So Vitiate's (Old Republic era) end-game was basically the same as Legends Palpatine: - Gain immortality through dark side rituals - Use external proxies to cheat death (clones for palpatine, people for Vitiate) - Have an eternal empire (literally Valkorian) with a massive fleet of unlimited size Only difference is Vitiate mentioned he wanted to try living all aspects of life, whereas Palpatine only wanted to rule.
Actually, he wanted to absorb all life In the Galaxy to maintain immortality and then move on to another galaxy and live different types of lives and repeat the process over again to the end of Universe. Then wait for another universe to form and start the process over again. Essentially he wanted to Omnicide on galactic scales for all eternity and then rest in between them to try different experiences. One of the things I always liked about him is that it seems that unlike palpatine, he really seem to understand through his experiences that nothing lasts forever and that despite how powerful he was his empires he built were never going to last in a long run because nothing ever does due to the forces of entropy. His opinion was that building empires or anything of scale is meaningless in the long run and that life should be enjoyed for what it offers him, and he would do so despite the fact that for him doing so would mean the death of countless beings throughout time.
This would’ve been a great what, if instead of rise of Skywalker, it’s gonna be his plan B or a this would’ve been better than rise Skywalker, if you told anyone
It would have worked better if Palpatine's return was not his own doing. Like have Snoke's plan be to resurrect him. Use the terror caused by the destruction of the NR capital system to enhance his power to pull Palpatine's soul out of the nether.
Palpatine not actually being a Sith has really remained true, because he could never bring himself to raise an actual successor instead of a puppet. _Real_ Sith would see that as the fear and weakness it clearly was.
Eh, I think the essence of being Sith is doing what you want vs. doing what's right/the will of the Force. In that sense, he's the ultimate Sith, unbound by the rules.
One line subverts this: "You will not stop me. Darth Vader will become more powerful than *either of us.* " Unfortunately, yeah, all the rest of his behavior proves you right. Although, perhaps not, now that I think about it, because the whole point of all of that was the total destruction of the Jedi. And, at the time, that had, in fact, come to pass.
I am once again reminded how incredible the sequels could have been by just literally adapting legends material faithfully. They clearly had people on the team who were *very* passionate about the lore as we see a lot of the reall small but meaningful details have *tons* of care and esoteric lore knowledge put into them, so it would basically be a foregone conclusion that it'd have worked and worked well
@@Deltarious to be fair, even the prequels betrayed the source material pretty badly. Political intrigue was always all well and fine to me, but I personally find everyone who's anyone in the galaxy has clone slaves who get sick of it and revolt much more interesting/potential for excitement
In place of the Empire and the New Republic, Palpatine planned to bring about a new form of galactic governance. He would use the dark side to control everything and everyone in the galaxy. What's more, he was capable of it. --Official Starships and Vehicle Collection #64
Canon Sidious is just an evil sorcerer. Legends Sidious is basically a deamon in man's flesh from birth. As imlied in both Dark Empire and the Plagueis novel.
Something I liked about the new thrawn novels was how Timothy Zahn had Ar'alani speak from an outsider's perspective of the Emperor. To the Chiss, Palpatine was a near mythical figure. She essentially shares with Thrawn that the Chiss believe/fear that Palpatine can read minds and see across the Galaxy like an omniscient god. Of course in the Dark Empire series, Palpatine does exhibit (demi)Godlike powers.
He doesn’t exhibit semi-godlike behavior, he exhibits godlike power. His darkside powers are still the most insane we’ve ever seen in the sith handbook. No1 will ever come close to sidious’ power in the darkside.
#AskEck We know that Plagiues helped fund the production of the clone army. We know dooku as Sifo Dias placed the order and we know Palpatine planned to use the clones have a war. But I doubt palpy forsaw kenobi just so happening to know a certain 4 armed chef who just so happens to know what planet a dart came from and kenobi just so happening to be skeptical of Jedi archives and stumbling on kimino. My question is, how did Palpatine originally plan to introduce kimino and the clones to the republic without it raising suspicion. Was a army in the millions just going to show up infront of the senate like “yo a dead Jedi placed a order so here you go have fun”
I think he was expecting to all Jedi other than Anakin to pretty much die, and then present Clone Army to the significantly weakened Jedi (since most of their high council and significant fraction of their master would be dead on Geonosis). And order 66 would most likely happen AFTER Anakin would finish all CIS command as one of few Righteous Jedi, and the rest would be somehow presented as traitors (since in EU it's not unseen of large Jedi fractions being actual traitors).
The original plan seemed to have been, to have used the Trade Federation to violate Senate-backed rights to discredit Republic institutional ability to problem-solve, driving division; and at the height of everyone's frustration, launch a massive, preemptive attack via the CIS across the mid-and-outer rims, that would have done horrific damage. The strike would have discredited the power of the Jedi to keep the peace, especially if the Jedi had failed to relieve Naboo, at which point he would have introduced the Clone Army as his solution, allegedly through Jedi channels. Even if the Jedi themselves were suspicious, it would have driven the Jedi to internally scrutinize themselves mid-war, potentially damaging their cohesion. The war from then-on would have proceeded much the same way, with the whole point and intent behind everything being to maximize political advantage and Jedi deaths. The Republic was going to become The Empire one way or another, and the CIS, even if everything had gone according to plan, would have been put down like a dog too old to hunt anymore, thanks to Palpatine having the shutdown codes to the droid armies.
At this point I'm hoping the current plan is to have Thrawn successfully reconquer the galaxy with Ahsoka being forced to seek out another entrance to the world between worlds in order to retcon the Disney trilogy, which is currently the post-Thrawn timeline, in order to bring it into alignment with the post-Imperial era seen in Legends with Mara, Luke and the Solo twins. This would satisfy fans as they get to see Thrawn achieving an ultimate victory yet still getting his "et tu Brutae" moment just before Ahsoka changes history. This allows the character to reappear in the new continuity as well.
wtf are you even on about? if Thrawn conquered the galaxy then there would be no sequel trilogy because in Episode VII the New Republic had been dominant for about 30 years until the First Order appeared, Thrawn returned about 7 years after Episode VI in Ahsoka, he's obviously not going to destroy the New Republic if this is the ST timeline.
@prometheusmodelow8322 If they use a retcon via the WbW it allowsThrawn to overthrow the New Republic but then history changes, thereby creating a different future where Rey was never hidden on Jakku or something along those lines. In this new timeline, Thrawn can then come back in a way that directly adapts the Zhan trilogy where he is betrayed and murdered by Ruhk.
@@KryyssTV but your premise was that Ahsoka would use the WBW to erase Thrawn defeating the New Republic, and then create the new timeline without the episodes VII-IX basically saying that Thrawn winning would lead to the Sequel Trilogy, which makes no sense, but if using the WBW leads to Thrawn winning then why would Ahsoka use it to alter the normal course of events? But most importantly, and this is something that a lot of people get wrong, the WBW was never established to create different timelines in Rebels, Ezra didin't change the timeline from saving Ahsoka for example, she was always pulled from Malachor by future Ezra, as this is the explanation for why she survived an impossible situation at the end of Season 2, it's all one continuous timeline and all the changes from anyone using the WBW are always present in the timeline, so any action Ahsoka would make in the WBW to alter time has "always happened" so it will not lead to a different timeline with a different future from what is already established.
@AzureWolf-91 palpatine coming back completely nulls anakin bringing balance to the force meaning it makes no sense to hate current Canon surrounding the emperor while praising the exact same thing in legends when it dies exactly the same thing, diminishes anakins achievement of bringing balance to the force.
@@TheAverageGamer1 Bzzzzt. Darth Plagueis and Sidious used a Dark Side ritual to pull the Force out of alignment, which s why the Jedi were losing their power in the prequels. When Sidious died over Endor that balance was restored because the two Sith who initiated the ritual were both gone. Upon return, the Force did not unbalance again-Palpatine would have had to use the same ritual again to pull the Force out of alignment…and given how this ritual took months and Palpatine’s clone bodies were constantly disintegrating, that wasnt an option. Anakin’s sacrifice also saved Luke’s life and probably the entire Rebellion, which would allow there to be a line of defense to take on the reborn Palpatine. So in both respects Anakin’s sacrifice was the essential to defeat the Dark Side for good.
#AskEck How do security cameras work in Star Wars? We’ve seen plenty of instances when they’ve been used in both canon and legends, yet heroes are often in situations like imperial bases (even the Death Star) where they lack any detection when cameras would be a logical necessary security measure.
FTL technology is mature to a point that not only is it basically a commodity that can be traded on a ghetto planet like Tatooine, but they have sensing technology capable of tracking objects moving FTL. Why don’t they have people tracking sensors in their ships?
Refer to Andor They don't expect anyone to dare challenge the Empire They don't care lol Andor literally just walks into an Imperial Base and plunders it pocket full of top secret imperial documents and credits and goes out undetected because Imperials don't care because nobody is that crazy to come anywhere close to an Imperial base Atleast that's what i understood from Andor lol
@@matrix-5466 pretty sure Justin mentioned he had changed up the outro music to avoid being demonetized, and it HAS been different since then. But this time there was no outro, no cute doggie. And Lord Vader is...displeased. :)
Well, dark empire makes so much more sense now… I didn’t realize it was released alongside the Thrawn trilogy to test the waters of the Legends timeline Good to know the next time someone rants to me using dark empire as an excuse to make the Thrawn Trilogy look bad
#askEck How does the scale of star wars function in lore? if there are trillions of beings on countless industrialised worlds why isn't there bigger fleets and armies? such is the empires fleet of 25000 star destroyers? how would they be able to control the galaxy with such a small fleet or why did they not attempt to make more.
They had countless other classifications of ships as well, spread throught the galaxy, in far greater numbers than SD's. Smaller outlying territories systems would be maintained by a range of smaller, older, or cheaper vessels, with lower crew requirements like the Carrack, the Republic era Dreadnought, the Ton Falk/Quasar class escort carriers or the Victory Class line of heavy Frigates. Even with all that, they still didn't have enough to protect it all perpetually, a fact the rebellion exploited - and the unknown regions where hyperspace travel is near impossible covers a massive expanse of the galaxy, where neither the empire or anyone else maintained any form of control.
25,000 spread over millions of systems. I think Lucas said the Old Republic was composed of over 20,000 member worlds... Even if you just guard the member worlds, that's only 1 or 2 per system. Scale in SW isn't always consistent, but a Star Destroyer was a pretty impressive force by itself. You rarely needed more than one in a system. So dozens of them is a large fleet.
@Goldenclad17 Yeah. When I first watched Star Wars in my youth, I justified in my head that the "Galactic Empire" had just enough forces in 3 movies to completely collapse from the Rebel victories on screen. I tried to justify it in my head because most people thought the Empire was completely eliminated after the Battle Of Endor. That victory ending did create a small scale for Star Wars.
Come to think of it; Palpatine is kind of a classic example of a theologian gone bad- I mean it: he's not so interested in ruling at all; what he *wants* is to manipulate access to their afterlife's inhabitants; he'd be perfectly happy even having to continually fend off the Rebellion if he himself had sole access to the Force's secrets, and to do *that* he needed a Jedi who was neither light nor dark to get indirect access to a Jedi Holocron's secrets he had obtained.
8:07. According to the Dark Empire Sourcebook this is the exact reason why Sheev had the Empire obssess over building massive ships. This way the larger the ship, the more people on board the dark side user can suck the lifeforce from while "in the field" on a mission.
Palp always have plans noone knows about until years after it was planned definitely all about the long game. This mofo would plant a redwood tree and wait for it to fully grow.
Haha, instead of evaporating on the golden throne, he ends up teleported to a galaxy a long time ago, far away… and without big E he had to become the emperor himself 😂
It actually goes even further than insofar as Palpatine ultimately wanted to expand what he was doing on the world of Byss to everywhere else in the Galaxy ( and presumably the rest of the universe once he started conquering other galaxies ) and ultimately become a sort of universal space energy vampire that controlled the energy flows of all life in the universe and thus would be the embodiment of the Force itself in a way. The Empire was only an engine to spready misery and darkness across the galaxy/universe to increase the presence of the Darkside and thus his own power. Edit: Ah, I see you saved that tidbit for the end of the video, good stuff.
I got a video idea if you're interested? So basically what if all the nations that participated in world war II (including the Axis powers) went up against a CIS invasion fleet. Of course they wouldn't go up against the capital ships but I'm talking about the ground units primarily.
So, has there always been a plan to bring him back but Disney simply butchered it or was it only viewed as a possible adaptation among other scenarios?
@@annapocalypsezero4719 Which is ironic, given the Dark Empire series was one of the least liked aspects of post Endor Legends material. Yet that's what they went with 😅
Simply put there was no solid plan. Disney had intended for a different director to do their own thing for each movie. Bringing in Palpatine was an over-correction to the response to Last Jedi.
#askeck How do non force users in the galaxy align themselves with different sides of the force? People in the galaxy say the words "May the force be with you" and such so there are obviously people who believe in the force and plenty who have seen Jedi and Sith fight each other. But how do their values align with this. Who exactly during the era of the old republic chose to fight for the Sith?
Well, a real life example would be the nazi's, or other conquering empire's throughout history. It simply was in their interest to build an idealistic world that benefited them and only them, and they genuinly thought that what they where doing was the right thing to do, or in their rights to clame so. There are ofc other reasons to why people side with evil ofc like desperation, fear or greed. One thing to keep in mind when it comes to this sort of thing is that morality is a subjetive subjet, which means there is technically no such thing as good or evil, only perspectives, and perspectives can and will be manipulated by those in power. So, in conclusion, its honestly not that suprising how so many people in the star wars galaxy or in real life for that matter who are totally willing to side with what we refer to as evil factions.
so palpatine's endgame was to essentially sucking out the force within the galaxy if not the universe for his own power like how the rakata's star forge did by feeding off the dark side
#AskEck I've always wondered how Maul built his syndicate because recently I was watching Solo Story again, and I know his revenge story in the Clone Wars, but I lost track with everything and I don't think I've seen a video on it. So I'm politely asking if you could put together a video explaining the chain of events and why. I think it would be really cool to see the full story and anything we've missed and sum it up. Also I love your channel and it's one of the few I go to for real star wars lore
I always wonder for characters like this what do you after that? Like you reach the highest level of power and authority possible for eternity. So now what? You gotta get pretty bored of that after awhile. I imagine you just purposely loosen your grip a little and allow a resistance to crush back into submission just for the satisfaction of doing something
Dark Empire was strange but I think most of its problems came down to it being a late 80s/early 90s comic book. It was more of a comic that had Star Wars stuff in it than it was a Star Wars comic, if that makes sense to anyone (especially since Star Wars canon, Legends or film, was still a very loose concept at this stage). As a result the pacing was _extreme_ and it would bring out these wildlly insanely high-scale concepts just out of the blue and we'd just have to take it. But that said, I actually really like a lot of the concepts Dark Empire brought to the table. I don't think most of the concepts couldn't even work in Star Wars, in fact I think just about all of them could fit so long as the story was properly paced around these grand ideas, and introduced them at a slower rate that was more digestible to the audience. Essentially, I think DE would have benefited heavily from a _series_ of novelizations that went into greater detail on these ideas, expanded on them further, and found ways to have better fit them into what we knew Legends canon to be like while still keeping the scope and scale. Because the idea of Palpatine trying to become immortal so he could become not just an eternal galactic Emperor but universal owner is the kind of stupid awesome that makes me love Palpatine as a villain in the first place.
#AskEck What exactly was the Galactic Alliance? More specifically what actually made it different from the New Republic? It's name and the fact that there were some semi independent member states like Hapes and the Imperial Remnant (for a time at least) imply that it was meant to be some sort of free association of planets/systems. But other aspects make it seem like some kind of centralized government. Was it's core territory just a new version of the New Republic or was it some kind of confederation of worlds?
He smiled he achieved his grand ambition, thanks to him and a pact made with an entity so Evil and cruel, he managed to achieve his true ambition. His Grand Plan achieved the heroes,which ones stopped him were dead, the Skywalker line finished. Now he waits and ponders, because the Entity is gone, having lost insterest or something he didnt care. Now the galaxy was ripe with incompetence and idiocy. He opened his eyes, he was reincarnated in his bloodline. Even that failure served his plans in the end. No one was left to stop him and as he heard his mother speak: he smiled, for now it was just a simple matter of rising to power. It was inevetable fate.
#AskEck in the first few episodes of the clones wars do you believe the Malovalence could have destroyed the medical station by just turbo laser fire alone rather than target Skywalkers group
Considering it took the spirits of all the Jedi in history to restrain his spirit to the Netherworld of the Force even after being divested of a body in Dark Empire, the Force was probably less amused and more disturbed, especially by Sidious transforming its "Chosen One/Jesus" figure into his own Dark Enforcer and Right Hand and planning to do the same with the entire bloodline of the Force's child in mockery of it on his path to replacing it as the foundational force directing the flow of life and events in the universe.
So this line was written before the prequels were a thing. That was obviously the implication back in 1991, but we know that wasn't the case due to the events of the prequels and all the other EU lore that's since come out. Most likely, Palpatine is lying to Luke or being non-literal.
@@AzureWolf-91 The EU doesn't depict every moment in the 33 years between Revenge of the Sith and Dark Empire. He could've done it multiple times and we would have no way of knowing.
Can you make a video about what the separatists were planning after the war? Did they have plans for exploration or colonization? Did the corporate separatists actually believe palpatine would let them help him run the empire as the “great reward” mentioned in the ROTS novelization or did they think was he going to pay them off and let them leave? What about separatists like grievous? Mina Bonteri? Is there even any material that covers this? #askeck
#AskEck I was wondering about your thoughts on a couple of in-universe explanatory theories regarding technology that I've cobbled together from online and from my own thoughts; 1: That the Old Republic game setting (Great Wars era) looks so similar to the OG 6 movies aesthetically because of a rumored "Dark Age" between that time and the Sith Wars leading up to the Brotherhood of Darkness/Ruusan Reformation and rise of Bane, a sort of technological reset where a LOT of in-use tech and culture was lost and had to be regained? 2: That the eccentricities of visual range space combat and space combat in general, such as the over manning of ships, being a galactic cultural prejudice against AI, droids, and automation? Given how many Droid Rebellions have happened in both canons and the recent Clone Wars souring everyone on the idea of AI controlled ship weaponry and function? Edit: the out of universe explanations of course being that the ToR developers wanted to draw in the casual SW movie audience and not the niche KotOR audience, and that Lucas wanted to evoke WWII dogfighting and the tech he was familiar with was very analog anyway. Funnily enough, we in real life have made great strides SW hasn't in terms of wireless networking and tech miniaturization
I like the version of SW in which Palpatine is a multi dimensional character and not just a weird old space wizard who only wants to rule for rules sake. I think these stories in which there is a purpose to him ruling; in which he likes art and the rituals is a form of mysticism so he's like the last representative of an extinct culture. This would differ him from Vitiae. I read a bunch of books with Vitiae back in the days (he's not game-only character) and it's ok if in SW universe there is one absolute sith abomination of an emperor but if every emperor is basically the same, it becomes superficial, artificial and stupid.
#AskEck Why is it that in Revenge of the Sith, the B2 battledroids on Utapau have an extra red photoreceptor on their backs? I haven't been able to find an explanation or acknoledgement of this anywhere and was wondering if you had come across something that mentions it. Surely I can't be imagining this every time I watch the movie
Guess I can go to bed 8 minutes and 45 seconds later
Same here lol!
Same
Wait… you can go to bed?
🤣👍
Same lololol
So Vitiate's (Old Republic era) end-game was basically the same as Legends Palpatine:
- Gain immortality through dark side rituals
- Use external proxies to cheat death (clones for palpatine, people for Vitiate)
- Have an eternal empire (literally Valkorian) with a massive fleet of unlimited size
Only difference is Vitiate mentioned he wanted to try living all aspects of life, whereas Palpatine only wanted to rule.
Palps would've gone down that route eventually. I believe it was implied Vitiate simply got bored and decided to start RPing.
@@Korijenkins1414 True, we met Vitiate after he had ruled for like 1300 years, palpatine was what, 90 at the battle of endor?
Actually, he wanted to absorb all life In the Galaxy to maintain immortality and then move on to another galaxy and live different types of lives and repeat the process over again to the end of Universe. Then wait for another universe to form and start the process over again. Essentially he wanted to Omnicide on galactic scales for all eternity and then rest in between them to try different experiences. One of the things I always liked about him is that it seems that unlike palpatine, he really seem to understand through his experiences that nothing lasts forever and that despite how powerful he was his empires he built were never going to last in a long run because nothing ever does due to the forces of entropy. His opinion was that building empires or anything of scale is meaningless in the long run and that life should be enjoyed for what it offers him, and he would do so despite the fact that for him doing so would mean the death of countless beings throughout time.
So, both basically a normal "immortal ruler" plan, just with too many extra steps and personal fetish kinks?
@@TheArklyte In a sense yes. He said he wanted to be a farmer or a painter as part of his experiences.
Palpatine would plan to return, somehow.
This would’ve been a great what, if instead of rise of Skywalker, it’s gonna be his plan B or a this would’ve been better than rise Skywalker, if you told anyone
Star Wars humor consists of like 10 jokes that have so disgustingly overused that’s is genuinely annoying to see ts
It would have worked better if Palpatine's return was not his own doing. Like have Snoke's plan be to resurrect him. Use the terror caused by the destruction of the NR capital system to enhance his power to pull Palpatine's soul out of the nether.
*fires death star laser at your location*
His ambition left unchecked basically means death for the universe.
It wouldn’t be death for the universe.
@@UltraBrian perhaps not but for some planets it would be like dac for instance.
@@UltraBrian Might as well be. We'd all just be zombies that feed him our energy under his power.
Death of the universe would had been a mercy.
Palpatine not actually being a Sith has really remained true, because he could never bring himself to raise an actual successor instead of a puppet. _Real_ Sith would see that as the fear and weakness it clearly was.
Bane would've murked his ass
He adhered to the sith philosophy but he himself was not loyal to the sith order itself.
Eh, I think the essence of being Sith is doing what you want vs. doing what's right/the will of the Force. In that sense, he's the ultimate Sith, unbound by the rules.
One line subverts this: "You will not stop me. Darth Vader will become more powerful than *either of us.* "
Unfortunately, yeah, all the rest of his behavior proves you right. Although, perhaps not, now that I think about it, because the whole point of all of that was the total destruction of the Jedi. And, at the time, that had, in fact, come to pass.
ANOTHER ACE COMBAT FAN??
"As he ascends to some other plane. But that's all for today"....
Dude
I know, right?
this is worse than "somehow palpatine returned" and "I'm the spy"
The only wait to fight him would be in other planes of existence.
I am once again reminded how incredible the sequels could have been by just literally adapting legends material faithfully. They clearly had people on the team who were *very* passionate about the lore as we see a lot of the reall small but meaningful details have *tons* of care and esoteric lore knowledge put into them, so it would basically be a foregone conclusion that it'd have worked and worked well
It's kind of a shame that it never became that. Though in my opinion I kinda prefer what Lucas had in the idea of the sequels.
Yeah really, Disney had the background work done on like 45 movies for them by insanely passionate fans and tossed it all out.
@@Deltarious to be fair, even the prequels betrayed the source material pretty badly. Political intrigue was always all well and fine to me, but I personally find everyone who's anyone in the galaxy has clone slaves who get sick of it and revolt much more interesting/potential for excitement
Movies never follow legends material ever.
@@RandyEdwards-mz8xn "betrayed the source material"?? Bruh, what?? Lucas WAS the source material 😂 Ep I - VI are all his design lol
In place of the Empire and the New Republic, Palpatine planned to bring about a new form of galactic governance. He would use the dark side to control everything and everyone in the galaxy. What's more, he was capable of it.
--Official Starships and Vehicle Collection #64
But how does that actually work? Does everyone just lose emotional control and go on rage benders?
@@specialnewb9821 ...Mind control
Wait… so in the end, Palpatine wanted to be interned on the golden throne?!
No . He wanted more than to be a golden criple
He's Palpatine! He's completely insane so it's not surprising
Incredibly, still one of the more sane sith
Oh no hes sane just evil lol
@@whitemamba0089 "evil is a point of view" as he would say
canon fans: dark empire sucks
legends fans: dark empire sucks
There are a lot of people who love Dark Empire actually
I loved Dark Empire 1.
The sequels to it?... not so much.
I like both 🤷♂️
Dark Empire slaps.
Canon Sidious is just an evil sorcerer. Legends Sidious is basically a deamon in man's flesh from birth. As imlied in both Dark Empire and the Plagueis novel.
I think..."beast" would be a better word than demon.
@AzureWolf-91 I think demon better suits his cunning and intelligence. Beast is, well just a beast.
6:06 well on youtube there’s a supposed deleted scene of a new hope that takes place in the death star meeting and the mention the word “Sith Lord”
They do mention it, as does the comic adaption and all the toy merchandise, but there was no definition for what a Sith actually was.
@ ohhh didn’t know about that thanks
Palpatine has been a psychopath since birth, him doing messed up plans make sense ;-;
Something I liked about the new thrawn novels was how Timothy Zahn had Ar'alani speak from an outsider's perspective of the Emperor. To the Chiss, Palpatine was a near mythical figure. She essentially shares with Thrawn that the Chiss believe/fear that Palpatine can read minds and see across the Galaxy like an omniscient god. Of course in the Dark Empire series, Palpatine does exhibit (demi)Godlike powers.
He doesn’t exhibit semi-godlike behavior, he exhibits godlike power. His darkside powers are still the most insane we’ve ever seen in the sith handbook. No1 will ever come close to sidious’ power in the darkside.
And Palpatine wept, for he had no more worlds to conquer
I know I had nothing to do with this, but I’ve been asking for this for a while! Amazing video as usual, Eck.
Dark empire was such a strange series, and I love to see it covered. The art in the comics was amazing
#AskEck We know that Plagiues helped fund the production of the clone army. We know dooku as Sifo Dias placed the order and we know Palpatine planned to use the clones have a war. But I doubt palpy forsaw kenobi just so happening to know a certain 4 armed chef who just so happens to know what planet a dart came from and kenobi just so happening to be skeptical of Jedi archives and stumbling on kimino. My question is, how did Palpatine originally plan to introduce kimino and the clones to the republic without it raising suspicion. Was a army in the millions just going to show up infront of the senate like “yo a dead Jedi placed a order so here you go have fun”
I think he was expecting to all Jedi other than Anakin to pretty much die, and then present Clone Army to the significantly weakened Jedi (since most of their high council and significant fraction of their master would be dead on Geonosis). And order 66 would most likely happen AFTER Anakin would finish all CIS command as one of few Righteous Jedi, and the rest would be somehow presented as traitors (since in EU it's not unseen of large Jedi fractions being actual traitors).
The original plan seemed to have been, to have used the Trade Federation to violate Senate-backed rights to discredit Republic institutional ability to problem-solve, driving division; and at the height of everyone's frustration, launch a massive, preemptive attack via the CIS across the mid-and-outer rims, that would have done horrific damage. The strike would have discredited the power of the Jedi to keep the peace, especially if the Jedi had failed to relieve Naboo, at which point he would have introduced the Clone Army as his solution, allegedly through Jedi channels. Even if the Jedi themselves were suspicious, it would have driven the Jedi to internally scrutinize themselves mid-war, potentially damaging their cohesion.
The war from then-on would have proceeded much the same way, with the whole point and intent behind everything being to maximize political advantage and Jedi deaths. The Republic was going to become The Empire one way or another, and the CIS, even if everything had gone according to plan, would have been put down like a dog too old to hunt anymore, thanks to Palpatine having the shutdown codes to the droid armies.
Love how you added a clip from jedi knight dark force 2. Amazing game
It had great live action cutscenes, but as a 3D game it's very dated and jank, the movement system is awful.
so the emperor of the galactic empire wanted to become...the emperor of mankind
The man emperor of mankind
At this point I'm hoping the current plan is to have Thrawn successfully reconquer the galaxy with Ahsoka being forced to seek out another entrance to the world between worlds in order to retcon the Disney trilogy, which is currently the post-Thrawn timeline, in order to bring it into alignment with the post-Imperial era seen in Legends with Mara, Luke and the Solo twins.
This would satisfy fans as they get to see Thrawn achieving an ultimate victory yet still getting his "et tu Brutae" moment just before Ahsoka changes history. This allows the character to reappear in the new continuity as well.
God, I fucking wish
Lol no, Filoni and Favraeu have both acknowledged that the sequel trilogy ultimately plays out. Nice cope tho 👍
wtf are you even on about? if Thrawn conquered the galaxy then there would be no sequel trilogy because in Episode VII the New Republic had been dominant for about 30 years until the First Order appeared, Thrawn returned about 7 years after Episode VI in Ahsoka, he's obviously not going to destroy the New Republic if this is the ST timeline.
@prometheusmodelow8322 If they use a retcon via the WbW it allowsThrawn to overthrow the New Republic but then history changes, thereby creating a different future where Rey was never hidden on Jakku or something along those lines. In this new timeline, Thrawn can then come back in a way that directly adapts the Zhan trilogy where he is betrayed and murdered by Ruhk.
@@KryyssTV but your premise was that Ahsoka would use the WBW to erase Thrawn defeating the New Republic, and then create the new timeline without the episodes VII-IX basically saying that Thrawn winning would lead to the Sequel Trilogy, which makes no sense, but if using the WBW leads to Thrawn winning then why would Ahsoka use it to alter the normal course of events?
But most importantly, and this is something that a lot of people get wrong, the WBW was never established to create different timelines in Rebels, Ezra didin't change the timeline from saving Ahsoka for example, she was always pulled from Malachor by future Ezra, as this is the explanation for why she survived an impossible situation at the end of Season 2, it's all one continuous timeline and all the changes from anyone using the WBW are always present in the timeline, so any action Ahsoka would make in the WBW to alter time has "always happened" so it will not lead to a different timeline with a different future from what is already established.
It’s so refreshing to hear “more liked by the fans, so they did what they wanted”
*Any* return of Palpatine undermines the saga.
I disagree, but I'd hear why you feel that is the case.
Somehow I feel like it does somehow
Palpatine is the only real heel.
@AzureWolf-91 palpatine coming back completely nulls anakin bringing balance to the force meaning it makes no sense to hate current Canon surrounding the emperor while praising the exact same thing in legends when it dies exactly the same thing, diminishes anakins achievement of bringing balance to the force.
@@TheAverageGamer1 Bzzzzt. Darth Plagueis and Sidious used a Dark Side ritual to pull the Force out of alignment, which s why the Jedi were losing their power in the prequels. When Sidious died over Endor that balance was restored because the two Sith who initiated the ritual were both gone. Upon return, the Force did not unbalance again-Palpatine would have had to use the same ritual again to pull the Force out of alignment…and given how this ritual took months and Palpatine’s clone bodies were constantly disintegrating, that wasnt an option.
Anakin’s sacrifice also saved Luke’s life and probably the entire Rebellion, which would allow there to be a line of defense to take on the reborn Palpatine. So in both respects Anakin’s sacrifice was the essential to defeat the Dark Side for good.
Can we take a moment to appreciate Sedriss' very '90s hairstyle?
We can always take a moment to appreciate Sedriss.
#AskEck
How do security cameras work in Star Wars? We’ve seen plenty of instances when they’ve been used in both canon and legends, yet heroes are often in situations like imperial bases (even the Death Star) where they lack any detection when cameras would be a logical necessary security measure.
FTL technology is mature to a point that not only is it basically a commodity that can be traded on a ghetto planet like Tatooine, but they have sensing technology capable of tracking objects moving FTL.
Why don’t they have people tracking sensors in their ships?
Refer to Andor
They don't expect anyone to dare challenge the Empire
They don't care lol
Andor literally just walks into an Imperial Base and plunders it pocket full of top secret imperial documents and credits and goes out undetected because Imperials don't care because nobody is that crazy to come anywhere close to an Imperial base
Atleast that's what i understood from Andor lol
@@kajmak64bit76yeah but it's not like security cameras would cost a lot of money
I feel like this video conveys his plan much better than the actual comic lol
Hmm, I found your lack of the doggie clip at the end...disturbing. :)
UA-cam: copyright claim his outro music so he gets no money!
Mods: my lord, is that legal?
UA-cam: I will make it legal!
@@matrix-5466 pretty sure Justin mentioned he had changed up the outro music to avoid being demonetized, and it HAS been different since then. But this time there was no outro, no cute doggie. And Lord Vader is...displeased. :)
Very true.
I have the dark empire source book some where. I will have to dig it out a and look at it .. Bit of a rpg nerd back in the day.
0:19 What game is this that's in the background?
Star Wars Empire at War. Great game with a huge modding community. Highly recommend.
@haydenburns292 thank you
@@redeemer9754welcome to the family
So his plan was to turn into the 40k God Emperor
Well, dark empire makes so much more sense now… I didn’t realize it was released alongside the Thrawn trilogy to test the waters of the Legends timeline
Good to know the next time someone rants to me using dark empire as an excuse to make the Thrawn Trilogy look bad
Resonance is such a great piece of music.
I want a story about a worker getting lost on the eclipse, and taking an entire week to walk the 40 km back to their post
#askEck
How does the scale of star wars function in lore? if there are trillions of beings on countless industrialised worlds why isn't there bigger fleets and armies? such is the empires fleet of 25000 star destroyers? how would they be able to control the galaxy with such a small fleet or why did they not attempt to make more.
All the citizenry was addicted to holonet dramas and social media
They had countless other classifications of ships as well, spread throught the galaxy, in far greater numbers than SD's. Smaller outlying territories systems would be maintained by a range of smaller, older, or cheaper vessels, with lower crew requirements like the Carrack, the Republic era Dreadnought, the Ton Falk/Quasar class escort carriers or the Victory Class line of heavy Frigates. Even with all that, they still didn't have enough to protect it all perpetually, a fact the rebellion exploited - and the unknown regions where hyperspace travel is near impossible covers a massive expanse of the galaxy, where neither the empire or anyone else maintained any form of control.
Star Wars just doesn't understand scale
25,000 spread over millions of systems. I think Lucas said the Old Republic was composed of over 20,000 member worlds... Even if you just guard the member worlds, that's only 1 or 2 per system.
Scale in SW isn't always consistent, but a Star Destroyer was a pretty impressive force by itself. You rarely needed more than one in a system. So dozens of them is a large fleet.
@Goldenclad17 Yeah. When I first watched Star Wars in my youth, I justified in my head that the "Galactic Empire" had just enough forces in 3 movies to completely collapse from the Rebel victories on screen. I tried to justify it in my head because most people thought the Empire was completely eliminated after the Battle Of Endor. That victory ending did create a small scale for Star Wars.
Come to think of it; Palpatine is kind of a classic example of a theologian gone bad- I mean it: he's not so interested in ruling at all; what he *wants* is to manipulate access to their afterlife's inhabitants; he'd be perfectly happy even having to continually fend off the Rebellion if he himself had sole access to the Force's secrets, and to do *that* he needed a Jedi who was neither light nor dark to get indirect access to a Jedi Holocron's secrets he had obtained.
So his ambition was to become the Warhammer 40K god emperor- never dying and fuelled by the souls of universe-connected beings.
Life goals I guess.
Cut scene at the 4:00 minutes mark. What game is that from?
8:07. According to the Dark Empire Sourcebook this is the exact reason why Sheev had the Empire obssess over building massive ships. This way the larger the ship, the more people on board the dark side user can suck the lifeforce from while "in the field" on a mission.
0:05
Space marine: HERECY!!!
Love the "go for papa palatine" robot chicken reference at the beginning.
I should read Dark Empire again. It was hokey and silly sometimes, steampunk spaceships anyone? But the hand drawn and painted art is spectacular.
do a run through of the audio drama if you haven't, really good
that's the only version I've ever had
Palp always have plans noone knows about until years after it was planned definitely all about the long game. This mofo would plant a redwood tree and wait for it to fully grow.
Damn malcador had some ambition
Haha, instead of evaporating on the golden throne, he ends up teleported to a galaxy a long time ago, far away… and without big E he had to become the emperor himself 😂
It actually goes even further than insofar as Palpatine ultimately wanted to expand what he was doing on the world of Byss to everywhere else in the Galaxy ( and presumably the rest of the universe once he started conquering other galaxies ) and ultimately become a sort of universal space energy vampire that controlled the energy flows of all life in the universe and thus would be the embodiment of the Force itself in a way. The Empire was only an engine to spready misery and darkness across the galaxy/universe to increase the presence of the Darkside and thus his own power.
Edit: Ah, I see you saved that tidbit for the end of the video, good stuff.
I got a video idea if you're interested? So basically what if all the nations that participated in world war II (including the Axis powers) went up against a CIS invasion fleet. Of course they wouldn't go up against the capital ships but I'm talking about the ground units primarily.
He’s not Papa Palpatine, he’s Skeevy Sheev!
So, has there always been a plan to bring him back but Disney simply butchered it or was it only viewed as a possible adaptation among other scenarios?
It was a possible idea, disney pretty much tried to do a entire dark empire arc in one film.
@@annapocalypsezero4719
Which is ironic, given the Dark Empire series was one of the least liked aspects of post Endor Legends material. Yet that's what they went with 😅
@@Neognostic-pk5wu They then took Legacy of the Force, an even MORE hated aspect of Legends and combined the two.
Simply put there was no solid plan. Disney had intended for a different director to do their own thing for each movie. Bringing in Palpatine was an over-correction to the response to Last Jedi.
Whats Scarcer is that someone told me george lucas stated that dark empire palpatine is weaker that the one vader killed.
George Lucas never had any lore to add to the expanded universe. As far as he was concerned Palpatine returning simply never happened.
#askeck How do non force users in the galaxy align themselves with different sides of the force? People in the galaxy say the words "May the force be with you" and such so there are obviously people who believe in the force and plenty who have seen Jedi and Sith fight each other. But how do their values align with this. Who exactly during the era of the old republic chose to fight for the Sith?
Well, a real life example would be the nazi's, or other conquering empire's throughout history. It simply was in their interest to build an idealistic world that benefited them and only them, and they genuinly thought that what they where doing was the right thing to do, or in their rights to clame so. There are ofc other reasons to why people side with evil ofc like desperation, fear or greed.
One thing to keep in mind when it comes to this sort of thing is that morality is a subjetive subjet, which means there is technically no such thing as good or evil, only perspectives, and perspectives can and will be manipulated by those in power.
So, in conclusion, its honestly not that suprising how so many people in the star wars galaxy or in real life for that matter who are totally willing to side with what we refer to as evil factions.
It is funny this section of legends was seen as iffy is now seen seen as well written compared to the last two sequels.
Degradation of writing and overall quality of everything around us.
So, Palpatine built his own version of the Starforge ok the Rakata Empire.
so palpatine's endgame was to essentially sucking out the force within the galaxy if not the universe for his own power like how the rakata's star forge did by feeding off the dark side
Oh man I wanted to see him play with the cute dog in the ending
#AskEck
I've always wondered how Maul built his syndicate because recently I was watching Solo Story again, and I know his revenge story in the Clone Wars, but I lost track with everything and I don't think I've seen a video on it. So I'm politely asking if you could put together a video explaining the chain of events and why. I think it would be really cool to see the full story and anything we've missed and sum it up. Also I love your channel and it's one of the few I go to for real star wars lore
Congrats on being one of the few people ever to pronounce the word "ichor" correctly (in my opinion) :D
In a way that's actually explained Palpatine returns
I always wonder for characters like this what do you after that? Like you reach the highest level of power and authority possible for eternity. So now what? You gotta get pretty bored of that after awhile. I imagine you just purposely loosen your grip a little and allow a resistance to crush back into submission just for the satisfaction of doing something
Dark Empire was strange but I think most of its problems came down to it being a late 80s/early 90s comic book. It was more of a comic that had Star Wars stuff in it than it was a Star Wars comic, if that makes sense to anyone (especially since Star Wars canon, Legends or film, was still a very loose concept at this stage). As a result the pacing was _extreme_ and it would bring out these wildlly insanely high-scale concepts just out of the blue and we'd just have to take it.
But that said, I actually really like a lot of the concepts Dark Empire brought to the table. I don't think most of the concepts couldn't even work in Star Wars, in fact I think just about all of them could fit so long as the story was properly paced around these grand ideas, and introduced them at a slower rate that was more digestible to the audience. Essentially, I think DE would have benefited heavily from a _series_ of novelizations that went into greater detail on these ideas, expanded on them further, and found ways to have better fit them into what we knew Legends canon to be like while still keeping the scope and scale.
Because the idea of Palpatine trying to become immortal so he could become not just an eternal galactic Emperor but universal owner is the kind of stupid awesome that makes me love Palpatine as a villain in the first place.
What’s more messed up is that I gotta watch a video to find out what SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE MOVIE, all we got is “somehow palpatine returned”
The Sith always seeked power to overcome Abeloth.
They couldn’t, as powerful as Sidious is, nothing could overcome Abeloth’s power unless Sidious would’ve aligned with Luke. Even then it’s a stretch.
What game or games are displayed showing the massive fleets fighting?!
It's pretty much a space version of the Final Empire from Mistborn.
Is it just me or does the Emperor draining the lifeforce of millions of beings sound awfully like WH40k's Emperor of Man draining billions of Psykers?
#AskEck What exactly was the Galactic Alliance? More specifically what actually made it different from the New Republic?
It's name and the fact that there were some semi independent member states like Hapes and the Imperial Remnant (for a time at least) imply that it was meant to be some sort of free association of planets/systems. But other aspects make it seem like some kind of centralized government.
Was it's core territory just a new version of the New Republic or was it some kind of confederation of worlds?
Luckily, that never came to pass!
-JMM
Bottom line. Sidious was no Nihilus, he was no Vitiate/Valkorion.
Yup, he was superior
So is goal was a universal Infinite Tsukuyomi with himself as god.
He smiled he achieved his grand ambition, thanks to him and a pact made with an entity so Evil and cruel, he managed to achieve his true ambition. His Grand Plan achieved the heroes,which ones stopped him were dead, the Skywalker line finished. Now he waits and ponders, because the Entity is gone, having lost insterest or something he didnt care. Now the galaxy was ripe with incompetence and idiocy. He opened his eyes, he was reincarnated in his bloodline. Even that failure served his plans in the end. No one was left to stop him and as he heard his mother speak: he smiled, for now it was just a simple matter of rising to power. It was inevetable fate.
It was Palpatine all along!
So bro wanted control above all else. Yeah that sounds about right for him
#AskEck in the first few episodes of the clones wars do you believe the Malovalence could have destroyed the medical station by just turbo laser fire alone rather than target Skywalkers group
I loved these comics and books from the 1990's
Palpatine returns in Legends by cloning himself; nobody bats an eye.
He does the exact same thing in Canon and EVERYONE LOSES THEIR MINDS
yeah but in legends it was way cooler
Just remember Luke Skywalker died from being tired........
So Palpatine's grand plan was to create a universe sized Matrix?
Eck says kilometers. Bro must be Canadian
The Force found a live one in Palpatine. He brought them so much amusement trying to be God.
Considering it took the spirits of all the Jedi in history to restrain his spirit to the Netherworld of the Force even after being divested of a body in Dark Empire, the Force was probably less amused and more disturbed, especially by Sidious transforming its "Chosen One/Jesus" figure into his own Dark Enforcer and Right Hand and planning to do the same with the entire bloodline of the Force's child in mockery of it on his path to replacing it as the foundational force directing the flow of life and events in the universe.
I always hated Luke's haircut
#AskEck What did Palpetine mean when he says it’s not the first time he died, was he already in a clone body at Endor?
That seems to be what he's implying. That he'd already successfully used Essence Transfer to inhabit a new body by that point.
So this line was written before the prequels were a thing. That was obviously the implication back in 1991, but we know that wasn't the case due to the events of the prequels and all the other EU lore that's since come out. Most likely, Palpatine is lying to Luke or being non-literal.
@@AzureWolf-91 The EU doesn't depict every moment in the 33 years between Revenge of the Sith and Dark Empire. He could've done it multiple times and we would have no way of knowing.
@@williamhenning4700 True, I just feel it works better if his death at Endor had truly been the first.
@@AzureWolf-91 it works better thematically for sure. Though the impact of Vader’s internal change remains.
Did Palpatine really name drop Ulec Qel-Droma? Was this before or after he and Exar Kun turned to the Dark Side?
im curious, are the empire at war clips you playing?
Can you make a video about what the separatists were planning after the war? Did they have plans for exploration or colonization? Did the corporate separatists actually believe palpatine would let them help him run the empire as the “great reward” mentioned in the ROTS novelization or did they think was he going to pay them off and let them leave? What about separatists like grievous? Mina Bonteri? Is there even any material that covers this? #askeck
After the original series, the Dark Empire is the second best series
What game is being played?
#AskEck I was wondering about your thoughts on a couple of in-universe explanatory theories regarding technology that I've cobbled together from online and from my own thoughts;
1: That the Old Republic game setting (Great Wars era) looks so similar to the OG 6 movies aesthetically because of a rumored "Dark Age" between that time and the Sith Wars leading up to the Brotherhood of Darkness/Ruusan Reformation and rise of Bane, a sort of technological reset where a LOT of in-use tech and culture was lost and had to be regained?
2: That the eccentricities of visual range space combat and space combat in general, such as the over manning of ships, being a galactic cultural prejudice against AI, droids, and automation? Given how many Droid Rebellions have happened in both canons and the recent Clone Wars souring everyone on the idea of AI controlled ship weaponry and function?
Edit: the out of universe explanations of course being that the ToR developers wanted to draw in the casual SW movie audience and not the niche KotOR audience, and that Lucas wanted to evoke WWII dogfighting and the tech he was familiar with was very analog anyway. Funnily enough, we in real life have made great strides SW hasn't in terms of wireless networking and tech miniaturization
#askeck what is the capital ship combat game that play in the background of your videos
It's called Empire at War - likely the Forces of Corruption sequel - but a modded version.
I like the version of SW in which Palpatine is a multi dimensional character and not just a weird old space wizard who only wants to rule for rules sake. I think these stories in which there is a purpose to him ruling; in which he likes art and the rituals is a form of mysticism so he's like the last representative of an extinct culture. This would differ him from Vitiae. I read a bunch of books with Vitiae back in the days (he's not game-only character) and it's ok if in SW universe there is one absolute sith abomination of an emperor but if every emperor is basically the same, it becomes superficial, artificial and stupid.
He could’ve destroyed the Vong with all that. I believe.
#AskEck Why is it that in Revenge of the Sith, the B2 battledroids on Utapau have an extra red photoreceptor on their backs? I haven't been able to find an explanation or acknoledgement of this anywhere and was wondering if you had come across something that mentions it. Surely I can't be imagining this every time I watch the movie
Palpatine having clones was stupid in Legends and it was stupid in canon.
What media did you get your scenes from?
So basically a more sustainable version of emperor vitatae?
Vitiate was pretty sustainable. It's more like Palpatine wanted what Vitiate had.
Man so much of the new canon is just a poor rehash of the old stuff.
KYLE KATARN!!
So, Palps was going to become the Emperor of Mankind in 40K. 🤨 sm
Palps wanted to become a god. Just like every other villain.
Long live the Empire!!!
I read the thesis about darth plagueis the wise
I met Palpatine at a work thing a few years ago. He was a terrible drunk. Loud, obnoxious and - worst of all - boring. Never meet your heroes, eh?