legacy, it established the way the force works, and so on. This movie activley undermines these established givens - the force is not a family thing, it works in new weird ways (projection and stuff), and most importantly the charecter of luke behaves in a manor that is inconsistant with what we knew and saw him do in the past. Now, this does not mean that the movie is bad for all viewers, but it does mean that the "world" that the older fans knew, and was dear to their hearts for more than 40 years, breaks apart, and so does the "illusion of reality" that this "world" had. When a director, repeatedly "breaks the rules" of that established ip, it loses it's meaning for those fans, who don"t recognized this imaginery world anymore, and are naturally upset. If you want to see a post modern parody that is not hate, but love letter to a genre, or a "world", crafted by a great auteur, i suggest the great late director, wes craven's "scream"
not about pandering to the audience its about taking common audience thoughts and making a story that makes sense that the AUDIENCE can unanimously agree on or mostly agree on.
if rey was of some important heritage being able to do what she does subconsciously because she was trained before having her memory wiped. people would allow more of her character to be what it is. but she isn't of important birth she is essentially a no body gifted by a macguffin "the force". everything she does is flawless without conflict or injury basically a god.
"How is this complete nobody who was chosen by the force with the task of fight the last remaining male Skywalker not good? "
1. vader was more than willing to kill his own children to end the rebellion. he cut off lukes hand and sell his own daughter off to jabba the hutt
2. if there is no character development showing a character overcoming adversity then its BAD EITHER WAY
I agree with David 100% on this vid! Even as a major animal lover, I also thought freeing the animals instead of the children was entirely stupid and evil! In reality it would have cost the kids their lives! Although I enjoyed a few aspects of the movie, the majority of it made me feel as if all that I loved about Starwars was being destroyed. Not really just the original cast, I wouldnt mind them being put to the side or killed off in a well written way, but come on! You'd think someone like Disney could afford to get the best writers! The writing IS atrocious! Ray is a Marysue....it took me awhile to realize that I didn't like her because of her bad writing. Kylo could have been well written if the writers weren't so wishy washy. That's really two words I could describe this movie as, "wishy-washy". Still liked it for its visuals. I'll never be bored enough for a 2nd 3 hr rewatch like some in my inner circle. Kudos for you guys if you liked it though. Film is subjective...although bad writing for me makes it hard to enjoy.
Rose inspires a child with force powers - they will free themselves
Rose Tico is the Jar Jar Binks of the new trilogy
Anthony P Except Jar Jar gave Palpatine Emergency Powers. His idiocy had a point. Rose has none.
Yeah, I shouldn't insult Jar Jar that way. Good point. Her idiocy only had the point of providing more opportunities for Kennedy to virtue signal needlessly.
Fin took jar jars place in TFA
Except his idiocy could have been fulfilled by literally anyone else: a corrupt politician, a dark side minion--anything that's not a Gungan.
Rose is annoying and there for feminist appeasement, but she has utility in that she was how themes of greed, morality, etc. were through the plotline involving the über-rich and fabulous denizens of the Canto Bight casino.
Silver Fame - That's a stretch considering what she actually does is decide the lives of animals were more important than the lives of slave children, then makes a decision which will undoubtedly cause these slave children beatings and hardships.
Yeah, no, she is an awful character and her morals are even worse.
The anti climatic deaths of all the men wasn't lost on me; i.e. Admiral Akbar just dies and Luke doesn't die in battle he just dies on a rock.
The climatic scenes of female roles wasn't lost on me either, i.e. Kamikaze lady with purple hair and Kamikaze crush girl.
Call me crazy but the film struck me as pandering to feminists.
The female roles are absent any struggle.
The Skywalker saga was hijacked then twisted into a feminized worldview.
I think that's fair considering the director's politics.
And when Disney saw toy sales is dropping all over their females toy. Be ready to be called sexist!
The voice actor for Akbar died. Luke went out with one of the most impressive uses of the Force ever seen in any of the movies, far above any previous Jedi we've seen. He saved the remains of the Resistance and re-ignited hope throughout the galaxy in the legend of Luke Skywalker. Nevermind Finn EASILY beating a woman (Phasma) in hand to hand combat despite the fact that he was just a janitor apparently and she's a commander. But yeah, it's all just SJW Feminist propaganda.... You people are insane.
E Magid
Propaganda,
Rogue one they took 40 years off Leia as well as brought Admiral Tarkin back.
Not to mention Darth Vader's voice was resurrected.
Yet Admiral Akbar is asking too much?
E Magid
As far as Luke, he died at the end of the film during the sunset not during the day when the fight with Kylo took place.
E Magid People saying this is "SJW Feminist propaganda" do not understand how corporations operate, nor the core values of corporations. They also seem to have an uncontrollable desire to impose political conflict on pretty much everything.
This does not make TLJ a good movie. Luke's impressive Force display is self-destructive as it basically turns his character into a coward who couldn't face Ren on his own. Then he just dies (for some reason). He trys to kill Ren because he senses a tiny bit of dark side in him, after spending the whole original trilogy maintaining hope for his 99% dark father. His character is interesting, but it totally cheapens the OT.
Rey receives little development. She is still too powerful in contrast to how much training she has received (I don't this is propraganda as much as it is poor writing, the Star Wars title basically ensures these movies will be a commercial success so they don't need to try as hard).
Finn is extremely underdeveloped and his entire story arc serves no purpose besides filler. Rose is a pointless character. Holdo is a pointless character. Poe Dameron also receives limited development. Leia flying through space.. I honestly don't grasp how anybody can say that was a good thing, even if you liked everything else about the movie.
Then there's Snoke and Phasma's death, missing Knights of Ren, the incosistences between TFA and TLJ (particularly Snokes character).
The only character I still find interesting at this point is Kylo Ren.
This movie feels like Marvel Superhero more than Star Wars. No true intense moment & tons of dumb one liner jokes. Worse of all nothing make common sense.
No, It doesnt.. Marvel is cohesive across its movies.. It remains true to its created storyline,... This new star wars is about as cohesive as a second grade playground.. Sadly, from what i can tell, disney owns marvel as well, so enjoy it as best you can. it wont last/
I thought this was a guardians of the galaxy movie?
But even Marvel movies have origin stories. We still don't know how Rey became a SuperJedi.
Rey's real identity is Super Saiyan. She was a already SS2 when she beat Emo Ren.
Super Saiyan...LOL.
Not looking forward to episode 9 at all.
BOYCOTT IT
You're overthinking it. You're putting way more thought into it than Rian Johnson did, and that's the problem. He didn't put a lot of thought into it. He didn't have a bunch of other people proofread the script and criticize it. I feel like it's a byproduct of trying so hard to keep everything a secret. They're afraid the secrets will leak out, so they don't tell anyone what they're doing, so no one can point out the plot holes and inconsistencies. As a result, they end up with a garbled mess.
Roadstar1602 So Vice Admiral Gender Studios is a representation of Rian Johnson.
No, it's clear he put a LOT of thought into it. No one ends up with two dozen subversions of expectations by accident. Is it bad fan-fiction? Yes, it's that, but written by a non-fan.
I totally agree I'm sitting here reading some dark horse star wars comics, thinking this shit is way better than last jedi.
I'm sitting here reading Timothy Zahn's "Heir to the Empire" trilogy and thinking Admiral Thrawn has more complexity and villainous potential in his blue left nut than Kylo Ren and Snoke put together.
And I'm gonna reread the X-Wing series for the millionth time because it's light-years better then this trash.
God dude, I did the same thing. Zahn even created realistic, understandable reasons why the New Republic would not be a solid and in control government despite defeating the Empire, there wasn't even an attempt at that. Mara Jade was a great character, she was angry, driven but torn, she failed, she learned, she grew from it. The opposite of Rey.
Thorsvald yeah I know and it's a shame we'll probably never see anything about those characters from the EU. I myself and still really upset over the Agent of the empire series being cancelled when Disney took over.
Now now.. We all know very well that disney has a moral perogative of completely destroying history or any mythos it focus's on, whether its Mulan, pocahontas or cinderlla.. They certainly wont change just because its star wars.. They delight in mythical destruction for the purpose of delivering inaccurate meaningless fluff. Thrawn was replaced by the blonde snot nosed kid on the bridge. Jayna and Jaycen became Kylo and Rey, and they had to be mutilated into something else.. Its pure disney.. Its what we love disney for right??? :(
Star Wars: The Last Jedi was the most disappointing thing since my son. I mean, how much more could you possibly fuck up the continuing story of Star Wars? And while my son eventually hanged himself in the bathroom of the gas station, the unfortunate reality of Disney controlling Star Wars, is that they'll be around. Forever. They will never go away. It can never be undone.
Tadicuslegion78 I can't wait for the Plinkett review
Kylo Vader ^Nice Name
Gee thanks Mr. Plinkett!
do we really need a comment of a user named Kylo Vader with a profile picture of Kylo Ren?
NOPE.
Tadicuslegion78 is this some kind of tongue in cheek reference to something someone pseudo famous said? I hope this is the case. If not.....you’re an idiot and your “son” can sway in the breeze.
To all those who’ve lost loved ones to suicide try to ignore those who lack life experience and spout inane babble for shock value. You know, like this moron.....
Star Wars is dead. It’s been in the hospital since 2015 and on December 15, 2017 after so many complications like feminism,SJW, corporate greed It could not continue to fight anymore. RIP.
The one time that they had to make a great movie Trilogy to continue for the next 50-60 years from now. after having The main characters on board with this new project. Disney completely and absolutely disrespected in every sense of the word the name of Star Wars. every beautiful memory I have of the original will not be taken away from me ever, but I could never show my kids the new propaganda Star Wars how could l.
Joyhood82- Agreed. The six films and the Clone Wars is what I'll show my kids. This "Star Wars" is just wrong.
Joyhood82 Fucking hell you people are such whiny fucking babies. Holy crap.
I'm boycotting the next movie.
The *only* way you can get them to make the movies *we* want to see is to *NOT GIVE THEM MONEY* .
Never pay for another movie ticket or DVD again. That's the only way to change the heading of this ship.
I was, mainly, expecting a movie that actually MADE SENSE. Not the crap that is TLJ. plot holes galore, characters being outright expendable/poorly used and/or developed after they spend 2 years saying, repeatedly, that they would matter to the main plot of the trilogy. Plot points being discarded left and right without any care after they HYPED THE SHIT OUT of said plot points....the killing of the mythos of the Force so the Force can do whatever they need it to do for their stupid, poorly written and implemented plot...it killed characters, it killed expectations. It fucking killed the IP to a lot of people...but casuals don't care. They just want their few hours of entertainment and there are plenty of stupid, DUMB entertainment in TLJ. This movie WILL be reaching that cool billion at the box office soon enough. Disney will get exactly what it wants. This outcry will just be a 'vocal minority'/fanboy meltdown because my 'expectations' and 2 years making theories on overly dreamful assumptions left by TFA...there are plenty of shills AND apologists to make sure of that...Disney can do no wrong and SW can always get a free pass (especially now that it is under Disney umbrella...).
Not going to see the next one, will wait for On Demand Free or Netflix or something
The force awakens was not a great movie. It was a safe recreation of a new hope, but it was at the right time. It was a good time to recreate what people loved about the originals after the prequels. It didn't do a good job of telling an original new story, but it did a great job of setting up a new trilogy and new interesting charecters and it raised alot of interesting questions. The last Jedi destroys all of these questions. It erases most of them. The questions from the force awakens that it does answer are so lazy, it makes me wonder why the force woke up at all.
Spencer Robertson it heard the door bell. The next royalty checks were due
I don't like the idea of burning everything to the ground, but you could do it in the third movie. With it being the 2nd, what on Earth is the ire movie going to be? There's no room to grow, and nothing new was introduced in TLJ to follow up on.
The best they can do is drag out the movie. It'll just be the First Order looking for the Rebels, maybe the Rebels actually find some help, they find the First Order to have a space battle, maybe they need to sneak on again for the umpteenth time, and Rey and Kylo battle and she either kills him purposefully or indirectly. No emotional weight, and no real tension because all of the loose ends have been tied already and the characters aren't really connected. Rey and Kylo are, but they had their moment already and Kylo turned it down, so doing that again but having him magically change back would be stupid.
The only possibly interesting thing is if General Hux stages a mutiny/trap against Kylo. He finds out he killed his own supreme leader/subordinates and thinks it's only a matter of time before Kylo tries to destroy the First Order. Rey tries to find him to have a showdown, only to find him locked up and let him free to destroy the First Order because she still thinks there's good in him. Then when that's done he turns to fight her because he wants everything dead. They fight, she wins, he probably dies in some form, the end. That's the best I have because there's nothing left to go on (which is odd given they're basically at the same point at the end of the movie as they are at the beginning).
Also, as a film, its highly flawed. I write this as I'm watching Raging Bull, one of the greatest films ever made... TLJ is a bad movie. So... Yeah.
TheFly212 I don't think you can really compare the two. It's like saying I'm watching Goodfellas and it's making me realise that Rogue One is crap
Dave Parker Goodfellas is prob my fav movie. Followed by saving private Ryan
+Dave Parker
Because Martin Scorsese is a brilliant direct. Even though it's not his usual forte, I'm sure he could have done much better than Rian Johnson.
And Taxi Driver is my favorite movie @TheFly212
I don't think this is an attempt to "destroy Star Wars". Rian Johnson is (or was) to be given his own trilogy of Star Wars movies, so that would not be a sensible goal for him to have. Rather, I think this was an attempt to destroy the Star Wars fanbase. To wipe the slate clean in order to take Star Wars to a different audience and in a different direction. However, it's still a pretty douchebag move. If you want a different audience and different direction, then either make a spin-off movie or try to create your own IP. Doing it to the core series of an existing IP is pretty egotistical and self-centered. Especially in the middle of a trilogy where a tone similar to the original has already been reinforced.
Deconstructivism and a generally nihilistic way of thinking lie at the very core of that movie. It is digusting and disturbing on a deep level. The movie makers exhibit such a lack of a moral compass, such a lack of appreciation of beauty and coherence in art... what's worse, they actually promote the deconstruction and destruction of beauty and coherence in art and culture. These people are nihilists, and nothing of true and pure beauty can come from such an attitude. Notice that this nihilism is part of a marxist outlook, which again is part of modern feminism. I had to listen to deconstructivist nonsense of feminist lecturers at university at one point, I know how destructive these people can be. They want to tear down any standards of beauty, moralty or art.
One of two: either you didn't pay attention to the movie or either you don't know what nihilism means. In which universe a movie that ends with Luke Skywalker doing the most Jedi thing EVER and restoring a spark of hope in the galaxy can be nihilistic? For god's sake
@@thedragondread9587
Your analysis is lacking.
It is pretty nihilistic. It destroys everything that was good about the OT, and then has an extremely dumb ending. Did Luke do the most Jedi thing ever? Why, though?
I saw no good development of Luke to cause a change of heart.
This movie was worse than Solo, a bomb.
The movie was created by a smirking nihilist who expressed nothing but contempt for the fans. He blew it all up.
@@grandwizardnoticer8975 There was a development though. He slowly opened up to Rey, she forced him to take responsibility for his acts and words, Yoda teached him to stop rejecting the past and instead learn from failure, and he mans up and fully recovers his courage and hope in the fight and the Jedi
Postmodernism ruins everything
the one hand History proves this correct, astutely observed my friend.
Brilliant analysis Dave. Ive seen a lot of reviews for TLJ on youtube but yours is the most in depth and informative.
I think the most fundamental error is the approach to force in the film-- and don't get me wrong I think Lucas was guilty of this too when he offered a materialist explanation for the force. Essentially it has now been democratized and by removing I guess the 'monopoly' a group of highly trained, elitist warrior monks had over it. So farewell any sort of hierarchy.
Secondly, it's effectively been relativized in a way given that its last light side practitioner has abandoned many of its ultimate truths.
For me the transcendent aspect of the force was always the most important factor when it came to the first films. Also that the promise of the light side was ultimately salvation and lasting fulfillment. That was a beautiful idea. Now, as the post-structuralists are wont to do, it's just messy, contradictory chaos.
tl;dr they took the Logos out of my films and I want it back.
LyovMyshkin. I think you're absolutely right. To me this is the foundational problem with disney starwars. It's not the characters or the storytelling, but the effect of how changing the concept of the force makes it inevitable that the characters and story MUST also change or be changed
"The Jedi were wrong."
This small sentence sums up my criticisms of the film entirely -- and you're absolutely RIGHT by the way. But see in the original series the Jedi weren't wrong they were completely right despite their flaws and errors. The light side WAS the way to truth, salvation, peace and love. The dark side WAS a corrupting, evil and unforgivable attraction. That, I would argue, was one of the most satisfying aspects of the original series not this 'balance' garbage. Not this grey, relatavistic mush. The fact is the original Force looked more like Manicheanism than Taoism -- though I'll admit my knowledge of Taoism is hopelessly small.
I think the timelessness of those first films ultimately came from the transcendent ideas contained within the Force. Ultimately I also think that removing that transcendent philosophy is the largest flaw in the new film. That and undoing the heroic sacrifice made by Luke and making it ultimately worthless. Terrible, terrible film Taoism or no.
Simple solution to midi-chlorians. It's like HIV. It's a possible subproduct of the force itself. Having a lot of MC in your blood can indicate you are force sensitive, has it can be a false positive due to something else.
rian johnson definitely poisons the well from which he draws water. modern intellect?
TLJ simply wasn't FUN. I spent almost its entire run-time uncomfortable, with what might laughably be described as the "plot," with the characters, and with the sheer pointlessness of the entire endeavor. Looking ahead to Episode Nine, it doesn't even really leave much to be done, except the binary choice of cranky five-year-old Kylo Ren either being defeated by Mary Sue Rey, or being somehow redeemed by her (which is where I would put my money, based on what we've seen, this far). I have NO interest in seeing this movie again, and that goes for TFA and R1, too. =-[.]-=
Yeah thats how I would describe my experience watching it. It was uncomfortable. Not because it was a deconstruction of what I liked as a kid, but because it was just an awkward movie. Much of the stuff felt forced and didn't properly fit. IE why do we need to divert into a scene in a casino about the mean rich people and animal abuse (much more common in lower stratus of society anyway) while
That's a shame and I most certainly feel sorry for you. I had a great time with my family seeing it. Went to Sushi afterwards and had the most wonderful time. One of the finest nights of my life happened because we went to see that movie. Whether it's good or not, that's up to the eye of the beholder, but it's certainly attached to a fond memory of mine. I hope you have yourself such an experience with a Star Wars movie soon, or any movie for that matter.
I think you might be right. I did feel some kind of contempt toward SW when watching this film. Especially in my case I watched The Force Awaken again a few days before seeing TLJ. And the red color motif throughout the film, the salt on the planet, are those expression of hate as well? but one thing that really really puzzled me: why did Rian Johnson do this? Why give a giant middle finger to the audience? And why did Disney allow this, considering that they might lose money in the long run if the brand is destroyed?
Disney allowed? Apparently you don't know disney is extremely involved in the making of these movies. If something displeased them or their test audience, there would have been reshoots. That's what happened to rogue one and what is happening to solo.
SPTX Yea, I know they did that. That's why it boggles my mind because I thought this type of deconstruction is against their interest, but as Silverknight ASMR said, Disney probably just wants this as well.
Bordering on parody. Ridiculous incompetent quasi-Nazis with big ships chasing small ships commanded by...............
That's because TFA was frankly awful.
Its weird, I know I don't want my Grand kids seeing this. We will stick to the first 6, not these two. I' won't be buying any merchandise for them for Christmas either. I know a lot of people who feel the same way. I think Disney wanted STAR WARS to end, not just the Jedi.
Rian Johnson may have a screw lose but I say whatever he was smoking/drugs he was on is the reason this movie make no sense. I really think he thinks he did a good job, my issues is what idiot at Lucasfilm/Disney approved this crap.
The more I think about this movie, the more I see the piss poor writing/directing/editing and can not believe Disney is giving him 3 more movies to mess up. o_O
I will not look at another Rian Johnson movie, he is on the top of my Director shit list, he knocked JJ Abrams off the top spot.
You are not the only one that has said, it look like RJ did all this just to shit on the fans. Shame on him and shame on Disney.
Gwendolyn Garnett Nah, Abrams is still #1, I'll never forgive him for what he did to Star Trek. But, yeah, Rian is definitely #2
You are right, I forget about Star Trek and Lost. I say they are tied for 1st place, they both suck.
Hey name is Kathleen Kennedy. And a lot of what is wrong with the Star Wars movies going forward is her strong attachment to feminism. She will crow bar girl power into the films over and over regardless of the impact on the story. She also believes that the best way to empower women is to degrade men.
Gwendolyn Garnett JJ worked with him and loved it
Fire that witch. She killed SW injecting feminism and poor story writing
This movie was just dreadful. I can only explain how bad it was in this context:
If the New Testament of the Bible was the original trilogy, and the Old Testament was the prequel trilogy, then this next chapter with Jesus returning, only to find out that God actually raped his mom. So he contemplates killing the Pope in his sleep, but doesn't and the Pope becomes Satanic. So he goes off to some deserted island in the Pacific to die, and some random girl shows up to give him a piece of the original cross. Mary becomes Mary Poppins and flies around. Meanwhile, his remaining followers flee by boat and are chased by an even slower cruise ship, while some Cardinals go to Monte Carlo for particular no reason.
Stephen Parallox don’t forget that the city of Luxembourg now has the military power of the former United States and is serving Satan in hunting down hobo Jesus
Mind freaking blown here, omg lol
Stephen Parallox Hi, I am a representative from Walt Disney Pictures, we'd like to schedule a sit down to discuss if you'd be willing to option your exciting new Bible story for film adaptation.
Zartan hahahaha!
Stephen Parallox
This comment here...
Was absolutely brilliant!
You Sir are genius satirist! :D
I salute you♥~ :3
You know, usually I'm a sucker for deconstructing genres, attacking expectations, even "insulting" the audience in order to show them their flaws through the characters. I love Neon Genesis Evangelion and Spec Ops: The Line, heck I consider them among the best and most important works of art since WW2. But... this is different.
I mean, NGE and SO:TL were new IPs, they did their thing, made you think you were about to see some specific sterotypes and tropes and then hit you in the face. But this is Star Wars. If this were "Star Fights - inspired by Star Wars", I'd be OK with it. If this were Star Wars VIII, but set, say, 200 years after the original trilogy, like the Legacy series, I'd be OK with it. But it's part of a franchise spanning eight other films and about thirty years of comics, books, videogames and so on and so forth, and it's using established characters who have been heroes for a whole generation. People have expectations about Luke, because we've seen him and Han and Leia post-Endor in countless stories.
I love specs ops as well. It was a great subversion experience, but it wasn't released as a Call of Duty game, it was released as something different in the same genre.
Exactly!
Well, actually, even if it was released as a COD game, many COD games have no connection to each other (no continuing storyline or recurring characters), so a COD game being this different from the rest of the franchise would still be acceptable. This is more like writing a sequel to, say, The Divine Comedy, in which Dante is a militant atheist who hates poetry.
I recommend taking a second look at MGS2 as that game does a lot of what SO:TL and Evangelion did as well. After you realise that, it becomes one of the best games in the series.
+InsanityMethods
Ah, I see you're a man of culture as well!
You're preaching to the choir, my friend: MGS2 is in my top 5 best games of all time, and I'd say it's tied to MGS3 for best game in the series exactly for that reason. ;-)
In fact, I'd go ahead and place it slightly above both Evangelion and SO:TL in that regard, because the political and social message behind that deconstruction has proven to be more universal and more relevant even to this day. Evangelion was mostly a deconstruction for its own sake, though it carried an important critique against the Japanese otaku fanbase and a series of extremely deep psychological portraits; SO:TL carried more of a critique against its own genre and a strong invitation to its fanbase to take a good look at themselves, though there was a very slight and subtle critique to certain aspects of American foreign politics; but MGS2 says something very important about society and politics as a whole in the age of information, it carries a lot of weight for the whole Western or westernised world.
Again, I count MGS2 among the most important works of art of all time, and it's a damn shame that so much of its message went under the radar for a large part of the audience. ^_^
And before you ask yes, I really fucking love the Metal Gear Solid series. XD
I could go on forever about how MGS2, MGS3 and due to the circumstances around it MGSV become some of the best games in the series and just sing MGS its praises on and on until the cows come home.
Like how Raiden is supposed to be a representation of us as the fans wanting only to play as Snake. Raiden himself is a fanboy of Snake and it's shown multiple times. We're subtly told that even in the Tanker mission we're still technically playing as Raiden.
The fact that MGS2 like you said still holds up and even more so today is a testament to just how ahead of its time the game is and how ahead of his time Kojima was.
I'd agree that it does deserve to be above Evangelion and SO:TL due to its political and social message, but also because of how it breaks down Snake as this living legend in order to give us Raiden and boost his character development further.
I also really love the MGS series and would say more, but you pretty much hit the nail on the head wit that comment alone.
There are many ways to "deconstruct audience expectations". Expectations can be as simple as what the audience thinks will happen. Having something different happen from what you expect is a venerable story-telling ploy.
This movie undermined, to the extent of complete destruction, the characters that were so fully developed through the entire series. Worse, it even changes the nature of the universe for no reason other than making the universe fit the plot.
Destroying the audience's understanding of the universe and the characters is not just "deconstructing expectations". That isn't a twist, it's an atomic bomb.
Character development is basic to story telling. Authors who can't develop coherent characters are quickly forgotten. Movies with incoherent characters are called "bad movies". Star Wars has built up a tremendous amount of "goodwill" (in the same sense that business put goodwill on the balance sheet as an asset.) When you have a huge amount of goodwill you can get away with a lot. But at the cost of diminished goodwill.
Good job pissing away it all away.