You can check out our honorable mentions here: bit.ly/3v2pYLJ
9 місяців тому
I was convinced that Demonic Tutor should be on the ranking. You reached top 2, and no Demonic Tutor appearance... I checked out the honorable mentions.... and again no Demonic Tutor. My heart said to me: It will be the top 1, it can't be out of this video.... And you guys made my heart happy. Thank you.
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@@beanofknowledge2125 ritual is the obvious #3. More iconic than YW and more longevity across more formats than Bowmasters. Enables so many different archetypes and playstyles from storm to midrange to aggro. Would still put Thoughtseize and DT over it. Maybe Reanimate and Necropotence as 4 & 5.
5 best cards that aren't sheoldred the apocalypse Bowmaster: Sheoldred at home Reanimate: Reanimate sheoldred Yawgmoth's Will: Make them discard their removal, then reanimate sheoldred Thoughtseize: Make them discard sheoldred, then steal it with Reanimate Demonic Tutor: Find sheoldred (the second, because black players start with her 100% of the time)
That was broken on Shandalar. I basically made a deck consisting of Contracts from below, Black Lotus/Dark ritual and Hypnotic Specters. Turn one play a bunch of hypnotics and win.
The thing with necro is if you just play it out on t3. You probably die before you can use the cards you draw with it. It's really as good as the rituals are in the format
Hymn is better in discard decks, but Thoughtsieze is more versatile. It can ruin your opponent combo deck, or make he looses the only answer to your deck.
How is that card even good? Skipping your draw step is awful and paying life for cards is incredibly dangerous. What if the other guy "just f*king kills you" with their creatures because you paid all your life for drawing cards which you could have gotten for free (draw step) if you waited a bit? That card seems like a total noob trap.
@@AfroAtze i know right? how is necropotence even a good card? what's even the point of getting over a dozen cards in your hand immediately without the mana to pay for them?
@lastnamefirstname8655 couple of things: Necropotence is only legal in formats with fast mana and rituals. There are cards you can cast for free. If nothing else you can discard down to handsome to put cards that want to be in the grave in the grave.
They're in the honorable mentions. Honestly, there's a pretty obvious top 10 for black cards, but dividing 1-5 from 6-10 is difficult, so I can't blame them
@@JohnFromAccounting Bargain is absolutely still the card it used to be if you have ever played no ban list in any of the formats where it would be legal including legacy. Its just that it is banned in all of those and you only have it available in vintage. If you can turbo it out it usually just wins the game
@@muditjohar5323 I play legacy and vintage. Bargain is unplayable in vintage. It would see a bit of play in legacy, but you can't even cast it off 2 Dark Rituals. Ad Nauseam is instant speed and can happen on turn 1. Beseech the Mirror also happens on turn 1 and is a deterministic storm kill. Bargain would be a genuinely safe unban in legacy.
Which card? Discard! Still I love the chemistry between you 3, there is something so special with you that makes it feel just like talking about magic with good friends
I like the list, I missed Necro on the top five, as well as Dark Ritual (although it was mentioned as part of comboing), but I agree with Demonic Tutor being the best.
Yawgmoth's Bargain was always a favourite of mine. Back when it was in Standard, it was so nice to play with alongside Skrige Familiar and Renounce. The turns were so long, the opponent was so bitter.
Bargain is twice as costly as Necro for pretty close to the same card. Necro comes down on turn 1, Bargain comes down on turn 2 at the earliest with 2 Rituals, which you're not always going to have. Necro is busted because it's so easy to cast, and even if you don't rush it out with Dark Ritual, it's still an obnoxiously powerful turn 3 play cast off swamps.
@@JohnFromAccounting Well, you're right, it's more costly, but it also draws cards right away, so I don't know which one is better. But anyway, I love Yawgmoth's Bargain because I could play it in Urza's and Mercadia's standard back then as a child. The deck was so busted ans fun, I don't know why it wasn't more popular. Let me give a decklist. Here is what I came up with trying to remember: 4 Dark Ritual 4 Duress 2 Renounce 2 Replenish 4 Vampiric Tutor 4 Academy Rector 4 Skirge Familiar 1 Contamination 2 Parallax Wave 2 Opalescence 3 Yawgmoth's Bargain 4 Grim Monolith 2 Tooth of Ramos 2 Voltaic Key 4 Crystal Vein 4 Peat Bog 3 Phyrexian Tower 2 Plains 4 Remote Farm 3 Swamp
Before watching, let me guess: #1 and #2 are demonic tutor and dark ritual, then probably one of those cheap reanimation spells, followed by a discard spell. Then last maybe a creature? Maybe Sheodred or bowmasters?
Back in the old days I used to run Yawgmoth's Will with Songs of the Damned. Play small creatures as fast as possible and roll in even into unfavorable blocks, then Songs, Will, Songs, Drain Life to finish.
I Demoic Tutored for a Basic Plains one time so I could Dovin's Veto my opponent. Goofy play, but damnit if it didn't feel worth it. Demonic Tutor is actually just insane lmao.
If I had a penny for every time I used demonic tutor in my yawgmoth commander deck to find a swamp so I can make my third landdrop, id have two penny's. Which is not a lot, however it is weird that it happened twice
The argument for Yawg's Will was that it can be "three mana, draw five" and yet Necro isn't on the list, which is "three mana, draw whatever you want." Obviously a more restrictive cost at three Black, but Yawg can often rot in your hand if your grave isn't set up. Never upset to see Necropotence 🤷🏻♂️
Honestly, probably not thoughtsieze. As much work as it does everywhere else, trading cards in hand one for one is not quite the same when you have 2 other players looking at you weakening both yourself and that opponent.
Okay, so let me know if this is a hot take or not or if this makes sense the way it does in my head. But I disagree with reanimate being here. Every other card has an extremely powerful effect within itself, whereas reanimate just has lots of potential based off of your possible targets. It's strong because of the decks it's built around using it to the best of its abilities, but that doesn't mean that the ability itself is that strong. If you reanimate a Griselbrand, doesn't that make Griselbrand the more impressive card?
I opened a pack with an alt art Orcish Bowmasters at the card store. I was like "Here let me scan it" the guy next to me said "Oh no, you definitely made your money off that pack"
My favorite thoughtseize thought is when you think your thoughtseize is the best, but your opponent thoroughly thrashed you by having not only a thoughtseize, but a second thoughtseize to thrash your thirsty ass
I agree with dark ritual not on the list, it's just an enabler (and so obviously good I don't think it's worth taking up a slot in the list) I'd argue hymn to tourach and sinkhole should be in the discussion but I like the list
@@edstone9890 um... dark rit is a staple in legacy and vintage as well and has been for years... necro was strong enough to get banned in legacy and is also restricted in vintage... As for demonic fair point however how can you refute commander not being the largest format? Also, we've always had these cards since the original commander set in 2011 so your point is what exactly?
Before watching, my guesses are, in some order: Dark Ritual, Necropotence, Yawgmoth's Will, Orcish Bowmasters and... I don't know if they'd pick Hymn to Tourach or Mind Twist or Thoughtseize for the last one. EDIT: Forgot about Demonic Tutor. Let's see what these dudes say.
Yeah, did not even thought about Yawgmoth's Will or Necropotense. Not sure if i agree with Bowmaster's though, still think that Dark Ritual is more powerfull
It's in the honorable mentions. Honestly, there's a pretty obvious top 10 for black cards, but dividing 1-5 from 6-10 is difficult, so I can't blame them
You can check out our honorable mentions here: bit.ly/3v2pYLJ
I was convinced that Demonic Tutor should be on the ranking.
You reached top 2, and no Demonic Tutor appearance...
I checked out the honorable mentions.... and again no Demonic Tutor.
My heart said to me: It will be the top 1, it can't be out of this video....
And you guys made my heart happy. Thank you.
Why are the elemental incarnations missing?
In scam they are so good.
good to see dark ritual on the honorable mentions list, was surprised it didn't make the top 5 tho, i have it at #1
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Dark Ritual not being on this list is wild. Necro HM is equally wild.
I assume they wanted not to use the most obvious ones. Then again, Reanimate isn't exactly unknown either.
Reanimate is 100% a busted card. You can reanimate an Emrakul turn 1 and swing with haste assuming you have a haste enabler.@@beanofknowledge2125
Dark Ritual is really nuts.
@@beanofknowledge2125 ritual is the obvious #3. More iconic than YW and more longevity across more formats than Bowmasters. Enables so many different archetypes and playstyles from storm to midrange to aggro. Would still put Thoughtseize and DT over it. Maybe Reanimate and Necropotence as 4 & 5.
Came to the comments to say the same thing
Thoughtseize really looks like a card where WotC was still operating on the "People Won't Pay Life For Stuff!" ideals.
5 best cards that aren't sheoldred the apocalypse
Bowmaster: Sheoldred at home
Reanimate: Reanimate sheoldred
Yawgmoth's Will: Make them discard their removal, then reanimate sheoldred
Thoughtseize: Make them discard sheoldred, then steal it with Reanimate
Demonic Tutor: Find sheoldred (the second, because black players start with her 100% of the time)
you realise bowmasters are better than sheoldred, right? You are not retarded, right?
black lotus is 1 im calling it now
For whatever reason, it's not a black card. We can make it one with Painter's Servant.
It is a black card, judging by the name.
Contract from below is the best magic card ever change my mind.
I mean fair but how do you rate that card with the ante I don't think it is fair to include it
That was broken on Shandalar. I basically made a deck consisting of Contracts from below, Black Lotus/Dark ritual and Hypnotic Specters. Turn one play a bunch of hypnotics and win.
I will absolutely steal the line "This card isn't bad, it's flexible and that makes it powerful" for everything!
another version: "this co&% isn't limp, it's flexible and that makes it powerful"
I was surprised necro wasn't number 1
same!
Same here
The thing with necro is if you just play it out on t3. You probably die before you can use the cards you draw with it. It's really as good as the rituals are in the format
There is a better, banned necro - Yawgmoths bargain
@@jirkau555 Necro is restricted in Vintage while Yawgmoth’s Bargain isn’t. 3 mana is a big difference.
Ok here are my guesses:
1. Demonic Tutor
2. Dark Ritual
3. Necropotence
4. Reanimate
5. Thoughtseize
Edit: 3 out of 5 ain’t bad
To be fair, this should have been the list in my opinion too. But I guess they had a equally hard time deciding aswell.
i would've switch out thoughtseize for yawgmoth's will, and changed the order
Doom, Doom, Doom, Doom, your creatures go kaboom
Say goodbye to your Welder
You no longer have a Delver
* _Merrily jaunts across your path while slinging Blades willy-nilly, like some sort of morbidly gleeful flower girl._ *
i think you're only limited to 4 doomblades in your deck
Everyone knows One with Nothing is the single most powerful black card, if not overall, of all time.
Nit disagreeing with Thoughtsieze, but when they started talking about discard, my brain went to Hymn to Tourach.
Seconded. Or even Cabal Therapy.
@@ReubenAotearoa best discard is hymn, for me. thoughtseize is second
My brain went to Grief but that's more situationally busted than Thoughtseize.
Hymn is better in discard decks, but Thoughtsieze is more versatile. It can ruin your opponent combo deck, or make he looses the only answer to your deck.
I was expecting mind twist
The upcoming top 5 white cards will be tough. Good luck finding 5 good white cards.
Balance, White Plume Adventurer, Swords to Plowshares, Solitude, Stoneforge Mystic.
@@JohnFromAccountingcompared to black cards it’s just sad
Teferis Protection, Sword to Plowshare, Path to Exile, Smothering tide, Esper sentinel
What about Necropotence?
How is that card even good? Skipping your draw step is awful and paying life for cards is incredibly dangerous. What if the other guy "just f*king kills you" with their creatures because you paid all your life for drawing cards which you could have gotten for free (draw step) if you waited a bit? That card seems like a total noob trap.
@@AfroAtze lol
@@AfroAtze Hahaa somebody needs to play a vintage league.
@@AfroAtze i know right? how is necropotence even a good card? what's even the point of getting over a dozen cards in your hand immediately without the mana to pay for them?
@lastnamefirstname8655 couple of things:
Necropotence is only legal in formats with fast mana and rituals.
There are cards you can cast for free.
If nothing else you can discard down to handsome to put cards that want to be in the grave in the grave.
Necro is number 1 guys. Its absurdly broken and dodges Sheoldred and Bowmasters.
Surprised dark ritual and necropotence/yawgmoth bargain weren’t shown
Bargain isn't the card it used to be.
They're in the honorable mentions. Honestly, there's a pretty obvious top 10 for black cards, but dividing 1-5 from 6-10 is difficult, so I can't blame them
@@JohnFromAccounting Bargain is absolutely still the card it used to be if you have ever played no ban list in any of the formats where it would be legal including legacy. Its just that it is banned in all of those and you only have it available in vintage. If you can turbo it out it usually just wins the game
@@muditjohar5323 I play legacy and vintage. Bargain is unplayable in vintage. It would see a bit of play in legacy, but you can't even cast it off 2 Dark Rituals. Ad Nauseam is instant speed and can happen on turn 1. Beseech the Mirror also happens on turn 1 and is a deterministic storm kill. Bargain would be a genuinely safe unban in legacy.
Top 5 before hearing list:
1. Contract from below
2. Necropotence
3. Yawgmoths will
4. Dark ritual
5. Demonic tutor
Honarable mentions:
Thoughtsieze
demonic consultation
Reanimate
Orcish bowmaster
Grief
Necropotence: "Am I a Joke to you?"
Which card? Discard!
Still I love the chemistry between you 3, there is something so special with you that makes it feel just like talking about magic with good friends
Start of list I said demonic tutor is first or second. I've tutored for even a sol ring when behind on mana to stay in a game and eventually even win.
I like the list, I missed Necro on the top five, as well as Dark Ritual (although it was mentioned as part of comboing), but I agree with Demonic Tutor being the best.
Yawgmoth's Bargain was always a favourite of mine.
Back when it was in Standard, it was so nice to play with alongside Skrige Familiar and Renounce. The turns were so long, the opponent was so bitter.
Bargain is twice as costly as Necro for pretty close to the same card. Necro comes down on turn 1, Bargain comes down on turn 2 at the earliest with 2 Rituals, which you're not always going to have. Necro is busted because it's so easy to cast, and even if you don't rush it out with Dark Ritual, it's still an obnoxiously powerful turn 3 play cast off swamps.
@@JohnFromAccounting Well, you're right, it's more costly, but it also draws cards right away, so I don't know which one is better. But anyway, I love Yawgmoth's Bargain because I could play it in Urza's and Mercadia's standard back then as a child. The deck was so busted ans fun, I don't know why it wasn't more popular.
Let me give a decklist. Here is what I came up with trying to remember:
4 Dark Ritual
4 Duress
2 Renounce
2 Replenish
4 Vampiric Tutor
4 Academy Rector
4 Skirge Familiar
1 Contamination
2 Parallax Wave
2 Opalescence
3 Yawgmoth's Bargain
4 Grim Monolith
2 Tooth of Ramos
2 Voltaic Key
4 Crystal Vein
4 Peat Bog
3 Phyrexian Tower
2 Plains
4 Remote Farm
3 Swamp
Jeez. Shitting on raise the alarm when it's in the strongest standard deck currently!
Speaking of thoughseize and reanimate, it's always a fun play to thoughseize yourself to dump a creature and then reanimate :)
1:40 Orcish does not say no he say 'okey but I will hurt you'
Please continue to do this with formats
Note: flexible does not mean physically flexible. DO NOT bend your 300€ cardboard
4:07 it would be crazy to print a yawg will that doesn't exile the cards (and also costs 1 mana less)
I need the pauper videos. I NEED them. I have holidays right now and I will die of boredom if I can’t see the pauper videos. PLEASEEEEE
Before watching, let me guess: #1 and #2 are demonic tutor and dark ritual, then probably one of those cheap reanimation spells, followed by a discard spell. Then last maybe a creature? Maybe Sheodred or bowmasters?
good call. I think this list would be more accurate than the one in the video.
best discard is hymn to tourach
Back in the old days I used to run Yawgmoth's Will with Songs of the Damned. Play small creatures as fast as possible and roll in even into unfavorable blocks, then Songs, Will, Songs, Drain Life to finish.
I Demoic Tutored for a Basic Plains one time so I could Dovin's Veto my opponent. Goofy play, but damnit if it didn't feel worth it. Demonic Tutor is actually just insane lmao.
that knock knock joke was hilarious
Hymn to tourach seems like it deserves a spot
If I had a penny for every time I used demonic tutor in my yawgmoth commander deck to find a swamp so I can make my third landdrop, id have two penny's. Which is not a lot, however it is weird that it happened twice
Hey, you do what you gotta do. i've burnt a main phase and mana to hit my land a million times
Surprised Torment of Hailfire wasnt there
haha that thoughtseize concede thing happened to me in standard recently but with duress. my opponent duressed me then conceded
The argument for Yawg's Will was that it can be "three mana, draw five" and yet Necro isn't on the list, which is "three mana, draw whatever you want." Obviously a more restrictive cost at three Black, but Yawg can often rot in your hand if your grave isn't set up. Never upset to see Necropotence 🤷🏻♂️
finally A LIST for all the cards my mono black cedh deck should have.
yes!
Honestly, probably not thoughtsieze. As much work as it does everywhere else, trading cards in hand one for one is not quite the same when you have 2 other players looking at you weakening both yourself and that opponent.
@@jaceg810 this. Is more satire commented before i even watched. But yes i agree
What is happening with Jamin's hair?
male pattern baldness
I was surprised not to see Bolas's Citadel. especially if you consider Commander.
Hell nah what
still rocking it guys! Great vid!
Okay, so let me know if this is a hot take or not or if this makes sense the way it does in my head. But I disagree with reanimate being here. Every other card has an extremely powerful effect within itself, whereas reanimate just has lots of potential based off of your possible targets. It's strong because of the decks it's built around using it to the best of its abilities, but that doesn't mean that the ability itself is that strong. If you reanimate a Griselbrand, doesn't that make Griselbrand the more impressive card?
I was thinking of Necropotence and Dark Ritual to be in this list
I opened a pack with an alt art Orcish Bowmasters at the card store. I was like "Here let me scan it" the guy next to me said "Oh no, you definitely made your money off that pack"
My favorite thoughtseize thought is when you think your thoughtseize is the best, but your opponent thoroughly thrashed you by having not only a thoughtseize, but a second thoughtseize to thrash your thirsty ass
I would argue that grief is the best discard spell in the game
I thought necropotence would be on this list it’s also having an umm effect on timeless on arena
Surprised that neither Dark Ritual or Necropotence made it here. Also Contract from Below - wasnt even mentioned lol
I think Bola's Citadel and Necropotence deserver some notable shoutouts.
Yawgmoth's Bargain and Contract From Below are missing
Hello demonic consultation literally banned in every format besides commander, and barely unbanned in it that one as well
what about the big cards in front of the desk like you did for blue and green? it was a great idea did you drop it or just forgot it ?
Dark Ritual and Necropotence are each better than anything else on this list, and together they are MUCH better. Ya'll sleeping on Iceage!
But somehow they are played far less in formats where they are legal 👀
I think it would fun to see a commander game with a price cap on decks, but the top 5 cards in these series don’t count towards the total
Wait, does Yagmawth’s will go infinite with dark ritual?
No Necropotence in top5? sounds crazy
I did not see dark ritual on the list, :(
Play enough commander, and youll eventually see someone Tutor for a basic land... to which is the lynchpin for them winning the game.
I have not watched yet but dark ritual better be on this list.
if demonic tutor is top, why isnt the best discard spell mind twist?
I agree with dark ritual not on the list, it's just an enabler (and so obviously good I don't think it's worth taking up a slot in the list)
I'd argue hymn to tourach and sinkhole should be in the discussion but I like the list
Necropotence, dark ritual, and demonic consultation not being in the list seems wild when magic is very much a commander driven game
thats what you commander players make them think, man how did they survive the first 16 years without it hahahahahahahahahah
@@edstone9890 um... dark rit is a staple in legacy and vintage as well and has been for years... necro was strong enough to get banned in legacy and is also restricted in vintage... As for demonic fair point however how can you refute commander not being the largest format? Also, we've always had these cards since the original commander set in 2011 so your point is what exactly?
Before watching, my guesses are, in some order: Dark Ritual, Necropotence, Yawgmoth's Will, Orcish Bowmasters and... I don't know if they'd pick Hymn to Tourach or Mind Twist or Thoughtseize for the last one.
EDIT: Forgot about Demonic Tutor. Let's see what these dudes say.
Hymn to Tourach? Hahaha
i think sinkhole is also strong 🙌
No contract from below :(
Is the price on demonic tutor right?
Which might be in MH3?
Needs Gary, every mono black players best friend
Necropotence is banned in Legacy and Restricted in Vintage but no Powerfull enough to be in CardMarket´s top 5. Amazing.
And thoughtsieze which isn’t even banned in pioneer made the top 5
Necropotence?
Where is Necropotence?
Honestly I think Vampiric Tutor is better because it has far more utility and safety.
Reanimate number 4???
Reanimate is available in way cheaper variants
I think they needed to make orcish bowmaster 2/2 and cost one {1} more
"Not your point anymore, that was actually still pretty funny"
Where are Guardian Beast, The Abyss, Nether Void, Juzám Djinn and Chains of Mephistopheles?
lol those cards are junk compared to the warping these cards did
T1: Thoughtseize
T2: Pack Rat
FTW
1.Yawgmoth`s Bargain
2.Necropotence
3.Yawgmoth`s will
4.Griselbrand
5.Dark Ritual
Dark Ritual: am I a joke to you!?
No konrad?
Yawgmoth's Will should have been #1 imo, and not even particularly close.
Calling Vamp Tutor as number 1
I was close!
No Sheoldred nor Dark Ritual? That's crazy.
Shouldered costs 4 mana
Sheoldred is not banned in standard, necro is banned in legacy and restricted in vintage but didn’t make the list
I´m not a bad person. I´m just morally flexible
No Necropotence is odd
I would gladly pay 4 life for Thoughtseize.
It's crazy reanimate was a common
I'm hopefully picking up Sheoldred the apocalypse and the one ring soon... Mwa ha ha! So busted!
1.dark ritual
2. Hym
3. Thoughtseize
4.d-tutor
5.reanimate
dark ritual should 100% be on this list, probably over bowmasters tbh
Before watching, and order doesnt matter:
1- Thoughtseize
2- Dark Ritual
3- Reanimate
4- Entomb
5- Sheoldred
Yeah, did not even thought about Yawgmoth's Will or Necropotense. Not sure if i agree with Bowmaster's though, still think that Dark Ritual is more powerfull
2/5. Not Sheoldred? Really? Fells bad
Top 5 black cards is tough. I'm sure there will be some disagreement in comments haha.
"some disagreement" LOL
Am I the only one seeing warhammer minis on the orcish bowmaster?
no necropotence? im sad :(
It's in the honorable mentions. Honestly, there's a pretty obvious top 10 for black cards, but dividing 1-5 from 6-10 is difficult, so I can't blame them
my boy dark ritual is crying in the corner D:
Bit sad there no removal on there, that why black exists! But I guess it understandable as there's no stand out.