Brightline West is Great. Let’s Make it Even Better.
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- Опубліковано 22 вер 2024
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LA is set to get high-speed rail before the decade is out, but how should it actually get to the city centre to do what rail does best? Let's talk about it in my latest video.
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Every time RMTransit uploads I become 0.5% stronger.
Compounding or just based on your original strength?
Wait wasn’t it 0.4% last time and 0.3% the time before that? Exponential strength growth!
Unfortunately, this video shows a lack of understanding regarding the complexity of the southern California mega-region.
More than four and a half million people live in southern California's Inland Empire alone.
Brightline is completely neglecting all of the people who live in San Diego, Riverside, and Orange Counties and in the eastern portions of San Bernardino County.
Southern California's population is not concentrated in downtown L.A., so the focus on the Los Angeles/Las Vegas city pair embodies a misunderstanding of the polycentric configuration of this mega-region.
@user-vo9wd6tx6c I live in Orange County. OCTA should be doing something. We run express buses to LA. It's not that complicated to run them to Rancho Cucamonga.
you should be at like 363% strength rn
The problems you mentioned for Los Angeles public transportation have existed since the late 1940's when they closed down the Pacific Electric (yes there once was an electrified railroad amongst the populated neighborhoods). Since the 1970's when people, including myself, were pushing for improved public transportation, governmental agencies have worked in slow motion, as has the transportation system they are responsible for. They had the infrastructure to start with but were decades slow to start rebuilding what was destroyed. Once built, they made service so infrequent it was undependable. We have trained generations NOT to use it.
The shennagins of the automotive industry were felt as far back as the mid-1920s, when they persuaded the cities with rail-based public transit to order the private rail carriers to pave the streets in which they had trackage at their own expense, WITHOUT any governmental assistance whatsoever. Additionally, the municipal transit operators were prohibited from increasing their fares to offset their losses; as a result, service declined in several cities.
In 1935, the Public Utilities Holding Company Trust Act was passed, forcing ALL electric railroads, whether municipal or mainline, to sell off their electrical generating stations to established utilities which almost immediately increased the consumption rates, thus forcing municipal railways to purchase buses, and the mainline railroads were forced to purchase inefficient, expensive, and environmentally disastrous diesel locomotives which quickly ate into the railroads' profits, thus forcing a great many of them into bankruptcy.
The diesel locomotives were manufactured by none other than General Motors, a company that, along with Ford, Standard Oil, and others, assisted Hitler and his Nazis during WW2!
The PE actually ended in 1961, although the powers that be started dismantling lines as early as the 1930s. And Metro service is frequent and generally dependable.
@@chewybunz Only the RAIL portion of LA’s Metro service is fairly reliable. The buses, because they’re automobiles just like any car, suffer the same problems and troubles associated with rubber tires/steering wheels.
@@CraigFThompson I was referring only to trains.
What the State and city should do is work the federal government to establish a Green Transit Fund and rebuild both the Pacific Electric and Los Angeles railways as modern battery-electric tram networks that can use ground-based power/induction looping or just conventional fast-charging overhead like is offered now with most streetcars... It would be the cheapest and easiest way to re-roll out service and a great way to help establish transit-oriented developments along key corridors... 5 over 1's are a great non-highrise solution for many areas that don't want towers... Although personally I prefer the look of glassy Vancouver-style narrow-point towers with pedestrian friendly podiums of lofts, shops and townhouses...
IMO the refusal to electrify Metrolink’s San Bernardino line nor was it considered to upgrade a blended regional/HSR corridor like Caltrain is honestly a heinous policy failure and is absolutely unacceptable in this day of age when planning for HSR. I truly think this lack of foresight will hurt BLW in the long run
It's a fixable problem, no? They can in the near future electrify it so the train extends deeper into LA
@@adanactnomew7085 the issue is that there is zero political moment to make this happen, and there are absolutely no plans as of now. Metrolink is perfectly content with its current antiquated push-pull diesel operations, and Brightline has failed to engage with Metrolink to make a downtown connector possible on the San Bernardino ROW
@@toadscoper4575 BLW literally changed their planned headways to sync up with the SB line. To say they didn't engage with Metrolink is laughable
Hopefully people can change their minds because a lot of people will ride this if they build it to LAUS
@@bistro-tatit’s also my understanding that BLW’s CEO has voiced interest in Metrolink electrifying the SB Line.
Thanks for the shout!
Always enjoy your stuff!
born and raised in rancho cucamonga and constantly craving for more transit options. i take the san bernardino line into DTLA for work and there's so much room for improvement ! super excited for the potential for growth and what's (hopefully) to come
This video is so strange to watch as someone from Rancho Cucamonga. Not that we're a small town, but nobody ever knows where it is when I talk about it now that I live in LA County. I LOVE my freaking hometown except its car-dependency, so when this train was announced I was on the MOON about the potential it might bring. Thanks so much for doing a video about my hometown. Do more, and come visit us!!!
They all have their own issues, but there is something to be said for the sheer number of projects planned in Southern California! I just wish we could inject more money into these projects with the explicit purpose of getting them done faster
Calrail's mismanagement has made that not viable with voters. Yes I know apologists pretend it is a mismanaged disaster but the budget and time alone shows that's just coping.
@@ZontarDow*Caltrans. Or at least that’s what I think you’re referring to
@@PhilliesNostalgia I'm talking about the high speed rail.
To be fair the prices being paid are already really high, so if some of the best practices seen in other countries were implemented that might be possible WITHOUT more money!
@@RMTransit Exactly!! The Netherlands is one country we could stand to learn from in this area.
Rancho Cucamonga is a Metrolink station...as well as bus service and so on. It does NOT dump people into a parking lot. Metrolink may not be high speed, but it IS regional commuter rail to downtown LA.. and *if* the California High Speed ever gets finished, they will have a direct connection to that. The problem being that IF. IF they can gather up another billion for all the tunnels and track outside the valley and so on.. Connecting Brightline to LA's big station would cost as much or more than simply using the Metrolink. Figure any extension of the Cal High Speed might happen by 2045 or 2050...IF the governor doesn't abandon it totally before then. They have a lot of homeless to feed...
Good excuses!!!! LMAO
As someone who doesn't drive, if there's no rail connection to the train station I'm just going to Uber to the much closer airport instead. I hope they take your suggestion here to heart, Reese!
I hope so too! Thanks for watching!
When the HSR station is completed, plans for a rail connection to other parts of the city will be finalized....
You could just Uber to the train station.
Brightline Florida includes a $10 Uber voucher with some train rides and I can see them doing the same with Vegas-LA. Easy clap
The other thing I suspect you'll see happen in Vegas is what happens in Atlantic City... The major hotels/casinos run shuttle service, timed around (the Amtrak) train schedules to pick up/drop off patrons at the Station. The Hotels already have this infrastructure in place (i.e. "airport shuttles") so there is a a straightforward, immediate solution...
Though I agree...I'd like to see a BLW extension into "The Strip" proper.
ive always said it: no more single track mains!
and having two electric regional rail lines, and a 2nd HSR, is defiantly be good for the country as a whole: and with the amazing new rolling stock on the way (the siemens velaros and KISSes are AMAZING!), it will for sure be a paradigm shift! the country will finally have examples of modern (not 100+ years old) electric regional rail thats not in the northeast. and it will finally have a second HSR line. its also worth mentioning that denver RTD reigonal rail is really good too; 3 american electric regional rail networks in 20 years will for sure inspire the country! a lot of times, life is like an exponential growth graph: you start off slow, then once you gain traction, more and more comes! i hope this is what happens with brightline west and electric metrolink
one thing i will add is i hope metrolink puts pantographs in their beautiful F125s.
So based on what Siemens is doing for the NEC locomotives, I don't think you could bi mode the F125 by just attaching a pantograph. The NEC spec ALC-42s are a 2 unit pair that has the diesel locomotive up front and behind it is a car with a front half of electrical gear and a pantograph, and back half passenger, this second unit will also have traction motors, giving the ALC-42 the power of two locomotives when running on the wire. Amtrak did this to avoid having to swap locomotives on routes that are a mix of electrified line and diesel line.
Amtrak is using a similar arrangement on their empire corridor locomotives to replace the P32DMs, but using a battery bank instead of a pantograph, they will leave Penn station on battery, start the diesel in the tunnel before 43rd st like they do now and then the batteries will also be used to aid in acceleration and will recharge off the diesel while the train is cruising and obviously dynamic braking will dump energy back into the batteries as well.
As a Denverite, RTD rail is a mixed bag. Most of the light rail should've been heavy commuter rail, it's the very definition of tram trains now. The A-line is amazing, and they missed their opportunity on the B line when they chose not to run a highway median alignment when they rebuilt US36 in 2016, though the B line appears to have been farmed out to Amtrak for the upcoming front range regional rail. Though I don't know how they're going to pull that off by 2027, other than running at painfully slow speeds on the existing single track BNSF corridor, but Polis says he wants that service to run at up to 125mph, which will require building an entirely new rail corridor, though it could be built roughly parallel to the existing one.
@@mrvwbug4423 Ill be going to denver in a month for the first time, how good is the A line to get from airport to union station? Also, would you say denver downtown is safe to walk
7:00 they don’t need to backtrack into downtown LA, they can transfer to Metrolink at the three shared stations with the A line in order to get to rancho cucamonga for Brightline. Operating a roughly 68 mile or 109km light rail line would also be a nightmare. But then again, 30 minute frequencies are still suboptimal
They don't have to operate it as a single service. A second transfer to go such a short distance is pretty problematic.
I like the electrification of the Metrolink San Bernardino line. That project and the current Brightline West would generate interest for Brightline to build a Rancho Cucamonga-Palm Springs-Phoenix line. The result would be LA-Las Vegas and LA-Phoenix lines faster than waiting for mostly public funding of such.
If you look at Interlaken in Switzerland, there is a single track railway line with level crossings, but it is also used by German high-speed trains (of course at low speed), allowing direct connections to Frankfurt, Berlin and Hamburg.
Not too shabby ideas. For Vegas I actually had a similar idea, just follow the highway a bit, and run elevated over Flamingo road past the Bellagio fountains to a new central Strip station either above the road or at the Parking lot behind the Flamingo where the Monorail also has a station. Having the trains be directly visible from the strip is also sure to be a big marketing draw for Brightline as people can physically see the streamlined high speed trains as they walk down the Strip.
And yeah I agree on the LA end.
But just a note, while the Brightline west corridor will be capable of 300km/h in some places, it will sadly suffer from a LOT of sections with lower speed limits, likely between 120km/h and 200km/h due to its highway median allignment, meaning it still has to take pretty sharp curves in many places. Still a great project though.
Honestly, at this point I think its whatever we can get!
I agree about the visibility, the "sphere" and its appearance all over social media shows how powerful that can be!
Faster isn’t necessarily better, as operational costs rise exponentially with velocity. As long as it’s competitive with regional flights and driving, people will ride the train regardless of its top speed.
@@doujinflip The BEST way to make passenger rail travel competitive is to reduce, or even eliminate, the excessive oversubsidization granted to stuperhighway and air travel.
They should totally do it, coz whoever rejected the idea of having the monorail in the front of the strip was stupid and should be called out.
@@doujinflipPermanent breaking and accelerating is really inefficient tough.
Thanks for covering this. As an Angelina I'm so excited to see the new trains and the reopening of old corridors that the Redcar and Yellowcar trolleys used to run on.
Pacific Electric has been reopened in part.
LARy does not have a chance. Too much street running.
Better would have been had those old interurban and streetcar trolley lines been kept and upgraded into good regional and local light railways, respectively. It would have cost far less than building them back now, some of which cannot ever be restored except as Arterial Bus Rapid Transit, Minneapolis-Saint Paul style.
@@jamesparson At the VERY LEAST, LARY could be rebuilt in the wide medians of these boulevards with nothing but inefficient bus service presently....
They are too busy trying to extend that Tesla tunnel nonsense.
That is possibly the worst gadgetbahn in existence. When we talk about trains we are talking moving hundreds of people. A Tesla Model Y can take 3 passenger; 4 if one is small
I'm fine with it so long as it does not get in the way of real mass transit
This is a gadgetbahn that will probably succeed until there's a multitesla fire horror inside the tunnels. Then the project will be abandoned and the city'll go back to the monorail, busses, taxis, ubers and of course private cars. ☹️
@@EdwardM-t8p The tunnels are the exact right size to fit Glasgow subway trains...
Ugh I don't even want to think about that . . . .
This is great. I’d love your input on the drama in Dallas right now as the city council is trying to stop HSR in the DFW and Texas Triangle areas. Especially if you could map out a corridor for the Dallas to Fort Worth line as that still hasn’t been done.
Is there any vids or sources on the topic sounds really interesting, also DFW really needs to be at any terminus of any future TX-HSR
Interesting, I thought the Texas Central project was essentially a done deal. What problem does the Dallas city council have with it? In a rarity for a red state even the state of Texas is supporting this HSR line. Texas is certainly a good place to build HSR, cheap land and a less NIMBY friendly regulatory environment
@@RafaquaQuetta Texas Central HSR is supposed to connect Dallas to Houston and eventually San Antonio and Austin.
Which is stupid in my estimation. Any HSR connector between Dallas and Fort Worth is necessary for the Texas Triangle network and a boon for commuters between the two cities.
@@mrvwbug4423 Amtrak is getting involved and keeping it alive
If I were a betting man, I would be putting my money on the High Desert Corridor, between Palmdale & Victorville, and onto CAHSR being BLW's electrified connection into LAUS before the San Bernardino line gets upgraded with double tracking, grade separation & electrification. Unlike their Northern counterpart on the Peninsula, Metrolink seems contented to operate Diesel locomotives on legacy infrastructure.
Agreed. I also think the potential to grow Palmdale Airport into the next LAX is still there since that's been the plan all along... And I believe that part of the HD region is still really fast moving AND affordable. A rare combination in Southern California these days... And Los Angeles Airport is capacity constrained and while Ontario or San B. COULD work they are much more constrained by development and nearby houses than the good old desert metropolis of tomorrow not named California City... ;-)
I live just a few miles south of the Rancho station, and I go out to LA and Long Beach often. Really hoping that the increased traffic to Brightline will make transit to LA more often and faster. This is all very exciting.
Reece, it's *THE Inland Empire
I kind of love this rendition "to In-Land Empire" (with "Land" pronounced like in "Disneyland" or "Thailand", and with no "the") as a potential Canadianism for what Californians would say as "to the Inland Empire" (with "Land" pronounced like in "England" or "Scotland", and with "the")
Quickest route is probably, extend the A line to Ontario airport and bring Birghtline to the airport too. Based on nandert's video.
Brightline West should not only be expanded to Union Station but also to LAX using the Harbor subdivision tracks. This will allow tourists to go directly from the airport to Las Vegas without the need to board the metro first
Wasn't LA to Las Vegas one of the busiest air corridors in the world?
Not saying it a bad idea but with the air lobby being the air lobby I don't see it happening fast.
@@dennyroozeboom4795 unless you could get them do interlining with Brightline West, similar to certain ICE trains that have a LH flight number, TGV trains having an Air France flight number (you can even get checked in at the station of departure in some cases). For that goal, you do need those trains to serve the airport, of course. Basically, if you buy an Air France flight from Brussels to e.g. Abidjan via Paris, there's a good chance your first flight will be a train...
Pay for it by taxing regional flights which connect large airports which could otherwise be well served by HSR.
@@barvdw Very true. I just doubt it because that's a relation high speed rail could have had with aviation in relation to CHR and it didn't. But maybe who knows.
LAS has direct flights from 170 airports, and LAX is nearing peak capacity despite primarily being an origin/destination airport, so it doesn't really make sense to invest in making LAX a better connection point for Vegas.
“Detailed transit thoughts”. Wow, you got that right. You are far more detail oriented than I am. And I can be a total detail geek. Good luck to your channel… 😊
4 tracks in the same direction inside a metro area are nothing unheard of, Actually I my city Prague Czechia we are upgrading a 3 track line to 4 track, and Prague has only 1.5 milion people.
Don’t forget that Brightline is owned by Florida East Coast Industries, a real estate investment firm. As a result, I expect that at the Los Vegas end, they will be building their own casino and hotel near the station, making that the destination for most passengers.
Exactly. There will be a lot of mix-used development along the BLW route. What people see now as "out there" will be hotspots in the future.
Yes, I think Brightline purchased about a hundred acres of land at the new station site. Thats a lot of space if it's just for a train station. Wes Edens has actually already spoken about this a number of times. They will in fact engage in a number of commercial real estate developments in Las Vegas.
@@PapillonTraining Interesting. The one thing people misunderstand about Brightline is that they aren’t trying to make money from ticket sales (that’s just a bonus) but, like the rail Barton’s of old, are trying to increase their profit on real estate. That’s why the stations often aren’t in the optimal locations for the general public. Just look at where they’re planning on building their station in Tampa (hint, they aren’t planning on using the existing station, because that’s not where their land is).
@@roger1818 thats similar to train companies in japan that run their trains on a loss but make a grand profit from their real estate with shopping dining etc.
The Metrolink San Bernadino line is really great and has good ridership. I would love to see it upgraded.
You’re forgetting that it’s in the middle of I-10 (or probably more accurately, they built a highway around a rail line), and unless you can remove at least one lane of traffic, maybe one on each side, that is not happening. Caltrans would not demolish two lanes to expand the rail line
@@PhilliesNostalgia Brightline west could potentially utilize the Alhambra Subdivision and the trench west of the El Monte Station.
@@PhilliesNostalgiaThe SCORE program is scheduled to eventually upgrade every Metrolink line with the possible exception of the Riverside Line (which uses a overloaded freight corridor that would extremely difficult to expand). For Riverside, they would get more service via the 91 Line.
They are going to have to fully double track all of San Bernardino Line eventually, probably at extremely great time and expense.
@@PhilliesNostalgia Just elevate it!
@@PhilliesNostalgia These days, no one can be too sure about what Caltrans will do in the near future; hell, they might even decide to turn the entire stretch of the 10 from LA to El Monte into a toll road----who really knows?!
Extending the A line to RC is a pretty ballsy idea. It's already the longest light rail line in the world at 48.5 miles according to Wikipedia, and extending it to Montclair alone pushes that up to around 61. Eight more miles to Rancho Cucamonga would put it at about 69 miles, nice, which I think might be longer than all of Caltrain.
But yeah, the idea that BLW is going to a Metrolink station that has a direct connection to LA Union Station, and they *wouldn't* electrify that connection so BLW trains can run all the way there, is just mindboggling to me.
While nobody's likely to want to ride from one end to the other of the A line, operating it as a single continuous line does allow for a lot of useful no-transfer trip options for riders. But I could see them splitting it into two lines someday, probably at Pasadena so they could extend the east-west portion west towards Glendale/Burbank.
I'd like to think that this initial route is just to get something built, and the future extensions/connections will come later. A highway right of way was probably trivial to get approvals for, but going deeper into a city requires a lot of planning, approvals, and lawsuits, as you'd have to negotiate with the existing property owners, utilities, etc, within proximity.
Sharing the existing right of way could work, but then you'd have to share tracks with other trains which would affect frequency.
I’m really excited for Brightline West. I actually believe that this line will kick off a new high speed rail revolution in the United States. I think it could lead to more funding of CalHSR as a result. Unfortunately, the main reason why CalHSR is going so slow right now is because most of our politicians don’t really know how high-speed rail works because we don’t really have it here. We literally only have about 35 miles of it between Boston and Providence. I feel that once Brightline West opens, a lot more people will realize the benefit of having high-speed rail and more projects will be planned
While the main train station in this city, where all the long-distance trains stop, is fairly central, I still need to take a bus. Because my home isn't downtown.
The point is by having. A large ce tral station, it is within the easiest reach for most people. I'd you have one station just on one side of town at its edge, that's gonna favour those living there immensely yet put everyone else at a disadvantage. Especially those going to the downtown area which is the majority of traffic. Plus with a downtown station you also benefit from cost savings in public transit. Since most routes already focus on getting you into downtown, you can use those to get to a train station, rather than needing to invest in an entirely separate amount of lines to get to that station at the far edge, or risk everyone getting ubers or driving there instead, creating traffic jams.
If i remember correctly Brightline had also planned to split at Victorville and go to Palmdale also, hoping to connect to the Cali High Speed Rail from there but that plan was put on the back burner until the HSR is closer to completion.
I live in Vegas and I was so excited to hear that this project was finally coming to fruition, let’s just say that excitement dropped about 70% when I heard they’re dropping you off in Rancho.
How about a video on the High Desert Corridor as a second way to reach L.A. via the Antelope Valley line and Palmdale? Because that's also planned/in the works...
The AVL is very scenic, but not fast. Trains have to wind their way over two mountain passes usually at 30mph or less
@@mrvwbug4423 OP is talking about a new line, not using the existing route, considering that this is where CHASR is going.
CaHSR could also reach Victory Valley and Rancho/the IE through this HDC in the next 8 years
@@mrvwbug4423 Obviously. That's why that massive $35B tunnel needs to happen. Sad that the pricetag is that high, but with so many potential users of it, the price over time is well worth it... Brightline plans to use it, CA HSR plans to use it as does Metrolink if you real the literature... That's 3 major passenger rail operators who could benefit from this one single piece of infrastructure...
@@stickynorth not in Palmdale only from Bakersfield to modesto and Sacramento
I think the success Brightline had in Florida will be repeated with this line. As long as the service is top notch and the operational is profitable I don't think that anyone is worried that the line does not server the maximum amount of people in the LA region.
8:53 I agree with most of nandert's ideas, but something i didn't really get / didn't get an answer for when i asked in the comments ->
"why not have the Las Vegas and San Diego HSR lines branch off to the East of ONT instead?(...)
In other words -> I get why they would want Rancho Cucamonga as a terminal in a 1st phase, but why not disconnect it in a 2nd phase?"
Personally I see no problem with a terminal at Ontario International Airport. From there the BLW can extend into downtown L.A. and Union Station via California Rte. 60 and US-101, and a branch line can extend south from Ontario and further branch off to Anaheim, Disneyland, L.A. International Airport, and San Diego.
As someone who lives in Rancho Cucamonga it doesn't make sense to extend it to the airport. There's a lot more room to develop at the current Rancho Cucamonga station and the station is in the middle of the busiest part of Rancho Cucamonga with lots of dense housing, commercial shopping, and event centers. Also, Rancho Cucamonga station is already 10 minutes away from the airport by car and that's during traffic hours. Just having a small light rail system from Cucamonga station to the airport would be more than enough.
@@krisalis709 I know what you're thinking: a line down Euclid Avenue, right?!
If so, we've sup'm in common....
I was just at the Redlands Arrow station last night! It's SOOOOO nice. It's weird, but the parking structure is legit one of the nicest things about it. I really hope they figure out a way to extend that line east to Palm Springs with stops in Yucaipa, Beaumont, Morongo, and Cabazon along the way. That'd be incredible.
Extending Metrolink to Palm Springs is in the very, very early planning stages. It may still not happen, but they are actively looking into it.
The A Line extension is CRAZY! Make the longest light rail line LONGER‼️🗣️
In the long run it could be split into two lines, especially if they decide to extend it west from Pasadena, which is one of several long range options for improving transit into the San Fernando Valley, in which case the A line might terminate in Pasadena, with a separate train going between Rancho Cucamonga and the Valley. This would add a transfer for a lot of trips, but it would probably improve operations.
@@tim1724It already goes far west of Pasadena, all the way to Azusa. There is an under construction extension that goes as far as Pomona that will open next year. A second extension to Montclair just got funding and will probably start construction soon.
What happens after that is unknown, if anything. It could go Ontario Airport. It could go to Rancho to meet Brightline. It could go to both places, but I doubt as branches; probably to Rancho first then south to Ontario Airport.
The big issue from San Bernardino west to downtown Los Angeles is that Metrolink is using old Santa Fe right of way, which is only enough for one track of traffic in many places. Double-tracking the line and adding in overhead wiring would be almost as costly as building from Rancho Cucamonga all the way to Las Vegas itself, due to the very high cost of right of way acquisition and construction,
Pacific Electric. But your point stands
And that ROW acquisition would include demolishing at least a lane of I-10, something I don’t think Caltrans wants to do (for a few reasons)
@@PhilliesNostalgia There could be a projection of 100,000 people per day, and they still wouldn't do it.
Not to mention 1 lane? Do you loose an eastbound lane or westbound?
@@PhilliesNostalgiaThey're too car-brained?
@@PhilliesNostalgia Especially that. The construction cost of reconfiguring Interstate 10 to accommodate double-tracking and overhead power would be extremely expensive on a per mile basis.
I could live in the IE and commute to Vegas for work & come home the same day. Thats awesome, Thats the future we've been missing here.
If by commute you mean a few days a month rather than five days a week, which would get pricey.
That is a waste of energy. Just live in Las Vegas.
Doesn't make sense. Vegas real estate is cheaper than the IE.
To the other comments, it all comes down to where you want to live. I'd want something walkable and with good local transit. As far as I know that doesn't exist in Las Vegas or the IE, so I'd have to live in Los Angeles. But somebody might want to live in the IE for personal or family reasons. In that case my question would be, does Las Vegas really have the most compelling jobs? Why not Los Angeles? Are there no suitable jobs in the IE, which Reece says has 4 million people? That's like my entire metropolitan area (Seattle). There"s also the possibility that the original comment is satirical: he wouldn't commute to Vegas.
@@sluggo206 Brightline has done monthly passes before. I could see a form of it taking place on BLW.
As an american Gen z, im very excited that we will actually have a real high-speed rail, unlike the acela where we can finally have it!
Edit: holy s*** didn't expect this one to go up! One thing I wanna mention is that while my generation can carry us to a better future, we are also heading for another dark chapter in man kinds history such as the rise of fasc'ism but socialism and socialists like myself can give this world a better place polls have shown about 70% of gen z and millennials will somewhat or will vote for a socialist
Im also and american gen z, and im super excited to see the first ground up high speed rail link in the country. But im ngl I cant stand when people undermine the acela because its a REALLY good service with the amount of funding it initially had to work with. The acela is real high speed rail link by definition. It is a legacy line that has been mostly upgraded to speeds of 125+mph, similar to the west coast mainline and east coast mainline in the UK. Also with bidens infrastructure law and the combination of new trains, over the next 10 years the acela/nec will recieve major upgrades which will make the almost 3 hour dc-nyc trip cut down to only 2hrs and 15 minutes, which is a lot of time saved (im not too sure what the nyc-bos time saving are yet but the rumor is it will be cut down from 5 hours to 3, dont quote me on that though). I think the acela has a really bright future and we should be proud of it because really any high speed rail in the US is better than none.
I would be happy to have Acela level service.
@@brayg488 I get what you mean but the US, for being such a rich country, are still fairly late in building a new HSL (at the speed it matters) instead of upgrading existing tracks.
@@brayg488 hard agree!!! acela and the NEC is a fantastic/worldclass service - i ride along the corridor with MARC every day to work and can zip up and down the east coast as i please. not to mention, people are genuinely startled when acela express trains tear past regional stations. i cannot wait until the new rolling stock is finally up and running
@@brayg488 absolutely
Great video, would love to see San Bernadino line upgraded could serve as launching pad for further regional rail expansion. I think fast, clean and convenient rail service could see the county connect in the first time since the old street cars.
I also think most regional rail needs to sped up with end of the line being 1 hour max. Ex LA to Lancaster in 1 hour, LA to Anaheim 1 hour etc. This not only makes travel more convenient but could open up loads of cheap housing further away from the city
A lot of the rail alignments in the LA area aren't conducive to fast trains due to the terrain. Prime example the Metrolink Antelope Valley line, it crosses two major mountain passes with a lot of 30mph running through twisty mountain tracks. The upside is it's probably the most scenic commuter train in the US, downside is it takes over 2 hours to go from LA Union to Lancaster which is a distance of 76 miles. The AVL was also built in less than a week in 1994 by the Army Corps of Engineers because all the roads to the Antelope valley were blocked by landslides after the Northridge earthquake but the rail corridor was passable.
RMTransit, I can't get enough of your content, so I subscribed!
Having the A line (Gold line) connect to Ontario airport and the Rancho Cucamonga station would be a dream.
The A Line is the Blue one. The E Line is the Gold one, the former color of the line which used to run from the Eastside out to the Foothills
Haven’t looked at the video yet, but if Reese mistakenly colored the A line as the gold one, then ignore my previous comment
@@PhilliesNostalgiaWhen the Regional Connector opened, the Azusa to Union Station portion of the L/Gold Line were connected to the A/Blue Line. This combined line is currently called the A Line, with a blue color on the map (but using colors as names is no longer correct). Likewise, the East Los Angeles portion of the L/Gold Line was connected to the E/Expo Line. Likewise, that combination is currently called the E Line and uses a gold color on the map.
The A Line and the E Line now share five stations. Two (Pico and 7th Street/Metro Center) they shared before; the Regional Connector added three new ones (Grand Avenue/Bunker Hill, Historic Broadway, and Little Tokyo/Arts District). There was a previous station on the L/Gold Line also called Little Tokyo/Bunker Hill that was closed for the new one.
Whew.
@@PhilliesNostalgia Yes, the A line is blue. But the portion of the A line that runs parallel to the 210 was historically part of the Gold Line (later known as the L line) before that line got chopped in half and divided between the A and E lines. The independent entity that is responsible for constructing the line (as well as any future extensions) is still legally named "Metro Gold Line Foothill Extension Construction Authority" and the tracks they build are legally the "Foothill Gold Line" until the point at which they are finished and are handed over to LACMTA for operation (at which point they are legally redesigned as the A Line).
Yeah, it's confusing and yeah, he probably shouldn't have used the "gold line" terminology given the current operational reality.
Another alternative could be a people mover from the Rancho Cucamonga station to Ontario Airport. Sort of what LAX is working on now.
JFK has AirTran to connect it to a major transit station in Queens, so this could be a similar monorail like system.
As an alternative. Public rail extensions also work equally well.
Just need a little planning and input.
Love these. Always stoked when a new one drops. How about a feature on the growing LA River bike/ped path? Outside your wheelhouse...? or not? I see that as a game changer, completing a sort of bike freeway through the city with (hopefully) seamless transit connections built in... Thanks for your work!
There are issues with each of the proposals brought up here. For the electrification and shared use of Metrolink trackage, there is a very problematic single-track section in the I-10 freeway median that would be a huge bottleneck that can barely support the every 30 min frequencies proposed by SCORE, so a permanent solution would need to be figured out first. Also, Brightline West would probably not want to provide funding for electrification because building anything outside the freeway median becomes much more expensive and risky, which doesn't work well with their public-private funding scheme. As for the A Line extension, they do actually have long-term plans to extend it further east of Montclair, but it would not be very attractive for Brightline West riders because of how long and slow it is compared to Metrolink. I think the most effective way to get Brightline West to Union Station early would be to have Brightline construct the High Desert Corridor and Palmdale-Union Station HSR segment as planned by CaHSRA, but Brightline would probably not want to pay for that for the same reasons they wouldn't pay for Metrolink electrification.
There is one passing loop and space for at least one more passing loop in the I-10 median section of the San Bernardino line West if El Monte. There are incremental improvements to be made to get to maybe 20 minute headways, especially with faster accelerating electric trains. East of El Monte (or more accurately the fly over just east of El Monte) the corridor can be double tracked at grade (except the fly over near the San Bernardino Depot)
"a very problematic single-track section in the I-10 freeway median" I addressed this in the video?
As an Angeleno I cringed so hard reading "I-10" 😂
@@RMTransit The elevated idea is doable for some of it, but there are places where you would need to dodge freeway ramps and overpasses, especially around the I-710 interchange. I do think something could be worked out if there was enough interest/funding (and honestly I wish they would just for the sake of San Bernardino Line improvements), but at this stage it seems like neither Metrolink nor Brightline are going to do it any time soon.
Steal back freeway lanes. They aren't precious and they won't be missed. Induced demand already has swollen the road past sustainable size anyhow... Time for a drastic road diet.. Steal back the fake express/HOV lanes first... All you need is two or MAYBE three good electrified tracks, one in each direction with passing sections and a somewhat less than 220 mph top operating speed... 110-125 mph would work since it would be largely grade separated and a straight shot. And I believe that's what the SF-SJ section is using for the joint CalTrain/CA HSR section between the two cities and it's a perfectly reasonable solution...
I think this shows that urban transit is the greater, earlier need than high speed rail. Hopefully Brightline West will stimulate improvements in urban transit at one or both ends, but it's also possible that this will start and remain as a park and ride project. Using some of the California High Speed rail money toward the urban transit improvements mentioned in the video, would do more for urban transit and for high speed rail than CAHSR, but why stop there, what's really needed is a comprehensive rapid transit system for the Los Angeles metropolis. That might even fit within the budget of CAHSR. Include stations at all the airports, and voila, rapid intercity transit as well. Mandate use of Sustainable Aviation Fuel, and you'd have low emissions as well. I think that some reflection on why things are being done would be useful, but the methods seem to have become ends in themselves.
Exactly --- it has to have the good qualities of the New York City subways and Philadelphia regional rail but with the drawbacks of neither. Surface light rail tramways just don't cut it!
@@EdwardM-t8p However, ANYTHING rail-based is "better" than having to take a BUS everywhere!
Don't forget that there are already plans for mixed-use projects around BLW stations. It won't be a "park and ride" for long. As for boosting local intracity transit, Brightline has done that in FL. Tri-Rail as of January, connects into Brightline Miami Central and starting next month will offer 1-seat express trains into said station from West Palm Beach. Miami-Dade has contracted Brightline to build out their new 'Northeast Corridor' commuter rail system between Miami Central & Aventura station. Brightline is also working with SunRail as part of the Sunshine Corridor. There are other commuter projects on the table being discussed as well.
If you take the Eurostar from London to Paris, the last few km into Paris takes the same alignment as the RER, and originally on the London end, it took local tracks shared with what is now South Eastern Railway. That seems like the right approach here, local tracks for now, upgrade later.
If I recall, the section of Southeastern line that was used by Eurostar prior to HS1 became part of HS1, they had to add overhead wire electrification to the existing line just to get eurostar started since the rest of Southeast's lines and the South London lines in general use 3rd rail electrification.
@@mrvwbug4423 The Class 373s originally had 3rd rail pickup for running on South Eastern lines.
Cost is the issue. Properly extending Brightline West to Union Station from Rancho would probably cost as much as if not more the cost of the Rancho to Vegas portion, take longer to build, and make the entire thing not make economic sense. Running tracks down the center of a desert freeway is a lot cheaper than doing similar work in an already built up area. So, they will make do with more frequent but diesel powered 79 MPH max San Bernardino Metrolink Line service to start.
As for the other end, I imagine shuttle buses and Ubers will be the last mile solution for 90%+ of riders, again, at least to start.
For slightly more than the initial section in cost you make the whole line much more valuable, its good!
@@RMTransitI suspect "double or more" is more accurate than "slightly more". Double tracking the single tracked 10 freeway portion in particular is going to be a serious problem. And, no, they aren't going to eliminate any lanes to do so; double decking it, at extreme expense, will be the way to go, as you suggested.
The plan might very well wait until CAHSR Phase Two in 2060 or something and then electrify and quad track the whole thing. Doing the in between step of electrify and dual track it for 203X until then might be considered too much for a "temporary" solution, even if "temporary" is 20 to 30 years.
How come cost was NEVER an issue with stuperhighway construction, which presently guzzles more money per unit of distance?!
@@CraigFThompsonCost is frequently an issue on freeway construction. Many freeway projects are delayed, scaled back, or canceled completely due to costs.
Also, Brightline West is a private project (although it has received some public money from the Feds). As a private company, they are more sensitive to making a profit than the government may be.
That is, they have calculated that extending it all the way to Union Station would make them make less money; the extra cost would not be balanced with as much extra revenue.
The Vegas side is already covered. The Las Vegas Loop is currently being built, underground mass transit to the strip, and there will be at station at the BLW station.
Have you ever tried driving on the strip? There are traffic lights every block. So yes a metro system would be good.
No I have not
Beg/Borrow/Steal a Boring Company TBM and drive it under the strip up and down twice... There's your metro line! And like I pointed out before in other videos in theory a London deep tube train could squeeze down the existing 12' Musk tunnels with just enough room to spare since the narrowest London tube is 11' 6" and those are the most beloved/iconic trains in the system. Narrow and a bit cramped? Yes but certainly good enough for one of the busiest cities and systems on Earth!
The strip is a traffic nightmare with rideshare now🙈
I love these style videos: rather than complaining, actually workable solutions and fair takes on the projects.
I like to think I don't complain all that much!
@@RMTransit Nope. You are probably one of the most constructive UA-camr's around much less ones who comment on Urban and Transit planning... Plus every video really should follow the Oreo/Sh*t sandwich principle that even HR directors use and Family Guy once so famously parodied.. Complement/Constructive Criticism/Complement... The truth Canadian way...
The LV monorail (which has gone bankrupt twice) never went to the airport because the cab and shuttle bus folks loudly told the city/county government that an airport connection would wipe out their jobs and livelihoods. Tesla Boring ignored them, and the LV Convention Center embraced Tesla's help to get things started. Tesla Boring is actively building to the Thomas and Mack arena at UNLV (lots of parking, especially for the Formula One races). Tesla Boring has already got a station planned, called Blue Diamond, to connect to Brightline.
Rail daddy is back!
Every Saturday!
Only problem, the San Bernadino line has other sections where it is too narrow. It should be electrified but more work should be done looking into taking freight off the Alhambra sub and removing BRT lanes for tracks.
Having it to go to downtown LA will be very expensive. That would cost as much as the HSR being built between SF and Burbank. The reason HSR will connect to Caltrain in Gilroy and Metrolink in Palmdale is to save money. This is how the high speed trains in Germany operate, using existing tracks into downtown stations. Who is going to pay for your plan?
Federal funding.
This is after all, the 19 million population LA metro conurbation. The 2nd largest urban population center after NYC (21 million).
Cities like NYC and Boston have decades of getting tens of billions of dollars in federal funding to build public transit and highway projects in those cities. Which some called boondoggles.
The Big Dig in Boston was funded by Congress to the tune of almost $8.0 billion dollars in the 80s ($21 billion in today's dollars).
NYC sought (and Biden promised) $11 billion in federal funding from Congress for its Gateway Project. Schumer has also gotten federal funding to build Moynihan Hall, redo Penn Station, and Hudson Yards--even just to modernize some stations. Billions.
Getting some few billion from Congress for Los Angeles to electrify and/or double track Metrolink lines, seems like common sense. Our area Congressmembers need to lobby for this.
The area needs it--it's also the 2nd most important economic center after NYC metro.
Many other countries from China to Thailand, India to Germany also involve their national governments to fund projects like these.
Nice using footage from André Marqués, he’s almost like the RM transit of Spain publishing short videos on Instagram and Twitter on how to improve the national network (often enough with something that is common sense in our European neighbours)
Hes great!
It would be great to get improved transit. I'd rather take the train than drive hours through traffic and smog. Corona made my eyes water so bad I could barely see. All this transit coming in when I no longer have a reason to visit the area.
You've hit all of them Anaheim, Azusa and Cuc-a-monga.
LA Metro A line is now BLUE through the SGV after the downtown connection opened a year ago.
No. The A Line from downtown Los Angeles to downtown Long Beach used to be called the Blue Line. The Regional Connector connected it with a portion of what was originally called the Gold Line, later the L Line. On maps, the combined line is colored blue but is called the A Line.
I have faith that the current last-mile plans for Brightline West at both ends will have significant improvements by the time passenger trains are actually in service. The Vegas end doesn't need much, that's for sure. Frequent buses alone could pull off the station to the major casinos. Some casinos might elect to run their own direct free shuttles. But as a side question, why in the world is transit from Vegas airport to the Strip not easier???
The reason: Taxi and rideshare lobbyists. It's also why the monorail was kneecapped by not going to the airport.
@@EdgarEsc1972 Which is going to prevent any other services, even the Tesla tunnels, from reaching the Brightline West terminal unfortunately.
@@EdwardM-t8p it will be harder for the cab union to stop the Vegas Loop Tunnel because it is a ride sharing service and it is no costs to the tax payers. Next year taxi's/Ubers will be taking travelers to/from the airport to the new Loop station just 1 mile north of the airport's car drop off/pickup, at the Thomas & Mack Center/University of Nevada Las Vegas(under construction now). I also expect Tesla taxis/Ubers/shuttles to next year pick up/drop off at the airport going to/from the underground Loop Station at the nearby Thomas & Mack Center. Another Loop station even closer to the airport, at 795 E. Tropicana, less then a mile north from airport drop off/pickup is already planned as well
@@EdwardM-t8p That project is already in the works. Vegas Loop will have a station at BLW Vegas.
Vegas side of the equation is already handled. The Vegas Loop project will address tourist transportation issue, including the BLW station. It's currently being built.
I commented this on nandert's video but I question the value of directly overlying the A line in the same ROW as Metrolink all the way between Pomona and Rancho Cucamonga. I can see an argument to extend the A line beyond Pomona but I think that the lines should quickly diverge as there are already multiple services that can and will be on the Metrolink tracks (especially if they get fully double tracked and electrified). Moving the A line north or south of Metrolink creates new catchment areas for transit and argues for a reason to extend Brightline and Arrow west past Rancho Cucamonga to Pomona where they can transfer to the Metro A line.
praying for the A line to run north along the 210 into Rancho cucamonga... if they build a station in walking distance i'll never leave rancho. and imagine taking that from Rancho to Long Beach !
@@cowboycrook987 to get to Long Beach it would be faster to take Metrolink to union and catch the A line there
Nobody is going to ride the A line all the way from RC to LB. But extending the A line would be great for local use, as well as bringing people to Brightline (or ONT) from the San Gabriel Valley. As well as helping commuters in both directions.
As someone who is only familiar with the area thanks to Google Map, I know exactly what needs to happen in Vegas: turn the train into a subway, send it through the city under the boulevard (with maybe 3 stops, and I'm sure the casinos would love to have direct access) then back to the surface on the other end, and send it up to Salt Lake City!
IMHO, extend BLW up to the strip, run it on elevated line, basically make it an attraction on top of being a transit system. Seeing high speed trains pull right up to the strip would be quite a sight.
Brightline West 2, SLC to Vegas Boogaloo, would receive tremendous ridership. Having St. George, Cedar City, and Provo stations would be a huge boon and would see lots of ridership. It would create a lot of partial trips along the route. Lots of St. George people go to Vegas or SLC/Provo. Also, since FrontRunner isn't too shabby, it could just be Vegas to Provo and function pretty well like that, making FrontRunner transfers to keep going north.
LA to Vegas is a slam dunk high speed route. Brightline will make tidy lifetime profits on this. I hope that encourages them to double down and build a second, equally kickass high speed route out here.
Brightline West is a slam dunk high speed rail line but California and Nevada are shooting themselves in the foot and doing Brightline a big disservice by not having service extended into L.A. Union Station and the center of Las Vegas. At the very least the San Bernardino line needs to be electrified to Union Station and a Skytrain built from the Vegas terminal to the Strip monorail system.
Bonus: with electrification of the San Bernardino Line electrified regional rail service and a future regional rail extension east to Palms Springs is doable and certainly should be in the cards!
To not electrify the San Bernardino line out to Rancho Cucamonga is definitely a sin!
Haha, I am not sure that would be the most practical solution!
@@mrvwbug4423 The subway option, even if much more expensive, would end up being much better for the city, as it'd keep enviornmental inteference to very low levels.
I think instead of elevated guideways along I-10, they should just remove the busways / HOV lanes for that segment to allow for double tracking, it would save a lot of money but I wish elevated guideways were viable for prices that aren’t over $1B
Ignoring the legal problems and ownership problems...
There are a lot of busses that are on the busway. What would you do with them during construction and after construction?
If Caltrans doesn’t freak out, they could give up 2 lanes of regular traffic lanes or just expand the freeway
@@californiaporg They will freak out. They freaked out when the Red Line (B Line) was going up to North Hollywood. The whole project ended up being much more expensive.
I don't think there is a single example of CalTrans giving up any of its road space for a transit project. Maybe they will allow for lanes to be moved. Maybe
@@jamesparson maybe they could, caltrans should really focus on building transit and will hopefully allow that portion to be double tracked, but highly doubt it for the coming future
@@jamesparson The governor can fix that, just replace the CalTrans leadership with more transit focused people
It is always good to here ideas and support for the brightline west or HSR in general. It is frustrating when you see the nonsense comments from car people opposing the project.
Cara Mendelsohn and Aaron Freeman took bribes from the auto industry to kill high-speed rail projects.
I live in San Diego and I am so so excited about this project. Unfortunately metrolink doesn’t go any further south than Oceanside so I’m really looking forward to CA HSR coming down the 15 to connect me to Vegas and my family up north
I hope you are young.
Need to wait till Phase 2 of CAHSR and hope they will have a station at Rancho Cucamonga @@jamesparson
The Amtrak Pacific Surfliner is a thing. It duplicates service of the Coaster, Metrolink Orange County Line, and Ventura County Line, and stops at many of the same stations. You might also be able to combine the Coaster and the Metrolink Orange County or IE OC Lines, as both stop at Oceanside. They are not designed to connect though, so time wise it might not work.
The redesign and electrification of Metrolink were supposed to be done by CAHSR unless there was a change in the design. Last I understood the BLW line will still end in Rancho Cucamonga even after the CAHSR is built in the LA metro. Its the Palmdale line of the BLW that was supposed to be a direct connection to DTLA.
As several have said before... how many big decision makers have ever used transit in any form and how many have a financial stake in the auto industry? Lots?
Biden is famous for it (they used to call him "Amtrak Joe") but he's a different generation than the state-level decision makers.
Cara Mendelsohn and Aaron Freeman took bribes from the auto industry to kill high-speed rail projects.
Wait, what? The Vegas end doesn’t even go all the way to the strip? How do you screw that up??
Did the taxi commission break some legs?
Vegas already has that covered, as they are currently building an underground transportation system to the strip and airport and beyond, and there will be a station at BLW.
@@MichaelDavis-il8ze Transit planners underestimate resistance to changing modes during a trip.
@@AtomicBuffalo It's already being built. When done, it will replace monorail, busses, reduce need for taxis, and Ubers.
Honestly, the "simplest" and most direct solution is for BrightlineWest to do what Brightline in the East has done once they got their trunk service up and running...extend. A simple extension down to the Ontario Airport from Rancho would be consistent with the Brightline modality...they extended the from the Miami Station down to the Cruise Ship hub, they currently have a station in Orlando Airport (that also works as a multi-modal service), and they are looking at the next extension to Kissimmee. Brightline has developed and sustains an "extendable" model, so extending BLW to Ontario would make perfect sense in the medium-term and would help with parking.
The other steps you outline are also very good and reasonable...I just don't know if they "fit" into BLW or another category.
Am I thee only one that was thinking "Canada?", when Ontario Airport were mentioned?
@@Greybone62 It's for good reason. Ontario, California was named that because its founders were from Ontario, Canada and wanted to honor their home province LOL
Never thought I'd hear Reece *praise* Metrolink. On the one hand, access to Metrolink makes traveling and commuting in/out of LA via train actually an option. On the other hand, it runs once an hour but not every hour (no SB line trains out of LA between 4pm and 7pm), and the SB line in particular frequently breaks down between San Bernardino and Claremont.
It would also be AWESOME if the gold line gets extended to Montclair, but that discussion has been ongoing for a long time and keeps getting pushed back over and over. As much as I want to believe in Reece's vision in this video, I've spent too much time in this specific area of LA/Inland Empire fighting for transit to believe these essential connections will happen by the time Brightline West opens.
The SB line future SCORE upgrades include higher 30 min frequencies.
The A line (it's not gold anymore) will be extended to Montclair. Funding from the state should be in place within a year. (As for operations, I think LACMTA is just going to eat the cost.) Construction should be finished by 2030.
Any extension beyond Montclair is going to require buy-in from SB County though, for the construction costs, the right-of-way, and for operating costs after it's built. And so far the county is refusing to consider it. But eventually there's going to be a lot of pressure from both Brightline West and ONT to get it built, so I think it's coming eventually. But probably not before 2035, maybe 2040.
There are SIX trains leaving Union Station for San Bernardino between 4 pm and 7 pm on weekdays (although just one on weekends), not zero.
Reese, your videos are great. Look forward to them coming out, and am an avid viewer. But, you lost me on this one at ‘multi use path’. The proposed site is three miles from Mandalay Bay. In the middle of the desert. That will be 105 today (40c degrees for your convenience). With no shade. There’s a decent possibility that walking from the airport to the strip will give you heat stroke and could quite literally kill you. (And the weather is like this at least 6 months out of the year).
I was so let down when I found out Brightline west's "LA station" was in Rancho Cucamonga and not LA proper. As a Pasadena resident, I selfishly love the idea of an A line extension to Rancho, and it would also make using Brightline west much more doable to thousands and thousands of people.
6:23 Once again, in order for that to happen, the A Line would to be absorbed into Metrolink as the Metro Rail is for the county and not the basin. It's related to jurisdiction.
LACMTA is already authorized by the state legislature to operate the A line to Montclair. The state could authorize it to extend further into SB County, but realistically it would require buy-in from SB County which hasn't happened yet. (But if both Brightline and ONT push for it, I bet they'd make it happen. It would bring so many Angelenos (and their money) into the county.)
@@tim1724 At that point, would just be absorbed into Metrolink as the second light rail line (counting Arrow as a DMU light rail line)
I think Brightline West and Las Vegas Monorail need to find a way to connect each other seamlessly. This kind of connection will benefit both systems. I think on southern California side, if connecting to Metrolink at Rancho Cucamonga is the cheapest and fastest way to get Brightline West start rolling, it's ok for right now. Maybe it is better to connect CAHSR phase 2 in the future.(who knows how long it takes)
The Vegas Monorail is being decommissioned. The underground Vegas Loop will act as its replacement
@@StreamSchedVegas Loop is not a direct replacement for Monorail. Monorail is a mass public transit. Vegas Loop is a personal rapid transit.
Metrolink’s mix matched cars throw me for a loop!!
In the UK high speed trains lacked a high speed rail link to the Channel tunnel for many years. They eventually built it and that’s what will eventually happen in Los Angeles. The Vegas high speed trains will run on existing lines (with upgrades to infrastructure) and then eventually the money will be found to build a dedicated high speed line to Union Station.
Not so, Brightline West is building new rail, not using existing rail.
Always love your takes and that nandert reference is spot on!!
Even if nothing new happens, we can still cycle to the nearest A line station, then cycle from Montclair to Rancho, and finally cycle the last 2 miles from the station to the Vegas strip, 2 train and bike should do it
It is up to Metrolink and LA to figure what to do with the San Bernadino line. Something similar to Caltrain could in their plan though LA has other priorities right now
dual track + electrification + Stadler KISS EMUs ala CalTrain is what that corridor needs. The KISS EMUs take full advantage of the huge US loading gauge allowing their 7 car trains to carry as many passengers as a 12 car single deck train. Though I do believe the NJT 9 car double decker trains are the highest capacity trains in North America. Metrolink could also just haul their existing double decker cars with electric locomotives, but a lot of their current cars are quite old so they have a good opportunity to upgrade to EMUs
Thanks!
Thanks for supporting my work :) and for watching!
I agree that the train should go to union station. It should even go to Santa Monica. If it won’t be extended, a good alternative would be an express line on the metro system
How would it get to Santa Monica?
Maybe there could be direct E Line service on dedicated trains, but that is it.
How can you have express services on the metro system? None of the subways or light railways have four or even three tracks, thus mandating either all local service or skip-stop limiteds.
@@EdwardM-t8p Adding tracks to Metro to enable express service on the E Line would cost a tiny fraction of the amount it would cost to. build high speed rail lines through LA.
Somewhat related, seeing as it's also part of the SoCal railroad system, the route between LA and Bakersfield going through Tehachapi pass is sorely lacking. It's the busiest single track freight route in the country and no passenger trains are allowed to use the route, leaving the Amtrak San Joaquins to stop in Bakersfield and run coach buses in order to connect to LAX. Something needs to happen to change that, either state acquisition of the route enabling it to be double tracked, or the high speed rail route through the region can run three or four tracks, with conventional speed track for Amtrak use. It would be something worth investing in but I don't see any interest in it.
@@JimBones1990 It'd be interesting to see since when that's the case. According to OSM, the Mojave Subdivision is two-tracked in some places but single tracked in others (the loop is actually double-tracked except for the bottom bit) so it is true that there is an amount of double tracking as opposed to what the OP implies but still not good enough (not helped by the fact that the tracks are very windy and in turn cause slow speeds which makes clearing the single track segments with the loooooooong trains much more difficult).
Forget the Tehachapi route. The Tejon Pass/Grapevine is the better route.
@@MarioFanGamer659 I'm looking at it on gearth right now to see, I can trace some lines over the tracks in the satellite imagery and count up their lengths to find out how much single track vs. double track/siding there is. I'll let you guys know the results lol
I agree it is a restricted resource that needs to be improved and better utilized. There is only so much money to buy things and to improve things.
@@mrmaniac3 On that aside, I do agree that it is quite a pity that there is no passenger service between Bakersfield and the Antelope valley not only because it serves all the towns which CAHSR skips over and it makes it easier to interchange to the Palmdale-Lancaster station (also opens up a potential rail connection between them and Oak Hills i.e. indirectly to Victorville).
Yes the intermediate stations are in odd locations ? Rancho C is a good start because most people in reality might not come from LAUPT and you need a large catchment of passengers from the suberbs . But intermediate stations destroy the average speeds of high speed trains and seem to just be in the middle of a dessert .
Brightline West being single tracked is a huge problem for capacity reasons
No it isn't. They only plan to run 45-60 min headways. Also, they can run tandem EMUs. Tandem saturation would have to happen before any 45 minute headway saturation.
@@Ven100 Thats the plan because its single tracked and wants schedule with Metrolink. If brightline wants to put more trains when demand rises it physically cant unless they build new track
The Metrolink line passes a few blocks from my house and in my area there are always pedestrian and auto accidents at the many, MANY crossings. So a train blasting at 100MPH through 30 miles a pure suburban sprawl is extremely dangerous.
It is still safer than if all those passengers drove. Yeah ideally we would build more overpasses but the golden age of unlimited funding for grand projects like interstates is over. Brightline succeeded because they delivered high speed rail to Miami and just accepted they would have 110mph grade crossings as part of cost cuts. Ironically, Florida's high risk tolerance as one of the worst states for car crashes may end up spurring a transit renaissance that transforms them into one of the safest states.
@FullLengthInterstates
You're forgetting that FL is run by a leader who likely thinks car accidents are "freedom" and traffic safety measures are "communism."
No, what is dangerous is the idiots that try to “beat” or “go around” the train crossing guards as they come down at streets like Azusa, Lone Hill, etc. At what point does personal accountability come into play?
I, too, live a couple blocks from the SB line, by the way.
@@Treemaster89 Yup, I was also thinking of people who have died at the Sunflower, Glendora, Grand, and Barranca crossings.
@@Treemaster89 exactly why we need fully enclosed smart gates that quickly slam shut early enough before drivers even get close to the tracks. Re-designing environments always goes much further than the "personal responsibility" American excuse to do nothing.
i love transport and trains
And also it might extend to Phoenix, Tucson, Salt Lake City, Denver etc. but again that's not until 10-15 years from now.
Really don't understand why they didn't go down I-10 to get to downtown LA. It'd make it perfect - keep the Rancho Cucamonga stop, but have it terminate in Downtown LA
No room for a ROW and probably no funding to run it down the median.
The Rancho to Union Station portion would have cost as much, if not more, than the Rancho to Vegas portion. That's why.
Brightline in Orlando is legit nice & relaxin' idek about those Las Vegas cars doe bc they're owned by the same business.
3:00 Yes, I advocate for "Shinkansen style bridges" all the time in every single High speed project!
Unfortunately, they are "ugly" for Western standards...
5:30 Even if they didn't remove all the level crossings, the idea of having a train that brings you directly to Los Angeles without making a change is good. Yes, "high speed" trains would run at "regional service" speed, but they wouldn't make any in-between stops and MOST of the customers would get to Las Vegas without changing trains. So, it would be ABSOLUTELY WORTH IT!
Not an LA native or local but electrifying the San Bernandino line is a no brainer. I dont care if it can't hit 200+ mph as long it can achieve an higher average speed than highway. NJ Transit is doing it on the NE Corridor with cooperation with Amtrak so why not California?
Brightline should go to Union Station!
It should but it would double (at least) the cost of the project so I wouldn't hold my breath. Brightline has considered running a track to Palmdale but I think more likely they'll just wait for the state to run its HSR extension from LA to San Diego, which is intended to go along the 15. Once that's in place it would be easy for Brightline to tie into that.
I'm not sure if Metrolink owns all of its tracks, given that it runs so infrequently and is not electrifying. But you just follow existing train tracks into la like with cahsr, or even do the cahsr to brightline west high desert corridor link so maybe cahsr wouldn't have to do all that demolition after all in the la metro area and there can even be through running services from sf to las vegas.
I still have problems with your cahsr video. In the australia one, you said that building rail in the countryside was fine because people are still living there, but im pretty sure fresno is roughly the size of calgary. Also, that branching idea from the i5 corridor is strange because it would make operations so much more complex (as banks rail said it, you can't just do shuttle services to the cahsr station since it guarantees a transfer because of the fact that those stations will be truly in the middle of nowhere.) Not to mention, japan doesnt do that because even though not all cities are in a PERFECT line, it does twist and turn to hit all of them. Also they're not purely going from some random dudes field, theyre following state roads and freight train track
It varies. In some places they own the tracks and in other places it does not. I believe they own all of the SB Line tracks, but there is little they can do for the part in the middle of I-10
Brightline's decison to use ERTMS/ETCS is odd given the operating environment, they did it because it's significantly cheaper than I-ETMS, but literally every other rail line in California already operates on I-ETMS (I don't know if CAHSR will do so or use ETCS) including Metrolink. Brightline also uses I-ETMS on their Florida trains, so they already know the system and use it. So to electrify the San Bernidino corridor and allow Brightline to use it to go to LA Union will require either Metrolink to transition to ETCS when they already have a system in place that can run HSR or run BLW as dual mode ETCS/ETMS which defeats the purpose of using ETCS in the first place.
ETCS is much better and well tested on high speed trains and lines in a number of countries, so I see this as a big win.
On its own, Caltrans will likely never remove lanes from freeways, even if it is to add a rail line that can carry 10x more people than that particular lane. But Caltrans is part of the California State Transportation Agency (CalSTA), which oversees various transportation-related departments and activities in the state. The Secretary of the California State Transportation Agency is appointed by the Governor of California and reports directly to the Governor. Therefore, if there is political will to improve transit on this corridor and significantly increase capacity along it, then Caltrans can be directed to do so.
it's LA Metro (A) Blue Line!!
People love shitting on Brightline exclusively because its a privatized rail company. I am glad that you pointed out that this is just one piece of a huge puzzle and its knocking down major barriers for HSR in America. The workers that are building Brightline West will easily be able to transition over to CalRail and actually get that project moving.
Here's an idea: let Brightline completely commandeer the Cal HSR project instead!
Brightline likes to portray itself as a private company to escape the kind of scrutiny that public works get and I applaud Brightline for this wise and prudent approach. However they cooperate very closely with the government and they make use of a lot of subsidies on the basis of the in actuality public service they provide.
@@pieter-bashoogsteen2283 Brightline does not portray itself as a private company, it is. It is extremely common for utilities and infrastructure companies to receive assistance from the government in the form of grants (that’s literally the point of a grant, to give money to private companies to do something) and “subsidies”. Do you think CSX isn’t a private company? Do you think electric companies aren’t private? Do you think Lockheed Martin isn’t private?
This point keeps getting pushed by people who are afraid of privatization, which is fair, but it’s simply not true and just being intentionally ignorant of how the system works. Sorry man but California and Amtrak failed where Brightline succeeded and it was a private company.
@@MustardAndFries I think you paint a very black and white picture when the reality regarding Brightline is a lot more grey. Wendover Productions made a good video about. I recommend it to you.
Regarding your other points. Lockheed Martin is a private company, but the market it operates in has only one customer, so they don’t operate on a free market principle. I do think utilities shouldn’t be private. Amtrak failed not because it was a public company, but it because it was underfunded and the government demanded it was run like a profitable company. CAHSR didn’t fail. They had issues as does any project which is the first of its kind, but they are still making progress.
@@pieter-bashoogsteen2283 I am not painting a black and white picture, you just have an agenda and cannot accept that the nuances (which you acknowledge here) play against your preconceived notion. Also I don’t care what surface level analysis Wendover provides.
High speed rail should connect city CENTERS, not city outskirts that are an hour-long drive away (or more if it's bad traffic)
We don't put airports in the middle of downtown either, though, and people cope.
The Las Vegas Airport to downtown is already a complete mess, so this will just make it worse until Las Vegas gets on the ball and extends the monorail (or successor system) to the south and links up Brightline, the various Casinos down there with a spur to the Airport.
The ridership would be off the charts and definitely lessen car traffic on the Strip.
The monorail is DOA. Its successor, Vegas Loop, is already being built, and will address transportation from the airport, to the strip, Alegiant Stadium, Fremont Street, and even Brightline station.
It's actually at a pretty good spot. I'd like more trains of course but we don't really have a population center here. SB, Fontana, Rancho, Montclair, El Monte and of course LA are all on that metrolink line and all very populated. And for the time comparison vs car that's tough because traffic and you can straight up get stopped on the Cajon Pass.
I think the Victorville to Rancho segment would get used a lot.
At least with this HSR project, it can still pretty effectively compete with air travel since the station is effectively positioned to draw flyers from LAX, John Wayne, and SAN, and at all of those you are likely to be arriving by car anyway, aside from SAN, none of those airports are served by any kind of rail based transit anyway due to how limited high quality transit is in SoCal. This is the perfect line to test the waters for HSR in America but there does need to be the understanding that Vegas is the destination and they need to get people to the strip from the station. That being said, you could say the exact same thing about McCarran, hotel/casino shuttles and taxis will be lined up outside in absence of a metro line to get people out to the strip.