Schiit Freya, Sophia Electric & Raytheon 6SN7 - Tube Listening Test
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- Опубліковано 11 вер 2024
- High-end new production vs Vintage new old stock 6SN7 tubes, can you hear a difference? In this listening test of matched dual tubes, we compare the Sophia Electric to the Raytheon tube in the Schiit Freya tube preamp. The dual tubes were placed in the gain stage position on the preamp.
#tycodogg #schiitfreya #tuberolling
Opening theme: Local Forecast - Slower Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License
creativecommons...
Songs for this listening test:
"Quicksilver" - Fourplay
"Deja Vu (I've Been Here Before)" - Teena Marie.
These comparisons are fantastic. Best on UA-cam I’ve ever seen. Great work!
The Room feels bigger with the Sophia
Here are my findings, based on listening tests with both my editing suite studio monitors (Focusrite 18i20 audio interface feeding a balanced signal to my Yamaha HS80M + HS10W subwoofer) and my headphones (Focusrite 18i20 audio interface > Venus Audio/Cardas balanced cable > Audeze LCD-2 Planar Magnetic):
In order to really hear the difference, you'll need a playback system with extended bass response that can go down below 40Hz. The Sophia Electric tubes have a "roundness" and "definition" to the bass notes, which is particularly heard in the bass guitar for both songs. Turn up your system and concentrate on the bass guitar. You'll hear an additional impact and definition from the Sophia Electrics, especially in the lowest harmonics. Switching to the Raytheon, those same lowest harmonics are more subdued and relaxed. The Sophia Electrics bring the bass impact to the front, but with more "air" and "space" around the bass, while the Raytheons seem to anchor the bass guitar in the center. NOTE: If your playback system cannot reach below 40Hz (small computer speakers, or most headphones), you will not be able to hear this difference. On my Audeze headphones, it was difficult to hear, but once I played it back on my editing studio monitors at reference level, it was my wife who first noticed the increased impact from the lowest bass harmonics.
The second difference is more obvious: The noise floor drops with the Sophia Electric tubes. The Raytheons have much more tube noise once the signal drops away, while the Sophia Electric tubes are nice and quiet.
BOTTOM LINE: The Sophia Electric tubes are great for extended deep bass response and low noise. The Raytheon tubes surprisingly match the Sophia Electrics in nearly everything else, with identical mids and highs (for my ears), but with a more relaxed and centered deep bass sound.
thanks for the info I was tring to figure out what the difference was but couldn't. I was playing off a Monster streamcast S2.
The difference is subtle, even for systems with extended bass response. I had to turn up my Yamaha studio monitors + sub to reference levels to hear the difference in the lower frequencies, and it was actually my wife who noticed it first (she may have better hearing than I do).
Well, I simulate and build tube amps. You hear a difference between the Raytheon 6SN7 and the Sophia 6SN7. But what is the reason for the difference? For my knowledge, good tubes have plus minus 20 per cent difference to the data sheet values in for example mu (voltage amplification) or S (transconductance). This is the reason for tube matching to reduce the difference in a pair of matched tubes - bring together the low values here and the high values there. Do you think the difference in sound is only due to difference in parameters?
I hear more detail in the Raytheon, which is unusual as I usually find more detail with the newer tubes on your tests.
Nice listening test. I know nothing about these tubes. Stumbled upon your video looking for info on Freya. Listening with my Stax L300, I agree with your bass characterization. Raytheon is slightly bloomy at the bottom. I do think that Raytheon blends the entire range very well, particularly the mids, and gives almost a reverb effect (to my ears). Sophia has this strange sound in the upper mids (upper registers on the piano on the first tune, vocals on the second piece) that makes the sound boxed in (in a narrow range). Otherwise, Sophia seems more solid state-like clarity while Raytheon has a tube-like warmth. I'm sure it took a lot of work to capture these details. Very nice!
Your assessment agrees very closely with my own, but I also felt the Sophia emphasized the high end, although with a fragile, crystalline sense, which you describe as "solid-state-like clarity." I found it to be a touch of the un-real. Also, where you say "the Raytheon blends the entire range very well", I fully agree, but describe it as the Raytheon integrating the entire audio spectrum in a natural, realistic way, so "blends" = "integrating", means long-term listening, sans fatigue. Thanks.
Very cool test! I think the Sophias were a little warmer/muted but didn't sound bad at all, they are soft as a marshmallow and that can be a good thing. While brightness and details or "sharpness" can be found in the Raytheons, I believe. Anyhow, great job!
I agree. The difference, though, is very subtle.
I give you high marks alone just because I love Fourplay and Tenna Marie!
This right here. Much agreed.
Raytheon is brighter more transparent sound quality and timbral accuracy.
Can people please help me? Why does this pre have 4 and other pre’s only have two tubes? I read T-Dogg’s description and he called the right two tubes ‘gain stage’ so what stage are the left two tubes? What does ‘gain stage’ do and like wise with the other stage? Thank you.
I like the Raytheon better
Love to see the tungsol 6sn7 reissues directly compared to the Sophias?
I like the color palette of the Raytheon! It’s very wet, though. An engineer may not dig it.
I prefer the Raytheon. The Sophia was more solid state-like.
Strange how the comments sections seems to mostly prefer the Raytheon because it "has more detail"... I agree with you, actually, Sophia was clearer, or sharper, so to speak, and therefore more solid-state-like.
The Raytheon's upper-mids are very "muddled" or "bit-crushed", i lack the vocabulary, but it lacked sharpness basically, the "edges" were rounded off, so it's more tube-like. I'm a solid-state person, myself, i prefer the sharpest, clearest, most accurate sound, i would totally go for the Sophia if i had a tube amp like that.
Dear Tyco: Among all the tubes you have tested in all your videos, which are the 5 best sounding tubes for you? Please sorte them to best to less best. Thanks.
What are my top 5 tubes so far?This is a good question and one that I plan on answering in an upcoming video. My favorite new production tube right now is the Genalex Gold Lion, which was from my latest listening test.
sophia electric 4 me
Hello, How is the Freya working for you? I am looking into getting one but I am a little skeptical of the built quality. how has it held up? the price is right but just a little worried about its working life expectancy. thanks
Full disclosure: I paid retail for my Freya, and so any opinion on Schiit Audio is as an unbiased regular customer. This is my 2nd Freya. The 1st one had a slight "click" noise at one position of the volume knob that came through to the speakers. I don't blame Schiit Audio for this, as it was probably a defective attenuator. They quickly replaced it and this one has been flawless so far. Schiit Audio's customer service was great to work with and their products carry a 5-year warranty. I really don't know of any other company that can come close to their bang-for-the-buck for a Made In USA product.
@@TycoDogg Thank you for your quick response. I might give it a try I do have two other pieces of theirs with no issues. just tube sockets and the constant tube changing with wear quickly? As well the impedance match with my Bryston 4B.might cause an issue Schiit said it will not.
@@theaudiophilecorner I think I'm using the TS-8 socket savers from Parts Connexion - they're $6.95 each and you need 4. Other socket savers I've tried were too wide in diameter and wouldn't fit in the Freya's tube opening. A quick check of impedance: Freya tube output impedance = 210 ohms, Bryston 4B input impedance = 30k ohms balanced, so I agree with Schiit that it shouldn't be an issue.
wonder how he changes the tube so fast without stopping the music..
I record the whole song with one brand of tube first, then record it a second time with the other brand of tube. Bring both recordings into my video editing program Adobe Premiere. Here's a video of the process: ua-cam.com/video/RPUtCs-jPoU/v-deo.html
That went way over his head , Ronnie. 🤣
Hi Tyco Dogg, Thank you for excellent videos..i have one question are you not getting any kind of HUM or Noise when using tube mode from that Schitt Freya Preamp?
Hi Chand, you're welcome...glad you found the videos informative. There can be noise but that's almost completely dependent on the individual tubes. That's not to say that a particular brand has a certain noise characteristic. I've had new production and NOS tubes that made a faint noise, as well as some that were very quiet. But for the noisy tubes, I have to put my ear to the high frequency drivers of my JBL 4343s to hear it.
@@TycoDogg Thank you for taking out your time to respond my request.. Which brand tubes are very quiet in your opinion? also i am looking forward exclusive review of Schiit Freya Preamp and its performance from you,your thoughts and experience with this tube preamp, on your channel..
Chand, the best way to ensure your tubes are quiet is to have them tested for microphonics before purchasing. It may cost a few dollars more but I feel it's worth it. As for a review of the Freya, there are great reviews out there already. This is my one and only tube preamp so I can't compare it to anything else. what I can say about the Freya is that it exceeds my expectations and I'm very happy with it.
Thank you.. Tyco.
Tyco Dogg Who have you had reliable experience with when having tubes tested / buying tested tubes? I live in Australia and the market here is not as big as America ect. Thanks.
Hi Tyco,
I am having a question.. If I don't use the XLR in the input stage, Can I get a XLR output from Freya? Because neither my CD player and my Phono pre is having a XLR out.
Hi Sumit, yes you can use the RCA inputs on the Freya to connect your sources, then use the Freya's balanced XLR or single-ended RCA outputs.
I see in some videos you change the all 4 tubes,but here only the right 2 ones.Does it make any difference?
Some tube sets I have are matching duals, so I only have 2 of that brand. I place them in the gain stage (front-right and back-right) and use another pair for the buffer stage.
no bass??? what happened with bass?? omg
Hi Tyco. In this review you dont use socket savers. As I could see, Sophia tubes fit inside Feeya. Righr? Thanks.
Hey Epigmenio, yes the Sophia tubes fit the Freya. This review was done before I purchased a set of socket savers, as I anticipated doing a lot of plugging/unplugging tubes and did not want to wear out the internal socket. The Freya is designed for 6SN7 tubes, so any 6SN7 tube should fit without the need for any socket saver.
i wonder if those sophias are actually relabeled tj fullmusic--the sophia 6SL7 ive seen are rebranded TJ.
Same tube.
@@ianlarson1744 they rebrandedn and resold 12AX7 as well. they also jack up the price.
Hi Wish to check your views. Hows the Schiit Freya + with the bluesound node 2i to a power amp like the XTZ. Any views?
Hi Rsmesh Ramesh. Unfortunately I don't have any experience with Bluesound or XTZ products, so I can't comment on what that combo sounds like. A quick check of the XTZ website leads me to believe their amp is a Class D. I like Class D for powering low frequency drivers due to their efficiency. My Seaton Sounds subwoofers are both powered by 700W Class D amps. However, for the rest of the frequency range (midbass, mid, high, ultrahigh) I prefer Class AB. This is why I'm specifically running the Crest Audio 5200s for my JBL 4343 speakers because they are the only Class AB amps in their current Professional Series lineup.
@@TycoDogg Tks for your views. Wow 700watt Class D amp! Now thats something. My power amp is only 150Watts. Tks for your feedback. I get where you are coming from. Looks like a tube preamp may just add some refinement to my class D power amp.
May I know what are the gears your are using?
This video gives a brief listing of equipment: ua-cam.com/video/RltJw004j3c/v-deo.html
So what did you settle on in the end? Did you try the GE gtb or gtn?
Bill, check out my pinned comment for my thoughts on this listening test. I do have a set of NOS GEs that I'm burning-in now, and will feature them in an upcoming video.
Tyco Dogg cool. Looking forward to it. I am having a tough time trying to find a good source for valves. I am new to the tube world, and finding out that this will be a time consuming journey to locate reliable sources. Can you lend some guidance?
@@billybastar4022 eBay is a good source as long as you're careful with whom you're buying from. Only buy NOS tubes that are tested good and checked for microphonics. Buy from long time sellers with perfect seller ratings, who only sell tubes and nothing else.
Tyco Dogg eBay...gulp....wish me luck
Is there slight popping noise when you switch?
Yes unfortunately the popping was a result of an issue during editing and not coming from the tubes. Luckily this was the only video I made that has this issue.
Thanks for the quick reply. Been having issues with popping in my system with changes in videos or apps from my receiver. I was hoping that there wasn’t something new I had not noticed before. Cheers.
Listen to 572 B with Class A TNT 50 oil cooled amps every day. That kind of natural rendition of music like My Audio power Labs is incredible, Too bad it is $47500 a pair! Must be the Lundahl transformers also used by Focusrite!
oil cooled amps - do they leak like a Harley Davidson motor bike?
raytheon sounds better
raytheon and sylvania are overrated ge cbs or rca are better