Retrospectively, the part about becoming Lee makes a lot more sense having played through the next two games. Season three is Clementine's Kenny phase, if you will; she's messy, violent, and shut off. And then the next season is her Lee phase, where she's focused on protecting the kid that she's taken on.
that's a cool way to look at it, puts a lot more value on season 3. it also makes sense in context to lee, who before the game started murdered the person his wife was cheating with (I'm assuming that their marriage a little before the murder was rough and there were arguments and stuff). you could say that was his Kenny phase.
She's more like Kenny in the 4th season than lee if you ask me, especially considering how violent she's willing to get for him. I'll never forget our little Clem telling James she'd "claw his fucking eyes out" if he touched AJ. That along with a lot of reckless things Clem says(that we don't pick) without taking precautions. I love lee but i hate thinking of Clem as "trying to be lee" cause if she was, she'd be dead because lee was nice to a fault, so much so that he's dead, she just isn't enough like him, i think that's too rosey of a observation.
The best ending has to be going to "Wellington" with Kenny, then watching Kenny *FINALLY* recognizing himself for who and what he is and how that is a major danger for Clementine and AJ, and then making the right decision by walking off on his own, right after giving her his hat. It's a beautiful ending imo and even though God only knows what will happen to a broken, lonely Kenny (we never did sadly), it makes the most sense and it's great to finally see Kenny's "family philosophy" being put in action
@@Anna-wf9fd so in that alt universe theres a chance hes still alive right? Cuz when u go with him they kill him off in a flashback which feels cheap and frustrating since you cant affect the outcome. Honestly, I feel they kill off a lot of characters to prevent too much branching narrative paths, and it's pretty obvious they do that. No character carries over from one season to another properly, they either die or separate and disappear. The only exceptions are clem and Kenny and kenny dies right after s2 anyway.
@@halinaqi2194 yeah, they pretty much left that ending open, which makes it the best one honestly. I hated how they killed him off in season 3, there were many more scenarios that would do him justice
Both Kenny and Jane try to substitute Clem for the people that they lost and use her to try and reconcile their mistakes. Kenny thinks he has his second try at protecting his child from the dangers of the apocalypse, Jane thinks that she has her second chance of appreciating, teaching and taking care of her sister. Yikes this is depressing
I wished you would have talked about how Kenny sacrificed himself to get AJ and Clem into Wellington. I feel like that made that ending worth it. He knew they were better off there without him.
I don't know man, i think that killing Kenny and then taking off alone with AJ is the best ending. I think that if you let Kenny kill Jane it kinda mess the character. If you shoot him, you prevent him of doing some irrational shit, he forgives you and truly dies as good man. And Jane putting AJ's life at risk just to prove a point? She's not worth being a partner. That's my favorite ending (:
@@gustavolopes2490 I know she survives in season 3, but it's an 11 year old child and a baby. If you really wanted to leave both of them, it would've been logical to get to Wellington and then leave Kenny behind.
@Ben66 66 yes, but from my point of view, Jane's actions are not as passionate as Lee's, i mean, what Lee did had no relation to his later group, did not reflect on his treatment or put anyone in danger. Idk, whoever came out of that fight alive would be too unstable to take care of Clem.
@@gustavolopes2490 I'm not saying you should change your opinion but I just wanted to share what I would've done. Just let Jane get bodied (As she should) and then leave Kenny at Wellington. I get why you'd not want Kenny to kill Jane and say him "dying a good man." and all but he killed MANY other people that wasn't just Jane and so did Lee at one point (granted they were all bad people but so was Jane and Kenny in a way.) Kenny's character is tragic and truly one of the more sadder sides of the game at least in my eyes. If I were to choose to shoot him my reasoning would only be to release him from the hell of that life he was living but leaving him to survive, possibly die or meet new people off screen would've been better to me since we could all hope he was alive and well somewhere out there in the world.
When I first played this series i overthought everything WAY too much like this dilemma I thought, hey Carly’s really good with a gun, get her another clip for the gun and she can just shoot the walkers off of Doug, but that was before I realized someone always dies no matter what in most scenarios
I don’t get at all why he says in this video he’s an abusive stepfather In a way he’s a stepfather and he was violent and sometimes irrational, he’s to blame for that. However he’s a good parent (maybe not as careful as Carlos but Carlos was too flawless if you ask me, a bit unrealistic) as you said he doesn’t want Clementine to pay for his decisions. Him having very bad relationships doesn’t make him abusive to Clementine. What Jane says in my opinion is totally inaccurate, he let people correct him many times during season 2, he let Clementine contradict him, he just get a little annoyed like always. He just becomes way more violent and unlikable to everyone after losing Sarita. Even so he’s the best shot Clementine has to reach Wellington. Him being very pushy and a bit unreasonable doesn’t really make him a dictator either. What he usually did is to get get things done and safe as soon as possible while usually other people just wait and see. That’s a bit careless but ultimately effective to survive. Just the fact he is willing to let go of Clementine in a couple of endings (as well as when she meets her if you say you want to part ways) with her makes it clear he’s no dictator, he lets people he loves and knows and respect have a choice. (I guess what many people don’t understand in Season 2 is him knowing very few about those people, he just met everyone but Sarita and Walter so I think it’s safe to assume he never truly trust anyone but them and Clementine, that’s why he doesn’t listen to them all that often.
@@edwardsuou I think he means abusive in the sense of violent and uncontrollable which are the main characteristics of domestic abusers and they certainly fit Kenny but like most people he seems more interested in shaming then helping
@@luisandrade2254 people become violent to unknown people when they have to survive in an apocalypse, it’s called desperate defense, in his mind Kenny punched Arvo because he thought he was dangerous. (And you can argue he was indeed a danger to the group) And people get more unreasonable and hard to talk to whenever they just had a psychological trauma. Jane was also already hostile towards Kenny so you can’t really say he assaulted her in chapter 5, she said she let the kid to die (meaning she could’ve done the same to Clem and she was dangerous) and Jane was the one bringing out a knife as soon as Kenny got mad, we can’t know if Kenny would’ve wanted to kill her if she didn’t, I would say he would’ve just fight her a bit and then let her live and get away with Clem. Kenny doesn’t just kill people if they did something wrong to him, he never wanted to kill Ben for instance but he wanted and tried to punch him. It’s true Kenny became more violent and it was way more unreasonable to the point the strangers either do what he says or he leave without them. That’s bad don’t get me wrong but it’s not abusive.
@@edwardsuou I didn’t say it was abusive I just said it’s a common characteristic of abuse thus the op association. I don’t even know if there’s a defenition of abuse tbh
Kenny is the most realistic and emotional character. I thought he died in season one and I was majorly upset. Then I found he was still alive in season two and that was amazing to see!
I like to think by choosing that ending, he doesn't die. And maybe he is out there, surviving like a badass. It makes me feel at peace cause they didn't do his death justice in 3. He should have went out by saving Clem and AJ from a group of walkers, taking their attention away and going on a rampage till he is inadvertently taken down, probably in the way of you dont see it, but confirmation that he is dead with him gurgling as he is ripped apart while Clem gets away with AJ
I like to think in that ending, Kenny realizes he won't be able to change enough to be Clem's "new Lee" due to the trauma he has faced and allows clementine to be free of him- willingly allowing himself to suffer for the sake of Clem and AJ- Losing the abusive nature of his relationship to Clementine
Even tho Clem was the one who wrecked the car and killed kenny💀💀 I always choose go with Kenny and leave Wellington, I thought Clem would be happier together with him and Aj.
Anthony Flames I think he did save Clem and aj. He knew the accident crippled him but aj and Clem were fine and with the walkers drawing closer he sacrificed himself so they could escape
yeah and what sucks is that he apparently got killed because of pedos shipping him with clem. him a 27 year old man with a 11 year old girl and telltale did not want to be seen as a disgusting game company so they killed him off. apparently the final choice was going to be luke or kenny but they scrapped it for that reason and others such as the narrative of luke hiding and putting aj in danger not going with his character.
This bitch Bonnie told me to go ahead and save him when its clear that the ice was about to crack. I chose the to shoot the walkers. And she went ahead where luke was. And she started hating on Clemintine bruh.
I sat there and watched him kill her. Didn't even pick up the gun. She was always looking for a fight, she had to go for that alone. Kenny didn't deserve her bullshit.
I have to say, Kenny is a good reason as a symbol of hope. Even though there are pipedreams, he believed in it until he dies. He believed in Lee and Clementine as a means of moral support and a motive for something to protect. He believed in the boat, since its something that will help them restart their life anew from dangers. He believed in Wellington, a community far up North that will keep them safe, or give Clem and AJ the life they deserve. The first group Kenny was in, is the best group as they understand Kenny. They all believed in the boat and they all had Lee. The second group Kenny was in, is shit because they don't understand Kenny. They doubted Wellington (understandably) and they had no real leader. The difference between Kenny is night and day because Lee is a Leader and Kenny is a survivor. Kenny isn't fit for leadership yet he felt the responsibility because he wanted to keep Clem alive. He is a survivor and yet an complete opposite of Jane and sometimes the opposite of Lee. He knows he is no "Lee", but yet he tries. That's why I sided with Kenny. Kenny at least fucking tried to change, Jane does not. Out of the "TT:TWD" characters, Kenny is the most unlucky and the most tragic. So its no surprise that he is a ticking time bomb.
Kenny was WAY too much like Anakin Skywalker from Star Wars - Episode 3. He loses his family because of Bandits, just like when Anakin lost his mother because of Tusken Raiders. Then Kenny worries about Sarita for losing her, too. Emperor Carver felt Kenny's hate and anger, which made him more "powerful". That's why if Kenny joined the Dark Side, he'd be able to save the ones Kenny loved, especially Sarita. but Sarita knew that was WRONG. So Kenny strangles her with the force from the Dark Side for turning against him. Then the fight between Jane and Kenny starts, and Clem steps in and stopped Kenny, felt into the lava, yelled at Clem: "I HATE YOU CLEM!" then burned up, became a machine, became Emperor Carver's apprentice.
I agree with you. Kenny even has dialogue that says "Lee would know what to do" literally telling the player that Kenny realizes this is not the role he was meant to play. But he still puts the effort forward which makes him great in my opinion.
Plus Jane isn't any better She just does it in a different way plus If you go with the character this is what happens Kenny: dies protecting Clem from walkers and teaching her to drive Jane: Just gives up. She wasn't mentally stable. She sends Clem away and hangs herself for Clem to find Who do you think Clem should look up to A Teacher, A Survivor, Someone who protects the ones they care about and when they can't protect them anymore they tell them to escape and move forward Or A Person who gave up, Someone who couldn't handle living in this world, Someone who sent there loved ones away, just for them to comeback a swinging rope and growling body.
J-rod ! although ben never got to say goodbye to his family, i firmly believe that kenny had it worse. ben could still have hope that his mom and little sister were alive, while kenny watched his family die in front of him. ben was messed up and wanted to die at one point, which makes me feel for him. im not discrediting the pain he felt because it was more than upsetting to watch him beg lee to drop him into the walkers, but if we're comparing kenny and ben and who had it worse, we can't reasonably compare ben; the college kid who lost contact with his family, watched his friends die, was threatened by lilly (and actually did it, causing the death of kenny's family), to kenny; the fisherman who saw his son eating literal human meat, killed a man in a meat locker in an attempt to save the group from a potential huge walker, lost his wife and son right in front of him, lost his best friend, got his eye beaten out of his face with a walkie talkie, bashed carvers skull with a crowbar (the fact that he enjoyed it was proof enough that he was already traumatized), lost sarita, and much much more. they both went through terrible things, but the difference between them is huge. it would be unfair to compare them any different
@@wizgi7201 he’s torturing a shithead who regardless of what you do shoots clems and runs away Fuck Arvo “My sister is sick” no she’s not you liar. He gets mad at Clementine for shooting a walker trying to kill her son. Idk why Mike and Bonnie felt bad for that piece of shit
hated her. probably my least favorite character of season two aside from carver (though he added tension which was good, he was just a p.o.s) and arvo lmfao who SHOOTS a kid??? kenny was in the right to beat arvo’s ass and kill carver. not to mention, jane as well.
Honestly I feel walking dead season two would have ended much better if it was Luke VS Kenny. This decision would be such tougher one. Kenny was the old figure that we knew and trusted who is know a broken man. Luke is the new guy who we may not fully trust as much as Kenny but is probably much more stable. Jane really only cares for herself and even pretended to kill Rebecca's baby! Honestly i chose Kenny in the original ending but if the decision was between Luke and Kenny I would be much more conflicted
Totally agree. I definitely would pick Kenny over Luke, however that's a decision that I would actually have to have a good thought about. Letting Jane die was a no brainer for me.
I feel like by the end. If it all played out to be Kenny beating in Lukes' face and I was forced to choose between the two- I think Luke would've been one of the easier choices in the game. Luke was stable and a pleasantry and Kenny was taxing and always felt detrimental to me. Which is kinda why I think it would've been better/ is better that we were presented with Jane. I feel like the 50/50 ratio between those characters is preserved but in this alternate ending speculation, on one hand, you're stuck with a friend who you KNOW you can count on and on the other a melancholy link to the past that struggles to be a normal empathetic understanding human being. FUCK THESE ARE GOOD GAMES.
I think that the ultimate theme is not necessarily a cynical "no one is ultimately trustworthy," but more "you cannot replace the people you love with surrogates." I think this is echoed by Clementine's search for a Lee surrogate, Jane's desire to run away from Clem because she keeps seeing her sister in her, and Kenny's constant pursuit to replace his long lost family. It tells us that there we run into trouble and make poor decisions when we continuously try to look for surrogate replacements for lost loved ones, and that the greatest honor we can actually pay to those we love is to follow their example, when they're gone, rather than try to replace them. Embrace their absence, and their good qualities.
I was 13 when I played this game, and as such, you missed something so very important. Jane, for most of the game, is your best chance of escape from Kenny; and yet even she is revealed to not truly care about us. She wants Clem around because she seems useful. Jane is manipulative, and Kenny is scary. They are different types of abusive, and that’s why pure self-reliance with the implied vow to never be like either of them. Sarah is another level of this. Carlos acts like Kenny used to, but more. Carlos is what Kenny would’ve been if Duck managed to live.
Jane is literally a lame writing device lazy writers use when they have made a terrible character and wrote that character into a hole. The lazy way to "fix" this is introduce and even less savory character with less or no ties to the main cast to make that character look "better" by default. That is all Jane is, a plot device to make Kenny look like less of a POS.
@@jackd6881 uhh, Jane is the one who points out how bad Kenny is so regularly you have to be blind and deaf not to see the signs getting posted. She’s got no ties to the main cast, which means she has no investment outside of the desire to protect us. And that’s exactly what she tries to do the whole time. Hell, she asks us to leave with her at one point, but we literally can’t. She isn’t actually shitty to us. She’s just shitty to everyone around us, in a less dangerous way. Up until the finale, I literally never worried about if she’d hurt someone in our group.
@@bookbook9495 But that's the problem with her character is she is written as plot device to try and redeem Kenny or to get us to shoot him. While also kind of being replacement Kenny who just won't hit clementine and isn't a coward. The kid endangerment segment was just bad telltale writing to make us like Kenny after almost 2 whole games of being the worst, its audience manipulation at its best. There where a million ways she could have pushed his buttons to get him to snap other then potentially killing a kid. But Telltale knew people despise Kenny so they had to basically force that choice in to make the decision to shoot him in any way difficult for some. IMO Luke should have been the one to fight Kenny as that would have created a tougher choice as he was more likeable and actual cared about clementine. Both Jane and Kenny are drama creation plot devices designed by the writers to generate conflicts. This is proven when they kill her off later anyways if you choose to go with her because outside of creating this conflct with Kenny they had no ideas of how to write her into the story... Kenny is clearly more of a threat and way more awful to everyone but I wish the game gave me the option to shoot both of them.
@@bookbook9495 Sometimes I feel like people on UA-cam comments have never had a family before. Like, even a found family. Kenny is the sole remaining link Clem has to Lee who was the closest person she had to a parent since the apocalypse began. Kenny demonstrably cares for her and is willing to die for her. He definitely needs Clem more than she needs him but the two have a familial bond from all their shared hardships and experiences. Kenny loves Clementine unconditionally and is probably the last person in the world who she can trust absolutely even if he is a basket case. Realistically I don't think Clem wouldn't have such an easy time abandoning the only person who loves and trusts her unconditionally in a world that only offers violence, deception, and death.
@@heehokuzunoha7757 Just because someone cares for you does not justify the mistakes they made for you. For example children would be barely okay with their parent robbing someone just so they have money. I have met people who are similar to Kenny. They are not worth siding with even though they care for you. Sometimes the people you know less are kinder than the ones you don't. You also take in the considereation in the way they treat others besides yourself in order to know how terrible they are. There are people who act kind to you but treat others terribly.
Kenny might be good, Kenny might be bad, but regardless Jane put a helpless child alone in a car to frame someone so they would die. Kenny might not be the best, but he's not a liar. Kenny won't frame someone else to get them murdered, he wouldn't put a newborn at risk in a zombie apocalypse snowstorm. In a cutthroat world, having one terrible person you can trust to the end of the world is miles better than any saint that leaves children in the car.
Kenny would not "frame someone to get them murdered" (arguably, not what Jane wanted to do), but he will himself murder someone, then run around all happy the very next day with zero regrets about it. I'm not sure what the moral scales are in your head but damn
sigh let me copy and paste kenny... - physically threatens a man when he first meets him - is implied to be verbally abusive to his girlfriend - yells at a little girl no matter how she handles his GF getting bit - piles all of his stress onto that same little girl after his GF dies, including his suicidal ideation, which definitely fucked her up mentally - tries to alienate her from everyone else by bringing up her dead father figure and using him to manipulate her into doing what HE wants (lee would want you to go to wellington, etc...) - threatens to kill a crippled teenager after he surrenders - beats up said crippled teenager multiple times - tries to send the group on a death march to a winter wonderland that nobody knows really exists - attempts to murder a seemingly innocent woman because the baby "died" Jane's biggest sin is pulling the stunt at the end which doesn't even touch some of the worst things kenny did
@@Auubreygraham your cherry picking and rewording things to sound a lot nicer or meaner than they actually were to fit your image. You say Jane pulled a "stunt" when in reality she literally threatened a crying babies safety by stuffing them in a car in the middle of walkersville and basically told everyone she got it killed. If you call her a monster for killing a child apparently you're the bad guy? And she's seemingly innocent when she admits she lost the child? She's literally admitting guilt!
this is why i hate kenny...he was more one track minded than a goldfish...he was racist and cruel to others in Season 2 and he never once stopped to ask "what do you guys want to do?"
@@IDyce88 ight so i wanna know when was he racist? and yes he was cruel but you gotta remember hes been through some shit his mind was being held together by sarita and after she died clem was trying to basically super glue him back together (for the racist part use the exact words he used in dialogue)
@@Rogue-qj5qi not exactly but pretty much: in season 3 either either he or Jane die, they did this on purpose to save time spent on making separate stories, in the actual game he dies from Walkers by breaking his legs which is pretty shitty but in an early promo image we see him kill himself by drowning which makes more sense to his character, at this point in the game time he has nothing to lose, he's empty and a shell of who he was and killing himself would probably happen ONLY in the ending where he left and clem went to wellington
Walking Dead S1: People can die, your choices have consequences, think about everything you have to lose. Walking Dead S2: LMAOOOOOOOOOOOO WHO WE GONNA KILL THIS CUTSCENE?
I mean, in S1 as well, the whole original gang gets clapped at the end. Larry ded. His daughter leaves the group because she kills the person you chose to save in episode 1. Kenny's wife and Duck ded. "Shaggy", he ded ded. Kenny M.I.A. and Lee ded
"She left me...my son...people that cared about us... I forgive her, but it don't make it any less wrong. *You don't just end it cause it's hard. You stick it out, and you help the folks you care about.* So let's figure a way outta here and get that little girl." -Kenny This is what separates Kenny from Jane after season 2.
"This is what separates Kenny from Jane after season 2" .kenny simp are hardcore morons fr. "You don't just end it cause it's hard. You stick it out, and you help the folks you care about." this coming from the mouth of a abuser is somehow FaCts lol. " the abuser is right and jane is wrong" the mental gymnastic people play.......
Kenny was right in killing Jane. "I'm going to push this already unstable man off the edge by pretending I killed the baby that for the past week we've been trying to save." Terrible.
That is completely false she states a walker grabbed the baby out of her hands and Kenny flips out and attempts to murder Jane as Jane had no intent of killing Kenny, but also both characters are completely in the wrong in the situation stop being bias for Kenny Alone has and always will be the true way to go
If you chose to leave with Kenny, it’s later revealed he sacrifices himself to getting eaten by wakers to allow Clementine to escape with AJ If you chose to leave with Jane, it’s later revealed she committed suicide because she was scared of taking care of her own child... leaving Clementine and AJ by themselves.... I chose to stick with Kenny because besides Luke, i KNEW he was the only one who would stick by Clementine’s side to ‘till end, just like Lee
I really want to believe the narrative that this video proposes, because it would make this whole part of the game feel like it actually MEANS something, but... Jane is the big flaw in the analysis of Kenny Bad. Taken on its own and without analyzing the eventual outcomes of the choices, Kenny As An Abusive Parent is a perfecty plausible reading that's supported by the text- but when you take into account Jane's entire existance in the final act as anything OTHER than "the last other adult in Clem's life", it starts to fall apart. Because the game deliberately juxtaposes these two, it creates a situation where the would-be abuser is OBJECTIVELY THE BEST OPTION in this binary choice. ofc this leaves us with the conclusion that the best ending is the one where Clem braves the world on her own with AJ, but... I still would have liked the game to fully commit to creating a situation where either BOTH choices were glaringly bad, or in which Jane had more going for her. Maybe make it so that in the next game it's revealed Jane is the one who stuck around to take care of the kids as long as she could despite never growing close to Clementine as a friend or a mother, while Kenny was the one who caved under the pressure. With the story as it currently exists, it affords Kenny too many Good Parent Points to really argue for an abuse narrative. Which sucks, because I think the reading of the game outlined in this video is fascinating and would have been a great direction to take the whole thing... if the writers had actually committed to Kenny being too dangerous and volatile to be a viable caretaker. Like... They genuinely did write him as a pretty realistic abusive parent, all in all, but then they still made him the most viable option in the final visible binary choice, and reinforced that desite everything, he DID love Clem and was more wiling to protect her than anyone he opposed. that ain't a great look on a character who went through the characterization he did. I think this is why many people are so hesistant to buy into this reading of the text, despite how compelling it is and how much sense it makes when viewed in isolation.
I find it extremely unfair of him to give such a harsh treatment to a story that clearly still wasn't over and had to be continued, it's the same as chudging a movie before you've watched the ending
Kenny is my favorite and that'll never change, but this was a really good video. I felt sick to my stomach whenever Kenny lashed out, but I never once didn't take Kenny's side, immediately in this game. It makes me wonder why I was loyal to this man, even when it meant putting my own character in danger. I cried every time they interacted sweetly with eachother, I was just so happy to have someone that I trusted in the game. Damn.
@@americancommunist6076 He really was, Jane was a selfish idiot, Carver was a phyco, Lilly turned out to be a literal child enslaving monster who cuts out peoples tounges and Larry was definitely going to die in that meat locker. All his decisions are practical and are focused on protecting his family.
Kennedy didn’t just keep Clementine around for himself, he wanted the best for her. This was clearly shown when he wants Clementine and AJ to stay in Wellington rather than with him. He wanted to make sure what happens to Clementine and AJ is not what happened to his family.
I think the reason Kenny seems to keep Clem close a lot of the time is becuase he trusts and can rely on her, the other group members are pretty much strangers and with the exception of Mike Clem has a decent connection with the rest of her group members Post-"In Harm's Way" but Kenny doesn't, he isn't used to taking orders that much from strangers but that by no means meens that he's going to be a horrible person for some reason.
Well, to be fair, many abusive (step-)parents also truly wholeheartedly believe that what they do is the best for the abused person. So I don't see Kenny wanting the best for Clementine in any way disproving what is said in the Video.
Going to Wellington with Kenny then staying there as he walks off is canon to me. Completes his arc, his redemption, and fits in tone with the game perfectly.
Either that or shooting him was good to me. Ending his suffering from all the loss he went through.. It indeed made him stronger but it also hurt him greatly and his anger turned into something that hurt him sometimes the others around him. Long Live Kenny.
@@mrturtletail3945 I wasn't trying to like say that your way of seeing this was wrong or anything but just wanted to tell you what I'd do but leaving him at wellington is also my favorite ending and at least there's hope he's alive.
Redemption? Kenny created all of his own problems and realises at the end that HE is the reason Clem and AJ cannot be safe. He is finally able to see that the only way to keep Clem safe is to let her go. He has not redeemed himself for anything, he still threatens anyone who isn't Clem and pushes them to the point of violence, he repays kindness with anger and hate and justifies it with his own trauma, he STILL uses protecting Clem or those he considers family as excuse to do unnecessarily violent things... But of course Kenny fans do not remember any of this, all they know is "Kenny protected Clem, therefore he's a good guy and he's the goat :) "
@@cubbwatch Jane started the problem by hiding the baby in a car in the cold. That’s why Kenny got heated. Kenny got mad cuz Luke and jane was smashing, while Rebecca was having a baby and the herd was after them, another reason he got mad at nick for being a jackass, he got mad at Arvo cuz he almost had the whole squad killed in the cold, got mad at Larry cus he was asshole, he lost his son and wife. He had it the worst, those are all good reasons to get mad about
+Daniel England iirc one of the devs said in an interview that it felt really good to kill her (or something similar to that), which i thought was pretty disconcerting. i can't find it though :-/
+entireties I think it's very telling when Greg says "Sarah was on my "Ben" list", because Ben was another character that was made incompetent and unadaptable to a truly unbelievable extent, something right out of a cartoon, only it's more like a sadistic Happy Tree Friends than Bugs Bunny. There are better ways to pose a question of morality versus pragmatism without resorting to this. There are real reasons why people become a risk to themselves and a liability, without having the troperiffic Idiot Ball, insane bad luck and a complete lack of self-preservation instincts.
lumpythebored Way to overgeneralize and demean criticism. In my opinion, a character so incapable of even trying to show some minimal self-preservation capability is just poor writing. Even including disabilities.
I picked Kenny for two HUGE reasons 1. Jane was suicidal, and wasn't guaranteed to be for you there 100% of the time. And this point is even proven in season 3 2. As abusive as Kenny would get, he always prioritized Clementine over himself. I hated how violent he could get, but he was always there for Clem, even if she wasn't always there for him. After all that, I wanted to be there for him because no matter what, I still trusted him
That Cynic ironic because Kenny is suicidal aswell the game literally throwing it at your face from s2 e3-5, regardless it's stupid to go with either Jane or Kenny
Andrew Ortiz That is true, but here's the difference. Jane actually follows through, and personally, I cared about Kenny and wanted to help him through his losing battle. I could give a fuck if Jane lived or died because she abandoned Clementine, TWICE. Proving that she put herself over Clem, for Kenny, Clem comes first no matter what. Jane may have came back the first time, but she killed herself the second time! That's why I wanted to help Kenny, therefore, I stayed with him
Andrew Ortiz Atleast he didn’t end his life, based on what you said, before ensuring clementine is left at a secure location with people to look out for her.
After being witness to the ending where he is willing to let Clem and AJ go into shelter instead of him and crying my eyes out, i'm glad i chose Kenny.
Same as Lee did, Lee was her's Third father, frist she had she's real father second Jesus Christ and Lee. So belive in Christian Orthodox and all of you gonna be saved I am just asking you to.
Bro Jane locked a literal newborn in a car in winter to get Kenny going and “show who he really is” but like… you just said “yeah baby gone y’know”. So you pushed a broken man to the limit, presumably got a baby killed he cared about, and is now trying to turn the only other person he cares about against him.
this isn’t a “jane vs kenny” argument it is a “kenny is an abusive caretaker and a lot of people cannot or purposely will not recognize that due to bias” argument
Both Kenny and Jane are abusive. Hell, the first thing Jane says after Kenny is unwillingly killed by Clem is "I did it for you" and "Please, we can leave this all behind". Sounds familiar? Alone ending is the way to go for sure.
you’re so right. and that’s the thing i’ve been thinking this whole time. jane says things that every abuser says to the person they’ve abused. she also acts like a typical abuser most times. but, kenny is also super abusive in his own way too, even if he wants to protect clem/it comes off that way to every player.
@@theunknownuser9609 jane wasnt abusive at all though??? it was just her selfishness that was bad really. she did way more than kenny ever did and hes been in the game for 2 seasons
@@rubyyy325 kenny loves clem like a daughter, he was willing to be all alone and even die just for her and aj's sake, jane k*lls herself anyway because she got pregnant, so uhh idk, i think both of the kenny endings have their good and bad parts but they are better than jane's
@@MsScarletwings Except, its a zombie apocalypse, a baby in a blizzard. Its practically abandoning him to leave him in that situation just to make a stupid antagonizing point against Kenny.
@@shadows_star "look at Kenny getting mad when I push his buttons and threaten the only things left in the world that he cares about lol, told you he was a bad guy" Jane is such a bitch
There is one thing you missed about Kenny in Season 1. He had the potential to be as volatile and angry as he is now. If you don't treat Kenny well, or don't help him with Larry, he becomes bitter, angry, and vengeful towards Lee--he lets him fall when you go to get Medicine, where if you're good to him he powers through his pain to save you. He can either fight and argue with you the whole way, or see things from your perspective and sympathize. You say that Kenny, in Season 1, was a coward, but he fights with Lee almost every step if you make the wrong decisions, literally on the train, and when you're all stuck in the attic he's the one who brings up they might have to kill Lee, as well as actually moves to do it--regardless of how you treated him. If you treated him well, he may be the only character in the game to follow you when you go to save Clem from Vernon, and if it's just you and him he will cut off your arm to save you. In Season 2, everyone but Clem treats him like Lee did if you chose not to side with him; they all turn him away, shut him down, and he gets angrier and angrier, and if you said with him--even without taking into consideration Season 3's flashbacks--him and Clem are genuinely happy together, something that none of the other endings can manage. Kenny is a broken man, and the darkness he shows in Season 2 are shown, more subtly, in Season 1. Remember, that in the first game, they barely dealt with the seriousness of the end of the world--they spent just about all of it holed up safe in a motel. Once you leave, and shit hits the fan, Kenny becomes far more violent and unreasonable than he was before.
This is something you learn by playing the game more than once, then you know Kenny will make it to the end and it's best to play to him than all the other characters who leave or die no matter what. The choices are a lot less branching than implied.
@CallOfDrewthulhu But with Kenny wasn't about power, even in chapter two, he was arguing with Lilly, he wanted to say that one person can't be in charge of everything and that they can make their decisions, if he wanted power, instead of saying that one person can't be in charge of everything, he would say "i should be the leader" or something like that. With Kenny was about understating or not his arguments. You wanted to help Larry? From Kenny's perspective, you're putting the life of an asshole that tried to kill you above Clem, the chance of saving his family, Lily and him. Even in chapter 1 you saw how Larry needed pills to get recovered, and in the meat locker they didn't have medical supplies. So, there was like an 95% chance of Larry being dead. You don't side with him in leaving the motel? That's a pretty stupid idea and again Kenny has very strong arguments. You saw how in chapter 2 there were bandits around there (even Kenny said that weeks ago the bandits were annoying them), so the safest thing was like Kenny said, leaving the motel. You shot the screaming woman to put her out of her misery? Well, from Kenny's perspective, you're the asshole that is putting an already bitten woman that you don't know above taking supplies and food for Clem and the group. It's not about Kenny wanting to be right and that's it, it's like he always has strong arguments and when you disagree, from his perspective you're the bad guy that it not thinking what's best for the kids and the group. Kenny almost has arguments behind every situation and when Lee disagree with him he truly shows that he is mad, but not for wanting to be right, it's for feeling that you're the decisions put the group in risk.
@Alexander Metzler if you don't count that she killed herself at the first sign of problems she wasn't ready to deal with. I'd call that weak. Imo the authour of this video is right - the only real choice was to leave them both behind. I personally prefer the ending where Clem watches Kenny kill Jane (she does if you don't choose to shoot or tunr away) - because untill that moment she can't really believe that he will - and then shoots him like the mad dog he had become.
be real, what he did was absolute insanity. it's one thing to just shoot him in the face and be done with it. it's a whole other thing to shoot off his knee caps and then beat in his face with a crowbar. yes, Carver is an asshole, but that doesn't mean what Kenny did wasn't barbaric
the entire point of what kenny did is that it was barbaric.. kenny was an extremely abusive person throughout the game. his own GIRLFRIEND said he was scared of him. and all the adults in his life were scared of him… alvin, luke.. and jane, bonnie, & mike all left the group in the middle of the night bc they were sick of kenny’s abusive behavior. yes, kenny lost everything. yes, kenny was a broken man and that’s why he became a monster
@@kai1ey The reason people were scared of Kenny is because he was the only one strong enough to protect them. People were scared of Carver because he would hurt them.
I love and hate AJ at the same time, he's really likeable and just a kid but he's also a little shit in a creepy way but Lee is best guy anyway Clem is the best character overall by far tho
@Alexander Metzler To be fair you can't completely change Lee his mindset can be different depending on your choices but he's still going to be similar in many ways, this isn't like a rpg, Lee isn't 100% the player and I mean it would be understandable to find Kenny more interesting than Lee even if I personally don't
@Alexander Metzler I don't really get how it's stupid or missing the point, he never said he hated Lee just that he preferred Kenny and they both are really different characters and they go through very different character arcs, a lot of people like Kenny it's probably not their #1 character but that doesn't mean it's stupid if he is And yeah sorry I didn't get the joke but on the internet you just never know sometimes
Beautiful work on this one. And I must say, the inclusion of text on screen for your key points was much appreciated. Made it far easier to parse the more complex ideas which can become mush in my brain when I'm 15 minutes into a video essay.
She was pregnant, if she didn't kill herself they would have had 2 babies, and there's a high chance that Jane would have died during childbirth, leaving Clem alone with not just 1 baby, but 2.
@@brandonj7586 so the alternative is to kill herself and the baby without even telling clem? Doesn't sound like a good alternative but a easy get out of jail free card
Janes death in S3 where she just nopes out and leaves Clem with a baby sealed the choice of Kenny. He did great with Clem and it only goes bad because of an accident.
That's one of the things that makes me mad abou S3. This guy survived jumping in a hole full of zombies (at least mine did), got beaten to death, lost an eye and still survived. THIS guy is gonna die because he forgot to put on his goddann seatbelt?
@Onyxiate She did noped out. She killed her own child and abandoned another kid and a baby right after she literally got the other adult who would've been capable of taking care of Clem and AJ killed out of pure manipulative malice. Fuck Jane
I watched this video years ago, and again today. The problem with this season was, as bad as Kenny might have been, Jane's problems were much more obvious. She lied about so many important things. The key reason for me not trusting her was when she described her sister's death, then she tried to make me abandon Sarah. Here's the problem: if you stick with Sarah, she will fight for her life until the bitter end. You know who abandons her? Jane. And then she picks fights with Kenny, purposely antagonizing him to make him look bad, but that really means she's a bully. She ultimately lies and pushes him too far over the edge. This story that Kenny is abusive might work if we didn't have manipulative Jane.
I mean, what was Jane expecting when there is this guy on the edge and she decides to put the life of an INFANT in peril to try to prove a point to an 11 year old girl who to pick as her new parent? Like, what kind of backwards logic is that? If Kenny just snapped because she kept bullying him about his past and wanted to kill her, that is one thing. But what she did with AJ was kind of really really fucked up? Plus how much stress that'd put on Clementine? It was entirely unnecessary drama so she could say she was right?
Jane’s issues weren’t more obvious though (at least not to me when I first played it). And that’s where the whole choosing the lesser of two evils comes in. Kenny is much more blatant about having issues. He acts out, attacks, yells, etc. But Jane is much more subtle, it’s because of her calm demeanor that made her so easy to trust. When I was a twelve year old playing through this episode for the first time, I shot Kenny because of this. I was successfully manipulated by Jane into believing that she wouldn’t abandon me or act out against me. I’d like to think that because I was just a little under two years older than Clementine, the decisions I made were pretty close to the ones she would have made. And in the end, for me at least, it was a lot more realistic for Clementine to shoot Kenny and then go with Jane, having been successfully manipulated. And then having to learn that she’s a dick.
blacksesamecandies not to get murdered for it. She says so in the ending. If Aj died in a walker encounter, if kennys response was to murder whoever he likes with his grief, he would very quickly become the most hated character in the series.
Porfirio Rubirosa you love Kenny so much you think the GAME was wrong? Kenny had been unstable since episode 2. Kenny had been endangering lives. Kenny at that point had abused clementine and anyone else who got in his way. And Jane is the bad one for trying to prove it to clem, who he had been gaslighting and using ever abuser trick in the book... Kenny turned bad. Even he knew it in the end. That was the whole point of the game.
You realize the game makes both characters completely wrong in the situation? Jane never intended to kill Kenny the one who attempted murder was Kenny proving Jane's point Alone is the true way to go
17:02 Okay, but was Jane REALLY looking out for her? The impression I got was that Clem to her was just a substitute for Jaime (the same way she's a substitute for Duck with Kenny). The difference is, Jane doesn't care about Clem the way Kenny does and she's willing to manipulate her into killing the closest thing to a father figure she has left just to get Clem on her side. Say what you will about Kenny, but I just don't think Jane actually cared for Clem the way Kenny did. If it came to it, no one can deny that Kenny would sacrifice himself for Clem (He tried to sacrifice himself for the kid who killed his son) where as Jane has already made it clear that even if she does care for her, Jane would put her own survival before Clementine. Still though Kenny definitely was abusive and she's probably better off without either of them.
He actually did sacrifice himself for Clem & AJ in the next season while Jane selfishly commits suicide without any hints of planning to do so earlier and on top of that she leaves two children out by themselves in the dangerous apocalyptic world
" If it came to it, no one can deny that Kenny would sacrifice himself for Clem" That's true, however, I'm sure that the chances are much higher that Kenny would devolve into one of his many rage-filled episodes and take it out on Clementine (accidental or not) than Jane actually leaving Clementine to die. Kenny had become FAR more unstable than he was in Season 1, and Clementine became Jane's morality pet, the little sister that she always wanted. I'd say that Jane and Kenny are both equally manipulative/needy. They both wanted to use Clementine as a replacement goldfish for dead family members, and Clementine is probably better off without both of them. The thing that makes me dislike Kenny more is that we already saw plenty of his bullshit in Season 1, and that turned me off to him before his reappearance.
Didn’t Jane also trigger Kenny to attack her by saying the baby went missing on her watch? She even admits that if you save her from Kenny when she shows that AJ was in a car nearby. I think that’s a very important thing to note. The whole time when it was Jane, Kenny and Clem, Jane repeatedly tried to make Kenny cave to prove something to Clementine. And all it really showed me is that if someone is already pushing themselves down the road to danger then a person (i.e. Jane) could easily torment them into being a monster. I think Kenny being an abuser is also the wrong term for him. Suffering from PTSD would probably be better.
I agree, but I chose Jane because she wasn't losing her shit. I REALLY wanted to save Kenny, but he just kept fucking things up. So me and Jane went off on an adventure. I have yet to play season 3 though, cause season 2 was just so god damn taxxing on me.
Season 1 : Clementine's Lee is Lee. Season 2 : Clementine's Lee is Kenny. Season 3 : -Clementine's Lee is Javi- Javi's Lee is Clementine.(lil mistake there) Season 4 : -Clementine is the new lee- Telltale gets this m.ua-cam.com/video/zHC3uvzcfV0/v-deo.html. Edit: Also holeh crap thx for 1k laiks guys 😁
Season 1 : Clementine's Lee is Lee Season 2 : Clementine's new Lee is Clementine Season 3 : Clementine's Lee is Javier Season 4 : A.J.'s Lee is Clementine
To be fair it's not like she was related by blood and that relationship was way toxic, not helped by his brother being a moron. That said, I feel like Kate seriously should have taken a stand instead of expecting Javi to just solve all of her problems. Not once did she actually try to talk to David about things. To be honest I actually couldn't stand her, David, or Gabe, I think Javi as a character suffers because everyone around him is either a jackass or a weak character. Except Jesus, of course.
It's the final season, it's very likely, I don't want it to happen either but it's gotta happen.unless they find a damn cure or something (imo that is very very unlikely.)
I don’t know about anyone else but in season 2 you have to choose who you want to sit with Luke or Kenny and for me that was hard decision just for that so imagine if you had to kill Kenny or Luke that would have been a much harder decision than Jane or Kenny it felt like they were building tension between kenny and luke throughout episodes 2-5 but then just kill him off and it switches to jane instead
Honestly at first I didn't understand, but now I do. Luke is nice, always had ur back (besides when he thought u were bitten at first), acts like an uncle or older brother, and had a plan to help u guys out. If anything, Jane should either dies from the lake or never came back to save the group. If never coming back, Luke maybe injured, but as the Russian was about to shoot Kenny, Luke saved him from shooting the Russian in the head. Or you get a choice to shoot the Russian. Then as Kenny get all pissed at Arvo for attacking them, Luke defends Arvo saying his armed and harmless now, making them argued until the team convinced Kenny to go to the house with the group and Arvo. Luke and Clem talks about Kenny, with Luke saying, he seen Carver being crazy, but he's scared that Kenny will become crazy like him. And Clem tell him that he's still there and to not be against him, to which Luke said he'll trust her, even though he was still worried about Clem and Kenny. At the lake, Luke doesn't fall in, instead made it across to stop Kenny from hurting Arvo, then the 2 ran back to save Clem who fell in and ran back in. Then inside, Kenny yells at Arvo, which Arvo pissed off Kenny, making him attack Arvo with the team wanting Kenny to stop, until Clem succeed to stopping Kenny. After she warmed up, Kenny and Clem chatted then Luke and Clem did, at first its about AJ being adorable and he tells Clem he did a good job saving AJ when he didnt see him. Then he talked about Kenny, this time asking "Do you think that Kenny will actually be ok?" Or something. Then once the truck is fixed, Luke and Kenny argued about where they need to go. Kenny said Wellington while Luke said Howes, even though he despised going back there, he thinks there's not much people or walkers or lurkers, plus there's enough food and baby food for the group. But then Arvo shot Clem, making the 2 drive off fast. Luke and Kenny are relieved that she's ok, but Kenny and Luke argued more. Kenny insults Luke's group, calling them cowards, besides some he respects, and calls Luke a pathetic nobody, Luke insults Kenny saying he's a rude crazy asshole and that he's not safe for Clem or AJ, and the 2 begins to argued until they got separated. Now how they fight is that AJ doesn't not get in danger, but with them arguing until Luke said "IM GLAD HIS FAMILY IS DEAD SO THEY WONT BE AFRAID OF A PSYCHOPATH!" To which he regretted, not meaning to say that. Kenny, however, had enough and attacks Luke, making the 2 fight. Clems choice will be to Shoot Kenny or Let Luke Die. If you choose Kenny lives, it'll stay the same. If you choose Luke to live, Clem cries as Luke comforts her, apolozing and not meaning to say that, he didn't want this all to happened. To which it sounds genuine, unlike Jane, and u 2 go back to Howes or you can leave him, to which he's worried, but understands as it's her choice. Lukes death in Season 3: Clem, Luke, and AJ as a toddler, goes out to hunt, until raiders came up to attack, until Luke sacrifice himself to save Clem and AJ. Clem shot down the rest of the raiders, after Luke shot some, and he tells Clem to protect aJ no matter what before slowly dying.
@@iconic3606 Luke wasn’t a saint at all. But to pull off such a stupid plan to prove your “point” is something only a madman would do and Luke was not, simple. He needed to die because he would’ve kept the group more united and would’ve never want to kill Kenny just because he got unreasonable a couple of times.
Wow. The didn’t realize that I WAS asking myself “what will this do to Kenny” the entire time. This video really hit me especially since I grew up too fast. I was crying during parts of this
I like how the choices you make in Season 2 are sometimes undercut because, well, you're a child. It plays into the helplessness you feel as a child, and how people seem to not allow you to make decisions. Clem at the end of the game finally gets a choice that matters and is only up to her, symbolizing her transformation into adulthood. EDIT: Nevermind you definitely covered what I was trying to
that explains why in season 1 your choices had more impact than they did in season 2. This is why I believe that in season 2 we should of played as Kenny as it would of made more sense.
Doug sucked and was a weak weirdo. "I don't like guns". What the fuck man, do you realize its the apocalypse right now? Carly was ride or die chick who knew about my sordid criminal conviction and is someone I could count on to help in protecting the kids, like she did first time we even met her, which is largely why I saved her. Also, didn't hurt that she would be good for future family rebuilding with Lee.
Hey man. It's fine to have a crush on a fictional character. Good. Great even. I myself have about a dozen crushes going on at all times. But you don't have to justify you liking something by hating on something else. Just like the thing. Carly is awesome. She's great with guns, she forgives Lee, she saves Clem. She's awesome. Doug is awesome. He doesn't like guns, but he's a loyal doughboy who misses his robots. Doug is awesome. Look at that, we have two awesome things. Isn't life grand?
Kumie this guy is arguing against Jane because she could’ve gotten the baby killed since she’s the only one who knew where it was and they only found it because it cried and she knew she might die which is why she antagonized Kenny it was just really stupid in her part and the reason everyone should chose Kenny
The point of the video wasn't about Jane, he never once defends her actions or her as a whole. She's mentioned only In relation to Kenny and her ending isnt even brought up
Yeah I'm a fan of 8bitryan lol, but jane was just overall a bitch, Kenny always put you first even when he was about to die, whilst jane left you all alone
Exactly. It was meant to symbolize that Kenny went full circle. He returned to where Lee started morally. He even used the same excuses Lee did when questioned about the murder. And 75% of people still think Kenny is in the right while also praising Lee. Foolish and hypocritical.
Jane left a baby in a blizzard and told everyone she killed a baby just to "prove a point"....she brought it on herself. Then she goes on to commit suicide and leave clem alone.
Literally people too stupid to figure this out, as soon as I heard that she killed/dropped the baby I was thinking about how I will kill her, thank god I got the option.
She literally baited them, she came back from a cold fucking blizzard and said "it was an accident", if she really wanted to live she would have said, "he is still alive and in a car, lets go get him before something happens to him", but nope, she wanted the fucking fight, she wanted Kenny gone because she is a fucking selfish bitch. Also it makes sense for a player (and Clementine too) to trust Kenny over Jane, you as a player know Kenny from season 1 as a man who cares about family the most, but Jane on the other hand, is someone that happened to be in the prison with you that left her sister to die, and even if that is what her sister wanted it doesn't get your hopes up when you think of the fact that she asked Rebecca "what are you going to do with it (child)". Kenny comes off as mentally unstable if his trust is just a little bit tested but still caring about a family, even if its not really his blood, meanwhile, Jane comes off as an asshole that cares for herself, that only helped you once without expecting nothing in return and that might be dangerous for the group by possibly risking ones life to "prove a point" like with AJ or just ditch the whole group and make them hope that she will come back one day. And lets not even talk about what she did after you decided to go for an ending with her.
Kenny was too far gone so I had to shoot him, but when Jane revealed the baby wasn't actually dead and she put herself and Clem in danger just to prove a point. It made me realize how many levels of manipulative she could be so I ditched her with AJ.
If I had been able to, I would have shot Jane in the head before Kenny and her fought because Clem genuinely thought that Jane had let AJ die as well when she was saying "Not again!..."
this is exactly what i did, i think they both went way too far, but kenny wouldn’t stop trying to kill people who didn’t really deserve it, so i shot him. jane was abusive, too, so i didn’t feel comfortable staying with her.
@@lucybiermann8750 Who did Kenny try to kill who did not deserve it? Jane? Far as anyone knew, she had abandonned AJ, an infant, to die either in the freezing cold or to walkers, which even Clem thought she did ("No... not again!") Carver? If there is anyone who ever deserved to die, it was Carver. Arvo? Arvo most definitely deserved to die. No matter WHAT you do - if you give him the drugs that he's hoarding (and not for his sister who was NOT SICK), Arvo ambushes you with his buddies and would take EVERYTHING you own - and LIES about you no matter what. It's Arvo's fault that a lot of people die, including Luke. He should have been shot right away. Oh and btw, no matter how nice you are, even if you put down your gun and ask to go with them... ARVO SHOOTS CLEM. No. Arvo definitely deserves death. My biggest regret in the game series is that neither the 3rd or final season let me find Arvo so I could kill him in the most excruciating way possible. Bonnie can just screw off too, since people die because of her evil actions as well, but especially Arvo. Who else did Kenny try to kill? The people who were holding others in the ski lodge hostage? He was trying to save them. After Carver's group (thanks Bonnie) killed Walter. btw, ENTIRELY Bonnie's fault. Kenny's the best person you can have in the zombie apocalypse next to Pete, who is basically Kenny but more emotionally stable.
@@lucybiermann8750 And in case anyone forgets... Kenny was right about almost EVERYTHING. He was right about not trusting Arvo. He was right about being cautious about Bonnie. He was right about them needing to escape from Carver. He was right about Wellington existing. Kenny's the one who kept fixing up every vehicle. He fixed the RV in the first game. He also was able to fix the boat in the first game - and did not trust Vernon. And considering Vernon steals the boat he wa right there as well. He fixed the truck in the second game. He saves Clem MULTIPLE times. But oh, he's unstable because he's seen his son die and his wife kill himself and every single person he loves dies except for Clem. He even tries to save that Ben, who is directly tied to how his son gets bitten, which is why his wife kills herself. Also he was right about Larry. Larry was going to turn and they would have ALL died in that meat locker. Larry, the piece of garbage racist who tried to get Lee killed in the drug store, if not for KENNY SAVING LEE. Kenny continually thinks of the survival of children - whether Duck or AJ or Clem, before that of adults, including of himself. He's willing to sacrifice himself every time if it means the children that he tasks himself to protect will survive. That's nobility right there.
@Robd1 replies I don't know man, i think that killing Kenny and then taking off alone with AJ is the best ending. I think that if you let Kenny kill Jane it kinda messes up the character. If you shoot him, you prevent him of doing some irrational shit, he forgives you and truly dies as good man. And Jane putting AJ's life at risk just to prove a point? She's not worth being a partner. That's my favorite ending, Clem being her own Lee (:
@Robd1 replies I agree with you, more scenarios would be very interesting. But I also think that Kenny needed that moment of redemption, he deserved to rest
At least Kenny didn’t pretend to kill a kid to prove a point that a man that lost two of his family’s and then his last hope in AJ dying would maybe react violently
Well he did quite a lot of horrible things throughout both seasons he was in. I'd argue he indirectly got a lot of people killed. The Boat as a Holy Grail used to be a S1 meme joke back in the day as during the final half of S1 Kenny's mission to find the Boat got most of the remaining cast killed. What bugs me the most is Season 1 Kenny doesn't care about Clem but Season 2 Kenny does. If you didn't side with him 99% of the time he would refuse to help find Clem in S1. Even though Clem did nothing wrong. He even goes full Jane and abandons everyone. The whole righteous side of Kenny fans proclaim did not exist. I'd even argue saving Ben during the most positive S1 ending was self serving not being righteous. Because he was proving to himself he wasn't a coward. He may have still been, and was doing a self deletion by zombie that got retconned in S2. Either way selfish. Clem acting as an adopted surrogate family in S2 makes a lot of sense. As Kenny needs it, not because he cares about Clem. Explaining the 180 toward Clem. You see it throughout S2 as well, Wellington becomes the new boat and like before the Journey ends much of the cast. I disagree with the author on that Kenny had a big personality switch between the seasons. I always had a negative opinion of him, and do not get fooled so easily by cheap emotional banter. I do agree with the ending though. That shooting Kenny and leaving Jane is the true canon ending of S2. Makes the most sense to me. They both wanted Clem, needed Clem, but didn't tolerate eachother. Neither deserved Clem.
fun fact, when kenny says "listen vanilla ice", its another shot back to his florida roots, as vanilla ice lives in florida and makes houses lmfao, lives one acreage down from me :D
Kenny's no angel, but can we say Kenny is the sole, abusive monster to be overcome when Jane went out of her way to manipulate a tortured, lonely man in the hopes it would force a fatal confrontation, using a newborn child as a tool in her game?
Patrick Hooper The video never said Jane isn't bad. To the contrary, it clearly endorses the view that both Kenny AND Jane ought to be left behind. The video is specifically about Kenny and what makes HIM abusive. It's not about Jane and what makes her manipulative. It's not about Lee and what makes him fatherly. It's not about Carver and what makes him a communist-like dictator. It's about Kenny and what makes him abusive.
In the end I shot kenny to save jane, because I thought it was an accident, then it turns out she lied... I would have left her, but I also thought she might be able to teach Clem some more skills to help survive since she was clearly very resourceful. I was also thinking about AJ in that if clem went off alone with AJ that would only put them both in even more danger
regarding wild animal with Kenny being unstable over a baby that isnt his simple reply Any Peron who lost a husband or wife with a child lost them both would be traumatized and would be easily prone to considering those who are close to him depends on which affliction hits them either abusive or selfish etc. Long story short not everyone has an iron will of a mind I have seen alot of cases where something simple as jealousy and envy took over someone and kill them and their CHILD the mind has its own ways to grasp over the body and decision making processes Kenny's actions is indeed hot headed and emotional which is simply possible given enough trauma but not idiotic just reckless so yeah my decision is to let Kenny kill Jane due to her manipulating a traumatized and over emotional unstable man and let Clem and AJ stay on wellington so we wouldn't get to see how his life ends part ways in a mystery
Jane was much worse. She tried manipulating Clementine into killing Kenny just so she'll see 'what he really is" but that's so stupid. Of course he was gonna go off the tracks. She put the baby's life at risk first of all by putting it in a unlocked window filled car by itself well she go tells Kenny that the baby is dead. The only thing, other than Clementine that matters to him. Jane could of stopped the fight by saying the baby was alright. She wanted to fight and kill Kenny. Plus, Jane doesn't even love Clementine. Is season 3, Jane kills herself when she finds out she's pregnant and leaves Clementine with a baby to defend by herself. Kenny was already not stable, and Jane pushed it. If u go with Kenny he tries so hard to get u to stay with Wellington because he wants Clem save. Jane wouldn't of done that. Kenny sacifrices the bag if supplies that Wellington gives him just to save AJ and Clem
Cadence Western wrong Jane's intent was never to kill Kenny her intent was to show Clem what Kenny is really like so Jane and Clem can leave him she explains this when you shoot Kenny she also says she didn't know Kenny would go that far also Jane did care for Clem it's the reason she came back to group and saved them, literally its stupid to go with either Kenny or Jane there both completely in the wrong in this situation you can write a essay worth of facts with in game dialog explaining how the alone ending is the right choice
Andrew Ortiz Jane didn't care about clem like Kenny did. If she cared, why'd she kill herself knowing darn well that Clem and the baby would be on their own. Jane was selfish. And even if she wasn't, she stabbed Kenny just as much as Kenny stabbed her. If she didn't want to kill him and realized that it would go down like that, she should of said the baby was okay and Kenny would of stopped. Even before Kenny got on top of her, she didn't run away, had a knife in hand ready to fight. Kenny cared about AJ and Clem more than anyone. He sacifriced so much for them. Now I'm not saying leaving with Kenny or even not killing him is the best choice, but in my opinion leaving with Jane was definitely the worse. Leaving alone is one of the better choices, but I'm still sticking with Kenny
Cadence Western Jane killed herself realizing they couldn't care for 2 babies in a zombie apocalypse and realizing if something happen to her or Clem that 1 person would be raising 2 babies in a zombie apocalypse even in her death she's looking out for clem, also s2 and s3 pretty much show Clem doing fine by herself, again Jane's intent was never to kill Kenny it was to show what he really is to Clem so they can leave him and Jane is purely acting on self defense as she has man attacking her and doesn't realize he's trying to kill her until he tries to stab her in the chest, I find go with either Jane or Kenny to be quite stupid but most of time you have Kenny fanboys who try twist the narrative of Jane to make Kenny look better telltale purposely made Kenny and Jane have a point to there situation and reason also both characters are flawed especially Kenny dating back to s1, Kenny is one of my favorite characters but and I still shoot him everytime and leave Jane and go alone for an essay worth of reasons
Andrew Ortiz I know this sounds pretty dark and morbid but she coulda of just killed the baby. I know what ur probably thinking "this girl is psychotic" but u gonna realise. Jane hanging herself killed both her and the baby and she had no problem with that. So what's the difference keeping herself alive and killing the baby before it's too grown to do it. And also, it's really hard to believe that she didn't try to kill Kenny. Like even when Clem was pulling him away, that's how she stabbed him. She could of ran. But most importantly she coulda told Kenny the truth and stopped him. And Kenny isn't perfect don't get me wrong. And also don't get me wrong about how I feel about Jane. For some stupid reason I decided to watch Jacksepticeye play the second season before I even watched season 1. And in my first time watching I loved Jane. I love those characters in shows that are badass. But even though I loved her, I still felt as she was in the wrong. Instead of looking at Kenny as Kenny, not knowing him from season 1 just made me think of a sad unstable old guy. And doing that to him was terrible. But anyway, going alone isn't a bad choice, like I said. But I just prefer Kenny ending over it. Not saying Kenny's ending is the best. But it's the one I like the most for my Clem. Simple as that
Cadence Western I don't care much for her killing herself, the problem is that she didn't tell anything to Clementine. She (and the player) will never know why exactly she hanged herself and Clementine can easily end up thinking that she did something wrong and it's her fault, especially after Lee dies on her and she had to shoot Kenny because of Jane's manipulative ass. But yes, I think that she could have just killed her kid if keeping Clementine and AJ safe (which includes both being there to physically protect them and not wasting resources) was really her ultimate goal.
Kenny has good intentions. He sometimes is a bit aggressive and handles stuff the wrong way. But he shown time and time again he’s selfless and cares a lot for Clem.
You mean like when he crushed a mans head because he argued with him before having a heart attack? those kind of good intentions. Or when he leave Hershell's son to get eaten by walkers, Or the multiple times he refuses to back up Lee at all if you dont kiss his ass.
@@jackd6881 if you play Season 2 you can see what I’m talking about. He protects Clem and AJ with his life. He even sacrifices himself and takes blame for Clem stealing the Walkie. Also he is willing to give up clem and aj to Wellington when it meant he wasn’t allowed to go in.
@@jackd6881 Nope he dealt the right way with Larry. THIS guy actually had some brain and knew that CPR won't save Larry who needed medical help in order to survive which the group didn't have. His wife could have explained to him.
@@GamingLife-ce5du Good I handled his son the right way when he turned and had him shoot his son in the face. Also, unsurprisingly when the tables are turned and you have to confront him right before that about dealing with his own son turning he fights you and if you lose that fight duck ends up turning and killing everybody. Kenny's only interested in making decision for the group when no-one he cares about is involved, he's a selfish hypocrite and yet the game FORCES you to coddle him and take his side instead of what I really would do in a situation like that. Hell after he bailed on and left Hershel son to die I would have cut all ties with him and his shitty family. Worst part about the Salt lick murder is he literally threatens to abandon you and clementine if you didn't take his side in brutally murdering the guy in front of his daughter. Fuck Kenny. In fact you could easily argue most of the deaths in the first season of series are caused by his stupid boat idea. More then half of the deaths in the first game could have been prevented if you had the option, to tell him and his boat bullshit to go to hell, but these games do not give you real choices.
Essay time: Kenny was far from perfect, he’s a flawed and realistic depiction of what the apocalypse could do to a good person, which is why lots of us love him so much. Unlike many of the other people in the game he lost all the people he cared about (Duck, Katjaa, Sarita) in front of his own eyes. He watched his wife shoot herself/sees her body in the woods, sees Duck get shot or shoots him himself, and watches his new girl get eaten by walkers/sliced in the face by Clem/slowly die of the infection. He becomes somewhat emotionally unstable from all this, having moments where he has outbursts of depression or anger, but also has the desire to protect and was loyal to the people he cared about to the bitter end. Of course you have the right to not like him, as there’s a decent number of people who don’t, but the statement that he becomes abusive is one that is definitely one I don’t believe is true. One of the major things that Kenny did for Clementine in s2 was taking blame for the walkie talkie at Carver’s compound in ep3. Mike wasn’t going to speak up despite KNOWING that Clementine (one of the little girls) was going to get into serious trouble if she was exposed (we already see Carver determinantly hit/smack her, and threaten her with a knife and gun in episodes 2 and 3, fuck knows what he would’ve done). He then gets his eye destroyed, which arguably is the moment that changed him (Carlos did mention potential head trauma). After this, he had more anger, and more vengeance inside of him, feeling more angry when the bad things happened, especially Sarita’s death later on. Now I’ll talk about the things that people bring up the most to say that Kenny is a bad guy. Larry. Larry has a heart attack in the meat locker after raging out. He stops breathing and his heart stops. This occurs earlier in the day, after everybody at the Motel saw Ben’s friend or teacher turn into a walker despite not being bitten, and where Ben reveals that no matter how you die, you turn, the time it takes to do so varying among people. Now Larry treats Lee like shit throughout all of episodes 1 and 2, no matter how kind you are to him. Kenny witnesses this first hand at the end of the first episode of season 1, where after getting Larry his medicine, he knocks Lee out and leaves him to die, to which Kenny comes back for him and saves his life from a walker that was right next to him. Also in the first episode, Larry has a smaller heart attack and is down for the count until they get his “nitroglycerin pills.” With the meat locker scenario, they were trapped in there with a potentially dead man, one of whom even if resuscitated and breathing, wouldn’t be able to make it due to there being NO PILLS AND NO MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS in the room. The writers intentionally made Larry’s fate before the head smashing ambiguous so the choice is tougher, try to help Lilly or help Kenny. And if you wanna be like “Oh well, if you help Larry, you see his mouth move”, again they left that ambiguous to whether or not he was breathing or if he was starting to reanimate. By deciding to try and help Larry, in Kenny’s eyes you are putting everybody in there at risk of being killed and stopping him from rescuing his family, putting a man who was a complete asshole to you over the safety of Clementine and the others in there. And if you want to think of it from a “colder/more practical” standpoint, getting rid of Larry is benefitial, dude’s condition is a drain on the medical resources they had, especially with his older age. In every other big source of Walking Dead media (Show, comics) they don’t just wait for somebody to be confirmed dead before the die, if sombody experiences an injury or something else that might seem fatal, they get put down before they turn. Simple. It seems brutal, but at the end of the day, what Kenny does to Larry is easy to justify, especially in the post-apocalyptic world.
Ben. Now I personally feel like Ben is also another accurate portrayal of how some people would be in the apocalypse, but he screwed up. He was giving the bandits supplies and the raid that occurred as a result of that indirectly got Duck and Katjaa killed. Kenny, 100% had justification behind being pissed at him, especially after Ben lied about it to avoid Lilly’s crazy ass, but ends up getting Carley/Doug killed while they try to defend him. Kenny wasn’t the only one who wanted Ben out of the group at that point, and they give you the option to let Ben die at the bell tower, whether you do so because you don’t like him or because he consider him a liability is up to the player. But at the end of the day, if you SAVE Ben, he hears Ben’s argument and feels bad for him, so much so, that when Ben gets injured in the Savanah alleyway, he the first one to try and save him save and later mercy kills him despite all the pain that Ben’s incompetance caused him. (Hell, he even does the same for Christa in the season one finale if Ben died in episode 4, with her, he sacrficies himself knowing that he accidentally made them end up with the situation with the dropped walkie talkie, and saving this preganant woman). Carver. Carver HAD to die, if he wasn’t killed, he would’ve tried hunting them down for a third time, and they would’ve made no progress. Sure, his death was brutal, but you can’t forget the fact that he terrorized the group for months/years (implied that he raped Rebecca [though AJ doesnmt seem to be his kid], tortured Carlos in front of his kid, pushed a physically disabled man off a building over some miscut blueberries, etc.), and he almost beat Kenny to death, and Kenny wanted revenge for that and to avenge his friend Walter. Saying “he could’ve left Carver behind” is absolutely ridiculous, seeing how tough Carver was before and especially since he easily could radio to his people that Clem’s group is escaping. Kenny makes it very clear that he doesn’t want the others to see what he does, whether Clem watches Carver’s gruesome (and amazing gory) demise or not is up to the player. Arvo. With Arvo, you can argue that he was doing too much, and I agree to an extent, but at the same time Arvo literally lied and lured his whole gang to Clem’s group to rob and kill them, and afterwards not once does he try to show any good faith or apologize, so of course Kenny doesn’t treat him well, he’s not as forgiving. The others are like “Oh he lost his sister”, but that doesn’t mean he deserves to be let off the hook, they literally just care because he looks “weak”. Hell (mentioning other Walking Dead media sources), guaranteed if this was in the show or comic of the walking dead, they would’ve killed Arvo and continued on to their original location instead of taking Arvo hostage and following him to the house (which for all they knew could’ve been another trap). Arvo caused episode 5’s worst events to occur: He got Luke killed by having one of his guys (which he brought in the first place) shoot him in the leg, then ran across the ice and distracting Mike and Kenny, making them unable to help Luke at all with the walkers PLUS he shot Clementine (the 11 year old girl who could determinantly support him against Kenny the WHOLE time) and for sure could’ve killed her, and for what? Because she put down his zombified sister? Get the fuck out of here, that’s ridiculous. Arvo did something bad and instead of trying to make it right or punishing him for what he did, he just gets pity through losing his sister, pity which was NOT earned. Speaking of Arvo, the majority of the group’s decision to keep him around is what split the group up, the group became divided because of Arvo. Now, from the beginning, Kenny was not close to the other members of the Cabin survivor group, with them disagreeing on plans and NONE of the adults having the common decency to go and comfort Kenny after Sarita died AS A GROUP or just leave him be to grieve. When trying to take care of AJ as Rebecca is slowly dying, Luke tries to accuse Kenny of being “weird” with baby AJ, even though Kenny was the only one putting in the initiative to take care of him. Then with Arvo (as mentioned before), the group acts like Kenny is being irrational for not trusting his teenager who lied to them and led them in the woods to be robbed at gunpoint. Later, after Luke dies and Kenny blames Arvo (and Arvo swears at him, then gets beat up), they [mostly Bonnie] somehow manage to put Luke’s death on KENNY (which is completely ridiculous, no matter how you feel about Kenny) they started disagreeing on where to go and find refuge at once he starts the truck. How is Kenny not expected to be frustrated by this group? When they accuse and blame him for things and act like he’s so awful, even though he’s done nothing but keep them safe and hurt the people who tried to do harm onto them. Of course when they don’t like the way Kenny is acting, instead of just talking it out like ADULTS, Mike puts it onto Clementine to “talk some sense” into Kenny, but still decides to betray the group with Arvo (who again, tried to kill them and who he’s known for literally one day) and Bonnie (if she’s still alive). Shoot Kenny or Look Away. Jane specifically told Clementine very early into the episode ‘No Going Back’ that “Kenny is in a dark place, you’re the one he trusts most and the one who can bring him back.” This is very true, as seen by how Sarita’s death affected him and how he felt while talking to Clementine in the tent, feeling as though he was useless. While in the car, Kenny and Jane get into an arguement about where to go: To Howe’s Hardware (Carver’s old camp) or To Wellington. Now granted they both get into the spat, but Jane is the one who takes things personal with the whole “I spy with my little eye, an asshole.” comment, then they start insulting one another. Right after this though, when they spin out, notice one big thing: Kenny immediately checks afterwards to see if Jane is alright, then AJ, then Clem and then heads out of the car to get gas. Jane pretends like she is about to apologize, but then the moment he is out of the car she calls him a “fucking asshole”. She was taking it personally at that point, while Kenny may not of particularly “liked” her, there was still a bit of care. After this, she tries to get Clem to drive away, but they crash and Jane dips out with AJ and leaves Clem behind to put her little scheme into play. Kenny sees Jane approaching the rest stop, checks to see if she is alright, but then is shocked when she doesn’t have AJ, he runs off to search for AJ and she’s like “you’re going to see what he really is” and “you’ll see what he’s capable of”. So knowing GODDAMN WELL that this man lost his family (and bringing up his deceased wife and kid in the car argument), and that he VOWED to take care of AJ after Rebecca died, she decides to lie to him and to Clem about AJ’s fate, telling Kenny she left him to die so that he could have a reaction and snap. None of that needed to happen, not one bit. They could’ve had a civilized conversation like actual adults did if she was unsatisfied with Kenny’s behavior and they could’ve talked out where to go. But nope, I’ll hide a kid and pretend he’s dead so that this somewhat emotionally unstable man can attack me. She could’ve stopped the fight at any point and made it clear that AJ was safe, but then she makes the fight lethal by whipping out her knife. EVEN WHEN SHE HAS THE BLADE ALMOST PRESSED INTO HER CHEST, SHE IS JUST LOOKING BACK AT CLEMENTINE, WAITING FOR HER TO KILL KENNY. Jane wanted to kill Kenny, get rid of him so that she and Clem could follow her plans, but when she gets overpowered by him, she wants Clementine to do her dirty work for her. She manipulates a little girl into killing somebody who freaked out over a horrible lie. OF COURSE, Kenny didn’t have to take it that far and kill her, but Jane played a stupid game (that she didn’t know she could for sure win) and her stupid prize was her own unnecessary death. That fight was unnecessary and couldve been avoided, showing what sombody can do in their worst moment, in their worst state of mind cannot define the person as a whole, especially not in the apocalypse.
No matter what choice you make in the season 2 finale, kill him, leave him at the rest stop, leave him at Wellington, leave Wellington with him, HE SUPPORTS WHATEVER YOU DO, and unlike Jane he doesn’t act like he’s totally innocent, if you leave Kenny is basically like “Okay, stay safe” and gives her a little speech while all Jane does is try and beg you to stay as you walk away “Clem! I did it for you, for us. Clem...?”. And Kenny literally sacrifices himself for AJ and Clemetine twice, once for them to enter Wellington (a safe haven), and another time to save their lives while knowing he is going to die (seen in season 3 episode 1, if you stayed with him instead of going to Wellington). He made plenty of mistakes and traveled briefly into the dark side, but is indeed a strong man for not going COMPLETELY off the wall and going full blown cuckoo, saying “Fuck it, this world is shit, so I’m going to make others feel my wrath.” He didn’t emotionally abuse Clementine, the closest thing you can say to him doing that was with him blaming her for Sarita’s death (and if you did cut off her arm, then yes, Clementine IS PARTIALLY RESPONSIBLE for her death, as she bled out and the zombies smelled her) which he ends up apologizing for and owns up to, regretting what he said. Kenny doesn’t try to act like he didn’t do anything wrong, he ALWAYS acknowledges when he acts out and owns up to his faults. An abusive person DOES NOT admit to their wrongdoings, they push it onto others and act like they did nothing wrong, like they are innocent. Whenever Clementine disagreed with him on something after that point, he DIDN’T FORCE her to agree with him, he just hoped she would be on his side, over the side of people she only met recently. Trying to have someone you’ve known for a while on your side and trusting of you in the APOCALYPSE is NOT emotional abuse. Somebody worth your trust might confuse you with their words, but displays they are worthy through their actions. Season 2 of this game wasn’t about “trying to see Kenny is abusive” like some people try to paint it out to be, the big focus of the season was Kenny and Clem’s relationship, and whether or not you feel it’s time to give up on it. No matter what you do in the Walking Dead universe, you WILL change (most likely for the worse) and do questionable things to adapt to what the new world has to offer, that’s what trauma does to you. Kenny evolved from being “cowardly” to being able to do what needs to be done, not into a monster. In Kenny’s introductory episode of season 2 (A House Divided), Sarita has this box and Kenny insists he will take it for her, even after she tries to tell him it’s fine, to which she looks surprised but then tells Clementine “When I met him, he couldn’t life a fly”. Kenny wanted to show and feel like he wasn’t weak anymore, show that he is capable of doing the tough work, but was always once again hit with guilt when somebody close to him was killed and he couldn’t do anything to save them. He wanted to prove himself and show that he was indeed a worthy member of whatever group he joins. As Lee says in Clem’s dream after Arvo shoots her, “Bad things happen to everyone. And it’s hard to keep being yourself after they do.” Kenny’s sacrifice at the Wellington gates show that he is a broken man, he’s done bad things, things he has regretted (which he explicitly states while trying to convince you to stay there), but deep down he hasn’t changed, he is still a good man. Even if you don’t like Kenny, if you say you don’t like Jane either, the best ending is to go into Wellington and let Kenny leave as you enter, you are in a safe haven now with the baby and you don’t have to deal with him if you don’t want to. Saying that the “Alone” ending is the best is absurd, a little girl and a baby alone (based on a survival standpoint, rather than basing it on the characters you are left with) is the WORST ending. In season 3, we see Kenny again and he’s much more calmed and mellow, by the end of the season Kenny needed Clementine in his life, he needed her because she is the one who saves him, Clementine is the one who gives him back his sense of tolerance and patience after everything they’ve gone through, she is the one who brings him back while they take care of baby AJ. Even the way “your Clementine” is able to talk and feel about life in A New Frontier is shaped around who you chose. If you stayed with Jane, she is colder and less caring, more focused on survival. With Kenny, she’s more compassionate and focused on AJ’s wellbeing, having family on her mind, Kenny (arguably) leaving a better influence on her than being with Jane or by herself. ua-cam.com/video/BCGieXvvnJ8/v-deo.html (If you wanna get EXTRA technical, the “Your Clementine became...” stats at the end of A New Frontier ep5 it LITERALLY states that Clementine “enjoyed brief, happy days with her loyal friend Kenny and AJ, until a terrible accident changed all of their lives”. And it even has an impact on the type of Clem “personality” you have going into s4 (ua-cam.com/video/RToDAESYPaw/v-deo.html, walkingdead.fandom.com/wiki/Story_Builder_(Video_Game) ), shooting Kenny leads to righteous or brutal, while looking away leads to selfess or loyal). And before anybody can say “oh, well, this video was made before seasons 3 and 4, so these points are invalid.”, NO. Seasons 3 and 4 are a part of Clementine’s journey and the player’s choices shape the lore behind it, so yes seasons 3 and 4 are fine to use to analyze Kenny’s character and the impact he has on Clem, especially since he can be mentioned multiple times in The Final Season (and he is the only other character besides Clem and AJ who can appear alive in 3 seasons). Again, Kenny is a flawed, realistic portrayal of what the end of the world can do to a good person. You can feel and say whatever way you may about him, but I love his character (he sits comfortably in my top 10) and I will always dispute the statement that he’s abusive.
So basically what your saying is that killing Kenny is brutal. That's is an exaggeration and far from the truth. The reason that option was even there was because Kenny went crazy and was about to kill Jane and clem had to make a decision. And also Kenny does emotionally abuse clementine shown in s2 ep 2 or 3 Kenny is arguing with nick and luke at Walters house says says that clementine is staying there without her say. And one time Kenny disagreed with the group and tried to leave by himself with clementine without her say
@@leilasaid6232 Your not wrong but you can agree with Kenny before Luke and Nick sit with you /if you chose to sit with Kenny/ you can ask to stay with him, you can also do the same when Kenny wants to leave with just Clementine, she can ask or say she wants too but that's if you pick those options,,, also Jane could of stopped everything like people have said multiple times, she was making a broken unstable man more broken. Yes Kenny did have his faults but Kenny loved AJ like he loved Duck He wanted to be a better father, mentioned in episode 3-4 Kenny says he knows he wasn't a good father with Duck and that he wanted to be a better father for AJ
It's impressive to see how Clementine (at least in my storylines) is the only one who tries to keep the group together (like Lee tried) and in the end she finds her way through loneliness. So yes, Clementine's new Lee is Clementine.
This is one of the best video essays I have ever seen, the editing alone was done really well. Keep it up! Or, If you've kept it up since the 8 years that this video exists, great job!
Kenny cared. He didnt abuse, he had over 2 sets of severe trauma hit him, and it did enough damage to change his personality. Also who the hell trusts glass eater Jane?
Kenny was WAY too much like Anakin Skywalker from Star Wars - Episode 3. He loses his family because of Bandits, just like when Anakin lost his mother because of Tusken Raiders. Then Kenny worries about Sarita for losing her, too. Emperor Carver felt Kenny's hate and anger, which made him more "powerful". That's why if Kenny joined the Dark Side, he'd be able to save the ones Kenny loved, especially Sarita. but Sarita knew that was WRONG. So Kenny strangles her with the force from the Dark Side for turning against him. Then the fight between Jane and Kenny starts, and Clem steps in and stopped Kenny, felt into the lava, yelled at Clem: "I HATE YOU CLEM!" then burned up, became a machine, became Emperor Carver's apprentice.
almost like trauma doesn't ever justify treating other people like garbage. kenny was unstable, nasty, and possessive. while i love kenny and feel somewhat indifferent towards jane, i'd choose jane over kenny. kenny beat a man to death in front of clementine, beat up arvo in front of everyone because he was angry, and is constantly the force that drives others away from him. it's his way or no way at all, at least after clementine reenters his life. it doesn't matter that he cared.
@@ysabellamedrano3360 the man Kenny beat up took his eye made clem and others do slave labor and killed a man for taking too long. Yeah I would do the same.
To be honest preserving innocence isn’t a good idea as we can see in season 2 with that doctors daughter. I believe a father is supposed to teac a child life and survival skills to a world they live in. And teach them how to adapt
Kenny was WAY too much like Anakin Skywalker from Star Wars - Episode 3. 1: Kenny/Anakin loses his family/mother because of Bandit Raiders/Tusken Raiders. 2: Kenny/Anakin fears about losing Sarita/Padmé. 3: Kenny/Anakin joins the Dark Side just to "save" the ones they loved. 4:Kenny/Anakin reveals themselves as a Sith for Sarita/Padmé. 5: The fight between Kenny/Anakin and Jane/Obi-Wan started. (Clem steps in and shoots Kenny.) 6: Kenny/Anakin fell down onto the lava shore, looked up at Clem/Obi-Wan and yells: "I HATE YOU, CLEM!!!" 7: Kenny/Anakin was found by Palpatine/Carver, turned Kenny/Anakin into a machine, and became Palpatine's/Carver's apprentice.
@Unlimited Mobile Gaming Sure... I gotta say, that Kenny even was like Nathan Hawkins from Beyond Two Souls. He loses his wife and daughter in a car accident, then went completely insane about deactivating the containment field and putting the whole humanity in great danger just so he only could get his family back. PS: Who's "Kalja?"
I personally see Season Two as a full on Greek Tragedy. Full of new characters with problems, a villain of comedic proportions, a hero who rises to the occasion, and a character returning from a previous story. In a Tragedy, as the name implies, bad things happen. The most common are ironic tragedies. The second most common is Tragedy of Character. I see this entire season as the second, a Tragedy of Character(s). Specifically the second half, where you are losing more and more and you know SOMETHING is gonna give. And it ends with two polar opposites duking it out and you help to decide the fate. We have Kenny. He is Emotion. He is physically powerful, though unstable. He is a bottled up bag of emotions that just can’t let things go no matter how hard he tries. Through this, he creates emotional abuse that people understand but also is not warranted. Then there is Jane. Cold. Calculating. She is a survivor, and she is interested in surviving. We see very little else on her list. She is logic. And she is also a double edged sword. Because the moment she thinks she doesn’t need you, you are GONE. The only exception seems to be Clementine and AJ, for no other reason then Clementine is useful, and she isn’t heartless enough to leave a baby to die. Kenny appeals to emotion, Jane appeals to logic. During the final scenes in the snow, she is purposefully goading Kenny into exploding. Is she doing this for herself? Hell no, if she actually thought he was a danger to her, she would have LEFT, or atleast kept her mouth shut. Ya know why she goads and yells at him? To prove a point to Clementine. She is just as manipulative as Kenny is, she just so happens to have an opponent who is visibly not in the right state of mind, making her look like she is in the right. What do you think would happen if Kenny stayed quiet the entire care ride? And it was just Jane laying into him until he broke down in sadness instead of anger. Then it’s obvious that she is the aggressor. But since her target talks back and is angry, she can spin it to look innocent. Kenny is an abuser who keeps getting pushed by the world around him, but Jane is a manipulator who is trying to capitalize on that. I think that’s the reason that all of the endings are kinda considered bad in their own ways, except for Clementine alone with AJ. If you side with Jane, you are killing emotional instability and a good friend. You are betraying someone, just like what she wants you to do, or what SHE would do to anyone. You are becoming just as manipulative- narratively at least. If you side with Kenny, you let emotions run wild in search of this perfect fantasy… and you find it. But it’s not perfect. And either you have to leave Kenny alone, or you go with him, back with your abuser, appealing to emotion rather then logic. Finally… there is the Clementine Ending. Where Clementine rejects both manipulation and abuse in order to do things her way. Taking the things she has learned, and just… trying. I wouldn’t say that any ending is GOOD… in fact, I would say that all except the Clementine Alone ending should be considered “bad” endings. While Clementine Alone is the “Neutral Ending”. You don’t pick sides, you pick yourself and AJ. Maybe you will survive. Maybe you’ll make mistakes. But you will be unburdened by the bad… and the bit of good, in either exploding emotion or brutal logic.
Jane left a newborn baby in a car in the middle of a blizzard knowing Kenny cared about that child and told him he died in her watch knowing it would make Kenny angry to convince Clementine that kenny was a bad person when in reality Kenny wouldnt leave a newborn child in a car during s blizzard to prove a point
@@AppleOfThineEye no you're right. She said "it was an accident" and still risked an infants life to prove a point instead of sticking through it to help 2 children. Also there's no argument that Jane really cared about Clem because she just walked off and killed herself without any kind of warning to clem
>didn't care >taught her survival >gave her the nail file to remember her by >came back when she heard shooting >killed a man to save her life >is straight about what will - and does - happen to Sarah >predicts the psychological connection between Carver and Kenny One of those things is not like the other. (Hint: it's the first one.) Also, the infant is in no danger. For one, the car is warmer than anywhere else. Two, the car is whole and unbroken. A walker's not gonna break a window. And three, the walkers are frozen anyway. They can't fucking move. We see this on our walk to the rest area.
Jane is human garbage. At least Kenny cares about something other than himself. In that argument within the car, at the moment were Jane seems to be pushing Kenny to the edge, the car spins out; Who is the first to speak after everyone gets their bearings? Kenny asks Jane- "You OK?" with general concern in his voice. That's who Kenny is. The guy who (if you choose to shoot him) in his dying moments tries to ease any guilt you have- telling you you did the right thing. The guy who (if you go with him to the end) willingly ostracizes himself for you and a baby that isn't his. The guy who has lost his son, two wives, and two groups of survivors (that we have seen), and blames himself and his weakness for their loss. Of course he is going to be traumatized. Of course he is going to be bitter. No matter how tough Kenny talks, when it gets to brass tacks, he is willing to throw away his life for the people he has claimed as 'his'.
and yet Jane wanted to leave Kenny with Clementine once he stepped out of the car. She is no different than Bonnie / Mike who tried to rob the car and betraying your old friend, not to mention they were kind of responsible for Kenny's lost and left him irritable.
kenny never cared about anyone else but himself. Thru the whole game I was agreeing with kenny but he still screws you over and he acts like an asshole if you disagree with him even once in the whole game. I don't know how some people didn't pick up on that...
Bullshit. Kenny ended up like that because of trauma of his family's death, and he will still go with you to get Clem as long as you shoot Duck and defend him against Larry. You just have to say that Clem is your family, and he'll understand. Kenny is a very messed up guy, he has flaws, he can't control his emotions a lot of the time, but that's what makes him the most human character in the series. The rest of your cast will either backstab you, or are goodie-two-shoes about everything. Kenny sticks around, even if you piss him off, and will only ever leave you if you're actively going against him. At the end of Season 1, Kenny will sacrifice himself for Christa or Ben, and at the end of Season 2, he will put the children before himself and be left alone in the snow. Hell, at the end of the first episode, Kenny will always save Lee, regardless of how horrible Lee was to him. Yes, Kenny can be an asshole at times, but his true side shows when it has to. Jane was saying that Clem wouldn't be able to get Kenny to change, but in Season 3, he's a new man. He's happy, for the first time since the apocalypse started, he's happy just taking care of two kids on his own. After AJ is born, he makes him priority and is determined to keep him alive. Bonnie and Mike attempt to leave a new-born to die, after shooting a kid, just because they disagree with Kenny's plan. What, they have a better plan? Down south? Texas? Hell no, AJ would die on the way. Then there's Jane, who actually only cares about herself. Kenny may be an asshole to people, but he actually does care about them. Even when their truck crashes, Kenny asks Jane if she's okay with real concern. What does Jane do? She manipulates his emotions, leaving him to believe that she got AJ killed. Of course, she actually left him in a detreating car, in the middle of a snow storm, surrounded by Walkers. Wait, what? How is any of this a good idea? No shit Kenny is going to try and kill her, she just took away the only thing giving him purpose in such a horrible fashion. Instead of telling Kenny that AJ is alive, she asks Clem for help, leaving a kid to make the decision of shooting a man that they've known from the very beginning. No, Jane is the one who only ever cares about herself. She leaves the group, but does come back, but we all know it wasn't for the group. She only came back for Clem, trying to convince her to leave the group with her. There are plenty of other occasions where Kenny shows that he cares for others, like when Carver has Clem at gunpoint and Kenny gives himself up, but that would take too much time to look through the game again and type every thing he does. I don't know how some people didn't pick up on the fact that, despite being an asshole at times, Kenny truly cares for others. Hell look at the way Kenny and Jane die in Season 3. Kenny is teaching Clem how to drive, the car goes off the road, and Kenny sacrifices himself again for the safety of Clem and AJ. Jane tells Clem to check outside, when Clem comes back, Jane has hung herself in front of AJ. The reason? She was pregnant with Luke's child. How selfish is that? Leaving two kids on their own to survive, while killing yourself and another child. Their deaths really show a contrast in how much they care for others. Kenny will give his life for those he loves, Jane will give her life over stupid shit, and leave those she "loves" to fend for themselves.
I don't think Clementine had to "see Kenny for what he is" I think this entire time she's been the only one seeing him for who and what he really is. She sees him as a father and a man that fought for her and for Lee because she knew him before things got bad. And as people that are introduced to him recently, they're seeing Kenny as this monster changed by the apocalypse, telling Clem to open her eyes... in reality Clem sees him for the real Kenny, the one that is loyal and kind and protective. And she knows his pain. Pain that no one in the group can understand because they've never lost a child.
@Ryan Romano Yes, he's pretty unstable at this point, however at the end of the day those in the Walking Dead universe tend not to have the best mental health. He is a better option as Clementines caretaker than Jane by leaps and bounds
Exactly, kenny has been through alot and clementine has been there for all of it while none of the others have, if anything, clementine has seen the real Kenny.
Lee puts it well if you chose to tell Omid and Christa to leave Clem with Kenny. He says "You didn't see Kenny with his family. He was willing to do anything for them" (or something of the sort) and its true. Kenny has no reason to feel any loyalty to this group that brought nothing but death and pain onto his friends. Because they came to his lodge Walter was killed by Carver. And then Sarita was bit by a walker. People who say Jane was the clear choice are delusional. She was so willing to give up on her sister, Sarah and everyone else. She would be willing to give up on Clem too
I come back to this video a lot, as it's taught me a lot about how to weave the decisions characters make into a story. Absolutely one of the best videos on this site, with very few rivals to the name
I agree and the fact that most people can't make a compelling argument against this video just shows how well thought of the video is. Most people are just writing short essays to oppose which is not enough as there are still sides of his argument still standing.
I agree and dissagree. Jane was definitely worse but that's not my reason to why I think this video is inacurate (that's not how it works), this guy manipulates his audience by cutting out the good parts that should complete Kenny's ark and makes it look like he's a bad person. Plus, it was obvious that Telltale was going to continue this story with new instalments, so how can he be this judgemental and harsh on a story that clearly isn't even completed? It's the same as criticizing a movie before you've seen the ending
I feel like a lot of people are missing something about how abuse works when it comes to Kenny. Someone can be protective and be abusive at the same time by displaying behavior that puts people at risk over and over again. It doesn't occur as abusive to them, since they are acting out of righteous fervor and thus feel justified in their actions. To them controlling someone is being protective of them and very rarely does it become apparent to them that they are just being controlling than anything else. That is not to say that such people are malicious or evil, rather rash, unwise and insensitive. Trauma can lead to abusive behavior but it does not justify it. People with different predispositions will be affected by trauma in different ways and some might display abusive behavior in certain situations. The issue here is that storytellers need to more responsible while talking about trauma so that the stereotype of "The abused become abusers" isn't ridiculously reinforced because it's extremely damaging to public perception of how trauma works. We don't need more people sympathizing with abusers. And yes, season 2 certainly lacked nuance here.
Thank you for this measured response. I've become very worked up about Kenny in the past because he reminded me so much of what an abuser looks like. I'm glad to see someone else who shares a similar experience
Is empathy enough? Yes. Yes it is. If a work of art gets us to be in that place we would have never been before, no matter how fucked up that place is, it fulfilled my expectations and more. While trauma does not "create" abuse, the notion of "I have been through stuff therefore I am justified to..." is ingrained in our brains, and even people not otherwise violent or abusive will fall back onto that justification to lash out at others. It happens, that's what society teaches us, without saying it out loud: trauma can make you crazy, will make you crazy, to the point where when someone who has been to traumatic experiences does not break down some people find it weird and unnatural, like they are just waiting to burst behind the supposed facade. Following your interpretation, Kenny is that. Kenny is a man that had no reason or justification to actually be violent, at least on the first game, the one that ran away constantly and you would never imagine making the awful but necessary choices when the chips where down. However, he taught himself. He knows, on some basic level, that he should be lashing out, losing it after what happened to him and his family. And when he finally starts acting like that, people fear or respect him, and oh does that respect feel cathartic. And it gets easier, because people see him as a grieving, broken, patched-together-into-determination mess, and they do not want to confront him. And it works, narratively. This is also how abuse is born, through self justification. It is not the trauma that breaks you, but sometimes you just fill in the shoes of what the victim of trauma is supposed to be. And you lash out, and you go overboard, and eventually noone around you is even justifying your actions with what you went through and neither are you, that's just how you are now. So this might not be our Kenny, but then Clementine is not the Clementine we called down from the treehouse, is she?
+Generic Username I agree. Thank you! Someone knows their stuff! People snap! The environment can make you insane because you loose control. This is about power and control. That is WHY it is important to be genuinely nice to each other and realize that we are ALL related to each other. The environment mutates your genes and turn you into monster like everyone else. So be careful of your choices because of the butterfly effect. That is the TRUE horror of your choices! The butterfly effect is the horror! Your choices DO matter. Making choices is frighting! Empathy creates good change and growth.
+Generic Username It's great that the game gives us this perspective, but until watching this video, I didn't know that was the perspective the game was giving us. It put us in that position of an abusive relationship, but was never able to tell us, even at the end, when it would've been fine to give us that revelation. If people miss the point the game is trying to make because the game didn't make us understand, then empathy isn't enough.
+Generic Username Your interpretation would work if the game revealed that Kenny was, in fact, acting this way because he felt he had to. But he just does it, and in order for your interpretation to work we need to assume he did this offscreen somewhere before the events of the second game. Not saying that you're not on to something here, this would be a really interesting game to play, but it isn't what season 2 is.
I'd pick Kenny over Jane any day. Everything Kenny did in the second season was to protect Clementine. Jane on the other hand killed herself and left Clementine and AJ alone.
@@domossgameplays9730 grief is not an excuse to shout at and blame a child for a death. Imagine it was an abuser blaming his child for his mom's death because he's "grieving". there's no excuse for that in my opinion
@@nam9085 I think there is. It's called denial. After Kenny got over it he wholeheartedly apologizes because he feels terrible. An abuser wouldn't admit they're wrong.
The thesis of having people you can trust is more relevant to Kenny than Clem. Kenny sees innocence in children. He didnt want others to influence Clem. He probably thought Clem purposely killed sarita because of the group she was with's influence on her. Kenny hasn't just lost sarita, he has lost Clem. For the rest of the season, Kenny tries to protect Clem, with the inner idea that she isn't innocent anymore. Upon AJ's birth, Kenny saw a blank slate: an innocent newborn. If the baby was not in the picture, would Kenny have cared to attack jane? Kenny saw something in aj.
No offense but all that Jane says to Kenny is just to provoke him in order to get Clem on her side. She fabricates and chooses to escalate a confrontation in order to get Clem all to herself and then takes no responsibility for Clem in Season 3. Kenny is a broken man who lashes out and is suffering for the weakness he showed in the past, and while he's no angel, I'll never allow a person who confessed to using a complete and utter deception to trick the man she hates into lashing out in order to get rid of him. Jane hated Kenny because he had Clem, at least in my own playthrough. I wanted Jane to stay with the group but ultimately she was too scared of both responsibility and reliance on others to be anything but alone. I don't regret for a single second letting Kenny kill her, but ultimately she chose to make Kenny an enemy and her only way of getting out of the situation alive was to have Clem shoot the last parental figure in her life. Jane's no role model in the same way that Kenny isn't, but at least Kenny is made all too aware of his failures as a human while Jane is ignorant even if you choose to abandon her. I don't like that Clem is forced to choose between them, as I would prefer if neither had to die, but Jane could never be someone Clem could trust, and even Season 3's flashbacks show it.
She pushes a kid that hasn’t driven and who can barely reach the pedal to drive down a icey road through zombies. When it inevitably crashes she leaves clem to die. Then as you said deceives both to try and push Kenny to the brink of insanity. She barely cares for clem at all. Kenny, whilst an unhinged asshole, does have redemption in the wellington ending. The Russian kid lied and tried to kill clem but apparently him wanting to kill the kid was what made him too much? End of the day it’s about what clementine would do. I let Kenny Jill Jane first then shot him. But it’s not very clem. They don’t really give you much option but to leave alone or go to wellington and tbh wellington is a much more satisfying ending and we can- as with the first game- find some forgiveness for Kenny.
This is the best commentary on Kenny I’ve seen. Everyone “loves” Kenny but they do not acknowledge his flaws, likely because they’ve never played the second game. This is an extremely generous reading of this game, but very well done and enjoyable
Realistic doesn't mean you have to like him. No idea why people like Kenny. It's like saying a killer (like Carver) felt real therefore I like him and support him... I liked Kenny as a character too but he would not be part of my group. He's too much about his family that he'd endanger the rest of us
Warning: Long ass comment. Kenny was better than Jane in almost every way. The main thing that Jane had going for her that Kenny didn't is that it took her longer to lose her temper and when she did it wasn't as bad. Kenny in S1 didn't have huge temper if it didn't involve harming anyone in his family. Can you really blame him for having the temper he did after Sarita died in S2(Plus he was a little sour about Duck and Katjaa still, and carver made him half blind, so I guess it half justifies what Kenny did to him)? Yes it didn't justify everything he did before or after, but at least Kenny was hopeful and had faith in the people he trusted. Jane originally left the group in S2 because she didn't want to see Clem die, in which she had trust in Clem, but near 0 hope she would live. Kenny saw what Jane was but didn't let on about in the right way. He lost trust of the people who could've had his backs. When Rebecca gave birth, Kenny was happy, when Jane heard Rebecca was pregnant at all, she was already talking about abortion/abandoning the child (AJ). Kenny once again gained a second hope(first hope was Clem) at the sight of a living baby. Jane left because she saw the baby as a death trap, crying, need of food and water, she saw it as a waste of supplies and decided to leave (she may have said it was because of Clem but the baby was probably 50% of why she left, 10% Clem, 40% Kenny.) She knew Kenny and her were on thin ice and she knew if she provoked him, Clem might realize that Kenny was going a little mad, but fixable (in my eyes it was fixable, after seeing the good and bad things Kenny did I thought it balanced out, he still had heart, so I thought he was save-able anyway.) But she set Kenny up to get rid of him, so she could get the GODDESS CLEMENTINE on her side, her strategy being eliminating the last person who was truly against her. If you somehow forgave Jane in S2 at the end, after killing KENNY :(, in S3 the flashback shows Jane giving up and killing her self when she learned she had a baby from Luke, with no regard for Clementine, no goodbye, no nothing. She gave up at hope of new life, and left nothing to clementine than her walker self hanging from a noose. As I've mentioned Kenny saw a beam of hope with AJ and would protect him and Clem at all costs. If you chose to leave Wellington with Kenny, the flashback would show Clem crashing a car and Kenny being put near motionless on the ground, not being able to move anything but his mouth, he gave Clem a goodbye and told her to be strong, and he drew walkers away from her protecting her 'til the very end. I personally think going with Kenny to Wellington was best, even without him :P (at least there's a little bit of hope of him returning.) Jane cared near nothing for Clementine, just a tool for her to keep moving. Anyways this was my opinion, no ones gonna still be watching this video or seeing this comment at least, but if you do reply and tell me if I gave a good opinion, plus to type and edit this took an hour :P.
Lefou L quote from Ben regarding this Kenny apology garbage "I am so so sorry about what happened to your family..... You know how they died you said goodbye I never even got to see my family...." You hear that Kenny is not the only goddamn person in the universe to lose his family he'll Lee lost his brother and Clem lost a lot too but the still try to remain calm and level headed in their decisions Kenny on the other hand operates on this mentality of you're either with me or against me and he enforced this mentality onto a child nontheless In regards to the decision with Sarita where Kenny (the same guy with no regrets about killing Larry) yells at an 11 year old girl for not saving his love interest Kenny is a selfish hypocritical dipshit that didn't give a shit about Clementine until season 2 (seriously Kenny will refuse to help Lee find a little girl because of minor disagreements) Kenny is the worse
It's a metaphor, but also on point about how many in the community seems to view Kenny as your typical Florida Man, without looking closer into his character. Not many people seem to discuss how Kenny is very abusive, or how much of a danger and detriment he is to Clementine's survival. Jane isn't any better, duh. But to pick the lesser evil (Kenny / Jane) is still very evil.
20:23 I understand where you're going but abuse and trauma aren't all that black and white, accepting that trauma awakened or created something in Kenny that made him abusive is not automatically assuming that all trauma leads to abusers. People might not want this narrative because it demonizes traumatized people, and that's understandable, but also, there's a lot of worth on this narrative. Traumatized people CAN become abusers, and they are still accountable for what they do, the trauma is still there, valid and all, but they have become Abusers too, and that's not something that is black or white, it isn't "you're the victim or you're the abuser and that's it for all your life". This lack of knowledge is the one that abusers can take advantage of to victimize oneself, the idea that, if they're victims of trauma, suddently their actions are justified and not their own. We need to acknowledge that. Trauma can make some people lean into abuse, but the moment they cross that line, especially when knowing how much it hurts, it doesn't matter how much trauma they have, they are in the absolute wrong.
Agree with that one. My family and life have been both unstable and toxic, where it was unclear for me at times when I was supposed to feel safe and think that everything was fine - or when suddenly everything turned to hell. Pain can either make you shrivel into yourself and suffocate in all of it until you either decide to end by death... or you let it out. The healthiest but also most difficult way is to get help, get out of the situation and talk to someone about it. What's more easy is to lash out, it just feels just as good. The world feels cruel and painful, so why not treat it back the same. That's the dark reality of it. Not everybody has to be happier or like it when they act out like this, but it feels more easier to give into it than and let it out instead of falling down or trying to climb out of it. I've done some shitty things were I got into fights, was both verbally and physically abusive... I don't know if I also acted out on emotional abuse. What I feel when thinking back is the amount of pain I was in and the shame now that I treated members of my family and also friends this way and can only be so lucky that they understood it and forgave me. I got the help and I'm better now, but not completely out. There still times when I want to lash out just to feel better and not have it eat me. That's how I related to Kenny. I felt and understood his pain and also knew that him doing horrible things wasn't right, but that he didn't see it in that situation. That's why I chose Kenny.
Kenny reminds me of my father. Yeah, he can be (verbally) abusive and is a ticking time bomb of violence, but when you have so many good memories about someone that promises to protect you, it's hard to walk away from them. Only recently I've limited my contact father, even then it's hard because I still love and trust him deep in my heart, but in the end I know it's healthier for my mental/physical well being to avoid him as much as I can. Kenny isn't a bad guy, neither is my father. They just make the wrong decisions and don't think rationally sometimes. They also don't know how to vent their frustrations/sadness/or angers out in a healthy matter, which causes family and other people to be fearful of them and unsure how they might react. This eventually pushes them away and since they can't comprehend that the problem starts with their own behavior, they get more and more abusive/controlling because "their world" is falling apart.
I had this issues with my father too. In fact, this past year we actually got in a fist fight and I chased him out of my house, and even tried to stab him. I know the pain that brings and the pressure that puts on you. But now I'm gonna tell you something you don't wanna hear. Stop being a fucking sniveling little pussy and talk to him. Look at the situation from his point of view. Don't come in there and tell him how you felt as if only your feelings matter. Ask him why he did those things, you might actually have sympathy for him. Hiding from your problems is not a solution. Go talking to him wanting peace but be ready to fight. If you believe your father is a good person that cares about you work it out. Hiding from it like this is mentally scaring shit.
Okay, here's the deal. I'm a 5'8" 180 pound female, who has dealt with a father that has used emotional abuse to both my mother and me for more than 20 years. He is 6'6", lifts hundreds of pounds of steel for a living, and has a violent temper. His house is also filled with guns, and other military equipment. Finally he has a habit of threatening even his own family, that he'd track us down if we piss him off. Sorry if I'm afraid of him, because I truly believe he is capable to physically harm me or kill me one day. It's safer for me to avoid him/limit interaction with him, until I have the funds to move far enough away that it wouldn't be worth the effort to chase me down.
coldeed you have no idea what its like to live with an emotionally abusive parent, do u? ur the same dude yapping off in the comments on how "kenny isn't abusive" so thats funny
No, I lived with a father that would beat me and my mother. Real abuse that is inexcusable. Guys like you are just sensitive to a fault or cowards, incapable of sympathy or forgiveness while not having the guts to speak your own mind. Bday has a serious issue and I thought I'd offer what I know worked for me personally.
I love Kenny's story across the first two seasons of Walking Dead. I chose to shoot him, because I recognized that he was suffering and his self-resentment manifested itself as self-destruction. He refused to recognize it himself and thought he was being protective of what little family he had left. Abusers know what they're doing and how wrong it is, but I don't believe Kenny was a bad person at his core. That's why he thanks Clem when she chooses to shoot him in the final confrontation. He was finally letting go, and likely believed he would be reunited with his family in death. I then promptly told Jane to fuck right off.
On another comment I made the same conclusion as you (If I were to shoot Kenny.) I left him at wellington but if I were to shoot him it would to be to put an end to his suffering and finally free him from that life of pain that was surviving. It pained me to see him go but It's better than being torn apart and becoming a walker.
I love Kenny but I had to kill him in my view. He was in so much pain and his words made me feel like it was he right decision. I know it probably wasn’t the best for Clem but it’s my moral of me being unable to see people suffer. After years of minding my own business with my mom going through an abusive relationship with her ex. The last fight they had was the first and last time I tried to stop it. After that I felt guilt for not doing anything sooner so at this point. Ending Kenny’s pain felt like the right choice to me. Although that’s my opinion. (Also if anyone who knows me sees this. I’m still not allowed to talk about this so please don’t tell anyone we know)
Kenny was a shattered man, abusive? Yes he changed. I didn't like seeing him so violent. But I think based on everything that happened, Kenny simply had enough. It's really not that difficult to understand his thought process, though, he did become abusive towards the end. His intentions and feelings for Clementine always stayed true to his words, all he wanted was for her to be safe. The separate ending where he chooses to let Clementine and the baby stay at Willington is abseloutly heart breaking and really does show his true intentions and selfishness. Eventually thought, I choosed the ending where I went with Kenny (also knowing that Willington wasn't gonna last) Because one thing I learned from this, is that yes, you can't trust anyone, they all fucking backstabbed Clementine, used her, neglected her, blamed her. (except for the few who actually cared but died. Kenny was truly the only one I trusted Clementine with, broken or not, somewhat abusive, maybe but most certainly not an abusive step father. He was a God damn gem to me.
Evil Snail but I hated it so much. It didn’t feel right or how the way I would have expected. All the ways to die in a zombie apocalypse and he dies because he didn’t wear a damn seatbelt. It was sad but I didn’t feel emotionally connected to his death
Amen. Kenny might be abusive towards the others, but that's why it might be better that the rest went off. I just couldn't leave him alone in the state he's in. And if he didn't punch Arvo around, I'd be on the same page as him on that guy.
Black The Nerevarine Then in Season 3 THEY FUCKING KILLED HIM OFF IN THE MOST FUCKING SHITTIEST FUCK YOU EVER TO THE PLAYERS!!!! Jane just fucking ditched you, but Kenny help Clem, with life and with AJ. They weren't abusive or dysfunctional, but a family. Kenny was an amazing person, who had nothing but shit thrown in his face, and broke. But when he moved on, a gem from all that shit returned and he was able to truly deal with his issues and become a better man in the end. R.I.P. Kenny -loving father, husband, and good friend...
I know I'm 8 years too late, but eh, I'll bring up some problems I have with this video anyway: 1.) Kenny never leaves alone with the boat. It's a myth, and if you piss Kenny off enough, yeah, he'll stay behind with the boat, but when you come back to the house he'll be trapped in the shed alone, having been beaten up by "The Invalids". At which point, he goes with you to save Clementine regardless, and meets the same fate as every other version of Kenny in S1. 2.) Kenny is NOT a coward. Kenny will try to fight Larry in Ep1, if you don't deescalate the situation, and get beat down by the brick house Larry is. He will save Lee in that same episode, despite his family already being safe and walkers flooding in, being the only reason Lee lives to see another episode after Larry sucker punches him. Plus he saves his son 3 times, once at the gas station right before the game starts (400 days), at the farm, and then outside the drugstore. Each time, from a walker that had a grab on his boy. In Ep2, Kenny is the only one putting his foot down to investigate the St. John's, risking everything to ensure the place is safe. Without his insistence/encouragement, the entire group would have died as cattle. At the end of the episode, he will charge in to save his son like an idiot against a man with a rifle, and to the surprise of 5 whole people, gets shot for trying. In Ep3, he is one of two people that goes on a supply run to make sure the group isn't dying from lack of supplies, even with Ben stealing their sh-t), and with a guy that he may love, but also may hate the guts of (Lee). By the midway point, he suffers a world-shattering, soul-crushing event that rocks his very being at its core, and he spends the rest of his screen time in S1 and even S2 recovering from that loss. But right before that point, if you confront Kenny, and don't work things out with him peacefully, the dude will try to kick your ass, and if you are too passive? He'll legit shove you out of the train car, locking the door, and giving you a secret bad ending. At this point onward, it isn't cowardice, but apathy, that stops him in his tracks. Bro has lost his reason to continue, and is like a walking corpse himself at this point, the only thing bringing him life is hatred/bitterness toward the world and constantly being prodded to do something when he's too hurt to care otherwise. He sorta rebounds here and there, but Kenny is a broken man since Ep3, and his only real shining moment from then on is at the end of Ep5, where he makes his famous "sacrifice". I could go on and on about how Kenny is anything but a coward with more moments from S2, and instead is the opposite, being too hotheaded and stubborn to back down and realize that he's outmatched in just about every confrontation he's faced with (Lee being his main opposition). 3.) Kenny is not abusive. One could argue that he was heading there (no one starts out as an abusive person), but even by the end of S2, I don't consider him abusive at all. Never laid a hand on his wife, never laid a hand on his son (even though the kid frankly needed some harsh love IMO, and it was the coddling/overprotection that led to the boy's death), and never laid a hand on Sarita. Two separate relationships over 2 seasons, and the guy never once hit them, or even threatened to. Was he verbally abusive? In that apocalyptic world, I'd be surprised if you DIDN'T scream down someone's throat at some point to get your point across, as Kenny often needed to (or at least felt he needed to). He had serious anger issues, and sure, he could even get violent. However... failing to think of an instance where his violence wasn't either completely justified, or he was egged on by someone else while he was in an emotionally unstable state, in which S2 he was in such condition practically the entire time. He still never hit Clementine (I remember he elbows her accidentally if you try to pull him off of Arvo, and I think also pushes Clem out of the way while fighting Jane). But I will say that "Kenny is abusive and dangerous, and bad for Clem" is the direction S2 was trying to go, 100%. Every character was obsessed with Kenny, talking sh-t about him, warning Clem about him, talking about wanting to escape from Kenny, yadda yadda yadda, despite Kenny frankly being what was pushing the group since his arrival. They wouldn't have escaped Carver, they wouldn't have saved AJ's life (most likely, anyway), and they wouldn't have survived Arvo's group's ambush. Also, while constantly harping on Kenny's 'imaginary' safe haven to the North, they stuck with him, because they knew they'd be wandering aimlessly otherwise. Yet he's dangerous, a ticking time bomb, a threat... so let's take the truck (that Kenny fixed and the only form of transportation the group has), the supplies (that Kenny forced out of Arvo, like it or not), and bail, leaving an infant and an 11(?)-year old girl with Kenny in a half-built house in the middle of Winter. Could have left with what was on them, if they believed the group was too toxic, but nah... let's try to take everything. I love that Clem can actually call them out for it, too. I seriously hated the cast of S2. Even Luke wasn't perfect, as he was the actual coward that you keep insinuating Kenny was. But still, Luke was one of the only "good" characters in S2. Even then, Kenny > the rest, easily. If Telltale wanted me, the player, to side with someone else over Kenny, then they needed to make me value them over him, or at least put them on even ground. But instead... they all sucked, or died way too early, like Walter. Then there's Jane... ugh. I miss Lee, man...
Season 2 tried so fucking hard to make you not side with Kenny when majority of the things going on with him MADE sense, with the context of all he had been through he was still a good man at heart and if we DO side with him in season 2 he ends up sacrificing his life for us
Thank you for putting into words everything I was thinking 😭. This man is broken and he lost everything, of course he's going to be overprotective and a little rash.
I used this video to study for my essay for my English class which is the topic (what drives a person to be someone else?) meaning Kenny was once a family man a kind person willing to risk everything for his family if it meant to kill innocent people, but when it’s taken away he goes to a darker place but keeps Clem close because he truly does care about the only family he has left even if she isn’t blood. But I didn’t understand that until I watched this and kinda put my essay together. I got an A on it.❤️
"What can change the nature of a man?" is the arc-thesis question posited by _Planescape: Torment._ If you haven't already played it, it might be worth a look.
I never understood the hate for Kenny. Almost all his action where completely UN-selfish and was always trying to help his family. (Including Clem and AJ) Its even proven when he begs for the Wellington group to take them and he'll stay knowing he'll probably die. I don't know why but that line "I just need them to be ok" always made me shed a tear.
@ahegao god I have an issue with how this video is structured and just plainly calling him an abuser just like that. It ignores the situation, setting, and ALL of the other characters, who really weren't good parents or role models either. Many of them not really caring, or just barely about Clementine.
@ahegao god How an abuser? I mean, as Clem you can disagree with him the whole game he still would try to protect Clem. Every time he gets angrier he really has a valid reason to be. Angry at Lee because he didn't help him in killing Larry?, well, from Kenny's perspective, you're the one that are putting Clem, the chance of saving his family, Lily and basically everyone in risk for an asshole. Also, remember that Larry in chapter 1 needed pills to get recovered, and in a meatlocker they didn't have those, which makes more unlikely that he would recover. To be honest, Kenny has more arguments in that situation. Angry at Lee because he disagrees about leaving the motel?, well, the game showed us that there were bandits around there that since weeks were being a problem. Angry and yelling at Bonnie, Mike and Jane when he fixed the car? Well, according to Kenny "there's only 1 day of food for that kid". Bonnie, Mike and Jane by arguing with the one that fixed the car and by wanting to wait until tomorrow are being very irresponsible. They should've left in that exact moment when Kenny fixed the car like Kenny said, but instead of that, they just wanted to continue arguing with him and waiting until tomorrow like nothing or like it's not a big deal. And even knowing that, Kenny didn't even think about leaving or betrayng the group even if he cares that the baby has only 1 day of food, he still wanted to convince them and have their approval. Bonnie, Mike and Jane didn't understand that he was angry because he precisely thought that just waiting would affect the kid. We just can't see him angry and call him an abuser. He most of the times has very good reason to get angry and the people around just were thinking "oh, he is getting crazy, he is turning into Carver blablabla"' without understanding why he gets angry in the first place or without seeing his arguments and just making him seem like the bad guy. That being said, I agree that a few times he was angry for not good reasons and sometimes he was kind of a dick with Lee even if you agree with him.
ahegao god “either with me or against me” stuff is kinda not on point though, because most of the time (it not every time) he apologized to Clem for being a dick if he actually was one. (Like when he just lost it due to losing Sarita and blamed Clem for it)
His choices were all selfish. Did you pay attention to the story? Before his wife and child died, it was all about protecting them. Granted it's noble, it's also selfish because he was doing it for himself and he didn't care about others.
The video: Talks about how Kenny is thoroughly a very flawed person, someone who lets his emotions get the better of him and typically lashes out in the worst way possible whenever things don't turn out his way. The comment section: Supporting Kenny because of the one thing he's angry for is completely justified. The choice would be, would you stay with someone that will make you feel lesser, someone you can't talk back because you're too busy thinking about his feelings just because he's family or would you finally take a stand for yourself, realizing that blind loyalty isn't the correct choice?
Anyone chosing Jane over Kenny don't really understand Kenny. They kept saying he would never let Clementine go. He does let Clem go for her to be safe at Wellington.
Both of them were kind of bad, but where Jane was just self-centered, Kenny was not only a murder, but always made problems wherever he went from his inception.
krizzex there both clearly in the wrong and telltale gave both Jane and Kenny points to justify themselves for there actions or why they did what they did and both points about each other are somewhat correct which furthers the point that going with either makes no damn sense, the canon ending is alone for many facts
I chose Jane because Kenny was a threat that Clem would have to always deal with. She didn't have a bond with Jane, so I figured she'd be totally expendable. I also didn't know I could abandon Kenny.
I like how he just ignores Jane being a gaslighter and manipulator. Sure, Kenny wasn't the best, but Jane was far closer to the worst. She literally left a baby out to freeze in a blizzard just to gaslight Kenny and prove her point. Kenny and Jane were both monsters, but Kenny was a monster who would do anything to protect Clem, and later AJ-even though at some points he pushed Clem away, he probably would've still taken a bullet for her if it came to that. Jane was a monster ready to leave the little girl and baby to fend for themselves on a moments notice. Was I happy with season 2 and Kenny's character? No. Not at first. The more I thought about it, though, I really loved what we got, even if I would've preferred something else. Also, I'm totally on Not My Kenny express. The personality change is believable, of course, but I don't think it's what would've actually happened.
Not to mention it's still possible to side with Kenny in the last confrontation and still say it to his face that hes dangerous, and also leave him later on. Kenny may be unhinged, maybe too unhinged for safety, but hes still way better than Jane. She has the empathy capacity of a fish and only keeps Clem around because she sees her as a survival tool and an idealized version of her sister. If Clementine wasnt such a badass Jane would have abandoned her like she abandoned everyone else.
@@justastudent1423 Exactly! Honestly, it's absolutely crazy anybody can truly defend Jane. As a character, she was *amazing,* but she was a horrible person who only saw Clem for usefulness and similarities to her sister.
@@StoneBasilisk You call it crazy that people can defend her but if you read most of the comments and their associated chains from a few months ago you'll see a bunch of Jane defenders taking half a page out of Jane's book and turning a peaceful stating of opinion into a stupid argument instead of just letting people *state their goddamn opinions in peace*
@@cogwithnoambition2990 I didn't read many replies to the comments I looked at-were people seriously pulling that crap? I guess it does give a bit of explanation as to why they like/defend such a shit person (who, yes was an amazing character, but was still a shit person).
I really like Jane more than Kenny you choose Kenny you get in a car crash you go with Jane you gat a freaking dope TATTOO but I still cried when Clem killed Clem I mean I don’t hate Kenny but he’s not my favorite
This is no joke, one of my most favorite videos on this platform, it goes so in deep into something seemingly simple and clearly had a lot of focus put into both the writing and editing, and that intro while long, was super good
“I was honestly too busy pressing the [HUG KENNY] button”
SAME
There's not a single video on the internet that doesn't do that
Wouldnt"kill" be much better
@@Exel3nce _no_
@@br3adcat ofc it would. He is the worst
@@Exel3nce _n_ _o_
Retrospectively, the part about becoming Lee makes a lot more sense having played through the next two games. Season three is Clementine's Kenny phase, if you will; she's messy, violent, and shut off. And then the next season is her Lee phase, where she's focused on protecting the kid that she's taken on.
that's a cool way to look at it, puts a lot more value on season 3. it also makes sense in context to lee, who before the game started murdered the person his wife was cheating with (I'm assuming that their marriage a little before the murder was rough and there were arguments and stuff). you could say that was his Kenny phase.
She's more like Kenny in the 4th season than lee if you ask me, especially considering how violent she's willing to get for him. I'll never forget our little Clem telling James she'd "claw his fucking eyes out" if he touched AJ. That along with a lot of reckless things Clem says(that we don't pick) without taking precautions.
I love lee but i hate thinking of Clem as "trying to be lee" cause if she was, she'd be dead because lee was nice to a fault, so much so that he's dead, she just isn't enough like him, i think that's too rosey of a observation.
@@neonthehedgehog12 well at the end of the game she was in the same position as Lee but AJ just refused to kill her
@@seru.89 I know, but cause Aj isn't like Clementine, she lives. The same why i don't like to think of Clem as Lee. We all knew how that story ended.
@@neonthehedgehog12 yes but Lee couldn't be saved he was already turning
“It’s a game about becoming Lee.”
Holy Jesus. You predicted season 4 in 2015. Clementine has AJ and will probably die the same way Lee did...
What the frick dude, this is predictions. First Innuendo predicts S4 and now you.. Jesus Christ
Nope
I mean.
*almost, literally almost.*
*almost.*
*literally, almost.*
@@mahirukoizumi6031 Waaaay too fucking close man..
The best ending has to be going to "Wellington" with Kenny, then watching Kenny *FINALLY* recognizing himself for who and what he is and how that is a major danger for Clementine and AJ, and then making the right decision by walking off on his own, right after giving her his hat.
It's a beautiful ending imo and even though God only knows what will happen to a broken, lonely Kenny (we never did sadly), it makes the most sense and it's great to finally see Kenny's "family philosophy" being put in action
I read somewhere that he was supposed to kill himself in that ending, walking into a lake and drowning himself, but they cut it off
@@Anna-wf9fd so in that alt universe theres a chance hes still alive right? Cuz when u go with him they kill him off in a flashback which feels cheap and frustrating since you cant affect the outcome.
Honestly, I feel they kill off a lot of characters to prevent too much branching narrative paths, and it's pretty obvious they do that. No character carries over from one season to another properly, they either die or separate and disappear. The only exceptions are clem and Kenny and kenny dies right after s2 anyway.
@@halinaqi2194 yeah, they pretty much left that ending open, which makes it the best one honestly. I hated how they killed him off in season 3, there were many more scenarios that would do him justice
I couldn't leave him, not after everything he was willing to sacrifice for Clem and AJ
@@cordycat9798 I had to when I learned if you stay with him he dies in a car crash
“Pass me that can duck”
That made me truly sorry for kenny
What about me HuH
...
@@duckdoofus3786 rekt
Alex Warner I laughed at him for it
Both Kenny and Jane try to substitute Clem for the people that they lost and use her to try and reconcile their mistakes. Kenny thinks he has his second try at protecting his child from the dangers of the apocalypse, Jane thinks that she has her second chance of appreciating, teaching and taking care of her sister. Yikes this is depressing
I wished you would have talked about how Kenny sacrificed himself to get AJ and Clem into Wellington. I feel like that made that ending worth it. He knew they were better off there without him.
He ended up making this vid about a year before season 3 was released I think. So thats why he didn't talk about it lol.
I don't know man, i think that killing Kenny and then taking off alone with AJ is the best ending. I think that if you let Kenny kill Jane it kinda mess the character. If you shoot him, you prevent him of doing some irrational shit, he forgives you and truly dies as good man. And Jane putting AJ's life at risk just to prove a point? She's not worth being a partner. That's my favorite ending (:
@@gustavolopes2490 I know she survives in season 3, but it's an 11 year old child and a baby. If you really wanted to leave both of them, it would've been logical to get to Wellington and then leave Kenny behind.
@Ben66 66 yes, but from my point of view, Jane's actions are not as passionate as Lee's, i mean, what Lee did had no relation to his later group, did not reflect on his treatment or put anyone in danger. Idk, whoever came out of that fight alive would be too unstable to take care of Clem.
@@gustavolopes2490 I'm not saying you should change your opinion but I just wanted to share what I would've done. Just let Jane get bodied (As she should) and then leave Kenny at Wellington. I get why you'd not want Kenny to kill Jane and say him "dying a good man." and all but he killed MANY other people that wasn't just Jane and so did Lee at one point (granted they were all bad people but so was Jane and Kenny in a way.) Kenny's character is tragic and truly one of the more sadder sides of the game at least in my eyes. If I were to choose to shoot him my reasoning would only be to release him from the hell of that life he was living but leaving him to survive, possibly die or meet new people off screen would've been better to me since we could all hope he was alive and well somewhere out there in the world.
When you accidentally save Doug because you thought Carly was able to handle herself and you needed to give help to the weaker one
I HAD THE EXACT SAME THOUGHT!! THANK YOU
When I first played this series i overthought everything WAY too much like this dilemma I thought, hey Carly’s really good with a gun, get her another clip for the gun and she can just shoot the walkers off of Doug, but that was before I realized someone always dies no matter what in most scenarios
Doug's cooler anyhow
@@anthemiusaugustulusiii7831 I just wanted to get my boy Lee laid
@Chandler Burse sadly
“Go on now, you don’t need to see this.”
Kenny saying that to Clem shows that, damaged of a man he is, he still cares and has a decent heart.
I don’t get at all why he says in this video he’s an abusive stepfather
In a way he’s a stepfather and he was violent and sometimes irrational, he’s to blame for that. However he’s a good parent (maybe not as careful as Carlos but Carlos was too flawless if you ask me, a bit unrealistic) as you said he doesn’t want Clementine to pay for his decisions. Him having very bad relationships doesn’t make him abusive to Clementine.
What Jane says in my opinion is totally inaccurate, he let people correct him many times during season 2, he let Clementine contradict him, he just get a little annoyed like always.
He just becomes way more violent and unlikable to everyone after losing Sarita. Even so he’s the best shot Clementine has to reach Wellington.
Him being very pushy and a bit unreasonable doesn’t really make him a dictator either. What he usually did is to get get things done and safe as soon as possible while usually other people just wait and see. That’s a bit careless but ultimately effective to survive.
Just the fact he is willing to let go of Clementine in a couple of endings (as well as when she meets her if you say you want to part ways) with her makes it clear he’s no dictator, he lets people he loves and knows and respect have a choice. (I guess what many people don’t understand in Season 2 is him knowing very few about those people, he just met everyone but Sarita and Walter so I think it’s safe to assume he never truly trust anyone but them and Clementine, that’s why he doesn’t listen to them all that often.
@@edwardsuou I think he means abusive in the sense of violent and uncontrollable which are the main characteristics of domestic abusers and they certainly fit Kenny but like most people he seems more interested in shaming then helping
@@luisandrade2254 people become violent to unknown people when they have to survive in an apocalypse, it’s called desperate defense, in his mind Kenny punched Arvo because he thought he was dangerous. (And you can argue he was indeed a danger to the group)
And people get more unreasonable and hard to talk to whenever they just had a psychological trauma.
Jane was also already hostile towards Kenny so you can’t really say he assaulted her in chapter 5, she said she let the kid to die (meaning she could’ve done the same to Clem and she was dangerous) and Jane was the one bringing out a knife as soon as Kenny got mad, we can’t know if Kenny would’ve wanted to kill her if she didn’t, I would say he would’ve just fight her a bit and then let her live and get away with Clem. Kenny doesn’t just kill people if they did something wrong to him, he never wanted to kill Ben for instance but he wanted and tried to punch him.
It’s true Kenny became more violent and it was way more unreasonable to the point the strangers either do what he says or he leave without them. That’s bad don’t get me wrong but it’s not abusive.
@@edwardsuou I didn’t say it was abusive I just said it’s a common characteristic of abuse thus the op association. I don’t even know if there’s a defenition of abuse tbh
@@edwardsuou yeah those saying that he's abusive have absolutely no idea what they're talking about
Kenny is the most realistic and emotional character. I thought he died in season one and I was majorly upset. Then I found he was still alive in season two and that was amazing to see!
Femur breaker
@@pablodonoso7674 pablo donoso
@@roskcity Johannes Löf
bro I criedddd
@@breenewi6405 chain ruined
I was in Wellington with AJ. I took Kenny's advice because he said and I quote, "I don't trust myself to keep you and AJ safe."
I like to think by choosing that ending, he doesn't die. And maybe he is out there, surviving like a badass.
It makes me feel at peace cause they didn't do his death justice in 3.
He should have went out by saving Clem and AJ from a group of walkers, taking their attention away and going on a rampage till he is inadvertently taken down, probably in the way of you dont see it, but confirmation that he is dead with him gurgling as he is ripped apart while Clem gets away with AJ
@@AnthonyFlames275 this is facts
I like to think in that ending, Kenny realizes he won't be able to change enough to be Clem's "new Lee" due to the trauma he has faced and allows clementine to be free of him- willingly allowing himself to suffer for the sake of Clem and AJ- Losing the abusive nature of his relationship to Clementine
Even tho Clem was the one who wrecked the car and killed kenny💀💀 I always choose go with Kenny and leave Wellington, I thought Clem would be happier together with him and Aj.
Anthony Flames I think he did save Clem and aj. He knew the accident crippled him but aj and Clem were fine and with the walkers drawing closer he sacrificed himself so they could escape
luke had so much potential i felt so bad the first time saw his death
yeah and what sucks is that he apparently got killed because of pedos shipping him with clem. him a 27 year old man with a 11 year old girl and telltale did not want to be seen as a disgusting game company so they killed him off. apparently the final choice was going to be luke or kenny but they scrapped it for that reason and others such as the narrative of luke hiding and putting aj in danger not going with his character.
@@fernfaith lol even pewdiepie did but to be fair pewdiepie thought clem was over 18.
@@fernfaith she’s 16
This bitch Bonnie told me to go ahead and save him when its clear that the ice was about to crack. I chose the to shoot the walkers. And she went ahead where luke was. And she started hating on Clemintine bruh.
@@0subsWith0vidsChallenge source???
Jane's logic: "Kenny's already broken, so... let's break him more"
More of Jane’s flawless logic: You have to do whatever it takes to survive……… *kills herself before season 3*
it's like accidentally breaking a flashlight. you don't shatter more so that you can see.
I sat there and watched him kill her. Didn't even pick up the gun. She was always looking for a fight, she had to go for that alone. Kenny didn't deserve her bullshit.
@@B-rex395 I mean…
@@thesocialgracesofanangrybe7446 same
We don't talk about Telltale's bankruptcy
No why you do this to me 😭
You’re talking about it right now
What's the song at the start?
We dont talk about Thanos dying in Episode 1 of Telltale Guardians of the Galaxy
@MonkeyBones Eh,served its purpose
Kenny is my favorite video game character ever, he's so flawed and destroyed, he just seems so real
My dad is an identical twin of kenny, he even sounds like him.
+Instant.Michael that's.... Not good o_o
NJJL98
why? he's aggressive and a jerk at times, but he always puts me before him and is caring and loving like any other parent.
i mean... judging from the video... :/
I mean, my dad does that too, but without being aggressive and a jerk. People like that exist.
I have to say, Kenny is a good reason as a symbol of hope. Even though there are pipedreams, he believed in it until he dies.
He believed in Lee and Clementine as a means of moral support and a motive for something to protect.
He believed in the boat, since its something that will help them restart their life anew from dangers.
He believed in Wellington, a community far up North that will keep them safe, or give Clem and AJ the life they deserve.
The first group Kenny was in, is the best group as they understand Kenny. They all believed in the boat and they all had Lee.
The second group Kenny was in, is shit because they don't understand Kenny. They doubted Wellington (understandably) and they had no real leader.
The difference between Kenny is night and day because Lee is a Leader and Kenny is a survivor.
Kenny isn't fit for leadership yet he felt the responsibility because he wanted to keep Clem alive. He is a survivor and yet an complete opposite of Jane and sometimes the opposite of Lee.
He knows he is no "Lee", but yet he tries. That's why I sided with Kenny.
Kenny at least fucking tried to change, Jane does not.
Out of the "TT:TWD" characters, Kenny is the most unlucky and the most tragic. So its no surprise that he is a ticking time bomb.
Kenny was WAY too much like Anakin Skywalker from Star Wars - Episode 3. He loses his family because of Bandits, just like when Anakin lost his mother because of Tusken Raiders. Then Kenny worries about Sarita for losing her, too. Emperor Carver felt Kenny's hate and anger, which made him more "powerful". That's why if Kenny joined the Dark Side, he'd be able to save the ones Kenny loved, especially Sarita. but Sarita knew that was WRONG. So Kenny strangles her with the force from the Dark Side for turning against him. Then the fight between Jane and Kenny starts, and Clem steps in and stopped Kenny, felt into the lava, yelled at Clem: "I HATE YOU CLEM!" then burned up, became a machine, became Emperor Carver's apprentice.
I agree with you. Kenny even has dialogue that says "Lee would know what to do" literally telling the player that Kenny realizes this is not the role he was meant to play. But he still puts the effort forward which makes him great in my opinion.
Plus Jane isn't any better She just does it in a different way plus
If you go with the character this is what happens
Kenny: dies protecting Clem from walkers and teaching her to drive
Jane: Just gives up. She wasn't mentally stable. She sends Clem away and hangs herself for Clem to find
Who do you think Clem should look up to
A Teacher, A Survivor, Someone who protects the ones they care about and when they can't protect them anymore they tell them to escape and move forward
Or
A Person who gave up, Someone who couldn't handle living in this world, Someone who sent there loved ones away, just for them to comeback a swinging rope and growling body.
@@ssense7042 espaiclly since Kenny sacrfices himself for you when he takes the radio. true loyalty there
J-rod ! although ben never got to say goodbye to his family, i firmly believe that kenny had it worse. ben could still have hope that his mom and little sister were alive, while kenny watched his family die in front of him. ben was messed up and wanted to die at one point, which makes me feel for him. im not discrediting the pain he felt because it was more than upsetting to watch him beg lee to drop him into the walkers, but if we're comparing kenny and ben and who had it worse, we can't reasonably compare ben; the college kid who lost contact with his family, watched his friends die, was threatened by lilly (and actually did it, causing the death of kenny's family), to kenny; the fisherman who saw his son eating literal human meat, killed a man in a meat locker in an attempt to save the group from a potential huge walker, lost his wife and son right in front of him, lost his best friend, got his eye beaten out of his face with a walkie talkie, bashed carvers skull with a crowbar (the fact that he enjoyed it was proof enough that he was already traumatized), lost sarita, and much much more. they both went through terrible things, but the difference between them is huge. it would be unfair to compare them any different
Jane spent like a solid quarter of the game trying to push this man to the brink of madness
Exactly. She just manipulated people
She doesnt really push until the end of season 5 when kennys basically torturing a prisoner
@@wizgi7201 he’s torturing a shithead who regardless of what you do shoots clems and runs away Fuck Arvo “My sister is sick” no she’s not you liar. He gets mad at Clementine for shooting a walker trying to kill her son. Idk why Mike and Bonnie felt bad for that piece of shit
hated her. probably my least favorite character of season two aside from carver (though he added tension which was good, he was just a p.o.s) and arvo lmfao who SHOOTS a kid??? kenny was in the right to beat arvo’s ass and kill carver. not to mention, jane as well.
not at all, kenny was broken from the beginning of the season
Honestly I feel walking dead season two would have ended much better if it was Luke VS Kenny. This decision would be such tougher one. Kenny was the old figure that we knew and trusted who is know a broken man. Luke is the new guy who we may not fully trust as much as Kenny but is probably much more stable. Jane really only cares for herself and even pretended to kill Rebecca's baby! Honestly i chose Kenny in the original ending but if the decision was between Luke and Kenny I would be much more conflicted
Totally agree. I definitely would pick Kenny over Luke, however that's a decision that I would actually have to have a good thought about. Letting Jane die was a no brainer for me.
Bmanfly I couldn't even choose which one to sit with, Idk how I'd be able to choose whose life to save
I feel like by the end. If it all played out to be Kenny beating in Lukes' face and I was forced to choose between the two- I think Luke would've been one of the easier choices in the game. Luke was stable and a pleasantry and Kenny was taxing and always felt detrimental to me. Which is kinda why I think it would've been better/ is better that we were presented with Jane. I feel like the 50/50 ratio between those characters is preserved but in this alternate ending speculation, on one hand, you're stuck with a friend who you KNOW you can count on and on the other a melancholy link to the past that struggles to be a normal empathetic understanding human being. FUCK THESE ARE GOOD GAMES.
Bmanfly WHOA YES
i was totally team Jane, and i would totally be team Luke. Kenny was clearly unstable
I think that the ultimate theme is not necessarily a cynical "no one is ultimately trustworthy," but more "you cannot replace the people you love with surrogates." I think this is echoed by Clementine's search for a Lee surrogate, Jane's desire to run away from Clem because she keeps seeing her sister in her, and Kenny's constant pursuit to replace his long lost family. It tells us that there we run into trouble and make poor decisions when we continuously try to look for surrogate replacements for lost loved ones, and that the greatest honor we can actually pay to those we love is to follow their example, when they're gone, rather than try to replace them. Embrace their absence, and their good qualities.
This is one of the most thoughtful UA-cam comments I've ever gotten. You should make a video!
Lupostehgreat surrogate is the word of the day thankyou stranger
Thanks Palpy
I agree completely
Best answer is seen.
I was 13 when I played this game, and as such, you missed something so very important. Jane, for most of the game, is your best chance of escape from Kenny; and yet even she is revealed to not truly care about us. She wants Clem around because she seems useful. Jane is manipulative, and Kenny is scary. They are different types of abusive, and that’s why pure self-reliance with the implied vow to never be like either of them. Sarah is another level of this. Carlos acts like Kenny used to, but more. Carlos is what Kenny would’ve been if Duck managed to live.
Jane is literally a lame writing device lazy writers use when they have made a terrible character and wrote that character into a hole. The lazy way to "fix" this is introduce and even less savory character with less or no ties to the main cast to make that character look "better" by default. That is all Jane is, a plot device to make Kenny look like less of a POS.
@@jackd6881 uhh, Jane is the one who points out how bad Kenny is so regularly you have to be blind and deaf not to see the signs getting posted. She’s got no ties to the main cast, which means she has no investment outside of the desire to protect us. And that’s exactly what she tries to do the whole time. Hell, she asks us to leave with her at one point, but we literally can’t. She isn’t actually shitty to us. She’s just shitty to everyone around us, in a less dangerous way. Up until the finale, I literally never worried about if she’d hurt someone in our group.
@@bookbook9495 But that's the problem with her character is she is written as plot device to try and redeem Kenny or to get us to shoot him. While also kind of being replacement Kenny who just won't hit clementine and isn't a coward. The kid endangerment segment was just bad telltale writing to make us like Kenny after almost 2 whole games of being the worst, its audience manipulation at its best. There where a million ways she could have pushed his buttons to get him to snap other then potentially killing a kid. But Telltale knew people despise Kenny so they had to basically force that choice in to make the decision to shoot him in any way difficult for some.
IMO Luke should have been the one to fight Kenny as that would have created a tougher choice as he was more likeable and actual cared about clementine. Both Jane and Kenny are drama creation plot devices designed by the writers to generate conflicts. This is proven when they kill her off later anyways if you choose to go with her because outside of creating this conflct with Kenny they had no ideas of how to write her into the story... Kenny is clearly more of a threat and way more awful to everyone but I wish the game gave me the option to shoot both of them.
@@bookbook9495 Sometimes I feel like people on UA-cam comments have never had a family before. Like, even a found family. Kenny is the sole remaining link Clem has to Lee who was the closest person she had to a parent since the apocalypse began. Kenny demonstrably cares for her and is willing to die for her. He definitely needs Clem more than she needs him but the two have a familial bond from all their shared hardships and experiences. Kenny loves Clementine unconditionally and is probably the last person in the world who she can trust absolutely even if he is a basket case. Realistically I don't think Clem wouldn't have such an easy time abandoning the only person who loves and trusts her unconditionally in a world that only offers violence, deception, and death.
@@heehokuzunoha7757 Just because someone cares for you does not justify the mistakes they made for you. For example children would be barely okay with their parent robbing someone just so they have money. I have met people who are similar to Kenny. They are not worth siding with even though they care for you. Sometimes the people you know less are kinder than the ones you don't. You also take in the considereation in the way they treat others besides yourself in order to know how terrible they are. There are people who act kind to you but treat others terribly.
Kenny might be good, Kenny might be bad, but regardless Jane put a helpless child alone in a car to frame someone so they would die. Kenny might not be the best, but he's not a liar. Kenny won't frame someone else to get them murdered, he wouldn't put a newborn at risk in a zombie apocalypse snowstorm. In a cutthroat world, having one terrible person you can trust to the end of the world is miles better than any saint that leaves children in the car.
Kenny would not "frame someone to get them murdered" (arguably, not what Jane wanted to do), but he will himself murder someone, then run around all happy the very next day with zero regrets about it. I'm not sure what the moral scales are in your head but damn
sigh let me copy and paste
kenny...
- physically threatens a man when he first meets him
- is implied to be verbally abusive to his girlfriend
- yells at a little girl no matter how she handles his GF getting bit
- piles all of his stress onto that same little girl after his GF dies, including his suicidal ideation, which definitely fucked her up mentally
- tries to alienate her from everyone else by bringing up her dead father figure and using him to manipulate her into doing what HE wants (lee would want you to go to wellington, etc...)
- threatens to kill a crippled teenager after he surrenders
- beats up said crippled teenager multiple times
- tries to send the group on a death march to a winter wonderland that nobody knows really exists
- attempts to murder a seemingly innocent woman because the baby "died"
Jane's biggest sin is pulling the stunt at the end which doesn't even touch some of the worst things kenny did
@@Auubreygraham your cherry picking and rewording things to sound a lot nicer or meaner than they actually were to fit your image. You say Jane pulled a "stunt" when in reality she literally threatened a crying babies safety by stuffing them in a car in the middle of walkersville and basically told everyone she got it killed. If you call her a monster for killing a child apparently you're the bad guy? And she's seemingly innocent when she admits she lost the child? She's literally admitting guilt!
@@Auubreygraham Quit the strawmanning to make Kenny look bad you bum.
@@harmandtoor5111 he makes himself look bad lmfao.
JUST GIVE HIM HIS BOAT GODDAMMIT
LILLY GIVE BACK KENNY'S BOAT!!
Thanks
this is why i hate kenny...he was more one track minded than a goldfish...he was racist and cruel to others in Season 2 and he never once stopped to ask "what do you guys want to do?"
#Givekennyhisboat
@@IDyce88 ight so i wanna know when was he racist? and yes he was cruel but you gotta remember hes been through some shit his mind was being held together by sarita and after she died clem was trying to basically super glue him back together (for the racist part use the exact words he used in dialogue)
The best ending imo is going to Wellington with Kenny but staying without him and watching him walk into the sunset.
It's the only ending in which he is theoretically still alive so I agree.
@@domossgameplays9730 Kenny is still alive, regardless of where he went. Season 3 was a fever dream!
Or killing Kenny, and leaving Jane
@@Rogue-qj5qi not exactly but pretty much: in season 3 either either he or Jane die, they did this on purpose to save time spent on making separate stories, in the actual game he dies from Walkers by breaking his legs which is pretty shitty but in an early promo image we see him kill himself by drowning which makes more sense to his character, at this point in the game time he has nothing to lose, he's empty and a shell of who he was and killing himself would probably happen ONLY in the ending where he left and clem went to wellington
@@kodekYT oh right I see now
Walking Dead S1: People can die, your choices have consequences, think about everything you have to lose.
Walking Dead S2: LMAOOOOOOOOOOOO WHO WE GONNA KILL THIS CUTSCENE?
This comment is gold 💀💀💀
It doesn't matter how good or bad your choices are, the entire cast gets clapped ☠
I mean, in S1 as well, the whole original gang gets clapped at the end. Larry ded. His daughter leaves the group because she kills the person you chose to save in episode 1. Kenny's wife and Duck ded. "Shaggy", he ded ded. Kenny M.I.A. and Lee ded
Telltale : Like Jane, okay let her die. YOU WANNA KILL KENNY NOW? 😀
@@floricel_112 just that season 1 actually does a better illusion at choice
"She left me...my son...people that cared about us... I forgive her, but it don't make it any less wrong. *You don't just end it cause it's hard. You stick it out, and you help the folks you care about.* So let's figure a way outta here and get that little girl." -Kenny
This is what separates Kenny from Jane after season 2.
Damn straight
Except Kenny only says this if you kiss his ass, lol.
@@willfanofmanyii3751 That doesn't make it untrue to his character though.
definitely, Kenny and Lee are the best characters
"This is what separates Kenny from Jane after season 2" .kenny simp are hardcore morons fr. "You don't just end it cause it's hard. You stick it out, and you help the folks you care about." this coming from the mouth of a abuser is somehow FaCts lol. " the abuser is right and jane is wrong" the mental gymnastic people play.......
Kenny was right in killing Jane. "I'm going to push this already unstable man off the edge by pretending I killed the baby that for the past week we've been trying to save." Terrible.
And if you do save her she just hangs herself. She's shit.
They’re both shit in their own ways. Alone is best ending imo. Too bad it literally doesn’t matter at all
killed kenny then left jane anyway after seeing the influence jane had on clem i dont regret it
That is completely false she states a walker grabbed the baby out of her hands and Kenny flips out and attempts to murder Jane as Jane had no intent of killing Kenny, but also both characters are completely in the wrong in the situation stop being bias for Kenny
Alone has and always will be the true way to go
@@andrewortiz6430 yes
If you chose to leave with Kenny, it’s later revealed he sacrifices himself to getting eaten by wakers to allow Clementine to escape with AJ
If you chose to leave with Jane, it’s later revealed she committed suicide because she was scared of taking care of her own child... leaving Clementine and AJ by themselves....
I chose to stick with Kenny because besides Luke, i KNEW he was the only one who would stick by Clementine’s side to ‘till end, just like Lee
Boba -O- Tea Oh boi Jane would've believe what she's going to see next (in heaven) with two angery men bout to beat the crap out of her
I really want to believe the narrative that this video proposes, because it would make this whole part of the game feel like it actually MEANS something, but... Jane is the big flaw in the analysis of Kenny Bad.
Taken on its own and without analyzing the eventual outcomes of the choices, Kenny As An Abusive Parent is a perfecty plausible reading that's supported by the text- but when you take into account Jane's entire existance in the final act as anything OTHER than "the last other adult in Clem's life", it starts to fall apart. Because the game deliberately juxtaposes these two, it creates a situation where the would-be abuser is OBJECTIVELY THE BEST OPTION in this binary choice.
ofc this leaves us with the conclusion that the best ending is the one where Clem braves the world on her own with AJ, but... I still would have liked the game to fully commit to creating a situation where either BOTH choices were glaringly bad, or in which Jane had more going for her. Maybe make it so that in the next game it's revealed Jane is the one who stuck around to take care of the kids as long as she could despite never growing close to Clementine as a friend or a mother, while Kenny was the one who caved under the pressure.
With the story as it currently exists, it affords Kenny too many Good Parent Points to really argue for an abuse narrative. Which sucks, because I think the reading of the game outlined in this video is fascinating and would have been a great direction to take the whole thing... if the writers had actually committed to Kenny being too dangerous and volatile to be a viable caretaker.
Like... They genuinely did write him as a pretty realistic abusive parent, all in all, but then they still made him the most viable option in the final visible binary choice, and reinforced that desite everything, he DID love Clem and was more wiling to protect her than anyone he opposed. that ain't a great look on a character who went through the characterization he did. I think this is why many people are so hesistant to buy into this reading of the text, despite how compelling it is and how much sense it makes when viewed in isolation.
I wish Luke had lived
Thx for the spoiler warning pos
I find it extremely unfair of him to give such a harsh treatment to a story that clearly still wasn't over and had to be continued, it's the same as chudging a movie before you've watched the ending
"...too busy pressing the hug Kenny button."
All of the yes
Kenny is my favorite and that'll never change, but this was a really good video.
I felt sick to my stomach whenever Kenny lashed out, but I never once didn't take Kenny's side, immediately in this game. It makes me wonder why I was loyal to this man, even when it meant putting my own character in danger. I cried every time they interacted sweetly with eachother, I was just so happy to have someone that I trusted in the game. Damn.
Makes you realize how messed up abusive relationships are
@@theunknownuser9609 Shit, you can't be giving me the feels like that man lmao
Kenny was always right though, wasn't he? Even if he was rude at times.
@@americancommunist6076 ...Uh, no.
@@americancommunist6076 He really was, Jane was a selfish idiot, Carver was a phyco, Lilly turned out to be a literal child enslaving monster who cuts out peoples tounges and Larry was definitely going to die in that meat locker. All his decisions are practical and are focused on protecting his family.
Well when he said “who’s gonna be Clem’s new lee” my mind immediately went to “SHE IS LEE NOW! And AJ is clem”
Makenna & Mallie The Twin Sisters well.... yea
Kennedy didn’t just keep Clementine around for himself, he wanted the best for her. This was clearly shown when he wants Clementine and AJ to stay in Wellington rather than with him. He wanted to make sure what happens to Clementine and AJ is not what happened to his family.
*Kenny
Kennedy is not his name, his name is Kenneth and his nickname is Kenny. Guess you tried to guess his full name or something.
@@cobalt615 or it's just an auto correction on their phone and y'all need to chill
I think the reason Kenny seems to keep Clem close a lot of the time is becuase he trusts and can rely on her, the other group members are pretty much strangers and with the exception of Mike Clem has a decent connection with the rest of her group members Post-"In Harm's Way" but Kenny doesn't, he isn't used to taking orders that much from strangers but that by no means meens that he's going to be a horrible person for some reason.
Well, to be fair, many abusive (step-)parents also truly wholeheartedly believe that what they do is the best for the abused person.
So I don't see Kenny wanting the best for Clementine in any way disproving what is said in the Video.
Going to Wellington with Kenny then staying there as he walks off is canon to me. Completes his arc, his redemption, and fits in tone with the game perfectly.
Either that or shooting him was good to me. Ending his suffering from all the loss he went through.. It indeed made him stronger but it also hurt him greatly and his anger turned into something that hurt him sometimes the others around him. Long Live Kenny.
@@foolcool2584 Nah
@@mrturtletail3945 I wasn't trying to like say that your way of seeing this was wrong or anything but just wanted to tell you what I'd do but leaving him at wellington is also my favorite ending and at least there's hope he's alive.
Redemption? Kenny created all of his own problems and realises at the end that HE is the reason Clem and AJ cannot be safe. He is finally able to see that the only way to keep Clem safe is to let her go. He has not redeemed himself for anything, he still threatens anyone who isn't Clem and pushes them to the point of violence, he repays kindness with anger and hate and justifies it with his own trauma, he STILL uses protecting Clem or those he considers family as excuse to do unnecessarily violent things... But of course Kenny fans do not remember any of this, all they know is "Kenny protected Clem, therefore he's a good guy and he's the goat :) "
@@cubbwatch Jane started the problem by hiding the baby in a car in the cold. That’s why Kenny got heated. Kenny got mad cuz Luke and jane was smashing, while Rebecca was having a baby and the herd was after them, another reason he got mad at nick for being a jackass, he got mad at Arvo cuz he almost had the whole squad killed in the cold, got mad at Larry cus he was asshole, he lost his son and wife. He had it the worst, those are all good reasons to get mad about
“Pass me that can duck”
Shows how broken Kenny is.
nah he was just going through it still, but he pulls through. Did you see him in season 3?
Kenny was the only one willing to let himself die for the sake of Aj and Clem.
That is why I disagree with everything in this video
@Deacon Kenny was WAY too much like Anakin Skywalker from Star Wars - Episode 3.
Kenny was WAY too much like Anakin Skywalker from Star Wars - Episode 3.
@WillFanofMany Kenny was WAY too much like Anakin Skywalker from Star Wars - Episode 3.
Lee was willing to die for Clem but never met aj
Still upset by the game's treatment of Sarah, it felt like the developers didn't even care about her.
+Daniel England iirc one of the devs said in an interview that it felt really good to kill her (or something similar to that), which i thought was pretty disconcerting. i can't find it though :-/
+Lilith I think it had something to do with there being different writers on each episode.
+entireties I think it's very telling when Greg says "Sarah was on my "Ben" list", because Ben was another character that was made incompetent and unadaptable to a truly unbelievable extent, something right out of a cartoon, only it's more like a sadistic Happy Tree Friends than Bugs Bunny.
There are better ways to pose a question of morality versus pragmatism without resorting to this. There are real reasons why people become a risk to themselves and a liability, without having the troperiffic Idiot Ball, insane bad luck and a complete lack of self-preservation instincts.
As someone who hasn't played Season 2, who is Sarah, what happened with her, and why were people upset?
lumpythebored Way to overgeneralize and demean criticism.
In my opinion, a character so incapable of even trying to show some minimal self-preservation capability is just poor writing. Even including disabilities.
I picked Kenny for two HUGE reasons
1. Jane was suicidal, and wasn't guaranteed to be for you there 100% of the time. And this point is even proven in season 3
2. As abusive as Kenny would get, he always prioritized Clementine over himself.
I hated how violent he could get, but he was always there for Clem, even if she wasn't always there for him. After all that, I wanted to be there for him because no matter what, I still trusted him
That Cynic ironic because Kenny is suicidal aswell the game literally throwing it at your face from s2 e3-5, regardless it's stupid to go with either Jane or Kenny
Andrew Ortiz That is true, but here's the difference. Jane actually follows through, and personally, I cared about Kenny and wanted to help him through his losing battle. I could give a fuck if Jane lived or died because she abandoned Clementine, TWICE. Proving that she put herself over Clem, for Kenny, Clem comes first no matter what. Jane may have came back the first time, but she killed herself the second time! That's why I wanted to help Kenny, therefore, I stayed with him
Andrew Ortiz Atleast he didn’t end his life, based on what you said, before ensuring clementine is left at a secure location with people to look out for her.
After being witness to the ending where he is willing to let Clem and AJ go into shelter instead of him and crying my eyes out, i'm glad i chose Kenny.
Same as Lee did, Lee was her's Third father, frist she had she's real father second Jesus Christ and Lee. So belive in Christian Orthodox and all of you gonna be saved I am just asking you to.
Bro Jane locked a literal newborn in a car in winter to get Kenny going and “show who he really is” but like… you just said “yeah baby gone y’know”. So you pushed a broken man to the limit, presumably got a baby killed he cared about, and is now trying to turn the only other person he cares about against him.
You are failing to understand the point if you think comparing the two makes either one more or less of a total monster.
@@UmbreonMessiah In fact, everything is nothing. Up is down. I am a god - the god. Etc.
this isn’t a “jane vs kenny” argument it is a “kenny is an abusive caretaker and a lot of people cannot or purposely will not recognize that due to bias” argument
@@UmbreonMessiah Kenny was entirely justified in trying to kill her lmfao what are you on about?
The video is about how both suck. Solo Clem is best.
Both Kenny and Jane are abusive. Hell, the first thing Jane says after Kenny is unwillingly killed by Clem is "I did it for you" and "Please, we can leave this all behind". Sounds familiar?
Alone ending is the way to go for sure.
you’re so right. and that’s the thing i’ve been thinking this whole time. jane says things that every abuser says to the person they’ve abused. she also acts like a typical abuser most times. but, kenny is also super abusive in his own way too, even if he wants to protect clem/it comes off that way to every player.
they are both bad, but if it came down to it kenny is way worse and jane is the safer option to raise clem
@@rubyyy325 I disagree. None of them are safer. Jane even less considering her suicide in ANF
@@theunknownuser9609 jane wasnt abusive at all though??? it was just her selfishness that was bad really. she did way more than kenny ever did and hes been in the game for 2 seasons
@@rubyyy325 kenny loves clem like a daughter, he was willing to be all alone and even die just for her and aj's sake, jane k*lls herself anyway because she got pregnant, so uhh idk, i think both of the kenny endings have their good and bad parts but they are better than jane's
I feel like the whole Kenny killing Jane problem was worded poorly. You left out the part of Jane abandoning AJ in the middle of a blizzard
Except she didn’t abandon him?
@@MsScarletwings Except, its a zombie apocalypse, a baby in a blizzard. Its practically abandoning him to leave him in that situation just to make a stupid antagonizing point against Kenny.
@@shadows_star "look at Kenny getting mad when I push his buttons and threaten the only things left in the world that he cares about lol, told you he was a bad guy"
Jane is such a bitch
in a blizzard that walker can eat AJ anytime, Jane just stupid
@@MsScarletwings Definitely did lmao
There is one thing you missed about Kenny in Season 1. He had the potential to be as volatile and angry as he is now. If you don't treat Kenny well, or don't help him with Larry, he becomes bitter, angry, and vengeful towards Lee--he lets him fall when you go to get Medicine, where if you're good to him he powers through his pain to save you. He can either fight and argue with you the whole way, or see things from your perspective and sympathize.
You say that Kenny, in Season 1, was a coward, but he fights with Lee almost every step if you make the wrong decisions, literally on the train, and when you're all stuck in the attic he's the one who brings up they might have to kill Lee, as well as actually moves to do it--regardless of how you treated him.
If you treated him well, he may be the only character in the game to follow you when you go to save Clem from Vernon, and if it's just you and him he will cut off your arm to save you.
In Season 2, everyone but Clem treats him like Lee did if you chose not to side with him; they all turn him away, shut him down, and he gets angrier and angrier, and if you said with him--even without taking into consideration Season 3's flashbacks--him and Clem are genuinely happy together, something that none of the other endings can manage. Kenny is a broken man, and the darkness he shows in Season 2 are shown, more subtly, in Season 1. Remember, that in the first game, they barely dealt with the seriousness of the end of the world--they spent just about all of it holed up safe in a motel.
Once you leave, and shit hits the fan, Kenny becomes far more violent and unreasonable than he was before.
This is something you learn by playing the game more than once, then you know Kenny will make it to the end and it's best to play to him than all the other characters who leave or die no matter what. The choices are a lot less branching than implied.
Except that Kenny wasn't evil. He was the only that was thinking about the food and situation of the baby.
@CallOfDrewthulhu
But with Kenny wasn't about power, even in chapter two, he was arguing with Lilly, he wanted to say that one person can't be in charge of everything and that they can make their decisions, if he wanted power, instead of saying that one person can't be in charge of everything, he would say "i should be the leader" or something like that. With Kenny was about understating or not his arguments.
You wanted to help Larry? From Kenny's perspective, you're putting the life of an asshole that tried to kill you above Clem, the chance of saving his family, Lily and him. Even in chapter 1 you saw how Larry needed pills to get recovered, and in the meat locker they didn't have medical supplies. So, there was like an 95% chance of Larry being dead.
You don't side with him in leaving the motel? That's a pretty stupid idea and again Kenny has very strong arguments. You saw how in chapter 2 there were bandits around there (even Kenny said that weeks ago the bandits were annoying them), so the safest thing was like Kenny said, leaving the motel.
You shot the screaming woman to put her out of her misery? Well, from Kenny's perspective, you're the asshole that is putting an already bitten woman that you don't know above taking supplies and food for Clem and the group.
It's not about Kenny wanting to be right and that's it, it's like he always has strong arguments and when you disagree, from his perspective you're the bad guy that it not thinking what's best for the kids and the group. Kenny almost has arguments behind every situation and when Lee disagree with him he truly shows that he is mad, but not for wanting to be right, it's for feeling that you're the decisions put the group in risk.
Why do people like you comment on videos like this 3 years later?
@Alexander Metzler if you don't count that she killed herself at the first sign of problems she wasn't ready to deal with. I'd call that weak.
Imo the authour of this video is right - the only real choice was to leave them both behind. I personally prefer the ending where Clem watches Kenny kill Jane (she does if you don't choose to shoot or tunr away) - because untill that moment she can't really believe that he will - and then shoots him like the mad dog he had become.
He's not a monster for brutalizing Carver, Carver deserved it
Dude lets be real yes carver was a monster..but doing that is mental
be real, what he did was absolute insanity. it's one thing to just shoot him in the face and be done with it. it's a whole other thing to shoot off his knee caps and then beat in his face with a crowbar. yes, Carver is an asshole, but that doesn't mean what Kenny did wasn't barbaric
the entire point of what kenny did is that it was barbaric.. kenny was an extremely abusive person throughout the game. his own GIRLFRIEND said he was scared of him. and all the adults in his life were scared of him… alvin, luke.. and jane, bonnie, & mike all left the group in the middle of the night bc they were sick of kenny’s abusive behavior. yes, kenny lost everything. yes, kenny was a broken man and that’s why he became a monster
@@kai1ey The reason people were scared of Kenny is because he was the only one strong enough to protect them.
People were scared of Carver because he would hurt them.
@@crumblyairshipbeing real, that bastard deserved it. Serves him well.
Top 3 Male characters in the Walking Dead Games :
1. Lee (easily)
2. Kenny
3. Luke
(And OF COURSE) AJ
Mine:
1. Kenny
2. Lee
3. Ben (Yes, Ben.)
I love and hate AJ at the same time, he's really likeable and just a kid but he's also a little shit in a creepy way but Lee is best guy anyway
Clem is the best character overall by far tho
@Alexander Metzler To be fair you can't completely change Lee his mindset can be different depending on your choices but he's still going to be similar in many ways, this isn't like a rpg, Lee isn't 100% the player and I mean it would be understandable to find Kenny more interesting than Lee even if I personally don't
Alexander Metzler where tf did anyone mention race? 😂 that escalated quick
@Alexander Metzler I don't really get how it's stupid or missing the point, he never said he hated Lee just that he preferred Kenny and they both are really different characters and they go through very different character arcs, a lot of people like Kenny it's probably not their #1 character but that doesn't mean it's stupid if he is
And yeah sorry I didn't get the joke but on the internet you just never know sometimes
Beautiful work on this one. And I must say, the inclusion of text on screen for your key points was much appreciated. Made it far easier to parse the more complex ideas which can become mush in my brain when I'm 15 minutes into a video essay.
At least Kenny didn’t kill himself and abandon a kid and a baby
Hello It is me ikr
That’s what Jane did
She was pregnant, if she didn't kill herself they would have had 2 babies, and there's a high chance that Jane would have died during childbirth, leaving Clem alone with not just 1 baby, but 2.
@@brandonj7586 Should have thought about that before fucking with Luke.
@@brandonj7586 so the alternative is to kill herself and the baby without even telling clem? Doesn't sound like a good alternative but a easy get out of jail free card
Janes death in S3 where she just nopes out and leaves Clem with a baby sealed the choice of Kenny. He did great with Clem and it only goes bad because of an accident.
That's one of the things that makes me mad abou S3. This guy survived jumping in a hole full of zombies (at least mine did), got beaten to death, lost an eye and still survived. THIS guy is gonna die because he forgot to put on his goddann seatbelt?
“She just nopes out” is a disgustingly flippant way to say dies by suicide because she was pregnant.
@Onyxiate She did noped out. She killed her own child and abandoned another kid and a baby right after she literally got the other adult who would've been capable of taking care of Clem and AJ killed out of pure manipulative malice. Fuck Jane
Irrelevant because you wouldn't know that when playing season 2.
I watched this video years ago, and again today. The problem with this season was, as bad as Kenny might have been, Jane's problems were much more obvious. She lied about so many important things. The key reason for me not trusting her was when she described her sister's death, then she tried to make me abandon Sarah. Here's the problem: if you stick with Sarah, she will fight for her life until the bitter end. You know who abandons her? Jane. And then she picks fights with Kenny, purposely antagonizing him to make him look bad, but that really means she's a bully. She ultimately lies and pushes him too far over the edge. This story that Kenny is abusive might work if we didn't have manipulative Jane.
I mean, what was Jane expecting when there is this guy on the edge and she decides to put the life of an INFANT in peril to try to prove a point to an 11 year old girl who to pick as her new parent? Like, what kind of backwards logic is that?
If Kenny just snapped because she kept bullying him about his past and wanted to kill her, that is one thing. But what she did with AJ was kind of really really fucked up? Plus how much stress that'd put on Clementine? It was entirely unnecessary drama so she could say she was right?
Jane’s issues weren’t more obvious though (at least not to me when I first played it). And that’s where the whole choosing the lesser of two evils comes in.
Kenny is much more blatant about having issues. He acts out, attacks, yells, etc. But Jane is much more subtle, it’s because of her calm demeanor that made her so easy to trust.
When I was a twelve year old playing through this episode for the first time, I shot Kenny because of this. I was successfully manipulated by Jane into believing that she wouldn’t abandon me or act out against me.
I’d like to think that because I was just a little under two years older than Clementine, the decisions I made were pretty close to the ones she would have made.
And in the end, for me at least, it was a lot more realistic for Clementine to shoot Kenny and then go with Jane, having been successfully manipulated. And then having to learn that she’s a dick.
blacksesamecandies not to get murdered for it. She says so in the ending. If Aj died in a walker encounter, if kennys response was to murder whoever he likes with his grief, he would very quickly become the most hated character in the series.
Porfirio Rubirosa you love Kenny so much you think the GAME was wrong?
Kenny had been unstable since episode 2. Kenny had been endangering lives.
Kenny at that point had abused clementine and anyone else who got in his way.
And Jane is the bad one for trying to prove it to clem, who he had been gaslighting and using ever abuser trick in the book...
Kenny turned bad.
Even he knew it in the end. That was the whole point of the game.
You realize the game makes both characters completely wrong in the situation? Jane never intended to kill Kenny the one who attempted murder was Kenny proving Jane's point
Alone is the true way to go
17:02
Okay, but was Jane REALLY looking out for her? The impression I got was that Clem to her was just a substitute for Jaime (the same way she's a substitute for Duck with Kenny). The difference is, Jane doesn't care about Clem the way Kenny does and she's willing to manipulate her into killing the closest thing to a father figure she has left just to get Clem on her side. Say what you will about Kenny, but I just don't think Jane actually cared for Clem the way Kenny did. If it came to it, no one can deny that Kenny would sacrifice himself for Clem (He tried to sacrifice himself for the kid who killed his son) where as Jane has already made it clear that even if she does care for her, Jane would put her own survival before Clementine. Still though Kenny definitely was abusive and she's probably better off without either of them.
He actually did sacrifice himself for Clem & AJ in the next season while Jane selfishly commits suicide without any hints of planning to do so earlier and on top of that she leaves two children out by themselves in the dangerous apocalyptic world
Ronald7984 Totally agree. Fuck Jane. I liked her up till the last episode of Season 2 tho
" If it came to it, no one can deny that Kenny would sacrifice himself for Clem"
That's true, however, I'm sure that the chances are much higher that Kenny would devolve into one of his many rage-filled episodes and take it out on Clementine (accidental or not) than Jane actually leaving Clementine to die. Kenny had become FAR more unstable than he was in Season 1, and Clementine became Jane's morality pet, the little sister that she always wanted.
I'd say that Jane and Kenny are both equally manipulative/needy. They both wanted to use Clementine as a replacement goldfish for dead family members, and Clementine is probably better off without both of them. The thing that makes me dislike Kenny more is that we already saw plenty of his bullshit in Season 1, and that turned me off to him before his reappearance.
Didn’t Jane also trigger Kenny to attack her by saying the baby went missing on her watch? She even admits that if you save her from Kenny when she shows that AJ was in a car nearby. I think that’s a very important thing to note. The whole time when it was Jane, Kenny and Clem, Jane repeatedly tried to make Kenny cave to prove something to Clementine. And all it really showed me is that if someone is already pushing themselves down the road to danger then a person (i.e. Jane) could easily torment them into being a monster.
I think Kenny being an abuser is also the wrong term for him. Suffering from PTSD would probably be better.
I agree, but I chose Jane because she wasn't losing her shit. I REALLY wanted to save Kenny, but he just kept fucking things up. So me and Jane went off on an adventure. I have yet to play season 3 though, cause season 2 was just so god damn taxxing on me.
Season 1 : Clementine's Lee is Lee.
Season 2 : Clementine's Lee is Kenny.
Season 3 : -Clementine's Lee is Javi- Javi's Lee is Clementine.(lil mistake there)
Season 4 : -Clementine is the new lee- Telltale gets this m.ua-cam.com/video/zHC3uvzcfV0/v-deo.html.
Edit: Also holeh crap thx for 1k laiks guys 😁
Season 1 : Clementine's Lee is Lee
Season 2 : Clementine's new Lee is Clementine
Season 3 : Clementine's Lee is Javier
Season 4 : A.J.'s Lee is Clementine
What's wrong with Javi? lol, dude seemed like a good guy.
To be fair it's not like she was related by blood and that relationship was way toxic, not helped by his brother being a moron. That said, I feel like Kate seriously should have taken a stand instead of expecting Javi to just solve all of her problems. Not once did she actually try to talk to David about things. To be honest I actually couldn't stand her, David, or Gabe, I think Javi as a character suffers because everyone around him is either a jackass or a weak character.
Except Jesus, of course.
Hopefully they don't kill off clem like they did with lee
It's the final season, it's very likely, I don't want it to happen either but it's gotta happen.unless they find a damn cure or something (imo that is very very unlikely.)
I don’t know about anyone else but in season 2 you have to choose who you want to sit with Luke or Kenny and for me that was hard decision just for that so imagine if you had to kill Kenny or Luke that would have been a much harder decision than Jane or Kenny it felt like they were building tension between kenny and luke throughout episodes 2-5 but then just kill him off and it switches to jane instead
Exactly my thought. They built up luke and kenny ending in a fight but that for some reason switched to jane and that decision wasnt hard at all
Honestly at first I didn't understand, but now I do.
Luke is nice, always had ur back (besides when he thought u were bitten at first), acts like an uncle or older brother, and had a plan to help u guys out.
If anything, Jane should either dies from the lake or never came back to save the group.
If never coming back, Luke maybe injured, but as the Russian was about to shoot Kenny, Luke saved him from shooting the Russian in the head. Or you get a choice to shoot the Russian. Then as Kenny get all pissed at Arvo for attacking them, Luke defends Arvo saying his armed and harmless now, making them argued until the team convinced Kenny to go to the house with the group and Arvo. Luke and Clem talks about Kenny, with Luke saying, he seen Carver being crazy, but he's scared that Kenny will become crazy like him. And Clem tell him that he's still there and to not be against him, to which Luke said he'll trust her, even though he was still worried about Clem and Kenny.
At the lake, Luke doesn't fall in, instead made it across to stop Kenny from hurting Arvo, then the 2 ran back to save Clem who fell in and ran back in. Then inside, Kenny yells at Arvo, which Arvo pissed off Kenny, making him attack Arvo with the team wanting Kenny to stop, until Clem succeed to stopping Kenny.
After she warmed up, Kenny and Clem chatted then Luke and Clem did, at first its about AJ being adorable and he tells Clem he did a good job saving AJ when he didnt see him. Then he talked about Kenny, this time asking "Do you think that Kenny will actually be ok?" Or something.
Then once the truck is fixed, Luke and Kenny argued about where they need to go. Kenny said Wellington while Luke said Howes, even though he despised going back there, he thinks there's not much people or walkers or lurkers, plus there's enough food and baby food for the group. But then Arvo shot Clem, making the 2 drive off fast.
Luke and Kenny are relieved that she's ok, but Kenny and Luke argued more. Kenny insults Luke's group, calling them cowards, besides some he respects, and calls Luke a pathetic nobody, Luke insults Kenny saying he's a rude crazy asshole and that he's not safe for Clem or AJ, and the 2 begins to argued until they got separated.
Now how they fight is that AJ doesn't not get in danger, but with them arguing until Luke said "IM GLAD HIS FAMILY IS DEAD SO THEY WONT BE AFRAID OF A PSYCHOPATH!" To which he regretted, not meaning to say that. Kenny, however, had enough and attacks Luke, making the 2 fight.
Clems choice will be to Shoot Kenny or Let Luke Die.
If you choose Kenny lives, it'll stay the same.
If you choose Luke to live, Clem cries as Luke comforts her, apolozing and not meaning to say that, he didn't want this all to happened. To which it sounds genuine, unlike Jane, and u 2 go back to Howes or you can leave him, to which he's worried, but understands as it's her choice.
Lukes death in Season 3: Clem, Luke, and AJ as a toddler, goes out to hunt, until raiders came up to attack, until Luke sacrifice himself to save Clem and AJ. Clem shot down the rest of the raiders, after Luke shot some, and he tells Clem to protect aJ no matter what before slowly dying.
If Jane drowns, Luke was sad about her leaving, but understands that he needs to suck it up and move on
@@iconic3606 Luke wasn’t a saint at all. But to pull off such a stupid plan to prove your “point” is something only a madman would do and Luke was not, simple. He needed to die because he would’ve kept the group more united and would’ve never want to kill Kenny just because he got unreasonable a couple of times.
@@edwardsuou so what your saying is we got a bad ending because they felt like giving us a bad ending
AAAAND then the 3rd season threw all of this out of the window
yes. it sure did. so many people on the wrong side of the argument and I'm just over here in kenny's corner watching all the backtrackers
Season 3 was a mistake.
Eh season 3 was ok. Clem’s story felt rushed. That’s probably my biggest issue.
Michael Grant
Wrong
RJ Goombes If you want to like A New Frontier, then more power to you, but I'm not going to praise garbage.
the ending of this video is the best “who will become Clementine’s new Lee? Clementine.” and after playing season 4 that is the truest statement ever
Wow. The didn’t realize that I WAS asking myself “what will this do to Kenny” the entire time. This video really hit me especially since I grew up too fast. I was crying during parts of this
yea! i think that part was the strongest thing about the video because i never noticed that as well.
This!!
I like how the choices you make in Season 2 are sometimes undercut because, well, you're a child. It plays into the helplessness you feel as a child, and how people seem to not allow you to make decisions. Clem at the end of the game finally gets a choice that matters and is only up to her, symbolizing her transformation into adulthood.
EDIT: Nevermind you definitely covered what I was trying to
that explains why in season 1 your choices had more impact than they did in season 2. This is why I believe that in season 2 we should of played as Kenny as it would of made more sense.
@@Kenny-ep2nfON GOOOOOD. And then you play as Clem in Season 3 maybe? And have Clem at least try to go back to Richmond in season 4
@@Glenn_Quagmire nah season 3 you play as Kenny and then season 4 as Clem under Kenny’s guidance
Um excuse me but everyone's favorite character from season one was Lee
Just saying
Uh... I think you mean Doug!
Adam Penrod
Nah I'm pretty sure I mean Lee Everett
Doug sucked and was a weak weirdo. "I don't like guns". What the fuck man, do you realize its the apocalypse right now?
Carly was ride or die chick who knew about my sordid criminal conviction and is someone I could count on to help in protecting the kids, like she did first time we even met her, which is largely why I saved her. Also, didn't hurt that she would be good for future family rebuilding with Lee.
It's cool if you want to gush about your crush on Carly, but you don't gotta dunk on my boy Doug like that.
Hey man. It's fine to have a crush on a fictional character. Good. Great even. I myself have about a dozen crushes going on at all times. But you don't have to justify you liking something by hating on something else. Just like the thing.
Carly is awesome. She's great with guns, she forgives Lee, she saves Clem. She's awesome.
Doug is awesome. He doesn't like guns, but he's a loyal doughboy who misses his robots. Doug is awesome.
Look at that, we have two awesome things. Isn't life grand?
I like how you ignore Jane risking AJ’s life to prove a point about Kenny that he desperately wants to hide
@@KumiesCummies simps, huh? Lmfao
Kumie this guy is arguing against Jane because she could’ve gotten the baby killed since she’s the only one who knew where it was and they only found it because it cried and she knew she might die which is why she antagonized Kenny it was just really stupid in her part and the reason everyone should chose Kenny
“Simp: a silly or foolish person.”
Typical narcissistic sociopath behavior. (Referring to Jane).
The point of the video wasn't about Jane, he never once defends her actions or her as a whole. She's mentioned only In relation to Kenny and her ending isnt even brought up
Now onto season 4. I miss Kenny so much. He was fucking awesome. Jane killed herself whilst Kenny sacrificed himself for Clem and AJ
So true 😔
Fu*k jane
She didn’t want a baby and Kenny wanted AJ A BABY to live wow opposites DX
I saw you on 8-bitryans video
Yeah I'm a fan of 8bitryan lol, but jane was just overall a bitch, Kenny always put you first even when he was about to die, whilst jane left you all alone
Kenny became the embodiment of the point that Clem no longer needed a Lee
Exactly. It was meant to symbolize that Kenny went full circle. He returned to where Lee started morally. He even used the same excuses Lee did when questioned about the murder. And 75% of people still think Kenny is in the right while also praising Lee. Foolish and hypocritical.
@@BoolyK what do you mean?
@@Kenny-ep2nf this was like a year ago lol but I think the point is Kenny moved in the opposite direction as Lee
@@BoolyK yeah more or less
Jane left a baby in a blizzard and told everyone she killed a baby just to "prove a point"....she brought it on herself. Then she goes on to commit suicide and leave clem alone.
Literally people too stupid to figure this out, as soon as I heard that she killed/dropped the baby I was thinking about how I will kill her, thank god I got the option.
I totally agree, atleast Kenny would die to save AJ and Clementine, or he would let you go to Wellington without him.
She literally baited them, she came back from a cold fucking blizzard and said "it was an accident", if she really wanted to live she would have said, "he is still alive and in a car, lets go get him before something happens to him", but nope, she wanted the fucking fight, she wanted Kenny gone because she is a fucking selfish bitch.
Also it makes sense for a player (and Clementine too) to trust Kenny over Jane, you as a player know Kenny from season 1 as a man who cares about family the most, but Jane on the other hand, is someone that happened to be in the prison with you that left her sister to die, and even if that is what her sister wanted it doesn't get your hopes up when you think of the fact that she asked Rebecca "what are you going to do with it (child)".
Kenny comes off as mentally unstable if his trust is just a little bit tested but still caring about a family, even if its not really his blood, meanwhile, Jane comes off as an asshole that cares for herself, that only helped you once without expecting nothing in return and that might be dangerous for the group by possibly risking ones life to "prove a point" like with AJ or just ditch the whole group and make them hope that she will come back one day.
And lets not even talk about what she did after you decided to go for an ending with her.
WillFanofMany oh jane wanted to die anyway
General towneswhat did she do after.
Kenny was too far gone so I had to shoot him, but when Jane revealed the baby wasn't actually dead and she put herself and Clem in danger just to prove a point. It made me realize how many levels of manipulative she could be so I ditched her with AJ.
If I had been able to, I would have shot Jane in the head before Kenny and her fought because Clem genuinely thought that Jane had let AJ die as well when she was saying "Not again!..."
This was the best choice
this is exactly what i did, i think they both went way too far, but kenny wouldn’t stop trying to kill people who didn’t really deserve it, so i shot him. jane was abusive, too, so i didn’t feel comfortable staying with her.
@@lucybiermann8750 Who did Kenny try to kill who did not deserve it?
Jane? Far as anyone knew, she had abandonned AJ, an infant, to die either in the freezing cold or to walkers, which even Clem thought she did ("No... not again!")
Carver? If there is anyone who ever deserved to die, it was Carver.
Arvo? Arvo most definitely deserved to die. No matter WHAT you do - if you give him the drugs that he's hoarding (and not for his sister who was NOT SICK), Arvo ambushes you with his buddies and would take EVERYTHING you own - and LIES about you no matter what. It's Arvo's fault that a lot of people die, including Luke. He should have been shot right away. Oh and btw, no matter how nice you are, even if you put down your gun and ask to go with them... ARVO SHOOTS CLEM. No. Arvo definitely deserves death. My biggest regret in the game series is that neither the 3rd or final season let me find Arvo so I could kill him in the most excruciating way possible. Bonnie can just screw off too, since people die because of her evil actions as well, but especially Arvo.
Who else did Kenny try to kill? The people who were holding others in the ski lodge hostage? He was trying to save them. After Carver's group (thanks Bonnie) killed Walter. btw, ENTIRELY Bonnie's fault.
Kenny's the best person you can have in the zombie apocalypse next to Pete, who is basically Kenny but more emotionally stable.
@@lucybiermann8750 And in case anyone forgets... Kenny was right about almost EVERYTHING. He was right about not trusting Arvo. He was right about being cautious about Bonnie. He was right about them needing to escape from Carver. He was right about Wellington existing. Kenny's the one who kept fixing up every vehicle. He fixed the RV in the first game. He also was able to fix the boat in the first game - and did not trust Vernon. And considering Vernon steals the boat he wa right there as well. He fixed the truck in the second game. He saves Clem MULTIPLE times. But oh, he's unstable because he's seen his son die and his wife kill himself and every single person he loves dies except for Clem. He even tries to save that Ben, who is directly tied to how his son gets bitten, which is why his wife kills herself.
Also he was right about Larry. Larry was going to turn and they would have ALL died in that meat locker. Larry, the piece of garbage racist who tried to get Lee killed in the drug store, if not for KENNY SAVING LEE. Kenny continually thinks of the survival of children - whether Duck or AJ or Clem, before that of adults, including of himself. He's willing to sacrifice himself every time if it means the children that he tasks himself to protect will survive. That's nobility right there.
"Who will be clementines new lee? Clementine." Gave me chills man, almost cried just from those words.
@Robd1 replies I don't know man, i think that killing Kenny and then taking off alone with AJ is the best ending. I think that if you let Kenny kill Jane it kinda messes up the character. If you shoot him, you prevent him of doing some irrational shit, he forgives you and truly dies as good man. And Jane putting AJ's life at risk just to prove a point? She's not worth being a partner. That's my favorite ending, Clem being her own Lee (:
@Robd1 replies I agree with you, more scenarios would be very interesting. But I also think that Kenny needed that moment of redemption, he deserved to rest
At least Kenny didn’t pretend to kill a kid to prove a point that a man that lost two of his family’s and then his last hope in AJ dying would maybe react violently
Well he did quite a lot of horrible things throughout both seasons he was in. I'd argue he indirectly got a lot of people killed. The Boat as a Holy Grail used to be a S1 meme joke back in the day as during the final half of S1 Kenny's mission to find the Boat got most of the remaining cast killed.
What bugs me the most is Season 1 Kenny doesn't care about Clem but Season 2 Kenny does. If you didn't side with him 99% of the time he would refuse to help find Clem in S1. Even though Clem did nothing wrong. He even goes full Jane and abandons everyone. The whole righteous side of Kenny fans proclaim did not exist. I'd even argue saving Ben during the most positive S1 ending was self serving not being righteous. Because he was proving to himself he wasn't a coward. He may have still been, and was doing a self deletion by zombie that got retconned in S2. Either way selfish.
Clem acting as an adopted surrogate family in S2 makes a lot of sense. As Kenny needs it, not because he cares about Clem. Explaining the 180 toward Clem. You see it throughout S2 as well, Wellington becomes the new boat and like before the Journey ends much of the cast.
I disagree with the author on that Kenny had a big personality switch between the seasons. I always had a negative opinion of him, and do not get fooled so easily by cheap emotional banter.
I do agree with the ending though. That shooting Kenny and leaving Jane is the true canon ending of S2. Makes the most sense to me. They both wanted Clem, needed Clem, but didn't tolerate eachother. Neither deserved Clem.
fun fact, when kenny says "listen vanilla ice", its another shot back to his florida roots, as vanilla ice lives in florida and makes houses lmfao, lives one acreage down from me :D
Kenny's no angel, but can we say Kenny is the sole, abusive monster to be overcome when Jane went out of her way to manipulate a tortured, lonely man in the hopes it would force a fatal confrontation, using a newborn child as a tool in her game?
Patrick Hooper The video never said Jane isn't bad. To the contrary, it clearly endorses the view that both Kenny AND Jane ought to be left behind.
The video is specifically about Kenny and what makes HIM abusive.
It's not about Jane and what makes her manipulative. It's not about Lee and what makes him fatherly. It's not about Carver and what makes him a communist-like dictator.
It's about Kenny and what makes him abusive.
Blue Bird "kill" any baby and find out how abusive literally every parent would be
Patrick Hooper amen
In the end I shot kenny to save jane, because I thought it was an accident, then it turns out she lied... I would have left her, but I also thought she might be able to teach Clem some more skills to help survive since she was clearly very resourceful. I was also thinking about AJ in that if clem went off alone with AJ that would only put them both in even more danger
regarding wild animal with Kenny being unstable over a baby that isnt his
simple reply
Any Peron who lost a husband or wife with a child lost them both would be traumatized and would be easily prone to considering those who are close to him depends on which affliction hits them either abusive or selfish etc.
Long story short not everyone has an iron will of a mind
I have seen alot of cases where something simple as jealousy and envy took over someone and kill them and their CHILD
the mind has its own ways to grasp over the body and decision making processes
Kenny's actions is indeed hot headed and emotional which is simply possible given enough trauma
but not idiotic just reckless
so yeah my decision is to let Kenny kill Jane due to her manipulating a traumatized and over emotional unstable man and let Clem and AJ stay on wellington so we wouldn't get to see how his life ends part ways in a mystery
Jane was much worse. She tried manipulating Clementine into killing Kenny just so she'll see 'what he really is" but that's so stupid. Of course he was gonna go off the tracks. She put the baby's life at risk first of all by putting it in a unlocked window filled car by itself well she go tells Kenny that the baby is dead. The only thing, other than Clementine that matters to him. Jane could of stopped the fight by saying the baby was alright. She wanted to fight and kill Kenny. Plus, Jane doesn't even love Clementine. Is season 3, Jane kills herself when she finds out she's pregnant and leaves Clementine with a baby to defend by herself. Kenny was already not stable, and Jane pushed it. If u go with Kenny he tries so hard to get u to stay with Wellington because he wants Clem save. Jane wouldn't of done that. Kenny sacifrices the bag if supplies that Wellington gives him just to save AJ and Clem
Cadence Western wrong Jane's intent was never to kill Kenny her intent was to show Clem what Kenny is really like so Jane and Clem can leave him she explains this when you shoot Kenny she also says she didn't know Kenny would go that far also Jane did care for Clem it's the reason she came back to group and saved them, literally its stupid to go with either Kenny or Jane there both completely in the wrong in this situation you can write a essay worth of facts with in game dialog explaining how the alone ending is the right choice
Andrew Ortiz Jane didn't care about clem like Kenny did. If she cared, why'd she kill herself knowing darn well that Clem and the baby would be on their own. Jane was selfish. And even if she wasn't, she stabbed Kenny just as much as Kenny stabbed her. If she didn't want to kill him and realized that it would go down like that, she should of said the baby was okay and Kenny would of stopped. Even before Kenny got on top of her, she didn't run away, had a knife in hand ready to fight. Kenny cared about AJ and Clem more than anyone. He sacifriced so much for them. Now I'm not saying leaving with Kenny or even not killing him is the best choice, but in my opinion leaving with Jane was definitely the worse. Leaving alone is one of the better choices, but I'm still sticking with Kenny
Cadence Western Jane killed herself realizing they couldn't care for 2 babies in a zombie apocalypse and realizing if something happen to her or Clem that 1 person would be raising 2 babies in a zombie apocalypse even in her death she's looking out for clem, also s2 and s3 pretty much show Clem doing fine by herself, again Jane's intent was never to kill Kenny it was to show what he really is to Clem so they can leave him and Jane is purely acting on self defense as she has man attacking her and doesn't realize he's trying to kill her until he tries to stab her in the chest, I find go with either Jane or Kenny to be quite stupid but most of time you have Kenny fanboys who try twist the narrative of Jane to make Kenny look better telltale purposely made Kenny and Jane have a point to there situation and reason also both characters are flawed especially Kenny dating back to s1, Kenny is one of my favorite characters but and I still shoot him everytime and leave Jane and go alone for an essay worth of reasons
Andrew Ortiz I know this sounds pretty dark and morbid but she coulda of just killed the baby. I know what ur probably thinking "this girl is psychotic" but u gonna realise. Jane hanging herself killed both her and the baby and she had no problem with that. So what's the difference keeping herself alive and killing the baby before it's too grown to do it. And also, it's really hard to believe that she didn't try to kill Kenny. Like even when Clem was pulling him away, that's how she stabbed him. She could of ran. But most importantly she coulda told Kenny the truth and stopped him. And Kenny isn't perfect don't get me wrong. And also don't get me wrong about how I feel about Jane. For some stupid reason I decided to watch Jacksepticeye play the second season before I even watched season 1. And in my first time watching I loved Jane. I love those characters in shows that are badass. But even though I loved her, I still felt as she was in the wrong. Instead of looking at Kenny as Kenny, not knowing him from season 1 just made me think of a sad unstable old guy. And doing that to him was terrible. But anyway, going alone isn't a bad choice, like I said. But I just prefer Kenny ending over it. Not saying Kenny's ending is the best. But it's the one I like the most for my Clem. Simple as that
Cadence Western
I don't care much for her killing herself, the problem is that she didn't tell anything to Clementine. She (and the player) will never know why exactly she hanged herself and Clementine can easily end up thinking that she did something wrong and it's her fault, especially after Lee dies on her and she had to shoot Kenny because of Jane's manipulative ass.
But yes, I think that she could have just killed her kid if keeping Clementine and AJ safe (which includes both being there to physically protect them and not wasting resources) was really her ultimate goal.
Kenny has good intentions. He sometimes is a bit aggressive and handles stuff the wrong way. But he shown time and time again he’s selfless and cares a lot for Clem.
You mean like when he crushed a mans head because he argued with him before having a heart attack? those kind of good intentions.
Or when he leave Hershell's son to get eaten by walkers, Or the multiple times he refuses to back up Lee at all if you dont kiss his ass.
@@jackd6881 if you play Season 2 you can see what I’m talking about. He protects Clem and AJ with his life. He even sacrifices himself and takes blame for Clem stealing the Walkie. Also he is willing to give up clem and aj to Wellington when it meant he wasn’t allowed to go in.
@@Ant_Mann yah that shutem up
@@jackd6881 Nope he dealt the right way with Larry. THIS guy actually had some brain and knew that CPR won't save Larry who needed medical help in order to survive which the group didn't have. His wife could have explained to him.
@@GamingLife-ce5du Good I handled his son the right way when he turned and had him shoot his son in the face. Also, unsurprisingly when the tables are turned and you have to confront him right before that about dealing with his own son turning he fights you and if you lose that fight duck ends up turning and killing everybody.
Kenny's only interested in making decision for the group when no-one he cares about is involved, he's a selfish hypocrite and yet the game FORCES you to coddle him and take his side instead of what I really would do in a situation like that. Hell after he bailed on and left Hershel son to die I would have cut all ties with him and his shitty family. Worst part about the Salt lick murder is he literally threatens to abandon you and clementine if you didn't take his side in brutally murdering the guy in front of his daughter. Fuck Kenny.
In fact you could easily argue most of the deaths in the first season of series are caused by his stupid boat idea. More then half of the deaths in the first game could have been prevented if you had the option, to tell him and his boat bullshit to go to hell, but these games do not give you real choices.
I want to know how many foreign women Kenny got together with and lost tragically between seasons 1 and 2.
DiamandaHagan I
DiamandaHagan 👌
best comment 2017
#DEEP
DiamandaHagan I shouldn’t laugh at this
Essay time:
Kenny was far from perfect, he’s a flawed and realistic depiction of what the apocalypse could do to a good person, which is why lots of us love him so much. Unlike many of the other people in the game he lost all the people he cared about (Duck, Katjaa, Sarita) in front of his own eyes. He watched his wife shoot herself/sees her body in the woods, sees Duck get shot or shoots him himself, and watches his new girl get eaten by walkers/sliced in the face by Clem/slowly die of the infection. He becomes somewhat emotionally unstable from all this, having moments where he has outbursts of depression or anger, but also has the desire to protect and was loyal to the people he cared about to the bitter end.
Of course you have the right to not like him, as there’s a decent number of people who don’t, but the statement that he becomes abusive is one that is definitely one I don’t believe is true.
One of the major things that Kenny did for Clementine in s2 was taking blame for the walkie talkie at Carver’s compound in ep3. Mike wasn’t going to speak up despite KNOWING that Clementine (one of the little girls) was going to get into serious trouble if she was exposed (we already see Carver determinantly hit/smack her, and threaten her with a knife and gun in episodes 2 and 3, fuck knows what he would’ve done). He then gets his eye destroyed, which arguably is the moment that changed him (Carlos did mention potential head trauma). After this, he had more anger, and more vengeance inside of him, feeling more angry when the bad things happened, especially Sarita’s death later on.
Now I’ll talk about the things that people bring up the most to say that Kenny is a bad guy.
Larry. Larry has a heart attack in the meat locker after raging out. He stops breathing and his heart stops. This occurs earlier in the day, after everybody at the Motel saw Ben’s friend or teacher turn into a walker despite not being bitten, and where Ben reveals that no matter how you die, you turn, the time it takes to do so varying among people. Now Larry treats Lee like shit throughout all of episodes 1 and 2, no matter how kind you are to him. Kenny witnesses this first hand at the end of the first episode of season 1, where after getting Larry his medicine, he knocks Lee out and leaves him to die, to which Kenny comes back for him and saves his life from a walker that was right next to him. Also in the first episode, Larry has a smaller heart attack and is down for the count until they get his “nitroglycerin pills.” With the meat locker scenario, they were trapped in there with a potentially dead man, one of whom even if resuscitated and breathing, wouldn’t be able to make it due to there being NO PILLS AND NO MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS in the room. The writers intentionally made Larry’s fate before the head smashing ambiguous so the choice is tougher, try to help Lilly or help Kenny. And if you wanna be like “Oh well, if you help Larry, you see his mouth move”, again they left that ambiguous to whether or not he was breathing or if he was starting to reanimate. By deciding to try and help Larry, in Kenny’s eyes you are putting everybody in there at risk of being killed and stopping him from rescuing his family, putting a man who was a complete asshole to you over the safety of Clementine and the others in there. And if you want to think of it from a “colder/more practical” standpoint, getting rid of Larry is benefitial, dude’s condition is a drain on the medical resources they had, especially with his older age. In every other big source of Walking Dead media (Show, comics) they don’t just wait for somebody to be confirmed dead before the die, if sombody experiences an injury or something else that might seem fatal, they get put down before they turn. Simple. It seems brutal, but at the end of the day, what Kenny does to Larry is easy to justify, especially in the post-apocalyptic world.
Ben. Now I personally feel like Ben is also another accurate portrayal of how some people would be in the apocalypse, but he screwed up. He was giving the bandits supplies and the raid that occurred as a result of that indirectly got Duck and Katjaa killed. Kenny, 100% had justification behind being pissed at him, especially after Ben lied about it to avoid Lilly’s crazy ass, but ends up getting Carley/Doug killed while they try to defend him. Kenny wasn’t the only one who wanted Ben out of the group at that point, and they give you the option to let Ben die at the bell tower, whether you do so because you don’t like him or because he consider him a liability is up to the player. But at the end of the day, if you SAVE Ben, he hears Ben’s argument and feels bad for him, so much so, that when Ben gets injured in the Savanah alleyway, he the first one to try and save him save and later mercy kills him despite all the pain that Ben’s incompetance caused him. (Hell, he even does the same for Christa in the season one finale if Ben died in episode 4, with her, he sacrficies himself knowing that he accidentally made them end up with the situation with the dropped walkie talkie, and saving this preganant woman).
Carver. Carver HAD to die, if he wasn’t killed, he would’ve tried hunting them down for a third time, and they would’ve made no progress. Sure, his death was brutal, but you can’t forget the fact that he terrorized the group for months/years (implied that he raped Rebecca [though AJ doesnmt seem to be his kid], tortured Carlos in front of his kid, pushed a physically disabled man off a building over some miscut blueberries, etc.), and he almost beat Kenny to death, and Kenny wanted revenge for that and to avenge his friend Walter. Saying “he could’ve left Carver behind” is absolutely ridiculous, seeing how tough Carver was before and especially since he easily could radio to his people that Clem’s group is escaping. Kenny makes it very clear that he doesn’t want the others to see what he does, whether Clem watches Carver’s gruesome (and amazing gory) demise or not is up to the player.
Arvo. With Arvo, you can argue that he was doing too much, and I agree to an extent, but at the same time Arvo literally lied and lured his whole gang to Clem’s group to rob and kill them, and afterwards not once does he try to show any good faith or apologize, so of course Kenny doesn’t treat him well, he’s not as forgiving. The others are like “Oh he lost his sister”, but that doesn’t mean he deserves to be let off the hook, they literally just care because he looks “weak”. Hell (mentioning other Walking Dead media sources), guaranteed if this was in the show or comic of the walking dead, they would’ve killed Arvo and continued on to their original location instead of taking Arvo hostage and following him to the house (which for all they knew could’ve been another trap). Arvo caused episode 5’s worst events to occur: He got Luke killed by having one of his guys (which he brought in the first place) shoot him in the leg, then ran across the ice and distracting Mike and Kenny, making them unable to help Luke at all with the walkers PLUS he shot Clementine (the 11 year old girl who could determinantly support him against Kenny the WHOLE time) and for sure could’ve killed her, and for what? Because she put down his zombified sister? Get the fuck out of here, that’s ridiculous. Arvo did something bad and instead of trying to make it right or punishing him for what he did, he just gets pity through losing his sister, pity which was NOT earned. Speaking of Arvo, the majority of the group’s decision to keep him around is what split the group up, the group became divided because of Arvo. Now, from the beginning, Kenny was not close to the other members of the Cabin survivor group, with them disagreeing on plans and NONE of the adults having the common decency to go and comfort Kenny after Sarita died AS A GROUP or just leave him be to grieve. When trying to take care of AJ as Rebecca is slowly dying, Luke tries to accuse Kenny of being “weird” with baby AJ, even though Kenny was the only one putting in the initiative to take care of him. Then with Arvo (as mentioned before), the group acts like Kenny is being irrational for not trusting his teenager who lied to them and led them in the woods to be robbed at gunpoint. Later, after Luke dies and Kenny blames Arvo (and Arvo swears at him, then gets beat up), they [mostly Bonnie] somehow manage to put Luke’s death on KENNY (which is completely ridiculous, no matter how you feel about Kenny) they started disagreeing on where to go and find refuge at once he starts the truck. How is Kenny not expected to be frustrated by this group? When they accuse and blame him for things and act like he’s so awful, even though he’s done nothing but keep them safe and hurt the people who tried to do harm onto them. Of course when they don’t like the way Kenny is acting, instead of just talking it out like ADULTS, Mike puts it onto Clementine to “talk some sense” into Kenny, but still decides to betray the group with Arvo (who again, tried to kill them and who he’s known for literally one day) and Bonnie (if she’s still alive).
Shoot Kenny or Look Away. Jane specifically told Clementine very early into the episode ‘No Going Back’ that “Kenny is in a dark place, you’re the one he trusts most and the one who can bring him back.” This is very true, as seen by how Sarita’s death affected him and how he felt while talking to Clementine in the tent, feeling as though he was useless. While in the car, Kenny and Jane get into an arguement about where to go: To Howe’s Hardware (Carver’s old camp) or To Wellington. Now granted they both get into the spat, but Jane is the one who takes things personal with the whole “I spy with my little eye, an asshole.” comment, then they start insulting one another. Right after this though, when they spin out, notice one big thing: Kenny immediately checks afterwards to see if Jane is alright, then AJ, then Clem and then heads out of the car to get gas. Jane pretends like she is about to apologize, but then the moment he is out of the car she calls him a “fucking asshole”. She was taking it personally at that point, while Kenny may not of particularly “liked” her, there was still a bit of care. After this, she tries to get Clem to drive away, but they crash and Jane dips out with AJ and leaves Clem behind to put her little scheme into play. Kenny sees Jane approaching the rest stop, checks to see if she is alright, but then is shocked when she doesn’t have AJ, he runs off to search for AJ and she’s like “you’re going to see what he really is” and “you’ll see what he’s capable of”. So knowing GODDAMN WELL that this man lost his family (and bringing up his deceased wife and kid in the car argument), and that he VOWED to take care of AJ after Rebecca died, she decides to lie to him and to Clem about AJ’s fate, telling Kenny she left him to die so that he could have a reaction and snap. None of that needed to happen, not one bit. They could’ve had a civilized conversation like actual adults did if she was unsatisfied with Kenny’s behavior and they could’ve talked out where to go. But nope, I’ll hide a kid and pretend he’s dead so that this somewhat emotionally unstable man can attack me. She could’ve stopped the fight at any point and made it clear that AJ was safe, but then she makes the fight lethal by whipping out her knife. EVEN WHEN SHE HAS THE BLADE ALMOST PRESSED INTO HER CHEST, SHE IS JUST LOOKING BACK AT CLEMENTINE, WAITING FOR HER TO KILL KENNY. Jane wanted to kill Kenny, get rid of him so that she and Clem could follow her plans, but when she gets overpowered by him, she wants Clementine to do her dirty work for her. She manipulates a little girl into killing somebody who freaked out over a horrible lie. OF COURSE, Kenny didn’t have to take it that far and kill her, but Jane played a stupid game (that she didn’t know she could for sure win) and her stupid prize was her own unnecessary death. That fight was unnecessary and couldve been avoided, showing what sombody can do in their worst moment, in their worst state of mind cannot define the person as a whole, especially not in the apocalypse.
No matter what choice you make in the season 2 finale, kill him, leave him at the rest stop, leave him at Wellington, leave Wellington with him, HE SUPPORTS WHATEVER YOU DO, and unlike Jane he doesn’t act like he’s totally innocent, if you leave Kenny is basically like “Okay, stay safe” and gives her a little speech while all Jane does is try and beg you to stay as you walk away “Clem! I did it for you, for us. Clem...?”. And Kenny literally sacrifices himself for AJ and Clemetine twice, once for them to enter Wellington (a safe haven), and another time to save their lives while knowing he is going to die (seen in season 3 episode 1, if you stayed with him instead of going to Wellington). He made plenty of mistakes and traveled briefly into the dark side, but is indeed a strong man for not going COMPLETELY off the wall and going full blown cuckoo, saying “Fuck it, this world is shit, so I’m going to make others feel my wrath.”
He didn’t emotionally abuse Clementine, the closest thing you can say to him doing that was with him blaming her for Sarita’s death (and if you did cut off her arm, then yes, Clementine IS PARTIALLY RESPONSIBLE for her death, as she bled out and the zombies smelled her) which he ends up apologizing for and owns up to, regretting what he said. Kenny doesn’t try to act like he didn’t do anything wrong, he ALWAYS acknowledges when he acts out and owns up to his faults. An abusive person DOES NOT admit to their wrongdoings, they push it onto others and act like they did nothing wrong, like they are innocent. Whenever Clementine disagreed with him on something after that point, he DIDN’T FORCE her to agree with him, he just hoped she would be on his side, over the side of people she only met recently. Trying to have someone you’ve known for a while on your side and trusting of you in the APOCALYPSE is NOT emotional abuse. Somebody worth your trust might confuse you with their words, but displays they are worthy through their actions.
Season 2 of this game wasn’t about “trying to see Kenny is abusive” like some people try to paint it out to be, the big focus of the season was Kenny and Clem’s relationship, and whether or not you feel it’s time to give up on it. No matter what you do in the Walking Dead universe, you WILL change (most likely for the worse) and do questionable things to adapt to what the new world has to offer, that’s what trauma does to you. Kenny evolved from being “cowardly” to being able to do what needs to be done, not into a monster. In Kenny’s introductory episode of season 2 (A House Divided), Sarita has this box and Kenny insists he will take it for her, even after she tries to tell him it’s fine, to which she looks surprised but then tells Clementine “When I met him, he couldn’t life a fly”. Kenny wanted to show and feel like he wasn’t weak anymore, show that he is capable of doing the tough work, but was always once again hit with guilt when somebody close to him was killed and he couldn’t do anything to save them. He wanted to prove himself and show that he was indeed a worthy member of whatever group he joins. As Lee says in Clem’s dream after Arvo shoots her, “Bad things happen to everyone. And it’s hard to keep being yourself after they do.” Kenny’s sacrifice at the Wellington gates show that he is a broken man, he’s done bad things, things he has regretted (which he explicitly states while trying to convince you to stay there), but deep down he hasn’t changed, he is still a good man. Even if you don’t like Kenny, if you say you don’t like Jane either, the best ending is to go into Wellington and let Kenny leave as you enter, you are in a safe haven now with the baby and you don’t have to deal with him if you don’t want to. Saying that the “Alone” ending is the best is absurd, a little girl and a baby alone (based on a survival standpoint, rather than basing it on the characters you are left with) is the WORST ending.
In season 3, we see Kenny again and he’s much more calmed and mellow, by the end of the season Kenny needed Clementine in his life, he needed her because she is the one who saves him, Clementine is the one who gives him back his sense of tolerance and patience after everything they’ve gone through, she is the one who brings him back while they take care of baby AJ. Even the way “your Clementine” is able to talk and feel about life in A New Frontier is shaped around who you chose. If you stayed with Jane, she is colder and less caring, more focused on survival. With Kenny, she’s more compassionate and focused on AJ’s wellbeing, having family on her mind, Kenny (arguably) leaving a better influence on her than being with Jane or by herself.
ua-cam.com/video/BCGieXvvnJ8/v-deo.html
(If you wanna get EXTRA technical, the “Your Clementine became...” stats at the end of A New Frontier ep5 it LITERALLY states that Clementine “enjoyed brief, happy days with her loyal friend Kenny and AJ, until a terrible accident changed all of their lives”. And it even has an impact on the type of Clem “personality” you have going into s4 (ua-cam.com/video/RToDAESYPaw/v-deo.html, walkingdead.fandom.com/wiki/Story_Builder_(Video_Game) ), shooting Kenny leads to righteous or brutal, while looking away leads to selfess or loyal). And before anybody can say “oh, well, this video was made before seasons 3 and 4, so these points are invalid.”, NO. Seasons 3 and 4 are a part of Clementine’s journey and the player’s choices shape the lore behind it, so yes seasons 3 and 4 are fine to use to analyze Kenny’s character and the impact he has on Clem, especially since he can be mentioned multiple times in The Final Season (and he is the only other character besides Clem and AJ who can appear alive in 3 seasons).
Again, Kenny is a flawed, realistic portrayal of what the end of the world can do to a good person. You can feel and say whatever way you may about him, but I love his character (he sits comfortably in my top 10) and I will always dispute the statement that he’s abusive.
Understanable have a Great day
So basically what your saying is that killing Kenny is brutal. That's is an exaggeration and far from the truth. The reason that option was even there was because Kenny went crazy and was about to kill Jane and clem had to make a decision. And also Kenny does emotionally abuse clementine shown in s2 ep 2 or 3 Kenny is arguing with nick and luke at Walters house says says that clementine is staying there without her say. And one time Kenny disagreed with the group and tried to leave by himself with clementine without her say
@@leilasaid6232 Your not wrong but you can agree with Kenny before Luke and Nick sit with you /if you chose to sit with Kenny/ you can ask to stay with him, you can also do the same when Kenny wants to leave with just Clementine, she can ask or say she wants too but that's if you pick those options,,, also Jane could of stopped everything like people have said multiple times, she was making a broken unstable man more broken. Yes Kenny did have his faults but Kenny loved AJ like he loved Duck
He wanted to be a better father, mentioned in episode 3-4 Kenny says he knows he wasn't a good father with Duck and that he wanted to be a better father for AJ
It's impressive to see how Clementine (at least in my storylines) is the only one who tries to keep the group together (like Lee tried) and in the end she finds her way through loneliness.
So yes, Clementine's new Lee is Clementine.
This
Exactly!!!
After all this time, we find that the Lee we were looking for is the trauma we endured along the way
Alone ending is the only true ending
This is one of the best video essays I have ever seen, the editing alone was done really well. Keep it up! Or, If you've kept it up since the 8 years that this video exists, great job!
Kenny cared. He didnt abuse, he had over 2 sets of severe trauma hit him, and it did enough damage to change his personality.
Also who the hell trusts glass eater Jane?
Kenny was WAY too much like Anakin Skywalker from Star Wars - Episode 3. He loses his family because of Bandits, just like when Anakin lost his mother because of Tusken Raiders. Then Kenny worries about Sarita for losing her, too. Emperor Carver felt Kenny's hate and anger, which made him more "powerful". That's why if Kenny joined the Dark Side, he'd be able to save the ones Kenny loved, especially Sarita. but Sarita knew that was WRONG. So Kenny strangles her with the force from the Dark Side for turning against him. Then the fight between Jane and Kenny starts, and Clem steps in and stopped Kenny, felt into the lava, yelled at Clem: "I HATE YOU CLEM!" then burned up, became a machine, became Emperor Carver's apprentice.
almost like trauma doesn't ever justify treating other people like garbage. kenny was unstable, nasty, and possessive. while i love kenny and feel somewhat indifferent towards jane, i'd choose jane over kenny. kenny beat a man to death in front of clementine, beat up arvo in front of everyone because he was angry, and is constantly the force that drives others away from him. it's his way or no way at all, at least after clementine reenters his life.
it doesn't matter that he cared.
@@ysabellamedrano3360 the man Kenny beat up took his eye made clem and others do slave labor and killed a man for taking too long.
Yeah I would do the same.
@@ysabellamedrano3360 he isn't possessive
In all his endings he either sacrifices himself it let's then go willingly
@@ysabellamedrano3360 you would be unstable too if you had to experience what he went through.
To be honest preserving innocence isn’t a good idea as we can see in season 2 with that doctors daughter.
I believe a father is supposed to teac a child life and survival skills to a world they live in. And teach them how to adapt
uxserdvghbjl is hard to adapt to that world, even being an adult
Kenny was the best, no regrets staying with him until Telltale ripped him away from me in Season 3.
Kenny was WAY too much like Anakin Skywalker from Star Wars - Episode 3.
1: Kenny/Anakin loses his family/mother because of Bandit Raiders/Tusken Raiders.
2: Kenny/Anakin fears about losing Sarita/Padmé.
3: Kenny/Anakin joins the Dark Side just to "save" the ones they loved.
4:Kenny/Anakin reveals themselves as a Sith for Sarita/Padmé.
5: The fight between Kenny/Anakin and Jane/Obi-Wan started. (Clem steps in and shoots Kenny.)
6: Kenny/Anakin fell down onto the lava shore, looked up at Clem/Obi-Wan and yells: "I HATE YOU, CLEM!!!"
7: Kenny/Anakin was found by Palpatine/Carver, turned Kenny/Anakin into a machine, and became Palpatine's/Carver's apprentice.
@@murtaughthedragon1145 Weird. I love Kenny but hate Anakin ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
@@VanillaSkyCrawler Well, he was JUST like him, or WORSE, to be honest.
Yes
@Unlimited Mobile Gaming Sure... I gotta say, that Kenny even was like Nathan Hawkins from Beyond Two Souls. He loses his wife and daughter in a car accident, then went completely insane about deactivating the containment field and putting the whole humanity in great danger just so he only could get his family back.
PS: Who's "Kalja?"
I personally see Season Two as a full on Greek Tragedy. Full of new characters with problems, a villain of comedic proportions, a hero who rises to the occasion, and a character returning from a previous story.
In a Tragedy, as the name implies, bad things happen. The most common are ironic tragedies. The second most common is Tragedy of Character.
I see this entire season as the second, a Tragedy of Character(s). Specifically the second half, where you are losing more and more and you know SOMETHING is gonna give.
And it ends with two polar opposites duking it out and you help to decide the fate.
We have Kenny. He is Emotion. He is physically powerful, though unstable. He is a bottled up bag of emotions that just can’t let things go no matter how hard he tries. Through this, he creates emotional abuse that people understand but also is not warranted.
Then there is Jane. Cold. Calculating. She is a survivor, and she is interested in surviving. We see very little else on her list. She is logic. And she is also a double edged sword. Because the moment she thinks she doesn’t need you, you are GONE. The only exception seems to be Clementine and AJ, for no other reason then Clementine is useful, and she isn’t heartless enough to leave a baby to die.
Kenny appeals to emotion, Jane appeals to logic.
During the final scenes in the snow, she is purposefully goading Kenny into exploding. Is she doing this for herself? Hell no, if she actually thought he was a danger to her, she would have LEFT, or atleast kept her mouth shut.
Ya know why she goads and yells at him? To prove a point to Clementine. She is just as manipulative as Kenny is, she just so happens to have an opponent who is visibly not in the right state of mind, making her look like she is in the right.
What do you think would happen if Kenny stayed quiet the entire care ride? And it was just Jane laying into him until he broke down in sadness instead of anger. Then it’s obvious that she is the aggressor. But since her target talks back and is angry, she can spin it to look innocent.
Kenny is an abuser who keeps getting pushed by the world around him, but Jane is a manipulator who is trying to capitalize on that.
I think that’s the reason that all of the endings are kinda considered bad in their own ways, except for Clementine alone with AJ.
If you side with Jane, you are killing emotional instability and a good friend. You are betraying someone, just like what she wants you to do, or what SHE would do to anyone. You are becoming just as manipulative- narratively at least.
If you side with Kenny, you let emotions run wild in search of this perfect fantasy… and you find it. But it’s not perfect. And either you have to leave Kenny alone, or you go with him, back with your abuser, appealing to emotion rather then logic.
Finally… there is the Clementine Ending. Where Clementine rejects both manipulation and abuse in order to do things her way. Taking the things she has learned, and just… trying.
I wouldn’t say that any ending is GOOD… in fact, I would say that all except the Clementine Alone ending should be considered “bad” endings. While Clementine Alone is the “Neutral Ending”. You don’t pick sides, you pick yourself and AJ. Maybe you will survive. Maybe you’ll make mistakes. But you will be unburdened by the bad… and the bit of good, in either exploding emotion or brutal logic.
Jane left a newborn baby in a car in the middle of a blizzard knowing Kenny cared about that child and told him he died in her watch knowing it would make Kenny angry to convince Clementine that kenny was a bad person when in reality Kenny wouldnt leave a newborn child in a car during s blizzard to prove a point
The car is literally warmer than the rest stop. Less room for cold air to try and circulate.
@@AppleOfThineEye ok but why didn't Jane just say " aj is in the car" instead of "he died"
First, she never said "he died."
Second, that was the whole point. She wanted to show Clem how easy it was to break Kenny's sanity.
And it worked.
@@AppleOfThineEye no you're right. She said "it was an accident" and still risked an infants life to prove a point instead of sticking through it to help 2 children. Also there's no argument that Jane really cared about Clem because she just walked off and killed herself without any kind of warning to clem
>didn't care
>taught her survival
>gave her the nail file to remember her by
>came back when she heard shooting
>killed a man to save her life
>is straight about what will - and does - happen to Sarah
>predicts the psychological connection between Carver and Kenny
One of those things is not like the other. (Hint: it's the first one.)
Also, the infant is in no danger. For one, the car is warmer than anywhere else. Two, the car is whole and unbroken. A walker's not gonna break a window. And three, the walkers are frozen anyway. They can't fucking move. We see this on our walk to the rest area.
Jane is human garbage. At least Kenny cares about something other than himself. In that argument within the car, at the moment were Jane seems to be pushing Kenny to the edge, the car spins out; Who is the first to speak after everyone gets their bearings? Kenny asks Jane- "You OK?" with general concern in his voice.
That's who Kenny is. The guy who (if you choose to shoot him) in his dying moments tries to ease any guilt you have- telling you you did the right thing. The guy who (if you go with him to the end) willingly ostracizes himself for you and a baby that isn't his. The guy who has lost his son, two wives, and two groups of survivors (that we have seen), and blames himself and his weakness for their loss. Of course he is going to be traumatized. Of course he is going to be bitter. No matter how tough Kenny talks, when it gets to brass tacks, he is willing to throw away his life for the people he has claimed as 'his'.
salmonking Jane hung herself when she was pregnant. She ain’t any better then Kenny
and yet Jane wanted to leave Kenny with Clementine once he stepped out of the car. She is no different than Bonnie / Mike who tried to rob the car and betraying your old friend, not to mention they were kind of responsible for Kenny's lost and left him irritable.
I posted a nearly identical argument. Glad I'm not the only one speaking sense in this comment section.
kenny never cared about anyone else but himself. Thru the whole game I was agreeing with kenny but he still screws you over and he acts like an asshole if you disagree with him even once in the whole game. I don't know how some people didn't pick up on that...
Bullshit. Kenny ended up like that because of trauma of his family's death, and he will still go with you to get Clem as long as you shoot Duck and defend him against Larry. You just have to say that Clem is your family, and he'll understand. Kenny is a very messed up guy, he has flaws, he can't control his emotions a lot of the time, but that's what makes him the most human character in the series. The rest of your cast will either backstab you, or are goodie-two-shoes about everything. Kenny sticks around, even if you piss him off, and will only ever leave you if you're actively going against him. At the end of Season 1, Kenny will sacrifice himself for Christa or Ben, and at the end of Season 2, he will put the children before himself and be left alone in the snow. Hell, at the end of the first episode, Kenny will always save Lee, regardless of how horrible Lee was to him. Yes, Kenny can be an asshole at times, but his true side shows when it has to. Jane was saying that Clem wouldn't be able to get Kenny to change, but in Season 3, he's a new man. He's happy, for the first time since the apocalypse started, he's happy just taking care of two kids on his own. After AJ is born, he makes him priority and is determined to keep him alive. Bonnie and Mike attempt to leave a new-born to die, after shooting a kid, just because they disagree with Kenny's plan. What, they have a better plan? Down south? Texas? Hell no, AJ would die on the way. Then there's Jane, who actually only cares about herself. Kenny may be an asshole to people, but he actually does care about them. Even when their truck crashes, Kenny asks Jane if she's okay with real concern. What does Jane do? She manipulates his emotions, leaving him to believe that she got AJ killed. Of course, she actually left him in a detreating car, in the middle of a snow storm, surrounded by Walkers. Wait, what? How is any of this a good idea? No shit Kenny is going to try and kill her, she just took away the only thing giving him purpose in such a horrible fashion. Instead of telling Kenny that AJ is alive, she asks Clem for help, leaving a kid to make the decision of shooting a man that they've known from the very beginning. No, Jane is the one who only ever cares about herself. She leaves the group, but does come back, but we all know it wasn't for the group. She only came back for Clem, trying to convince her to leave the group with her. There are plenty of other occasions where Kenny shows that he cares for others, like when Carver has Clem at gunpoint and Kenny gives himself up, but that would take too much time to look through the game again and type every thing he does. I don't know how some people didn't pick up on the fact that, despite being an asshole at times, Kenny truly cares for others. Hell look at the way Kenny and Jane die in Season 3. Kenny is teaching Clem how to drive, the car goes off the road, and Kenny sacrifices himself again for the safety of Clem and AJ. Jane tells Clem to check outside, when Clem comes back, Jane has hung herself in front of AJ. The reason? She was pregnant with Luke's child. How selfish is that? Leaving two kids on their own to survive, while killing yourself and another child. Their deaths really show a contrast in how much they care for others. Kenny will give his life for those he loves, Jane will give her life over stupid shit, and leave those she "loves" to fend for themselves.
I don't think Clementine had to "see Kenny for what he is" I think this entire time she's been the only one seeing him for who and what he really is. She sees him as a father and a man that fought for her and for Lee because she knew him before things got bad. And as people that are introduced to him recently, they're seeing Kenny as this monster changed by the apocalypse, telling Clem to open her eyes... in reality Clem sees him for the real Kenny, the one that is loyal and kind and protective. And she knows his pain. Pain that no one in the group can understand because they've never lost a child.
Good guy. Bad guy. Monster. None of that matters. It’s an apocalypse. If Kenny has Clem’s back then he should be good in her eyes
@Ryan Romano Yes, he's pretty unstable at this point, however at the end of the day those in the Walking Dead universe tend not to have the best mental health. He is a better option as Clementines caretaker than Jane by leaps and bounds
Btw. Clem says "No not again. Not again." That could be Christa's Baby dying. Just had to mention that.
Exactly, kenny has been through alot and clementine has been there for all of it while none of the others have, if anything, clementine has seen the real Kenny.
Lee puts it well if you chose to tell Omid and Christa to leave Clem with Kenny. He says "You didn't see Kenny with his family. He was willing to do anything for them" (or something of the sort) and its true. Kenny has no reason to feel any loyalty to this group that brought nothing but death and pain onto his friends. Because they came to his lodge Walter was killed by Carver. And then Sarita was bit by a walker. People who say Jane was the clear choice are delusional. She was so willing to give up on her sister, Sarah and everyone else. She would be willing to give up on Clem too
I come back to this video a lot, as it's taught me a lot about how to weave the decisions characters make into a story. Absolutely one of the best videos on this site, with very few rivals to the name
I agree and the fact that most people can't make a compelling argument against this video just shows how well thought of the video is. Most people are just writing short essays to oppose which is not enough as there are still sides of his argument still standing.
*People in the comments:* hey, Jane was also an abuser
*Me:* You can leave them both and fend on your own right
THIS. None if them are good guardians.
@Decapatain Cuppajoe better lose a finger then live with such a man. but i admit she made aj an asshole
I didn't know you could leave on your own, I'll have to do that when I play season two again.
@Wrench Ohh ok. I'll choose that once I finish playing season one again.
I agree and dissagree. Jane was definitely worse but that's not my reason to why I think this video is inacurate (that's not how it works), this guy manipulates his audience by cutting out the good parts that should complete Kenny's ark and makes it look like he's a bad person. Plus, it was obvious that Telltale was going to continue this story with new instalments, so how can he be this judgemental and harsh on a story that clearly isn't even completed? It's the same as criticizing a movie before you've seen the ending
I feel like a lot of people are missing something about how abuse works when it comes to Kenny. Someone can be protective and be abusive at the same time by displaying behavior that puts people at risk over and over again. It doesn't occur as abusive to them, since they are acting out of righteous fervor and thus feel justified in their actions. To them controlling someone is being protective of them and very rarely does it become apparent to them that they are just being controlling than anything else. That is not to say that such people are malicious or evil, rather rash, unwise and insensitive.
Trauma can lead to abusive behavior but it does not justify it. People with different predispositions will be affected by trauma in different ways and some might display abusive behavior in certain situations. The issue here is that storytellers need to more responsible while talking about trauma so that the stereotype of "The abused become abusers" isn't ridiculously reinforced because it's extremely damaging to public perception of how trauma works. We don't need more people sympathizing with abusers. And yes, season 2 certainly lacked nuance here.
Hayat Yeah Kenny was turning into a Carver.
@@thefrontier1059 .........now that you mention it....
Thank you for this measured response. I've become very worked up about Kenny in the past because he reminded me so much of what an abuser looks like. I'm glad to see someone else who shares a similar experience
Season 2 lacked nuance in a lot of places. I'm still upset over how they handled Sarah and their obvious disdain for the character.
@@Ramiell777 Excellent argument.
Is empathy enough?
Yes. Yes it is. If a work of art gets us to be in that place we would have never been before, no matter how fucked up that place is, it fulfilled my expectations and more. While trauma does not "create" abuse, the notion of "I have been through stuff therefore I am justified to..." is ingrained in our brains, and even people not otherwise violent or abusive will fall back onto that justification to lash out at others. It happens, that's what society teaches us, without saying it out loud: trauma can make you crazy, will make you crazy, to the point where when someone who has been to traumatic experiences does not break down some people find it weird and unnatural, like they are just waiting to burst behind the supposed facade.
Following your interpretation, Kenny is that. Kenny is a man that had no reason or justification to actually be violent, at least on the first game, the one that ran away constantly and you would never imagine making the awful but necessary choices when the chips where down. However, he taught himself. He knows, on some basic level, that he should be lashing out, losing it after what happened to him and his family. And when he finally starts acting like that, people fear or respect him, and oh does that respect feel cathartic. And it gets easier, because people see him as a grieving, broken, patched-together-into-determination mess, and they do not want to confront him.
And it works, narratively. This is also how abuse is born, through self justification. It is not the trauma that breaks you, but sometimes you just fill in the shoes of what the victim of trauma is supposed to be. And you lash out, and you go overboard, and eventually noone around you is even justifying your actions with what you went through and neither are you, that's just how you are now.
So this might not be our Kenny, but then Clementine is not the Clementine we called down from the treehouse, is she?
+Generic Username I agree. Thank you! Someone knows their stuff! People snap! The environment can make you insane because you loose control. This is about power and control. That is WHY it is important to be genuinely nice to each other and realize that we are ALL related to each other. The environment mutates your genes and turn you into monster like everyone else. So be careful of your choices because of the butterfly effect. That is the TRUE horror of your choices! The butterfly effect is the horror! Your choices DO matter. Making choices is frighting! Empathy creates good change and growth.
+Generic Username
It's great that the game gives us this perspective, but until watching this video, I didn't know that was the perspective the game was giving us. It put us in that position of an abusive relationship, but was never able to tell us, even at the end, when it would've been fine to give us that revelation.
If people miss the point the game is trying to make because the game didn't make us understand, then empathy isn't enough.
+Generic Username amazing post!
+Generic Username Your interpretation would work if the game revealed that Kenny was, in fact, acting this way because he felt he had to. But he just does it, and in order for your interpretation to work we need to assume he did this offscreen somewhere before the events of the second game.
Not saying that you're not on to something here, this would be a really interesting game to play, but it isn't what season 2 is.
amazing point
The luke´s death is really a ridiculous death in this game.
Word. Him and Marianna’s death was so unnecessary
@@iliketoreadgirl2556Mariannas death was important for the conflict
I'd pick Kenny over Jane any day. Everything Kenny did in the second season was to protect Clementine. Jane on the other hand killed herself and left Clementine and AJ alone.
Including yelling and blaming a child for a death she had no part in? Wow thanks for the protection kenny
@@nam9085 no one said he wasn't crazy.
@@nam9085 He was grieving. He later apologizes to Clem.
@@domossgameplays9730 grief is not an excuse to shout at and blame a child for a death. Imagine it was an abuser blaming his child for his mom's death because he's "grieving". there's no excuse for that in my opinion
@@nam9085 I think there is. It's called denial. After Kenny got over it he wholeheartedly apologizes because he feels terrible. An abuser wouldn't admit they're wrong.
The thesis of having people you can trust is more relevant to Kenny than Clem. Kenny sees innocence in children. He didnt want others to influence Clem. He probably thought Clem purposely killed sarita because of the group she was with's influence on her. Kenny hasn't just lost sarita, he has lost Clem. For the rest of the season, Kenny tries to protect Clem, with the inner idea that she isn't innocent anymore. Upon AJ's birth, Kenny saw a blank slate: an innocent newborn. If the baby was not in the picture, would Kenny have cared to attack jane? Kenny saw something in aj.
Kenny is a family man at the end of the day.
No offense but all that Jane says to Kenny is just to provoke him in order to get Clem on her side. She fabricates and chooses to escalate a confrontation in order to get Clem all to herself and then takes no responsibility for Clem in Season 3. Kenny is a broken man who lashes out and is suffering for the weakness he showed in the past, and while he's no angel, I'll never allow a person who confessed to using a complete and utter deception to trick the man she hates into lashing out in order to get rid of him.
Jane hated Kenny because he had Clem, at least in my own playthrough. I wanted Jane to stay with the group but ultimately she was too scared of both responsibility and reliance on others to be anything but alone. I don't regret for a single second letting Kenny kill her, but ultimately she chose to make Kenny an enemy and her only way of getting out of the situation alive was to have Clem shoot the last parental figure in her life. Jane's no role model in the same way that Kenny isn't, but at least Kenny is made all too aware of his failures as a human while Jane is ignorant even if you choose to abandon her.
I don't like that Clem is forced to choose between them, as I would prefer if neither had to die, but Jane could never be someone Clem could trust, and even Season 3's flashbacks show it.
VengefulKyle I agree. I let him kill her too.
Kenny at least stands for something, as twisted as he and the things he has done to uphold it has been. Jane is just a self-serving psychopath.
Plus jane just ends up killing herself in the next season leaving clem alone with a baby.
She pushes a kid that hasn’t driven and who can barely reach the pedal to drive down a icey road through zombies. When it inevitably crashes she leaves clem to die. Then as you said deceives both to try and push Kenny to the brink of insanity. She barely cares for clem at all. Kenny, whilst an unhinged asshole, does have redemption in the wellington ending. The Russian kid lied and tried to kill clem but apparently him wanting to kill the kid was what made him too much? End of the day it’s about what clementine would do. I let Kenny Jill Jane first then shot him. But it’s not very clem. They don’t really give you much option but to leave alone or go to wellington and tbh wellington is a much more satisfying ending and we can- as with the first game- find some forgiveness for Kenny.
I hated Jane bec what she was tryna to do to Kenny wish I could of shot her instead of Kenny killin her 😂
This is the best commentary on Kenny I’ve seen. Everyone “loves” Kenny but they do not acknowledge his flaws, likely because they’ve never played the second game. This is an extremely generous reading of this game, but very well done and enjoyable
Being a coward is what makes him more realistic.
FramingTally Cowards are always the most immersive character if they are pulled off correctly.
-and a liability
And?
Realistic doesn't mean you have to like him. No idea why people like Kenny. It's like saying a killer (like Carver) felt real therefore I like him and support him... I liked Kenny as a character too but he would not be part of my group. He's too much about his family that he'd endanger the rest of us
Being a piece of shit makes him realistic too. There are pieces of shit in the real world after all.
Warning: Long ass comment. Kenny was better than Jane in almost every way. The main thing that Jane had going for her that Kenny didn't is that it took her longer to lose her temper and when she did it wasn't as bad. Kenny in S1 didn't have huge temper if it didn't involve harming anyone in his family. Can you really blame him for having the temper he did after Sarita died in S2(Plus he was a little sour about Duck and Katjaa still, and carver made him half blind, so I guess it half justifies what Kenny did to him)? Yes it didn't justify everything he did before or after, but at least Kenny was hopeful and had faith in the people he trusted. Jane originally left the group in S2 because she didn't want to see Clem die, in which she had trust in Clem, but near 0 hope she would live. Kenny saw what Jane was but didn't let on about in the right way. He lost trust of the people who could've had his backs. When Rebecca gave birth, Kenny was happy, when Jane heard Rebecca was pregnant at all, she was already talking about abortion/abandoning the child (AJ). Kenny once again gained a second hope(first hope was Clem) at the sight of a living baby. Jane left because she saw the baby as a death trap, crying, need of food and water, she saw it as a waste of supplies and decided to leave (she may have said it was because of Clem but the baby was probably 50% of why she left, 10% Clem, 40% Kenny.) She knew Kenny and her were on thin ice and she knew if she provoked him, Clem might realize that Kenny was going a little mad, but fixable (in my eyes it was fixable, after seeing the good and bad things Kenny did I thought it balanced out, he still had heart, so I thought he was save-able anyway.) But she set Kenny up to get rid of him, so she could get the GODDESS CLEMENTINE on her side, her strategy being eliminating the last person who was truly against her. If you somehow forgave Jane in S2 at the end, after killing KENNY :(, in S3 the flashback shows Jane giving up and killing her self when she learned she had a baby from Luke, with no regard for Clementine, no goodbye, no nothing. She gave up at hope of new life, and left nothing to clementine than her walker self hanging from a noose. As I've mentioned Kenny saw a beam of hope with AJ and would protect him and Clem at all costs. If you chose to leave Wellington with Kenny, the flashback would show Clem crashing a car and Kenny being put near motionless on the ground, not being able to move anything but his mouth, he gave Clem a goodbye and told her to be strong, and he drew walkers away from her protecting her 'til the very end. I personally think going with Kenny to Wellington was best, even without him :P (at least there's a little bit of hope of him returning.) Jane cared near nothing for Clementine, just a tool for her to keep moving. Anyways this was my opinion, no ones gonna still be watching this video or seeing this comment at least, but if you do reply and tell me if I gave a good opinion, plus to type and edit this took an hour :P.
upvoted for effort
Great comment. You say what I want too. My grammar broke. Thank.
Lefou L quote from Ben regarding this Kenny apology garbage
"I am so so sorry about what happened to your family..... You know how they died you said goodbye I never even got to see my family...."
You hear that Kenny is not the only goddamn person in the universe to lose his family he'll Lee lost his brother and Clem lost a lot too but the still try to remain calm and level headed in their decisions
Kenny on the other hand operates on this mentality of you're either with me or against me and he enforced this mentality onto a child nontheless
In regards to the decision with Sarita where Kenny (the same guy with no regrets about killing Larry) yells at an 11 year old girl for not saving his love interest
Kenny is a selfish hypocritical dipshit that didn't give a shit about Clementine until season 2 (seriously Kenny will refuse to help Lee find a little girl because of minor disagreements)
Kenny is the worse
I should’ve read the warning
Agreed.
“We don’t talk about Kenny.”
*Talks about kenny for literally 3/4 of the entire video*
yep
Wasnt the point of the video...
Lol
toadlles why dose he not talk about him
It's a metaphor, but also on point about how many in the community seems to view Kenny as your typical Florida Man, without looking closer into his character.
Not many people seem to discuss how Kenny is very abusive, or how much of a danger and detriment he is to Clementine's survival.
Jane isn't any better, duh. But to pick the lesser evil (Kenny / Jane) is still very evil.
20:23 I understand where you're going but abuse and trauma aren't all that black and white, accepting that trauma awakened or created something in Kenny that made him abusive is not automatically assuming that all trauma leads to abusers.
People might not want this narrative because it demonizes traumatized people, and that's understandable, but also, there's a lot of worth on this narrative. Traumatized people CAN become abusers, and they are still accountable for what they do, the trauma is still there, valid and all, but they have become Abusers too, and that's not something that is black or white, it isn't "you're the victim or you're the abuser and that's it for all your life".
This lack of knowledge is the one that abusers can take advantage of to victimize oneself, the idea that, if they're victims of trauma, suddently their actions are justified and not their own.
We need to acknowledge that.
Trauma can make some people lean into abuse, but the moment they cross that line, especially when knowing how much it hurts, it doesn't matter how much trauma they have, they are in the absolute wrong.
Agree with that one. My family and life have been both unstable and toxic, where it was unclear for me at times when I was supposed to feel safe and think that everything was fine - or when suddenly everything turned to hell.
Pain can either make you shrivel into yourself and suffocate in all of it until you either decide to end by death... or you let it out.
The healthiest but also most difficult way is to get help, get out of the situation and talk to someone about it.
What's more easy is to lash out, it just feels just as good.
The world feels cruel and painful, so why not treat it back the same.
That's the dark reality of it.
Not everybody has to be happier or like it when they act out like this, but it feels more easier to give into it than and let it out instead of falling down or trying to climb out of it.
I've done some shitty things were I got into fights, was both verbally and physically abusive... I don't know if I also acted out on emotional abuse.
What I feel when thinking back is the amount of pain I was in and the shame now that I treated members of my family and also friends this way and can only be so lucky that they understood it and forgave me.
I got the help and I'm better now, but not completely out. There still times when I want to lash out just to feel better and not have it eat me.
That's how I related to Kenny. I felt and understood his pain and also knew that him doing horrible things wasn't right, but that he didn't see it in that situation.
That's why I chose Kenny.
We don't talk about proper representation of mental trauma
Kenny reminds me of my father. Yeah, he can be (verbally) abusive and is a ticking time bomb of violence, but when you have so many good memories about someone that promises to protect you, it's hard to walk away from them. Only recently I've limited my contact father, even then it's hard because I still love and trust him deep in my heart, but in the end I know it's healthier for my mental/physical well being to avoid him as much as I can.
Kenny isn't a bad guy, neither is my father. They just make the wrong decisions and don't think rationally sometimes. They also don't know how to vent their frustrations/sadness/or angers out in a healthy matter, which causes family and other people to be fearful of them and unsure how they might react. This eventually pushes them away and since they can't comprehend that the problem starts with their own behavior, they get more and more abusive/controlling because "their world" is falling apart.
I had this issues with my father too. In fact, this past year we actually got in a fist fight and I chased him out of my house, and even tried to stab him. I know the pain that brings and the pressure that puts on you.
But now I'm gonna tell you something you don't wanna hear. Stop being a fucking sniveling little pussy and talk to him. Look at the situation from his point of view. Don't come in there and tell him how you felt as if only your feelings matter. Ask him why he did those things, you might actually have sympathy for him. Hiding from your problems is not a solution. Go talking to him wanting peace but be ready to fight. If you believe your father is a good person that cares about you work it out. Hiding from it like this is mentally scaring shit.
Okay, here's the deal. I'm a 5'8" 180 pound female, who has dealt with a father that has used emotional abuse to both my mother and me for more than 20 years. He is 6'6", lifts hundreds of pounds of steel for a living, and has a violent temper. His house is also filled with guns, and other military equipment. Finally he has a habit of threatening even his own family, that he'd track us down if we piss him off.
Sorry if I'm afraid of him, because I truly believe he is capable to physically harm me or kill me one day.
It's safer for me to avoid him/limit interaction with him, until I have the funds to move far enough away that it wouldn't be worth the effort to chase me down.
coldeed you have no idea what its like to live with an emotionally abusive parent, do u? ur the same dude yapping off in the comments on how "kenny isn't abusive" so thats funny
No, I lived with a father that would beat me and my mother. Real abuse that is inexcusable. Guys like you are just sensitive to a fault or cowards, incapable of sympathy or forgiveness while not having the guts to speak your own mind. Bday has a serious issue and I thought I'd offer what I know worked for me personally.
so you just told them to stop lol
I love Kenny's story across the first two seasons of Walking Dead. I chose to shoot him, because I recognized that he was suffering and his self-resentment manifested itself as self-destruction. He refused to recognize it himself and thought he was being protective of what little family he had left. Abusers know what they're doing and how wrong it is, but I don't believe Kenny was a bad person at his core. That's why he thanks Clem when she chooses to shoot him in the final confrontation. He was finally letting go, and likely believed he would be reunited with his family in death.
I then promptly told Jane to fuck right off.
On another comment I made the same conclusion as you (If I were to shoot Kenny.) I left him at wellington but if I were to shoot him it would to be to put an end to his suffering and finally free him from that life of pain that was surviving. It pained me to see him go but It's better than being torn apart and becoming a walker.
I did the same as you
i stayed with Kenny I knew he'd be there for clem til the end.
I love Kenny but I had to kill him in my view. He was in so much pain and his words made me feel like it was he right decision. I know it probably wasn’t the best for Clem but it’s my moral of me being unable to see people suffer. After years of minding my own business with my mom going through an abusive relationship with her ex. The last fight they had was the first and last time I tried to stop it. After that I felt guilt for not doing anything sooner so at this point. Ending Kenny’s pain felt like the right choice to me. Although that’s my opinion. (Also if anyone who knows me sees this. I’m still not allowed to talk about this so please don’t tell anyone we know)
@@danimorgan5378 would be better to keep him alive and leave him at wellington or whatever its called
Kenny was a shattered man, abusive? Yes he changed. I didn't like seeing him so violent. But I think based on everything that happened, Kenny simply had enough.
It's really not that difficult to understand his thought process, though, he did become abusive towards the end. His intentions and feelings for Clementine always stayed true to his words, all he wanted was for her to be safe.
The separate ending where he chooses to let Clementine and the baby stay at Willington is abseloutly heart breaking and really does show his true intentions and selfishness.
Eventually thought, I choosed the ending where I went with Kenny (also knowing that Willington wasn't gonna last)
Because one thing I learned from this, is that yes, you can't trust anyone, they all fucking backstabbed Clementine, used her, neglected her, blamed her. (except for the few who actually cared but died.
Kenny was truly the only one I trusted Clementine with, broken or not, somewhat abusive, maybe but most certainly not an abusive step father. He was a God damn gem to me.
Black The Nerevarine inuyasha?
Black The Nerevarine loved Kenny was a great character it’s a fuckin shame what they did in season 3 still pissed bout it 😡
Evil Snail but I hated it so much. It didn’t feel right or how the way I would have expected. All the ways to die in a zombie apocalypse and he dies because he didn’t wear a damn seatbelt. It was sad but I didn’t feel emotionally connected to his death
Amen. Kenny might be abusive towards the others, but that's why it might be better that the rest went off. I just couldn't leave him alone in the state he's in. And if he didn't punch Arvo around, I'd be on the same page as him on that guy.
Black The Nerevarine Then in Season 3 THEY FUCKING KILLED HIM OFF IN THE MOST FUCKING SHITTIEST FUCK YOU EVER TO THE PLAYERS!!!! Jane just fucking ditched you, but Kenny help Clem, with life and with AJ. They weren't abusive or dysfunctional, but a family. Kenny was an amazing person, who had nothing but shit thrown in his face, and broke. But when he moved on, a gem from all that shit returned and he was able to truly deal with his issues and become a better man in the end.
R.I.P. Kenny
-loving father, husband, and good friend...
I know I'm 8 years too late, but eh, I'll bring up some problems I have with this video anyway:
1.) Kenny never leaves alone with the boat. It's a myth, and if you piss Kenny off enough, yeah, he'll stay behind with the boat, but when you come back to the house he'll be trapped in the shed alone, having been beaten up by "The Invalids". At which point, he goes with you to save Clementine regardless, and meets the same fate as every other version of Kenny in S1.
2.) Kenny is NOT a coward. Kenny will try to fight Larry in Ep1, if you don't deescalate the situation, and get beat down by the brick house Larry is. He will save Lee in that same episode, despite his family already being safe and walkers flooding in, being the only reason Lee lives to see another episode after Larry sucker punches him. Plus he saves his son 3 times, once at the gas station right before the game starts (400 days), at the farm, and then outside the drugstore. Each time, from a walker that had a grab on his boy.
In Ep2, Kenny is the only one putting his foot down to investigate the St. John's, risking everything to ensure the place is safe. Without his insistence/encouragement, the entire group would have died as cattle. At the end of the episode, he will charge in to save his son like an idiot against a man with a rifle, and to the surprise of 5 whole people, gets shot for trying.
In Ep3, he is one of two people that goes on a supply run to make sure the group isn't dying from lack of supplies, even with Ben stealing their sh-t), and with a guy that he may love, but also may hate the guts of (Lee). By the midway point, he suffers a world-shattering, soul-crushing event that rocks his very being at its core, and he spends the rest of his screen time in S1 and even S2 recovering from that loss. But right before that point, if you confront Kenny, and don't work things out with him peacefully, the dude will try to kick your ass, and if you are too passive? He'll legit shove you out of the train car, locking the door, and giving you a secret bad ending.
At this point onward, it isn't cowardice, but apathy, that stops him in his tracks. Bro has lost his reason to continue, and is like a walking corpse himself at this point, the only thing bringing him life is hatred/bitterness toward the world and constantly being prodded to do something when he's too hurt to care otherwise. He sorta rebounds here and there, but Kenny is a broken man since Ep3, and his only real shining moment from then on is at the end of Ep5, where he makes his famous "sacrifice".
I could go on and on about how Kenny is anything but a coward with more moments from S2, and instead is the opposite, being too hotheaded and stubborn to back down and realize that he's outmatched in just about every confrontation he's faced with (Lee being his main opposition).
3.) Kenny is not abusive. One could argue that he was heading there (no one starts out as an abusive person), but even by the end of S2, I don't consider him abusive at all. Never laid a hand on his wife, never laid a hand on his son (even though the kid frankly needed some harsh love IMO, and it was the coddling/overprotection that led to the boy's death), and never laid a hand on Sarita. Two separate relationships over 2 seasons, and the guy never once hit them, or even threatened to. Was he verbally abusive? In that apocalyptic world, I'd be surprised if you DIDN'T scream down someone's throat at some point to get your point across, as Kenny often needed to (or at least felt he needed to).
He had serious anger issues, and sure, he could even get violent. However... failing to think of an instance where his violence wasn't either completely justified, or he was egged on by someone else while he was in an emotionally unstable state, in which S2 he was in such condition practically the entire time. He still never hit Clementine (I remember he elbows her accidentally if you try to pull him off of Arvo, and I think also pushes Clem out of the way while fighting Jane).
But I will say that "Kenny is abusive and dangerous, and bad for Clem" is the direction S2 was trying to go, 100%. Every character was obsessed with Kenny, talking sh-t about him, warning Clem about him, talking about wanting to escape from Kenny, yadda yadda yadda, despite Kenny frankly being what was pushing the group since his arrival. They wouldn't have escaped Carver, they wouldn't have saved AJ's life (most likely, anyway), and they wouldn't have survived Arvo's group's ambush. Also, while constantly harping on Kenny's 'imaginary' safe haven to the North, they stuck with him, because they knew they'd be wandering aimlessly otherwise. Yet he's dangerous, a ticking time bomb, a threat... so let's take the truck (that Kenny fixed and the only form of transportation the group has), the supplies (that Kenny forced out of Arvo, like it or not), and bail, leaving an infant and an 11(?)-year old girl with Kenny in a half-built house in the middle of Winter. Could have left with what was on them, if they believed the group was too toxic, but nah... let's try to take everything. I love that Clem can actually call them out for it, too.
I seriously hated the cast of S2. Even Luke wasn't perfect, as he was the actual coward that you keep insinuating Kenny was. But still, Luke was one of the only "good" characters in S2. Even then, Kenny > the rest, easily. If Telltale wanted me, the player, to side with someone else over Kenny, then they needed to make me value them over him, or at least put them on even ground. But instead... they all sucked, or died way too early, like Walter. Then there's Jane... ugh.
I miss Lee, man...
😢
Season 2 tried so fucking hard to make you not side with Kenny when majority of the things going on with him MADE sense, with the context of all he had been through he was still a good man at heart and if we DO side with him in season 2 he ends up sacrificing his life for us
Thank you for putting into words everything I was thinking 😭. This man is broken and he lost everything, of course he's going to be overprotective and a little rash.
I used this video to study for my essay for my English class which is the topic (what drives a person to be someone else?) meaning Kenny was once a family man a kind person willing to risk everything for his family if it meant to kill innocent people, but when it’s taken away he goes to a darker place but keeps Clem close because he truly does care about the only family he has left even if she isn’t blood. But I didn’t understand that until I watched this and kinda put my essay together.
I got an A on it.❤️
That’s awesome, great job on getting an A 👍💞
Nice job!
"What can change the nature of a man?" is the arc-thesis question posited by _Planescape: Torment._ If you haven't already played it, it might be worth a look.
I hope this guy does another video on The Walking Dead
Same
Its been a year but Season 4 is Coming Out... There's Hope
This video gave me a whole new perspective on the game, I really hope there’s more
EN7171 It's the last season too 😭
West Beasty yea and let’s not make him cry again by talking about Kenny
I never understood the hate for Kenny. Almost all his action where completely UN-selfish and was always trying to help his family. (Including Clem and AJ) Its even proven when he begs for the Wellington group to take them and he'll stay knowing he'll probably die. I don't know why but that line "I just need them to be ok" always made me shed a tear.
@ahegao god I have an issue with how this video is structured and just plainly calling him an abuser just like that. It ignores the situation, setting, and ALL of the other characters, who really weren't good parents or role models either. Many of them not really caring, or just barely about Clementine.
@ahegao god
How an abuser? I mean, as Clem you can disagree with him the whole game he still would try to protect Clem.
Every time he gets angrier he really has a valid reason to be.
Angry at Lee because he didn't help him in killing Larry?, well, from Kenny's perspective, you're the one that are putting Clem, the chance of saving his family, Lily and basically everyone in risk for an asshole. Also, remember that Larry in chapter 1 needed pills to get recovered, and in a meatlocker they didn't have those, which makes more unlikely that he would recover. To be honest, Kenny has more arguments in that situation.
Angry at Lee because he disagrees about leaving the motel?, well, the game showed us that there were bandits around there that since weeks were being a problem.
Angry and yelling at Bonnie, Mike and Jane when he fixed the car? Well, according to Kenny "there's only 1 day of food for that kid". Bonnie, Mike and Jane by arguing with the one that fixed the car and by wanting to wait until tomorrow are being very irresponsible. They should've left in that exact moment when Kenny fixed the car like Kenny said, but instead of that, they just wanted to continue arguing with him and waiting until tomorrow like nothing or like it's not a big deal.
And even knowing that, Kenny didn't even think about leaving or betrayng the group even if he cares that the baby has only 1 day of food, he still wanted to convince them and have their approval. Bonnie, Mike and Jane didn't understand that he was angry because he precisely thought that just waiting would affect the kid.
We just can't see him angry and call him an abuser. He most of the times has very good reason to get angry and the people around just were thinking "oh, he is getting crazy, he is turning into Carver blablabla"' without understanding why he gets angry in the first place or without seeing his arguments and just making him seem like the bad guy.
That being said, I agree that a few times he was angry for not good reasons and sometimes he was kind of a dick with Lee even if you agree with him.
This guy would instantly die in a zombie apocalypse, or be one of those cannibals.
ahegao god “either with me or against me” stuff is kinda not on point though, because most of the time (it not every time) he apologized to Clem for being a dick if he actually was one. (Like when he just lost it due to losing Sarita and blamed Clem for it)
His choices were all selfish. Did you pay attention to the story? Before his wife and child died, it was all about protecting them. Granted it's noble, it's also selfish because he was doing it for himself and he didn't care about others.
The video: Talks about how Kenny is thoroughly a very flawed person, someone who lets his emotions get the better of him and typically lashes out in the worst way possible whenever things don't turn out his way.
The comment section: Supporting Kenny because of the one thing he's angry for is completely justified.
The choice would be, would you stay with someone that will make you feel lesser, someone you can't talk back because you're too busy thinking about his feelings just because he's family or would you finally take a stand for yourself, realizing that blind loyalty isn't the correct choice?
why talk back when he's been nothing but correct? what is there to even talk back about?
Anyone chosing Jane over Kenny don't really understand Kenny. They kept saying he would never let Clementine go. He does let Clem go for her to be safe at Wellington.
Anyone who chooses Jane or Kenny doesn't understand the game
Both of them were kind of bad, but where Jane was just self-centered, Kenny was not only a murder, but always made problems wherever he went from his inception.
krizzex there both clearly in the wrong and telltale gave both Jane and Kenny points to justify themselves for there actions or why they did what they did and both points about each other are somewhat correct which furthers the point that going with either makes no damn sense, the canon ending is alone for many facts
fuck understanding the game Kenny is the homie and will always be my choice i fucking hate jane
I chose Jane because Kenny was a threat that Clem would have to always deal with. She didn't have a bond with Jane, so I figured she'd be totally expendable.
I also didn't know I could abandon Kenny.
I like how he just ignores Jane being a gaslighter and manipulator. Sure, Kenny wasn't the best, but Jane was far closer to the worst. She literally left a baby out to freeze in a blizzard just to gaslight Kenny and prove her point.
Kenny and Jane were both monsters, but Kenny was a monster who would do anything to protect Clem, and later AJ-even though at some points he pushed Clem away, he probably would've still taken a bullet for her if it came to that.
Jane was a monster ready to leave the little girl and baby to fend for themselves on a moments notice.
Was I happy with season 2 and Kenny's character? No. Not at first. The more I thought about it, though, I really loved what we got, even if I would've preferred something else.
Also, I'm totally on Not My Kenny express. The personality change is believable, of course, but I don't think it's what would've actually happened.
Not to mention it's still possible to side with Kenny in the last confrontation and still say it to his face that hes dangerous, and also leave him later on.
Kenny may be unhinged, maybe too unhinged for safety, but hes still way better than Jane. She has the empathy capacity of a fish and only keeps Clem around because she sees her as a survival tool and an idealized version of her sister. If Clementine wasnt such a badass Jane would have abandoned her like she abandoned everyone else.
@@justastudent1423 Exactly! Honestly, it's absolutely crazy anybody can truly defend Jane. As a character, she was *amazing,* but she was a horrible person who only saw Clem for usefulness and similarities to her sister.
@@StoneBasilisk You call it crazy that people can defend her but if you read most of the comments and their associated chains from a few months ago you'll see a bunch of Jane defenders taking half a page out of Jane's book and turning a peaceful stating of opinion into a stupid argument instead of just letting people *state their goddamn opinions in peace*
@@cogwithnoambition2990 I didn't read many replies to the comments I looked at-were people seriously pulling that crap? I guess it does give a bit of explanation as to why they like/defend such a shit person (who, yes was an amazing character, but was still a shit person).
Honestly, the way the made luke such a good character, a fight between kenny and luke would have been a lot harder than jane and kenny
Whoever chooses Kenny over Jane is a real one.
Fax
PREACH
KingMoe I’m so late but whenever I’ve replayed I always stick with Kenny. he’s a true ride or die
I really like Jane more than Kenny you choose Kenny you get in a car crash you go with Jane you gat a freaking dope TATTOO but I still cried when Clem killed Clem I mean I don’t hate Kenny but he’s not my favorite
Danielle Biddle Clem Killed Clem?
This is no joke, one of my most favorite videos on this platform, it goes so in deep into something seemingly simple and clearly had a lot of focus put into both the writing and editing, and that intro while long, was super good
He fails to take into account the vast majority of outside factors and is obviously biased, its really not all that great a video