New Argument For God? | Talk Heathen: Throwback
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- Опубліковано 5 лют 2025
- #bible #moral #debate
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WHAT IS TALK HEATHEN?
Talk Heathen is a weekly call-in television show in Austin, Texas geared toward long-form and on-going dialogue with theists & atheists about religion, theism, & secularism. Talk Heathen is produced by the Atheist Community of Austin.
Talk Heathen is filmed in front of a live studio audience every week at the Freethought Library of the Atheist Community of Austin.
The Atheist Community of Austin is organized as a nonprofit educational corporation to develop & support the atheist community, to provide opportunities for socializing & friendship, to promote secular viewpoints, to encourage positive atheist culture, to defend the first amendment principle of government-religion separation, to oppose discrimination against atheists & to work with other organizations in pursuit of common goals.
We define atheism as the lack of belief in gods. This definition also encompasses what most people call agnosticism.
NOTES
The views and opinions expressed by hosts, guests, or callers are their own and not necessarily representative of the Atheist Community of Austin.
/ talkheathen is the official channel of Talk Heathen. "Talk Heathen" is a trademark of the ACA.
Copyright © 2024 Atheist Community of Austin. All rights reserved.
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Atheism is what happens when you read the bible, Christianity is what happens when someone else reads it for you.
Bertrand Russell.
The guy makes a great pot of tea. 😐
Someone also said that Bad people do bad things. To maker good people do bad things takes religion. The caller is doubtless a good and honest person, but pushing his religion made him misrepresent, accuse and deprecate and in near desperation traduce the hosts. This is Love that cannot be told apart from hate.
I love it when say they come in peace and then insists amyone who isnt a christian is evil
They are ignorant.
They’re aliens 👽
They are dishonest.
They are delusional.
They are ego centric
“Don’t believe in The Bible, believe in God… by reading The Bible”. 🤣🤣🤣
I really appreciate the kindness, patience and respect they demonstrated
“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. That's religion.
Between the 1960's and late 1990's, I read six versions of the Bible with an open mind in their entireties. The experience convinced me beyond a shadow of doubt that the Bible is nothing more than a book of mythology and heroic fiction.
What differed between the versions? Anything in particular that struck you?
The Bible is the world's most famous, most complex instance of fan fiction.
Most infamous, most basic
Also badly written. And the main character is a Mary Sue to end all Mary Sues.
@@FrikInCasualMode I agree it's badly written-- or it was written beautifully, but it didn't translate well or was poorly translated.
Complex? You've never read 40k fan fiction
@@cshubsnope, even in its own native language, the Bible is contradictory and contains poor characterization flat lifeless characters with no personalities😂
This caller is an expert tap-dancer. He should be on the stage
13:00 In the story of Balaam and the donkey what most upsets me is that Balaam reacts totally normal to the speaking donkey. As something like this happens every day. Imagine you are riding a horse and suddenly the horse speaks perfectly articulated and discusses the actual econony with you. I would get a heart attack.
That shows to me that this is just more of those fables in this dusty old book
Blessed are the pure in heart.? But according to Christianity we’re all sinners so nobody can see god.
Circular reasoning at its' finest. Everyone is born a sinner and you can only become "pure of heart" by recognizing God. BUT, you can't see God if your a sinner.
@@chrisgraham2904If there IS a "god", "he" really needs a better public relations team.
There is no hate quite like Christian love.
There is no ignorance like Atheist ignorance.
What is the opposite of love? xD
@jannieschluter9670 Wait, hold on... there's ignorance like atheist ignorance? But according to the dictionary, the opposite of love isn't ignorance, it's indifference. Maybe you meant 'inquisitional fervor'? After all, history books are full of examples of that kind of love... right?
@@latinzane The opposite of love is not hate. If it was so then love and hate could not exist at the same time. ;)
You live in a bubble. "Science says this!" and "Dictionary says that!". It is like someone would say "The Bible says this!" and "Jesus says that!".
I bet you believe that a dictionary is certainly more reliable than the Bible. ;)
@@jannieschluter9670 Now, just so I do this correctly, which religion do you partake of and which Bible is your go to?
While you're choosing whether or not to divulge that... no one mentioned love and hate existing at the same time. Besides, my comment reflects Christian love as coming across more like hate. Now that that's clear, let's debate that. 🤣🤣🤣 If the bible is telling you the opposite of love isn't hate, then yes, I will absolutely be sticking to science and all the like. After all Genesis says the earth is 6 thousand (6000) years old, while science has debunked that claim and aged the earth at 4.5 billion (4,500,000,000) years old. That's a large discrepancy and enough to question the bible. That's just the tip of the iceberg. Want a little more? 🤣🤣
@@latinzane since you have all the answers already, you must have reached that peak of the iceberg of wisdom, knowledge and understanding about love and its opposite? You strike me as a Mormon who has reached god status now. You already know what Earth-like planet you will rule over? 😃😃😃
For humanity to move forward, we have to leave all these superstitions behind!
You already left it behind and where did it lead to? To people creating their own fantasies to believe in and live by. It has led you to a place where humans don't know if they are male or female, dye their hair blue and green and put the greatest effort into being as unnatural and corrupted as they can be. *clap clap*
That is exactly why America is stuck in the 20th century. Living in an inward looking bubble of their own making for decades has not allowed them to see that the rest of the developed world has moved on
@@Gerryjournal
Absolutely, I've been following US politics for about 8 years from 🇬🇧 specifically 🏴. Also, as you can see, I follow religion from the non religious side. If someone doesn't understand religion in American politics they don't understand American politics.
It's pretty secular here.
I agree as; religion tends to make believers isolationists, the more literalist the religion is, the more accurate this is. History has shown groups, religions, states, and even nations, stagnate and decline when they decide they have no need to interact, share knowledge, culture, etc. When enough individuals disagree with the views of their church; they break off into another church, and if they disagree with the views and actions of the denomination, they form a new denomination. Likewise, when enough people believe the same thing; they will form a new religion. We also see people gathering together for countless aspects of popular culture, from music, art, movies, TV shows, to sports, and countless other past times.
Only the ignorant believe everyone else shares their worldview.
Religion is a cancer to humanity
Well done you two. I am impressed by your restraint.
"So you think torturing children is wrong? You are better than your god -- I applaud you." Burying the caller with love and respect. L.M.A.O.
Don’t trust the bible trust the god of the bible. Where do we learn about god? In the bible. Do theists not listen to the stupid things they say.
Alex Conor recently slaughtered Dinesh D'Souza. And Dinesh also had the position "The Bible is true, no matter what it says".
They come with some detail, "How could the people have known that back then=", and when you tell them "Why did God harden Pharaoh's heart repeatedly after he had decided to let the Israelites go, until he could kill ALL the firstborn in Egypt, even the firstborn animals (unless you had smeared fresh lambs blood on the doorposts - it seems God roamed through the egyptian cities and had to enter through the door)?". "Oh,, you do not have to see that so literally".
Then I take the other stories also not literally (what catholics don't do anyhow), and take the hits as luck, that people back then were not as ignorant as they are often portrayed, and as having adapted exiting locations and historic events as props in their storytelling.
Stupid is who stupid does. my best regards to your blue and green hair friends who are so mentally instable and confused that they don't know if they are male or female and spend half their pay check on a shrink's couch.
@@feedingravens Talking to those people is like trying to wrap Jello in rubber bands.
If you live in a restricted religious bubble, then you might never hear anyone challenge you seriously. It takes time and courage to step away from it. There is a reason that religion is so pervasive. It has evolved defensive mechanisms. These people are victims, even if their shit-talk makes one dislike them.
@@ronthered138 same for atheists. The denial is so severe.
Religion does a number on people, they actually come to believe that a supreme being created the world as is, created eternal torment for his creation, sacrificed himself to himself in a gruesome blood thirsty death, to save us from himself. This is madness. We need to leave these destructive, iron age myths behind.
When you respond to everything with "I believe..." it may be time to reconsider your beliefs.
Paul says "Believe in Jesus Christ and you shall be saved!". What do you think this means? Can you describe it with your own words?
@@jannieschluter9670sure, you see, jesus is a narcissist. If you dont believe im him, he'll burn you for eternity.
@@jannieschluter9670 It means that so long as you believe in Jesus Christ you are accountable for none of your actions. A horrible philosophy in my opinion.
@@papabeard4976 what you wrote is a sad delusion. I was more curious to know what "to believe" means in your opinion. I think you get that wrong, too. But let's see.
@@jannieschluter9670 And JRR Tolkien said that "In a hole in the ground there lived a hobbit." Does that mean that hobbits are real? Does that mean that Gandalf, dwarves, elves, Gollum, magic rings, dragons, trolls, orcs, goblins and the Dark Lord Sauron are real? You're doing the usual, lazy, ignorant apologetics of "The book proves the book". You know WHY you are doing that? Because IT'S THE ONLY F'ING PROOF YOU HAVE!
Jeffrey literally has nothing but the bible tells me so. It's embarrassing!
I will never understand why black people cling so blindly to a religion that was violently forced on their ancestors.
The problem is that is not about NOT understanding the bible. The problem is understanding what it says and still justifying it as true, moral, ethical or good..
Most people are bothered by those passages of Scripture they do not understand, but the passages that bother me are those I do understand.
-- Mark Twain
People who really understand the Bible know it’s not a good foundation for truth or morality.
The problem is believing the bable is worth anything! To me it's at best toilet paper, the shittiest toilet paper
I get the impression people like this think, quoting the bible to people is like a magic spell to attack the evil spirits within you, and bring you to the light! As if the rantings of religious fanatics have some divine power. Hate to break it to them, but in 58 years of people quoting bible verses at me, I've yet to have a reaction beyond facepalming.
Sometimes they even lose their own language and only speak in Bible verses. As these are perfect, and to them these verses made them OWN The Truth, and so they do not need to KNOW the truth.
Usually regularly Jehova's witnesses appeared at my place, and I started to train discussing with them once we sat down for half an hour or so outside.
And then came an older with a younger woman (probably mother and daughter), and we talked, and I think I was quite good at having anstwers to their "arguments".
And when they were about to go, I asked the young one "What do you think is the best argument fo believe?" - "That Jesus fulfilled hundreds of prophecies".
"But look, the biblical texts were written by biblical scholars in anotther country decades later, and they DEFINITELY had read the Old Testament and knew all the prohecies the messiah had to fulfill. Don't you think that they could not have tuned the story so that all fits? Back then no one could have checked, all eye-witnesses were dead and a thousand miles away.".
And in my memory she stopped dead and looked at me with wide open eyes.
And the older women hurried to her, grabbed her "Let's go, let's go and dragged her along.
Since then they have not returned...
This is exactly what they think. They absolve themselves of the responsibility to believe things for good reasons by shifting the burden onto “the holy spirit” to do the work for them.
@@feedingravens I've lived in several places over the years and usually haven't had much issue with that sort of thing, but there was a stint of about two years where I lived relatively close to a good sized Mormon community, and my neighborhood was inundated with Mormon kids (18 or so) going door to door. I would invite them in because they'd be out there in the middle of summer, in a suit and tie. I really just wanted to get them out of the heat and something to drink.
However, we did have discussions and I would say they were well trained on what to do if they lost control of the conversation, and that was to politely leave. Which they all did within about 20 minutes. It took about 5 or 6 of them in about a 3 or 4 week period before none of them knocked on my door the rest of the time I lived there. I'd say my address was blacklisted. Whether it had any impact on those kids after the fact, I couldn't say, but they certainly were not expecting someone to be in a position to rebut their arguments, and it was pretty clear by the look on the faces of some of them that I was telling them things they'd never considered before.
@@feedingravens The religious are masters of "cut & paste".
58 years and you are still not a single step further? what a joke.
This dude is a few fries short of a happy meal.
A few???!!
Jesus.
It's an empty tray, dude.
Lol.
He’s a couple sandwiches short of a picnic.
@@jexelbur6872 And a blanket, basket, and location short, as well!
I enjoy listening to you ;you have a lot of knowledge. My respect for all of you.👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👍🏼👌
"I start with obedience" ughhhh how stupid. Its like those people that say god wont reveal himself to you unless you humbly and sincerely ask him to. Why the fuck would I and how the fuck could I unless I believed already?
Wow! You guys handled that perfectly!
But what if your heart is pure _but it's pure evil?_
I thought it was actually 'blessed are the cheesemakers'
I'd like it more if it did say that!
"Shut up, big nose!"
its not?
@seansanders2150Fr it’s not meant literally
I provide my blessings to all who make delicious cheeses.
I love it when my wife sends me vids and time stamps. This is great 😂
The hosts are using their intellect while the caller is operating on tribal instincts.
You give him too much credit
Not tribal insincts.
He was operating on his written and preached religion.
Nothing to do with tribal.
The Tribes in the bible didn't have the bible to refer to.
@@BoogieBoogsForever i think he's referring to the instinctual defense mechs used cuz human nature is tribal
A light attracts bugs like religion attracts ego centric psychos.
Theists that talk at me or try to convert me to their thought processes based on a book that is full of immorality, factual inconsistencies, and logical fallacies are not going to have any luck.
This guy clearly started off planning to preach and trying to get the hosts quoting Bible verses to make his points,and they rightly said, up front, ‘we aren’t going to engage with that, so do you really want to have a conversation in good faith, or should we just end the call here?’
He thought he could work his way back around into tricking them into his original plan. 😡
How did we get from "it's true because I see and experience it every day" to "I just assume god can do magic"
Where does he see supernatural events every day.
Jeffrey has “it” bad. Poor bastard!
How is it we can be pure at heart but born sinners at the same time😳😂😂
In other news, there's something wrong with you if you can't see the Emperor's fine clothes.
It is sad what religion does to people's minds. Jeffrey sounds like a nice guy. I think the call has shaken him up a bit but we know he's going to shrug it off rather than thinking about the call, so that he can continue to believe. Sad.
I remember when I thought my cat might be able to speak in human language, and English, too!
Then I turned 7 and never thought that was possible again.
Someone did a good job on Jeffrey...
People fly Airliners through office block
with the same mindset
So his all powerful magic fairy could make a gigantic universe, so why has it needed a human to build a simple boat to save a couple of humans after it killed everyone else?
Religion is so warped I just can't understand how anyone can accept it.
Its called "the foolishness of GOD" (a few scriptures reference it.) And its on purpose, it has to do with how GOD is keeping hidden. To a great extent, especially regarding not manifesting openly. Or empirically.
@@ChessArmyCommander If it is even real, I don't believe it is real so it isn't hidden, it probably just doesn't exist, it was all made up by primitive men to explain stuff they couldn't understand.
"Because it's true... first your going to have to read it blah blah blah". That's when I bailed on the video.
Jeffrey doesn’t seem to understand the difference between actually seeing his god thing and seeing things that have nothing to do with his undescribed god thing!
Exodus 33:20 And he said, Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live. I am atheist and know my bible better than most christians.
That's because those of us who READ it realize what a load of batshittery the Book of Insanity. Bullshit. Lies. and Evasions is. Unfortunately, there are too many people like this caller who want to live in magic land.
How many letters are in the donkey alphabet i wonder!😂
Listening to a normal human being's brain dissolve as he endeavours to explain
Ah, good old classic of :"Prove the Bible is right using the Bible."
I think at this point anyone trying to use it in a discussion should be immediately dismissed as mentally unfit.
Truth simply is and it does not even have to make sense to anyone. If it would have to make sense then we are talking about man-made religion.
@@jannieschluter9670Religion IS man-made. Why should we think you know anything more than us? Maybe answer question rather than preach. Btw, theologians try to make sense of this stuff all the time
@@dwightfitch3120 it's basic philosophy yo...
Truth does not owe you...
Wisdom is attracted to the humble and the meek and is recognized by the wise.
@@jannieschluter9670truth is considered truth *because* it makes sense to everyone. Because it all makes no sense and is clearly written by man it's obviously man made. God did not make a book talking about it in the second person. Hell it's not even a singular book on a singular story about a single god. Knowing things is considered wisdom, that implies something has to be understood to be true to be truth.
@@danielkeizer4174 how old are you? xD
There was a tree standing. One day the same tree fell to the ground. No creature witnessed what happened. Nothing makes sense. Now, is the tree lying on the ground truth or is it man-made?
Oh. Good. He prayed. I bet that helped a load. I mean that praying is a load of shit. That's what I mean.
Watching the logical gymnastics that believers like this use to justify their inane fairy tale book is almost physically painful.
His god of the bible. The god of a huge flood? The god of multiple genocides? The god of infanticide? Mass abortion at the point of a sword? Earthquakes and tsunamis? Hurricanes and other natural disasters?
Just change « in the beginning » to « once upon a time ». There, fixed the bible.
He said he's an ambassador of heaven. The whole point of ambassadors is to represent a leader who can't be at a certain place at a certain time. Is he saying Jesus can't be anywhere at any given time so he needs people to be his representatives on his behalf?
I think Satan he's reached out to jeffrey but he isn't pure of heart so he doesn't understand.
caller thinks that quoting harry potter scripture will make listeners join dumbledore against voldermort!
To the religious, I often quote the wise words of YODA from the book and screenplay of Star Wars. "May The Force Be With You".
Then your God is no loving God, love that bit at the end of the call.
I love the thinly veiled insults from the bible.
"Only smart people can see god"
Yeah thanks Stacey.
"Go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel" (Matthew 10:6)
Was that divinely inspired or an actual quote ?
Hey dude... PROVE IT.
thanks for content
Sin is an artificial disease, made to sell you an imaginary cure.
I wonder how people would view the bible if it was unearthed 50 years ago ?
This is what happens when you're indoctrinated early in life and look to the bible for knowledge.
Why can't the folks who 'see' god, describe him?
It is not about what God says. When a person says to you “Worship my god, do what my god says, ”They are really saying to you “Do what I say, worship me.”
Blessed all the cheesemakers.. 😁
Brain glitching badly with that guy!
Just the same old “the bible says so”
“Like oh my God”, even the Valley girl saying proves the existence of god.😂
😊
This dude is a walking contradiction
Extremely little bit of logic
Blessed are the cheese makers!
I have a flying talking donkey
What's that old saying? Ain't no hate like christian love
PRAYER DOESNT WORK MATE!!
It's so boring that God only speaks with passages of the Bible. Update your materials dude.
God punished Adam and Eve, and all of their descendants, and all of mankind, because they ate the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. So, apparently, God did not want mankind to know good from bad, right from wrong. So, why do you look to that God for your morality? How can you “learn” morality from someone who didn’t want you to know right from wrong? (and was a pi$$-poor example of morality himself?
God created Heaven before he curse humanity with death. Looks like he stacked the deck to me.
Not to mention if "god" is "all knowing" then he knew after creating Adam and Eve EVEN BEFORE CREATING THEM they were going to eat the apple, so why even create them in the first place? That's not loving AT ALL. So god created us just to torture us!?!? Like come on now.
it would be so useful if ppl like jeffrey took some time to actually THINK for a day or 2.....
Always trust the coercive controlling sky daddy
Its true because of OBEDINCE. OK???
Pretzels suck, who likes dry knots of dough covered in salt.
I do.
Well - here in Munich, a pretzel, sliced open, with butter and parsley, is NICE.
What you will see in beer gardens is that the experienced pretzel-eaters under the table rub off most of the salt.
The main task of the salt is to suck up moisture and keep the pretzel crisp.
Had you imagined that you would get a crash course in bavarian pretzel culture today?
I do.
me lol
I like pretzels. Damn are you gluten sensitive or something?
Love is love, and every hole is a goal.
A whole lotta cognitive dissonance going on.
Wishy washy word conversation from the caller. Complete waste of time
Cringeworthy! Religous fervour is a form madness.
Jeffrey don't understand that he is so unlikeable. Condescending isn't a positive trait dude...
This guy really believes that he's gonna turn these hosts into theists.
Everything is possible...please feed the starving stop the wars...few thousand years just hang on just be a few more. By the way worship me or be punished forever. P.S. I love you
Buy Bull === Bible
There are no Jesus points to be scored here Jeffrey. Go door to door…
WAD!
is that Roman Reigns
I thought Jesus came for sinners so why cant sinners see him?
God doesn't exist
"It is true because it is true"
When are theists going to understand how empty and gullible these words are?
Jeffrey is a goofy & doesnt knows it. Talking donkeys!?
But da bible say.......
God is suppose to live everybody so why is he invisible somebody and only hear a voice from an invisible "man" in the sky.
Do I need to be scitzo first? 🤔
There is a God coz im Mr Ed 🐎 🐴 🎠 🏇 🐎
The poor fellow is operating at about a forth grade level and these two SJWs desperately want to try to take him seriously.
Unreal.
All things are possible with GOD..........
-So why is there still evil in this world?
Oh that's right! The Lord creates evil😂
God's using Google translate.
The Bible correlates to our reality! Wait!, what about the talking donkey?
Everything in the Bible correlates to our reality OR describes god-magic!
😍
This is boring. ‘I believe it’ So what?
You believe what ?