Some of California's biggest law firms have gotten rich over this high speed rail project due to lawsuits filed against it by a wide array of interest groups, including environmental groups and agri-business groups..
Don’t forget kickbacks for all the various politicians and leaders involved. No American mega-project is safe from the tentacles of corruption. Same with the interest groups. It’s all about easy money.
@@thequietstag4366 "Environmentalists" are split into a lot of splinter special interest groups. The Endangered Species ones, the Green Energy ones, the Wetlands Protection ones, the Sacred Native American Burial Grounds ones. They all don't really give a rat's ass about the type of project (well OK the Green Energy ones might), they only care about their narrow special interest, to the exclusion of all else.
We’re so worried about a train damaging the environment while leaving everyone to drive everywhere because there is no other choice. All the driving we have to do is so much worse for the environment and our health.
And let’s not forget that the train can directly be connected to the grid so no need of batteries of fuel that pollutes even more! There are trains in Europe that are over 50 years old and still running.
@Oak Island Pictures those Californian environmental laws are a gigantic joke! I hope we destroy all the infrastructure that has been built with ICE and oil products and see what will remain!
There's an existing freight line that Amtrak operates on traveling LA to SF. But, it is one set of track. Two-way traffic runs on it by playing leapfrog using the side-rails to stop & wait on while the oncoming train eventually arrives & passes by. If only there was another set of rail. Average system speed could be boosted far beyond its present 20-30mph. The Amtrak train running Chicago -St. Louis runs on a double tracked route with a speed near 80mph for the greater portion of the trip.
Basically what my classmate describes of Hefei: I came from a city very close to Shanghai, £23 for an hour and 50 min of the ride, with the only distance between London and Newcastle
I mean that really puts it into context. The projected cost for HS2 in the UK was £87bn, which is roughly $107bn USD. High speed railways are expensive.
I’m trying to have a better understanding of the objections of various farm and ranch owners of the central valley - is the main gripe the sort of blighted eyesore that an elevated concrete railbed would put on their property? A bunch of pillars and a corridor of concrete obviously much narrower than that of the typical CA freeway doesn’t eat up that much of their lands, right? Or am I looking at this all wrong ..
@@billkittleman9631it’s all about 💰💰🤑🤑 they want a big piece of the pie. Same thing happening in Texas with rail project from Houston to Dallas. Land owners want premium price for their land.
transit spending in the US is unfairly scrutinized. Check out the budget for I-69 extension. Its literally more expensive than the the Cal HSR, yet it serves a region that is less than a quarter of the population.
Rode the high speed train from Guangzhou to Wuhan in 2010. A distance of 600 miles was covered in less than 4 hours An amazing experience. When I came back to the US in 2012 I experienced the inconvenience, slowness, and unorganized and unreliable Amtrak from LA to San Diego. Was a total joke.
I went to france and spain and experienced their rail network. Wasn't even the fastest out there, but I was blown away at how easy it was, how affordable, and how nice it was compared to cramped and gross airline seats. Makes me really wish we had better rail. I will say, Vancouver BC, Seattle WA, and Washtington DC all have great lightrail/metro lines. I wish Seattle would build theirs out faster. They are also taking 20-30 years instead of getting everything done in one fell swoop.
Rapid manufacturing is the key to achieving efficient results. The longer the process takes, the faster taxpayers' taxes will be lost, and even more money will be spent. From past practical cases, it has been proven that low efficiency is a stepping stone to prevent progress.
France and Spain and pretty much most of Developed Europe and Asia started their HSR back in the 70s and 90s and continued it on from there, while the US was still car dominate at the time was still strangled by big oil and car lobbyists that dont like rail, thats why there's still lack of true HSR
It's the mentality of the citizens, we want to have huge vehicles, used by one person for most of the time. While other countries, they understood long time ago, that successful communities are better off with public transportation.
@@SLICEDfinds It's not the citizens fault, read my previous comment, corruption via companies promoting and forcing cars and planes are why passenger rail has fallen so far behind compared to other places
Historically, high-speed trains have a lot of cost overruns when they start out. Japan is the best example. Anything you build here is going to be more expensive dealing with land acquisition and expensive labor. Once it is in place, it will change things. Consider how much money the US and California have spent on roads and airports over the 100 years.
But those roads and airports are already there. High-speed rail is being proposed as a *replacement* for those roads and airports, not an adjunct. It's not at all clear that high-speed rail will lure people out of their cars. So I'll bet that the only way to make HSR viable will be to ban cars entirely or impose steep prohibitive fees and taxes on them (like congestion pricing)--and FORCE those other modes out of business.
@@stevenlitvintchouk3131 Bruh out of business? You high or something? Read the original comment, and focus on the bit ‘Japan is the best example.’ Like what Japan has a PROFITABLE and VIABLE high speed rail alternative, while having cars everywhere. In fact Toyota is the largest automobile company in the world, while originating from the nation that literally invented high speed commercial railway. Americans sure are good at making excuses for everything.
I lived in Italy for a year and was very impressed by the Italian high-speed rail network. The main line, which runs from Turin to Naples via Milan, Bologna, Florence, and Rome, covers around the same distance as San Francisco to San Diego in around five hours. The whole travel experience is way easier than flying. Trains leave from stations located in the city center, instead of airports on the outskirts that take forever to get to; you can show up to the station just a few minutes before the train leaves, since there's no airport security to deal with; and the trains are much more comfortable than airline seats, so you can actually sleep or get work done on the way. Prices are very reasonable compared to airlines too, especially if you're bringing luggage, since the railways don't tack on a bunch of ridiculous fees. There are two competing railway operators in Italy that use the same tracks, one public (Trenitalia) and one private (NTV), which helps keep prices low. Most of the network was built relatively recently, and in true Italian fashion, has had its fair share of political scandals and cost overruns, but the investment was absolutely worth it. I hope that despite its many setbacks, California's HSR project achieves something similar when it is finally completed.
It is a great system but it’s subsidized by the Italian government which has been on the verge of insolvency for the last 12 years and is considered one of the most financially at risk countries in the EU. Spending on these infrastructure problems is part of the problem.
@@davidwelty9763 Infrastructures especially roads and rails are meant to be supporting other economic activities. If you want revenues from the infrastructure itself you'd better not build many infrastructure.
I think the issue in US, people cant wrap their head that infrastructure road and train are the same. The Airlines lobby brainswash people to think train investment it too expeensive, but somehow people dont care how much wasteful the military spend or how much wasteful spending in roads and bridges.
@@JChang0114 the government can’t take property without compensation this is the law. On top of this the corrupt California government made the project over complicated when there was publicly owned land they could build rail on. Instead they chose to pursue a route that would go over private land. Building rail on property already owned by the government is not an issue for a public rail service.
Ok, but who’s gonna go to San Francisco? Why would anyone want to go from one homeless and drug addict infested city to another? What exactly is the draw here?
@Jakecosenza69, these types of projects are for sure transformative. The trouble is with the way we do things these days perhaps our grandkids will enjoy that transformation.
From 2008 to 2023, China built about 30,000 miles of high speed rails while US spent roughly the same amount of money on the wars US fought in the Middle East during the same period. Both China and US got what they wanted.
Wow this is some Terrible logic you have first of China is a dictator ship. They are using slave labor to build them trains and.they are literally Bankrupt because of this just leave all that out there why don’t you and the USA isn’t Waging war in the Middle East stop with the stupid conspiracy theories god you people are ridiculous
@@Sacto1654 not really. In China acquisition of land is also a big hassle. Search “钉子户” on UA-cam you will see plenty examples of stubborn people. I would say that peer pressure is much higher in China compared with US and Europe. It is relatively easier for government to get land in China.
The Chinese government also doesn't have to deal with acquiring private land to build such railways. They also don't have to deal with environmental reviews or pesky landowners of land that generates billions of dollars of revenue.
As a person who took High-Speed Rail in Taiwan, China, and Japan, it is mind blowing that the US does not have one yet. I am excited to see this come true and hopefully have HSR in every part of the nation.
@@MrWaterbugdesign Of course it is expensive, but it is an investment to benefit the state, the people, and the nation. The US is already 20 years behind most developed countries in this area.
@@MrWaterbugdesign as someone who can’t drive, and I have many famillies in Sf. This train will be amazing. It will be efficient , fast, and conveniant. I dont understand why anybody would vote against it. I’m sick of freeways
Sadly, the problem is not a matter of cost, but of politicians and special interest groups that will always litigate and fight against these common sense public transportation projects. I have traveled to Japan, Italy and Germany and I have to say, it is quite sad how lacking the US's railway system is. The Time for the USA to have developed High Speed Rails and Bullet Trains was 40-60 years ago and the USA will never develop it.
who is even going to ride this thing....amtrack has to be subsidized as it is, now this will also be subsidized...and where does all the money come from? building and maintaining and running it? Your back pocket! I wish it would just stop!
@@alec_cooking_channel , obviously, but do we need to push more money into another bad business that can not even keep itself afloat.Becaus its bad a business venture.........Yes, the people voted for it......But not at 100 billion over budget......4 times its original cost.....
California High-Speed Rail will probably cost $100 billion. But if it's not built, we'll need to spend at least double that amount on expanding airport runways at LAX and SFO; widening highways; and adding other transportation capacity throughout the state as our transportation needs grow. Compared to the alternative, it's money well-spent.
@@DN-cf5rz Even with the current rate (which is historically highest) by 2050 CA is still the most populated state in US. So no they still need to build the new good infrastructure especially something CA or US as a whole never have before.
There is no way land owners are gonna sell the land cheap. This rail project started before even researching if they could acquire the land it resides on.
Definitely agree with Bent. We needed to build in the more densely populated OC/LA legs up to Bakersfield primarily to energize users to use rail. Also building from SF down to the central valley. Once the project is built and people see how clean/innovative/efficient it is, they will sign on to build the rest. I'm hoping Brightline West will also pave the way for growing public support.
Most people recognize we need this. We collectively pay with tome( being stuck in traffic for hours a day) just to barely make ends meet. The oil lobbies destroyed LA but now we have to create super blocks like Barcelona to have more green space. 👍
@@trvst5938 This is one concern I have. General populations have internalized the cost externalities about road/highway infrastructure and scoff at the large price tag/tax increases we would need to fund the project. But it's been proven time and time again these transit projects are most cost effective for society in the short and long run.
Another issue is that the general public doesn't understand how much infrastructure costs. They see the large numbers for high speed rail, but don't see how much gets spent daily on car streets. Maintenance, repaveing, and signals cost a TON but nobody bats an eye.
The hood is over their eyes. They're told by the outrage machine to get mad at bikes buses and trains, and told to shut up and enjoy their expensive traffic congestion boxes.
People also need to realize that a large portion of the budget is given to improving transit in California not just the HSR project itself. New commuter rail expansions, electrifications, facilities are being built all over California with the HSR money.
@@temper44 The best way I can put it is, they completely underestimated how difficult the project would be with California’s current transit infrastructure. It wasn’t just the Central Valley that started ballooning, but all transit projects associated with the CAHSR. But since the Central Valley is the “centerpiece” of the entire HSR project, everyone focuses on that.
As a California State worker, I wish this was completed long ago (Id probably be in the capital much more often). Having alternative modes of transportation vs being car dependent would be the great equalizer for our state and make it more affordable. I was in a meeting with job developers who specifically help the disabled population and the number one barrier is transportation. Having more mobility is key for the development of people, owning a car should not be the main prerequisite for taking part in society
The central valley of california was founded by farmer's 1880s during the 1970s much of the landscape was rural less taxes, they could not have built this 50 years ago no tax revenue. 9:45
It's embarrassing how many miles of high speed rail other countries have completed in the time California has been trying to get this project finished. China has completed 24,000 miles of high speed rail in the time this project has been in process, and is returning 6.5% a year on their investment.
@@todoldtrafford Ironically, China has fairly weak land acquisition laws which results in the phenomenon of needle houses i.e. home owners who resisted to sell their land to the government.
Because China TELLS the people to move away, China does NOT have Environmental groups with their hand out for $$. It's embarrassing that CA even thinks it can build a HSR Project fast and on budget.
As someone from the younger generation - I am so excited for high speed rail and a route from LA to SF. HOWEVER the whole project has been a big planning disaster and lesson for the future of high speed rail construction on the real costs. At the end of the day, in my opinion, it will be worth it 20 times over, and our children will use it and think 'thank god they built this' just like I think when I take the trolley in San Diego or use the interstate roads (instead of thinking about how much money it cost). Public transportation infrastructure is always worth it.
We already knew the lessons on the real costs and delays associated with CA state government work. I am 41, I voted for this on the ballot back in 2008 because I live in LA and have family in SF, but we all knew it would never actually get built. It was more a joke vote to help the state go bankrupt faster, as it was in a huge budget crisis back then
I kinda agree with you there. I remember when it came up for the vote and little middle schooler me was so excited to hear it passed and that we were getting HSR. But watching it has just been watching a slow train wreck that we are finally starting to sort out. From the project starting before it was fully funded, to starting before all the land was in hand for the IOS. We really did kind of fumble the start to the project. I definitely think it will be worth it, but damn if it hasn't been a messy project so far. More-so than the start of LA Metro Rail back in the 80's/90's
The dirty secret is previous infrastructure investments weren't about the railroad or highway they were about the real estate, that would become more valuable as a result of the connections. This is ultimately going to be a boon not for LA or SF, but those central Valley cities. You will be able to afford a home in those cities and take train into SF or LA for work. The state will also benefit from people able to produce housing in a less expensive regions which helps to address the housing crisis.
@@btomimatsucunard I agree that this project may not survive the rising cost and delay, and if it ends up being built it will be astronomically over budget. This will give critics of Mass transportation ammo that these are not a legit solution. I feel for California Residents and Taxpayers footing the bill for sure. The silver lining will be that there will be a lot of important/ Expensive lessons learned from the success and failures of this project, which might enable any future project to avoid these pitfalls and do things better. I can only keep my fingers crossed.
It is not a big planning disaster. Like they explained in the video, the planning has always been done in phases and the broader the plan, the less accurate the estimations. This is exactly what happened to literally every high speed rail or any large public project in history of the world. Even Japan's Shinkansen ended up costing multiple times over estimate cost and time.
8:35 "We're not going to bulldoze people out of the way... in this country" -- I had to chuckle there because America has absolutely never had a problem bulldozing Black and/or poor neighborhoods, especially, to build highways and whatever else, and you can even still see the same phenomena at work with interstate widening projects in places like Miami's Overtown area. Now that there are "other" people in the way I guess things have to be different.
Yep, it's a shameful part of our history. Many century plus old American cities have highways running through them. City planners of the 17th, 18th, and 19th centuries did not leave empty space for highways; residential neighborhoods were demolished to make room, and to force the residents out of the city.
And Florida will spend billions to widen lanes, and in six months, it will look like a parking lot, and the state will be on the hook to maintain and upkeep for years and years.
Yeah, and since the "Highway Revolt" in California in the 70s it's been basically made illegal to bulldoze people out of the way. That's precisely why it's so expensive to build here. We literally have the strongest private property protections in the US. This is the whole point of his comment. We don't bulldoze people anymore. They can and do sue all the time.
The USA once had great passenger rail coverage. Where I live in NW Arkansas, there was once passenger rail service. That stopped in the mid-late 1960's. It would be nice to have service again.
@bbabbich3467 No. The way you build your cities made cars atractive. There is in the US dense urban cores, and middle raise housing, and car parks can be reconverted into housing.
The Amtrak from LA to San Antonio presently take longer than it did when the trip was made with a steam engine. Much of the trip is made on a route that has only one set of tracks. The two-way traffic plays leapfrog using side-rails for trains to stop and wait on while the oncoming train eventually passes;' slows average travel speed to 25-30mph or even less if the system is busy. Encourage the freight companies to double track the routes. Faster freight delivery is a bonus.
@bbabbich3467 has nothing to do with the price of cars. The Interstate system went in during the 50s and 60s, effectively killing the need for rail travel at the time.
@@rustyyb8450 that's the biggest issue, the ancient rail companies are holding the progress of rail travel hostage when it comes to using their existing networks. If you make it easier for passenger trains to travel, you lose leverage when it comes to charging these passenger companies money to utilize your network. Unfortunately, the existing passenger train companies don't have the funding to build their own network.
Passenger rail was never profitable, it was subsidized by transporting mail, dairy and express cargo at the head end of passenger trains and by shifting profits from freight operations to pay for passenger trains. Once the interstate highways and state and local highways were built during the cold war (with the justification of moving troops and equipment) as well as the advances in airplanes this shifted the lucrative mail and express cargo contracts to truck or plane and moved a lot of freight to trucks as well. This literally bankrupted most of the railroads by the 1970s because they could no longer offset the cost of passenger trains with the loss of mail and so much freight to trucks and planes. This is why passenger rail died in all but the most densely populated areas (where passenger rail could potentially make a profit if run by a private company that doesn't need to waste its profits to run trains where its not profitable like Amtrak has to).
We in Indonesia cooperate with China and the construction of high speed trains takes 7 years in 143km if there is no Covid it will be completed in 5 years, believe me..working with China in terms of infrastructure is very fast compared to other countries, compare with Japan? in India the construction of fast trains in 7 years has only reached 10km even though it was started at the same time 😔
I don't care how long it takes or how much money it costs. Literally we are going through the exact same grueling process the Japanese went through in the 60's when they built their first bullet trains. If anything to me it looks like we're on the right track (lol). Point is, I'm sick of massive, dirty, inefficient, noisy, and wasteful freeways that tear through our cities. I'll support the HSR effort because we are so behind on transport infrasturcture.
@@JChang0114 CAHSR has already helped upgrade Caltrain to BART/subway service levels. The same will happen to Metrolink in SoCal. One of the reasons why this project costs so much is that it actually does fund these much needed upgrades to the local transit systems that fill funnel riders to CAHSR.
@@JChang0114 this is the first step. Then at city level you can start replacing highways with local rail or other transportation with the hsr connection and eventually the need for car will reduce
8:34 this is how we were able to build our interstate highways so fast and across the entire country. People who compare new rail projects to the interstate highways forget how badly the highways destroyed communities and cities in order for it to be built, and the fact that these environmental reviews happen now are a good thing Also, no matter where it’s built, an electric train is already a hundred times more environmentally friendly than any road and we need to build more trains and electrify old ones if we want to solve our climate crisis
Those highways, while not faultless, provided crucial transport of goods nationwide (including the food you eat) at large scale, opened up vast economic opportunities and also provided the average American to freely travel in safety across the U.S.
@@weirdshibainu Yeah before the highways, no goods moved around the country, nobody could travel, and the US had essentially no economy. If only America had some transcontinental transit link before the highways… shame.
@@Zero76606 On the contrary, before the highways, there was passenger rail service (not high speed) all over the USA. Granted it wasn't one centralized system as there were multiple companies, put that's how people got around. It wasn't until the advent of the highway system, along with trucking, AND the auto/airline companies doing their part to shut rail down that we saw a shift in transportation.
@@Zero76606 It didn't to nowhere the scale it does now. You have any idea what it was like to travel cross country prior to ww2. Slow, dangerous and the transcontinental link didn't service large portions of the country as interlinked or the last few miles. Is there a rail line that goes directly from the farmer to the processor to your grocery store? Nope. Moved largely by truck.....on the interstate system. Too bad you haven't a clue about history. P.S. without looking it up, where do you think the highway system was copied from?
China built 99% of their high speed rail network from 2012-2018 (They started in 2008 on one section for the Olympics). Their network covers 23,550 miles, all high speed and is the largest in the world.
It's a great system, but they traded speed for convenience on many stations. Most of the China HSR stations are outside the main populace requiring you to take a 30-45 minute ride to use them. Unlike Japan and Korea, and other countries that have their HSR go into their city centers.
@@MauricioUA-cam it's a long term strategy to address population density that's currently happening in Japan where countryside people are moving to metropolis for better opportunity resulting to massive decline in local demographics. They took the lesson from a Japanese economists that the Japanese government still ignoring: "You don't tell the people to leave Tokyo and live in countryside, the answer is to build more Tokyo."
@@inigobantok1579 they don't have trade deficit and most of their debt are in yuan currency. Also, China has the world's largest middle class and highest savings, PPP and it's easily because Chinese banks are state-owned which are too big to collapse, unlike in the US where it's currently happening
@@MauricioUA-cam It's by design, not trade-off. Local governments set the new stations away from existing city centers with the expectation that high speed rail would help drive new progress in urbanization. And in tier one and tier two cities, they did. The desolate regions where high speed rail stations are have become booming new city districts or even centers. It's in the 3rd and 4th tier cities and towns that this plan didn't pan out, and who knows, maybe give them another 10 to 20 years, they may too.
By the time America has their first high speed rail, Japan and China would know how to teleport by then. actually more like we're off at mars, including american citizens.
that's funny, the US is closer to fusion than both those uncreative countries, and that's probably going to be the source of unlimited energy needed for teleportation.
High speed rail didn't come quickly in Japan either, it only came earlier, and you bet with practically the same amount of baggage and stupid people complaining (not realizing they're asking for a worse alternative) that nobody's going to remember some years from now.
@@monadic_monastic69 Thank you, I lived in Japan for several years and can attest to the amount of time it takes to build high-speed (Shinkansen) lines in Japan. In fact, most people are not aware that there is still Shinkansen rail being built. The Hokuriku extension line from Kanazawa to Osaka has a 15-year timeline, as does the Tohoku/Hokkaido line from Hokadate to Sapporo!
We just spent 20 days in Japan. The rail system is so efficient and the bullet train is next level. California can learn alot from what they have accomplished
You assume california would ever do anything properly or efficiently. The government is so controlled by unions and environmental groups and choked by red tape they literally cant get anything done.
Japan is different than US. This boondoggle is going to be a giant terrorist target. Who in favor of this project discussed that possibility. They should stop construction now before wasting another dollar.
Japan has subways so once high speed rail train gets you to next city can subway to destination. In US gotta rent a car upon arrival. In US high speed rail is literally pointless, if need a car anyway. Minneapolis to Chicago is 5 hour drive, that's better than 1 hour HSR then gotta blow $500 on car rental for weekend. And any subways in US soon are too dirty to ride, so yeah HSR in US is pointless.. I road light rail in St. Paul and wow even it was dirty and dangerous, no way can families use St. Paul transit it's like out of Mad Max the bums and drugs... Cars are only realistic option in US. ..
Nothing gets done in California. There's a 5-mile stretch of 680 in Contra Costa County that's been under construction for at least 10 years. Politicians blame interest groups; interest groups blame politicians; armies of lawyers get rich; and thousands of contractors and union workers get paid to do nothing. As the joke goes: "What's orange and sleeps 7? A Caltrans truck!" This is the consequence of decades of one-party rule: Absolutely no accountability while taxes and government payrolls go up and up and up.
Japan built its first highspeed line way back for double the original budget as well. It needs to be completed asap and with a ton of lessons learned that can be applied to new projects so such a desaster never happens again. They really need to pick up speed...
I've ridden the HSR in China and Taiwan. Not Japan yet (one day). They are glorious things. Imagine not having to go through airport security, or fumbling with baggage at the airport, or having to experience turbulence. And getting great legroom and a nice view the whole time. And if something goes wrong, just stop the train. The whole thing is electric so that's nice. They're fast, comfortable, absurdly quiet, and efficient. I live next to a train station, and oh boy would I love to get to work in 20 minutes vs 80 mins. Oh and another thing? NO TRAFFIC. Rail traffic, sure, but no bumper-to-bumper stuff. I think I'm just a sad American who's seen how green the grass is on the side but can never truly hope I can get to it. Unless...
Yes, beautiful, but one thing that they had to compromise is the distance of the HSR stations. Most are not located in convenient locations within the cities and require a 30-45 minute trip to use it.
I lived in Spain for two years and my views on trains have never been the same since. I'm a huge proponent of high speed rail. It really does create connection both physically and mentally for people, which is desperately needed at this time. This isn't realistic, BUT I think one thing that would help people from all parts of the project understand it's value a bit more would be to take a small group of stakeholders to a place, like Spain, where high speed rail is the norm and have them experience it. Imagine, a small group of railroad workers, construction workers, farmers, people opposing it and the voters needing to approve it for funding, all taken to experience it and see what a benefit it is to the community would make all the difference.
No one needs to go to Spain to know the pros and cons of a hi-speed rail line. People voted for it back in 2008, when they were told it would cost $33B. Fifteen years on there has not been one mile of track laid, and the estimated cost is now $135B, and that's based on figures from 2019. This will end up costing closer to $200B by the time it's finished, which means that it never will be. I spend a lot of time in Spain, and I will be there again for a couple of months at the end of the year. The train and road network is incredible, but it was a luxury the country did not need and could not afford, and Spain will be bleeding for decades because of it.
every single time I ride high speed rail outside of the US, it has me thinking how sad it is we haven’t utilized it yet. hopefully california continues to be a pioneer for the rest of the country.
"every single time I ride high speed rail outside of the US it has me thinking how sad it is we haven’t utilized it yet" It does? What HSR did you ride in Canada? What HSR did you ride in Australia?
@@neutrino78xCanada has the same issues in terms of car dependency in the US and is currently considering some high speed rail corridors as well. Australia, if I remember correctly, has some world class public transit in its major cities, but doesn't have the population (less than Texas in the entire landmass) to warrant high speed rail between them. The same can actually be said for Canada as well. No reasonable person would argue that the US does not have the density for high speed rail. Corridors on the east coast quite literally have more people than comparable exisiting HSR corridors in Europe. Hopefully the US can continue building it out so can try it for yourself and realize what you're missing out on.
@@rojaalborada "Canada has the same issues in terms of car dependency " You misspelled "Canada is another case where HSR is not applicable to their needs". " Australia, if I remember correctly, has some world class public transit in its major cities" As do we. "but doesn't have the population (less than Texas in the entire landmass) to warrant high speed rail between them. The same can actually be said for Canada as well. " Yep, there you go. It's the same here. Yet you're harassing the USA, when none of these three nations are doing high speed rail, and it's all for the same reasons. Just relax. Europe and Asia are very different from North America and Australia. The same solution is not going to work everywhere, and that's ok. If a European wants to go 400 miles, they fly, just like we do. Tourists praise the HSR and it's mainly them who use it.
@@neutrino78x Canada is not the same empty land everywhere. In fact, about 15 million Canadians live between a 500km corridor between Toronto and Montreal. That's pretty similar to Madrid to Barcelona, 620 km, about 14 million people. For America, Houston and Dallas have a distance of 385 km and 16 million people. It absolutely works geographically, keeping in mind Spain is hell of a lot more mountainous than Saint Lawrence corridor or central Texas.
@@chinguunerdenebadrakh7022 "Canada is not the same empty land everywhere. I" Yeah they are, they have stuff in the southeast and stuff in the southwest, and in between is mostly empty. That's VERY similar to the USA. And no, THEY ARE NOT BUILDING A HSR, for the same reason we are not. "15 million Canadians live between a 500km corridor" You realize that's very low density, right? Do the math. "That's pretty similar to Madrid to Barcelona, 620 km, about 14 million people." Not exactly because Madrid is quite a bit more dense than Toronto and Barcelona is quite a bit more dense than Montreal. The only reason is works in Spain is that they have the population density in each city. If they didn't, that HSR line would be way too long. We're just more spread out in North America and Australia, man. Our countries have existed for less than 300 years. In another 2000 years, it's possible we'll be as dense as Europe is now, but I think it's actually unlikely, because by that time, more people will live on other planets than live on Earth. The USA will probably be roughly the same density it is now. 🙂
We recently just got the Elizabeth Line (Crossrail) built here in London. It was over budget and delayed and the usual rabble rousers were out in force decrying the project. Now that it’s open not a word, everyone loves it and the trains already packed. Big infrastructure projects are always worth it in my view!
@@ATHIP12 Yes and no. I frequently take train between Riverside and LA due to school. It's 15 dollars one way, 20-25 round trip. Sure, it takes longer, but it's hours not driving. I've also taken the metro bus frequently. It's $3.50 to get on the bus and you can take the entire route. The bullet train will not be perfect, but I'd like the idea of visiting friends in San Fran and coming back to sleep same day WITHOUT having to spend 6 hours in start and stop traffic. The cali train is the first of its kind in a while (at least in the US), transportation will get better as we build more.
@@ATHIP12 Correct. Rail transport is non-existent here because the cities became large during the age of cars. Unlike London, in which the rail system was built at a time of horse and cart. Unfortunately Californians don't understand this, and so are being "taken for a ride" by all the grifters. As usual.
The problem with America is that every time the government embarks on a major project, there’s hundreds of interests that want to squeeze every dollar out of it. Eventually the money dries up and the project is nowhere near completion. Hell, True Detective had a whole season around corruption regarding California HS Rail.
I have seen clips of hsr construction in China. The US is still hand forming the concrete whereas the Chinese use precast. You can’t beat their speed and quality.
@@Teyore except, they probably are compared to the us, and being efficient at the same time again, unlike the us which seems to love taking their sweet time on literally anything, and Nothing gets done for 10+ years
@@PotatoLaptopUser101 I'm not defending the red tape the US etc. has to cut thru to get simple things done, but my point is that just because the chinese can build it fast, doesn't guarantee that is good at all. Theres been lots of reports of faulty construction and issues with dams and other infrastructure. Terrible quality control etc.
@@Teyore Precast is standard in Europe. And is also the Standard Brightline uses to get its hundreds of miles of new and rebuilt track done in a year or two. Every progress shot I see of CHSR is pathetic by comparison. Huge sites, enormous amounts of materials strewn about, but only every one or two people milling about on a weekday.
I've only ridden the Shinkansen, but it changed the way I look at traveling across long distances without a car or plane. Makes me wonder why we never developed high speed rail in the States until now with CAHSR. In regards to the high costs of CAHSR, ironically, the Shinkansen also went over budget when it was built, but no one ever thinks about that because it's a service that people enjoying using. Hoping for the same with CAHSR.
The whole CAHRS Profject is still not expensive tho. California is very much comparable to Italy in size. Still CA is a bit wider but the shape is pretty much identical and ideal for trains. So What California tries to do is to build a HSR network from the ground up which is massive. Italy started in the 70s and by now they have such a good network that flights are not competable anymore. Right now they build a tunnel towards france to connect the two countries HSR networks for 8 billion. A single tunnel with "just" the length of 55 km. So 128 billion for a country wide HSR network? Sounds good to me
The Shinkansen was a revolutionary project - even regular trains have improved because of it. I've ridden the Italian train from Florence to Venice and it reached over 400Km/h (around 250mph) and we couldn't even notice. Trails for those trains are not easy to build, though! Another option to bullet trains is what we call here "high speed trains" - trains that go around 100mph and are cheaper to build.
Yeah. Lot of people forget Shinkansen was very controversial in Japan (cars and planes were supposed to be the future of transport, trains were "old fashioned", on the way out 1800's technology and so on)and was over budget when built. Once complete it was success and now everyone marvels at the Shinkansen and the Japanese success with it. Learn from that, big infrastructure is never built without controversy, will cost a lot, take a longish time. However once complete it serves long time and is a success.
@@aritakalo8011 This high speed trains were build in Europe and Asia decades ago. Even African nations like Morocco have high speed trains similar to French ones
I hope Brightline is able to finish their much smaller projects in Vegas and Florida so that millions more Americans can truly see the potential of high-speed rail and support putting major tax dollars behind California's and other projects. I would take HSR over a plane for every single medium-distance trip ever. We also need to make sure we develop density around these stations and connect all of them to local transit if we truly want to unlock all of HSR's potential.
All they care about is money. So they drag it out to reach new highs. No integrity anymore.. They want to maximize funding. We want more, we need more for your own best interests. 🤑🤑🤑
It was really nice hearing from some of the workers about what the project means to them and how it has impacted their lives. I think more reporting like this would only help improve public opinion of infrastructure projects like this in America.
I live in the Fresno Area and there’s a lot of construction going on every day. It may seem like there’s no progress on the coasts, but the backbone of the system needs to be built out along the San Joaquin Valley and it’s happening.
That 'backbone' has already consumed three times the projected budget. And they still don't have any real idea as to how they are going to get the train through the mountains near Los Angeles and San Francisco. Any solution that does not cost over $200 billion for each of those crossings turns it into an 'average speed rail line. Just look at the fact that the company that is building it was awarded a 'no-bid' contract and has not been held accountable for the schedule slips and the fact that everything is - for some reason - costing significantly more to build than similar projects elsewhere. And there's no public accounting as to exactly what those costs are. Oh and this is a privately held company that will not disclose who their investors are. If that doesn't make you smell a rat - then you need to get your sinuses fixed. A lot of California politicians are going to join the 1% because of this project.
Just get the existing Amtrak freight line double tracked. On one set of rail the existing two-way traffic plays leapfrog using side-rails to get past each other. All the stopping, waiting and starting slows average travel speed to 25-30mph. The trains are capable of 80mph. When the system is busy, leapfrog slows Amtrak's average travel time even more to the point of putting the train out-of-service mid-trip for a fresh crew to arrive.
@@colincampbell767 I don't really care. If it ends up being a WORKING high speed rail line, even if not quite at intnl. standards, it is a huge improvement. Every US project runs insanely over budget, that's not a real concern. We have plenty of money in the gov't.
@@rustyyb8450 Piggybacking to the Amtrak rail is a non-starter, because our CA coastline is eroding and the tracks get shut down. See San Clemente recently. Has to be through San Joaquin Valley. I only ask for a stop in Coalinga so that everyone can get a nice steak and bio break at Harris Ranch. 🐂
Some of the most significant complaints about this project have been resolved, including land acquisitions and environmental reviews. It would be incredibly foolish not to complete this link between San Francisco and Los Angeles. As for cost, remember that East Side Access in New York City cost over $11.1 billion.
@@ronclark9724 I am pretty sure East Side Access is more expensive per mile of track, which is actually insane. But hey, its finished now, and california hsr is not yet so there is that.
we’re getting this high speed rail regardless of the naysayers!! states across the country will look to us as a model and will be able to make cheaper and more economical high speed rail thanks to california.
"we’re getting this high speed rail regardless of the naysayers!! " If by that you mean we're getting Merced to Bakersfield then I guess you're right. No more will be constructed beyond that.
I have been travelling over China, Taiwan and Japan and had seen their HRS are the fastest, the cleanest, the quietest and the most convenient transportation systems in the world. These truly makes me think twice why US is the richest country in the world but still being the poorest HRS...Lets stop war for few years, make HRS this is what American needs.
A bigger question is why all construction projects including maintenance on roads and upgrades take so long? It took 8 months for a freeway ramp to be done with redoing it and there’s rarely anyone there even abandoned construction vehicles
@@ZeusAVI it costed Florida 4 million dollars to built a pedestrian bridge for international students living quarters to cross a freeway and leads to the main campus and several months later that bridge collapsed. So regulations are not a factor at all, NIMBYs have less influence on state owned highways and the environment….I’m sure most cities would even pass if grandfathered exceptions were removed as cities solutions is to pour more concrete or another lane
Did you ever watch the OG top gear? Back with Clarkson, Hammond and May? They talked about road construction here in America vs Britain. In Britain, they'll close the entire road for a week or two to get the work done as quickly as possible. IN America, we drag it out for months and try to minimize the impact on traffic. We are stupid....
Saw a video on the cost of tunneling in NYC for the subway compared to other expensive countries which are cheaper. Bottom line, the way of work is corrupt to inflate the costs.
High speed rails in Japan and Europe are staples for travel. I've used the train in Japan and in Italy and it was great. I think eventually, in the future, this will be a great addition in CA. People sometimes have trouble seeing the good in something they haven't really experienced. I mean most Americans have never travelled abroad. My mom (in her 60s) rides Amtrak from the Central Valley to SF and she prefers it than the car (more space and she can use the bathroom easily) but it's not that efficient. I hope she gets to travel on this high-speed railway.
Most Americans don't travel abroad because we have the best here. EU is a crowded Shole and Asia is even worse, add feces on the streets and power outages.
How do you protect it from a terrorist taking out a portion? And after that happens who is going to ride it? Did anyone in favor of this boondoggle discuss this possibility. ROI will be zero.
@@NICOLASLAM-xy6mn Doubtful. Once the central portion is operational, there will be support from the north or south to get it connected to their area. As they said in the video, too much time/$$ has already been invested.
@@onetwothreeabc Take more debt? And the debt will take a percentage of every yearly tax as well as taking a debt to pay the debt if it's not enough which will eventually have our taxes pay for nothing but interests.
It helps when you have brown nosing yes-men running things. now the real question is if its safe and that they used actual rebar in the concrete and not bamboo to make mandated cost savings.
@@Teyore well at least they didn't waste time like your HSR trying to determine if its a non binary him/her they/them trans homosexual 2 spirit LGBTQ THYVGYFVYGDGGK+++++++++++ train which is what your country. had to do. Hopefully your politicians asked the train if it felt inclusive and validated enough with the requisite amount of diversity in the tracks.
Having experienced Korea's SRT and KTX hs trains (not to mention their public transport network in its entirety) Poland's train network and now Germany's, I honestly believe the US is really missing out on something that will not only help its people, but really jumpstart its economy again. Afterall most of the cities and towns that are dead or dying thrived mainly because of their steel and rail industries. We are shooting ourselves in our own feet by not investing in hsr (or rail in general)
I personally think rail is one of the dumbest sorts of transportation. It's impossible to modify where a bus route can change throughout the day. Also adding or removing a bus stop is a much simpler process. I think any type of rail system for transportation just doesn't make sense in the US.
@@agisler87so Japan, Germany, and Italy the king of car nations with Germany especially having the Autobahn was dumb to build efficient high speed rail that is quicker than car travel between major population centers? Tokyo the world's biggest city is dumb to have rail? Dude I think you need to invest in a passport!
Amtrak should run trains over the new central valley HSR line and connect LA to SF overall at medium speed until the last high speed segments are finished. Current CHSR is an incremental investment toward a high speed future in California, and throughout North America.
13:48 - Correction: "...from San Francisco south" to San Jose, HSR will be using the Caltrain corridor - and electrifying & upgrading that corridor with grade separations & such *has been going on from the start* and is well underway. The trickiest bit has been the tunnel from the current 4th/Townsend terminal to the new [corporate-named] Transbay terminal, which was built with a train box specifically for HSR - because *one* property-owner along the route the tunnel will go under threw a wrench into it. The part *from San Jose to Merced* is what's on hold, for the same reason as the part from Los Angeles to Bakersfield - *because they still don't know where it's going to go* . The reason the Central Valley (Merced to Bakersfield) part is being built first, is *because they can* - it's the _only_ part of the route that's both physically and legally _possible_ to build yet. Honestly, I am sick and tired of all these supposedly knowledgeable people saying crap like this.
I remember reading about how to value engineer the project, CalTrain would simply be part of the "High Speed Rail Network" and that would make these trains go faster due to the electrification project that was already in the works before CHSR was approved...are they going to run HSR heavy rail on CalTrain rails now?
.. Most people leave their metro once a year, and mostly the rich. Poor people don't vacation much or have spread out family. It's a train 90% for the rich. Which is fine. It's darn like airplanes, it's 90% upper half of income people. Govt is spending tax money to mostly help the rich.. It basically replaces some airplanes and saves some pollution, but literally it's the same travel time to fly Sacramento to San Fran than the new train, it's literally No Change in travel time... You don't fly to see family now cuz you want a car with you upon arrival, it'll be same with train..... So much exaggeration, trains are very like planes, they don't magically help many... I ride Greyhound buses, but most people want a car upon arrival.... Sorry to ramble many points, but HSR in US is dumb for many reasons...
once its built no one will talk about how expensive it was. The original budget for thr Interstate hiway system was 25 billion dollars in 1956. The actual cost was estimated to be 128 billion, yet no one talks about how much it cost to build because they see how transformative it was to our economy. CHSR will have the same effect.
This video doesn't mention the HSR segment between San Jose and San Francisco, which it will share with Caltrain. That segment will running new electric trains starting in 2024.
@@OakIslandPicturesplus once HSR reaches SF, it’ll be faster than driving between there and LA, even with the bus bridge from/to Bakersfield. CAHSR estimates a nonstop travel time between Bakersfield and SF of 2 hours 10 minutes, and the bus bridge takes 2 1/2 hours nonstop. Compare that to about 6 hours driving. Pacheco Pass is the most crucial segment of the entire project, not just to create faster statewide travel than driving but also connects affordable Central Valley housing with Bay Area jobs with a 1-hour or so train ride vs up to 3 hours driving. That should make a strong case for it to get fully funded, especially once HSR service in the Central Valley begins and people can begin experiencing true HSR on US soil. Connecting the Central Valley to San Jose and SF is the next priority for CAHSR once the Merced-Bakersfield route is operational. Once Bakersfield-SF HSR service is established, then focus will turn south to reaching Palmdale and LA.
@@OakIslandPictures it’s easier to criticize than endorse something like this, and focus on the short term negatives rather than the long term positives. Admittedly CAHSR has faced setbacks, both by its own doing as well as outside opposition, and the tripled estimated cost and continuously pushed back timeline can’t be glossed over, but there needs to be a balance with what high speed rail can do for California and the US just as it has for decades across the world. California is brave enough to be the first to try bringing it here, and being the first was bound to hit challenges and learn lessons that’ll be applied to both its future progress and all future US high speed rail projects. The success of this first one is crucial for all the ones that follow. There needs to be more focus on the benefits this project will bring tomorrow rather than just the criticisms it faces today. There needs to be greater political support behind it to get it the funding it needs to get trains running ASAP so Americans can start experiencing true high speed rail here, then reassess to see if it’s still worth going to SF and LA. Compare the costs of doing that to the alternatives, weighing them against any potential benefits. If benefits outweigh the costs, and HSR is still the best option, then go for it.
HSR is fantastic. Only rode it once in my life when I visited China but damn it was great. Fast, quiet, and very comfortable. Feds really need to stop screwing around and fund rail in the US
London St Pancras to Paris Gare du Nord by hst in 3 hours was an amazing trip! Smooth, with excellent catering and arrival on time. Remember this train goes under the ocean for 30 miles at high speed as well! No messing about driving to airports, baggage delays, or finding car parking. Come on USA, stop dithering and get 'er done. You'll love it!
The problem with the U.S compared to places like in Asia and Europe is that it not only lacks high speed rail, but also mostly any type of rail systems beyond freight in most of the country. For instance, once the High speed rail comes from South California to Las Vegas the only thing to connect to it from Vegas are buses and the 1 line monorail that no one uses. I would say build up these smaller transit systems first and then build up high speed rail, or you truly would be going from nowhere to nowhere regardless of the city your connecting.
A simple google search would reveal that this country was BUILT on rail. But as the popularity of the automobile grew, the rail systems dried up and were decommissioned. I sit literally 30 feet away from an abandoned railroad that ran from Seattle to Chicago.
@@CowboyDave07 They didn't just dry up - they were killed off as the Government enacted *massive* subsidies of cars and the infrastructure they use at the pressure of auto industry lobbyists.
@@worldwidelibra I take it reading comprehension isn't your strong suite. It absolutely does matter. You and every other keyboard warrior love to balk about the lack of rail in the US. Once again, we had it, it grew into insolvency due to increasing lack of use over the last 100 years. Few cared about it then and no climate agenda will make people care about it now.
After spending a few weeks in Europe last year and utilizing their High Speed Rail, we really need this in California! At some point, they should get private investors like Brightline involved to help fund this and get it done quicker! Brightline is already breaking ground on LA to Vegas, this would be a good opportunity to continue their Brightline West program on LA to SF
That’s because brightline doesn’t have to deal with the roadblocks purposefully put in front of the project. Also bright line isn’t nearly as big as this.
Brightline started with owning their own track and using near idle ones. The vegas project is running on near empty land and with one big aim, get punters to vegas from LA as fast and as often as possible. LA is not pleading for a better vegas gambling access choice. Same for disneys open arms to get punters to orlando. Texans only want theirs as the current interstate is near gridlock and texans won't expand the road any wider without a near mutiny by its own citizens. Some have even seen a train and watched the cowboy movies with trains. Plus they worry daily about the red/chinese menace laughing as they are passing them.
@@mattlaw5426 again because it’s a much smaller project that isn’t being purposely handicapped by politicians who take money from the auto and oil industry and the private sector.
@@djc7039 Sadly because many in this country still are catering to cars and car infrastructure. California being car centric is what makes it dystopian, people like me who don’t want to drive are stuck. We need more public transportation and finally compete with the rest of the world.
@@georgebruv3955it’s still going to be car centric. What method of transportation do you think the users of this HSR would have to transfer to once they get off the train? CA should’ve invested into city transit instead.
Ironically, California's and China's high-speed railway projects started in the same year. While China just finished over 45000kms. While California.....
@@Woysla Nothing to do with wages and everything to do with land costs, meager funding and outsourcing wasting said meager funding. Also technical knowhow and experience does not exist here unlike China where they invest i education for the long term and not to make a profit in the next quarter.
"We have one segment that's going to be completed this year" - this is a meaningless statement. It does not mean limited rail service. It means wait until 2030 or as late as 2033 for rail service to begin between Bakersfield and Merced. When will the segment between San Francisco to Merced be ready? When will the segment between Bakersfield and Los Angeles be ready? When will the actual 2:40 minute planned route be fully completed? Between 2045 and 2055 at the absolute earliest. A thirty to forty-year building program. I'm pro-rail but I'm embarrassed as a native Californian at seeing how poorly this has unfolded.
It will be ready when the state decides to commit to actually funding the project. The state has not provided any meaningful amount of money since 2008. Its no wonder nothing gets built; they can't build without having the money!
I recently took the San Joaquins (a train that is somewhere between commuter and long distance rail and runs along much the the California HSR corridor) and it was fairly well populated and an enjoyable experience. I can't imagine how much better it will be when it doesn't take 1½x as long as driving.
there are no high speed train in America .....🚅 due to politics. ( cough lobbying) the changing economic landscape is now showing less preference to car ownership w/gen z ( rideshare apps) and how people will live and work in the future ie moving back into midtown/ downtown vs the suburbs | remote work. ....now people are listening. because technology has surpassed the 'car owner' narrative. people are on their phones; a 📰newspaper, book or 📱game app is ideal for easing the stress of rush hour. a bullet train match the 21st century aesthetics . fast convenient and you dont have put your phone down
@@mbryson2899 Exactly the same areas that CAHSR will go through. CAHSR is literally just an HSR replacement for the already extremely successful Amtrak San Joquins. It's already the 5th most popular rail line in the country and it only goes as far down as Bakersfield.
@@HeadsUpNorth Lol, the already existing Brightline-style train that CAHSR is replacing has none of those problems. What makes you think that the train that replaces it will? Also, get a grip. No one is riding this train for free. This was literally in the ballot measure that we passed. Everyone pays full market price, full stop. This is a for-profit system by design. We explicitly traded market prices to avoid having to subsidize fares.
Lived in Taiwan for 14 years before moving to America. High speed rail for a 2 hour drive took 30 min and maybe 25$ ticket. A regular train station was always walking distance to get to any city for skateboarding competitions
The most difficult part of the project is from san Francisco and Los Angeles. Nimbys, environmental groups, city zoning , noise control etc will slow the project even more and futher increase cost
@@weirdshibainu The CAHSR has upgraded the shared Cal Rail tracks. The tracks have had grade separations and improved track added. It is certified to a higher speed, now. So the CAHSR is already helping the people of California.
@Oak Island Pictures I didn't say that....why don't you try watching the video that stated " traveling over 200 miles per hour from San Francisco to Los Angeles in under three hours". I never said it would start out at 220 mpoh..those are your words.
Yeah, but your entire defense budget is being subsidized by you know who. That is coming to an end, so is all the extra fat funding projects you've enjoyed. Sorry....
Germany already had the infrastructure around the HSR in place before the HS ICE was built. You can get on a bus or a cab anywhere in Germany and get to a Ubon, a train, or light rail and get to the ICE. California is doing this backwards, you build the HSR last, after the smaller connecting systems. You will have little to no public transportation to get to the HSR, or home after getting off.
@@travisjohn4630 In case you don't remember, europe fought to bloody wars in the 20th century and after then there was a clear political goal of not letting germany rearm too much too fast.
@@johnny_eth So tell me how my comment was inaccurate? I'm not judging the intent or reasons for why things are the way they are, but things are changing, so you'd better get that silly nose out of the past and start looking to the future, things are happening REAL FAST now...
If the freight rails used by AMTRAK were to be double railed, so that there's a track coming and going, then LA to SF travel time could be 5 hours; freight delivery would be much faster as well. Presently those freight rails are a single track with lots of side-rails used to offload an oncoming train from the tracks; trains are playing leap-frog with an average travel speed of 30mph when the system is moderately busy.
I am fairly certain it would not have cost $125B+ to improve the existing line, nor required as much environmental whatnots as building a line from scratch. But...there was obviously money to be made by important people at taxpayer expense to build this...
@@culcune the existing Freight companies have a lot of legal strongholds when it comes to upgrading the existing rail network, and they drag their feet on purpose, because if you force demand on your own network, you can charge whatever you want for others to use it. As always, money is the root of this evil.
So from LA to SF its 500Miles right ? to get there in 5 hours you would have to travel at 100Miles/h. Do the existing tracks make that ? Probably no, so you would rebuild the entire line anyway, then you electrify it, and get a decent rail line for regional travel. Sorry freight trains wont go at 160km/h, good idea in general, but the state would build a high speed line at some point anyway to connect major cities.
@@jn4kp1 It's true, US trains are very slow and hardly anyone rides them because everyone needs a car anyway when they reach their destination and gas and cars are incredibly cheap compared to Europe so there's hardly any situation where you would want to take a train instead. This is partly because a LOT of US infrastructure was built between 1910 and 1950 when travel by wagon or car was just emerging, whereas much of Europe was built either for foot travel in medieval times (no parking) or was rebuilt after the war in the 50s-70s when the technology to install high speed rail existed. The future of the US is decently bright compared to the rest of the world. When the US stops being the eminent global superpower providing the world's security, countries like Spain where the average age is 45 years are going to have a hard time suddenly providing their own military security. The ability to commute quickly was important for a short period of time but the majority of clerical work can now be done remotely which also greatly reduces the need for service sector jobs (restaurants and hotels) clustered in metropolitan areas, so the need to commute long distances at all is going to be severely reduced in the coming years. So I don't think the US is terribly hurt by not having this infrastructure although there are some instances when it would be nice. The kinds of jobs that will thrive in the post-metropolitan era are going to be jobs that come to the customer in the customers own house, i.e traveling and telecommuting doctors, traveling nurses, food delivery, traveling veterinarian, traveling mechanic. All of these are going to work better using cars than by train.
It'll be worth it, living in a few continents. I miss the infrastructure in Europe and Asia, but instead of leaving again we need to support projects like this. Being able to travel from SF to LA over the weekend without the hassle of TSA or traffic is going to be great. I'm sure sports fans will enjoy the project as well.
... F any sports fan wanting govt to pay for their train for vacation. When did vacation trains become a left goal. Left use to fund city buses, now they whine about trains for rich vacationers !
@albertoalvarez. I am with you. On the weekend you can take a ride to from LA to SF or another way around. if you can afford for a $1k game ticket, but can't afford for a $200 room, just do a 1 day trip
Why build a high speed train when cyber taxis and ride hailing can bring you point to point on-demand? With all the public funds into this project, we could provide ride hailing subsidies with much better customer experience. For faster travel, just make the airport experience smoother with better trusted traveler access. The real problem is ideology and too many govt agencies and hangers-on on the take of these huge infrastructure projects.
Many people in countries with huge rail networks have all said, these are built more for future generations than the current, and that’s okay and needed. We have to think about the future and not just in the moment for the quickest solution.
The issue is americans dont think like this anymore. We're hounded by propaganda from conservatives that any project like this is a massive waste of money and that people need to provide for themselves. Folks need to pull themselves up by their boot straps and do this on their own. It's so, so sad and it's responsible for this massive divide between urban and rural people in this country. Rural people think urban folks want to spend massive amounts of money on nothing, while urban folks acknowledge issues and are willing to spend money to fix the issues. America is so divided because of battling ideologies that basically boil down to conservatives pushing "everyone for themselves" until it affects them.
@@CRneu we are tens of trillions of dollars in debt, and we have governments that are bankrupt across the entire country. I don't blame conservatives for thinking this way, especially when politicians constantly LIE about their goals/intentions. If you want to say you are building for the future, go for it. But don't lie about how the future is now, and that everything will come to fruition in less than 5 years just so you can get more money for you to pocket when the project inevitably fails.
Yep, the US needs to catch up to the rest of the world. We don’t want a future where Japan will have levitating trains & Americans will be stick in electric cars on 1960s freeways waiting 90 minutes to move 1 mile 😅
It’s good that the state don’t forget about Central Valley, because like the person said we are almost 4 million people, full of hard working persons that works on agriculture and oilfields to support the state and country!
but how dense is the population and how frequent is the individual transport. i am guessing there is a lot more traffic between SF to South bay, than in the central valley. if you are starting with a leg to prove the projects usefulness, I would have started from SF or from LA
Yeah, coz in China, the communist party would simply send the cops into the communities along the rail line and run them out of town. Do you mind if I push your house over with this bulldozer? No? Oh well...
California approved this 15 years ago. What happened? Even Morocco and Indonesia have operating high speed railway now. The US political system simply will not allow anything largescale to get done. Had the current political landscape been the reality in 1950, the Interstate highway system would never have been built either. The only time the US was able to do great things was when there was genuine sense of collectivism from the FDR era until the 1980s. Once this window was passed, it reverted back to 19th century every man for himself. Yet, rather than retreat its ridiculous position, politicians continue to promote hyper-individualism domestically and internationally, when what is needed is reversion back to more collectivism, so the US (and other Western societies) can get things done again like it is possible in China and several Arab countries.
I love to see the pride these workers have in the thing they're building, and how projects like these create well paying jobs that allow people to live the lives they want to live. It's just one small part of why this is so good, but it makes me happy to see it, and I'd love to see more of it.
@@mattahmann We approved this project in a referendum during the financial crisis specifically so that it creates jobs! China also built their HSR network to create jobs. Obviously there are transportation advantages and that is the main focus of these projects, but the jobs that are created in this country, in our communities are not to be ignored! These are important projects. This is also how and why we built the interstate highway network and the Golden Gate bridge!
@@TohaBgood2 the problem with stimulating the economy with these projects is that they have to increase tax revenues as a result. China is a completely different beast since there's no regulations and the government can move quickly. California needs to strengthen the economy by connecting SF to LA. Right now it's a train to no where that doesn't make sense for very many people to take. If they can complete the project, it would be amazing. Seems like there's too many regulations and red tape that eat up funding.
@@mattahmann Nonsense. 6.5 million Californians live in the Central Valley. 4.2 million people live just in the metros that have stops on the route. Fresno and Bakersfield have a million people each in their respective metros. They're also the fastest growing metros in the state. There will be a cross-platform transfer at Merced to Bay Area and Sac local trains. That's a region with 12 more million people! This whole idea that the Central Valley is "nowhere" is complete $%%hit. If the Central Valley is nowhere then what about the much smaller Las Vegas metro? or Austin? or Portland? or Miami? or Orlando? Also, nowhere? Then what isn't "nowhere"?! I understand that we have not one but two world famous metros in the state, with massive mindshare in world culture. But you can't nullify literal tens of millions of Californians like that just because they don't live in the two famous regions! We don't do that in this state! I'm from the Bay Area, btw. And I want the Central Valley to get the exact same treatment that we do!
Did she just say that by next year they will be able to "start planning" how to lay the track system? It's a train, that seems like it should have been one of the first things planned. This isn't ground breaking technology folks.
She means they'll start putting RFQs out for signaling and rolling stock. Putting rails down is pretty much the easiest, most known quantity. The hardest is planning and building the right-of-way.
Train switching, safety systems, signaling, track and ballast, and other considerations are well down the time-line. First determine routing, then do environmental reviews, get feedback from citizens and local governments, finalize route, design grade separations (overpasses and underpasses), buy the property, relocate utilities that cross or sit in the design paths, design the rest of the rail beds, put out the construction bids, accept the best bids, monitor the construction, and that is where we are now. Now as the construction is finishing some of the grade separation work, it is time to do the actual track design, so that the bids on the track system can be let. If it had been done before now, it most likely would have to have been changed, because of one of the previous steps.
Why would use something that takes at least 3 hours when the plane only takes an hour? If I'm sitting in an airplane at 1200 noon, and you're sitting in the HSR at 1200 noon, I will reach Los Angeles at 1 pm. You will be just barely getting to Merced.
@@micah6635 "your going to arrive at the airport 1 hour early " Nah, 30-45 minutes early. Same for HSR. People on tripadvisor forums say you should get to the HSR station 30 minutes prior as well, to make sure you have time to get on the right train. We're talking about going from SF to LA here, so people generally don't have a lot of baggage. I just have my backpack and sometimes a secondary bag that goes in the overhead bin. And I have "clear" so security is a five minute thing. Personally I have arrived at SJC airport 20 minutes before takeoff (boarding had already begun) and I got on the plane just fine. I would say 30 minutes is probably better. You definitely don't need to get there hours early. I can see on the east coast or in Europe, the airport might be further away from the city, but here in San Jose the airport is literally so close there is a height limitation on buildings. Public transit can get you there in about 20 minutes. For SFO, Bay Area Rapid Transit can get you from downtown to the airport in 30 minutes, same for Burbank airport and downtown Los Angeles. In any case if the train is taking three times longer these considerations don't really count. If the train was still under two hours then yes. But 3 or 4 hours, that's too long when the plane is only one hour.
@@neutrino78xtrains are much more convenient. Japan has a high rail network that connects every major city, and they don’t need an airplane to accomplish it.
I hope I get to see this project completed in my lifetime. It would be cool to buy a house in the Central Valley where it’s much cheaper and then take the HSR and work in the Bay Area. It would level out housing prices in California since people would flock to the Central Valley, not to mention the environmental benefits. We need this. Asap.
You made an excellent point in regards to housing. I have a couple of brothers who work in the Bay Area but have to drive three hours a day given where they live. A LOT of people in that area do that. There's little doubt this is going to create communities around the line.
"It would be cool to buy a house in the Central Valley where it’s much cheaper and then take the HSR and work in the Bay Area. " This is California we are talking about. If HSR was available then prices would skyrocket in the central valley. PLUS high speed rail prices would also skyrocket.
The first segment of 119 miles will be done 25 years after it started (assuming no more delays). And they plan for 800 miles in all? At this rate it will be 175+ years before its all finished. Also take into consideration all of the regulatory red tape with CEQA, Cal EPA, the "impact studies", paralysis by analysis which California government is known for, and lawsuits galore, the price tag will exceed $500,000,000,000 before it is all said and done.
Most of that is already done. CAHSR is environmentally clearing each segment with California and the federal government before construction. The Anaheim to SF section is totally environmentally cleared, with the exception of the tunnels, which still need to determine final route.
I agree, the raill project should have begun from the big cities. If it began from San Francisco (which already has a station built and waiting to be used) you would have had immediate strong ridership with a population already quite used to using transit. The highest percentage of car-less people in all of CA is in San Francisco.
But they have to dig a tunnel to get through the mountains next to San Fran if they want it straight enough for a high speed route. Expensive af! Oh and they have to tunnel through parts of the grapevine mountains to actually reach LA
I've ridden the high-speed train in South Korea many times. You don't have to travel as far to get to the main train station compared to the airport. No security lines of course; pretty much no downtime at the train station; no bag limits nor fees; no lines to board the train; and a strong cell connection throughout the entire journey. ANNND is rarely ever axed due to extreme weather. Whereas planes are regularly canceled during the typhoon (hurricane) and blizzard seasons. My dad stupidly booked the two of us on a flight from Seoul to Busan once, got canceled because of a strong storm. On top of that, in the respective train stations of Seoul and Busan, there are way more connections to the final destinations. Seoul Station alone has four subway lines and more than five commuter rail transfer options.
When highway/freeway projects go over budget and are delayed, which they do all the time. It’s rare to hear complaints from the media and people. But when a project that does not directly benefit cars is over budget and delayed all you hear is “it’s a waste of money and time”.
Originally CA partnered with SNCF, the French group that operates the TGV. After years of dealing with the state they bailed, claiming CA was too politically dysfunctional so they went and build a high speed rail system in Northern Africa instead - which has been online for like 5 years now.
@@bobsmith-wg9fz Yeah SNCF insisted that it go between SF and LA --- which was a bridge too far for the ca gov. I've always read it as everyone involved expected it to be a disaster and wanted it as far away from them as possible.
The very beginning of the video, there was already double-speak. I recall the cost quoted as $30B or maybe even less similar to the interviewer stating '$33B'. Of course, the truth comes out when the woman interviewed stated the double-speak of something along the lines of, 'Oh, that was just a portion...' and then goes on to say, 'Just to be clear, we never had the full funding...'
@@culcune Yeah, we used to play those games on my programs when I was a project manager. There's all kinds of numbers that can get sliced & diced in all sorts of ways. "Construction Cost", then there's add on's = Utilities, Inspection, Design, Planning, Rights of Way, Financing/Bonding, inflation/escalation, contingencies (I could write a book about the various sorts of "contingencies"), yata yata. Then, yeah, what exactly is the "scope" of the "program" you are managing? On my sorts of smaller jobs, it was a baffling ordeal to keep track of what was in/out of various complicated programs, like a new 22 gate 2 concourse airport terminal, a 75 acre rail maintenance & storage facility (those were my 2 biggest jobs). For 1 example: A new airport fueling facility & maintenance garage for airport maintainers had to be built because our new terminal complex displaced those 2 existing facilities (which were old & obsolete anyhow). We got pilloried all the time for not including them in the budget, but we argued that new facilities were needed anyhow, & thus separate funding sources were applied for. YMMV . . .
@@sideshowbob The mafia used to do this in those cities it dominated, but California was pretty good about keeping them out. Instead of the mafia, however, friends of politicians, and I am sure politicians themselves, get rich off these projects. In fact, I recall Diane Feinstein's husband getting a large contract from a section of this project.
The US is only 50 years behind Europe on high-speed rail. By the time we actually have high speed rail it will be 100 years behind. Meanwhile these high Teck executives and I do not mean the actual construction workers are making big salaries which they have for 50 years.
It just blow my mind that my country Indonesia will open a 350kph High Speed Line in a few mouth left, while the US maybe still need a decade to complete CHSR or Brightline west.
Terrain and miles (km) of how far the train commutes are a big factor in why it takes so long. America is a big country and California alone is bigger then a lot of countries.
@@Truth-of-the-matter If I'm not wrong, the Laos-China HSR Railway traverses mountainous terrains and valleys, and it was still completed not in 15 years or more (note my sarcasm).
You just don't get the level of corruption of the US. It's beyond anywhere else in the world. Everyone has to get their cut and also they don't care about the finished product. It's in their interest of the longer it's in development , the more of a cut they will get. That's why this project will never finish. The US corruption will collapse the US.
Being in Taiwan for many trips, and utilizing that high speed train (215mph) I can attest to the use and ease it will bring. Taiwan's HSR is about 2/3 the length of the whole proposed LA to San Fran.... I wish this would get built sooner than later. I really think people that do not understand fully and/or have never used the HSR in Taiwan, and Europe for that matter, knows exactly what it would bring to CA and USA.. adding here, just think about that people can live in Fresno, Madera and commute to San Fran in 1.5 hours... Also, people living in Bakersfield, Palmdale can commute to LA in 1 hour or less.... I for one would probably choose to live in that MUCH cheaper area and commute on a train 2 - 2.5 hours each day.
@@sethaldrich6902 it would spread out the high housing prices. My guess is cities like SF would see a decrease in demand for this very reason and home price decrease would follow, while prices in the central valley will go up as more people realize they can commute using hsr. Ideally it will decrease the discrepancy in prices between major cities vs smaller cities/rural areas.
not sure why would anyone want to commute 2 hours to anywhere... why a lot of people moving to smaller cities live right by where they work and on the cheap.
@@TheGrape1234 Bingo, that's exactly what the landlords and elite class don't want! Including the city administration in general. Think about it with a mobile workforce the chances of jobs including big corporates moving out of the cities like NY, SF and LA would become a thing very soon (And it has started already with many moving to TX). Big No no no for the shady Mr. Grey's living upstairs.. they rather hope to cage everyone to these cities forever staying over dependant on the services within than move back.
The first segment will unironically help keep me and my girlfriend together. We have a strong relationship but living so far apart puts a big strain on things and the California high speed rail, a project started before I was old enough to make myself a sandwich, is going to close that distance in a big way whenever that first segment gets done.
@@weirdshibainu the train going at 200 or so mph. Imagine sitting in the airport as you see a train fly by at 200 mph while you sit waiting for your plane for an hour or more.
@@weirdshibainu HSR has been proven to be faster than overall airline travel for distances of 600 miles or less. HSR is effective even beyond that considering studies have shown people prefer the higher comfort offered by rail than the that of short-haul airline travel.
The guy hit the nail on the head when he said the project should have started in SF or LA so lots of people could start riding it. This project has to be financially viable and without riders it won’t be.
@@tommurphy4307 Right now in the city of LA people don't ride the subway because it doesn't connect to many of the most densely populated areas. It's useless, dirty, and slow.
Some of California's biggest law firms have gotten rich over this high speed rail project due to lawsuits filed against it by a wide array of interest groups, including environmental groups and agri-business groups..
Don’t forget kickbacks for all the various politicians and leaders involved. No American mega-project is safe from the tentacles of corruption. Same with the interest groups. It’s all about easy money.
This is how competing interests have their voices heard in our system of government. Do you have a better idea for resolving these conflicts?
You'd think the environmentalists would support this project.
@@thequietstag4366 "Environmentalists" are split into a lot of splinter special interest groups. The Endangered Species ones, the Green Energy ones, the Wetlands Protection ones, the Sacred Native American Burial Grounds ones. They all don't really give a rat's ass about the type of project (well OK the Green Energy ones might), they only care about their narrow special interest, to the exclusion of all else.
@@thequietstag4366 environmentalist don’t support anything
We’re so worried about a train damaging the environment while leaving everyone to drive everywhere because there is no other choice. All the driving we have to do is so much worse for the environment and our health.
@Oak Island Pictures The heritage foundation was right time to sue to cancel some of these NEPA suits
And let’s not forget that the train can directly be connected to the grid so no need of batteries of fuel that pollutes even more! There are trains in Europe that are over 50 years old and still running.
@Oak Island Pictures those Californian environmental laws are a gigantic joke! I hope we destroy all the infrastructure that has been built with ICE and oil products and see what will remain!
No it doesn't, what are you talking about?
@@alanmay7929 How do you think the powers created, genius? Ah yes, the fuel that would've went into the car
San Fransisco to LA doesnt seem like much, but for UK audiences, its the same distance from Edinburgh to London (560 km).
There's an existing freight line that Amtrak operates on traveling LA to SF. But, it is one set of track. Two-way traffic runs on it by playing leapfrog using the side-rails to stop & wait on while the oncoming train eventually arrives & passes by. If only there was another set of rail. Average system speed could be boosted far beyond its present 20-30mph. The Amtrak train running Chicago -St. Louis runs on a double tracked route with a speed near 80mph for the greater portion of the trip.
Basically what my classmate describes of Hefei: I came from a city very close to Shanghai, £23 for an hour and 50 min of the ride, with the only distance between London and Newcastle
The UK is a drop in the bucket when compared to the size of the US.
A bit more, downtown LA to downtown SF is about 380 miles, so over 610 kms
I mean that really puts it into context. The projected cost for HS2 in the UK was £87bn, which is roughly $107bn USD. High speed railways are expensive.
I grew up in the central valley, and once I found about the high speed rail connecting us, I was so happy to see a megaproject that would benefit us.
I’m trying to have a better understanding of the objections of various farm and ranch owners of the central valley - is the main gripe the sort of blighted eyesore that an elevated concrete railbed would put on their property? A bunch of pillars and a corridor of concrete obviously much narrower than that of the typical CA freeway doesn’t eat up that much of their lands, right? Or am I looking at this all wrong ..
You’ll probably be dead by the time project is completed. Hell, we all will be dead by that time. This is a project for the benefit of my grandkids 😂😂
@@billkittleman9631it’s all about 💰💰🤑🤑 they want a big piece of the pie. Same thing happening in Texas with rail project from Houston to Dallas. Land owners want premium price for their land.
People question the budget for trains, but never the budget for car infrastructure.
The problem is the political climate and Union leaders
transit spending in the US is unfairly scrutinized. Check out the budget for I-69 extension. Its literally more expensive than the the Cal HSR, yet it serves a region that is less than a quarter of the population.
false equivalence
Also why don’t question enormous military industries budget without audit
@@kenny4957 Correct. Car infrastructure is the overwhelming recipient of funding for decades.
Rode the high speed train from Guangzhou to Wuhan in 2010. A distance of 600 miles was covered in less than 4 hours An amazing experience. When I came back to the US in 2012 I experienced the inconvenience, slowness, and unorganized and unreliable Amtrak from LA to San Diego. Was a total joke.
Its ridiculous and the main reason I moved out of usa
See population density. See your brains get bigger lol
I flew from Dallas to Denver, a distance of nearly 800 miles in about 2 hours.
@@kev3d and polluted the environment 20 times more than a train would
they changed that train now in China i believe. you can travel that distance even faster now.
I went to france and spain and experienced their rail network. Wasn't even the fastest out there, but I was blown away at how easy it was, how affordable, and how nice it was compared to cramped and gross airline seats. Makes me really wish we had better rail. I will say, Vancouver BC, Seattle WA, and Washtington DC all have great lightrail/metro lines. I wish Seattle would build theirs out faster. They are also taking 20-30 years instead of getting everything done in one fell swoop.
Rapid manufacturing is the key to achieving efficient results. The longer the process takes, the faster taxpayers' taxes will be lost, and even more money will be spent. From past practical cases, it has been proven that low efficiency is a stepping stone to prevent progress.
France and Spain and pretty much most of Developed Europe and Asia started their HSR back in the 70s and 90s and continued it on from there, while the US was still car dominate at the time was still strangled by big oil and car lobbyists that dont like rail, thats why there's still lack of true HSR
It's the mentality of the citizens, we want to have huge vehicles, used by one person for most of the time. While other countries, they understood long time ago, that successful communities are better off with public transportation.
US is not a socialist country so we can never have good things like that, here we are CAPITALISTS and profits are everything.
@@SLICEDfinds It's not the citizens fault, read my previous comment, corruption via companies promoting and forcing cars and planes are why passenger rail has fallen so far behind compared to other places
Historically, high-speed trains have a lot of cost overruns when they start out. Japan is the best example. Anything you build here is going to be more expensive dealing with land acquisition and expensive labor. Once it is in place, it will change things. Consider how much money the US and California have spent on roads and airports over the 100 years.
But those roads and airports are already there. High-speed rail is being proposed as a *replacement* for those roads and airports, not an adjunct. It's not at all clear that high-speed rail will lure people out of their cars. So I'll bet that the only way to make HSR viable will be to ban cars entirely or impose steep prohibitive fees and taxes on them (like congestion pricing)--and FORCE those other modes out of business.
@@stevenlitvintchouk3131
Bruh out of business? You high or something?
Read the original comment, and focus on the bit ‘Japan is the best example.’
Like what Japan has a PROFITABLE and VIABLE high speed rail alternative, while having cars everywhere. In fact Toyota is the largest automobile company in the world, while originating from the nation that literally invented high speed commercial railway.
Americans sure are good at making excuses for everything.
I lived in Italy for a year and was very impressed by the Italian high-speed rail network. The main line, which runs from Turin to Naples via Milan, Bologna, Florence, and Rome, covers around the same distance as San Francisco to San Diego in around five hours. The whole travel experience is way easier than flying. Trains leave from stations located in the city center, instead of airports on the outskirts that take forever to get to; you can show up to the station just a few minutes before the train leaves, since there's no airport security to deal with; and the trains are much more comfortable than airline seats, so you can actually sleep or get work done on the way. Prices are very reasonable compared to airlines too, especially if you're bringing luggage, since the railways don't tack on a bunch of ridiculous fees. There are two competing railway operators in Italy that use the same tracks, one public (Trenitalia) and one private (NTV), which helps keep prices low. Most of the network was built relatively recently, and in true Italian fashion, has had its fair share of political scandals and cost overruns, but the investment was absolutely worth it. I hope that despite its many setbacks, California's HSR project achieves something similar when it is finally completed.
I've been on Italy's HSR too. The Frecciarossa is great.
It is a great system but it’s subsidized by the Italian government which has been on the verge of insolvency for the last 12 years and is considered one of the most financially at risk countries in the EU. Spending on these infrastructure problems is part of the problem.
@@davidwelty9763roads don't pay for themselves either
@@davidwelty9763 Infrastructures especially roads and rails are meant to be supporting other economic activities. If you want revenues from the infrastructure itself you'd better not build many infrastructure.
I think the issue in US, people cant wrap their head that infrastructure road and train are the same. The Airlines lobby brainswash people to think train investment it too expeensive, but somehow people dont care how much wasteful the military spend or how much wasteful spending in roads and bridges.
The longer you wait on massive projects like these, the larger the land acquisition costs will become. Get HSR right-of-way as quickly as possible.
Exactly! Imagine if Japan also waited that long to build the Shinkansen line! It would have been totally impossible project.
Who is paying for it???? They need more federal support
So the government should be carte blanche when it comes to seizing private property?
@@JChang0114 the government can’t take property without compensation this is the law. On top of this the corrupt California government made the project over complicated when there was publicly owned land they could build rail on. Instead they chose to pursue a route that would go over private land. Building rail on property already owned by the government is not an issue for a public rail service.
@@JChang0114 Do you think that's what I said?
It's so easy to hate on this project, but once it's completed it will be absolutely amazing and transformative. I really hope we can get this done.
Ok, but who’s gonna go to San Francisco? Why would anyone want to go from one homeless and drug addict infested city to another? What exactly is the draw here?
Problem is, it will not be completed in our life time
Maybe your grandkids can ride it.
@@stvdmc2011 and people then will thank us for having the foresight. There will be a plaque somewhere LOL
@Jakecosenza69, these types of projects are for sure transformative.
The trouble is with the way we do things these days perhaps our grandkids will enjoy that transformation.
From 2008 to 2023, China built about 30,000 miles of high speed rails while US spent roughly the same amount of money on the wars US fought in the Middle East during the same period. Both China and US got what they wanted.
Wow this is some Terrible logic you have first of China is a dictator ship. They are using slave labor to build them trains and.they are literally Bankrupt because of this just leave all that out there why don’t you and the USA isn’t Waging war in the Middle East stop with the stupid conspiracy theories god you people are ridiculous
China's infrastructure is made out of cardboard.
But the Chinese don’t have to deal with right of way issues like land acquisition. The government just takes it, sometimes by force.
@@Sacto1654 not really. In China acquisition of land is also a big hassle. Search “钉子户” on UA-cam you will see plenty examples of stubborn people. I would say that peer pressure is much higher in China compared with US and Europe. It is relatively easier for government to get land in China.
The Chinese government also doesn't have to deal with acquiring private land to build such railways. They also don't have to deal with environmental reviews or pesky landowners of land that generates billions of dollars of revenue.
As a person who took High-Speed Rail in Taiwan, China, and Japan, it is mind blowing that the US does not have one yet. I am excited to see this come true and hopefully have HSR in every part of the nation.
Sure, great, let's spend money on HSR instead of...what? Because it's "mind blowing"? I do think it'd be cool, but the cost is an issue.
That is a great question. Perhaps we should throw money at more lanes on the highways?
It really isn't mind blowing when you look at the geography and populations of countries.
@@MrWaterbugdesign Of course it is expensive, but it is an investment to benefit the state, the people, and the nation. The US is already 20 years behind most developed countries in this area.
@@MrWaterbugdesign as someone who can’t drive, and I have many famillies in Sf. This train will be amazing. It will be efficient , fast, and conveniant. I dont understand why anybody would vote against it. I’m sick of freeways
Sadly, the problem is not a matter of cost, but of politicians and special interest groups that will always litigate and fight against these common sense public transportation projects. I have traveled to Japan, Italy and Germany and I have to say, it is quite sad how lacking the US's railway system is. The Time for the USA to have developed High Speed Rails and Bullet Trains was 40-60 years ago and the USA will never develop it.
@alfredcortines1769
You made me think of that episode from _South_ _Park_ .
Yes, cause OIL!! Same with EV.
U.S could be ahead of any other nation. Yet here you are, we are cathcing up ☺️
who is even going to ride this thing....amtrack has to be subsidized as it is, now this will also be subsidized...and where does all the money come from? building and maintaining and running it? Your back pocket! I wish it would just stop!
@@wtghost1Freeways are also subsidized
@@alec_cooking_channel , obviously, but do we need to push more money into another bad business that can not even keep itself afloat.Becaus its bad a business venture.........Yes, the people voted for it......But not at 100 billion over budget......4 times its original cost.....
California High-Speed Rail will probably cost $100 billion. But if it's not built, we'll need to spend at least double that amount on expanding airport runways at LAX and SFO; widening highways; and adding other transportation capacity throughout the state as our transportation needs grow.
Compared to the alternative, it's money well-spent.
Bro, CA residents are leaving by the truckload. They will not have to expand existing infrastructure.
OR live near where you work.
@@DN-cf5rz Even with the current rate (which is historically highest) by 2050 CA is still the most populated state in US. So no they still need to build the new good infrastructure especially something CA or US as a whole never have before.
California took federal grant money for this. So everyone in United States has a say in it.
There is no way land owners are gonna sell the land cheap. This rail project started before even researching if they could acquire the land it resides on.
Definitely agree with Bent. We needed to build in the more densely populated OC/LA legs up to Bakersfield primarily to energize users to use rail. Also building from SF down to the central valley. Once the project is built and people see how clean/innovative/efficient it is, they will sign on to build the rest. I'm hoping Brightline West will also pave the way for growing public support.
Most people recognize we need this. We collectively pay with tome( being stuck in traffic for hours a day) just to barely make ends meet. The oil lobbies destroyed LA but now we have to create super blocks like Barcelona to have more green space. 👍
@@trvst5938 This is one concern I have. General populations have internalized the cost externalities about road/highway infrastructure and scoff at the large price tag/tax increases we would need to fund the project. But it's been proven time and time again these transit projects are most cost effective for society in the short and long run.
Another issue is that the general public doesn't understand how much infrastructure costs. They see the large numbers for high speed rail, but don't see how much gets spent daily on car streets. Maintenance, repaveing, and signals cost a TON but nobody bats an eye.
The hood is over their eyes. They're told by the outrage machine to get mad at bikes buses and trains, and told to shut up and enjoy their expensive traffic congestion boxes.
and the huge upfront cost they need to provide to even use the roads. Average car payment is well over 500 a month
What repaving, have you driven in LA?
Cars pay for themselves
People also need to realize that a large portion of the budget is given to improving transit in California not just the HSR project itself. New commuter rail expansions, electrifications, facilities are being built all over California with the HSR money.
Is CalMod included in the budget
@@m--a Yes. A portion of the Budget went to CalMod. That’s the whole reason Caltrain was able to begin construction. But no one ever looks at that.
So that is why the budget ballooned from $33bn to $130bn I assume? Everyone gets a slice of the cake!
@@temper44 Why assume? They explained it in the video.
@@temper44 The best way I can put it is, they completely underestimated how difficult the project would be with California’s current transit infrastructure. It wasn’t just the Central Valley that started ballooning, but all transit projects associated with the CAHSR. But since the Central Valley is the “centerpiece” of the entire HSR project, everyone focuses on that.
As a California State worker, I wish this was completed long ago (Id probably be in the capital much more often). Having alternative modes of transportation vs being car dependent would be the great equalizer for our state and make it more affordable. I was in a meeting with job developers who specifically help the disabled population and the number one barrier is transportation. Having more mobility is key for the development of people, owning a car should not be the main prerequisite for taking part in society
Forget it, it is never going to get completed.
You better off in a car you get robbed on the train notice how they said no security.
The central valley of california was founded by farmer's 1880s during the 1970s much of the landscape was rural less taxes, they could not have built this 50 years ago no tax revenue. 9:45
As a California state worker... The HSR is a waste of money and a load of B.S.
@@basillah7650 At least they can't rob the car itself... Also come to Japan and see how high speed rail is done❤
It's embarrassing how many miles of high speed rail other countries have completed in the time California has been trying to get this project finished. China has completed 24,000 miles of high speed rail in the time this project has been in process, and is returning 6.5% a year on their investment.
Yea let’s compare our country to a dictatorship where the government can take your land
@@todoldtrafford Ironically, China has fairly weak land acquisition laws which results in the phenomenon of needle houses i.e. home owners who resisted to sell their land to the government.
So they say. And why is 6.5 an impressive number? I get 5.1% with my money just sitting in the savings account. I get 10% in the stock market.
They are hypocrites and liars, The American tax payers should have hired China,
Because China TELLS the people to move away, China does NOT have Environmental groups with their hand out for $$. It's embarrassing that CA even thinks it can build a HSR Project fast and on budget.
As someone from the younger generation - I am so excited for high speed rail and a route from LA to SF. HOWEVER the whole project has been a big planning disaster and lesson for the future of high speed rail construction on the real costs. At the end of the day, in my opinion, it will be worth it 20 times over, and our children will use it and think 'thank god they built this' just like I think when I take the trolley in San Diego or use the interstate roads (instead of thinking about how much money it cost). Public transportation infrastructure is always worth it.
We already knew the lessons on the real costs and delays associated with CA state government work. I am 41, I voted for this on the ballot back in 2008 because I live in LA and have family in SF, but we all knew it would never actually get built. It was more a joke vote to help the state go bankrupt faster, as it was in a huge budget crisis back then
I kinda agree with you there. I remember when it came up for the vote and little middle schooler me was so excited to hear it passed and that we were getting HSR. But watching it has just been watching a slow train wreck that we are finally starting to sort out. From the project starting before it was fully funded, to starting before all the land was in hand for the IOS. We really did kind of fumble the start to the project. I definitely think it will be worth it, but damn if it hasn't been a messy project so far. More-so than the start of LA Metro Rail back in the 80's/90's
The dirty secret is previous infrastructure investments weren't about the railroad or highway they were about the real estate, that would become more valuable as a result of the connections. This is ultimately going to be a boon not for LA or SF, but those central Valley cities. You will be able to afford a home in those cities and take train into SF or LA for work. The state will also benefit from people able to produce housing in a less expensive regions which helps to address the housing crisis.
@@btomimatsucunard I agree that this project may not survive the rising cost and delay, and if it ends up being built it will be astronomically over budget. This will give critics of Mass transportation ammo that these are not a legit solution. I feel for California Residents and Taxpayers footing the bill for sure. The silver lining will be that there will be a lot of important/ Expensive lessons learned from the success and failures of this project, which might enable any future project to avoid these pitfalls and do things better. I can only keep my fingers crossed.
It is not a big planning disaster. Like they explained in the video, the planning has always been done in phases and the broader the plan, the less accurate the estimations.
This is exactly what happened to literally every high speed rail or any large public project in history of the world. Even Japan's Shinkansen ended up costing multiple times over estimate cost and time.
8:35 "We're not going to bulldoze people out of the way... in this country" -- I had to chuckle there because America has absolutely never had a problem bulldozing Black and/or poor neighborhoods, especially, to build highways and whatever else, and you can even still see the same phenomena at work with interstate widening projects in places like Miami's Overtown area. Now that there are "other" people in the way I guess things have to be different.
Right?! He just wanted to have a comparison to make China look heartless, nice try.
Yep, it's a shameful part of our history. Many century plus old American cities have highways running through them. City planners of the 17th, 18th, and 19th centuries did not leave empty space for highways; residential neighborhoods were demolished to make room, and to force the residents out of the city.
And Florida will spend billions to widen lanes, and in six months, it will look like a parking lot, and the state will be on the hook to maintain and upkeep for years and years.
Yeah, and since the "Highway Revolt" in California in the 70s it's been basically made illegal to bulldoze people out of the way. That's precisely why it's so expensive to build here. We literally have the strongest private property protections in the US.
This is the whole point of his comment. We don't bulldoze people anymore. They can and do sue all the time.
You ever been to Fresno?Everyones Latino.
The USA once had great passenger rail coverage. Where I live in NW Arkansas, there was once passenger rail service. That stopped in the mid-late 1960's. It would be nice to have service again.
@bbabbich3467 No. The way you build your cities made cars atractive. There is in the US dense urban cores, and middle raise housing, and car parks can be reconverted into housing.
The Amtrak from LA to San Antonio presently take longer than it did when the trip was made with a steam engine. Much of the trip is made on a route that has only one set of tracks. The two-way traffic plays leapfrog using side-rails for trains to stop and wait on while the oncoming train eventually passes;' slows average travel speed to 25-30mph or even less if the system is busy.
Encourage the freight companies to double track the routes. Faster freight delivery is a bonus.
@bbabbich3467 has nothing to do with the price of cars. The Interstate system went in during the 50s and 60s, effectively killing the need for rail travel at the time.
@@rustyyb8450 that's the biggest issue, the ancient rail companies are holding the progress of rail travel hostage when it comes to using their existing networks. If you make it easier for passenger trains to travel, you lose leverage when it comes to charging these passenger companies money to utilize your network. Unfortunately, the existing passenger train companies don't have the funding to build their own network.
Passenger rail was never profitable, it was subsidized by transporting mail, dairy and express cargo at the head end of passenger trains and by shifting profits from freight operations to pay for passenger trains. Once the interstate highways and state and local highways were built during the cold war (with the justification of moving troops and equipment) as well as the advances in airplanes this shifted the lucrative mail and express cargo contracts to truck or plane and moved a lot of freight to trucks as well. This literally bankrupted most of the railroads by the 1970s because they could no longer offset the cost of passenger trains with the loss of mail and so much freight to trucks and planes.
This is why passenger rail died in all but the most densely populated areas (where passenger rail could potentially make a profit if run by a private company that doesn't need to waste its profits to run trains where its not profitable like Amtrak has to).
We in Indonesia cooperate with China and the construction of high speed trains takes 7 years in 143km if there is no Covid it will be completed in 5 years, believe me..working with China in terms of infrastructure is very fast compared to other countries, compare with Japan? in India the construction of fast trains in 7 years has only reached 10km even though it was started at the same time 😔
Its because of delays in land acquisition. All land is state-owned in China.
I don't care how long it takes or how much money it costs. Literally we are going through the exact same grueling process the Japanese went through in the 60's when they built their first bullet trains. If anything to me it looks like we're on the right track (lol). Point is, I'm sick of massive, dirty, inefficient, noisy, and wasteful freeways that tear through our cities. I'll support the HSR effort because we are so behind on transport infrasturcture.
But this rail line won't do anything about freeways in cities, this is intercity rail.
Yup, and the fact that there are still Shinkansen lines being built that have long finishing times, like the Hokuriku and the Tohoku/Hokkaido line
@@JChang0114 I hear you, but that's a different conversation
@@JChang0114 CAHSR has already helped upgrade Caltrain to BART/subway service levels. The same will happen to Metrolink in SoCal.
One of the reasons why this project costs so much is that it actually does fund these much needed upgrades to the local transit systems that fill funnel riders to CAHSR.
@@JChang0114 this is the first step. Then at city level you can start replacing highways with local rail or other transportation with the hsr connection and eventually the need for car will reduce
8:34 this is how we were able to build our interstate highways so fast and across the entire country. People who compare new rail projects to the interstate highways forget how badly the highways destroyed communities and cities in order for it to be built, and the fact that these environmental reviews happen now are a good thing
Also, no matter where it’s built, an electric train is already a hundred times more environmentally friendly than any road and we need to build more trains and electrify old ones if we want to solve our climate crisis
Those highways, while not faultless, provided crucial transport of goods nationwide (including the food you eat) at large scale, opened up vast economic opportunities and also provided the average American to freely travel in safety across the U.S.
@@weirdshibainu Yeah before the highways, no goods moved around the country, nobody could travel, and the US had essentially no economy. If only America had some transcontinental transit link before the highways… shame.
@@Zero76606 On the contrary, before the highways, there was passenger rail service (not high speed) all over the USA. Granted it wasn't one centralized system as there were multiple companies, put that's how people got around. It wasn't until the advent of the highway system, along with trucking, AND the auto/airline companies doing their part to shut rail down that we saw a shift in transportation.
@@Ven100 woosh
@@Zero76606 It didn't to nowhere the scale it does now. You have any idea what it was like to travel cross country prior to ww2. Slow, dangerous and the transcontinental link didn't service large portions of the country as interlinked or the last few miles. Is there a rail line that goes directly from the farmer to the processor to your grocery store? Nope. Moved largely by truck.....on the interstate system. Too bad you haven't a clue about history. P.S. without looking it up, where do you think the highway system was copied from?
China built 99% of their high speed rail network from 2012-2018 (They started in 2008 on one section for the Olympics). Their network covers 23,550 miles, all high speed and is the largest in the world.
It's a great system, but they traded speed for convenience on many stations. Most of the China HSR stations are outside the main populace requiring you to take a 30-45 minute ride to use them. Unlike Japan and Korea, and other countries that have their HSR go into their city centers.
And now they are in 1 Trillion dollars in debt due to the high maintenance
@@MauricioUA-cam it's a long term strategy to address population density that's currently happening in Japan where countryside people are moving to metropolis for better opportunity resulting to massive decline in local demographics. They took the lesson from a Japanese economists that the Japanese government still ignoring: "You don't tell the people to leave Tokyo and live in countryside, the answer is to build more Tokyo."
@@inigobantok1579 they don't have trade deficit and most of their debt are in yuan currency. Also, China has the world's largest middle class and highest savings, PPP and it's easily because Chinese banks are state-owned which are too big to collapse, unlike in the US where it's currently happening
@@MauricioUA-cam It's by design, not trade-off. Local governments set the new stations away from existing city centers with the expectation that high speed rail would help drive new progress in urbanization. And in tier one and tier two cities, they did. The desolate regions where high speed rail stations are have become booming new city districts or even centers. It's in the 3rd and 4th tier cities and towns that this plan didn't pan out, and who knows, maybe give them another 10 to 20 years, they may too.
Congrats Indonesia for became the first country in ASEAN who have High Speed Railway 🇮🇩❤️
I hear it's a fantastic system!
who build high speed railway for Indonesia?
@@jason980eChina
@@jason980eChina
@@jason980e China
By the time America has their first high speed rail, Japan and China would know how to teleport by then.
actually more like we're off at mars, including american citizens.
Oh yeah, china good, US Evil
that's funny, the US is closer to fusion than both those uncreative countries, and that's probably going to be the source of unlimited energy needed for teleportation.
Calif politicians and unions will milk this for as long as possible
Not China.
You know all that is propaganda.
building hsr in their own country is not even challenging any more so they start to build for other countries now
Nothing happens quickly in this country. Everyone has to make sure they're getting their cut.
It’s not that. It is due to the fact that every little expansion has to be voted on by the population. This slows the process down tremendously.
In California you mean
High speed rail didn't come quickly in Japan either, it only came earlier, and you bet with practically the same amount of baggage and stupid people complaining (not realizing they're asking for a worse alternative) that nobody's going to remember some years from now.
@@monadic_monastic69 Thank you, I lived in Japan for several years and can attest to the amount of time it takes to build high-speed (Shinkansen) lines in Japan. In fact, most people are not aware that there is still Shinkansen rail being built. The Hokuriku extension line from Kanazawa to Osaka has a 15-year timeline, as does the Tohoku/Hokkaido line from Hokadate to Sapporo!
@@johnwinter7597 eh....not necessarily. Greed is an American thing.
We just spent 20 days in Japan. The rail system is so efficient and the bullet train is next level. California can learn alot from what they have accomplished
You assume california would ever do anything properly or efficiently. The government is so controlled by unions and environmental groups and choked by red tape they literally cant get anything done.
Oops, pride got in the way
Japan is different than US. This boondoggle is going to be a giant terrorist target. Who in favor of this project discussed that possibility. They should stop construction now before wasting another dollar.
🤣🤣 flying is cheaper and just as efficient. Kinda why it dominates
Japan has subways so once high speed rail train gets you to next city can subway to destination. In US gotta rent a car upon arrival. In US high speed rail is literally pointless, if need a car anyway. Minneapolis to Chicago is 5 hour drive, that's better than 1 hour HSR then gotta blow $500 on car rental for weekend. And any subways in US soon are too dirty to ride, so yeah HSR in US is pointless.. I road light rail in St. Paul and wow even it was dirty and dangerous, no way can families use St. Paul transit it's like out of Mad Max the bums and drugs... Cars are only realistic option in US. ..
Nothing gets done in California. There's a 5-mile stretch of 680 in Contra Costa County that's been under construction for at least 10 years. Politicians blame interest groups; interest groups blame politicians; armies of lawyers get rich; and thousands of contractors and union workers get paid to do nothing. As the joke goes: "What's orange and sleeps 7? A Caltrans truck!"
This is the consequence of decades of one-party rule: Absolutely no accountability while taxes and government payrolls go up and up and up.
decades of one party rule? lol ok
Japan built its first highspeed line way back for double the original budget as well. It needs to be completed asap and with a ton of lessons learned that can be applied to new projects so such a desaster never happens again. They really need to pick up speed...
The geography of the U.S. and Japan are totally different.
@@jason4663 Yeaha exactly Japan has tons of mountain ranges and no great plains for example
@@ThunderTiger0801 exactly. Japan's terrain is much tougher to work with yet they get the job done. The bureaucracy in the US is just silly.
@@koshobai The oil and car industry is also to blame by lobbying politicians for car centric city design for decades unfortunately...
Japan did that with 1960s technology and we are now in 2020s
I've ridden the HSR in China and Taiwan. Not Japan yet (one day). They are glorious things. Imagine not having to go through airport security, or fumbling with baggage at the airport, or having to experience turbulence. And getting great legroom and a nice view the whole time. And if something goes wrong, just stop the train. The whole thing is electric so that's nice. They're fast, comfortable, absurdly quiet, and efficient. I live next to a train station, and oh boy would I love to get to work in 20 minutes vs 80 mins.
Oh and another thing? NO TRAFFIC. Rail traffic, sure, but no bumper-to-bumper stuff.
I think I'm just a sad American who's seen how green the grass is on the side but can never truly hope I can get to it. Unless...
No security? A train going 200 mph is the perfect soft target.
Yes, beautiful, but one thing that they had to compromise is the distance of the HSR stations. Most are not located in convenient locations within the cities and require a 30-45 minute trip to use it.
to be fair, I think any HSR in the US will have security comparable to airports
Get to really shorten the distance for the homeless in SF to get drugs from the central valley.
@@KevinSmith-qi5yn Now that's a selling point.
I lived in Spain for two years and my views on trains have never been the same since. I'm a huge proponent of high speed rail. It really does create connection both physically and mentally for people, which is desperately needed at this time.
This isn't realistic, BUT I think one thing that would help people from all parts of the project understand it's value a bit more would be to take a small group of stakeholders to a place, like Spain, where high speed rail is the norm and have them experience it. Imagine, a small group of railroad workers, construction workers, farmers, people opposing it and the voters needing to approve it for funding, all taken to experience it and see what a benefit it is to the community would make all the difference.
great idea
No one needs to go to Spain to know the pros and cons of a hi-speed rail line. People voted for it back in 2008, when they were told it would cost $33B. Fifteen years on there has not been one mile of track laid, and the estimated cost is now $135B, and that's based on figures from 2019. This will end up costing closer to $200B by the time it's finished, which means that it never will be. I spend a lot of time in Spain, and I will be there again for a couple of months at the end of the year. The train and road network is incredible, but it was a luxury the country did not need and could not afford, and Spain will be bleeding for decades because of it.
this is actually a great idea. thumbs up
I live in the PNW, and our regional intercity trains (Amtrak Cascades) use the same Talgo series of train sets as you
@@daleviker5884 bruh, it's rentable and we have tickets for 9€. We can afford it and our economy and society benefits from it
US: it cost too much. too hard to complete as plan😅
China:🤣
China is bankrupt
China is bankrupt from there’s read a book
every single time I ride high speed rail outside of the US, it has me thinking how sad it is we haven’t utilized it yet. hopefully california continues to be a pioneer for the rest of the country.
"every single time I ride high speed rail outside of the US it has me thinking how sad it is we haven’t utilized it yet"
It does?
What HSR did you ride in Canada? What HSR did you ride in Australia?
@@neutrino78xCanada has the same issues in terms of car dependency in the US and is currently considering some high speed rail corridors as well. Australia, if I remember correctly, has some world class public transit in its major cities, but doesn't have the population (less than Texas in the entire landmass) to warrant high speed rail between them. The same can actually be said for Canada as well.
No reasonable person would argue that the US does not have the density for high speed rail. Corridors on the east coast quite literally have more people than comparable exisiting HSR corridors in Europe. Hopefully the US can continue building it out so can try it for yourself and realize what you're missing out on.
@@rojaalborada
"Canada has the same issues in terms of car dependency "
You misspelled "Canada is another case where HSR is not applicable to their needs".
" Australia, if I remember correctly, has some world class public transit in its major cities"
As do we.
"but doesn't have the population (less than Texas in the entire landmass) to warrant high speed rail between them. The same can actually be said for Canada as well. "
Yep, there you go. It's the same here.
Yet you're harassing the USA, when none of these three nations are doing high speed rail, and it's all for the same reasons. Just relax. Europe and Asia are very different from North America and Australia. The same solution is not going to work everywhere, and that's ok.
If a European wants to go 400 miles, they fly, just like we do. Tourists praise the HSR and it's mainly them who use it.
@@neutrino78x Canada is not the same empty land everywhere. In fact, about 15 million Canadians live between a 500km corridor between Toronto and Montreal.
That's pretty similar to Madrid to Barcelona, 620 km, about 14 million people.
For America, Houston and Dallas have a distance of 385 km and 16 million people.
It absolutely works geographically, keeping in mind Spain is hell of a lot more mountainous than Saint Lawrence corridor or central Texas.
@@chinguunerdenebadrakh7022
"Canada is not the same empty land everywhere. I"
Yeah they are, they have stuff in the southeast and stuff in the southwest, and in between is mostly empty. That's VERY similar to the USA.
And no, THEY ARE NOT BUILDING A HSR, for the same reason we are not.
"15 million Canadians live between a 500km corridor"
You realize that's very low density, right? Do the math.
"That's pretty similar to Madrid to Barcelona, 620 km, about 14 million people."
Not exactly because Madrid is quite a bit more dense than Toronto and Barcelona is quite a bit more dense than Montreal. The only reason is works in Spain is that they have the population density in each city. If they didn't, that HSR line would be way too long.
We're just more spread out in North America and Australia, man. Our countries have existed for less than 300 years. In another 2000 years, it's possible we'll be as dense as Europe is now, but I think it's actually unlikely, because by that time, more people will live on other planets than live on Earth. The USA will probably be roughly the same density it is now. 🙂
We recently just got the Elizabeth Line (Crossrail) built here in London. It was over budget and delayed and the usual rabble rousers were out in force decrying the project. Now that it’s open not a word, everyone loves it and the trains already packed. Big infrastructure projects are always worth it in my view!
@@ATHIP12 Yes and no. I frequently take train between Riverside and LA due to school. It's 15 dollars one way, 20-25 round trip. Sure, it takes longer, but it's hours not driving. I've also taken the metro bus frequently. It's $3.50 to get on the bus and you can take the entire route.
The bullet train will not be perfect, but I'd like the idea of visiting friends in San Fran and coming back to sleep same day WITHOUT having to spend 6 hours in start and stop traffic.
The cali train is the first of its kind in a while (at least in the US), transportation will get better as we build more.
@@ATHIP12 Correct. Rail transport is non-existent here because the cities became large during the age of cars. Unlike London, in which the rail system was built at a time of horse and cart. Unfortunately Californians don't understand this, and so are being "taken for a ride" by all the grifters. As usual.
@@ATHIP12 I’m sure there would be plenty of bus routes that would go where you’d need it to, to connect to this system.
Not talking about intercity travel. Talking about a line going from Durham to London equivalent. Not even that simple.
@@technokicksyourass Cars don’t go 250mph, legally at least.
So rail transport would still be needed.
If Japan, China & Europe can build it, we deesrve a HSR system too
But it can't just be an overpriced system. It needs to be affordable like their eastern counterpart.
Europe forgot how to do it. They have been trying to modernize a small segment between Stuttgart and Ulm for ages, with no end in sight.
@@easylight6412 its already in operation
@@easylight6412 Germany is not all of Europe. If you have a look at Italy, Spain and France you can see a ton of great stuff.
Even India started HSR. It will most probably complete before California although its construction started 10 years ago.
The problem with America is that every time the government embarks on a major project, there’s hundreds of interests that want to squeeze every dollar out of it. Eventually the money dries up and the project is nowhere near completion. Hell, True Detective had a whole season around corruption regarding California HS Rail.
The Simpsons predicted this with their own monorail episode
@Fika_Break so you're saying the US is both corrupt and inept
That's a problem in California. Other states don't have that problem.
The problem is government allows this to happen.
I have seen clips of hsr construction in China. The US is still hand forming the concrete whereas the Chinese use precast. You can’t beat their speed and quality.
because the chinese are known for high quality construction...riiiiiiiight.
@@Teyore except, they probably are compared to the us, and being efficient at the same time again, unlike the us which seems to love taking their sweet time on literally anything, and Nothing gets done for 10+ years
@@PotatoLaptopUser101 I'm not defending the red tape the US etc. has to cut thru to get simple things done, but my point is that just because the chinese can build it fast, doesn't guarantee that is good at all. Theres been lots of reports of faulty construction and issues with dams and other infrastructure. Terrible quality control etc.
@@Teyore Precast is standard in Europe. And is also the Standard Brightline uses to get its hundreds of miles of new and rebuilt track done in a year or two. Every progress shot I see of CHSR is pathetic by comparison. Huge sites, enormous amounts of materials strewn about, but only every one or two people milling about on a weekday.
i think i'd want the hand job....
I've only ridden the Shinkansen, but it changed the way I look at traveling across long distances without a car or plane. Makes me wonder why we never developed high speed rail in the States until now with CAHSR. In regards to the high costs of CAHSR, ironically, the Shinkansen also went over budget when it was built, but no one ever thinks about that because it's a service that people enjoying using. Hoping for the same with CAHSR.
The whole CAHRS Profject is still not expensive tho. California is very much comparable to Italy in size. Still CA is a bit wider but the shape is pretty much identical and ideal for trains. So What California tries to do is to build a HSR network from the ground up which is massive. Italy started in the 70s and by now they have such a good network that flights are not competable anymore. Right now they build a tunnel towards france to connect the two countries HSR networks for 8 billion. A single tunnel with "just" the length of 55 km. So 128 billion for a country wide HSR network? Sounds good to me
The Shinkansen was a revolutionary project - even regular trains have improved because of it. I've ridden the Italian train from Florence to Venice and it reached over 400Km/h (around 250mph) and we couldn't even notice. Trails for those trains are not easy to build, though! Another option to bullet trains is what we call here "high speed trains" - trains that go around 100mph and are cheaper to build.
Yeah. Lot of people forget Shinkansen was very controversial in Japan (cars and planes were supposed to be the future of transport, trains were "old fashioned", on the way out 1800's technology and so on)and was over budget when built. Once complete it was success and now everyone marvels at the Shinkansen and the Japanese success with it. Learn from that, big infrastructure is never built without controversy, will cost a lot, take a longish time. However once complete it serves long time and is a success.
@@aritakalo8011 This high speed trains were build in Europe and Asia decades ago. Even African nations like Morocco have high speed trains similar to French ones
THE money goes to Afghanistan and Ukraine.
I hope Brightline is able to finish their much smaller projects in Vegas and Florida so that millions more Americans can truly see the potential of high-speed rail and support putting major tax dollars behind California's and other projects. I would take HSR over a plane for every single medium-distance trip ever. We also need to make sure we develop density around these stations and connect all of them to local transit if we truly want to unlock all of HSR's potential.
Not city center to city center it stops in rancho Cucamonga so useless.
Brightline only goes 130 MPH.
All they care about is money. So they drag it out to reach new highs. No integrity anymore.. They want to maximize funding. We want more, we need more for your own best interests. 🤑🤑🤑
@@demotter Currently, yes, but it's goals are actual high-speed.
@@demotter That is high speed, Its not a bullet train.
It was really nice hearing from some of the workers about what the project means to them and how it has impacted their lives. I think more reporting like this would only help improve public opinion of infrastructure projects like this in America.
I live in the Fresno Area and there’s a lot of construction going on every day. It may seem like there’s no progress on the coasts, but the backbone of the system needs to be built out along the San Joaquin Valley and it’s happening.
That 'backbone' has already consumed three times the projected budget. And they still don't have any real idea as to how they are going to get the train through the mountains near Los Angeles and San Francisco. Any solution that does not cost over $200 billion for each of those crossings turns it into an 'average speed rail line.
Just look at the fact that the company that is building it was awarded a 'no-bid' contract and has not been held accountable for the schedule slips and the fact that everything is - for some reason - costing significantly more to build than similar projects elsewhere. And there's no public accounting as to exactly what those costs are. Oh and this is a privately held company that will not disclose who their investors are.
If that doesn't make you smell a rat - then you need to get your sinuses fixed. A lot of California politicians are going to join the 1% because of this project.
Just get the existing Amtrak freight line double tracked. On one set of rail the existing two-way traffic plays leapfrog using side-rails to get past each other. All the stopping, waiting and starting slows average travel speed to 25-30mph. The trains are capable of 80mph. When the system is busy, leapfrog slows Amtrak's average travel time even more to the point of putting the train out-of-service mid-trip for a fresh crew to arrive.
@@colincampbell767 this suppose to be the cheapest section to build but nope
@@colincampbell767 I don't really care. If it ends up being a WORKING high speed rail line, even if not quite at intnl. standards, it is a huge improvement. Every US project runs insanely over budget, that's not a real concern. We have plenty of money in the gov't.
@@rustyyb8450 Piggybacking to the Amtrak rail is a non-starter, because our CA coastline is eroding and the tracks get shut down. See San Clemente recently.
Has to be through San Joaquin Valley. I only ask for a stop in Coalinga so that everyone can get a nice steak and bio break at Harris Ranch. 🐂
Some of the most significant complaints about this project have been resolved, including land acquisitions and environmental reviews. It would be incredibly foolish not to complete this link between San Francisco and Los Angeles. As for cost, remember that East Side Access in New York City cost over $11.1 billion.
128 billion PLUS is not 11.1 billion... BOONDOGGLE!!!
@@ronclark9724 I am pretty sure East Side Access is more expensive per mile of track, which is actually insane. But hey, its finished now, and california hsr is not yet so there is that.
we’re getting this high speed rail regardless of the naysayers!! states across the country will look to us as a model and will be able to make cheaper and more economical high speed rail thanks to california.
So, 1) I totally agree: we’re building for the future here! 2) WOW these comment bots are something else 😮
A railroad between 3 farmers towns is a waste of money.
people can't get out of hell hole california fast enough
So Much BS.,
"we’re getting this high speed rail regardless of the naysayers!! "
If by that you mean we're getting Merced to Bakersfield then I guess you're right. No more will be constructed beyond that.
I have been travelling over China, Taiwan and Japan and had seen their HRS are the fastest, the cleanest, the quietest and the most convenient transportation systems in the world. These truly makes me think twice why US is the richest country in the world but still being the poorest HRS...Lets stop war for few years, make HRS this is what American needs.
A bigger question is why all construction projects including maintenance on roads and upgrades take so long? It took 8 months for a freeway ramp to be done with redoing it and there’s rarely anyone there even abandoned construction vehicles
Exactly we need to criminalize incomptejce or the people In charge need to give our money back
Environmental resistance, regulations, NIMBYs, etc.
@@ZeusAVI it costed Florida 4 million dollars to built a pedestrian bridge for international students living quarters to cross a freeway and leads to the main campus and several months later that bridge collapsed. So regulations are not a factor at all, NIMBYs have less influence on state owned highways and the environment….I’m sure most cities would even pass if grandfathered exceptions were removed as cities solutions is to pour more concrete or another lane
Did you ever watch the OG top gear? Back with Clarkson, Hammond and May? They talked about road construction here in America vs Britain. In Britain, they'll close the entire road for a week or two to get the work done as quickly as possible. IN America, we drag it out for months and try to minimize the impact on traffic. We are stupid....
Saw a video on the cost of tunneling in NYC for the subway compared to other expensive countries which are cheaper. Bottom line, the way of work is corrupt to inflate the costs.
High speed rails in Japan and Europe are staples for travel. I've used the train in Japan and in Italy and it was great. I think eventually, in the future, this will be a great addition in CA. People sometimes have trouble seeing the good in something they haven't really experienced. I mean most Americans have never travelled abroad. My mom (in her 60s) rides Amtrak from the Central Valley to SF and she prefers it than the car (more space and she can use the bathroom easily) but it's not that efficient. I hope she gets to travel on this high-speed railway.
Most Americans don't travel abroad because we have the best here. EU is a crowded Shole and Asia is even worse, add feces on the streets and power outages.
China。To put it bluntly, any high-speed rail is a tricycle compared to China's high-speed rail.
How do you protect it from a terrorist taking out a portion? And after that happens who is going to ride it? Did anyone in favor of this boondoggle discuss this possibility. ROI will be zero.
@@TG-bq1kn idk... ask the countries that have country wide high speed rails and are constantly being threatened by terrorists.....
Look at how dirty and unsafe is US train station 1st plzzz
Brightline in Florida is testing the trains now from Miami to Orlando. Tracks are finished.
The real disaster would be, if it was not completed. Period.
That’s most likely what will happen, or it will be majorly downsized
@@NICOLASLAM-xy6mn Doubtful. Once the central portion is operational, there will be support from the north or south to get it connected to their area. As they said in the video, too much time/$$ has already been invested.
@@stevenstrain283 What happens if the project can't be finished without adding more tax for California people?
@@onetwothreeabc Take more debt? And the debt will take a percentage of every yearly tax as well as taking a debt to pay the debt if it's not enough which will eventually have our taxes pay for nothing but interests.
@@stevenstrain283 Sure. Then fund it. It only cost Californian on average of $2,500.
China built its 1st high speed rail in 2008
Today it has 2/3rds of the worlds high speed rail.
China high speed train total length around 25,000 miles
It helps when you have brown nosing yes-men running things. now the real question is if its safe and that they used actual rebar in the concrete and not bamboo to make mandated cost savings.
@@Teyore the racism and ignorance with no actual experience on the trains
@@Teyore well at least they didn't waste time like your HSR trying to determine if its a non binary him/her they/them trans homosexual 2 spirit LGBTQ THYVGYFVYGDGGK+++++++++++ train which is what your country. had to do. Hopefully your politicians asked the train if it felt inclusive and validated enough with the requisite amount of diversity in the tracks.
Having experienced Korea's SRT and KTX hs trains (not to mention their public transport network in its entirety) Poland's train network and now Germany's, I honestly believe the US is really missing out on something that will not only help its people, but really jumpstart its economy again. Afterall most of the cities and towns that are dead or dying thrived mainly because of their steel and rail industries. We are shooting ourselves in our own feet by not investing in hsr (or rail in general)
I personally think rail is one of the dumbest sorts of transportation. It's impossible to modify where a bus route can change throughout the day. Also adding or removing a bus stop is a much simpler process.
I think any type of rail system for transportation just doesn't make sense in the US.
@@agisler87dude the US was literally built and expanded by rail.
@@BrakeCoach yes, before we had cars, buses, and airplanes. Trains made perfect sense during the Westward Expansion but little today.
you do know it far easier to build a rail transpo system on a bombed out nation, when another nation is footing the bill?
@@agisler87so Japan, Germany, and Italy the king of car nations with Germany especially having the Autobahn was dumb to build efficient high speed rail that is quicker than car travel between major population centers? Tokyo the world's biggest city is dumb to have rail? Dude I think you need to invest in a passport!
Amtrak should run trains over the new central valley HSR line and connect LA to SF overall at medium speed until the last high speed segments are finished. Current CHSR is an incremental investment toward a high speed future in California, and throughout North America.
13:48 - Correction: "...from San Francisco south" to San Jose, HSR will be using the Caltrain corridor - and electrifying & upgrading that corridor with grade separations & such *has been going on from the start* and is well underway. The trickiest bit has been the tunnel from the current 4th/Townsend terminal to the new [corporate-named] Transbay terminal, which was built with a train box specifically for HSR - because *one* property-owner along the route the tunnel will go under threw a wrench into it.
The part *from San Jose to Merced* is what's on hold, for the same reason as the part from Los Angeles to Bakersfield - *because they still don't know where it's going to go* .
The reason the Central Valley (Merced to Bakersfield) part is being built first, is *because they can* - it's the _only_ part of the route that's both physically and legally _possible_ to build yet.
Honestly, I am sick and tired of all these supposedly knowledgeable people saying crap like this.
I remember reading about how to value engineer the project, CalTrain would simply be part of the "High Speed Rail Network" and that would make these trains go faster due to the electrification project that was already in the works before CHSR was approved...are they going to run HSR heavy rail on CalTrain rails now?
@@rodneyleong3787 Yes, they'll be sharing the same tracks. (Caltrain is also heavy rail.)
that and the fact that they need to build over 16 tunnels
Go California HSR! I am excited to ride this HSR.
As someone that lives in Sacramento I would use this constantly as it would facilitate visiting family, events, work, etc.
.. Most people leave their metro once a year, and mostly the rich. Poor people don't vacation much or have spread out family. It's a train 90% for the rich. Which is fine. It's darn like airplanes, it's 90% upper half of income people. Govt is spending tax money to mostly help the rich.. It basically replaces some airplanes and saves some pollution, but literally it's the same travel time to fly Sacramento to San Fran than the new train, it's literally No Change in travel time... You don't fly to see family now cuz you want a car with you upon arrival, it'll be same with train..... So much exaggeration, trains are very like planes, they don't magically help many... I ride Greyhound buses, but most people want a car upon arrival.... Sorry to ramble many points, but HSR in US is dumb for many reasons...
@@amyself6678 citation needed. you're just making stuff up.
once its built no one will talk about how expensive it was. The original budget for thr Interstate hiway system was 25 billion dollars in 1956. The actual cost was estimated to be 128 billion, yet no one talks about how much it cost to build because they see how transformative it was to our economy. CHSR will have the same effect.
This video doesn't mention the HSR segment between San Jose and San Francisco, which it will share with Caltrain. That segment will running new electric trains starting in 2024.
@@OakIslandPicturesplus once HSR reaches SF, it’ll be faster than driving between there and LA, even with the bus bridge from/to Bakersfield. CAHSR estimates a nonstop travel time between Bakersfield and SF of 2 hours 10 minutes, and the bus bridge takes 2 1/2 hours nonstop. Compare that to about 6 hours driving.
Pacheco Pass is the most crucial segment of the entire project, not just to create faster statewide travel than driving but also connects affordable Central Valley housing with Bay Area jobs with a 1-hour or so train ride vs up to 3 hours driving. That should make a strong case for it to get fully funded, especially once HSR service in the Central Valley begins and people can begin experiencing true HSR on US soil.
Connecting the Central Valley to San Jose and SF is the next priority for CAHSR once the Merced-Bakersfield route is operational. Once Bakersfield-SF HSR service is established, then focus will turn south to reaching Palmdale and LA.
@@OakIslandPictures it’s easier to criticize than endorse something like this, and focus on the short term negatives rather than the long term positives. Admittedly CAHSR has faced setbacks, both by its own doing as well as outside opposition, and the tripled estimated cost and continuously pushed back timeline can’t be glossed over, but there needs to be a balance with what high speed rail can do for California and the US just as it has for decades across the world.
California is brave enough to be the first to try bringing it here, and being the first was bound to hit challenges and learn lessons that’ll be applied to both its future progress and all future US high speed rail projects. The success of this first one is crucial for all the ones that follow.
There needs to be more focus on the benefits this project will bring tomorrow rather than just the criticisms it faces today. There needs to be greater political support behind it to get it the funding it needs to get trains running ASAP so Americans can start experiencing true high speed rail here, then reassess to see if it’s still worth going to SF and LA. Compare the costs of doing that to the alternatives, weighing them against any potential benefits. If benefits outweigh the costs, and HSR is still the best option, then go for it.
HSR is fantastic. Only rode it once in my life when I visited China but damn it was great. Fast, quiet, and very comfortable. Feds really need to stop screwing around and fund rail in the US
Nope We don’t we don’t want it or need it and we will never have it
@@The_king567not everyone’s a masochist for 4h traffic u bum
London St Pancras to Paris Gare du Nord by hst in 3 hours was an amazing trip! Smooth, with excellent catering and arrival on time. Remember this train goes under the ocean for 30 miles at high speed as well! No messing about driving to airports, baggage delays, or finding car parking.
Come on USA, stop dithering and get 'er done. You'll love it!
Uk only has that one line of high-speed rail, to Paris its small.. france is the only one in Europe
with lots of rail
@@efeddwdw9782 Spain has more High speed rail that france
@@efeddwdw9782 You forgot to mention Russia
Yes because no African Americans.
@@efeddwdw9782 We are building the second one between London and Birmingham and Manchester.
As a French who loves California, I hope it gets completed. California has so much to offer in terms of tourism. It will boost its industry even more
The problem with the U.S compared to places like in Asia and Europe is that it not only lacks high speed rail, but also mostly any type of rail systems beyond freight in most of the country. For instance, once the High speed rail comes from South California to Las Vegas the only thing to connect to it from Vegas are buses and the 1 line monorail that no one uses.
I would say build up these smaller transit systems first and then build up high speed rail, or you truly would be going from nowhere to nowhere regardless of the city your connecting.
it's chicken and egg
A simple google search would reveal that this country was BUILT on rail. But as the popularity of the automobile grew, the rail systems dried up and were decommissioned. I sit literally 30 feet away from an abandoned railroad that ran from Seattle to Chicago.
@@CowboyDave07 doesn't matter if it was built on it if it's abandoned now
@@CowboyDave07 They didn't just dry up - they were killed off as the Government enacted *massive* subsidies of cars and the infrastructure they use at the pressure of auto industry lobbyists.
@@worldwidelibra I take it reading comprehension isn't your strong suite. It absolutely does matter. You and every other keyboard warrior love to balk about the lack of rail in the US. Once again, we had it, it grew into insolvency due to increasing lack of use over the last 100 years. Few cared about it then and no climate agenda will make people care about it now.
After spending a few weeks in Europe last year and utilizing their High Speed Rail, we really need this in California! At some point, they should get private investors like Brightline involved to help fund this and get it done quicker! Brightline is already breaking ground on LA to Vegas, this would be a good opportunity to continue their Brightline West program on LA to SF
That’s because brightline doesn’t have to deal with the roadblocks purposefully put in front of the project. Also bright line isn’t nearly as big as this.
Hopefully Brightline West will be a wake up call for CA to show how important trains are and CAHSR makes it to the finish line
@@russelljames5631 Brightline got it done faster though
Brightline started with owning their own track and using near idle ones. The vegas project is running on near empty land and with one big aim, get punters to vegas from LA as fast and as often as possible. LA is not pleading for a better vegas gambling access choice. Same for disneys open arms to get punters to orlando. Texans only want theirs as the current interstate is near gridlock and texans won't expand the road any wider without a near mutiny by its own citizens. Some have even seen a train and watched the cowboy movies with trains. Plus they worry daily about the red/chinese menace laughing as they are passing them.
@@mattlaw5426 again because it’s a much smaller project that isn’t being purposely handicapped by politicians who take money from the auto and oil industry and the private sector.
This would be great for our society! Lets get this done!
why would it be great. You realize that it has too many stops to ever be "High Speed"
@@djc7039 It will still be much more convenient than driving a car. We need it, it’s time to advance our country.
@@georgebruv3955 if we needed it the private sector would already built. This will be the biggest and longest waste in CA history
@@djc7039 Sadly because many in this country still are catering to cars and car infrastructure. California being car centric is what makes it dystopian, people like me who don’t want to drive are stuck. We need more public transportation and finally compete with the rest of the world.
@@georgebruv3955it’s still going to be car centric. What method of transportation do you think the users of this HSR would have to transfer to once they get off the train? CA should’ve invested into city transit instead.
The Crony Express will never pay for itself, even if it actually ever happens.
Ironically, California's and China's high-speed railway projects started in the same year. While China just finished over 45000kms. While California.....
The USA has strict property laws. The CCP can just bulldoze cause they own everything. It was in the video. The longest part was land acquisitions
The power of communism!
Would help a lot if workers were paid chinese wages
I think that I know why China is building more and more high-speed railways: China steals our high-speed railways technologies!
@@Woysla Nothing to do with wages and everything to do with land costs, meager funding and outsourcing wasting said meager funding. Also technical knowhow and experience does not exist here unlike China where they invest i education for the long term and not to make a profit in the next quarter.
"We have one segment that's going to be completed this year" - this is a meaningless statement. It does not mean limited rail service. It means wait until 2030 or as late as 2033 for rail service to begin between Bakersfield and Merced. When will the segment between San Francisco to Merced be ready? When will the segment between Bakersfield and Los Angeles be ready? When will the actual 2:40 minute planned route be fully completed? Between 2045 and 2055 at the absolute earliest. A thirty to forty-year building program. I'm pro-rail but I'm embarrassed as a native Californian at seeing how poorly this has unfolded.
It will be ready when the state decides to commit to actually funding the project. The state has not provided any meaningful amount of money since 2008. Its no wonder nothing gets built; they can't build without having the money!
I recently took the San Joaquins (a train that is somewhere between commuter and long distance rail and runs along much the the California HSR corridor) and it was fairly well populated and an enjoyable experience. I can't imagine how much better it will be when it doesn't take 1½x as long as driving.
there are no high speed train in America .....🚅 due to politics. ( cough lobbying)
the changing economic landscape is now showing less preference to car ownership w/gen z ( rideshare apps) and how people will live and work in the future ie moving back into midtown/ downtown vs the suburbs | remote work.
....now people are listening. because technology has surpassed the 'car owner' narrative. people are on their phones; a 📰newspaper, book or 📱game app is ideal for easing the stress of rush hour.
a bullet train match the 21st century aesthetics . fast convenient and you dont have put your phone down
What areas?
@@mbryson2899 Exactly the same areas that CAHSR will go through. CAHSR is literally just an HSR replacement for the already extremely successful Amtrak San Joquins. It's already the 5th most popular rail line in the country and it only goes as far down as Bakersfield.
@@HeadsUpNorth Lol, the already existing Brightline-style train that CAHSR is replacing has none of those problems. What makes you think that the train that replaces it will?
Also, get a grip. No one is riding this train for free. This was literally in the ballot measure that we passed. Everyone pays full market price, full stop. This is a for-profit system by design. We explicitly traded market prices to avoid having to subsidize fares.
@@HeadsUpNorth It must be terrifying and tiring to live with a mind that makes up TV-style crap like that and mistakes it for real life.
Lived in Taiwan for 14 years before moving to America. High speed rail for a 2 hour drive took 30 min and maybe 25$ ticket. A regular train station was always walking distance to get to any city for skateboarding competitions
The most difficult part of the project is from san Francisco and Los Angeles. Nimbys, environmental groups, city zoning , noise control etc will slow the project even more and futher increase cost
I like how people roll out "Nimbys" when they aren't affected by the outcome.
@Oak Island Pictures Use existing Cal Rail? See the problem? Those aren't HSR sections.
@@weirdshibainu The CAHSR has upgraded the shared Cal Rail tracks. The tracks have had grade separations and improved track added. It is certified to a higher speed, now. So the CAHSR is already helping the people of California.
@@jeffreypierson2064 Is it 200 mph rated?
@Oak Island Pictures I didn't say that....why don't you try watching the video that stated " traveling over 200 miles per hour from San Francisco to Los Angeles in under three hours". I never said it would start out at 220 mpoh..those are your words.
This is just the nature of high-speed rail projects. Here in Germany delays of 5-15 years are nothing unusual. It's worth the wait tho.
Yeah, but your entire defense budget is being subsidized by you know who. That is coming to an end, so is all the extra fat funding projects you've enjoyed. Sorry....
Germany already had the infrastructure around the HSR in place before the HS ICE was built. You can get on a bus or a cab anywhere in Germany and get to a Ubon, a train, or light rail and get to the ICE. California is doing this backwards, you build the HSR last, after the smaller connecting systems. You will have little to no public transportation to get to the HSR, or home after getting off.
@@travisjohn4630 In case you don't remember, europe fought to bloody wars in the 20th century and after then there was a clear political goal of not letting germany rearm too much too fast.
@@johnny_eth So tell me how my comment was inaccurate? I'm not judging the intent or reasons for why things are the way they are, but things are changing, so you'd better get that silly nose out of the past and start looking to the future, things are happening REAL FAST now...
Not in China.
I like these reports and the way they CNBC uses the subheadings in videos to organize the collective information in each section.
If the freight rails used by AMTRAK were to be double railed, so that there's a track coming and going, then LA to SF travel time could be 5 hours; freight delivery would be much faster as well. Presently those freight rails are a single track with lots of side-rails used to offload an oncoming train from the tracks; trains are playing leap-frog with an average travel speed of 30mph when the system is moderately busy.
I am fairly certain it would not have cost $125B+ to improve the existing line, nor required as much environmental whatnots as building a line from scratch. But...there was obviously money to be made by important people at taxpayer expense to build this...
@@culcune the existing Freight companies have a lot of legal strongholds when it comes to upgrading the existing rail network, and they drag their feet on purpose, because if you force demand on your own network, you can charge whatever you want for others to use it. As always, money is the root of this evil.
So from LA to SF its 500Miles right ? to get there in 5 hours you would have to travel at 100Miles/h. Do the existing tracks make that ? Probably no, so you would rebuild the entire line anyway, then you electrify it, and get a decent rail line for regional travel. Sorry freight trains wont go at 160km/h, good idea in general, but the state would build a high speed line at some point anyway to connect major cities.
@@apolloaerospace7773 It's not 500 miles it's 383 miles by highway. So an Amtrak train going 76 MPH could do it in 5 hours.
@@jn4kp1 It's true, US trains are very slow and hardly anyone rides them because everyone needs a car anyway when they reach their destination and gas and cars are incredibly cheap compared to Europe so there's hardly any situation where you would want to take a train instead. This is partly because a LOT of US infrastructure was built between 1910 and 1950 when travel by wagon or car was just emerging, whereas much of Europe was built either for foot travel in medieval times (no parking) or was rebuilt after the war in the 50s-70s when the technology to install high speed rail existed.
The future of the US is decently bright compared to the rest of the world. When the US stops being the eminent global superpower providing the world's security, countries like Spain where the average age is 45 years are going to have a hard time suddenly providing their own military security. The ability to commute quickly was important for a short period of time but the majority of clerical work can now be done remotely which also greatly reduces the need for service sector jobs (restaurants and hotels) clustered in metropolitan areas, so the need to commute long distances at all is going to be severely reduced in the coming years. So I don't think the US is terribly hurt by not having this infrastructure although there are some instances when it would be nice. The kinds of jobs that will thrive in the post-metropolitan era are going to be jobs that come to the customer in the customers own house, i.e traveling and telecommuting doctors, traveling nurses, food delivery, traveling veterinarian, traveling mechanic. All of these are going to work better using cars than by train.
Great project. Bring it on. Europe, Japan, China and even now India is leaving us in the dust in terms of high speed rail.
True.
India planned to start their HSR in 2024.
This has been obviously pushed backed a lot now.
But still far from the mess of California HSR.
blame typical US bureaucracy
As an Indian i won't say that, Indian HSR will take a lot of time
High speed rail isnt profitable in any of those countries
@@chiquita683 neither are highways
It'll be worth it, living in a few continents. I miss the infrastructure in Europe and Asia, but instead of leaving again we need to support projects like this. Being able to travel from SF to LA over the weekend without the hassle of TSA or traffic is going to be great. I'm sure sports fans will enjoy the project as well.
... F any sports fan wanting govt to pay for their train for vacation. When did vacation trains become a left goal. Left use to fund city buses, now they whine about trains for rich vacationers !
@albertoalvarez. I am with you. On the weekend you can take a ride to from LA to SF or another way around. if you can afford for a $1k game ticket, but can't afford for a $200 room, just do a 1 day trip
Why build a high speed train when cyber taxis and ride hailing can bring you point to point on-demand? With all the public funds into this project, we could provide ride hailing subsidies with much better customer experience. For faster travel, just make the airport experience smoother with better trusted traveler access. The real problem is ideology and too many govt agencies and hangers-on on the take of these huge infrastructure projects.
How does one get from SoCal to san francisco without a car, hmm?
Many people in countries with huge rail networks have all said, these are built more for future generations than the current, and that’s okay and needed. We have to think about the future and not just in the moment for the quickest solution.
Vote Republicans out and that will change. They literally turn down anything popular for Americans and their use.
The issue is americans dont think like this anymore. We're hounded by propaganda from conservatives that any project like this is a massive waste of money and that people need to provide for themselves. Folks need to pull themselves up by their boot straps and do this on their own. It's so, so sad and it's responsible for this massive divide between urban and rural people in this country. Rural people think urban folks want to spend massive amounts of money on nothing, while urban folks acknowledge issues and are willing to spend money to fix the issues. America is so divided because of battling ideologies that basically boil down to conservatives pushing "everyone for themselves" until it affects them.
@@CRneu we are tens of trillions of dollars in debt, and we have governments that are bankrupt across the entire country. I don't blame conservatives for thinking this way, especially when politicians constantly LIE about their goals/intentions. If you want to say you are building for the future, go for it. But don't lie about how the future is now, and that everything will come to fruition in less than 5 years just so you can get more money for you to pocket when the project inevitably fails.
Yep, the US needs to catch up to the rest of the world. We don’t want a future where Japan will have levitating trains & Americans will be stick in electric cars on 1960s freeways waiting 90 minutes to move 1 mile 😅
thats like your dad saying "this is for the next 5 christmases"
It’s good that the state don’t forget about Central Valley, because like the person said we are almost 4 million people, full of hard working persons that works on agriculture and oilfields to support the state and country!
but how dense is the population and how frequent is the individual transport. i am guessing there is a lot more traffic between SF to South bay, than in the central valley. if you are starting with a leg to prove the projects usefulness, I would have started from SF or from LA
I am still surprised how long it’s taking to build this. In China they could have the same route built in less than 2 years easily
Yeah, coz in China, the communist party would simply send the cops into the communities along the rail line and run them out of town. Do you mind if I push your house over with this bulldozer? No? Oh well...
California approved this 15 years ago. What happened? Even Morocco and Indonesia have operating high speed railway now. The US political system simply will not allow anything largescale to get done. Had the current political landscape been the reality in 1950, the Interstate highway system would never have been built either. The only time the US was able to do great things was when there was genuine sense of collectivism from the FDR era until the 1980s. Once this window was passed, it reverted back to 19th century every man for himself. Yet, rather than retreat its ridiculous position, politicians continue to promote hyper-individualism domestically and internationally, when what is needed is reversion back to more collectivism, so the US (and other Western societies) can get things done again like it is possible in China and several Arab countries.
I love to see the pride these workers have in the thing they're building, and how projects like these create well paying jobs that allow people to live the lives they want to live. It's just one small part of why this is so good, but it makes me happy to see it, and I'd love to see more of it.
Those jobs are funded by debt and ultimately burden the taxpayer. These projects need to have a plan to managing costs.
@@mattahmann We approved this project in a referendum during the financial crisis specifically so that it creates jobs! China also built their HSR network to create jobs. Obviously there are transportation advantages and that is the main focus of these projects, but the jobs that are created in this country, in our communities are not to be ignored! These are important projects.
This is also how and why we built the interstate highway network and the Golden Gate bridge!
@@TohaBgood2 the problem with stimulating the economy with these projects is that they have to increase tax revenues as a result. China is a completely different beast since there's no regulations and the government can move quickly.
California needs to strengthen the economy by connecting SF to LA. Right now it's a train to no where that doesn't make sense for very many people to take. If they can complete the project, it would be amazing. Seems like there's too many regulations and red tape that eat up funding.
@@mattahmann Nonsense. 6.5 million Californians live in the Central Valley. 4.2 million people live just in the metros that have stops on the route. Fresno and Bakersfield have a million people each in their respective metros. They're also the fastest growing metros in the state. There will be a cross-platform transfer at Merced to Bay Area and Sac local trains. That's a region with 12 more million people!
This whole idea that the Central Valley is "nowhere" is complete $%%hit. If the Central Valley is nowhere then what about the much smaller Las Vegas metro? or Austin? or Portland? or Miami? or Orlando? Also, nowhere? Then what isn't "nowhere"?!
I understand that we have not one but two world famous metros in the state, with massive mindshare in world culture. But you can't nullify literal tens of millions of Californians like that just because they don't live in the two famous regions! We don't do that in this state!
I'm from the Bay Area, btw. And I want the Central Valley to get the exact same treatment that we do!
@@TohaBgood2 Well said.
Did she just say that by next year they will be able to "start planning" how to lay the track system? It's a train, that seems like it should have been one of the first things planned. This isn't ground breaking technology folks.
5:09
That jumped out to me too.
She means they'll start putting RFQs out for signaling and rolling stock. Putting rails down is pretty much the easiest, most known quantity. The hardest is planning and building the right-of-way.
Train switching, safety systems, signaling, track and ballast, and other considerations are well down the time-line. First determine routing, then do environmental reviews, get feedback from citizens and local governments, finalize route, design grade separations (overpasses and underpasses), buy the property, relocate utilities that cross or sit in the design paths, design the rest of the rail beds, put out the construction bids, accept the best bids, monitor the construction, and that is where we are now. Now as the construction is finishing some of the grade separation work, it is time to do the actual track design, so that the bids on the track system can be let. If it had been done before now, it most likely would have to have been changed, because of one of the previous steps.
Lol,
I would 100% ride the train. I just hope the politicians don't mess it up for the rest of us.
Why would use something that takes at least 3 hours when the plane only takes an hour?
If I'm sitting in an airplane at 1200 noon, and you're sitting in the HSR at 1200 noon, I will reach Los Angeles at 1 pm. You will be just barely getting to Merced.
@@neutrino78x your going to arrive at the airport 1 hour early go through security baggage a whole lot of other things
@@micah6635
"your going to arrive at the airport 1 hour early "
Nah, 30-45 minutes early. Same for HSR. People on tripadvisor forums say you should get to the HSR station 30 minutes prior as well, to make sure you have time to get on the right train.
We're talking about going from SF to LA here, so people generally don't have a lot of baggage. I just have my backpack and sometimes a secondary bag that goes in the overhead bin. And I have "clear" so security is a five minute thing.
Personally I have arrived at SJC airport 20 minutes before takeoff (boarding had already begun) and I got on the plane just fine. I would say 30 minutes is probably better. You definitely don't need to get there hours early.
I can see on the east coast or in Europe, the airport might be further away from the city, but here in San Jose the airport is literally so close there is a height limitation on buildings. Public transit can get you there in about 20 minutes. For SFO, Bay Area Rapid Transit can get you from downtown to the airport in 30 minutes, same for Burbank airport and downtown Los Angeles.
In any case if the train is taking three times longer these considerations don't really count. If the train was still under two hours then yes. But 3 or 4 hours, that's too long when the plane is only one hour.
@@neutrino78x it's much easier to get on a train rather than a plane. it's also more environmentally friendly and cheaper
@@neutrino78xtrains are much more convenient. Japan has a high rail network that connects every major city, and they don’t need an airplane to accomplish it.
How about some high speed highways!
Thank you! Lol
Inefficient asf
@@ASutt23 cool opinion, the Germans are more efficient than you and they have em.
@@cRUIZcontrolFPV “more efficient than you?” Doesn’t make any sense
Germany also had great high speed rail
I hope I get to see this project completed in my lifetime. It would be cool to buy a house in the Central Valley where it’s much cheaper and then take the HSR and work in the Bay Area. It would level out housing prices in California since people would flock to the Central Valley, not to mention the environmental benefits. We need this. Asap.
You made an excellent point in regards to housing. I have a couple of brothers who work in the Bay Area but have to drive three hours a day given where they live. A LOT of people in that area do that. There's little doubt this is going to create communities around the line.
Or just increase prices as people move to were you are for the same reason lower cost housing
"It would be cool to buy a house in the Central Valley where it’s much cheaper and then take the HSR and work in the Bay Area. "
This is California we are talking about. If HSR was available then prices would skyrocket in the central valley. PLUS high speed rail prices would also skyrocket.
@@rael5469 exactly, how stupid are these people😂😂😂
I thought this generation of tik tok has it good. Next generation got it better.
The first segment of 119 miles will be done 25 years after it started (assuming no more delays). And they plan for 800 miles in all? At this rate it will be 175+ years before its all finished. Also take into consideration all of the regulatory red tape with CEQA, Cal EPA, the "impact studies", paralysis by analysis which California government is known for, and lawsuits galore, the price tag will exceed $500,000,000,000 before it is all said and done.
Most of that is already done. CAHSR is environmentally clearing each segment with California and the federal government before construction. The Anaheim to SF section is totally environmentally cleared, with the exception of the tunnels, which still need to determine final route.
I agree, the raill project should have begun from the big cities. If it began from San Francisco (which already has a station built and waiting to be used) you would have had immediate strong ridership with a population already quite used to using transit. The highest percentage of car-less people in all of CA is in San Francisco.
Not so fast: immediately? The city [SF] is a mess. I'll tell you what will be immediate: crime and homeless psychotics using it as a public urinal.
But they have to dig a tunnel to get through the mountains next to San Fran if they want it straight enough for a high speed route. Expensive af! Oh and they have to tunnel through parts of the grapevine mountains to actually reach LA
San Francisco is dead bruh. LA still makes sense. But why invest in a sinking city that people are leaving behind in droves?
@@megalith You clearly know little about SF.
@@megalitha metro area population of 4.6 billion and it's dead huh? Your head must be in the clouds. Or buried in the sand lmao
I've ridden the high-speed train in South Korea many times. You don't have to travel as far to get to the main train station compared to the airport. No security lines of course; pretty much no downtime at the train station; no bag limits nor fees; no lines to board the train; and a strong cell connection throughout the entire journey. ANNND is rarely ever axed due to extreme weather. Whereas planes are regularly canceled during the typhoon (hurricane) and blizzard seasons. My dad stupidly booked the two of us on a flight from Seoul to Busan once, got canceled because of a strong storm. On top of that, in the respective train stations of Seoul and Busan, there are way more connections to the final destinations. Seoul Station alone has four subway lines and more than five commuter rail transfer options.
When highway/freeway projects go over budget and are delayed, which they do all the time. It’s rare to hear complaints from the media and people. But when a project that does not directly benefit cars is over budget and delayed all you hear is “it’s a waste of money and time”.
Originally CA partnered with SNCF, the French group that operates the TGV. After years of dealing with the state they bailed, claiming CA was too politically dysfunctional so they went and build a high speed rail system in Northern Africa instead - which has been online for like 5 years now.
the state union just want to keep the money, they dont wan to pay any foreigners.
not to mention the french said "Why do you want to build this here where no one is at?" referring to the route
@@bobsmith-wg9fz Yeah SNCF insisted that it go between SF and LA --- which was a bridge too far for the ca gov.
I've always read it as everyone involved expected it to be a disaster and wanted it as far away from them as possible.
they were like " im not paied an off for this" for a company to think that it must have been quit bad
I could smell the cost over runs when they first proposed this idea!
build 10 nuclear power plants or part of a high speed rail line..
like honestly this is terrible value
@@notastone4832 Um, Nuclear power plants were Notorious for vast cost & time over runs. Remember the 1980's?
The very beginning of the video, there was already double-speak. I recall the cost quoted as $30B or maybe even less similar to the interviewer stating '$33B'. Of course, the truth comes out when the woman interviewed stated the double-speak of something along the lines of, 'Oh, that was just a portion...' and then goes on to say, 'Just to be clear, we never had the full funding...'
@@culcune Yeah, we used to play those games on my programs when I was a project manager.
There's all kinds of numbers that can get sliced & diced in all sorts of ways. "Construction Cost", then there's add on's = Utilities, Inspection, Design, Planning, Rights of Way, Financing/Bonding, inflation/escalation, contingencies (I could write a book about the various sorts of "contingencies"), yata yata.
Then, yeah, what exactly is the "scope" of the "program" you are managing? On my sorts of smaller jobs, it was a baffling ordeal to keep track of what was in/out of various complicated programs, like a new 22 gate 2 concourse airport terminal, a 75 acre rail maintenance & storage facility (those were my 2 biggest jobs).
For 1 example: A new airport fueling facility & maintenance garage for airport maintainers had to be built because our new terminal complex displaced those 2 existing facilities (which were old & obsolete anyhow). We got pilloried all the time for not including them in the budget, but we argued that new facilities were needed anyhow, & thus separate funding sources were applied for. YMMV . . .
@@sideshowbob The mafia used to do this in those cities it dominated, but California was pretty good about keeping them out. Instead of the mafia, however, friends of politicians, and I am sure politicians themselves, get rich off these projects. In fact, I recall Diane Feinstein's husband getting a large contract from a section of this project.
The US is only 50 years behind Europe on high-speed rail. By the time we actually have high speed rail it will be 100 years behind. Meanwhile these high Teck executives and I do not mean the actual construction workers are making big salaries which they have for 50 years.
It just blow my mind that my country Indonesia will open a 350kph High Speed Line in a few mouth left, while the US maybe still need a decade to complete CHSR or Brightline west.
Terrain and miles (km) of how far the train commutes are a big factor in why it takes so long. America is a big country and California alone is bigger then a lot of countries.
Even india
@@Truth-of-the-matter If I'm not wrong, the Laos-China HSR Railway traverses mountainous terrains and valleys, and it was still completed not in 15 years or more (note my sarcasm).
HSR problems are the same, no matter where they are. People just don't have any information what is being done in Indonesia is tremendous
You just don't get the level of corruption of the US. It's beyond anywhere else in the world. Everyone has to get their cut and also they don't care about the finished product. It's in their interest of the longer it's in development , the more of a cut they will get. That's why this project will never finish. The US corruption will collapse the US.
Being in Taiwan for many trips, and utilizing that high speed train (215mph) I can attest to the use and ease it will bring. Taiwan's HSR is about 2/3 the length of the whole proposed LA to San Fran.... I wish this would get built sooner than later. I really think people that do not understand fully and/or have never used the HSR in Taiwan, and Europe for that matter, knows exactly what it would bring to CA and USA.. adding here, just think about that people can live in Fresno, Madera and commute to San Fran in 1.5 hours... Also, people living in Bakersfield, Palmdale can commute to LA in 1 hour or less.... I for one would probably choose to live in that MUCH cheaper area and commute on a train 2 - 2.5 hours each day.
Although it won't be cheap for long since everyone will do the same.
Yeah, it's sad that the US is so far behind in high speed rail. It's embarrassing.
@@sethaldrich6902 it would spread out the high housing prices. My guess is cities like SF would see a decrease in demand for this very reason and home price decrease would follow, while prices in the central valley will go up as more people realize they can commute using hsr. Ideally it will decrease the discrepancy in prices between major cities vs smaller cities/rural areas.
not sure why would anyone want to commute 2 hours to anywhere... why a lot of people moving to smaller cities live right by where they work and on the cheap.
@@TheGrape1234 Bingo, that's exactly what the landlords and elite class don't want! Including the city administration in general. Think about it with a mobile workforce the chances of jobs including big corporates moving out of the cities like NY, SF and LA would become a thing very soon (And it has started already with many moving to TX). Big No no no for the shady Mr. Grey's living upstairs.. they rather hope to cage everyone to these cities forever staying over dependant on the services within than move back.
15 years in the making with not a single mile being done!
The first segment will unironically help keep me and my girlfriend together. We have a strong relationship but living so far apart puts a big strain on things and the California high speed rail, a project started before I was old enough to make myself a sandwich, is going to close that distance in a big way whenever that first segment gets done.
Imagine sitting in traffic under this bridge and seeing a train whiz by at 100+ MPH. I'd choose the train every time!
I drive through there all the time. At 80mph. There’s almost never traffic on the 99.
Only if the train went to where you needed to go.
Imagine sitting in a plane at 400 miles an hour flying over the train slugging along at 100 mph
@@weirdshibainu the train going at 200 or so mph. Imagine sitting in the airport as you see a train fly by at 200 mph while you sit waiting for your plane for an hour or more.
@@weirdshibainu HSR has been proven to be faster than overall airline travel for distances of 600 miles or less. HSR is effective even beyond that considering studies have shown people prefer the higher comfort offered by rail than the that of short-haul airline travel.
The guy hit the nail on the head when he said the project should have started in SF or LA so lots of people could start riding it. This project has to be financially viable and without riders it won’t be.
just like all the other non-used public transit systems in california- it wouldn't make any difference where it starts
@@tommurphy4307 Right now in the city of LA people don't ride the subway because it doesn't connect to many of the most densely populated areas. It's useless, dirty, and slow.
Because it was a scam to funnel taxpayer dollars into the pockets of contractors. Californians are so gullible.
Exactly, China right now has a ton of Zombie train stations because no one is riding the trains since they are premium and expensive
Exactly, why would I catch this train from Fresno to Merced?? I guess if I'm a UC merced student or need some herb. 😂😅😂😅