Facepalm. You have edited out the very bits (the actual example content) that i want to hear. PLEASE is there SOMEWHERE on the www where Sociocracy is explained with actual WORKED or REAL LIFE examples in CLEAR English (or Dutch) especially with CRITICAL examples of disadvantages. And by someone with a bit charisma/personality. ENOUGH vague statements of how good and inclusive it is! Thankyou
Fair enough, but I mean it is already nearly 13 minutes long. I'm not sure you realise how much adding another 10 minutes will increase how much a broad audience will feel like "omg this video is too long - I'll watch this later (never)" But fair - there could be a longer version for sure, with unabridged content (some of the real objections are in this, as I'm sure you saw)
Hi Jan. In both the Sociocratic Circle Method, and Sociocracy 3.0, a single proposal is the starting point for Consent Decision-Making. It's the process of then seeking and resolving objections, that enables the distributed intelligence to be harnessed and used to evolve a proposal to the point that is considered good enough and safe enough (a.k.a. no further objections). However, there is a pattern for co-creation of a proposal to begin with, called Proposal Forming. Sociocracy 3.0 and the Sociocratic Circle Method have a different approach for this, but in both cases, the pattern supports to co-creation of a proposal that can then be tested with Consent Decision-Making. Neither SCM or S3 work with 'counter proposals'. However, in the case that a group need to choose between two or more options, the (Role) Selection pattern is used. You can find a demonstration of the S3 Proposal Forming pattern, here: ua-cam.com/video/Nfkw9NGeiz4/v-deo.html
@@s3community Hi, thank you for such complete answer. I think it could be interesting to optimize the whole construction of the central proposal by starting with all the proposals (hence taking into account the whole batch of counter proposals), morph them all together until the main proposal is formed and then proceed in refining it through classic SCM. This would probably make a slow start but it would make SCM more fluid, prevent the initial dispersion of good ideas and keep all the parties involved equally included hence fully engaged from the very start. Unfortunately I never had the opportunity to test this so I am only speculating on theory here.
@@janlaag What you're describing is one step in the Proposal Forming Process: 'Gather ideas as possible ingredients for a proposal'. In this step, everyone shares ideas about how to respond to the driver. (clarified in Step 1 and understood more deeply in Step 2). This can include ideas that might provide a whole solution, partial solutions, iterative next steps and suggestions about how to respond to any of the prioritized generative questions (which were prioritized in the step before). We refer to gathering or harvesting ideas, rather than gathering 'counter proposals'. The term 'counter' is polarizing, whereas the purpose of this step is to accumulate options. It's about inviting a divergent space, prior to converging on a synergy of the ideas in the next step (form a proposal).
@@s3community Thank you for your very clear answers, I really appreciated it. Do you have any book on sociocracy that you maybe wrote yourself or that you would recommend to a regular small sized company owner and for skeptic beginners? Thank you!
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Crack on!! This is a great resource for demonstrating how to make a consent decision/agreement
I'm glad you found it useful, Charlie!
Facepalm. You have edited out the very bits (the actual example content) that i want to hear.
PLEASE is there SOMEWHERE on the www where Sociocracy is explained with actual WORKED or REAL LIFE examples in CLEAR English (or Dutch) especially with CRITICAL examples of disadvantages. And by someone with a bit charisma/personality.
ENOUGH vague statements of how good and inclusive it is!
Thankyou
Fair enough, but I mean it is already nearly 13 minutes long. I'm not sure you realise how much adding another 10 minutes will increase how much a broad audience will feel like "omg this video is too long - I'll watch this later (never)"
But fair - there could be a longer version for sure, with unabridged content (some of the real objections are in this, as I'm sure you saw)
Thank you for sharing. Very valueable. I am always surprised of the adding of background music. Why? I find it distracing and I have to blend it out.
How is this sociocracy if counter proposals are excluded from the start instead of becoming integrated into the central proposal itself?
Hi Jan. In both the Sociocratic Circle Method, and Sociocracy 3.0, a single proposal is the starting point for Consent Decision-Making. It's the process of then seeking and resolving objections, that enables the distributed intelligence to be harnessed and used to evolve a proposal to the point that is considered good enough and safe enough (a.k.a. no further objections).
However, there is a pattern for co-creation of a proposal to begin with, called Proposal Forming. Sociocracy 3.0 and the Sociocratic Circle Method have a different approach for this, but in both cases, the pattern supports to co-creation of a proposal that can then be tested with Consent Decision-Making.
Neither SCM or S3 work with 'counter proposals'. However, in the case that a group need to choose between two or more options, the (Role) Selection pattern is used.
You can find a demonstration of the S3 Proposal Forming pattern, here: ua-cam.com/video/Nfkw9NGeiz4/v-deo.html
@@s3community Hi, thank you for such complete answer.
I think it could be interesting to optimize the whole construction of the central proposal by starting with all the proposals (hence taking into account the whole batch of counter proposals), morph them all together until the main proposal is formed and then proceed in refining it through classic SCM.
This would probably make a slow start but it would make SCM more fluid, prevent the initial dispersion of good ideas and keep all the parties involved equally included hence fully engaged from the very start.
Unfortunately I never had the opportunity to test this so I am only speculating on theory here.
@@janlaag What you're describing is one step in the Proposal Forming Process: 'Gather ideas as possible ingredients for a proposal'. In this step, everyone shares ideas about how to respond to the driver. (clarified in Step 1 and understood more deeply in Step 2). This can include ideas that might provide a whole solution, partial solutions, iterative next steps and suggestions about how to respond to any of the prioritized generative questions (which were prioritized in the step before).
We refer to gathering or harvesting ideas, rather than gathering 'counter proposals'. The term 'counter' is polarizing, whereas the purpose of this step is to accumulate options. It's about inviting a divergent space, prior to converging on a synergy of the ideas in the next step (form a proposal).
@@janlaag You can read more about the Proposal Forming Pattern here: patterns.sociocracy30.org/proposal-forming.html
@@s3community Thank you for your very clear answers, I really appreciated it.
Do you have any book on sociocracy that you maybe wrote yourself or that you would recommend to a regular small sized company owner and for skeptic beginners? Thank you!