At that time all beers would have been sour beers and pretty weak, mostly a water replacement. Mead was they used to blow their tops off and that doeasnt requie as much hygiene since it gets strong faster and is antiseptic anyway,.
@@rimmersbryggeri Yeah, I am sure beer tasted quit terrible back in the day. Beer wasn't even recorded as being bottle conditioned less than 400 years ago, so most beer in the past wasn't even carbonated.
@@christopherdobbs3601 It would have been and so would the mead becasue they drank most of it before it had fermented out with pieces of bread and twigs od flavourings still floating around in it. They still some times drink Ethiopian Tella Beer like that in ethiopia. " different types available, filtered and unfiltered.
What I like most about your channel is the sheer amount of experience and professional tips you show. It's the place I come to if I need good info on anything related to brewing beer.
Been brewing for about 7-8 months. You're addressing some of the main questions I've had. I've looked into it but the "experts" and books all say the opposite. It's to hear another side to some of these questions. Cheers
A couple a years ago I'd just done a brew and added the yeast. It was the middle of winter so of course the heat would have to go out. It was getting down to 59F in the house for three days, but my yeast (S-05) just kept chugging along. And that IPA turned out great.
Appreciate this video. Agree there are bigger things to worry about than the myths you discussed. Glad to know I'm not crazy for not worrying so much about these things.
Totally agree with you guys. I saw a documentary where they show some Trappist brewers (and who knows how good they are in making beer) the guy was sparging like 90 degrees (Celsius).
Thanks for the yeast info. About to brew with 1968. I've cut boils short pretty regularly on certain simple beers. No issues, people love them. I also don't usually boil vigorously unless I need to get volume down.
Thanks for watching! What style you making with the Fuller's Strain? We are kind of in the same boat with the vigorous(ness?) of our boils. We have nice kettles, but are still careful not to get any scorching flavor from our direct heat.
Genus Brewing an ipa with Chinook for bittering and a citra cascade combo. Just starting to brew a light Belgian blond ale, getting my strike water hot.
The best beer u ever brew was 8 years a go ,when no boil was starting to be a concept,I did no boil Dopplebock,8 % alc,fermented at low ale temperature, freaking amazing beer.
Ales, yes, temperature isn't so important when fermenting. I've fermented from 60-75 and not noticed much difference. However, I brewed a Saison and fermented it at about 65 and it tasted very different compared to a saison fermented at 75-80.
I do a lot of 15 minute boils with extract Pale Ales. I will usually use about five ounces of hops with it to cover up any off flavors that might pop up. I have found them to be some of the best beers I’ve made.
Thanks for the info. I’m still hesitant to make the leap to less than 60 minute boil. I am a lazy brewer also and would love to cut down the time of my brew day. I guess I’ll have to experiment myself. Keep the videos coming.
I found myself that if either you keep the temp below 180° for no boil (referred to as raw beer but it's still pasteurized) or boil for 15-30 minutes, I find that it's just fine either way. However if you do no boil, you want to put a couple of quarts in a pot dissolve some liquid malt extract in there and boil your hops in that for 10 minutes that you're hop extraction and then pour that into your no boil steeping grains. You still get hop extraction, but you don't have to spend an hour boiling the hops. Also, if you hold the temp between 160-170°, it pasteurize everything within 30 seconds. (I'm a dairy pasteurization Technician by day). For me though, I like holding the wort at 154° for an hour to get as much as I can from my grains when brewing a no boil batch, occasionally stirring the grains every 5-10 minutes or so when using the BIAB method.
I've always understood the importance of the 60 minute boil related to the importance of reaching the proper reduction or concentration in the wort. There would be a big difference in post boil volume from a 10 minute versus a 60 minute. Also, staging the hop additions along the way is important to final flavor and aroma.
The thing about oxidative effects during boil, water at those temps can't take in much oxygen anyway as the closer you get to 100C the less oxygen can be dissolved into it.
My father has been brewing for about 15 years and built our house with that hobby in mind. The house itself is sitting on a rocky hill, our basement carved into that rock, is on 2 levels and the lower level has the same ambient temperature throughout the year at around 16 C, which is where we ferment all our batches. I've had terrible experience with fermenting at 23-24 C. The off-flavors were too strong, even though I used very neutral yeast.
23-24 is definitely too warm for many yeasts, and 16 is in a great sweet spot where most yeasts will ferment nice, clean beers. There are definitely strains that will excel at higher temperatures, and some that will struggle in the 16C Range (my favorite yeast flocs out too fast at that temperature range and under attenuates). The 34/70 strain we mention in this video should be ideal for your temperature range though, even though it is a lager strain.
Yes, I know it was a bit too high but I was doing a Hefeweizen. I don't like very strong banana taste so I usually keep it in the 21-22 range. I wonder if I simply underpitched but the ester was just too much for my taste. It smelled more like a dish soap with a banana aroma. Most of our beers ferment at around 18-20C inside the fermenter. We have ways to regulate the temperature throughout the entire basement and can go as low as 10C in each compartment, depending on our needs.
With Heffes the best practice is to add a lot of healthy yeast, oxigenate, and ferment at an ideal temperature. People try to stress the yeast to boost the esters, but the best way to do that is actually an acid rest, or the addition of certain acids to the mash.
I do all the specific and required rests for wheat beers - even when manufacturers tell me the grain is so modified, it doesn't need those low temp rests, but I still do them. In fact my very first beer I brewed entirely on my own when I was 14, was a 100% traditional German hefe with 50/50 wheat/barley, dry WB-06 and generous amount of hallertau mittelfruh. This was the best hefe I ever had in my entire life, and I've had many.
I heard a myth that Coors Light is the official beer of drinking in the shower, but honestly if I open my mouth in the shower, I swear I taste Coors Light even though I don't have a beer. What gives?
Would you know the difference between that "water beer" and a craft beer?? KEYSTONE LIGHT VS BALLAST POINT KOLSCH ($100 BLIND TASTE TEST) ua-cam.com/video/ZCTvKf51LN8/v-deo.html
I can't remember if it was this video or your part 2 that mentioned the myth of not stirring during your boil because of risk of oxidation. You guys are right on with what you say but also to stiffen your point, oxygen cannot thrive in water that's above 75 degrees farenheit so I don't see how stirring a boiling wort would introduce oxygen.
Do you use 6 row grains in any beers? I thought about trying it for the first time to make a clone. Just found you guys, love it. I was doing BiB and always squeezed bag. BUT now going electric brew method for home brew after 22 years.
I took a budweiser tour in February and saw a boil kettle getting wort pumped in like crazy, that's enough proof for me hsa does not exist... I'll keep recirculating with my spiral atomizer just above the surface to get that nice gentle fan thru my grain bed..
One thing I have wondered about is recipes that call for adding additional hops halfway through the boil. There are only two classes of flavor that can be derived from hops. Bittering flavors from hop oils that require a lot of boiling to extract and aromatic water-born flavors that are destroyed after only a few minutes of boiling. I reason that instead of adding, say, one ounce of a specific hops after 30 minutes of boiling, a similar result could be accomplished by adding only a half ounce of those specific hops at the beginning of the boil. If my reasoning is wrong, then what exactly is it that is being extracted from the hops by utilizing a shorter boiling time?
You aren't far off, Rob. There are a handful of intermediate flavors that can be gained from mid-boil hops, but in terms of IPA's the most recent trend has been late additions, after the boil is over. The balance is because of the difference between time for flavor/aroma compounds to become water soluble (for example, alpha acids need to isomerize before they can dissolve in wort) and the time it takes for the compounds to volatilize (become a gas and evaporate away from the beer). For hop-forward beers, I have recently tended towards the current trend of massive post-boil additions, among which there are still variances. This topic can get very convoluted, but in short, how you tackle post-boil additions depends largely on your chilling method. For beers that aren't traditionally hop-forward, I tend towards traditional hopping methods, for example a combination of a 60 and 20 minute addition.
Yesterday, 12-28-17, I did a fast boil on 4 gallons of Munich Dunkel and got the perfect bitterness from my hops in a 15 minute boil. Total boil time was 30 minutes. How? I used my Instant Pot Pressure cooker and put in 3 cups of wort, and brought it to boil on the stove as I got the main batch up to boiling temp. When it was at the boil point (little SS Pot) I put it inside the Instant Pot Pressure Cooker, set it on poultry, and adjusted the time to 15 minutes at HIGH pressure. when it was done i added the boiled wort, with the hops extracted into the main batch and finished the boil of the main adding the aroma hops about 3 minutes before flame out. Tasted it and "just" right... for me anyway. I figured the higher temp and pressure of the pressure cooker would lessen the time to do the bittering hops addition, lessening my overall boil time..... and it did.
On the forum site I visit I was talking about this, and it worked great! Then one of the members gave me a link: www.homebrewtalk.com/bittering-hops-in-15-minutes.html#comment-31595 I come up with it at supper one day recently, but the idea is even put into equations graphs and figures at that link. It IS real and possible.
I love Palmer and other gurus, but it's easy to get wound around the axle on a lot of things (Palmer even says this several times in his book). I'm about to try my first all-grain batch and I'm to the point where I just need to fire up the burners and get brewing and see what happens. Water chemistry is one of these areas for me. I appreciate the de-bunking of some of the fidgety parts of brewing. Thanks for the great videos...subscribed.
Yea the biggest thing we like to tell people is you can make great beer without being perfect. The best way to learn is to just jump in fearlessly - you might make some mistakes along the way, but that's how you learn where the line is! :)
Typically we don't do any transfers throughout fermentation. We actually find that single-vessel fermentation takes out risks from transfering and depending on the yeast can help the beer to clean up off flavors and some yeasts will actually clarify more on the cake.
I got a tilt hydrometer a few brews ago and can now see how much warmer the wort gets during fermentation. Is the recommended temperature range of your yeast an actual wort temperature or ambient temperature of your room your fermenting in? If its wort temperature then im always high and I dont have a control chamber to ferment in
Hello, Genus Brewers! Great video! :) Quick question on split-boiling. For my cooker it takes a lot of precious watts and time to boil a whole 5 gal tank for 60-90 minutes. Could I boil all of my hops (say, 2 oz for the 5 gal batch) for aroma and bitterness in a smaller 1/2 gal pot filled with the wort and then combine it back? Of course, pasteurize the whole mix afterwards at ~180F for 10min. Would that method be any different for the final taste? Understandably there will be less impact on gravity as there's little evaporation. Maybe there is an answer, I don't seem to find it :( Thanks!
I have a vague suspicion that squeezing SOME grain contributes to a chill haze that just won't go away on maybe 1 outta 5 of my beers. Taste is awesome, but that chill haze pisses me off. So I tried to not squeeze my bag during my last session to see if it made a difference. I could not NOT squeeze my bag, though, so perhaps I'll never know.
Hey guys I'm switching from 1 gallon batches to 5 gallon extract brews not sure if you covered this but I have a question about partially covering the pot during the boil because I brew in my apartment and the burner sucks I feel like partially covering the pot is the only way I'm going to maintain a boil for 3 to 3.5 gallons of wort. I read opinions that say it's fine and others that make it sound like if you even think about a lid during the boil that your beer will be a dms riddled bottle of creamed corn flavored hop water. Just wondering what you might think....
If you mash at 170 you are no longer converting FERMENTABLE sugars correct? Or am I mistaken? You are usually supposed to mash out at 170 after full conversion?
How would you sweeten the cider and when also how much sugar do you add to get rid of the tart flavour and can you add gelitine to clear it and would you bother with transferring to the secondry thanks
Sweetening a cider depends dramatically on how you are packaging. If you are bottle conditioning Stevia is your best sweetening option. If you can keg your best option is to drop out the yeast and back sweeten to taste with juice or juice concentrate :)
You sure can! Try the cal lager strain or 34/70 strain and ferment at normal temperatures, then once the beer is packaged (bottles or kegs) just find a spot to keep it cold for a longish time before serving!
German Munich or Melanoidin malts actually shouldn't be problematic because they are darker. The precursor to DMS (SMM) actually cooks off with a higher degree of malting so it shouldn't be a problem in darker malts. Typically the malts to worry about are undermodified or undermalted, light base malts.
Brulosophy actually just did a write up on something very similar! He found that although the overnight mash had a higher efficiency and finished dryer, he was not reliably able to determine a flavor difference from a standard 60 minute mash!
Talking about shorter boil times I read somewhere that people do a 90 minute boil because it gives the Wort 30 minutes to settle in the boil and allow something to happen (forgive my bad memory) before you begin adding your bittering hops so as not to change what properties the hops might give to the wort in the First few minutes of the boil. can you shed any light on that
Do I really NEED a yeast starter? I was planning on brewing today but didnt have time to make a starter. will not doing one really affect my beer that much?
Depends on gravity. I think of a starter more as insurance. Its a better guarantee that the yeast will do what you want it to. Any time you don't starter you are gambling a bit
During my "60 minute" boil now, does adding different hops at different times even matter? If I just throw all my hops in and boil for about 10 minutes, is this going to change the outcome, versus adding some at 30 min in, then 45 min and so on?
Yeah, the 60 minutes hops are bitter hops. They give bitterness to the beer. Basically, the shorter you boil the hops, you get more aroma and less bitterness. If you add all your hops in the last ten minutes, you will get very low IBUs but very much aroma.
Interesting to hear that lager yeast was found to ferment out the same at "lager" temps and "'ale" temps. Not sure I buy it, but it would be great if it is really true.
Ray O'Lenic It is very strain specific. The particular yeast we like to use is the 34/70 or Bohemian lager strain. It has very clean flavors even when fermented warm!
Also Saflager S-189 can ferment at warm temps, even at 70F. a local beer maker has won award on his S-189. Another is a California Lager strain that can ferment at warmer temps as well with little issues. See: brulosophy.com/2016/02/08/fermentation-temperature-pt-4-lager-yeast-saflager-3470-exbeeriment-results/
Absolutely! Try it with the 34/70 (bohemian lager) strain, or with a Cal Lager strain. (34/70 for slightly more malt-driven flavors, Cal Lager for brighter flavors)
So re myth no 3, do you think that in a 23 litre batch which calls for a 60 or 90 minute boil hop addition, it would work to take say 3 or 4 litres of the wort and boil the long hop addition in a separate pan and just add it to the remainder of the wort towards the end? It would save boiling the whole lot for 90 mins - could even be done in some spray malt wort say the night before?
In general my response to 60-90 minute hop additions is to either add higher AA% hops for non-hoppy beers, or simply add more hops for hoppy beers. There are a broad range of variables in estimating IBUs, inlcuding wort density and the mobility of the hops in the boil, so although in theory you can dramatically hop a small amount of wort to add to the larger batch to adjust bitterness, the extra work and variability steers me away from trying that as a method.
Aah, very true, good answer - I guess it could throw a curve ball from the increased saturation in the smaller amount of wort - maybe one to try when time is very limited though, and need for bittering hops is lessened, so a neipa or a punk-like clone.thanks for the answer, and great channel, glad I stumbled upon you!
so when you use a hop bag...is there any issue with the oils and resins not getting out into the wort? I guess the same thing would be questioned for starches releasing through from a BIAB...do these effect efficiencies!?
When using a hop bag we always say to get an oversized bag that can roll around in the wort. This increases the contact area for the hops and help you not lose utilization. If the hop bag is tight and clumps the hops together you can definitely lose some of the hoppy goodness :) BIAB can have reduced efficiency for a couple of reasons, but there are always techniques to buffer against that loss. One that we've used in a couple of our videos is pulling the bag over into a separate bucket and doing a pseudo-sparge in that to add back to the boil later.
Thanks for your reply I've been turning around my milk stout in 8 days and kegging them I use the beer gas 75/25 they are to die for what you think of that thanks
I'm assuming unhopped since the wort is unboiled? The biggest risk as far as I know is botulinum toxin. If you plan to store wort for starters best practice would be to properly can/pasteurize the wort. Even if boiling the wort at a later date, although the toxin will degrade the bacterial spores will not. Flavor wise, I am skeptical but have not personally experimented with storing unboiled wort without immediately inoculating (for gose/Berliner Weiss ect)
A brewery in my area did a wort share on Sunday and I didn't get back from vacation until today so they set a 6.5 gallons aside for me. Hoping to brew on Thursday but it sounds like it may not be worth the risk?
What's your plan with it? If you don't have time for a brew today you could always acidify and pitch a mixed-culture if you have easy access to those things. If it's in a sterile, oxygen free environment it is probably still fine, assuming the mash temperature and length were high/long enough to pasteurize the wort. I'd say it's gotta be a judgement call based on what conditions you feel the wort was stored in.
It is in a sterile, oxygen free environment and is a wort produced by a well established brewery so I am confident it was processed properly. I'm thinking I'll boil after all and pitch tonight and hope for the best. Thanks for the advice and cheers!
Not really a myth, but something to look at: Do you really need to mash for 60 minutes? Probably not. You can periodically test your mash to find the sweet spot.
Depends on the Ice, but store-bought Ice is usually save as it is UV pasteurized and generally fresh when you buy it. If the store doesn't turn Ice around quickly though I would trust it less. I would also never trust Ice out of your fridge/freezer for chilling beer.
If its ice from the sterilized water it can be done, otherwise you potentially introduce other bacteria. Store bought ice has been proven to potentially include bacteria that might affect your brew and yeast
If you drink american beers, you cannot taste differences in temperature of fermentation... with higher temperatures, yeast produce some other alcohols, which have different taste and can be modre dangerous... second you need boil it for 60 or 90 minutes for two reasons, firstly you need to get all proteins of your beer (time depends on type of malt), secondly you need evaporate dangerous substances from malt
Hot side oxidation begins when the water is slopped into the malt, stirred like mad and the lid closed for an hour. Home made beer usually goes from the boiler to belly in four weeks, the damage does not set in. Real issues become myth due to the type of liquid home made beer brewers produce. The liquid is basically distillers wash. I'm not sure that any experiments are of value when it comes to brewing Ale or Lager due to the poor quality liquid the experiments are performed on. High modified malt means that the malt has less enzyme content. The malt is high protein, except for certain types of Marris Otter which are very high modified malt but it is low protein. Marris Otter is distillers malt that home brewers have been convinced will make Ale and it will if enzymes are added. High protein malt contains less starch which means less sugar. It is basically, distillers grade malt. The single infusion is used in the brewing industry as a means to test malt. the temperature used for testing can be found in every recipe for producing home made beer. The method is used to produce grain alcohol. The liquid is called wash, the slang is moonshiners beer. That is the type of liquid that most home brewers produce which somehow by magic becomes Ale. It is chemically and enzymatically impossible to produce Ale using single infusion, single temperature method. The part about high sparge temps; you failed to mention that the complex starch called amylo-pectin enters into solution at temperature of 169 F and up. The starch bursts, the enzymes denature due to the high temperature and the occurrence creates starch carry over. But, that is probably a myth, as well. By the way, when you toss the starch in the garden notice that the birds are eating it. They are eating your money, more importantly, they are eating the starch that produces Ale and Lager. Yup, squeeze the bag, might as well squish the protein mud, protein gum, beta glucan and carry over starch right into the boiler, not to worry about tannin. Batch sparge while you're at it, that method insures that the highest amount of goop goes into the boiler. The method claims to increase efficiency, all that it increases is the amount of goop in the wort that a hydrometer floats high in. When the goop drops out, the hydrometer sinks and the brewer believes a false reading. Unless, your taste buds are tuned for drinking moonshiners beer with hops added continue to make home made style beer because everything works and everything that causes issues in Ale and Lager are myths. It is a conn story used to convince novices that anything goes and not much knowledge is needed to produce Ale. If novices knew what it takes to produce Ale the home made beer empire would not exist as it does today.
I won a homebrew competition which awarded me to brew on the brewery's pro system. We just scaled my recipe up and it was virtually the same type of single infusion process that I do at home. Sooooooooooo.....
yea,,,i am a bit confused on this slagging of home brewing . I am actually going to school for brewing ...and making ale is a pretty standard routine around the world ...with a few different techniques and exceptions of course . so I am not sure if the idea is moonshiners are way more sophisticated or what?
I have drunk macrobrewery lager with more substance than this comment, which is like the violent, sustained belch that their overcarbonated thinness musters forth on a hot summer evening: noisome gas.
Michael James said " If novices knew what it takes to produce Ale the home made beer empire would not exist as it does today." So I am curious as to what it takes to produce Ale? Is not Farmhouse beers (ales) from Norway also ales? Is not their techniques and "cleanliness" of brewing (if I may be so bold to address this) a lot less critical than here in the U.S. and other places? Yet they seem to have enjoyed making distiller's mash and enjoyed it for generations. So, again, what is ale? What is Lager? and mostly important then what do the commercial breweries do differently than what small home brew and craft brewer do?
Actually, adding hydrogen peroxide (H₂O₂) doesn't increase dissolved oxygen; it actually decreases it. The oxygen released during the breakdown of H₂O₂ escapes as gas rather than staying dissolved in the liquid. So it's not the best option for increasing mash oxidation, it's just decreasing it.
I can't help but think about Vikings or Monks hundreds of years ago, searching around for their laser thermometers and star san, on brew day.
I think star san was probably a highly valuable commodity during the ancient spice trade.
I question the solubility of that ancient version...
At that time all beers would have been sour beers and pretty weak, mostly a water replacement. Mead was they used to blow their tops off and that doeasnt requie as much hygiene since it gets strong faster and is antiseptic anyway,.
@@rimmersbryggeri Yeah, I am sure beer tasted quit terrible back in the day. Beer wasn't even recorded as being bottle conditioned less than 400 years ago, so most beer in the past wasn't even carbonated.
@@christopherdobbs3601 It would have been and so would the mead becasue they drank most of it before it had fermented out with pieces of bread and twigs od flavourings still floating around in it. They still some times drink Ethiopian Tella Beer like that in ethiopia. " different types available, filtered and unfiltered.
What I like most about your channel is the sheer amount of experience and professional tips you show. It's the place I come to if I need good info on anything related to brewing beer.
Been brewing for about 7-8 months. You're addressing some of the main questions I've had. I've looked into it but the "experts" and books all say the opposite. It's to hear another side to some of these questions. Cheers
Glad to hear you got something out of this - If you have any specific questions on brewing feel free to drop comments on any of our videos to ask :)
They guy stage right is 3 beers ahead of the guy stage left. But great info. Thanks fellers!
🤣🤣 think those are potent IPA or potent aged belgian darks they're drinking?
I am so going to give your ideas a go on my next brew day starting with a 30 min boil,thanks guys from over the pond 👍🍻
A couple a years ago I'd just done a brew and added the yeast. It was the middle of winter so of course the heat would have to go out. It was getting down to 59F in the house for three days, but my yeast (S-05) just kept chugging along. And that IPA turned out great.
Appreciate this video. Agree there are bigger things to worry about than the myths you discussed. Glad to know I'm not crazy for not worrying so much about these things.
We like to help you focus on all the other things you're crazy for ;)
Great video! It is perhaps one of the best videos for home brewers. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.
We appreciate the compliment! Talking about beer is what we love to do :)
I like the way you guys think. I'm just like you. Cheers and thanks for challenging the self-proclaimed experts.
Thanks for watching!
Totally agree with you guys. I saw a documentary where they show some Trappist brewers (and who knows how good they are in making beer) the guy was sparging like 90 degrees (Celsius).
Thanks guys you are a breath of fresh air
Thanks for the yeast info. About to brew with 1968. I've cut boils short pretty regularly on certain simple beers. No issues, people love them. I also don't usually boil vigorously unless I need to get volume down.
Thanks for watching! What style you making with the Fuller's Strain?
We are kind of in the same boat with the vigorous(ness?) of our boils. We have nice kettles, but are still careful not to get any scorching flavor from our direct heat.
Genus Brewing an ipa with Chinook for bittering and a citra cascade combo. Just starting to brew a light Belgian blond ale, getting my strike water hot.
Kyle B - Nice! There is a local brewery in Spokane that uses that as their house yeast and their IPAs are phenominal. Have a fun brew day!
The best beer u ever brew was 8 years a go ,when no boil was starting to be a concept,I did no boil Dopplebock,8 % alc,fermented at low ale temperature, freaking amazing beer.
You guys are wicked cool!! Thanks for the beer knowledge on myths. We'll have to bring you in as a guests on our beer show sometime!!
Ales, yes, temperature isn't so important when fermenting. I've fermented from 60-75 and not noticed much difference. However, I brewed a Saison and fermented it at about 65 and it tasted very different compared to a saison fermented at 75-80.
I do a lot of 15 minute boils with extract Pale Ales. I will usually use about five ounces of hops with it to cover up any off flavors that might pop up. I have found them to be some of the best beers I’ve made.
Save a bunch of time AND make great beer! Its the way to go :)
Very interesting, I am going to have to run parallel batch with 30 vs 60 minute boil :-)
Thanks for the info. I’m still hesitant to make the leap to less than 60 minute boil. I am a lazy brewer also and would love to cut down the time of my brew day. I guess I’ll have to experiment myself. Keep the videos coming.
Do It!
I found myself that if either you keep the temp below 180° for no boil (referred to as raw beer but it's still pasteurized) or boil for 15-30 minutes, I find that it's just fine either way.
However if you do no boil, you want to put a couple of quarts in a pot dissolve some liquid malt extract in there and boil your hops in that for 10 minutes that you're hop extraction and then pour that into your no boil steeping grains. You still get hop extraction, but you don't have to spend an hour boiling the hops. Also, if you hold the temp between 160-170°, it pasteurize everything within 30 seconds. (I'm a dairy pasteurization Technician by day). For me though, I like holding the wort at 154° for an hour to get as much as I can from my grains when brewing a no boil batch, occasionally stirring the grains every 5-10 minutes or so when using the BIAB method.
u guys saved me so many problems I watched a lot of video before I stumbled onto yours
Glad to hear! :)
I live off grid and my house can get up to 85+ during the summer, I've not had any problems with my wine yet.
I've always understood the importance of the 60 minute boil related to the importance of reaching the proper reduction or concentration in the wort. There would be a big difference in post boil volume from a 10 minute versus a 60 minute. Also, staging the hop additions along the way is important to final flavor and aroma.
Thanks for the very informative video, making home brewing less complicated.
The thing about oxidative effects during boil, water at those temps can't take in much oxygen anyway as the closer you get to 100C the less oxygen can be dissolved into it.
Good ol gas law!
My father has been brewing for about 15 years and built our house with that hobby in mind. The house itself is sitting on a rocky hill, our basement carved into that rock, is on 2 levels and the lower level has the same ambient temperature throughout the year at around 16 C, which is where we ferment all our batches. I've had terrible experience with fermenting at 23-24 C. The off-flavors were too strong, even though I used very neutral yeast.
23-24 is definitely too warm for many yeasts, and 16 is in a great sweet spot where most yeasts will ferment nice, clean beers. There are definitely strains that will excel at higher temperatures, and some that will struggle in the 16C Range (my favorite yeast flocs out too fast at that temperature range and under attenuates). The 34/70 strain we mention in this video should be ideal for your temperature range though, even though it is a lager strain.
Yes, I know it was a bit too high but I was doing a Hefeweizen. I don't like very strong banana taste so I usually keep it in the 21-22 range. I wonder if I simply underpitched but the ester was just too much for my taste. It smelled more like a dish soap with a banana aroma.
Most of our beers ferment at around 18-20C inside the fermenter. We have ways to regulate the temperature throughout the entire basement and can go as low as 10C in each compartment, depending on our needs.
With Heffes the best practice is to add a lot of healthy yeast, oxigenate, and ferment at an ideal temperature. People try to stress the yeast to boost the esters, but the best way to do that is actually an acid rest, or the addition of certain acids to the mash.
I do all the specific and required rests for wheat beers - even when manufacturers tell me the grain is so modified, it doesn't need those low temp rests, but I still do them. In fact my very first beer I brewed entirely on my own when I was 14, was a 100% traditional German hefe with 50/50 wheat/barley, dry WB-06 and generous amount of hallertau mittelfruh. This was the best hefe I ever had in my entire life, and I've had many.
Although it may not be needed for full conversion it definitely still impacts flavor. For Hefe's the ferulic acid rest is especially impactful.
The main reason I get polyphenol astringency is because of dry hopping. Some hop verities are smoother and some harsher.
Good video Guys. The yeast segment was very interesting I've had a feeling that was the case with some yeast strains! Keep the videos coming
Thanks for watching!
Great topic, “as brewers today are now commonly implored not to heed the lore of antiquity”. - Brulosophy
I heard a myth that Coors Light is the official beer of drinking in the shower, but honestly if I open my mouth in the shower, I swear I taste Coors Light even though I don't have a beer. What gives?
Would you know the difference between that "water beer" and a craft beer??
KEYSTONE LIGHT VS BALLAST POINT KOLSCH ($100 BLIND TASTE TEST)
ua-cam.com/video/ZCTvKf51LN8/v-deo.html
I can't remember if it was this video or your part 2 that mentioned the myth of not stirring during your boil because of risk of oxidation. You guys are right on with what you say but also to stiffen your point, oxygen cannot thrive in water that's above 75 degrees farenheit so I don't see how stirring a boiling wort would introduce oxygen.
Most of our myths just come from experience, but yea gas solubility decreasing with increased temperature is a solid point against hot side aeration.
Also a rolling boil is like stirring it up anyway surely
Oh great now how do i get back the three years of boiling time. Lol. Great video. Thanks.
Do you use 6 row grains in any beers? I thought about trying it for the first time to make a clone. Just found you guys, love it. I was doing BiB and always squeezed bag. BUT now going electric brew method for home brew after 22 years.
We have but we prefer other highly enzymatic malts instead. Our go to for extra conversion is Heidelberg Malt
I took a budweiser tour in February and saw a boil kettle getting wort pumped in like crazy, that's enough proof for me hsa does not exist... I'll keep recirculating with my spiral atomizer just above the surface to get that nice gentle fan thru my grain bed..
One thing I have wondered about is recipes that call for adding additional hops halfway through the boil. There are only two classes of flavor that can be derived from hops. Bittering flavors from hop oils that require a lot of boiling to extract and aromatic water-born flavors that are destroyed after only a few minutes of boiling.
I reason that instead of adding, say, one ounce of a specific hops after 30 minutes of boiling, a similar result could be accomplished by adding only a half ounce of those specific hops at the beginning of the boil.
If my reasoning is wrong, then what exactly is it that is being extracted from the hops by utilizing a shorter boiling time?
You aren't far off, Rob. There are a handful of intermediate flavors that can be gained from mid-boil hops, but in terms of IPA's the most recent trend has been late additions, after the boil is over. The balance is because of the difference between time for flavor/aroma compounds to become water soluble (for example, alpha acids need to isomerize before they can dissolve in wort) and the time it takes for the compounds to volatilize (become a gas and evaporate away from the beer). For hop-forward beers, I have recently tended towards the current trend of massive post-boil additions, among which there are still variances. This topic can get very convoluted, but in short, how you tackle post-boil additions depends largely on your chilling method. For beers that aren't traditionally hop-forward, I tend towards traditional hopping methods, for example a combination of a 60 and 20 minute addition.
Yesterday, 12-28-17, I did a fast boil on 4 gallons of Munich Dunkel and got the perfect bitterness from my hops in a 15 minute boil. Total boil time was 30 minutes. How? I used my Instant Pot Pressure cooker and put in 3 cups of wort, and brought it to boil on the stove as I got the main batch up to boiling temp. When it was at the boil point (little SS Pot) I put it inside the Instant Pot Pressure Cooker, set it on poultry, and adjusted the time to 15 minutes at HIGH pressure. when it was done i added the boiled wort, with the hops extracted into the main batch and finished the boil of the main adding the aroma hops about 3 minutes before flame out. Tasted it and "just" right... for me anyway. I figured the higher temp and pressure of the pressure cooker would lessen the time to do the bittering hops addition, lessening my overall boil time..... and it did.
That is a very interesting variant on how to get hop oil flavors out of your hops. I had no idea that we can pressure cook hops.
On the forum site I visit I was talking about this, and it worked great! Then one of the members gave me a link: www.homebrewtalk.com/bittering-hops-in-15-minutes.html#comment-31595 I come up with it at supper one day recently, but the idea is even put into equations graphs and figures at that link. It IS real and possible.
I love Palmer and other gurus, but it's easy to get wound around the axle on a lot of things (Palmer even says this several times in his book). I'm about to try my first all-grain batch and I'm to the point where I just need to fire up the burners and get brewing and see what happens. Water chemistry is one of these areas for me. I appreciate the de-bunking of some of the fidgety parts of brewing. Thanks for the great videos...subscribed.
Yea the biggest thing we like to tell people is you can make great beer without being perfect. The best way to learn is to just jump in fearlessly - you might make some mistakes along the way, but that's how you learn where the line is! :)
Do you guys do a two-step fermentation? And if not, have you noticed any differences between aroma, color, flavor??
Typically we don't do any transfers throughout fermentation. We actually find that single-vessel fermentation takes out risks from transfering and depending on the yeast can help the beer to clean up off flavors and some yeasts will actually clarify more on the cake.
Awesome video guys, just subscribed , I also brew my own beer make my own wine . Just bought a Kegerator and plan on kegging next week . Cheers
I got a tilt hydrometer a few brews ago and can now see how much warmer the wort gets during fermentation. Is the recommended temperature range of your yeast an actual wort temperature or ambient temperature of your room your fermenting in? If its wort temperature then im always high and I dont have a control chamber to ferment in
Many questions! To go!
Yup!
Have you guys ever put hops in cold water and brought it up to boil and then added extract for a short boil?
I like your pet mini sasquatch.
Jajaja!
We think we'll keep him :)
Hello, Genus Brewers! Great video! :) Quick question on split-boiling. For my cooker it takes a lot of precious watts and time to boil a whole 5 gal tank for 60-90 minutes. Could I boil all of my hops (say, 2 oz for the 5 gal batch) for aroma and bitterness in a smaller 1/2 gal pot filled with the wort and then combine it back? Of course, pasteurize the whole mix afterwards at ~180F for 10min. Would that method be any different for the final taste? Understandably there will be less impact on gravity as there's little evaporation. Maybe there is an answer, I don't seem to find it :( Thanks!
anyone have the answer to this please?
I have a vague suspicion that squeezing SOME grain contributes to a chill haze that just won't go away on maybe 1 outta 5 of my beers. Taste is awesome, but that chill haze pisses me off.
So I tried to not squeeze my bag during my last session to see if it made a difference. I could not NOT squeeze my bag, though, so perhaps I'll never know.
Really informative thanks.
Instead of dry hopping I’m going to try hop tea. I’ve read mixed results about it
I've not had great luck with Hop Tea, but I have heard it used with success! The craziest hopping I've used is french-press in the final beer!
Hey guys I'm switching from 1 gallon batches to 5 gallon extract brews not sure if you covered this but I have a question about partially covering the pot during the boil because I brew in my apartment and the burner sucks I feel like partially covering the pot is the only way I'm going to maintain a boil for 3 to 3.5 gallons of wort. I read opinions that say it's fine and others that make it sound like if you even think about a lid during the boil that your beer will be a dms riddled bottle of creamed corn flavored hop water. Just wondering what you might think....
I know'it 😄 thenk you guys for all
Cheers!
Right on, thanks. I also am a lazy brewer.
Is there any books or other literature out there that explains the qualities of various strains of yeast?
If you mash at 170 you are no longer converting FERMENTABLE sugars correct? Or am I mistaken? You are usually supposed to mash out at 170 after full conversion?
Yea 170 will stop the enzymes - its outside of Alpha Amylase range amd hot enough to denature them.
what about sanirizing. is it critical to sanitize the bottle capper it's already clean?
Never hurts, but also prolly not necessary
How would you sweeten the cider and when also how much sugar do you add to get rid of the tart flavour and can you add gelitine to clear it and would you bother with transferring to the secondry thanks
Sweetening a cider depends dramatically on how you are packaging. If you are bottle conditioning Stevia is your best sweetening option. If you can keg your best option is to drop out the yeast and back sweeten to taste with juice or juice concentrate :)
Does this mean I can lager in my apartment without buying and modifying a cooler
You sure can! Try the cal lager strain or 34/70 strain and ferment at normal temperatures, then once the beer is packaged (bottles or kegs) just find a spot to keep it cold for a longish time before serving!
Would not squeezing the air out of chill cubes affect the wort in any way? Ultimately the flavour?
Also is it a good idea to whirlpool your beer in your brew kettle after cooling or not thanks
What about using malts like German Munich malts or German Melanoidin malts for DMS? Would they be the more problematic with shorter boils you mention?
German Munich or Melanoidin malts actually shouldn't be problematic because they are darker. The precursor to DMS (SMM) actually cooks off with a higher degree of malting so it shouldn't be a problem in darker malts. Typically the malts to worry about are undermodified or undermalted, light base malts.
While I will concede the no secondary in homebrewing bit...John Kimmich. Is my response to the almost all of the rest.
What's the minimum boil time to get bitterness from the hops though?
Adding 4oz of high alpha hops to whirlpool/flameout depending on cool-down time can get you a high-Ibu beer easily!
@@GenusBrewing Thanks for replying. But if you were to do a 60 min boil you wouldn't need as many hops right?
How about a 12-16 hour mash in an insulated cooler?
Brulosophy actually just did a write up on something very similar! He found that although the overnight mash had a higher efficiency and finished dryer, he was not reliably able to determine a flavor difference from a standard 60 minute mash!
Where is your store. ??
Hi guys can you please tell me the best finings to clear cider and beer thanks
Talking about shorter boil times I read somewhere that people do a 90 minute boil because it gives the Wort 30 minutes to settle in the boil and allow something to happen (forgive my bad memory) before you begin adding your bittering hops so as not to change what properties the hops might give to the wort in the First few minutes of the boil. can you shed any light on that
I do 90 minute boil. Gives good hot break to reduce foaming over with hop additions. Probably not necessary, but I get good results.
Hi guys can you please tell me the difference between roast barley and roast chocolate malt or are they both the same thanks
Roast Barley is more tannic and bitter. Chocolate malt comes across a little powdery and carries deeper flavors.
Do I really NEED a yeast starter? I was planning on brewing today but didnt have time to make a starter. will not doing one really affect my beer that much?
Depends on gravity. I think of a starter more as insurance. Its a better guarantee that the yeast will do what you want it to. Any time you don't starter you are gambling a bit
Genus Brewing that’s a myth, I’ve never used a yeast starter in many years of brewing.
During my "60 minute" boil now, does adding different hops at different times even matter? If I just throw all my hops in and boil for about 10 minutes, is this going to change the outcome, versus adding some at 30 min in, then 45 min and so on?
Yeah, the 60 minutes hops are bitter hops. They give bitterness to the beer. Basically, the shorter you boil the hops, you get more aroma and less bitterness. If you add all your hops in the last ten minutes, you will get very low IBUs but very much aroma.
"Were lazy brewers" amen to that. Thats why i stick to Coopers and Muntons
Nuthin wrong with that! :)
Interesting to hear that lager yeast was found to ferment out the same at "lager" temps and "'ale" temps. Not sure I buy it, but it would be great if it is really true.
Ray O'Lenic It is very strain specific. The particular yeast we like to use is the 34/70 or Bohemian lager strain. It has very clean flavors even when fermented warm!
Our LHBS in Toledo carries Wyeast, so I assume that 2124 Bohemian Lager yeast is the same as the 34/70 you are referring to?
Yes, as far as I know these two strains are analogs to each other.
Also Saflager S-189 can ferment at warm temps, even at 70F. a local beer maker has won award on his S-189. Another is a California Lager strain that can ferment at warmer temps as well with little issues. See: brulosophy.com/2016/02/08/fermentation-temperature-pt-4-lager-yeast-saflager-3470-exbeeriment-results/
So if I wanted to make a Vienna lager I could ferment at room temp?
Absolutely! Try it with the 34/70 (bohemian lager) strain, or with a Cal Lager strain. (34/70 for slightly more malt-driven flavors, Cal Lager for brighter flavors)
Subbed!
Cheers!
Will definitely come back to this video (ordered a kit to learn how to brew). Y'all are a couple deep in this video though huh? Lmao
After going through the comments obviously I'm not the only one that picked up on that.
CAN YOU REVIEW THE ROBO-BRUE V3 with pump ??
It is very likely that will happen in the near future!
So re myth no 3, do you think that in a 23 litre batch which calls for a 60 or 90 minute boil hop addition, it would work to take say 3 or 4 litres of the wort and boil the long hop addition in a separate pan and just add it to the remainder of the wort towards the end? It would save boiling the whole lot for 90 mins - could even be done in some spray malt wort say the night before?
In general my response to 60-90 minute hop additions is to either add higher AA% hops for non-hoppy beers, or simply add more hops for hoppy beers. There are a broad range of variables in estimating IBUs, inlcuding wort density and the mobility of the hops in the boil, so although in theory you can dramatically hop a small amount of wort to add to the larger batch to adjust bitterness, the extra work and variability steers me away from trying that as a method.
Aah, very true, good answer - I guess it could throw a curve ball from the increased saturation in the smaller amount of wort - maybe one to try when time is very limited though, and need for bittering hops is lessened, so a neipa or a punk-like clone.thanks for the answer, and great channel, glad I stumbled upon you!
Thanks for watching! Let us know if you experiment with that idea!
so when you use a hop bag...is there any issue with the oils and resins not getting out into the wort? I guess the same thing would be questioned for starches releasing through from a BIAB...do these effect efficiencies!?
When using a hop bag we always say to get an oversized bag that can roll around in the wort. This increases the contact area for the hops and help you not lose utilization. If the hop bag is tight and clumps the hops together you can definitely lose some of the hoppy goodness :)
BIAB can have reduced efficiency for a couple of reasons, but there are always techniques to buffer against that loss. One that we've used in a couple of our videos is pulling the bag over into a separate bucket and doing a pseudo-sparge in that to add back to the boil later.
I thought the point of not going above 170 was that above that you killed of your enzymes ...no ?
Thanks for your reply
I've been turning around my milk stout in 8 days and kegging them I use the beer gas 75/25 they are to die for what you think of that thanks
I also have a fermentation freezer full control
wow thnx guys
You're welcome!
Thoughts on storing unboiled wort?
I'm assuming unhopped since the wort is unboiled? The biggest risk as far as I know is botulinum toxin. If you plan to store wort for starters best practice would be to properly can/pasteurize the wort. Even if boiling the wort at a later date, although the toxin will degrade the bacterial spores will not. Flavor wise, I am skeptical but have not personally experimented with storing unboiled wort without immediately inoculating (for gose/Berliner Weiss ect)
A brewery in my area did a wort share on Sunday and I didn't get back from vacation until today so they set a 6.5 gallons aside for me. Hoping to brew on Thursday but it sounds like it may not be worth the risk?
What's your plan with it? If you don't have time for a brew today you could always acidify and pitch a mixed-culture if you have easy access to those things. If it's in a sterile, oxygen free environment it is probably still fine, assuming the mash temperature and length were high/long enough to pasteurize the wort. I'd say it's gotta be a judgement call based on what conditions you feel the wort was stored in.
It is in a sterile, oxygen free environment and is a wort produced by a well established brewery so I am confident it was processed properly. I'm thinking I'll boil after all and pitch tonight and hope for the best. Thanks for the advice and cheers!
You're welcome!
For the record...... I don’t squeeze my grain bag because of any myth... I don’t squeeze it because it’s a SIN!
Not really a myth, but something to look at: Do you really need to mash for 60 minutes? Probably not. You can periodically test your mash to find the sweet spot.
Don’t squeeze the bag, and I see HOW TO BREW behind Logans head 🤣🤣 that is where I read not to squeeze ze bag
How long should you ferment a milk stout for at 20 c
Jack Tyrrell 3 weeks at 20c will do nicely for 99.9999999% of ales
Gettin a little cray here.
Yep.
Can I toss ice in my wort to lower temp to pitching temp? I once saw u guys add ice to your boiled wort.
Depends on the Ice, but store-bought Ice is usually save as it is UV pasteurized and generally fresh when you buy it. If the store doesn't turn Ice around quickly though I would trust it less. I would also never trust Ice out of your fridge/freezer for chilling beer.
If its ice from the sterilized water it can be done, otherwise you potentially introduce other bacteria. Store bought ice has been proven to potentially include bacteria that might affect your brew and yeast
Just discovered this channel, how about you brew a beer and shatter all the myths in the process, then do a follow up with a tasting and the results.
33k views! Headed to the moon!!
Apparently people like when we get drunk and talk about brewing stuffs! :p
Then there was LODO. ;)
squeeze the bagggggggggggggggggg
Every drop!
Question can you use pure apple juice treated with vitamin c to make cider thanks
Yes you can! Vitamin C will actually help prevent oxidation in the cider as well.
Vie-hey-stey-fan
If you drink american beers, you cannot taste differences in temperature of fermentation... with higher temperatures, yeast produce some other alcohols, which have different taste and can be modre dangerous... second you need boil it for 60 or 90 minutes for two reasons, firstly you need to get all proteins of your beer (time depends on type of malt), secondly you need evaporate dangerous substances from malt
Hot side oxidation begins when the water is slopped into the malt, stirred like mad and the lid closed for an hour. Home made beer usually goes from the boiler to belly in four weeks, the damage does not set in. Real issues become myth due to the type of liquid home made beer brewers produce. The liquid is basically distillers wash. I'm not sure that any experiments are of value when it comes to brewing Ale or Lager due to the poor quality liquid the experiments are performed on.
High modified malt means that the malt has less enzyme content. The malt is high protein, except for certain types of Marris Otter which are very high modified malt but it is low protein. Marris Otter is distillers malt that home brewers have been convinced will make Ale and it will if enzymes are added. High protein malt contains less starch which means less sugar. It is basically, distillers grade malt. The single infusion is used in the brewing industry as a means to test malt. the temperature used for testing can be found in every recipe for producing home made beer. The method is used to produce grain alcohol. The liquid is called wash, the slang is moonshiners beer. That is the type of liquid that most home brewers produce which somehow by magic becomes Ale. It is chemically and enzymatically impossible to produce Ale using single infusion, single temperature method.
The part about high sparge temps; you failed to mention that the complex starch called amylo-pectin enters into solution at temperature of 169 F and up. The starch bursts, the enzymes denature due to the high temperature and the occurrence creates starch carry over. But, that is probably a myth, as well. By the way, when you toss the starch in the garden notice that the birds are eating it. They are eating your money, more importantly, they are eating the starch that produces Ale and Lager.
Yup, squeeze the bag, might as well squish the protein mud, protein gum, beta glucan and carry over starch right into the boiler, not to worry about tannin. Batch sparge while you're at it, that method insures that the highest amount of goop goes into the boiler. The method claims to increase efficiency, all that it increases is the amount of goop in the wort that a hydrometer floats high in. When the goop drops out, the hydrometer sinks and the brewer believes a false reading.
Unless, your taste buds are tuned for drinking moonshiners beer with hops added continue to make home made style beer because everything works and everything that causes issues in Ale and Lager are myths. It is a conn story used to convince novices that anything goes and not much knowledge is needed to produce Ale. If novices knew what it takes to produce Ale the home made beer empire would not exist as it does today.
sooooo...if we are not making ale...what are we making? what is the definition of ale?
I won a homebrew competition which awarded me to brew on the brewery's pro system. We just scaled my recipe up and it was virtually the same type of single infusion process that I do at home. Sooooooooooo.....
yea,,,i am a bit confused on this slagging of home brewing . I am actually going to school for brewing ...and making ale is a pretty standard routine around the world ...with a few different techniques and exceptions of course . so I am not sure if the idea is moonshiners are way more sophisticated or what?
I have drunk macrobrewery lager with more substance than this comment, which is like the violent, sustained belch that their overcarbonated thinness musters forth on a hot summer evening: noisome gas.
Michael James said " If novices knew what it takes to produce Ale the home made beer empire would not exist as it does today." So I am curious as to what it takes to produce Ale? Is not Farmhouse beers (ales) from Norway also ales? Is not their techniques and "cleanliness" of brewing (if I may be so bold to address this) a lot less critical than here in the U.S. and other places? Yet they seem to have enjoyed making distiller's mash and enjoyed it for generations. So, again, what is ale? What is Lager? and mostly important then what do the commercial breweries do differently than what small home brew and craft brewer do?
Actually, adding hydrogen peroxide (H₂O₂) doesn't increase dissolved oxygen; it actually decreases it. The oxygen released during the breakdown of H₂O₂ escapes as gas rather than staying dissolved in the liquid. So it's not the best option for increasing mash oxidation, it's just decreasing it.