Here's my two cents, on an Education salary I'm not looking to blow all my points on a one way first class trip. Those points need to really go the extra mile for me. That's why I don't plan vacations, I let them fall on my lap by routinely checking award flights and transfer bonuses. Did two round trips to Paris on economy for 60k points total. That to me is much better than a one way first class ticket.
I only book economy, and the 1.5x from Chase and USBank Reserve cards are the best you can do except for a few cases with transfer partner on international flights, but it's probably 2x max. It doesn't make sense to me that the aspirational flyers would value points so highly when booking business/first class if they would never pay that much with cash. I would value business class at 2x economy for 10+ hour flights. Maybe 1.5x for domestic flights since they're usually short, so it's not that uncomfortable to be in economy for a few hours.
I have a theory that TPG benefits from overvaluing the transferable miles because the high valuations make the cards look better, therefore more enticing to new members of the points community, and therefore pulling in more readers/spenders
I really try to redeem my points for as much value as I can, but i think it’s most important to make sure you get the trip you want. First class is awesome, but if you can take three economy flights instead it might be a better way to use your points in the end. It’s different for everyone and the points valuations are really just a rough guide.
For me, I find medium to longer haul business class and use points for that one. Economy tickets and hotels are a good way to make the stash of points - I use Chase Travel Portal and Capital One Travel to get 5x on paid flights and 10x on prepaid hotels. Then - a J ticket comes to Singapore or Australia and here is the use...
@@antonh1709 That makes sense. I think business class flights can be really practical actually. It's not fun to deal with jet lag on a big trip and a good business class seat can help make the flight more restful. I need 4 seats for my family so it's a bit harder to justify business class flights for that reason. Unfortunately.
I hate the obsession about getting the highest CPP. So many people are sitting on stacks of MR points confused because they can’t find a 2 cent per point redemption on their family road trip. As long as you are going on a trip you want, it shouldn’t matter
My understanding from reading TPG's guide on points, American Express, Chase Points, Captial One points are valued more than airline points since you have more options (cash out, transfer points, statement credits, etc) with these points unlike pure airline points which can only be redeemed (typically) for flights or transfer them to an alliance partner or partner. Most of my points are American Express. My primary airline is American Airlines (Charlotte). I have a lot of American Airline points due to traveling with them, AA credit card spend etc. So, I look to get at least the value of the points for AA which is currently 1.77 cents per mile when I book flights using AA points. For American Express, I look to get at least 2 cents (current value) per point when I transfer points to an airline partner. So, even if a transfer partner may have their valuation at 1.5 cents (example) per point, I'm looking for at least 2 cents per point if I transfer Amex points. Kinda like exchanging USD for another currency. It's not uncommon that a partner in an alliance will cost less points than your primary airline. So, those are options to look at too. Or your primary airline doesn't have a route to a destination you want to go. Therefore, American Express points can be transferred to a different airline and alliance for point redemption. So, worst case scenario - if I can no longer fly, I would more likely lose my American Airline points unless I donate them. With American Express, I can cash them out (or do something different) even though at a possible bad redemption. But at least I got something. In the end, American Express gives me more options when I book points travel since I have many airlines to choose from vs. needing to stick with a particular airline.
TPG gets paid by Chase and Amex to tell everyone that UR and MR are 2cpp. That's the only algorithm they use, check deposits in their checking account lmao
Great insight on how these are calculated. I generally show people TPG valuations if they are new to this and don't have a good handle ont he rough comparision among airlines and hotels, so the TPG numbers are a great starting point. I agree with the sentiment that seems to be coming up in the comments - I'd rather go somewhere twice in economy than one time in business class, if the numbers allow. I'm glad you covered the flexibility of say, Chase points to be transferred just about anywhere. I try to keep my stash as high as possible to top off other programs or to transfer if the value makes sense, else just book through the portal. I wish the Chase portal was a bit better - sometimes maps don't load when I'm looking at hotels and other weird glitches. I also wish they had better parametric search options for things like number of bedrooms and other property details.
This makes a lot more sense now... Great idea for a video Ben! I also imagine the reason that transferrable currencies are valued higher is because they don't skew them as much towards domestic travel. That's my guess at least.
I think the simplest way to get a baseline of what Amex and Chase would get is what's the minimum possible value you can get through their portal. With the CSR you know for a fact you can get 1.5c value on all travel and with the Business Platinum you know for a fact you can get 35% rebate on flights which is about 1.53c. I find this to be a more realistic valuation of both currencies.
When using the calendar the airlines tend to give the worst flights the highest view for the reason of us calculating. When I dig deeper to book a flight for myself it's getting closer to 1c/pt for the flights that best suit me or anyone else.
Well I had to book economy on United for 8 people! I got RT 320k points amd $560 PDX to LIM... ofcourse I waited to find Saver Awards. If it wasn't saver it was 44k points per person instead of 20k. (Each way) Cash prices were a total of $6968 which gives me a valuation of .02c per point. I usually book Business but for 8 people (since I wanted my parents and others to go) I had to go economy. But I'm happy with the redemtion.
Great video and an interesting topic. Personally, I shoot for a minimum 2 CPP for flexible points redemptions, and I also have a spreadsheet where I record every award redemption I've done so that I can calculate my own valuations per currency based on my actual redemptions. I currently have it calculating that by a weighted average by amount of points, so a 100k points redemption counts 5 times as much as a 20k points redemption for example. Some of my valuations are closer than others to TPG's. My Hyatt valuation for example is 2.66 CPP compared to TPG's 1.7 CPP but knowing that helps me adjust my bar for target redemption values when taking into consideration how I actually travel.
0:47 the most valuable Chase transfer partner is Hyatt???? Are you serious? A good Hyatt redemption is 2cpp, maybe 3-4 if you're going somewhere really exotic. A good Singapore redemption is 10+
That is what the points guy says. Probably because like we say in the video, with airlines they weight it at 80% economy redemptions and 20% business/first
I find The Points Guy valuations as helpful, but not applicable to me. I use them as guidelines and create my own valuations based on my planned redemptions. I have a business with very high credit card spend, so I have more points than I can reasonable use every year. So, I assign values based on how I use them. I value Chase at 1.5 times because I can reliably use the Chase portal to book flights or rental cars at that rate. For Amex, I also value them at 1.5 times because I have the Amex Business Platinum and use Rewards points for my preferred airline which rebates 35% for redemptions. For Citi and Capital One, I use 2X because I usually transfer those points to Singapore Airlines for Business Class international tickets. I use Bilt Rewards and Chase points for Hyatt as well since I get well over 2 times value for Hyatt redemptions. I am also a United 1K so I use United miles for Saver fares when I can get them for over 1.7 times which is quite frequently since 1K have greater availability of saver fares.
I don’t care about points valuation. All I care about is having enough points to take the flight/trip I want at that moment. This year I have 3 business class tickets with Turkish, 1 business class with Emirates from Milan to NY and a first class round trip with Emirates Newark to Athens scheduled for summer and the fall. I also have several nights reserved for a trip to Miami and Honduras, I even got 2 car rentals all with points. I checked the first ticket to Athens whenI booked it and it would have been almost 17K but I got it for 187K points and 245 dollars. All other redemptions I didn’t even bother to check how much I would have spend because I wasn’t going to pay cash for them so I just did the redemption.
Ben I'll be honest, I almost missed this video because the thumbnail didn't have your iconic background of iMac and $ haha. Very thoughtful and interesting video though!
I think most of his valuations are overpriced. Take Wyndham for example. He has them at 1.1 cents per point. I have a hard time finding properties that value at even a 0.5 cents a point. Sure there are always exceptions but they are few. That’s why I prefer 5% cash back cards for most of my spend.
Very interesting video. This is part of the reason why I use whatever credit card will give me the highest return on spend whether it’s cash back or points, because I feel like these elevated points valuations are kind of speculative. You can get really elevated value if you get the right scenario, but it’s not something that I’m going to count on. I give a slight boost in my mind to points but if something gives me 5% cash back and another card gives me 3% in points, I’m using the card that gives me 5% cash back. Of course you don’t have to choose if you’re using a card that earns UR or thank you points for example.
These valuation sites really need to compile two different averages... one for Business/First Class valuations and another one for Economy redemptions. That would be more helpful than trying to combine both into one number.
That's actually up to each of us - where we like to fly and decide what airlines to transfer to, etc. For example, if you like flying between the coasts around Canada or from/to the USA, then AC or UA is your choice - AC often has excellent lie-flat J available for miles. Another example - regional flights around Canada which can get costly to book but are often available for relatively small number of miles. Sometimes you can visit a small picturesque town in the mountains for 10K KLM (WestJet) or Avianca/United (Air Canada) miles per way, while cash booking for such flight could easily be in $1000 range.
I have a question. Let's say I have AMEX points and Chase points. I know that they both have for example British Airways ( and some other airlines ) as a partner. Can I transfer points from AMEX (let's say 30,000 amex points) and Chase (let's say 30,000 chase points) to my membership number of British airways? Thank you in advance!
Yes! So you can pool points from both chase and amex in the mutual transfer partner e.g. BA. I do that all the time. Also British Airways lets you do household accounts, so you can even have other family members transfer points from chase or amex to their BA accounts and they all pool together
I'm about to join Jason and leave the game. Chasing redemption values seems like a headache. I'll stick with Chase 1.5x travel portal and hyatt redemptions.
Chase = Bilt > Citi = Amex > Capital1 to me. There’s much overlap in partners, and those that have exclusive partners, very useful partners or special powers are more valuable to me, e.g., Bilt: united, american, hyatt and also 1.25 cents redemption at its travel portal, all without annual fee. Main drawback is that it’s a startup, so more of a risk of defaulting on points. Chase: united, hyatt, 1.25-1.5 cents redemption at its travel portal Citi: 1 point redeems for 2 choice points, jetblue Amex: delta, ana, 1.1 cent cashout through schwab platinum Capital1: erasing travel charges at 1 cent per point but can also get 5-10x on those charges if at its travel portal (venturex)
Great video! When using my points I typically look at the cents per point calculation while also taking into account the “cash out” price especially for chase. I also look at the economy cash price versus the economy and business class points prices. I would never pay $5k for a round trip business class ticket, but if the economy price is $1200 and the points prices are 30k economy 60k business I’m going to consider it worth my points. By comparing this way I’m looking at what I would actually pay and making sure my points are going far enough for me
It is a good starting point, unfortunately for me business class and higher doesn't work for me, so economy premium, probably the most luxurious I can afford with my points. Same like 90% of people who don't have big business spending or have no business at all, I can't max out my referrals, hell, I am happy if I can get a few. New card bonuses help, but not as much as I would like. So my idea of chase redemption is 2 cents, mostly for Hyatt, city 1.2 cents for JetBlue and I have to figure out for amex and capital one.
I don’t agree that points are only worth that much if you would realistically spend that money. Since you are still getting something that is valued at $5k. For a lot of people there is no way they could justify $5k for a flight and the only way they ever fly business is using points.
@@TheCreditShifu exactly they'll never justify it at 5k so are the number of points they redeemed really worth 5k? I see it as the points redeemed on actual everyday travel or travel you would actually spend real money on are worth more. Just my 2 cents per point.
what did they say that was "woke"? It seems so fashionable these days to just call something woke just because someone doesn't like what they heard or didn't understand.
Jason told me that he is officially back in the game, just wanted to let you know
LOL
The plot thickens
@@berryzedzero 😂😂
@@mickylord21 😂😂
Here's my two cents, on an Education salary I'm not looking to blow all my points on a one way first class trip. Those points need to really go the extra mile for me. That's why I don't plan vacations, I let them fall on my lap by routinely checking award flights and transfer bonuses. Did two round trips to Paris on economy for 60k points total. That to me is much better than a one way first class ticket.
You made at least 2 points for your two cents, so we're only getting 1 cent per point on this comment.
Same. I don’t really care that much about business class. It’s nice but not really worth the extra points.
Tell you what... I'd really like to have the Hilton Aspire for at least one year.
I only book economy, and the 1.5x from Chase and USBank Reserve cards are the best you can do except for a few cases with transfer partner on international flights, but it's probably 2x max. It doesn't make sense to me that the aspirational flyers would value points so highly when booking business/first class if they would never pay that much with cash. I would value business class at 2x economy for 10+ hour flights. Maybe 1.5x for domestic flights since they're usually short, so it's not that uncomfortable to be in economy for a few hours.
I have a theory that TPG benefits from overvaluing the transferable miles because the high valuations make the cards look better, therefore more enticing to new members of the points community, and therefore pulling in more readers/spenders
I really try to redeem my points for as much value as I can, but i think it’s most important to make sure you get the trip you want.
First class is awesome, but if you can take three economy flights instead it might be a better way to use your points in the end. It’s different for everyone and the points valuations are really just a rough guide.
For me, I find medium to longer haul business class and use points for that one. Economy tickets and hotels are a good way to make the stash of points - I use Chase Travel Portal and Capital One Travel to get 5x on paid flights and 10x on prepaid hotels. Then - a J ticket comes to Singapore or Australia and here is the use...
@@antonh1709 That makes sense. I think business class flights can be really practical actually. It's not fun to deal with jet lag on a big trip and a good business class seat can help make the flight more restful.
I need 4 seats for my family so it's a bit harder to justify business class flights for that reason. Unfortunately.
I hate the obsession about getting the highest CPP. So many people are sitting on stacks of MR points confused because they can’t find a 2 cent per point redemption on their family road trip. As long as you are going on a trip you want, it shouldn’t matter
My understanding from reading TPG's guide on points, American Express, Chase Points, Captial One points are valued more than airline points since you have more options (cash out, transfer points, statement credits, etc) with these points unlike pure airline points which can only be redeemed (typically) for flights or transfer them to an alliance partner or partner.
Most of my points are American Express. My primary airline is American Airlines (Charlotte). I have a lot of American Airline points due to traveling with them, AA credit card spend etc. So, I look to get at least the value of the points for AA which is currently 1.77 cents per mile when I book flights using AA points.
For American Express, I look to get at least 2 cents (current value) per point when I transfer points to an airline partner. So, even if a transfer partner may have their valuation at 1.5 cents (example) per point, I'm looking for at least 2 cents per point if I transfer Amex points. Kinda like exchanging USD for another currency.
It's not uncommon that a partner in an alliance will cost less points than your primary airline. So, those are options to look at too. Or your primary airline doesn't have a route to a destination you want to go. Therefore, American Express points can be transferred to a different airline and alliance for point redemption.
So, worst case scenario - if I can no longer fly, I would more likely lose my American Airline points unless I donate them. With American Express, I can cash them out (or do something different) even though at a possible bad redemption. But at least I got something.
In the end, American Express gives me more options when I book points travel since I have many airlines to choose from vs. needing to stick with a particular airline.
I just value them at the cash value. 1.25 for CSR using the PYB feature and 1.1 for Amex Schwab. Anything above that is icing on the cake.
TPG gets paid by Chase and Amex to tell everyone that UR and MR are 2cpp. That's the only algorithm they use, check deposits in their checking account lmao
He could improve the algorithm by giving "economy points value" and "premium points value", separately.
I agree
Great insight on how these are calculated. I generally show people TPG valuations if they are new to this and don't have a good handle ont he rough comparision among airlines and hotels, so the TPG numbers are a great starting point. I agree with the sentiment that seems to be coming up in the comments - I'd rather go somewhere twice in economy than one time in business class, if the numbers allow.
I'm glad you covered the flexibility of say, Chase points to be transferred just about anywhere. I try to keep my stash as high as possible to top off other programs or to transfer if the value makes sense, else just book through the portal. I wish the Chase portal was a bit better - sometimes maps don't load when I'm looking at hotels and other weird glitches. I also wish they had better parametric search options for things like number of bedrooms and other property details.
This makes a lot more sense now... Great idea for a video Ben! I also imagine the reason that transferrable currencies are valued higher is because they don't skew them as much towards domestic travel. That's my guess at least.
I think the simplest way to get a baseline of what Amex and Chase would get is what's the minimum possible value you can get through their portal. With the CSR you know for a fact you can get 1.5c value on all travel and with the Business Platinum you know for a fact you can get 35% rebate on flights which is about 1.53c. I find this to be a more realistic valuation of both currencies.
When using the calendar the airlines tend to give the worst flights the highest view for the reason of us calculating. When I dig deeper to book a flight for myself it's getting closer to 1c/pt for the flights that best suit me or anyone else.
Well I had to book economy on United for 8 people! I got RT 320k points amd $560 PDX to LIM... ofcourse I waited to find Saver Awards. If it wasn't saver it was 44k points per person instead of 20k. (Each way) Cash prices were a total of $6968 which gives me a valuation of .02c per point. I usually book Business but for 8 people (since I wanted my parents and others to go) I had to go economy. But I'm happy with the redemtion.
Great video and an interesting topic. Personally, I shoot for a minimum 2 CPP for flexible points redemptions, and I also have a spreadsheet where I record every award redemption I've done so that I can calculate my own valuations per currency based on my actual redemptions. I currently have it calculating that by a weighted average by amount of points, so a 100k points redemption counts 5 times as much as a 20k points redemption for example. Some of my valuations are closer than others to TPG's. My Hyatt valuation for example is 2.66 CPP compared to TPG's 1.7 CPP but knowing that helps me adjust my bar for target redemption values when taking into consideration how I actually travel.
0:47 the most valuable Chase transfer partner is Hyatt???? Are you serious? A good Hyatt redemption is 2cpp, maybe 3-4 if you're going somewhere really exotic. A good Singapore redemption is 10+
That is what the points guy says. Probably because like we say in the video, with airlines they weight it at 80% economy redemptions and 20% business/first
I find The Points Guy valuations as helpful, but not applicable to me. I use them as guidelines and create my own valuations based on my planned redemptions. I have a business with very high credit card spend, so I have more points than I can reasonable use every year. So, I assign values based on how I use them. I value Chase at 1.5 times because I can reliably use the Chase portal to book flights or rental cars at that rate. For Amex, I also value them at 1.5 times because I have the Amex Business Platinum and use Rewards points for my preferred airline which rebates 35% for redemptions. For Citi and Capital One, I use 2X because I usually transfer those points to Singapore Airlines for Business Class international tickets. I use Bilt Rewards and Chase points for Hyatt as well since I get well over 2 times value for Hyatt redemptions. I am also a United 1K so I use United miles for Saver fares when I can get them for over 1.7 times which is quite frequently since 1K have greater availability of saver fares.
I don’t care about points valuation. All I care about is having enough points to take the flight/trip I want at that moment. This year I have 3 business class tickets with Turkish, 1 business class with Emirates from Milan to NY and a first class round trip with Emirates Newark to Athens scheduled for summer and the fall. I also have several nights reserved for a trip to Miami and Honduras, I even got 2 car rentals all with points. I checked the first ticket to Athens whenI booked it and it would have been almost 17K but I got it for 187K points and 245 dollars. All other redemptions I didn’t even bother to check how much I would have spend because I wasn’t going to pay cash for them so I just did the redemption.
Ben I'll be honest, I almost missed this video because the thumbnail didn't have your iconic background of iMac and $ haha.
Very thoughtful and interesting video though!
Oh! I'm glad to hear that use the 20% 80% for averaging. Actually that makes me feel more positive.
I think most of his valuations are overpriced. Take Wyndham for example. He has them at 1.1 cents per point. I have a hard time finding properties that value at even a 0.5 cents a point.
Sure there are always exceptions but they are few.
That’s why I prefer 5% cash back cards for most of my spend.
Very interesting video. This is part of the reason why I use whatever credit card will give me the highest return on spend whether it’s cash back or points, because I feel like these elevated points valuations are kind of speculative. You can get really elevated value if you get the right scenario, but it’s not something that I’m going to count on. I give a slight boost in my mind to points but if something gives me 5% cash back and another card gives me 3% in points, I’m using the card that gives me 5% cash back. Of course you don’t have to choose if you’re using a card that earns UR or thank you points for example.
I prefer Frequent Miler's points valuation. They are more realistic.
Agreed. The Points Guy is the absolute worst for travel news. They are advertising Credit One credit cards and a Amex Platinum 80k offer. TERRIBLE
These valuation sites really need to compile two different averages... one for Business/First Class valuations and another one for Economy redemptions. That would be more helpful than trying to combine both into one number.
That's actually up to each of us - where we like to fly and decide what airlines to transfer to, etc. For example, if you like flying between the coasts around Canada or from/to the USA, then AC or UA is your choice - AC often has excellent lie-flat J available for miles. Another example - regional flights around Canada which can get costly to book but are often available for relatively small number of miles. Sometimes you can visit a small picturesque town in the mountains for 10K KLM (WestJet) or Avianca/United (Air Canada) miles per way, while cash booking for such flight could easily be in $1000 range.
Great and informative video. Everything you discussed about these points valuations are things I have always wondered about. Cheers!👍🏻🙏
I have a question. Let's say I have AMEX points and Chase points. I know that they both have for example British Airways ( and some other airlines ) as a partner. Can I transfer points from AMEX (let's say 30,000 amex points) and Chase (let's say 30,000 chase points) to my membership number of British airways?
Thank you in advance!
Yes! So you can pool points from both chase and amex in the mutual transfer partner e.g. BA. I do that all the time. Also British Airways lets you do household accounts, so you can even have other family members transfer points from chase or amex to their BA accounts and they all pool together
@@TheCreditShifu
Thank you Ben for quick reply!!
Your videos helped me a lot!
I only fly domestric so Delta still makes the most sense for me, I am ok getting 1.25cpp but pre covid it was much higher like 1.6
It’s simple. They’re a sponsored site so they’ll say 2cpp for their 2 biggest backers, AMEX and Chase.
I'm about to join Jason and leave the game. Chasing redemption values seems like a headache. I'll stick with Chase 1.5x travel portal and hyatt redemptions.
I’m finally going to use my chase points to transfer to Hyatt in Guadalajara, 3 cents per point!
Chase = Bilt > Citi = Amex > Capital1 to me.
There’s much overlap in partners, and those that have exclusive partners, very useful partners or special powers are more valuable to me, e.g.,
Bilt: united, american, hyatt and also 1.25 cents redemption at its travel portal, all without annual fee. Main drawback is that it’s a startup, so more of a risk of defaulting on points.
Chase: united, hyatt, 1.25-1.5 cents redemption at its travel portal
Citi: 1 point redeems for 2 choice points, jetblue
Amex: delta, ana, 1.1 cent cashout through schwab platinum
Capital1: erasing travel charges at 1 cent per point but can also get 5-10x on those charges if at its travel portal (venturex)
Great video! When using my points I typically look at the cents per point calculation while also taking into account the “cash out” price especially for chase. I also look at the economy cash price versus the economy and business class points prices. I would never pay $5k for a round trip business class ticket, but if the economy price is $1200 and the points prices are 30k economy 60k business I’m going to consider it worth my points. By comparing this way I’m looking at what I would actually pay and making sure my points are going far enough for me
Chase has the lowest number of partners out of all of them. Having the higher value of 2.0 cents per point is odd.
Is that first republic bank logo on your jacket?
North face
Thank you for making a video looking into this. People have always been citing his valuations like scripture - including yourself lol
You should attempt to set up a joint video between you and the Points Guy, and run some live cost calculations, so he can explain his processes.
It is a good starting point, unfortunately for me business class and higher doesn't work for me, so economy premium, probably the most luxurious I can afford with my points. Same like 90% of people who don't have big business spending or have no business at all, I can't max out my referrals, hell, I am happy if I can get a few. New card bonuses help, but not as much as I would like. So my idea of chase redemption is 2 cents, mostly for Hyatt, city 1.2 cents for JetBlue and I have to figure out for amex and capital one.
Pay taxes with, say, Venture X and get juicy refunds?
I think they can be overinflated at times but it all depends on the redemption and what you’re looking to do
Focus more on multiplying how you earn the points, and save them till a good redemption deal comes around...
You can get 2¢/pt pretty easily on Hyatt
To settle this, I suggest that Ben Turkish oil wrestles TPG to determine a winner.
TPG website sucks.
If youre not going to pay cash for that business class seat you're not really getting the crazy high redemption rates.
I don’t agree that points are only worth that much if you would realistically spend that money. Since you are still getting something that is valued at $5k. For a lot of people there is no way they could justify $5k for a flight and the only way they ever fly business is using points.
@@TheCreditShifu exactly they'll never justify it at 5k so are the number of points they redeemed really worth 5k? I see it as the points redeemed on actual everyday travel or travel you would actually spend real money on are worth more. Just my 2 cents per point.
Still in the game
I used to follow them on Twitter until they started making every other tweet something woke that had nothing at all to do with travel.
Corporate activists are the worst.
what did they say that was "woke"? It seems so fashionable these days to just call something woke just because someone doesn't like what they heard or didn't understand.
Math sucks
1st
2nd you mean
maxrewards dont work, keep getting error trying to sign up. did you really tried the app?
They have issues with Chase right now, trying to fix but it is taking a while
Can a husbamd and wife share a MaxRewards Gold membership?