Do Water Pans Improve Barbecue? A Scientific Analysis
Вставка
- Опубліковано 16 кві 2020
- Order your leather apron here: madscientistbbq.com
More Mad Scientist BBQ:
Instagram: / madscientistbbq
Twitter: / madscientistbbq
FABRIC GLOVE LINERS: amzn.to/2vJ0t3s
Thermoworks:
Infrared thermometer: www.thermoworks.com/IR-Pro-75...
Thermapen: www.thermoworks.com/Thermapen...
Motion Graphics/Animation provided by Kaitlyn Kirk Design
kkirk.me
email: jeremy@madscientistbbq.com - Навчання та стиль
Please don’t take this the wrong way as I have watched all your content and am a fan. I do appreciate this video but as a fellow technical-minded BBQ cook (M. Eng) I have a few reservations. Your statements about the efficiency of a fire being affected by the presence of the water pan are erroneous. The efficiency of a wood-burning fire is not affected by anything in the cook chamber. The efficiency of a fire depends on sufficient oxygen being available for combustion. We all have to do the same dance in fiddling with the vents of our cookers to get a proper fire going and maintained. If you choke off the airflow the fire burns rich and you get the dreaded thick white smoke. Not efficient at all.
But c’mon, who are we fooling? We didn’t get into smoking thinking about efficiency and cooker heat rates. The overall heat efficiency of a smoker like an offset stickburner is really terrible. I would estimate under 15% at best. My Yoder Wichita weighs in at 660 pounds or so, and when I’m smoking ribs for instance the bulk of that weight has to be brought up to temperature and maintained. What’s 25 pounds of ribs compared to that? Almost statistical noise. It would be very difficult to determine the heat loss of an offset smoker through the combustion airflow, plus convection and radiation effects. A hilariously small portion of the wood’s heat energy actually goes into the meat. And be honest, how many people moderate their temps by leaving the firebox door open? That throws away what, 30% of your heat energy? Thanx Yoder (the company in Kansas, not the Jeremy in Cali😎).
I am dubious that a water pan significantly affects overall cooker efficiency. A water pans acts as a heat sink that absorbs or releases heat energy depending on changes to the air/gas temp inside the cook chamber. Most of the time you’re evaporating water yes, but in times of wind gusts, precipitation or opening the door, the water pan would release heat back into the ambient environment and prevent the need to ‘fire harder’ to make up for those temp swings. That’s an efficiency savings. That’s also pretty hard to quantify.
You correctly noted the amount of water present in wood as moisture, plus the effects of combustion in producing more. However, there is another potential source and that’s the meat itself. In one of your commercial brisket cooks with 25 briskets or so, you get an amount of water coming off the meat during the stall when the beef effectively ‘sweats’ out a portion of its weight. Just to make the math simple, say 25 briskets at 20 pounds each, and they all lose 1/4 of their weight during the stall. That’s 125 pounds of water in theory that you’re cooking out. How many water pans would that be?
Lastly, I am not sure what you were getting at with your Gaussian diagram. At a steady-state, the cooker will have mostly consistent zones of temperature. We all have to move our meat around inside from time to time to take advantage of warmer or cooler spots. But what are you attempting to visualize? The spread of temps around a mean inside a finite volume of smoke? That doesn’t seem very useful at all.
If you’re talking overall spread of temps from the firebox to the smokestack, it would be a strange situation if you were burning a fire and you were getting temps inside the cooker mostly too low to affect the meat at all. This is an elementary issue for the BBQ cook; just get a bigger fire going. If this is what you meant I guess you have a point, but it doesn’t seem consistent with your message in this video.
I do agree with the use of a water pan. For small cooks like a couple rib racks it makes more of a difference than a giant commercial cook of briskets, but it’s a heat-sink backstop that makes the cook’s control of the smoker easier. Liquid water will leech heat energy out of the smoke to vaporize molecules yes, but it’s a tiny amount of leeching due to the slow process over the hours of a cook. Shouldn’t bother anyone. It is to our advantage that we have to fire harder to make up for the water pan as it allow additional airflow and less chance of choking the fire off. Cheers all!
Soft-Top Convertible Metalhead
No worries, I’m not offended. It’s clear you have thought about the topic, so I want to engage meaningfully with the points you bring up.
1) As for the efficiency of the fire being unaffected by the presence of water in the cook chamber or the lack thereof, I have to disagree. The term efficiency there isn’t in relation to the amount of energy released from the fire, but it refers to the amount of energy that is absorbed by things other than the meat you are trying to cook. The water must first absorb energy to increase its temp to around 373K. Also, the enthalpy of vaporization requires quite a bit of energy. Presumably, this heat energy would not be efficiently transferred to the meat, because the entirety of the cook chamber would be above the boiling point of water. Thus the water wouldn’t condense on the meat, releasing the enthalpy of vaporization. It could obviously transfer the energy absorbed as the temp of water vapor increases beyond its boiling point, but the energy absorbed by the water molecules to increase in temperature before vaporizing and the energy absorbed in the process of vaporization would be lost (leaving with the water that exists through the stack).
2) You’re right, the goal of BBQ isn’t efficiency but we would like to make it as efficient as possible, otherwise we’re throwing away money. There is a significant financial cost involved when you drastically increase wood use. This is especially true when cooking on large smokers. As the price of a cord of wood in southern California sits around $450-600 per cord, this isn’t a trivial matter. In addition you mention that offset smokers are inefficient. Quite right, but inefficiency isn’t the goal. If it were, people would be building the thinnest smokers possible, trying to lose as much heat to the environment as they could. Finally, the energy required to bring the metal up to temperature is not going to be affected by the presence or absence of water pans. That must take place for any cook. You must also consider that the specific heat capacity of steel is much, much lower than that of water, meaning the energy required to raise its temperature is much less than for a substance like water.
3) Water would only be releasing energy back into the cook chamber if the temperature of the cook chamber has dropped below 212F. If this happens, there are serious problems with the cook that cannot be solved by the presence of water pans. I would concede, however, that the presence of a large volume of water at its boiling point can’t mitigate the problem, but I wouldn’t rely on it to keep a cook moving forward. It would only slow the reversal of the process. This is valuable only if you have made a significant mistake while cooking (e.g. falling asleep by mistake).
4) You are correct about the meat also releasing a large quantity of water during the cook. If you have ever cooked a handful of briskets in a large smoker, you know that they are always inferior to the results you achieve when cooking a full loaded smoker. I think this is largely due to the increased moisture from the evaporative cooling of the meat inside. In my smoker 25 briskets would probably sweat off the equivalent 6 water pans throughout the course of the cook. In those situations I use 2 water pans at most, because there is so much moisture in the cook chamber that water pans don’t make as much of a difference. At that point water pans are in the smoker to moderate the temperatures coming out of the firebox.
5) The graph was meant to visualize the increased risk of burning associated with higher temperature. While the average energy of the higher temperature air might be 10% higher, the portion of the gaseous molecules that could potentially burn the meat would increase significantly more than 10%. You might be 5 times as likely to burn something at 300F than you are 250F. The point of the water pan would be simply to moderate periods of high temperature that results from building a fire that is a little too big. This spares the pit master from trying to moderate temperature by cutting off air supply and producing “dirty” smoke. Also, I think you misunderstood what the graphs represent. The peak of each curve represents the temperature, that is, the average kinetic energy of the particles of a substance. At higher temperatures, the curve flattens and there is a greater distribution of energies at the extremes. It is the portion of very high energy gases present at higher temperatures that the water pans are used to moderate.
6) Finally, you mention that the amount of heat absorbed by the water is small. While that is true in a sense, representing only about 4% of the heat produced through combustion, the overall amount of heat absorbed is significant. This is especially true when you consider that the smoker is inefficient by nature. I know that the water must have absorbed the amount of energy calculated, because it all evaporates away. So, of the energy required to complete a cook, i would estimate that the water pans use somewhere between 10-15% more energy than would otherwise be required. I have tested this by weighing the amount of wood used to hold the smoker at a consistent temp for 4 hours with and without water pans. I found that the water pans increased the weight of wood used during that period by 14.7%. This is also true of the amount of wood required to run a smoker while empty vs. running it while packed full of meat. I would estimate that I use approximately double the amount of wood to cook 25 briskets when compared to running an empty smoker for the same amount of time. I would agree that there are many benefits to burning more wood, I just don’t believe it is trivial to consider how much additional cost one can incur by heating a large volume of water in the smoker. Thanks for your comment. I really appreciate you taking the time to think about the issues. I have to disagree with you of course, but hopefully we both gain more knowledge to improve our bbq skills. If there is something I missed or muffed, let me know.
@@MadScientistBBQ Ok, I have read both of your comments and I find it hilarious both of you went through all of that to disagree on so many variables; yet in the end, still promote using a water pan! Although I may disagree with many of the things both of you said. I think the key thing to take away from this is, there is an infinite number of variables to cooking great BBQ. All of which can be extremely difficult to control. This is a pitmaster's passion and his pain, yet it is what makes great BBQ. Lastly, $400-$600 for a cord of wood is absolutely bat-shit crazy! I can get top quality Oak here in TX for under$200. At this point, it is cheaper to buy it here and fly it back. Always enjoy your videos. The offer to come to my BBQ Trailer just outside Austin now extends to the both of you. I want to watch this argument in person lol
lol..
Fun watching you two Einstein's banter back and forth....lol.....but hay, I still say I want to see the Gateway drum go up against the Offset.....
@@MadScientistBBQ First off - this is the most engagement I've ever had with a UA-camr and as you can tell, the subject matter is right up my alley. :) Thanx for being cool about this.
We're actually closer in alignment than you realize - I think we're getting tripped up by semantics. You say efficiency of a fire, I say overall cooker efficiency; we are talking about the same thing. Putting chemical energy in the wood into the meat. I'm not digging out my old Thermodynamics textbook; I'll trust what you've said about the enthalpy business. I hope no one mentions stoichiometric combustion!
I'm still unsure about your Gaussian graphs, but I won't belabor the point. I just don't understand why the std dev. figure is larger with a higher mean temp. Does that come from experimental data? It's been 23 years since statistical classes and I'm having bad flashbacks. ;)
One thing I belatedly understood - you're coming at this from a commercial perspective where your desired fuel source is very expensive. That explains your position and mine as well; I have a friend who runs a local tree service company and I can get wood from him in exchange for smoked meat credits. So I never really have to put up cash for wood and don't think about it too much.
You information about the additional wood energy 'cost' of the water pans is interesting. You have the advantage over most of us as you've had some much experience with large cooks and can try different methods. That's why I subscribe. That additional cost is larger than I expected, but again, my perspective is much different. I use a smaller water pan, sort of a cheap dollar-store dog bowl shaped pan.
So, let me finish up with this - which might be a future video suggestion for MadScientistBBQ. In my Yoder Wichita Loaded I do something I have never seen anyone else do. At least on UA-cam and I've looked at all the big channels. I have placed a series of firebricks inside the firebox to contain a small fire. In my experience I find that I burning smaller splits in a smaller fire surrounded on three sides by firebricks works very well and I hardly have to do anything for fire management. I do use the tuner plate and do not count on any radiation effects from the burning wood. Just from the air/smoke flow.
Since you have taken the time and effort to determine % cost in fuel based on water pans, I wonder if you could determine % savings in fuel by using firebricks to keep the fire hotter and the heat energy more contained? Fire bricks are quite cheap and easy to come by and they're in a few different shapes. Something to think about. Cheers.
@@karatevideosandmore7685 I brought that up, sort of. Most of the argument is immaterial to the vast majority of viewers, who use relatively small cookers fired by charcoal; with a small amount of smoke-wood for additional flavor. I do usually use a water pan on longer cooks, at higher temps, or for fairly lean meats. Even if it isn't strictly necessary, I can't think of anything that was ever hurt by it.
Coming in a year later on this video, but love the time you took to analyze this. I've only recently started watching your videos within the last month, but you are now my go to bar-b-que guru. You put not only a lot of thought, time and effort into the art of BBQ, but you also show a lot of love and passion. I'm young and new to the world of smoking (received a WSM for my birthday this past December), but I plan to come to your channel a lot this spring and summer. Thanks again for all you do.
"Yes" was also a perfectly acceptable answer.
Indeed. But I love science and loved the explanation.
'Yes' is a perfectly acceptable answer like 'select' is a perfectly acceptable grade of meat.
Habitt5253 lies
@@Schedule1ne315 precisely.
Hahahaha
After all the explanations. I was like.. what was the question again lol
This is a very good video, I was thinking about this subject literally the other day. Thanks for taking the time to do this . This is why I love the bbq community a lot of help and love other pit masters show others that want to learn.
Man I'm so happy that there's someone like you in BBQ. I love learning this kind of stuff.
Love the in-depth geeking out on Q.
12:50, you're welcome. Bummed you didn't talk about entropy and enthalpy :)
Thank you! After a minute, I figured the answer would be in the comments.
thank you
Thanks!!
MVP
I owe you a 🍺
I’ve followed this channel for a few months now, but THIS is the coolest video I have seen! LOVE the empirical data and the simple explanations to go along with it! (Also a sucker for graphs)
I am relatively new to "smoking" Charcoal Grilling for decades, my first smoker. This does make a lot of guess work go bye bye, the higher the heat, will demand more water but not for the actual smoking process prevention of burning what you are cooking. So my rule of thumb 275 degrees and below water spray, above that use a pan.
Great video Jeremy! I have really been getting behind the science of why we do a lot of things in life, and with smoking being my passion, this was right up my alley!! Thanks again
Awesome! Love that you’re getting back to the Mad Scientist basics!! 👍🏼
Great job mad scientist. I really like the idea of an in depth explanation as to why cooks are so different and the thoughts behind different ways of cooking. I’ll keep watching if you keep them coming.
I have an offset smoker and I use a water pan when I’m going to have long cooks and I’ve found it’s not needed for shorter cooks. I recently removed my baffle plate and found that the best place for the water pan is all the way back right in my smoker. The one or two times that I have forgotten it or it ran out of water, I could tell a difference in the outside of the meat I was smoking. Great video and a lot of technical information for us to absorb.
I've never related barbeque to chemistry before, but you've opened my eyes to it. Great video!
Mad Scientist BBQ: Math (and Science)!
My Brain: *_AOL Sign On/Dial up sound effect_*
Great video. Just showed up in my feed. I feel like youtube should have recommended this to me sooner.. I watch pretty regularly. Love your work!!
Great video Jeremy, love the science behind it. That was very interesting. Keep those great videos coming. Need one now on different types of wood.
As a dad who has a busy schedule and desire for bbq.... I set wood on fire, keep thin smoke, when the meat looks edible.... we eat it. Works for our family! 🍻
Finally! 4 years of college chemistry means something to me!! Thank you!!
Great stuff. Keep it up! This was unexpected from a search about bbq, and I loved it.
awesome explanation.. i use the smaller off set smokers in my business (Smoking Shells BBQ and Catering)..spritzing is alot less needed and still get amazing bark ..but still have fire management and seeing what your protein is doing..again awesome explanation
Just an addition as I don’t think it was mentioned, the percentages of added moisture from the water pans are only when pans that *evaporate entirely* before foiling the meat. If half your water pan remains when you wrap, the moisture % you’ve added to the cook is half the number calculated in the video.
That would not apply to a butcher paper wrap to the same extent I would imagine.
Nice video Jeremy, thanks! One other reason for using a water pan is of course as a temperature buffer. Yes, there's a certain cost to heating up the water in the first place, but once it is up to temp, it will help stabilize temps in the smoker a bit. Whether that is noticable or not depends of course on the construction of the offset smoker (thickness of steel et.c.), as well a size. Either way I'm with you, I think using a water pan in an offset is a necessity. Have a great weekend!
Very informative, I'm glad to see why this works. I grew up using this method so I knew it worked but now I know why. Thank you for taking the time to do this. I just subscribed!
very valid info Jeremy...thanks brother...lots of folks don't know it to this depth
I'm totally forwarding this video to Alton Brown. Special episode of Good Eats featuring you, would be epic.
Dave Witt
Haha that would be awesome! That guy is a boss. I doubt he reads what people send him though
Mad Scientist BBQ he actually does. He’s replied to me multiple times. He’s very “fan friendly”, much like yourself.
Dave Witt Wow that’s cool! It would be awesome if he is actually interested in featuring a bbq science episode in his show.
I actually looked at this yesterday with my new pellet smoker. I always used a water pan in my Weber kettle to help maintain a constant temperature, swore by it. Being a new smoker to the collection and never having a pellet smoker before, I wanted to look at the temperature differential across the pit (a GMG Jim Bowie). It has a temp probe at one end to control the unit. I placed a water pan at the other end of the unit along with a second ambient temperature probe. Before the water pan, I had even temperatures across the pit running at 225. After adding water, that side of the pit dropped to 180 and pretty much stayed there. Sure it was a steady temperature but came at the cost of a huge temperature gradient across the pit. After a few hours, I pulled the pan and I went back to even temperatures across the whole pit, a steady 225. Even after kicking it up to 240, I was even across the pit. I have the temperature graph to back it up and in my mind, the water pan created more problems than it solved. You can clearly see when the water pan was added and then removed.
I think the controllers on a pellet grill (at least a PID controlled one) are doing the work of maintaining temperature and less of a the need of a heat sink of a water pan. Maybe I could try putting the water pan directly over the fire chamber in the center, but at this point, the space it would take up does not offset the benefit.
Yes, I know, using a pellet grill certainly takes a lot of the art out of mastering a fire, but sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do.
Just got my first pellet grill (Traeger) and this is exactly what I needed to read.
Try filling your water pan with sand instead of water. same result, with no temperature swings.
I've never tried it but a practice some people swear by is to evenly space raw biscuits across your entire cooking surface. This will tell you exactly where your hot spots are as they cook. Plus, you have a bunch of biscuits to eat as a bonus!
@@michaelcoughlin8238 I did that when I got the grill and helped me position my heat deflector better. It was pretty even across when I was done, that is why I was so shocked with the water pan results.
Loved the breakdown you made it easy to understand. Thank you 🙏🏻 please move videos like this.
Brilliant! That made a lot of sense, never would have thought about BBQ this way but it really helps conceptualize what is happening in the chamber. Thanks!
For me I like all the technical theory, however I’ve noticed that when I use a water pan in my smoker it causes me to cook longer in order to achieve the color and bark I’m looking for. I also power cook my briskets in roughly 4 hours or so and then rest in a cooler. Pork butts are my longest cook but it’s only exposed for 3 hours or so to smoke. In these cases for the average everyday backyard cook, does a water pan make that big a difference? IMO no. Low and slow doesn’t need one IMO either as things don’t tend to dry out as bad at low temps. If you’re mopping your meat as I do especially with a butter base then things are good as well. Also if you inject your adding moisture. High heat cooks I could see using a water pan but I don’t feel as if it’s necessary. Spritz, Mop and Wrap and you’ll be just fine. IMO
The question I've been trying to answer is how does this change for a pellet smoker/grill which is essentially just a convection oven. The air is moving through quicker and the air from the outside is being pumped into it quickly and never goes across a moisture producing firebox first.
put a small water pan next to the auger - it will work just fine
@@unclealzbbq2185 you genius
Love your videos, I love to bbq but your videos are very informative I've learned a lot from you thanks for the amazing content you put out keep em coming!
Thanks for sharing with us Jeremy.
From one chemist to another, that was a great analysis. You had me worried for a minute, but then came through with the water of combustion! I suspect that pellet grill users will get less benefit of stored water. The guy saying residual water in the metal 😂 My daughter’s HS chem teacher told her class that clouds are steam😡 Love your channel. Say Hi to Randy if you see him.
Bruce Hansel
Hi thanks! Yeah I believe that pellet grill users don’t get much smoke flavor because pyrolysis liberates gases too quickly to get efficient secondary combustion. I’ll be exploring that further in a wood science video.
My kids had an elementary teacher tell them tornadoes came out of the ground. Sometimes I fear for future generations.
RE: Pellet Grills - I use low profile disposable (aluminum) brownie pans between the grill grate and the drip tray. The taller style of pan do not fit. I usually position them over the hottest part of my pellet grill (usually opposite of pellet hopper). Plus this helps to catch the drippings, which helps with keeping your pellet grill clean (especially important when smoking a large brisket). This works pretty well. I usually have to fill the pan(s) twice when cooking a brisket.
Me: how do I barbecue??
JEREMY: watch this video it’s super easy to understand. May the force be with you
Pop quiz tomorrow.
Very good explanation, thanks for breaking it down and even offering tutoring help. 👍
Great explanation! Thanks for the breakdown!
What about water trays in a pellet smoker? The pellets are obviously compressed and probably don't have the same amount of moisture as regular wood. Also pellet grills burn way more efficiently. Completely different variables, so I imagine you would come to a completely different result. But I also know that you prefer stick burners, so this video makes more sense. Thanks for the info! Keep up the great work! Love your vids.
11:00 flatten the curve! Lol!
You answered alot of my questions here. Thanks bud!
Thanks for this. Its nice to have the science to back up (or negate) my opinions on what "works" and why when using my smokers. Very well executed.
I went to the last 2 minutes to get the answer, and I’m so glad I did. Appreciate the vid and the passion tho.
me too...LOL
Yup. A simple yes or no will do.
Science! I prefer running a waterpan knowing it added moisture and absorbed that extra energy ( helping regulate temp) but you did a great job breaking down the whole thing- even this non science guy can understand better.
Jeremy is the best. I always learn something watching these videos.
The offer of remote tutoring for people's kids is the next level.
Hats off bro
Incredible Video ! Thank you so much for sharing your Fabulous Knowledge!
I hate math, but I love BBQ. Best part of this video is Jeremy's "lab coat" for this chemistry lesson. 😎
If my daughter was still school aged,, I’d talk to you about tutoring her ASAP, but she’s 30 now.
I believe he will still do it 😂;)
I mean, you could marry your daughter off to him and get delicious bbq delivered every week.
@@richardnguyen1520 I’m pretty sure he’s already married with a small child. Besides, I’m pretty good on my off set smoker.
Glad someone like you provide a great video to show the science in the burning chamber, it helps me a lot! Appreciate. From a rookie pit boy in China.
I love your videos man. Your information has helped me get better at making brisket, ribs, and pulled pork. Keep them coming man much love for your passion✊
I just wanted to smoke some chicken wings and I ended up with a headache.. lmao! Great video but honestly my math level is not this high neither is my bbq 😬 I’ll just microwave some hot pockets and call it a day 👍🏼
Math is "hard" 5 out of 2 pit masters agree. :D We need a science of BBQ by Randy!
H2Oskiaddict
😂😂
That would be rockin' lol!
Great indepth and well explained video.
Thank you. This was helpful. As usual, I enjoyed your video
So my brain started hurting halfway through. Can someone please tell me should I use a water pan or not??
Pellet grill possibly. ,,BGE NO...stick burner if you want to.
Yes use a pan lol.
Yes use a water pan. It acts as a heat sink so makes it easier to control temp in a kettle grill like a weber.
# 2: Not only does it help keep your meat moist, but moist meat absorbs smoke better. Win/Win
Old Gyrene I got a stick burner(offset)
Do you spritz/spray OR wrap?
If you do any of these 3- no.
Great informative video. Keep this stuff coming plz, sir.
I figured out the hard way why the water pan is a key component in my vertical smoker. I know now the water pan acts as insurance against a fire that got to hot. Helps maintain the low and slow cook mantra. Knowing the science behind it all just made me the Cliff Clavin around the BBQ this summer. Thanks for the video.
Now I am thoroughly confused. But when I use a water pan in my smoker, the temps seem to be more stable. So, I will continue to use a water pan in the smoker.
Without the water pan temps will spike higher, where as with water those hotter molecules get absorb so temps is lower more stable.
You're both gay
@@Drip5167 can you breathe in that closet?
@@sephkurai LMFAO
@@Drip5167 +1 good sport
Never once have I noticed a difference between with or without a water pan. No matter what was cooked.
Thank you very much for the video and the work put into it. I really appreciate the scientific explanation as I always approach any cook scientifically to increase consistency in the end results every time, rather than do this and that happens by feel or smell or touch.
The best part of this kind of approach is that it helps without depending on a particular set up. We all get something relevant upon which we can improve our own cooks. Thanks again, and I am waiting for more of this kind:).
Edit: I would love to see an explanation on how moisture in the cook chamber changes the cooking process.I have a general idea but would love an in depth analysis.
I built a reverse flow offset smoker and definately need the water pans mostly for a barrier between the food and the directly heated floor that the pans sit on. Im always looking for better ways to design my next one. Thanks for your knowledge on smoking and smokers.
Great video mate. Keep up the great work.
Another couple things, moist air will cook faster than dry air because it’s able to transfer the heat to the meat much better, meaning more of it gets used up by cooking and you lose less of it out the chimney.
And I use a Weber kettle with the snake method for smoking, so it has thin walls and it’s quite small so it’s really susceptible to temperature changes as the cook goes on. I’ve found that without a water pan the temperature goes crazy, and it’s much easier to smoke with a water pan. This is because the water pan acts as a heat buffer, so if there’s a flare up in the smoker the water will absorb some of that heat and help control the temperature. If the coals start to burn out the water pan keeps heat inside the kettle. Controlling temp flare ups is the biggest difference I’ve found, and it doesn’t make as much of a difference for controlling dipping temps, but it definitely makes it easier overall.
I enjoyed the video sir! Liked the info and data. 👍🏻
Just watched this video very nice of you to offer help to kids needing help in supjects
Wow, I wish I could understand most of what you guys said? We need the discussion quick and explained to Backyard BBQrs, like us.
I enjoyed the detail and the science behind this issue, thanks for the vid.
That was great stuff J!!! I have never used a water pan in my BBQ but your scientific analysis has changed my mind & I will give er a go mate! 💥👊🤓 Keep the content coming brutha ✔💯 Much Luv from SoCal neighbor 🌞
Great video, I was just trying to figure this out yesterday.
Thanks for the video, much appreciated. I'm not sure I agree completely with your information regarding fire (10+ years experience as an arson investigator, I know a little about fire) but I'm not going to go into that right now. To me, the most important thing about your video is to get people thinking about more than just the meat. I am a huge proponent in getting the theory before practical experience. I've never really thought much about the humidity level inside the smoker and whether that would have an effect on the finished product. I will most definitely be using a water pan for my next brisket to try it out. I appreciate the information you have given regarding selection of the proper meats, rubs (I am going to develop my own for my next brisket), materials and methods behind construction of the smoker, rest times, etc. One thing I can't argue with is your methods produce a quality product!! I enjoy your videos, very informative!!
Love your stuff man. I'm a stick burner myself on a reverse flow pit. Mostly burn mesquite since I live in south Texas. I use a water pan myself and it seems to help. I also spray my bbq with apple juice and sometimes pineapple juice depending on what I'm cooking. Keep it up with the awesome videos!
Great video! We need more videos like this one
Man I was glad you talked about complete vs incomplete combustion 🙂.
Another noteworthy benefit of water pans in smaller smokers is temperature stabilization. I use a weber kettle and the grill itself doesn't retain or reradiate a substantial amount of heat like kamado cookers or heavy gauge steel smokers. The water pan is a stable heat sink which reduces the extent of temperature swings when you open the lid. That goes back to your comment about the pans making the chamber ideal weather for bbq. Cheers.
Third video I've watch by this guy... I have learned something every video.. subscribed..thumbs-up.. Thanks bro!
Excellent information brother
I really was wondering about this, so it's helpful.
I bought a Lodge bread pan and seasoned it. I then use that in my Yoder YS640 smoker and it makes a big difference. Typically, the water needs to be refilled about halfway to get through an entire briscuit cook and I do that when I come out to check the meat and bring a tall glass and fill it up.
I highly recommend it if you are looking for something perfect to use to hold water on your smoker. Again, you must season it because it will rust due to the water.
Thanks Jeremy, I really enjoyed this video.
Thanks for the video, Jeremy!
Awesome video! About 6 months ago I started using a cast iron pan to withstand the direct flames and provide an even heat.
This works. I have never used anything but a water pan because my smoker can with one and it runs out, it gets hot!
Just purchased a new offset smoker and your fire management videos have been helpful
Although my brain now hurts, from over usage......I absolutely love your videos and have an immense appreciation of your knowledge and respect for all aspects of the smoking processes. Keep up the good work. BTW, I live in Alpine (a mountain community above San Diego) and chose the pellet smoker method due to a number of factors. I started with a Traeger about 15 years ago and then graduated up to a Yoder, due to an anticipated move to Idaho (cold) upon my retirement. Well, my plans have changed and I am now moving to the Buckeye area of Arizona this year (hot/warm). My yoder is approximately 10 years old and has the old electronics, so instead of buying the new pid for it, I've decided to give it away to a family member, so they can enjoy a few more years of cooks on the old Yoder. I've been looking at another smoker that is out there and was wondering if you've heard about them or maybe have some info about them. It's Lone Star Grills out of Texas and they now have a pellet smoker that is supposed to put out more smoke than the normal pellet smokers. If you get a chance, I'd like to hear your input on the 20 x 42 pellet smoker they have. Thanks in advance.
I spend all day on UA-cam watching nonsense but I smoked two chickens today on a smoker I picked up off the side of the road and after that I can tell you this video is absolutely fantastic. Thank you sir. Please keep doing what you’re doing.
Thank you. I really learned a great deal.
It's always good to know WHY you're doing something and not just because people say you should. Good stuff!👍
This is the type of content that keeps me coming to your page!
I have another variable that I think might need to be addressed. Correct me if I'm wrong.... I'll try to spell out my question. A water pan will increase moisture through evaporation, but moisture content in the heated smoky air flowing over the meat is greatly effected by the volume of air you're pushing. As you've said in other videos, airflow is what makes an offset smoker yield more flavorful meat, and what you've said in this video, much heat and moisture are lost to the stack. In the case of this example, more airflow would mean lost through the stack, which would seem to lessen the effect of added water- there would be a smaller change in the humidity of the cook chamber and less moisture interacting with the meat. There could be some balance point where the hotter fire to overcome the loss of energy to the water pan increases the airflow so that there is no net gain.
Thank you for making this break down on using the water pan. I feel like it was made for me lol, was just thinking of not using it for tomorrow BBQ. While talking to my wife about it set down and whats in my feed, Do water pans improve BBQ lol right on time. Doing a smoke turkey tomorrow first time smoking one so maybe it came up because i watch your video on smoking a turkey.
I was really hoping for a brisket cook comparison similar to the foil/paper/none comparison. Thanks for the information in any case.
Hey dude, excellent applied science as always 👍. I just recently moved from a property that was in a white oak forest, I miss it terribly and the excellent barbecue I could make just from the windfall. Central Pennsylvania is very similar to your native Kentucky.
On cheap barrel smokers the water pan is a most when cooking at higher temps, it difuses the heat catches all the grease and also helps to keep the temp in check.
Excellent explanation!
My uncle has a bbq joint and he recommends just using a pan of playground sand to add mass for keeping consistent temps. Same concept as using a stone in the oven when baking.
Love this channel. I smoked my first brisket last week and I'm smoking a pork butt today. I've learned so much from your videos and my friends, my wife and I all thank you for helping me make a tastier smoked meat!
Greatest explanation I have ever seen, coming from a math/Chem teacher! Love this!
15 years of green egg/ lump Charcoal with a little green hickory... I've concluded from experience a large water pan directly under my BBQ. Makes my cook times shorter , makes better bbq, makes the temp easier to regulate and catches grease and keeps my grill cleaner. Thank you for your video
So glad this came out today! I legit put a pan in my smoker last night! Thanks for a knowledge!
Hi Jeremy,
I absolutely love your videos. You always provide great instructions, tips, and honest reviews. If at all possible, would you mind producing a video comparing your offset smoker(s) and ( for instance) Myron Mixon H2O smoker(s). I live in Los Angeles, but I’m originally from Louisiana. I plan on moving back home soon and I’m ready interested in purchasing one of them. I would love to hear your comments/comparisons.
Peace and blessings,
Reggie Brewer
Wow, Jeremy, absolutely loved this presentation! Also, I could follow it well (Diploma in mechanical engineering). Great job! Thanks a lot and greetings from Germany
Stay safe
Grumpy Griller
Vielen Dank
Man I love these kind of videos. Great info! I use a cast iron Dutch oven in my offset smoker. Never thought too deeply into the science, but I can tell you from experience that it keeps the temperature much more consistent. My smoker isn't very high quality and burning wood can sometimes get the temp over 400 degrees. With a water pan I can much more easily maintain a consistent temp and also a clean burning fire.
I'm not sure why this works, but it does. When my water pan is empty, my thermapen goes off to some crazy temp and I going running over to my smoker and realize that's the issue!
Great video Jeremy ! You remind a little of Alton Brown from the science prospective! I have the Primo XL grill. I did my first cook and used a water pan . I was wondering what size pan, now I could have checked the one I used but alas I didn't . Also when I put my water in the pan I added some barbeque sauce for favor .