I like this backstory a lot. Its a nice inversion of what we are used to with most other heroes. The story is tragic because the Duelist feels no guilt for doing something horrible instead of being motivated by it. It seems like she just genuinely does not care about anything else but growing as a fighter, and thats a really scary motivation for a "hero" to have. If murdering the only person she cared about didnt stop her, then what will? It makes me wonder how all the other mercs would have turned out if they just didnt give a damn about their flaws and failures. Edit, as well as a minor spoiler: Just fully upgraded Duelist at the Shrine, and the Academic commented it with something along the lines of "Now she will find purpouse beyond the blade"(don't cite me on that one). If those quotes the Academic says upon fully upgrading a hero pertain to what that hero become safter the main story is over, then it seems that Sahar's personal arc ends with her just stopping, and i find that really compelling to be honest.
@@adisca2k Yes, but she didn't do the whole "The deadliest prey of all is MAN" thing as soon as she came second place, Duellist didn't even need eldritch gods to be confirmed for her to start killing people.
"It seems like she just genuinely does not care about anything else but growing as a fighter, and thats a really scary motivation for a "hero" to have." This. This is why I think Goku is a fucking psycho.
RH : "Antiquarian is an enemy because she is the least moral" Duelist : sociopathic murderess without guilt, who only cares about fighting and killing. I'm wondering who is the least moral between her and Flag.
Probably her. Flagellant may enjoy pain whether it be his own or the pain of others, but at the end of the day he’s far more invested in his own pain. As for Sahar, she kills in cold blood and doesn’t seem to care for others. She only wants to get stronger.
@@JC_Stone Well, Flag is a religious hypocrite who only joined the Church to torture other people, like Vestal. So I'd say he's very interested in other people's pain. As for Duelist, when you max her in the Altar of Hope, the Academic says "she will find meaning beyond the blade" so there is hope for her yet.
Flag genuinely loves pain and think it's a good thing that should be shared. Duelist cares for nothing else other than honing her skills as a killer, and feels no remorse for killing her lover. So while Flag may be too zealous to see how his actions are horrific to others, Duelist's motivation is more selfish.
Flagellant has at least moved on past the sort of behavior shown during the Vestal's backstory, and is now more concerned with his own pain than others, believing it can absolve people by taking their aggression out on him. Yeah he fights too but those are clear monsters that need to be stopped. Duelist is a sociopathic social darwinist who will unblinkingly murder the man she loves then commit her life to duels to the death for only the sake of her own selfish self-improvement.
Murder-pervert, got it. But the extent to which she's the ideal product of her school is getting overlooked, I feel. She basically went to an art academy where the art is stabbing people to death. Her instructor was nothing but proud. Honestly it's a more interesting background than Murder Pervert.
Kinda wondering if she's meant to somewhat be an Antiquarian stand-in in terms of being probably the least "moral" of the heroes in the DD2 batch - she seems downright sociopathic considering the lack of remorse or guilt on her part.
It does feel like it tbh. The diference being that her goal is more reachable then Anti, who problaby turned to Banditry and Pillaging because she was unable to finish her Masters Ritual.
I like that about her tbh. Considering what they are fighting it would make sense that some of our heroes would have far more inclinations towards being brutal and amoral. The fact that Sahar is far more scary than her appearance may suggest is also a nice contrast. I legimately expected her to be someone like Musketeer but instead shes a far brutal Musketeer mixed with Graverobber backstory wise. Still hoping we see Shieldbreaker or someone like her turn up in the future. I really loved her playstyle in DD1 and I feel like her backstory could easily be represented in this game. We already have Flagg so seeing Shieldbreaker would be nice. Either that or Arbalest but I never really quite liked Arb's playstyle despite her backstory being very tragic.
@@WeaverOfStarsYeah Arb is a pretty standard ranged character, but we do need more of back rank attackers rn so I wouldn't complain if she's in next. Plus if Crusader is anything to go by, a LOT can be done to juice up a DD1 hero concept.
Very brutal that she went "minor fencing mistake, living privileges revoked" to her lover and teacher xD But she also says after that shrine that her teacher's eyes were full of pride, so maybe he also liked that about her. He turned her into a better and more ruthless version of himself.
I now think it could be even more so fucked up if the teacher wasn't so shocked and actually expressed proudness when being lethally pierced by someone better than him.
@@WiidLover You could argue that he is surprised that she managed to strike him so thoroughly and then passed out from the pain. She must have hit him right in the heart.
It's crazy how people blame her for killing him when the idea of a contest to the death was her instructor's idea. As the instructor uses "Preparation" she says "No quarter? A true contest, then!" They go from exchanging "Touche" (touches) to exchanging masterful swordplay in an attempt to kill their opponent. You've gotta remember that this is a person who by default isn't emotionally invested in others. On one hand, it's "murder", but it's more so self defense. I think the only reason he challenged her to the death was because she became so focused on improvement that they stood as equals of martial respect. It's crazy, but the way they expressed their "love" for each other was to take each other seriously and respect their desires to grow and improve as a duelist, challenging each other to the ultimate test of improvement in hopes that one of them will blossom beyond their limits. As she said in her 5th shrine after killing her instructor: "Playfights can take me no further." "Sport was an unacceptable abstraction: the true test of skill lay in contest to the death. She whispered thanks to him for this posthumous lesson." Tl;dr Duelist is honestly pretty cool and not a murderhobo.
Honestly, from how he treated her, I think she gave her master exactly what he wanted: Perfection. He had perfect poise, he forged a perfect student, he fought a flawless duel until he made one mistake and gained a perfect end. Mayte that's what he did to his master as well. And one day, Sahar will forge herself a promised end
taking a look at the cape she carries makes you wonder why would she actually do it, i wonder why so many character pasts are caused by guilty pleassure (vestal, runaway, flaggelant and now duelist)
I'd suspect arrogance, narcissism/potentially ASPD or outright sociopathy. She might not *truly* care about anyone or anything unless it benefits her goals if her murder's anything to go by. Perhaps she carries the cape because she thinks it symbolises her rank as a master?
I would argue it is more than just guilty pleasure. The Vestal had to live in Denial of her guilty pleasure until it was too much too handle and then was more or less exposed to it, causing her to be distracted. The Runaway is a pyromaniac, having an Obsession with fire that she is too young to control properly. The Flaggelant literally has an Obsession with pain. The Duelist had the Ambition to surpass her schools curriculum and then afterwards developed an Obsession with fights to the death. In fact every hero backstory has one or two elements of the scholars failings, which propably is by design to go with the main theme of DD2s story, to "face and accept your failures". The Plague Doctor had the Ambition and Obsession of basically "healing the dead". The Grave Robber started out with Resentment for her husband and the situation he left her in and then developed an Obsession with grave robbing. The Highwayman is a minor case, with his Ambition being freedom that left him to accept the one job that made him ridden with guilt. The Man-At-Arms Ambition drove him to get promoted prematurely, which lead him to lead his men to death. Since he was the only survivor of a total rout you could argue that he fled the fight and so displayed Cowardice as well. The Hellion is similar to the Man-At-Arms as she had the Ambition to join her warband early, but while she was physically ready, she wasn`t mentally and then got banished due to her display of Cowardice. The Jester, once he learned the song in the graveyard, was filled with Ambition and during all the mockery and torture he endured grew heavy Resentment that he unleashed in the song that massacred the entire court. The Leper is also a minor case, but the narration stated that he ignored earlier signs of his infection, a.k.a. living in Denial for a short time. Of course it is questionable if he could have been cured, if he seeked help earlier, since we can`t be sure how good Leprosy treatment is in the world of DD. The Occultist had the Ambition to learn and master eldritch power, which caused his acolytes death and him being cursed with staving off a void entity for the rest of his life. And the Crusader developed his Obsession with war that caused him to live in Self-Denial about his wishes to return to his family. Maybe that is the reason, why the Bounty Hunter is only playable as a temporary unit. From DD1 we know only three things about him, he is a professional, he loves his job and that, if his Crimson Court trinkets are any indication, he has a Vendetta against certain people. While the third point could count as an Obsession, it is balanced out by the first point. He is too much of a professional to be blinded by personal revenge. As ironic as it is, the Bounty Hunter is propably, unless being bombarded with lots of stress simultanouesly, one of the most stable people in the world of DD due to him being, as psychology calls it, a "functioning psychopath" (a person with psychopathic personality traits that managed to find his particular niche to satisfy his needs). He simply doesn`t fit into the story of DD2 and as such is more of a side actor.
I need The Instructor as skin for Duelist. He already have the wind-up and move execution animation for most of her move. Just need some touch from modder to complete the moveset.
It's pretty clear based on the scenery of the final fight that they were both drunk and she is in denial about what actually happened. Up until that final riposte, their respective attacks were lightly damaging. However, when she saw an opening in her mentor's defenses, reflexes drilled into her through ceaseless hours of training took over, and she struck him without hesitation. She dresses it up as wanting to find a worthy foe, but the truth is, she wants someone to kill her for what she has done.
YES I'm happy they gave us a ruthless hero instead of another "I'm not bad, it was circumstance" I already felt like they softened up the plague doctor and the grave robber to fit into DD2's idea of seeking redemption, so the duelist is a nice change of scenery
Well, plague doctor story is a failed experiment, so I dont know whats wrong with That, and grave robber correct me if im wrong, Just steals some shit from graves, and then goes straight to the crossroads(the question why gr is fighting for us at all is still present in My head)
I think she's in it either for the money or because if she's not in it and the world ends then she dies, and she would prefer not to die@@nikitakondrashin9061
Interesting to note that in her portrait, she faces left, away from the burning light symbolic of her past like everyone else but the Leper, who faces right, having no regrets of his past deeds (nor should he). Perhaps there's something going on inside her that this doesn't tell us. Of course, I haven't played DD2, only the first game so far...
So weirdly enough this feels like the wraiths backstory but from the students prospective? Wraith was a modded character in dd1 and I’m kinda curious if there is a genuine connection or if I’m insane
Appart from the student killing the master, they seem quite different. The wraith's student was planning to betray him from the start and the reason he lost was because he hesitated. Meanwhile the duelist is a psychopath that bested her master, she bore no ill will against him but was also unaffected by his demise, discarded like a finished book.
Hey Shuff, was wondering if you could try to make The Usual Suspects a somewhat decent party, now that Reynauld is back in DD2, I tried them out and it didn't end so well. I think it would be very cool to actively use again.
Cheers, I'll be there! Love your content though, been watching ever since your original guides from the first game. Always fun to watch along with your good humor.
She's literally "while you were making friends I was studying the blade."
she really went "tee hee hee" and then stabbed him in the chest
Bro 💀💀💀
Lol Wayne Jude pronouncing fancy french words in his dark voice is pretty funny for some reason
Yeah I laughed the first time too lol
I like this backstory a lot. Its a nice inversion of what we are used to with most other heroes. The story is tragic because the Duelist feels no guilt for doing something horrible instead of being motivated by it. It seems like she just genuinely does not care about anything else but growing as a fighter, and thats a really scary motivation for a "hero" to have. If murdering the only person she cared about didnt stop her, then what will?
It makes me wonder how all the other mercs would have turned out if they just didnt give a damn about their flaws and failures.
Edit, as well as a minor spoiler: Just fully upgraded Duelist at the Shrine, and the Academic commented it with something along the lines of "Now she will find purpouse beyond the blade"(don't cite me on that one).
If those quotes the Academic says upon fully upgrading a hero pertain to what that hero become safter the main story is over, then it seems that Sahar's personal arc ends with her just stopping, and i find that really compelling to be honest.
The obsession with the craft reminds me of Musketeer's backstory a little bit.
Just a little bit, though. She clearly isn't as extreme.
@@whosey2807 Musketeer embarked on a personal vendetta against an eldritch god just because it made her miss once. I would call that quite extreme.
@@adisca2k I saw it more as a vision of her fighting against the eldritch and being motivated by fate and the impending doom that the heart brings.
@@adisca2k Yes, but she didn't do the whole "The deadliest prey of all is MAN" thing as soon as she came second place, Duellist didn't even need eldritch gods to be confirmed for her to start killing people.
"It seems like she just genuinely does not care about anything else but growing as a fighter, and thats a really scary motivation for a "hero" to have."
This. This is why I think Goku is a fucking psycho.
RH : "Antiquarian is an enemy because she is the least moral"
Duelist : sociopathic murderess without guilt, who only cares about fighting and killing.
I'm wondering who is the least moral between her and Flag.
Probably her. Flagellant may enjoy pain whether it be his own or the pain of others, but at the end of the day he’s far more invested in his own pain. As for Sahar, she kills in cold blood and doesn’t seem to care for others. She only wants to get stronger.
@@JC_Stone Well, Flag is a religious hypocrite who only joined the Church to torture other people, like Vestal. So I'd say he's very interested in other people's pain. As for Duelist, when you max her in the Altar of Hope, the Academic says "she will find meaning beyond the blade" so there is hope for her yet.
@@SovietSnake89 Flag just loves pain so much that he doesn't want everyone else to miss out on it. Sharing is caring.
Flag genuinely loves pain and think it's a good thing that should be shared. Duelist cares for nothing else other than honing her skills as a killer, and feels no remorse for killing her lover. So while Flag may be too zealous to see how his actions are horrific to others, Duelist's motivation is more selfish.
Flagellant has at least moved on past the sort of behavior shown during the Vestal's backstory, and is now more concerned with his own pain than others, believing it can absolve people by taking their aggression out on him. Yeah he fights too but those are clear monsters that need to be stopped.
Duelist is a sociopathic social darwinist who will unblinkingly murder the man she loves then commit her life to duels to the death for only the sake of her own selfish self-improvement.
Murder-pervert, got it.
But the extent to which she's the ideal product of her school is getting overlooked, I feel. She basically went to an art academy where the art is stabbing people to death. Her instructor was nothing but proud. Honestly it's a more interesting background than Murder Pervert.
Kinda wondering if she's meant to somewhat be an Antiquarian stand-in in terms of being probably the least "moral" of the heroes in the DD2 batch - she seems downright sociopathic considering the lack of remorse or guilt on her part.
It does feel like it tbh.
The diference being that her goal is more reachable then Anti, who problaby turned to Banditry and Pillaging because she was unable to finish her Masters Ritual.
I like that about her tbh. Considering what they are fighting it would make sense that some of our heroes would have far more inclinations towards being brutal and amoral. The fact that Sahar is far more scary than her appearance may suggest is also a nice contrast. I legimately expected her to be someone like Musketeer but instead shes a far brutal Musketeer mixed with Graverobber backstory wise.
Still hoping we see Shieldbreaker or someone like her turn up in the future. I really loved her playstyle in DD1 and I feel like her backstory could easily be represented in this game. We already have Flagg so seeing Shieldbreaker would be nice.
Either that or Arbalest but I never really quite liked Arb's playstyle despite her backstory being very tragic.
@@WeaverOfStarsYeah Arb is a pretty standard ranged character, but we do need more of back rank attackers rn so I wouldn't complain if she's in next. Plus if Crusader is anything to go by, a LOT can be done to juice up a DD1 hero concept.
Very brutal that she went "minor fencing mistake, living privileges revoked" to her lover and teacher xD
But she also says after that shrine that her teacher's eyes were full of pride, so maybe he also liked that about her. He turned her into a better and more ruthless version of himself.
she’s 19th century French, though. Being ruthless comes with the country.
I now think it could be even more so fucked up if the teacher wasn't so shocked and actually expressed proudness when being lethally pierced by someone better than him.
@@WiidLover You could argue that he is surprised that she managed to strike him so thoroughly and then passed out from the pain. She must have hit him right in the heart.
“Minor fencing mistake, living privileges revoked” perfectly encapsulates Sahar, reading that made me laugh way too hard! 😂
I love how they describe sex in this game
which is strangely common in darkest dungeon games
I thought she'd be like GR, but she's more or less super old school badass French back when they were fighting the whole world.
Ya. Basically the french back in the napoleon era
It's crazy how people blame her for killing him when the idea of a contest to the death was her instructor's idea. As the instructor uses "Preparation" she says "No quarter? A true contest, then!" They go from exchanging "Touche" (touches) to exchanging masterful swordplay in an attempt to kill their opponent. You've gotta remember that this is a person who by default isn't emotionally invested in others.
On one hand, it's "murder", but it's more so self defense. I think the only reason he challenged her to the death was because she became so focused on improvement that they stood as equals of martial respect. It's crazy, but the way they expressed their "love" for each other was to take each other seriously and respect their desires to grow and improve as a duelist, challenging each other to the ultimate test of improvement in hopes that one of them will blossom beyond their limits.
As she said in her 5th shrine after killing her instructor: "Playfights can take me no further." "Sport was an unacceptable abstraction: the true test of skill lay in contest to the death. She whispered thanks to him for this posthumous lesson."
Tl;dr Duelist is honestly pretty cool and not a murderhobo.
Also you can see thst she too is trying to hide from the light on the shrines, meaning that she is carrying guilt or remorse
Honestly, from how he treated her, I think she gave her master exactly what he wanted: Perfection. He had perfect poise, he forged a perfect student, he fought a flawless duel until he made one mistake and gained a perfect end. Mayte that's what he did to his master as well. And one day, Sahar will forge herself a promised end
taking a look at the cape she carries makes you wonder why would she actually do it, i wonder why so many character pasts are caused by guilty pleassure (vestal, runaway, flaggelant and now duelist)
Corruption
I'd suspect arrogance, narcissism/potentially ASPD or outright sociopathy. She might not *truly* care about anyone or anything unless it benefits her goals if her murder's anything to go by.
Perhaps she carries the cape because she thinks it symbolises her rank as a master?
I would argue it is more than just guilty pleasure.
The Vestal had to live in Denial of her guilty pleasure until it was too much too handle and then was more or less exposed to it, causing her to be distracted.
The Runaway is a pyromaniac, having an Obsession with fire that she is too young to control properly.
The Flaggelant literally has an Obsession with pain.
The Duelist had the Ambition to surpass her schools curriculum and then afterwards developed an Obsession with fights to the death.
In fact every hero backstory has one or two elements of the scholars failings, which propably is by design to go with the main theme of DD2s story, to "face and accept your failures".
The Plague Doctor had the Ambition and Obsession of basically "healing the dead".
The Grave Robber started out with Resentment for her husband and the situation he left her in and then developed an Obsession with grave robbing.
The Highwayman is a minor case, with his Ambition being freedom that left him to accept the one job that made him ridden with guilt.
The Man-At-Arms Ambition drove him to get promoted prematurely, which lead him to lead his men to death. Since he was the only survivor of a total rout you could argue that he fled the fight and so displayed Cowardice as well.
The Hellion is similar to the Man-At-Arms as she had the Ambition to join her warband early, but while she was physically ready, she wasn`t mentally and then got banished due to her display of Cowardice.
The Jester, once he learned the song in the graveyard, was filled with Ambition and during all the mockery and torture he endured grew heavy Resentment that he unleashed in the song that massacred the entire court.
The Leper is also a minor case, but the narration stated that he ignored earlier signs of his infection, a.k.a. living in Denial for a short time. Of course it is questionable if he could have been cured, if he seeked help earlier, since we can`t be sure how good Leprosy treatment is in the world of DD.
The Occultist had the Ambition to learn and master eldritch power, which caused his acolytes death and him being cursed with staving off a void entity for the rest of his life.
And the Crusader developed his Obsession with war that caused him to live in Self-Denial about his wishes to return to his family.
Maybe that is the reason, why the Bounty Hunter is only playable as a temporary unit. From DD1 we know only three things about him, he is a professional, he loves his job and that, if his Crimson Court trinkets are any indication, he has a Vendetta against certain people. While the third point could count as an Obsession, it is balanced out by the first point. He is too much of a professional to be blinded by personal revenge. As ironic as it is, the Bounty Hunter is propably, unless being bombarded with lots of stress simultanouesly, one of the most stable people in the world of DD due to him being, as psychology calls it, a "functioning psychopath" (a person with psychopathic personality traits that managed to find his particular niche to satisfy his needs). He simply doesn`t fit into the story of DD2 and as such is more of a side actor.
Sahar be like " I don't want peace, I want problems ALWAYS"
I reckon she and the hound master would’ve gotten along well
Always imagined HM constantly on the verge of an altercation with people like Anti, GR and HWM. One of the few genuinely nice characters in DD1.
I need The Instructor as skin for Duelist.
He already have the wind-up and move execution animation for most of her move. Just need some touch from modder to complete the moveset.
It's pretty clear based on the scenery of the final fight that they were both drunk and she is in denial about what actually happened. Up until that final riposte, their respective attacks were lightly damaging. However, when she saw an opening in her mentor's defenses, reflexes drilled into her through ceaseless hours of training took over, and she struck him without hesitation. She dresses it up as wanting to find a worthy foe, but the truth is, she wants someone to kill her for what she has done.
YES I'm happy they gave us a ruthless hero instead of another "I'm not bad, it was circumstance"
I already felt like they softened up the plague doctor and the grave robber to fit into DD2's idea of seeking redemption, so the duelist is a nice change of scenery
Well, plague doctor story is a failed experiment, so I dont know whats wrong with That, and grave robber correct me if im wrong, Just steals some shit from graves, and then goes straight to the crossroads(the question why gr is fighting for us at all is still present in My head)
@@nikitakondrashin9061GR murdered her abusive husband.
@@PotionSmeller well, yeah, but why would she seek redemption?
I think she's in it either for the money or because if she's not in it and the world ends then she dies, and she would prefer not to die@@nikitakondrashin9061
@@nikitakondrashin9061 I don't think she is seeking redemption, it's more about the thrill of grave robbing/ adventuring.
Interesting to note that in her portrait, she faces left, away from the burning light symbolic of her past like everyone else but the Leper, who faces right, having no regrets of his past deeds (nor should he). Perhaps there's something going on inside her that this doesn't tell us. Of course, I haven't played DD2, only the first game so far...
Okay, now I have played it, and I still don't know.
So weirdly enough this feels like the wraiths backstory but from the students prospective? Wraith was a modded character in dd1 and I’m kinda curious if there is a genuine connection or if I’m insane
Well, Marvin Seo now works for Red Hook, so...
Marvin left a long time ago. I think he was doing an apprenticeship.
Appart from the student killing the master, they seem quite different. The wraith's student was planning to betray him from the start and the reason he lost was because he hesitated. Meanwhile the duelist is a psychopath that bested her master, she bore no ill will against him but was also unaffected by his demise, discarded like a finished book.
People that think she's amoral because of murdering the instructor haven't read the three musketeers.
The mentor in his dying moments ❤👍
Thanks for video, this one gave me such a hard time
right when needed!
"I can fix her..."
Jesus Christ, she’s plague doctor with some extra psychopath mixed in. Did not expect that to be her story
Hey Shuff, was wondering if you could try to make The Usual Suspects a somewhat decent party, now that Reynauld is back in DD2, I tried them out and it didn't end so well. I think it would be very cool to actively use again.
I'll give them a run tomorrow and see how it goes :)
Cheers, I'll be there! Love your content though, been watching ever since your original guides from the first game. Always fun to watch along with your good humor.
Do you think that his master lost only because of that final mistake or the fact that she was already stronger/more skilled?
Probably both
If he made a mistake then that shows a lack of skill, no?
yasss girl get it!!!!!! remorseless queen
When i first saw the trailer for her i tought it was the shieldbreaker but remade
Must see crusader shrine...
Damn
The cooler musky
Oh hey the Duelist made it into canon.
She's a heartbreaker.
she is reverse flagelant
M.E.R.C.I !!!
POG!
Where is crusader's shrine? Hurry it up
D:
Give the man some time, it takes ages getting to those shrines :(