**IT'S NOT FAIR!** Buffy the Vampire Slayer S4 Ep 19 "New Moon Rising" Reaction: FIRST TIME WATCHING
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- Опубліковано 17 лис 2024
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I think one thing pretty much every Buffyverse fan can agree on is that both Oz and Tara are perfect people to be in a relationship with. Willow is really lucky that way.
Very well said!
I could totally see Oz and Tara being buds and okay with both being in a relationship with Willow at the same time.
@@MacLeeland If only OT3 were a thing at the time...🧡❤🤍
They’re pretty similar too. The calm and collected characters. Quiet and comforting. Empathetic.
@@migmit What's OMWF?EDIT:Nevermind,I got it.
Don't feel dumb. This was the late 90s, not too different of a culture but it still was different, we were just past the point where talking about it was okay, and people catching on was not overly custom. You and the audience saw it, but Buffy Xander and Giles were more accustom to not see it back then plus side note they have other things going on. Willow's story line really spoke to midwestern people because it made many step back and think "oh, my 76 year old aunt who lives with her 76 year old female roommate might not have been what my parents claimed it was." Afterall this was a show geared toward teenagers.
If I had a friend who has always been straight and now has found new friend, I wouldn't figure out it either that fast. Girls can be really hard to spot when they are just good friends or something more, if they also try to hide the fact. Well the best friends would normally know but as you said here they have so much other things going on as each of the main character has been going through big changes in their lives.
"What, did he go up the mountain and meditate"
Actually, Yes. That is exactly what he did. I laughed so hard when you accidentially predicted that
Riley's "I'm an anarchist!" Made me really root for him.
I'm so glad nobody spoiled you. It's great to see your first time reactions and hear your speculation.
I loved your face when you saw Oz on the screen. I love Seth Green, so I was uber stoked when he came back for this episode. Keep in mind that talking about homosexuality was not as mainstream as it is now, hence the awkward moments. I thought they handled it pretty well for their time. It’s a bittersweet episode but a great one.
I wanted to say the same about homosexuality. My friend was outed in the late ‘90s and it resulted in slashed tires, a cracked skull, busted kneecap, and endless insults and bullying. And this was in a Southern California town, too! Even tolerant, accepting people were not sure how to react when someone came out. This was probably Buffy’s first experience with that.
But they got tv shows that has homosexuality back in the 90s , believe me, I watch alot TV when I was a kid
@@jamalbryant8099 True,but it was always a big deal and risking censorship(at least here in Italy),it wasn't chill at all!!
@@Nicamon Italy even censor mtv real world?
@@jamalbryant8099 I don't know"The Real World"but I've just read on Wikipedia that in Italy only the 12th and the 20th season have aired.
12:02 Most of the "not subtle" scenes were just Willow+Tara, without any other characters present. Also, this was 1999/2000. Non-secret gay relationships were less common. I think it's completely reasonable that the idea just hadn't occurred to Buffy.
22:15 The Buffyverse has several examples of bringing back former characters for just an episode or two (Jenny in 2x22 and 3x10 as evil visions, The Master in 3x9, Faith in 4x15-16). It's great, usually.
I always loved that line between Spike and Adam.
Scouts' honor.
YOU were a boyscout?
Parts of me...
🤣
Both hilarious and terrifying 👌
Your innocence of homophobia and the closet is charming, but the show did show Willow literally hiding Tara’s existence from the Scoobies for a while, & the only one who figured them out on screen was Faith (in Buffy’s body). Even after that scene, and all the on-the-nose magic as sex scenes, I promise much of the 90s audience remained clueless until this episode.
And in Italy this episode was censored when the season came out!The 1st time I could watch it was in the DVDs and I found Willow's coming out scene's SCRIPT online far before I could actually _watch_ the scene!!
We’ve come so far culturally that the fact that willow and Tara were hiding is both surprising and confusing to most of the younger reactors.
@@helenmccarthy2135 That's a great sign.😘
To me, their body language and behavior made it obvious, but you’re right, the context of the times does make difference in both audience and character perceptions
@@Nicamon agreed. Watching it for the first time we didn’t expect to see same sex relationships. And when we did see them the outcome was always negative.
You're perhaps not quite appreciating how unusual it was for a character like Willow to be gay in 2000. It was super rare to see a gay character under 30 on TV and to be fair, people from my generation didn't really tend to come out till their mid-twenties. I went to a high school in the late 90s with 1300 students, statistically there had to be 100-150 gay students but only TWO were actually out. That's the way it was. Buffy's reaction is absolutely on point, even if it is played up a bit for comedy. If your best friend came out to you in 2000, you would probably not know what to say. It's only through representation like this show that my generation was able to learn to accept LGBTQ+ realities. We were absolutely raised to believe that, at the very least, homosexuality was an undesirable abnormality. This is why representation matters kids.
Amazing writing, for them to make us love both Oz and Tara and want both of them with Willow. They're such great characters in different ways.
It was so cute that you just assumed all of Willow’s friends knew that Willow had a crush on Tara.
I also personally think Oz made things worse by making his werewolf trigger be when he gets angry/has high emotions instead of just the very easily predictable… every full moon.
Yeah, but if Oz can learn to control himself when he's in a rage, he could eventually learn to control the wolf and then he could become a werewolf superhero who uses his werewolf powers to fight the supernatural. That's my headcanon, that after this episode Oz wanders the world, like a that monk in Kung Fu, helping people in need as he gains control of his werewolf power.
Yes, I would take the moon curse over the Hulk curse for sure!
@@nickreacts6394 *This!* ☝
It's still the full moon that causes the change. He can just attempt to suppress it during that period which requires being calm and controlled.
In The 90s people never assumed anything between same sex was just friendship unless forced to see it
You wording is a bit confusing. Do you mean we assumed it was just friendship? That is the way it was for me. I never had anything against same sex relationships, I just always defaulted to thinking people were hetero.
@Crystal Fire you are correct I was writing quickly. Yes, the culture (at least where I was) pushed the hero viewpoint so hard, that almost anything could be taken as friendship instead of romantic.
I will say the one thing at the time that would have tipped me off was the fact Willow hides the relationship.
I can not be sure if I would have taken it like that myself because I saw it out of order, so I could be wrong.
@@MadawcSin When I saw"Hush"the 1st time(I was 12)I immediately thought Willow&Tara were in love...which is why I was confused to why they censored"New Moon Rising"in Italy when the 4th season 1st aired. I was like:"We ALREADY KNOW Willow&Tara are in love...and they will keep saying it later...what sense does it make to *only* censor the episode in which Willow specifically tells Buffy???@.@"
For women. Guys were automatically gay if they show the least bit of closeness with their male friends.
Thor's reaction to Oz showing back up may be one of my most favorite reactions. I had to rewind and watch it 3 times!!!
I'm so glad no one spoiled the surprise for you!! This is such a great episode for fans to watch reactors reactions....
Ok, back to the reaction...I want to see if you cry 😢😂
Props to everyone who held back and didn't spoil this incredible reunions for Thor🤣🥰
It's a nice reminder of how much things really have changed in the twentyish years since this aired that someone today wouldn't understand why Willow wouldn't tell people while also being so confused that no one noticed. For people not already connected to the queer community at the time this was filmed.. even if you thought your friends and family would be alright with it, for many it was still a difficult thing to work through and admit even to yourself. Having to sift through all the stigmas and misinformation and lack of information, trying to understand the things you were thinking and feeling in a time before the internet gave you access to communities to help with it, getting through the fears of rejection not just by friends and family but also the potential fallout in other areas of your life. Coming out was a process and depending on where you lived, a hard.. even dangerous.. thing to do. Willow hiding her blossoming relationship with Tara from her friends as she figured out this new part of herself was such familiar thing. And Buffy's reaction in this episode was honestly kind of the ideal one to hope for; Definitely thrown and initially a little freaked out, but then shifting into immediate support. Today in a lot of places this reveal would probably elicit just a shrug, but back then it pretty much always made even well intentioned people look at you a little strange for awhile. As for her friends not noticing. Really not that uncommon. Straight was the assumed default to the point that the possibility someone you knew might not be straight.. just wouldn't even occur. Especially if that person didn't align with the outward stereotypes that people expected a queer person to embody. Lipstick lesbians like Tara or Willow were just not the image a lot of straight people had in their heads back then when they pictured a gay woman.
I love this episode so much even all this time later. Coming out stories eventually became common enough to become cliche as more queer stories got to be told on screen, but this remains one of the most natural ones to me. Remarkable considering all the hoops they had to jump through to be able to make it. Even Tara and Willow's dialogue had to be worded so carefully to appease the network censors, saying what they needed to say in their scenes without actually saying the words too directly. To me they will always be the best pairing on the show.
One of the many reasons why BTVS is such an important and influencial show. I can imagine that this was a huge thing back when the season aired. Paved the way for many other movies and shows.
Yes! You have explained that very well. Someone being gay just never occurred to us. There wasn’t much representation in tv and movies so we just didn’t think of it. It was just around this time that some shows started pushing the boundaries to show that gay people are just people and can be found anywhere.
This was pretty early 2000’s and I watched it live. Back then it wasn’t common to have LGBTQ storylines and Willow and Tara’s relationship was subtle but honestly kind of a surprise to a lot of viewers. I didn’t realize it until this episode but it’s interesting to see more Gen Z’ers watch it and recognize it as it is. Things were a lot different back then for us. This was one of the first same sex relationships ever portrayed on television and it was something Joss had to fight for.
Before buffy had gay characters, dawson's creek, 90210, felicity, Melrose place, mtv the real world , and road rules, had gay characters, I'm surprised nobody mentioned these shows
@@jamalbryant8099 I remember Jack coming out in Dawson's Creek - that was a really big deal. I think that was the first same sex on-screen kiss at the time. I would place reality TV in a different category from scripted television but I definitely remember watching all those shows listed above.
I just remember at that time it wasn't as common or widely accepted as it is today. That's what I was trying to say.
@@JoanneGarcia I think they did accepted it, you remember that show "my so called life"? They had a gay character on there
@@jamalbryant8099 Oh yeah! That show was pretty revolutionary also. Too bad it only got one season.
@@JoanneGarcia ikr
What makes this episode tug at the heartstrings is that everyone involved in the love triangle is a genuinely kind, caring person who just wants what's best. There's no bad guy. That's hard to pull off, especially in the year 2000 when a main cast member entering into a queer relationship and being treated with dignity instead of being played for laughs or dropped immediately was pretty much revolutionary on television. Kudos to Alyson, Amber and Seth for acting their hearts out too.
This episode is one punch in the heart after another.
Nope, the Scoobies don't know about Willow and Tara. They just barely met Tara. More on that later.
I remember having Oz back was closure many of us didn’t even realize we needed.
On a second note I always found it an interesting contrast between Willow and Tara’s relationship versus Buffy and Riley’s relationship at this point. Buffy and Riley have been officially together longer than Willow and Tara, however, Tara states that she KNOWS how much OZ means to Willow. Meaning Willow has deeply opened up about her past relationships, troubles, and pains. But with Buffy and Riley it is only when an event brings up past heartbreak does Buffy somewhat open up about her past to Riley. J
Just an interesting thought to ponder.
> Tara states that she KNOWS how much OZ means to Willow. Meaning Willow has deeply opened up about her past relationships, troubles, and pains.
Faith (in Buffy's body) tells Tara about Oz (and Willoz) in 4x16. In the same episode Tara is shown to be good at reading people ("she was kinda' mean" as evidence that Faith-in-Buffy wasn't Buffy). Tara saw how Willow reacted to Oz's return, plus she saw Oz at Willow's dorm room in the morning. She might add up all the pieces and infer how much Oz means to Willow, without Willow having to say anything.
So many great moments in this episode!!! One of my favorites is the look that Oz & Spike exchange. No words necessary.
Home sick with a bad head cold but guess what? THOR'S GOT BUFFY!! Yayyyy 😊👍 Thanks bro.
Feel better my friend!!
@@nickreacts6394 😘👍
It was a different time! Back then, a lot of people didn't even pick up on the romance between Willow and Tara until this episode or even later. It was just too subtle, and mainstream audiences had very little, if any exposure to same-sex relationships. Nowadays, viewers just expect them to already be out to their friends by this point! The slow speed and subtlety of the relationship seems weird by today's standards.
Someone said that Buffy as the show will give you everything you thought you wanted, but at the worst possible time to make you suffer. I mean imagine feeling conflicted for Oz's return before seeing Tara!
Yesss some Riley hype! 🖤 Idk why, he's not very popular with the Buffyverse fans, but I personally think he's great, so it's nice to see someone analyzing his character arc!
Your reaction to seeing Oz was priceless! ❤
It was such a surprise! Thank you!
Great reaction to Oz's return.
Everything that didn't happen and should have happened in _Wild at Heart,_ finally does happen in Oz's van in the second to the last scene aka them talking.
Willow and Tara weren't a thing until the end of this episode. The way the writers wrote there story before this episode had to be the ambiguous way it was, at the time, otherwise the Network would have ordered it stopped in it's tracks, unfortunately. By the time they realized it had happened there was nothing they could do as it already happened and they didn't realize it.
As bittersweet as this episode was, I 100% agree that it gave us some proper closure that was needed after Wild at Heart
This episode always makes me cry at the end
Thanks for the reaction!
I loved your freakout over Oz's return.
I thought everybody knew about Willow and Tara, and that
Zander was sort of truthful when he told Oz that Willow doesn't have a new 'GUY'.
Did you notice that when Oz approached Tara in school, he started to say 'I thought I SMELLED Willow'.
heeee, I am cackling at your face seeing Oz! We did it! #NoSpoilers
Let's keep doing it for the next 50+ spoiler-worthy moments ;)
For cultural context on Willow's coming out, this episode originally aired only aired 3 year (almost to the day) after the Ellen show coming out episode. The subject was so controversial that they had to give the episode a code word "The Puppy Episode" as a title just so the crew could talk about it.
I always wonder who's telling Tara to "run" ? Is it Oz warning her she needs to flee, or the werewolf wanting to play with the chase ?
@11:49 - It's so interesting that you don't have a clue that THEY don't have a clue! I did gather this from your remarks about Xander "not telling Oz", but this is so the perfect, encapsulating moment - ! At this time, 1999-2000, awareness was growing - thanks to Pedro Zamora, this show, and other things - but still, there wasn't the general awareness of homosexuality that I'm thankful that later generations seem to have. In my high school class of 1992, while we had generally grown beyond stupid bullying by senior year, there were still at least two ostracized students: one I later recognized as a "butch lesbian", and one - very smart, formerly popular and funny dude - as an exposed gay individual. (Calling everyone "darling" accompanied his social fall.) I am so heartened by how normalcized later generations are to the range of orientaion to which people are born; but this show needs to be watched keeping in mind how the american culture was situated coming up to 2000 or so.
I still miss Oz, great guy. Show up anytime sir, you will always be welcome.
By far, the best reaction to this episode!
09:47 There will definitely be singing involved in Angel's future...
This episode - cry me a river. 😭💔
It’s a rough one for sure..
Your reaction to Oz was great. I don't envy Willow having to choose between him and Tara, they're both too sweet.
The thing is that back then, mentalities barely started to open up towards the gay community. A few years before that, most of homosexual relationships in medias where seen as a comedic element, in the best case scenario (like in Friends with Ross ex-wife). And Buffy was one of the earliest to portrayed it as a normal sweet and romantic thing (there was also the movie Brokeback Mountain, and probably a few others I don't know, but still).
So for the Scoobies to not have seen that before Willow told them, it's nothing surprising. We even had a song in french, a few years earlier, about how Tara and Willow's relationship could easily pass as a Friendship, performed by the group Mecano and titled Une Femme Avec Une Femme (A woman with a woman) whom first and second verses started that way :
Deux femmes qui se tiennent la main (Two women holding hands)
Ça n'a rien qui peut gêner la morale (There's nothing shocking to it)
Là où le doute s'installe (But a doubt is growing)
C'est que ce geste se fasse sous la table (when that happens under the table)
[...]
Un amour qui est secret (A secret love)
Même nues elles ne pourraient le cacher (even naked they couldn't hide it)
Alors sous les yeux des autres (So under people's sight)
Dans la rue elles le déguisent en amitié (in the street they dress it up as friendship)
one of the greatest, memorable and funniest things ive ever read about anything ever was someone on the buffy subreddit they commented:
When did y'all realize Riley is just a basic-ass Lab? (Labrador retriever)
something Thor said made me wanna say something but i realized it was a spoiler and im saying this mostly unrelated thing instead
The conversation with Buffy and Willow in their dorm room was Willow’s coming out confession since she didn’t get an entire coming out storyline. Buffy was the very first person (besides Tara, obviously) she told about her and Tara being more than friends and Buffy was taken aback by it. So no. Buffy didn’t know and didn’t have any suspicions about them. Neither did any of the Gang. The only other person to know was Faith but only because she assumed it and took it as true because Tara doesn’t deny it. That’s why she brings up Oz. She knew Tara would be uncomfortable by him being mentioned. Trying to make it out as she was a “for the moment” thing. She’d take Oz back.
I have an interpretation that in ‘Superstar’ Willow and Tara staged a “goodbye” scene while in front of Buffy. Willow was fully intending to go up to Tara’s dorm with her but couldn’t because Buffy was with them. I assume she went back to her when Buffy left so it’s likely they had being sexually intimate then. Even if it was just making out. And given Willow tries to make a move on Tara in the frat house in ‘Where The Wild Things Are’, it’s not too far of a reach to say that she was comfortable or familiar with being physical with her. Everybody’s hormones were on high in that episode so it’s not an illogical conclusion to come to that theirs were too. However, I think the ending scene of this episode was their actual “first time”. I think you’re to understand Tara blowing out the “extra-flamey” candle as Willow and Tara finally acting on their desires and choosing to consummate their sexual relationship. What else could it be with Willow’s line before it: “I’m going to make it up to you starting right now”, Tara asking for clarification: “Right now?” and Willow nodding in the affirmative.
> The only other person to know was Faith but only because she assumed it
I'd say Faith-in-Buffy _inferred_ it: at The Bronze the three sit down, then Willow goes to get drinks and Tara turns her head to look at Willow. Faith notices and asks "So... you two have been hanging out a lot lately, huh?"; I read Faith as _suspecting_ there's some girl-on-girl chemistry. Tara responds, "yeah, she's really cool". I think Tara praising Willow like that is confirmation to Faith. It's only after this that Faith says "So, Willow's not driving stick anymore".
@@jonaskoelker oh yeah, that’s true. Probably right then.
> Superstar [...] staged a "goodbye" [...] likely they had being sexually intimate then.
Good catch on the goodbye being deliberately staged, I like that interpretation.
Several episodes earlier (4x13 with Walsh watching, I think) there's a scene where Buffy returns to their dorm room in the morning with both beds empty, her having spent the night at Riley's. Five seconds later, Willow enters. Where did Willow sleep? Our channel host even called this out: "meaningful pan to an empty bed".
Obvious interpretation: Tara's bed. Other interpretation: her own-she had just gotten up, made the bed and gone down the hallway to the bathroom, then Buffy entered, then Willow came back.
I think Tara's bed. I've never slept in another person's bed with the other person also in the same bed unless I have previously kissed that person. One infers some amount of physical intimacy between Willow and Tara already at this point.
> Tara blowing out the “extra-flamey” candle [= sex]
Oh yes. I'd even say obviously so.
@@jonaskoelker Willow returns with the Dolls Eye crystal in the scene where there was an empty bed. I would interpret that as she’s accepted a romantic/sexual relationship with Tara. So yeah, Tara’s bed.
Plus she does respond to Buffy’s question of “Out all night, huh?” with “You too.” confirming that she was out all night.
@@Girl4Music > [B:] “Out all night, huh?” [W:] “You too.”
I had forgotten that, and not noticed the crystal. I guess that shoots down what I was too polite to call my 'denial explanation'.
Love that your reaction is pretty much Willows reaction: Yeah, i loved this dude, but he left and I have finally made peace with that and even found someone else and now he comes back and _what am i supposed to do here???!!_
It’s a very relatable situation. Especially in the case of forced or arranged relationships.
“I told you guys season 4 was insane…” 😂😳
*SPOILER!!!!*
And wait until he sees"Restless"...😵😵😵😵😵😵😵😵
I'm one of the unicorns whose favorite season is S4.
I can't wait until you start next season, so excited 😃
Back then I thought oz going to join angel crew
Great reaction as always!
Thank you!!
It is pretty rough BEING a main character too, tbf
I think Willow needed closure with Oz to accept a romantic/sexual relationship with Tara. And that’s something I really like about this whole storyline. It’s not so much choosing between a boy or a girl. It’s just choosing between Oz or Tara. She chose Tara. Gender doesn’t come into it and to be perfectly honest - it never really does when it comes to Willow. It’s just the assumption that she is straight. She never actually says she is. Like at any point in the show thus far. So it does throw you off a tad when it’s revealed she’s with Tara and so your reaction would be similar to Buffy’s even though you know more was going on between them than she did. This was when same-sex relationships weren’t as accepted on TV so they had to be so careful with how they went about representing it. I think they handled it really well given the times. As I said - making it about Willow choosing between a person rather than a gender since gender is irrelevant.
in today's world of open relationships, she could have both separately or all together. I have friends in that zone...and it seems to work for them.
@@samsonau8205 I think an open relationship between the three of them would have been interesting. Would it be polygamy though or a three-way relationship? As in would Oz and Tara be romantically/sexually involved as well or would they just share Willow as a partner? Because as far as we know it, Tara only dates and is attracted to women.
The Love Bug 1968, Walking with Dinosaurs The Movie 2013, Looney Tunes Back In Action 2003, Angry Birds 2016, Pixels 2015.
Leave it to Willow to say something crazy LOL they were talking about how monsters and vampires are working together and even giving each other a slap on the butt afterwards. And Willow says like Martin Luther King trying to bring the races together. Which I don't get these comments from her she's highly intelligent and in college
You have to remember that this show came out in the eraly 2000s. having a gay friend wasn't half as normalized as it is now and Buffys reaction is actually fairly good. It is clear that Gayness has never actually entered her Radar, so she is surprised and needs a moment to sort herself out, but it takes her about five minutes to go from confusion to "who cares, this is my friend we're talking about, if she's happy, I'm happy."
That’s right. Her reaction is actually incredibly validating. People, at that time, would have reacted a lot worse to their friend being gay and/or to dating the same-sex as them.
There was a lot of knowledge drop in Season 4 of Buffy.
Remember that one time Willow told Riley how she liked cheese?
But does Buffy wear the cheese? Or does the cheese wear Buffy?
Your reactions are so good! I'm with you. Even to this day, having watched the series a dozen times, at least, I'm still conflicted about whether I want Willow to choose Oz or Tara. I love them both so much!
willow has the best taste in partners. oz is a good guy. and tara is one of my favorite characters in the show. if i were going to settle down with anyone in the buffyverse it would be tara. i feel bad that willow didnt feel she could tell her friends, and that the reaction was so awkward. buffy did not react the way you want your best friend to react. btw, im sorry, but spike is so sexy. i was watching him talking to the gang and i was like dang, i remember why i had such a crush on him when i was younger. yes, past tense. im a mature adult who doesnt crush on fictional vampires. lets go with that. yes.
I agree,leaving out your comment on Spike. In Buffy's defense,she at least immediately made clear she was fine with it after the initial shock.💛She didn't even need a full day(or more!) to process,just a few seconds.Props for that.👍
@@Nicamon I agree, it's a huge thing that happened to Willow and it took Buffy a second to take it in. I don't get why anyone has an issue with her reaction.
But then there was Kennedy…
When's the next angel reaction? Been waiting for that one :) Patreon is a bit expensive I think its at the 20 dollar tier.
3:24 : As long as it's not a "Smelly Cat"...
Rather than being an excuse to give Oz a reason to leave the show, I think the Veruca storyline kind of highlighted the duality of werewolves, which is why it seemed out of character for Oz. Most werewolf lore talks about the person and the wolf being separate, with different instincts. I think Veruca appealed to the wolf, not really to Oz.
Posting my BUFFY REWATCH recap for ‘New Moon Rising’. May contain spoilers.
Well, this is it. This is the big reveal. And it’s finally a narrative that I can work with for writing my meta.
A brief summary: Oz is back. In this episode he learns that his werewolf condition has nothing to do with being based on the lunar cycle but it does have to do with when he gets angry or is subjected to negative energy of any kind. This is especially true surrounding his feelings for Willow. Oh, but that’s not the BIG ISSUE of this episode. No. The BIG ISSUE is Willow now has someone else. She has Tara and she’s falling deeper and deeper in love with her every day. And uh oh,... here is her first real love driving back into her life asking for her back, a lost love that she has mourned for the first half of the season, a love she still feels something for even now despite being in a relationship with Tara...
What the bloody hell does she do?
THUS, CONFLICT. ANGST. DRAMA. AND GOD DAMN GOOD FUCKING ACTING PERFORMANCES ENSUES. THIS EPISODE IS INCREDIBLE!
I have chosen to quote the confession scene between Buffy and Willow just because it sums up the entire story the best - and it shows you how Buffy reacts which is incredibly important for the validation of both Willow’s acceptance of her sexuality and acceptance of the relationship she has with Tara now that Oz is back in the picture. The conclusion to this episode is a double self-affirmation for Willow, and for anyone watching that has her as their self-insert character and that relates to and resonates with her difficult situation in this episode:
“I have chosen to be with a woman I have feelings for.”
AND
“I have chosen to be with a woman I have feelings for even when a man wants me. A man I have previously loved and still have feelings for.”
Yes, there’s the added complication that Oz still wolfs out and particularly while around Willow - but they’ve dealt with that before, they could deal with it again.
No, Willow has made an INFORMED CHOICE. She CHOSE Tara over Oz.
Oz: “But you’re happy *being with Tara*?”
Willow: “I am.”
This is incredibly important validation not just for closeted lesbians - but also for private WLW couples who constantly have men coming in and out of their life that they’re being assigned to or suited with by the company they keep. That they may have even been in a relationship with previously - either by their own free will or by force/pere-pressure from their family, friends and community. This episode is HUGE validation for that AUDIENCE specifically and solely. Respect!
Does anyone else think Oz’s reaction to finding out Willow and Tara are involved in ‘New Moon Rising’ is a little extreme? Like he straight up turns into a werewolf and tries to attack Tara based on that information alone. I’d like to say that he’d react like that even if it wasn’t Tara or if it was another male - Xander or some other dude - but I don’t know. It was a pretty blatant “oh my god, Willow is in love with a girl?!” reaction to me. Of course there were better ways of him finding out. Like Willow telling him the night before when she talked with him all night… but I feel like he would have reacted the very same anyway.
It was just,.. a bit much. Especially for Oz. Borderline violent masculinity behaviour from him there at the thought that Willow could possibly be dating Tara.
All for the shock factor I suppose. 🤷♀️ And I can’t really decide whether that “Run” was a warning or a threat.
Of course he would have reacted like that if it was a male. He was in shock because Willow didn't tell him she had a new partner,not because that partner was a girl!
That said,I've always wondered if knowing she had a new partner would have triggered the wolf regardless of _how_ the new had reached Oz.
@@Nicamon I don’t know. It didn’t come across that way to me. It seemed to bother him more so that it was Tara.
@@Girl4Music I *never* thought that for a *second.* And I still don't.🧡
(I could expect that kind of attitude/reaction from _Xander_ but not from Oz.)
@@Nicamon that’s why I said it feels extreme that he would just react so violently to Tara like that
@@Girl4Music As a guy who was the age that these character played when this aired, I didn't think it was because Tara was girl but because it was such a shock to him as he had already seen them together and saw Tara coming to Willow in the morning. Maybe the surprise that Willow is bi added to the shock, as they have had long history together. But mostly it's just him realizing that he has lost Willow.
I mean if I would have found my ex is dating a girl I wouldn't be more aggressive, on the contrary. I mean if the situation would have played like it played in this episode. I would get why I wasn't told immediately about the girl, but if that same thing would have happened with some man, then it would have pissed me up. Not that I'm advocating for violence, but tried to give perspective.
16:48 i wonder if Riley did this knowing something cause otherwise you can't explain the change in his behaviour later🤔
“Riley, the perfect boyfriend” 🤢
If your "straight" friend had a new same sex friend and you assume they're fucking,. that's on you. Even if they are.
Even if the new friend is a viable sex partner, it's a crass assumption.
Remember: Willow kept Tara "to herself" for MOST of the season. All of the cues WE have seen have NOT been seen by Willow's friends.
Also remember, this was 20 years ago. LGBTQ representation was not mainstream. Whedon had to fight every step to get it done. That wasn't because corporations are evil (I mean, they are, but it's just not the reason) It is because the culture was not ready.
Some may argue that the pendulum has swung a bit too far with the identity politics obsession and box ticking exercises we see these days, but telling these stories and including these identities remains essential.
And it is beautifully done here.
Buffys reaction was so natural. Surprised, bit uncertain, but taking a second she realized that it truly doesn't change anything. Willow is still the same person :)
I like Tara and Oz both way more than I like Willow. I vote let Oz stay, and let Willow move out of town. Tara doesn’t need to date a Scooby to be one of them. (Love her!! 💛)
you said that you wouldnt be surprised if they expirimented on riley because he didnt follow orders, but you forget they were drugging the soldiers without their knowledge, expirimenting on them already. i know riley is supposed to be a good guy but i just dont like him. he says some really awful things, and he keeps doing that over and over. and hes just...i dunno. bland. and yeah, really regimented. i just cant with him.
Oz is the best it's too bad the actor moved on.
I still feel you should switch to 2 episodes at a time. It's going to take years to finish this
Willoz were so cute and yet not clicking from the beginning 😢But this episode was so bitter to watch, something was still incomplete
I disagree. I feel they couldn't get a better closure than this.
I don't know how to explain, but I got the idea Oz was never fully there with Willow
Willow on the other hand was never completely understanding about his werewolf nature. I mean yes she is sensitive and kind but mmh idk
Surely this no drama closure is better than darker scenarios😅
@@trix_429 I mean...Oz can't completely understand his werewolf nature either...I think we can cut Willow some slack.😉❤
Oz > Tara
For me Oz = Tara.🧡🤍
SPOILER
Technically...Tara is _a little bit better_ because she never cheated on Willow or did anything to harm her in general(except that *1* spell in"Family"and she wasn't thinking with a clear mind in that occasion..she didn't predict the consequences). She was practically a saint.
@@Nicamon To me, Tara's just dull. Oz could at least come up with some funny one-liners.
Technically Oz didn't choose to cheat on Willow as it was just the wolf urges going on at the time, but the same can't be said for Willow making out with Xander more than once so she cheated on Oz!
@@The-Underbaker "Technically Oz didn't choose to cheat on Willow as it was just the wolf urges going on at the time, but the same can't be said for Willow making out with Xander more than once so she cheated on Oz!"Very true,but we were comparing Oz to Tara,not Oz to Willow and,even if it wasn't his fault,Oz still _did_ cheat on Willow and made her suffer and while it's true that he couldn't control himself as a werewolf(Veruca raped him the 1st time)he COULD have talked to Giles and/or Buffy to prevent them from locking him in the same cage with Veruca when he found out she was the other werewolf!!🤦♂He's at least _partially_ responsable for the mess.
@@Nicamon My apologies for the delayed reply. While you're correct in saying that Oz could've told the gang about Veruca and what was going on, but on the other hand...
- - - SPOILER - - -
Tara could've also done the same about potentially being part demon too. I would say that Oz "cheating" is a lesser issue than putting everyone else in danger where they could potentially have been killed due to Tara's spell!
@@The-Underbaker SPOILER
That's true,but I'm 100% sure that Tara didn't think about that. I mean... *_I_* didn't think about the fact that making _her_ demon part invisible would have made ALL the demons invisible! I'm sure she believed the spell would have only worked on herself and since she didn't percieve her own power as evil,I'm also sure she believed she wasn't going to harm them,even after turning 20. She was just trying to protect herself from the prejudice. Like...think it as if she had just discovered to be HIV-positive...she knew she wouldn't be a threat to them just for being positive,but,because of the social stigma,her friends could have still chosen to abandon her...but if she could _hide_ the fact of being positive they would have still been her friends without fear. That's what was going on in her head. She BELIEVED she could hide without causing any harm. Oz *knew* that,sooner or later,the Veruca thing would have caused troubles to Willow,one way or another. He was far more careless,giving the amount of informations both him and Tara had on their respective situations.
Season 4 was crap and left me cold.
I disagree.
Poor guy, I feel bad for you.
Man travels around the world, learning secret techniques from Romanian wizards and mystics, and Thor's like "It's that easy?" That's an epic quest Oz went on!
Good point, I probably wasn’t appreciating the effort/ journey Oz went on. But if I were Oz, after the events of this episode, I’d be asking to speak to a Romanian manager
@@nickreacts6394 😂