Not really good if you look at all his numbers throughout the 80s before the shortern three point line he had terrible percentages. Yes in the 90s his three point percentage was good but that was due to the three point line being shorten allowing him to shoot better he also had less attempts than even some of the best shooters in the 90s. Also the fact that his percentage was ok in the playoffs sure but his overall three point attempts wasn’t even that high at 2.5 which is the reason why he had an average of 33.2 percent. Also the fact that yes he did have a high percentage in the finals but his attempts weren’t even that high and very low. If you compare Kobe attempts in the finals it’s way more higher if you compare kyrie finals stats it’s way higher, I don’t really think he is a good three point shooter at all
It's not that he is not practicing.... It was because he was not shooting enough .. look at his 3pt% and his "attempts" in the 89-90 Then look at his first four seasons and how many attempts he did
That's What he did in General.. Some people have a 10 or 11 here. When playoffs or finals came, MJ had a few more even than the best had. He could just find an extra level..
Here is an interesting fact, MJ was the last player in NBA history to score 3,000 points in a season, 3,041 to be exact. He only hit 12 (3-pt) shots, and he won the scoring title with a 37.1 average. The only player to come close to this since is, James Harden, with 2818 points. James hit on 378 (3-pt) shots. The truth of the matter is, MJ did not need a (3-pt) shot. Instead of the (3-pt) shot becoming a part of the NBA, it has become the NBA. We now determine a player's worth on his ability to make this shot, and downplay players that shoot a mid range shot. Sad.
That's why people say he woulda avg 50ppg today. I doubt it would be that high but if Jordan had made that many 3's in his 37.1ppg season as harden did then it puts him in the 42ppg range which isn't that far fetched of an idea just turning 4-5 of his 2 pointers into 3's each game. I've always suggested he would avg 43pog today at peak scoring Jordan yet kobe is the one we should be asking that question about as his 35ppg season came at a time with much slower pace a less possessions and teams scoring mid 90's. Kobe could do 45ppg easily today.
@@aturner3246 mid range masters are probably the most beautiful players to watch. Unfortunately unless you’re making them at a staggering rate, you’re not going to outperform a 3 point maestro
@@reecenorwood8377 Very true, but the percentages would more than likely be a little better. I think the overall 2 pt shot percentage is 40%. Three point shot average is 36.6%. Passing up a 2 pt shot to shoot a lower percentage 3 pt shot seems counter productive. Your thoughts?
@ if they’re taken at close to the same volume then no. If you take 50 2s and 50 3s and make them at those rates, you would make 20 2s or 40 points and 18ish 3s or 54 points. That’s why 40% is the golden standard for elite 3 point shooters. It makes non shooters have to make shots at alarmingly high rates
I always appreciate the nuance and context that you add to your videos. You're helping turn casual fans into knowledgable ones. This is my 34th season watching NBA basketball and your videos have taught me things that I overlooked or wasn't even aware of.
You also have to consider that back then a planned 3pt shot wasn't used often...many of MJs early attempted 3s were awkward, highly contested, defended, tough, clock beating shots... last effort attempts to tie or go ahead when double teamed. He was never really a planned play 3pt shooter player...and even then, it was like 1 or 2 attempts per game.
There's nothing more I love in a basketball debate than when someone actually uses context to argue their points. At base value, Jordan was a terrible 3-pt shooter, but with context, he was above average, and in the finals specifically, he was better than Lebron and Kobe.
@@1vaultdweller Didn't u hear and watch. MJ was better when the games mattered the most. He was better than Kobe, Lebron and Kyrie on the game's biggest stage by a mile. MJs critics choose to ignore this facts.
@@YUHWAHN Which is a weak point. MJ's finals opponents were 10 times worse at defending the perimeter. They camped in paint and sagged off the 3 point line all night long
I think this is a great video, and I also believe that Michael answered this question many years ago when he said he was as good of a three-point shooter as he decided to be. If everyone on the planet were this objective and willing to analyze context and errors as you did, I don’t think the GOAT debate would even exist. People should reason based on objective criteria, but since most people can’t agree on the same ones, questions about whether MJ was as good or as flawed as some of us remember will always come up-even in regard to his three-point shooting. Your explanation makes complete sense to anyone, even with a basic understanding, but I think many will always choose to ignore reasoning to avoid being wrong and they prefer to raise their voices repeating stuff they hear from some questionable “experts”!
What people fail.to mention is during MJs eras we had ROLE PLAYERS. Mike didnt have to shoot threes because he had guys on the team, whose specific job was to knock down threes. Namely, BJ armstrong and steve kerr. The same could be said for rebounds and rim protection, that was rodmans and horace grants job. Mikes job was to slash to the basket and score/create plays/breakdown the defense. Scottys role was to fill in the holes when needed. If MJ is shooting volume threes what does steve kerr do? Hes not getting to the basket thats for sure. The current nba doesnt have roles, its just shoot in volume and your bound to get hot.
People say players are way better all around but i always think of the term good at everything, master of nothing. People try to point to the best players like steph and say the whole league is better at shooting when only few players should be shooting that far that often
@dyloiris8876 i agree, thats why over the last 20 yeard there are no leaders in separate categories. No standouts with assists, no standouts with rebounds, blocks, steals.
@@dyloiris8876 and the reality is that, yes they are better, but literal 1-2% better in average... they abandoned all other aspects of the game (defense mainly) in order to get 2% better at 3pts. That's why todays league is so boring to watch, it's just a bunch of tiktokers trading 3s.
And ...they are actively looking for that shot first and second. In Jordans day, it was a bailout or last resort for a good chunk of his career, especially Early.
I feel like that works more for off-the dribble shots which granted are a huge part of a lot of great players game. But typical spot up shooting which is foundational in today’s game is unchanged by rules.
I can't say for sure since I didn't see all of his 3 points attempts, but his early years' 3 points probably came as last second shots wirh no choice otherwise which explains the terrible percentage with low volume.
yea its interesting, his 3pt% has an extreme positive correlation with his attempts. Most guys are the opposite. Remember that he didnt play with a 3pt line until joining the NBA so it was a brand new shot for him. 90-93 is an interesting range to look at. In 90 and 93 he was at 3 attempts a game shooting ~36%, but in 91 and 92 he was back down closer to 1 attempt a game shooting
@@kevinjohnson4498 Usually, more attempts increase percentage. High volume every game, the percentages don't have wild swings one way or the other. One bad game will have much less impact on overall %. Taking only 2 game, the percentage will have wild swings game to game. One bad game has far greater impact on overall percentage. And in practical basketball play...if you take more, you are practicing more. Therefore you should be comfortable finding a rhythm.
He wasn't a great 3poit shooter. But he decent enough to not matter regardless the era he played (because let's be real that's what's all about). And he could definitely become a good one if he needed.
Another ammunition against MJ is that he participated in the 1990 3pt contest and tied the record w/ Detlef Schrempf (1988) for fewest points in a round w/ five. Interestingly, that was also the only year in which Larry Bird was eliminated w/ 13 first round points (sources: Celticsblog, Orlando Sentinel, UPI), as well as the beginning of Craig Hodges' three-peat.
MJ was a good to above average 3pt shooter. Whenever he attempted 2+ 3pt shots per game he was above average and was a super solid 3pt shooter. The philosophy of the game in the 80’s was not to incorporate the 3. In the 90’s when the game was a little more open minded to the 3 MJ adapted to the 3 and excelled at it. MJ had great great elite shooting mechanics, and had a great great elite shooting touch! Like we try to tell you youngins MJ had ZERO holes & weaknesses in his game. ZERO flaws! Good to Elite in all aspects of the game
He was a good three-point shooter, and when he attempted 3 or more, he was around the league average. Similar to Kobe. Bron shoots below the league average. There is the difference. It's all about volume, the era and how you stack up vs your peers.
He is literally statistically one of the worst 3p shooters of all time. Literally Giannis/Westbrook level. Lowest score in a 3p contest all time. Dude was a TERRIBLE 3p shooter
@@gggyy7104do you realise Jordan has a better % from 3 in the finals than lebron and kobe? 😂😂😂 and the two seasons he shot over 2.5 threes a game he made 37% and 35%, above league average.
Whenever I hear Jordan talk I am always amazed at how well spoken he is, even when you show early clips of when he was new in the NBA and in his first seasons. Not a spoiled brat, not some gangster from the hood crap, simply a well brought up and educated young man who went on to become the best basketball player in the history of the game.
Honestly that seems to be the case with most old school basketball players. Like even a douchebag dunce like Charles Barkley (I love Chuck FYI) comes off a more well spoken than most guys now
He also didn't have a 3pt line until college, ad even in college it wasn't widely used and wasn't used at all in the tournament. It wasn't adopted throughout all of college until 1987 or 1988. That interview clip also turned out to be kind prophetic too since there are a lot of guys that can shoot the 3 pretty well but aren't as great of a scorer from inside the arc compared to outside of it.
@@night6724 His Basketball_Reference page for college has 3pt stats for him for his sophomore year, and he shot 44.7% on 2 attempts per game albeit with a shorter line than the pros. Back then the 3pt line wasn't universal in college and only some conferences used it. It not being universal is why it wasn't used in the tournament.
Great video! The problem is the data surrounding his 3pt shooting falls under so many different contexts that makes it hard to nail down. It also means you can't just take his 3pt shooting percentage at face value like we do now. He came into the league without ever playing with a 3pt line and averaged less than one shot, usually as a last minute toss to win/tie games, and had abysmal 3pt shooting percentages for like the first 5-6 seasons of his career because of it. His best 3pt shooting came when the league shortened the 3pt line so many people like to, and probably not wrong to, throw out those years. And so because the rest of his career he didn't really take many 3s it's so hard to get to an idea of what he would like shooting the 3 today in volume. I think there are two seasons in his career that help shed light into what he would be however. Other than the league shortened season there are only two seasons he averaged over 2.5 attempts a game. In his 89-90 season he averaged 3 3PAs a game and shot 37%. In 92-93 he shot 2.9 3PAs a game and averaged 35% from the beyond the arc. I also tried to narrow games down where he shot 4 3pters or more a game and in those games he averaged like 38-39% but I couldn't filter out the years where the line was shortened so there is some questionable data in it. I honestly believe though based on the data around his two highest volume shooting non 3pt line shortened seasons, his average in games where he took 4 or more 3pters a game, and his other shooting metrics that if he grew up with the 3pt line he would probably be a career 36-38% 3pt shooter in today's league.
Yeah you are right and i would also add that its a pretty much surefire assumption when MJ took around 1 threepoint attempt per game (which includes last seconds shot) he didnt pratice it at his training sessions because why would he have done it if it was almost non existing in his game? But when he mad 3.0 and 2.9 attempts per game in 89-90 (37.6%)and 92-93 (35.2%) you can be sure he was praticing it aswell at his training sessions. That shows us if Jordan had emphasized 3s more at his training sessions he would have been at least a decent 3 point shooter. at least 35-36% efficiency Btw LEbron in his first 8 years already shot 4 attempts per game from 3s which means he consistenty practiced it at his training sessions despite of that he barely reached 33%. And Lebron is famous of being a bad shooter especially from midrange. I believe there is a hard connection between midrange shots and 3s. We can see players who are good from midrange they are good at 3s aswell, like KD, Kawhi, CP3, Booker,etc. or players who were good at midranges then transfered their game to the 3 point line became good 3 point shooters like Serge Ibaka. So do we really think Jordan who was a killer from midrange wouldnt have been good at 3s if he transfered his game there? This is what he has just shown us with his 3 attempts per game. I dont mind the Jordan criticism for example he was an asshole with his teammates but criticising his efficiency from 3s based on only his all time stat without context is just not fair. Thats why i dont feel a legitimate critic.
Great video, Jonny! I appreciate the nuance and context you bring to your argument and points. It is incredible how he was better in the playoffs (esp. The Finals) than the regular season. It makes sense though, given how he stepped up his game when it mattered most. I'd say he was a decent 3 point shooter overall, but when the game was on the line, he sunk the most crucial 3 point shots and was a good 3 point shooter at critical moments. Awesome video again. Have a nice day, Jonny 😊!
Great vid as usual...you made all the points, i totally agree with you...and by the way how in the world can random people or media say that Michael f... Jordan is a bad three point shooter ?
Honestly, for Michael Jordan‘s time he didn’t even really need a three-point shot for his game or for how the NBA as played back then. When he did start taking threes, like for example, 28% in his time means you could shoot, but nowadays 28% today doesn’t mean you can shoot. For his time he was a average shooter, and a decent shooter he needed to be. He also didn’t have to be a shooter, because teams didn’t rely on shooting threes as much as they do now but I still think Michael Jordan is an underrated shooter and capable of hitting threes if he really worked on it and if he got a chance to, in the set of the team schemes and game plans. It was still nice to see that he made the three-point contest too, even though he had the lowest score ever.
Haven’t watched the video yet but I believe he’s an underrated 3 point shooter I don’t think he was never bad and I actually think he was great for his time. Great analysis I 100% agree I think he’s a great shooter overall and a good 3 point shooter
Jonny Arnett.......I think you may be the GOAT basketball UA-camr. I don't know how many subscribers you have in Africa but I think I'm your biggest fan. Keep shining bro 👏👏
@@willemcenter8649 it means it was bad to you because you want to be cynical for whatever reason instead of taking things for what they are in the context of their time. A graphics processor on a PS2 is technically "worse" than a graphics processor on a PS5, if the only thing you care about is how realistic a video game looks. But it doesn't mean it was any less effective at conveying iconic moments and classic aesthetics from legendary games.
MJ was objectively bad from 1984-1985 to 1992-1993 he shot 30.1 from 3 and in 1997-1998 he shot 23.8 from 3 im obviously not including 1994-1995 to 1996-1997 because the 3 point line was shortened between that stint which lead to his 3 point percentage being much higher then what it should have been
It's also important to keep in mind that in those early years-when Jordan was averaging less than one three-point attempt a game and was not looking to shoot the three-most of those long shots were attempts to beat the buzzer. It's not surprising that he hit such a low percentage of them.
1 three point a game is an important and significantly note. The higher someone shoots the better the percentage in most cases. Also it 3 pointers where introduced in 79-80 season, so they took time to really take off and implement.
Michael’s three point shot is such revisionist history. The three wasn’t important to nba back then and he didn’t need it to be the nba’s greatest scorer of all time
Exactly. Your thoughts are pretty in line with what I was saying towards the end of the video, how they’re viewing MJ through the lens of 2024 Basketball. Not EVERYONE has to be a 3 point shooter, but unfortunately that’s the simplistic take of the casual fan in 2024.
The 3 point shot wasn't what Jordan was focused on. He didn't want to sit at the 3 point line and wait for the ball. That's not his game. Plus, the game didn't revolve around the 3 point line back then. The NBA as we know it today is more like the WWE (entertainment). The NBA as a professional sport died long ago.
Something I always say... YOU PLAY THE PLAYERS IN FRONT OF YOU. Every era is officiated differently and evolves differently. MJ played and won with HIS STYLE OF PLAY. What else matters?? ...and I'm a fan of GREATNESS. MJ, Kobe, Lebron, Steph Curry ALL EMBODY THAT TRAIT. 🏀
What I remember about Jordan is that, he was hitting them at insane rate when his team needed it the most...no moment was to big for this dude... Growing up as a MJ hater, today I can say he's The Best basketball player ever.. grace, skill, stats aside.. watching him play against your team, you could never relax until the game was over.. never had that feeling with any other player except for Kobe between 06-2010 and I wasn't a Kobe fan either..
An additional point that adds to this is that if you look at the stats carefully, his 3p% and his 3pt attempts per season both almost perfectly coincide, so his 3p% got better whenever he attempted more, and that's with or without the decreased 3pt line seasons. A skill isn't a weakness if the more you exploit it it gets better.
I agree - Guys can only beat (or not) those in front of them. I also think players are all products of the era in which they played, which is why comparing players of different eras is so difficult.
That MJ quote talking about having a driving mentality vs spotting up is key. I think the NBA needs to do anything it can to incentivize stars taking it to the hoop. I like the 3pt line as a constraint to keep defenses honest, but I don't like it when the 3pt shot is the most important shot, especially when it is still not as consistent as a layup or dunk at the rim. I think fouls on 3pt shots should only be 2 fts. I think the court should be widened so that a corner 3 pt shot is not shorter than other 3pt shots. You mention how they shortened the 3pt shot in the 90s, but the corner 3 is still shorter than any other 3pt shot. We don't call that out at all.
Before that Suns Nash/D’Antoni mid 2000s era where the game started to change, any player who wasn’t a 3point shooting role player who shot between 30-35% was basically as good as they needed to be to justify shooting a 3. The game was not the same whatsoever.
Was Jordan a good three point shooter? No. Was he a bad three point shooter? Also no. He was average and could be streaky from three point range but had he grown up with it and had it been more part of the basketball culture I think he would have been fine. On his comment about not shooting threes, I know he's the greatest, he's my GOAT, but he's just wrong. I don't want to disagree with Jordan on anything because he was just so great but he is just objectively wrong. In my opinion if he had worked on his three point game it would have made him even better. He was hard to guard from midrange, had a great first step, if teams had to guard him at the three point line with his first step, he would have had even more room to blow by guys. Not a big deal though, if the worst thing about your career was you were not the greatest three point shooter, being widely considered the greatest more than makes up for it.
One thing I thought you were going to point out is that, even starting with the 88-89 season, his 3P% is *positively* correlated with his 3P attempts. Even ignoring the 2nd 3peat due to shorter 3 point line, you have 5 seasons: 2 with 3+ 3 point attempts per game and over 35% accuracy, and 3 with
I love mj from day one up till today. But i really thought he was sucked at 3pointers because he didn't developed it that much, until you made this video. Thanks for this enlightenment
1) Plays were run for the post or for the midrange. The three-point line was only five seasons old in Jordan's rookie year. Three-point attempts were minimal, and were often called bad shots especially during transition plays. Players would run to the basket for lay-ups/dunks on the break, instead of running to the corner for the three. Anyone jacking up a three-point shot early in the shot clock instead of running the ball to the post would get an earful from the coach. 2) Jordan's game was predicated on slashing to the basket and mid-range jumpers. Even up to the first championship seasons (as appropriately referenced in the video), Jordan did not build his game around long-range shooting. By his own admission, it would take away his aggression and effectiveness on pressuring wing and rim defenders. 3) The three-point shot was a specialty shot during that period to open up the lane. Larry Bird famously said that less athletic players had to become shooters so that they can impact the game. 4) Jordan only took three-point shooting seriously when he returned from his first retirement, as his first step was no longer as explosive. He also worked on his post game/turn-around jumper. 5) The narrative around Jordan's poor shooting is often drawn from his horrible performance in the only three-point shootout he joined during All-Star weekend. 6) Jordan was an adequate three-point shooter but opposing teams would rather have him shoot the lower percentage shot than have him humiliate them at the rim. The three may be greater than the two, but a sure two is much better than a tough three.
1st Your in depth research is untouchable: You videos I call my personal set the record straight videos channel. I did the greatest scorer of all-time/ evaluation and I came to know that Jordan wasn't the worst 3pt shooter or scorer Lebron's fans was making him out to be. Like you said after year 88 he was above League Average/ I said his is good 3 point scorer and he can score from the 3 point line if he chose to.
I think it is an interesting what if for if jordan played in todays game. He definitely would have developed a 3pt shot just like so many others. I doubt he would ever be a really good 3 pt shooter but he definitely would be a threat. Ray allen was one of the players entering the league as a jordan type player yet he is now one of the greatest 3pt shooters. I would assume jordan would pick up the harden type step back and probably end up as a 35% on 5 attempts guy.
One other minor thing to mention, in his earlier years, when players sometimes averaged around 1 attempt or less per game, it was often a half court to full court heave at the buzzer. They weren't really worried about their percentages which is why so many of them had years where they shot under 10-20% Larry Bird was the same way at the beginning of his career as well
its true! if mj focused on 3pters. thats just one point more than a lay up, mid range.. attacking the basket affects the game more, opponent fouls, going to freethrows to give ur tm8’s a chance to catch their breath, create openings for tm8 3’s or 2’s, helping out team for offensive rebounds. nba teams know not to foul a 3pter so they can challenge but if they make it, hats off to them. its just 1 more point vs the whole aspect of the game
I would argue Jordan was the team's "3-point specialist" during his first 3-peat in the PLAYOFFS. Jordan made the most 3s over that 3-year stretch on the Bulls, while shooting roughly 38.5% from the arc. Someone tell me if LeBum ever did anything like that.
@gggyy7104 Jordan shot a higher 3p% than LeBron in the Finals. One guy is 6-0, with a game winning 3 in the Finals. The other guy is 4-6, with NO game winning 3s in the Finals. Can you guess who is who?
@@bwink23 One guy has the lowest all time score in a 3p contest when nobody’s guarding you Another guy shot a higher % from 3 than Steph Curry at 39 years old Can you guess who is who?
@gggyy7104 One guy was too scared to attempt a dunk contest or a 3-point contest...do you know who that was? One guy made more 3-pointers than the entire opposing team in an NBA Finals series.. something Steph Curry never did. Do you know who did that?
@@bwink23 The players don’t decide whether they participate in the contests goofy 🤣🤣 The NBA picks But what I do know is that one player shot 28.8% from 3 without the WNBA line for his career AVERAGE And the other player’s LOWEST 3p% in a season was 29% and that was with the standard line Take a guess who is who
One more thing about MJ's 3p%. Because MJ wasn't a volume 3p shooter and took very few attempts per game, a lot of these shots were forced shots at the end of the clock, which mess up his %. If a person who shoots 10 3s a night takes these shots, they won't affect the % too much, but for MJ who took less than 2 attempts per game, it makes a difference
Difficult to make half court or very long three pointers count as shot attempts. These shots greatly reduce the percentage of three point shooting when the sample size is low. For example, in 1990 jordan makes 1 out of 2 shots or 50% on regular 3 point shots and then fires up and misses a half court shot at the end of a quarter, the statistics will say that jordan shot a measley 1 for 3 or 33%. Same scenario in 2020, lebron makes 3 out of 6 shots from three or 50% and then fires up and misses a half court shot at the end of a quarter. Statistics say he shot 3 for 7 or 42.8% which is great. This math problem is not considered when comparing eras for 3point shooting
According to Nobody Touches Jordan, MJ was very good from the non-shortened three-point line in his prime during the playoffs. Even in the one area that is supposed to be his weakness, Jordan still set a playoff record. Only player in NBA history, along with Steph Curry, to shoot at least 38% on 3-point field goals in 3 NBA Finals runs (minimum 15 PPG and 1.5 3PA/game) Jordan did this in the Bulls' 1991, 1992, and 1993 championship runs under the original 3-point line. He also did it in the 1996 championship run, but with a shorter 3-point line Four other players meet this criteria in multiple NBA Finals runs - Terry Porter (1990 and 1992) - Manu Ginobili (2005 and 2007) - Ray Allen (2008 and 2010) - Stephen Curry (2015, 2016, 2017) All of the aforementioned players did this while scoring at a lower volume. Jordan is the only one to do it with 30+ ppg, all 3 times from 91-92-93. It would be 4 times if you included the shorter 96 line, but of course you shouldn't. Jordan shot 55/142 (38.7%) 3PT from three in the 91-92-93 Playoffs in his prime. Jordan shot 28/70 (40%) from the non-shortened 3-point line in his Finals career (1991, 1992, 1993, 1998). The shorter lines in 1996 and 1997 actually lowered his NBA Finals 3-point averages, probably due to passing his prime and less spacing afforded from shorter lines. 40% Non-Shortened Line 3PT Shooters for a Finals career (min. 15 PPG) 46.15% - Isiah Thomas (22.6 PPG) - 1988-1989-1990 Finals 45.24% - Kawhi Leonard (15.9 PPG) - 2013-2014 Finals 43.66% - Kevin Durant - (32.9 PPG) - 2012-2017 Finals 43.59% - Dan Majerle (17.2 PPG) - 1993 Finals 43.59% - Derek Harper (16.4 PPG) - 1994 Finals 41.30% - Larry Bird (23.1 PPG) - 1981-1984-1985-1986-1987 Finals 40.00% - Michael Jordan* (35.6 PPG) - 1991-1992-1993-1998 Finals *Only including the non-shortened 3PT line. Including the shorter line in the 1996 and 1997 Finals, Jordan had 33.6 PPG on 36.80% 3PT for his Finals career. Jordan was also 1 missed FT short of shooting 53/43/91 in the 1992 Finals. He shot 41/46 FT or 89% FT to barely miss it. The only player who has shot 50/40/90 in NBA Finals history under the original 3-point line and with enough 3PT/FT attempts (at least 1.5 3PA and 3 FTA/game) was Chauncey Billups in 2004, and while scoring at much lower volume of 21 ppg.
Writing this before finishing the video but wven as someone who doesn't want MJ to be the GOAT, I wouldn't make the crazy claim that he was bad at shooting 3s. The era context is important. Teams weren't setting up the 3 ball in the 80s and 90s. It was bigs to iso ball. MJ would turn it on in the playoffs, where the lights are the brightest. From 91-93 he averaged 2.4 3PA and shot .387. That's elite for the era. Always have to put the numbers in context with the era. His 1990 season is underrated in how he shot from 3. He was 14% better than league average and attempted 65% more shots from 3 than league average. Incredible.
He became a good 3 point shooter, although his skill in this area of the game was not as transcendent as his other skills, when compared to his peers. But he gave us the reason for that. It was clearly a choice, and related to a mentality he wanted to maintain. (And it should be noted, especially when talking about big men, that the ones that like to take 3 point shots, rarely like to drive to the basket, so MJ wasn't joking about the effect on his mentality when focusing on 3s). But people sure learned not to leave him alone out there to shoot 3s. You absolutely had to respect him with that shot. You never heard anyone after that series say anything like, "we'll let him take that shot." Most importantly, the bigger the stage, the bigger MJ's performance.
Today he would average 50+ easily even without high 3 point volume. He would just kill the terrible defense today with fadeaways and aggressive attacks to the rim. The modern soft losers of today don’t know how to guard that. These soft punks objectively would not survive the 80’s and 90’s. Just look at LeBanon I mean LeBum I mean LeBron. He would get murdered by Mugsey Boges. Sorry if I misspelled, but you get my point. Jordan would literally and figuratively murder LeBron. No question. If you call me an old head, go kick some rocks and chew some glass you shark teeth mouth breathing panty huffer
Something not many people take into account is that a significant amount of Jordan's 3 point attempts during his first 4 years were half court or full court shots at the end of regulation
personally i see it (kind of) similar to Demar Derozan. who actually isnt a BAD 3 point shooter, he just doesnt take them often at all. MJ just never took 3s. with such a low volume taken its not disingenuous to use percentages. a player shooting .9/2.4 would be listed at 35% but if they made .1 more itd be 42%. There are some players who fall victim to the small sample size box score watching (LeBron and his midrange percentages have been victim to this as well) epidemic that truly can only be fixed by looking deeper into tendencies and adding context. Jordan having multiple sub 30-20% 3point shooting seasons isnt an accurate reflection when hes not even taking 2 3s a game to measure it by
I've always felt that if MJ played in the modern NBA where the meta was to shoot 3s, he would just work on his 3PT game and adapt. He more than had the ability, but that's not the style of basketball he played. He played the style that allowed him to dominate his era. If he played at a time where 3s were more important to being successful, he'd just do that because at the end of the day, he was a winner.
Jordan was good enough from three to where you couldn't leave him open once he was in his prime during the early 90s. He shot like 38% during the entire playoffs from 1991-1993, which is mainly regarded as his peak during his championship years. This was also the highest volume he shot for the most part. Low volume is mainly what hurts Jordan's 3pt percentages, where every miss knocks a lot more off your overall shooting percentages. When that's the case, end of clock heaves and desperation shots will impact your numbers more.
If he played in today's NBA, then he would have just focused on what would make him win championships with his given body and his given team with current rules, same as what he has done during his era. I wouldn't be surprised if he trained himself to best Steph in 3PT%, range, shot creation, while still excelling in defense and being the leader of his team. That is what he meant by 'I chose to'. Whether he would still have won 6 championship or less or more would really depend on who his teammates are and the coach probably.
I was born in June 2003, couple weeks before bron got drafted to the nba. To think he’s still a top tier player today, throughout my WHOLE life so far, is unbelievable. Brons my goat, but MJ was a fucking beast, I don’t understand the whole rivalry between the fans of each player. Sure some mj fans will say I’m wrong but I literally couldn’t watch him play, I’ve watched bron for the most part of his second half of his career. These “fans” of MJ and bron need to be put down. They’re both goats, just to different generations
I think with three pointers or with shooting in general it's about a certain threshold! Is it harder to maintain a certain % when the volume goes up? Yes! But it's also hard to reach a certain % when you only try one a game. There is no getting hot, no being streaky with only one attempt. Btw I bet some of those were also prayers and heaves with the clock expiring.
noone probably criticized it or saw it as a weakness back in the day, it's only people who try to over hype lebron by downplaying MJ who even use the 3 point argument. No1 would say someone like shaq is a bad 3 point shooter to try to downplay him.
Even if MJ is bad at 3-point shooting, it doesn't negate anything in his career or legacy. You play the game that's being played in the league at the time, not what's being played decades later. If MJ came into the league in 2020 and grew up watching Steph curry, he'd likely have a much different game than what he did coming in in the 80s.
MJ himself had said it best: he was as good as he chose to be! That's why when it mattered the most and the game situations needed him to shoot more 3s to win or just he wanted to prove a point, he simply did better! But when his other arsenals were sufficient to win then that's it, no need many 3s!
i really like your videos and appreciate the attention to detail. however if you or anyone goes to this depth to try and "justify" a part of lebron's game everyone would call them biased, but because its done for MJ we are all looking the other way.
His true 3point shot was the 2and1, which was more devastating, coz he was a pretty good free throw shooter, and got opposing big man and guards into foul trouble constantly. Thats why he said (i think) what he said in the interview, and subsequently choose not to include the 3pointer in his game at a high volume.
Michael Jordan was so competitive that he would have adjusted to whatever it took to win. If he would have needed the 3-pointer to win, he would have been one of the best in the league.
Important to note that MJ played his prime athletic years with the 3 not part of his game plan.The same leniency needs applied to most 80s players. OTOH, Jordan was at his best in the reduced line ERA, and outside of certain magnificent instances, was average as a 3 threat. Does not affect his GOAT candidacy
The rule set it so much more important. Yes, it was more physical in the 80s and 90s. Yes, defense was better in the 00s. Because of what the rules allowed. Same goes for the 60s, ect. Russell is the goat
What is so impressive is that MJ was a great shooter with those huge hands. Kawhi is the same. Wilt and Shaq had those huge hands, and couldn't shoot worth a damn. Having all of the good things with large hands (ball control, dunks, lay-ups, steals, blocks) without the only bad thing (shooting accuracy) is possibly the most important thing that elevated MJ above everyone else.
Young guys might not have been able to compete back then, but MJ would average 40+ today by adding range. With high pick and roll, split action, and other modern schemes, he would be a surgeon.
I don't value volume 3pt shooting in my star. I value driving, penetrating the defense, and then being able to kick out. I do see the value in being able to keep defenses honest with a decent 3pt shot, but mostly, I want my star handling the ball and getting the defense in rotation. When stars pressure the rim, then their 3pt shooting doesn't matter as much. Giannis doesn't need a 3pt shot. Zion doesn't need a 3pt shot. That is something you need more when you can't drive as well. Lebron shoots more 3s now when he can't drive as well as he used to.
He was fine at threes. Didn't matter, he went for the higher percentage shots. Something they once taught in basketball. When basketball was actually played.
Based on the stats and footage, MJ was a solid 3-point shooter throughout his career. The fact that his average in the finals was so high at over 40% should say it all.
"Clyde is a better 3-point shooter than I choose to be" that shit is so cold bruh. I wonder if Clyde either dismissed it or believed it. He seemed to be confident in his skills so that maybe didnt shook him but Mj being Mj, i wonder if that made him concerned. Great end to the video btw.
I like when they bring up Jordan's 6 pts in the 3pt contest yet detlef Schrempf scored 6 and was considered a great 3 pt shooter and a certain guy named Kevin durant scored 7 pts in it but made a money ball so only made the same as Jordan yet isnt called a bad 3 poit shooter either.
I get two things from this video, 1. It took MJ to become an elite three point shooter before he won a championship 2. Steph is the GOAT because he doesn’t let 3-pointers affect his scoring mentality
The thing about Jordan is he loves winning..if he can score and win a game by driving to the basket..hes gonna do it...just look at it this way...hes the 5th most points of all time...yet he barely made 3s....Kareem and Malone were the same but they had longer careers
As with all other aspects of MJ's game, his play style was all about winning and performing when it mattered the most. He made his 3's when he had to make them, especially in the playoffs and finals. What other players can really say this about their game?
He was better than average. I don't think he'd shoot too many if he played today because he could score at will closer to the basket.He was never a terrible 3pt shooter. What Jonny here and everybody else fail to understand is that percentages were bad because the only time they shot 3 pointers was when they had to shoot with a clock running out. OBVIOUSLY your % will be crap when you are throwing a last second heave from 50 feet.
Didn’t take into account that many of his 3s in the 80s were possibly half court heaves and last second shots at the end of quarters. MJ didn’t care about his percentages.
Was MJ a bad, decent or great 3 point shooter?
Overall a bit bellow decent (terrible in the 80s, good one in the 90s)
But he could have for sure became a good one if he needed
Not really good if you look at all his numbers throughout the 80s before the shortern three point line he had terrible percentages.
Yes in the 90s his three point percentage was good but that was due to the three point line being shorten allowing him to shoot better he also had less attempts than even some of the best shooters in the 90s.
Also the fact that his percentage was ok in the playoffs sure but his overall three point attempts wasn’t even that high at 2.5 which is the reason why he had an average of 33.2 percent.
Also the fact that yes he did have a high percentage in the finals but his attempts weren’t even that high and very low.
If you compare Kobe attempts in the finals it’s way more higher if you compare kyrie finals stats it’s way higher, I don’t really think he is a good three point shooter at all
I think like the rest of his shooting he was above average and if he would have practiced the shot more he would be around 36-38% career shooter.
and i saw a few MJ shots beyond the 3-point line as a last-second hail mary...
It was enough
I mean good enough
He didn't practice it and was at league average.
That's not a weakness in my book.
you have no idea what he was practicing lol
It's not that he is not practicing.... It was because he was not shooting enough .. look at his 3pt% and his "attempts" in the 89-90
Then look at his first four seasons and how many attempts he did
Here we go again. Jonny creating unbiased and informed content and injecting it into our polarizing and toxic nba forum.
Watching his 88-89 seasons he was essentially Steph of the midrange
Really wish we had advanced midrange stats back further than 97…
One legend comment on other legend video.
Guys, my absolute respect to both of you .
88-90, pre-championship MJ was his absolute peak with shooting combined with elite athleticism
88-89 he was Demar Derozen at best
@@jeoffreywoolley5075 Jordan was much better than your favorite player ever was lol
He was ok during regular seasons, but could somehow become a good 3 point shooter during playoff runs. Shit made no sense lol
In all his years with the bulls he shot 33.2%, in the playoffs he shot 33.2%. At least he was consistent I guess
@Croc1579 true, but he still had sum great 3 point shooting series in his career and shot good from 3 in multiple nba finals
🐐
That's What he did in General..
Some people have a 10 or 11 here. When playoffs or finals came, MJ had a few more even than the best had. He could just find an extra level..
Playoff mode activated
Here is an interesting fact, MJ was the last player in NBA history to score 3,000 points in a season, 3,041 to be exact. He only hit 12 (3-pt) shots, and he won the scoring title with a 37.1 average. The only player to come close to this since is, James Harden, with 2818 points. James hit on 378 (3-pt) shots. The truth of the matter is, MJ did not need a (3-pt) shot. Instead of the (3-pt) shot becoming a part of the NBA, it has become the NBA. We now determine a player's worth on his ability to make this shot, and downplay players that shoot a mid range shot. Sad.
That's why people say he woulda avg 50ppg today.
I doubt it would be that high but if Jordan had made that many 3's in his 37.1ppg season as harden did then it puts him in the 42ppg range which isn't that far fetched of an idea just turning 4-5 of his 2 pointers into 3's each game.
I've always suggested he would avg 43pog today at peak scoring Jordan yet kobe is the one we should be asking that question about as his 35ppg season came at a time with much slower pace a less possessions and teams scoring mid 90's.
Kobe could do 45ppg easily today.
@@MJIZZEL Great point!
@@aturner3246 mid range masters are probably the most beautiful players to watch. Unfortunately unless you’re making them at a staggering rate, you’re not going to outperform a 3 point maestro
@@reecenorwood8377 Very true, but the percentages would more than likely be a little better. I think the overall 2 pt shot percentage is 40%. Three point shot average is 36.6%. Passing up a 2 pt shot to shoot a lower percentage 3 pt shot seems counter productive. Your thoughts?
@ if they’re taken at close to the same volume then no. If you take 50 2s and 50 3s and make them at those rates, you would make 20 2s or 40 points and 18ish 3s or 54 points. That’s why 40% is the golden standard for elite 3 point shooters. It makes non shooters have to make shots at alarmingly high rates
One of yhe things i hate the most about the Curry-effect? Using 3pt% as a gotcha to guys who played 30+ years ago.
Dead giveaway for someone that just started watching ball within the last decade which isn't that long when you really talk hoop.
I always appreciate the nuance and context that you add to your videos. You're helping turn casual fans into knowledgable ones. This is my 34th season watching NBA basketball and your videos have taught me things that I overlooked or wasn't even aware of.
You also have to consider that back then a planned 3pt shot wasn't used often...many of MJs early attempted 3s were awkward, highly contested, defended, tough, clock beating shots... last effort attempts to tie or go ahead when double teamed. He was never really a planned play 3pt shooter player...and even then, it was like 1 or 2 attempts per game.
Good point.
Yeah, no one was scheming the 3pt shot like they do today. It was a gimmick.
There's nothing more I love in a basketball debate than when someone actually uses context to argue their points. At base value, Jordan was a terrible 3-pt shooter, but with context, he was above average, and in the finals specifically, he was better than Lebron and Kobe.
He was %36 averaging 1,1 makes in finals. Lebron was %35 averaging 1,8 makes in finals. How that better?
@@1vaultdweller Didn't u hear and watch. MJ was better when the games mattered the most. He was better than Kobe, Lebron and Kyrie on the game's biggest stage by a mile. MJs critics choose to ignore this facts.
@@1vaultdweller idk, maybe watch the video instead of rushing to the comments.
@@YUHWAHN Which is a weak point. MJ's finals opponents were 10 times worse at defending the perimeter. They camped in paint and sagged off the 3 point line all night long
I think this is a great video, and I also believe that Michael answered this question many years ago when he said he was as good of a three-point shooter as he decided to be.
If everyone on the planet were this objective and willing to analyze context and errors as you did, I don’t think the GOAT debate would even exist. People should reason based on objective criteria, but since most people can’t agree on the same ones, questions about whether MJ was as good or as flawed as some of us remember will always come up-even in regard to his three-point shooting.
Your explanation makes complete sense to anyone, even with a basic understanding, but I think many will always choose to ignore reasoning to avoid being wrong and they prefer to raise their voices repeating stuff they hear from some questionable “experts”!
What people fail.to mention is during MJs eras we had ROLE PLAYERS. Mike didnt have to shoot threes because he had guys on the team, whose specific job was to knock down threes. Namely, BJ armstrong and steve kerr. The same could be said for rebounds and rim protection, that was rodmans and horace grants job. Mikes job was to slash to the basket and score/create plays/breakdown the defense. Scottys role was to fill in the holes when needed. If MJ is shooting volume threes what does steve kerr do? Hes not getting to the basket thats for sure. The current nba doesnt have roles, its just shoot in volume and your bound to get hot.
People say players are way better all around but i always think of the term good at everything, master of nothing. People try to point to the best players like steph and say the whole league is better at shooting when only few players should be shooting that far that often
@dyloiris8876 i agree, thats why over the last 20 yeard there are no leaders in separate categories. No standouts with assists, no standouts with rebounds, blocks, steals.
😂😂,sad, but true.
@@dyloiris8876 and the reality is that, yes they are better, but literal 1-2% better in average... they abandoned all other aspects of the game (defense mainly) in order to get 2% better at 3pts. That's why todays league is so boring to watch, it's just a bunch of tiktokers trading 3s.
Celtics have a very effective strategy and mathematically it works
Context: It’s also easier to shoot 3’s today because of the rule set( freedom of movement, no hand check, able to carry the ball to create space).
And ...they are actively looking for that shot first and second.
In Jordans day, it was a bailout or last resort for a good chunk of his career, especially Early.
I feel like that works more for off-the dribble shots which granted are a huge part of a lot of great players game. But typical spot up shooting which is foundational in today’s game is unchanged by rules.
I can't say for sure since I didn't see all of his 3 points attempts, but his early years' 3 points probably came as last second shots wirh no choice otherwise which explains the terrible percentage with low volume.
yea its interesting, his 3pt% has an extreme positive correlation with his attempts. Most guys are the opposite.
Remember that he didnt play with a 3pt line until joining the NBA so it was a brand new shot for him. 90-93 is an interesting range to look at. In 90 and 93 he was at 3 attempts a game shooting ~36%, but in 91 and 92 he was back down closer to 1 attempt a game shooting
@@kevinjohnson4498
Usually, more attempts increase percentage.
High volume every game, the percentages don't have wild swings one way or the other. One bad game will have much less impact on overall %.
Taking only 2 game, the percentage will have wild swings game to game. One bad game has far greater impact on overall percentage.
And in practical basketball play...if you take more, you are practicing more. Therefore you should be comfortable finding a rhythm.
He wasn't a great 3poit shooter.
But he decent enough to not matter regardless the era he played (because let's be real that's what's all about).
And he could definitely become a good one if he needed.
Another ammunition against MJ is that he participated in the 1990 3pt contest and tied the record w/ Detlef Schrempf (1988) for fewest points in a round w/ five. Interestingly, that was also the only year in which Larry Bird was eliminated w/ 13 first round points (sources: Celticsblog, Orlando Sentinel, UPI), as well as the beginning of Craig Hodges' three-peat.
Thank God ... FULL CONTEXT!
MJ was a good to above average 3pt shooter.
Whenever he attempted 2+ 3pt shots per game he was above average and was a super solid 3pt shooter.
The philosophy of the game in the 80’s was not to incorporate the 3. In the 90’s when the game was a little more open minded to the 3 MJ adapted to the 3 and excelled at it.
MJ had great great elite shooting mechanics, and had a great great elite shooting touch!
Like we try to tell you youngins MJ had ZERO holes & weaknesses in his game. ZERO flaws! Good to Elite in all aspects of the game
He was a good three-point shooter, and when he attempted 3 or more, he was around the league average. Similar to Kobe. Bron shoots below the league average. There is the difference. It's all about volume, the era and how you stack up vs your peers.
He is literally statistically one of the worst 3p shooters of all time. Literally Giannis/Westbrook level. Lowest score in a 3p contest all time. Dude was a TERRIBLE 3p shooter
@gggyy7104 Did you even watch the video?
@@gggyy7104do you realise Jordan has a better % from 3 in the finals than lebron and kobe? 😂😂😂 and the two seasons he shot over 2.5 threes a game he made 37% and 35%, above league average.
@@Carvis23 Yeah, and in no universe was Jordan a “solid 3p shooter”. Only with the shortened line
@@user-mh6nm5mv4b The shortened line doesn’t count. Without the shortened line, he was at 29% for his career
Whenever I hear Jordan talk I am always amazed at how well spoken he is, even when you show early clips of when he was new in the NBA and in his first seasons. Not a spoiled brat, not some gangster from the hood crap, simply a well brought up and educated young man who went on to become the best basketball player in the history of the game.
Honestly that seems to be the case with most old school basketball players. Like even a douchebag dunce like Charles Barkley (I love Chuck FYI) comes off a more well spoken than most guys now
He also didn't have a 3pt line until college, ad even in college it wasn't widely used and wasn't used at all in the tournament. It wasn't adopted throughout all of college until 1987 or 1988. That interview clip also turned out to be kind prophetic too since there are a lot of guys that can shoot the 3 pretty well but aren't as great of a scorer from inside the arc compared to outside of it.
I don’t think he had a three point line in college or would’ve been his junior year before joining the nba
@@night6724 His Basketball_Reference page for college has 3pt stats for him for his sophomore year, and he shot 44.7% on 2 attempts per game albeit with a shorter line than the pros. Back then the 3pt line wasn't universal in college and only some conferences used it. It not being universal is why it wasn't used in the tournament.
Love this! I'm a big MJ fan for life yet still learning different aspects of his greatness. Thanks Jonny as always
KD said it best. Mike was one of the BEST jump shooters of all time... Not just 3s, but SHOOTING. This dude was a midrange assassin
Great video! The problem is the data surrounding his 3pt shooting falls under so many different contexts that makes it hard to nail down. It also means you can't just take his 3pt shooting percentage at face value like we do now. He came into the league without ever playing with a 3pt line and averaged less than one shot, usually as a last minute toss to win/tie games, and had abysmal 3pt shooting percentages for like the first 5-6 seasons of his career because of it.
His best 3pt shooting came when the league shortened the 3pt line so many people like to, and probably not wrong to, throw out those years.
And so because the rest of his career he didn't really take many 3s it's so hard to get to an idea of what he would like shooting the 3 today in volume.
I think there are two seasons in his career that help shed light into what he would be however. Other than the league shortened season there are only two seasons he averaged over 2.5 attempts a game. In his 89-90 season he averaged 3 3PAs a game and shot 37%. In 92-93 he shot 2.9 3PAs a game and averaged 35% from the beyond the arc.
I also tried to narrow games down where he shot 4 3pters or more a game and in those games he averaged like 38-39% but I couldn't filter out the years where the line was shortened so there is some questionable data in it.
I honestly believe though based on the data around his two highest volume shooting non 3pt line shortened seasons, his average in games where he took 4 or more 3pters a game, and his other shooting metrics that if he grew up with the 3pt line he would probably be a career 36-38% 3pt shooter in today's league.
Yeah you are right and i would also add that its a pretty much surefire assumption when MJ took around 1 threepoint attempt per game (which includes last seconds shot) he didnt pratice it at his training sessions because why would he have done it if it was almost non existing in his game? But when he mad 3.0 and 2.9 attempts per game in 89-90 (37.6%)and 92-93 (35.2%) you can be sure he was praticing it aswell at his training sessions. That shows us if Jordan had emphasized 3s more at his training sessions he would have been at least a decent 3 point shooter. at least 35-36% efficiency
Btw LEbron in his first 8 years already shot 4 attempts per game from 3s which means he consistenty practiced it at his training sessions despite of that he barely reached 33%. And Lebron is famous of being a bad shooter especially from midrange.
I believe there is a hard connection between midrange shots and 3s.
We can see players who are good from midrange they are good at 3s aswell, like KD, Kawhi, CP3, Booker,etc. or players who were good at midranges then transfered their game to the 3 point line became good 3 point shooters like Serge Ibaka. So do we really think Jordan who was a killer from midrange wouldnt have been good at 3s if he transfered his game there? This is what he has just shown us with his 3 attempts per game. I dont mind the Jordan criticism for example he was an asshole with his teammates but criticising his efficiency from 3s based on only his all time stat without context is just not fair. Thats why i dont feel a legitimate critic.
Great video, Jonny! I appreciate the nuance and context you bring to your argument and points. It is incredible how he was better in the playoffs (esp. The Finals) than the regular season. It makes sense though, given how he stepped up his game when it mattered most.
I'd say he was a decent 3 point shooter overall, but when the game was on the line, he sunk the most crucial 3 point shots and was a good 3 point shooter at critical moments.
Awesome video again. Have a nice day, Jonny 😊!
Dope vid Johnny
Great vid as usual...you made all the points, i totally agree with you...and by the way how in the world can random people or media say that Michael f... Jordan is a bad three point shooter ?
Honestly, for Michael Jordan‘s time he didn’t even really need a three-point shot for his game or for how the NBA as played back then. When he did start taking threes, like for example, 28% in his time means you could shoot, but nowadays 28% today doesn’t mean you can shoot. For his time he was a average shooter, and a decent shooter he needed to be. He also didn’t have to be a shooter, because teams didn’t rely on shooting threes as much as they do now but I still think Michael Jordan is an underrated shooter and capable of hitting threes if he really worked on it and if he got a chance to, in the set of the team schemes and game plans. It was still nice to see that he made the three-point contest too, even though he had the lowest score ever.
Haven’t watched the video yet but I believe he’s an underrated 3 point shooter I don’t think he was never bad and I actually think he was great for his time.
Great analysis I 100% agree I think he’s a great shooter overall and a good 3 point shooter
Thank u so much for this
Jonny Arnett.......I think you may be the GOAT basketball UA-camr. I don't know how many subscribers you have in Africa but I think I'm your biggest fan. Keep shining bro 👏👏
Jordan was good at whatever he wanted to be.
Decent for his era.
Which means it was bad
@@willemcenter8649 why does there have to be good or bad? Why can’t you just be OK?
@@willemcenter8649 it means it was bad to you because you want to be cynical for whatever reason instead of taking things for what they are in the context of their time. A graphics processor on a PS2 is technically "worse" than a graphics processor on a PS5, if the only thing you care about is how realistic a video game looks. But it doesn't mean it was any less effective at conveying iconic moments and classic aesthetics from legendary games.
MJ was objectively bad from 1984-1985 to 1992-1993 he shot 30.1 from 3 and in 1997-1998 he shot 23.8 from 3 im obviously not including 1994-1995 to 1996-1997 because the 3 point line was shortened between that stint which lead to his 3 point percentage being much higher then what it should have been
@@Kendricktimes2 Did you even watch the video?
He was objectively bad until 1988
He was objectively better than average (so not bad) after 1988
It's also important to keep in mind that in those early years-when Jordan was averaging less than one three-point attempt a game and was not looking to shoot the three-most of those long shots were attempts to beat the buzzer. It's not surprising that he hit such a low percentage of them.
1 three point a game is an important and significantly note. The higher someone shoots the better the percentage in most cases. Also it 3 pointers where introduced in 79-80 season, so they took time to really take off and implement.
Michael’s three point shot is such revisionist history. The three wasn’t important to nba back then and he didn’t need it to be the nba’s greatest scorer of all time
Exactly. Your thoughts are pretty in line with what I was saying towards the end of the video, how they’re viewing MJ through the lens of 2024 Basketball. Not EVERYONE has to be a 3 point shooter, but unfortunately that’s the simplistic take of the casual fan in 2024.
He made them when it matters
The 3 point shot wasn't what Jordan was focused on. He didn't want to sit at the 3 point line and wait for the ball. That's not his game.
Plus, the game didn't revolve around the 3 point line back then.
The NBA as we know it today is more like the WWE (entertainment). The NBA as a professional sport died long ago.
Something I always say... YOU PLAY THE PLAYERS IN FRONT OF YOU. Every era is officiated differently and evolves differently. MJ played and won with HIS STYLE OF PLAY. What else matters?? ...and I'm a fan of GREATNESS. MJ, Kobe, Lebron, Steph Curry ALL EMBODY THAT TRAIT. 🏀
What I remember about Jordan is that, he was hitting them at insane rate when his team needed it the most...no moment was to big for this dude... Growing up as a MJ hater, today I can say he's The Best basketball player ever.. grace, skill, stats aside.. watching him play against your team, you could never relax until the game was over.. never had that feeling with any other player except for Kobe between 06-2010 and I wasn't a Kobe fan either..
An additional point that adds to this is that if you look at the stats carefully, his 3p% and his 3pt attempts per season both almost perfectly coincide, so his 3p% got better whenever he attempted more, and that's with or without the decreased 3pt line seasons.
A skill isn't a weakness if the more you exploit it it gets better.
I agree - Guys can only beat (or not) those in front of them.
I also think players are all products of the era in which they played, which is why comparing players of different eras is so difficult.
That MJ quote talking about having a driving mentality vs spotting up is key. I think the NBA needs to do anything it can to incentivize stars taking it to the hoop. I like the 3pt line as a constraint to keep defenses honest, but I don't like it when the 3pt shot is the most important shot, especially when it is still not as consistent as a layup or dunk at the rim.
I think fouls on 3pt shots should only be 2 fts. I think the court should be widened so that a corner 3 pt shot is not shorter than other 3pt shots. You mention how they shortened the 3pt shot in the 90s, but the corner 3 is still shorter than any other 3pt shot. We don't call that out at all.
Before that Suns Nash/D’Antoni mid 2000s era where the game started to change, any player who wasn’t a 3point shooting role player who shot between 30-35% was basically as good as they needed to be to justify shooting a 3. The game was not the same whatsoever.
Was Jordan a good three point shooter? No. Was he a bad three point shooter? Also no. He was average and could be streaky from three point range but had he grown up with it and had it been more part of the basketball culture I think he would have been fine. On his comment about not shooting threes, I know he's the greatest, he's my GOAT, but he's just wrong. I don't want to disagree with Jordan on anything because he was just so great but he is just objectively wrong. In my opinion if he had worked on his three point game it would have made him even better. He was hard to guard from midrange, had a great first step, if teams had to guard him at the three point line with his first step, he would have had even more room to blow by guys. Not a big deal though, if the worst thing about your career was you were not the greatest three point shooter, being widely considered the greatest more than makes up for it.
One thing I thought you were going to point out is that, even starting with the 88-89 season, his 3P% is *positively* correlated with his 3P attempts. Even ignoring the 2nd 3peat due to shorter 3 point line, you have 5 seasons: 2 with 3+ 3 point attempts per game and over 35% accuracy, and 3 with
I love mj from day one up till today. But i really thought he was sucked at 3pointers because he didn't developed it that much, until you made this video. Thanks for this enlightenment
1) Plays were run for the post or for the midrange. The three-point line was only five seasons old in Jordan's rookie year. Three-point attempts were minimal, and were often called bad shots especially during transition plays. Players would run to the basket for lay-ups/dunks on the break, instead of running to the corner for the three. Anyone jacking up a three-point shot early in the shot clock instead of running the ball to the post would get an earful from the coach.
2) Jordan's game was predicated on slashing to the basket and mid-range jumpers. Even up to the first championship seasons (as appropriately referenced in the video), Jordan did not build his game around long-range shooting. By his own admission, it would take away his aggression and effectiveness on pressuring wing and rim defenders.
3) The three-point shot was a specialty shot during that period to open up the lane. Larry Bird famously said that less athletic players had to become shooters so that they can impact the game.
4) Jordan only took three-point shooting seriously when he returned from his first retirement, as his first step was no longer as explosive. He also worked on his post game/turn-around jumper.
5) The narrative around Jordan's poor shooting is often drawn from his horrible performance in the only three-point shootout he joined during All-Star weekend.
6) Jordan was an adequate three-point shooter but opposing teams would rather have him shoot the lower percentage shot than have him humiliate them at the rim. The three may be greater than the two, but a sure two is much better than a tough three.
1st Your in depth research is untouchable: You videos I call my personal set the record straight videos channel.
I did the greatest scorer of all-time/ evaluation and I came to know that Jordan wasn't the worst 3pt shooter or scorer Lebron's fans was making him out to be.
Like you said after year 88 he was above League Average/ I said his is good 3 point scorer and he can score from the 3 point line if he chose to.
Chef kiss to the logic used when splitting Jordan 3 % based on a learning curve , stakes and approach
I think it is an interesting what if for if jordan played in todays game. He definitely would have developed a 3pt shot just like so many others. I doubt he would ever be a really good 3 pt shooter but he definitely would be a threat. Ray allen was one of the players entering the league as a jordan type player yet he is now one of the greatest 3pt shooters. I would assume jordan would pick up the harden type step back and probably end up as a 35% on 5 attempts guy.
One other minor thing to mention, in his earlier years, when players sometimes averaged around 1 attempt or less per game, it was often a half court to full court heave at the buzzer. They weren't really worried about their percentages which is why so many of them had years where they shot under 10-20%
Larry Bird was the same way at the beginning of his career as well
its true! if mj focused on 3pters. thats just one point more than a lay up, mid range..
attacking the basket affects the game more, opponent fouls, going to freethrows to give ur tm8’s a chance to catch their breath, create openings for tm8 3’s or 2’s, helping out team for offensive rebounds.
nba teams know not to foul a 3pter so they can challenge but if they make it, hats off to them.
its just 1 more point vs the whole aspect of the game
I would argue Jordan was the team's "3-point specialist" during his first 3-peat in the PLAYOFFS.
Jordan made the most 3s over that 3-year stretch on the Bulls, while shooting roughly 38.5% from the arc.
Someone tell me if LeBum ever did anything like that.
Lebron shot a higher % from 3 than Steph Curry last year
@gggyy7104 Jordan shot a higher 3p% than LeBron in the Finals.
One guy is 6-0, with a game winning 3 in the Finals.
The other guy is 4-6, with NO game winning 3s in the Finals.
Can you guess who is who?
@@bwink23
One guy has the lowest all time score in a 3p contest when nobody’s guarding you
Another guy shot a higher % from 3 than Steph Curry at 39 years old
Can you guess who is who?
@gggyy7104 One guy was too scared to attempt a dunk contest or a 3-point contest...do you know who that was?
One guy made more 3-pointers than the entire opposing team in an NBA Finals series.. something Steph Curry never did.
Do you know who did that?
@@bwink23
The players don’t decide whether they participate in the contests goofy 🤣🤣 The NBA picks
But what I do know is that one player shot 28.8% from 3 without the WNBA line for his career AVERAGE
And the other player’s LOWEST 3p% in a season was 29% and that was with the standard line
Take a guess who is who
thanks for that
One more thing about MJ's 3p%. Because MJ wasn't a volume 3p shooter and took very few attempts per game, a lot of these shots were forced shots at the end of the clock, which mess up his %. If a person who shoots 10 3s a night takes these shots, they won't affect the % too much, but for MJ who took less than 2 attempts per game, it makes a difference
Difficult to make half court or very long three pointers count as shot attempts. These shots greatly reduce the percentage of three point shooting when the sample size is low.
For example, in 1990 jordan makes 1 out of 2 shots or 50% on regular 3 point shots and then fires up and misses a half court shot at the end of a quarter, the statistics will say that jordan shot a measley 1 for 3 or 33%.
Same scenario in 2020, lebron makes 3 out of 6 shots from three or 50% and then fires up and misses a half court shot at the end of a quarter. Statistics say he shot 3 for 7 or 42.8% which is great.
This math problem is not considered when comparing eras for 3point shooting
According to Nobody Touches Jordan, MJ was very good from the non-shortened three-point line in his prime during the playoffs. Even in the one area that is supposed to be his weakness, Jordan still set a playoff record.
Only player in NBA history, along with Steph Curry, to shoot at least 38% on 3-point field goals in 3 NBA Finals runs (minimum 15 PPG and 1.5 3PA/game)
Jordan did this in the Bulls' 1991, 1992, and 1993 championship runs under the original 3-point line. He also did it in the 1996 championship run, but with a shorter 3-point line
Four other players meet this criteria in multiple NBA Finals runs
- Terry Porter (1990 and 1992)
- Manu Ginobili (2005 and 2007)
- Ray Allen (2008 and 2010)
- Stephen Curry (2015, 2016, 2017)
All of the aforementioned players did this while scoring at a lower volume. Jordan is the only one to do it with 30+ ppg, all 3 times from 91-92-93. It would be 4 times if you included the shorter 96 line, but of course you shouldn't.
Jordan shot 55/142 (38.7%) 3PT from three in the 91-92-93 Playoffs in his prime.
Jordan shot 28/70 (40%) from the non-shortened 3-point line in his Finals career (1991, 1992, 1993, 1998). The shorter lines in 1996 and 1997 actually lowered his NBA Finals 3-point averages, probably due to passing his prime and less spacing afforded from shorter lines.
40% Non-Shortened Line 3PT Shooters for a Finals career (min. 15 PPG)
46.15% - Isiah Thomas (22.6 PPG) - 1988-1989-1990 Finals
45.24% - Kawhi Leonard (15.9 PPG) - 2013-2014 Finals
43.66% - Kevin Durant - (32.9 PPG) - 2012-2017 Finals
43.59% - Dan Majerle (17.2 PPG) - 1993 Finals
43.59% - Derek Harper (16.4 PPG) - 1994 Finals
41.30% - Larry Bird (23.1 PPG) - 1981-1984-1985-1986-1987 Finals
40.00% - Michael Jordan* (35.6 PPG) - 1991-1992-1993-1998 Finals
*Only including the non-shortened 3PT line. Including the shorter line in the 1996 and 1997 Finals, Jordan had 33.6 PPG on 36.80% 3PT for his Finals career.
Jordan was also 1 missed FT short of shooting 53/43/91 in the 1992 Finals. He shot 41/46 FT or 89% FT to barely miss it. The only player who has shot 50/40/90 in NBA Finals history under the original 3-point line and with enough 3PT/FT attempts (at least 1.5 3PA and 3 FTA/game) was Chauncey Billups in 2004, and while scoring at much lower volume of 21 ppg.
Writing this before finishing the video but wven as someone who doesn't want MJ to be the GOAT, I wouldn't make the crazy claim that he was bad at shooting 3s. The era context is important. Teams weren't setting up the 3 ball in the 80s and 90s. It was bigs to iso ball. MJ would turn it on in the playoffs, where the lights are the brightest. From 91-93 he averaged 2.4 3PA and shot .387. That's elite for the era. Always have to put the numbers in context with the era. His 1990 season is underrated in how he shot from 3. He was 14% better than league average and attempted 65% more shots from 3 than league average. Incredible.
He became a good 3 point shooter, although his skill in this area of the game was not as transcendent as his other skills, when compared to his peers. But he gave us the reason for that. It was clearly a choice, and related to a mentality he wanted to maintain. (And it should be noted, especially when talking about big men, that the ones that like to take 3 point shots, rarely like to drive to the basket, so MJ wasn't joking about the effect on his mentality when focusing on 3s).
But people sure learned not to leave him alone out there to shoot 3s. You absolutely had to respect him with that shot. You never heard anyone after that series say anything like, "we'll let him take that shot."
Most importantly, the bigger the stage, the bigger MJ's performance.
Decent to good. He would definitely be better at it today.
Today he would average 50+ easily even without high 3 point volume. He would just kill the terrible defense today with fadeaways and aggressive attacks to the rim. The modern soft losers of today don’t know how to guard that. These soft punks objectively would not survive the 80’s and 90’s. Just look at LeBanon I mean LeBum I mean LeBron. He would get murdered by Mugsey Boges. Sorry if I misspelled, but you get my point. Jordan would literally and figuratively murder LeBron. No question. If you call me an old head, go kick some rocks and chew some glass you shark teeth mouth breathing panty huffer
Something not many people take into account is that a significant amount of Jordan's 3 point attempts during his first 4 years were half court or full court shots at the end of regulation
personally i see it (kind of) similar to Demar Derozan. who actually isnt a BAD 3 point shooter, he just doesnt take them often at all. MJ just never took 3s. with such a low volume taken its not disingenuous to use percentages. a player shooting .9/2.4 would be listed at 35% but if they made .1 more itd be 42%. There are some players who fall victim to the small sample size box score watching (LeBron and his midrange percentages have been victim to this as well) epidemic that truly can only be fixed by looking deeper into tendencies and adding context. Jordan having multiple sub 30-20% 3point shooting seasons isnt an accurate reflection when hes not even taking 2 3s a game to measure it by
I've always felt that if MJ played in the modern NBA where the meta was to shoot 3s, he would just work on his 3PT game and adapt. He more than had the ability, but that's not the style of basketball he played. He played the style that allowed him to dominate his era. If he played at a time where 3s were more important to being successful, he'd just do that because at the end of the day, he was a winner.
Jordan was good enough from three to where you couldn't leave him open once he was in his prime during the early 90s.
He shot like 38% during the entire playoffs from 1991-1993, which is mainly regarded as his peak during his championship years. This was also the highest volume he shot for the most part.
Low volume is mainly what hurts Jordan's 3pt percentages, where every miss knocks a lot more off your overall shooting percentages. When that's the case, end of clock heaves and desperation shots will impact your numbers more.
If he played in today's NBA, then he would have just focused on what would make him win championships with his given body and his given team with current rules, same as what he has done during his era. I wouldn't be surprised if he trained himself to best Steph in 3PT%, range, shot creation, while still excelling in defense and being the leader of his team. That is what he meant by 'I chose to'. Whether he would still have won 6 championship or less or more would really depend on who his teammates are and the coach probably.
Well said.
Good enough to hit 6 straight in a finals game. Bad enough to be the worst contestant in 3pt shootout history.
I was born in June 2003, couple weeks before bron got drafted to the nba. To think he’s still a top tier player today, throughout my WHOLE life so far, is unbelievable. Brons my goat, but MJ was a fucking beast, I don’t understand the whole rivalry between the fans of each player. Sure some mj fans will say I’m wrong but I literally couldn’t watch him play, I’ve watched bron for the most part of his second half of his career. These “fans” of MJ and bron need to be put down. They’re both goats, just to different generations
I think with three pointers or with shooting in general it's about a certain threshold! Is it harder to maintain a certain % when the volume goes up? Yes! But it's also hard to reach a certain % when you only try one a game. There is no getting hot, no being streaky with only one attempt. Btw I bet some of those were also prayers and heaves with the clock expiring.
noone probably criticized it or saw it as a weakness back in the day, it's only people who try to over hype lebron by downplaying MJ who even use the 3 point argument. No1 would say someone like shaq is a bad 3 point shooter to try to downplay him.
After Watching This, We Can Now Say, That This Is Michael Jordan's Underrated Skill
His 3 pt percentage drastically rose as his attempts rose. Your percent wildly fluctuates if your not taking many.
Even if MJ is bad at 3-point shooting, it doesn't negate anything in his career or legacy. You play the game that's being played in the league at the time, not what's being played decades later. If MJ came into the league in 2020 and grew up watching Steph curry, he'd likely have a much different game than what he did coming in in the 80s.
MJ himself had said it best: he was as good as he chose to be! That's why when it mattered the most and the game situations needed him to shoot more 3s to win or just he wanted to prove a point, he simply did better! But when his other arsenals were sufficient to win then that's it, no need many 3s!
So cool :)
i really like your videos and appreciate the attention to detail. however if you or anyone goes to this depth to try and "justify" a part of lebron's game everyone would call them biased, but because its done for MJ we are all looking the other way.
His true 3point shot was the 2and1, which was more devastating, coz he was a pretty good free throw shooter, and got opposing big man and guards into foul trouble constantly. Thats why he said (i think) what he said in the interview, and subsequently choose not to include the 3pointer in his game at a high volume.
Michael Jordan was so competitive that he would have adjusted to whatever it took to win. If he would have needed the 3-pointer to win, he would have been one of the best in the league.
Important to note that MJ played his prime athletic years with the 3 not part of his game plan.The same leniency needs applied to most 80s players. OTOH, Jordan was at his best in the reduced line ERA, and outside of certain magnificent instances, was average as a 3 threat. Does not affect his GOAT candidacy
The rule set it so much more important. Yes, it was more physical in the 80s and 90s. Yes, defense was better in the 00s. Because of what the rules allowed. Same goes for the 60s, ect. Russell is the goat
What is so impressive is that MJ was a great shooter with those huge hands. Kawhi is the same. Wilt and Shaq had those huge hands, and couldn't shoot worth a damn. Having all of the good things with large hands (ball control, dunks, lay-ups, steals, blocks) without the only bad thing (shooting accuracy) is possibly the most important thing that elevated MJ above everyone else.
MJ’s shooting less than one 3 pointer per game in the 80s aka MJ almost never shooting 3 pointers unless it’s an end of quarter prayer…
Young guys might not have been able to compete back then, but MJ would average 40+ today by adding range. With high pick and roll, split action, and other modern schemes, he would be a surgeon.
Michael actually said it already why he didn't shoot 3's in a video he said "it takes away from his all around game"
I don't value volume 3pt shooting in my star. I value driving, penetrating the defense, and then being able to kick out. I do see the value in being able to keep defenses honest with a decent 3pt shot, but mostly, I want my star handling the ball and getting the defense in rotation.
When stars pressure the rim, then their 3pt shooting doesn't matter as much. Giannis doesn't need a 3pt shot. Zion doesn't need a 3pt shot. That is something you need more when you can't drive as well. Lebron shoots more 3s now when he can't drive as well as he used to.
He was fine at threes. Didn't matter, he went for the higher percentage shots. Something they once taught in basketball. When basketball was actually played.
Based on the stats and footage, MJ was a solid 3-point shooter throughout his career. The fact that his average in the finals was so high at over 40% should say it all.
"Clyde is a better 3-point shooter than I choose to be" that shit is so cold bruh. I wonder if Clyde either dismissed it or believed it. He seemed to be confident in his skills so that maybe didnt shook him but Mj being Mj, i wonder if that made him concerned.
Great end to the video btw.
I like when they bring up Jordan's 6 pts in the 3pt contest yet detlef Schrempf scored 6 and was considered a great 3 pt shooter and a certain guy named Kevin durant scored 7 pts in it but made a money ball so only made the same as Jordan yet isnt called a bad 3 poit shooter either.
I get two things from this video,
1. It took MJ to become an elite three point shooter before he won a championship
2. Steph is the GOAT because he doesn’t let 3-pointers affect his scoring mentality
Context is a killer for any attempts to argue against Jordan as the GOAT.
MJ is MJ which means over 80% of the time when he said he gonna do something then those things happen.
Great video, he a line drive 3, didn't have that nice arc to it 😅
When you the goat they gotta exaggerate any perceived weaknesses.
The thing about Jordan is he loves winning..if he can score and win a game by driving to the basket..hes gonna do it...just look at it this way...hes the 5th most points of all time...yet he barely made 3s....Kareem and Malone were the same but they had longer careers
As with all other aspects of MJ's game, his play style was all about winning and performing when it mattered the most. He made his 3's when he had to make them, especially in the playoffs and finals. What other players can really say this about their game?
When you only take 1 3pt shot per game, it's the end of quarter half court buzzer beaters. This is why 3pt FG% in the 80's was so low.
He was better than average. I don't think he'd shoot too many if he played today because he could score at will closer to the basket.He was never a terrible 3pt shooter. What Jonny here and everybody else fail to understand is that percentages were bad because the only time they shot 3 pointers was when they had to shoot with a clock running out. OBVIOUSLY your % will be crap when you are throwing a last second heave from 50 feet.
Didn’t take into account that many of his 3s in the 80s were possibly half court heaves and last second shots at the end of quarters. MJ didn’t care about his percentages.