Shad is right about it being a Warbow here is a statement from Tolkien himself about Legolas "He was tall as a young tree, lithe, immensely strong, able swiftly to draw a great war-bow and shoot down a Nazgul, endowed with the tremendous vitality of Elvish bodies, so hard and resistant to hurt that he went only in light shoes over rock or through snow, the most tireless of all the Fellowship"
Tolkien Elves are my favorite type. People treat modern Elves like wispy bitches you could blow on and disintegrate. Tolkien Elves are power houses and extremely tough to bring down.
Legolas was using the Bow of Lothlorien which was given to him by Galadriel, and Tolkien even states that the bow was stronger and more powerful than the bow he carried from Mirkwood. It was an Elven Warbow.
Yes. In my reckoning, he left Mirkwood with a hunting bow since he was just traveling without knowledge of the Ring. Once in Lothlorien, he got a proper warbow.
@@SpiritualHypertrophy not sure if it would be a hunting bow as the goblins or the like in the mountains between mirkwood & riverdale were starting to move again by this point were they not? i could be wrong of course, its been years since i read the books after all.
@@blackdeath4eternity "Riverdale" /eye twitch But yes, the goblins of the Misty Mountains were on the move and travel was generally considered unsafe by that time. I can't really guess what type of bow Legolas would have left Mirkwood with (I could see either kind being plausible) but I would guess the Galadhrim bow he was given later on would be a in the lower ranges of war bows--like 80-ish pounds? That part just makes sense to me as Galadriel knew he'd be facing battles and would need a strong bow, but also a super-heavy bow isn't necessarily practical for someone who's going to be on the move as much and for as long as the Fellowship was.
Tolkien was obviously influenced by the idea that the English longbow developed from the shortbow. That theory is only defended by a few scholars today. However, shorter yew bows did exist, and they tend to have a shorter draw length. Draw length is as important as draw weight for bow strength.
So glad that Kramer could finally join you guys on set. I hope to see you guys work together more...and yeah a 5 hour long debate on LoTR is accurate...don't ask me how I know.
@@commissardale Kramer runs his own channel (Living Anachronism?) but has been collaborating with Shad and the guys over the last half a year-ish on a number of videos. Mainly Kramer helped out with how adventurers could sleep safely in the wild in the video about cloak tents. He's also had small cameos in the adventure cooking, chopping a tree with a sword, Epic Adventure Quests, and now this.
I remember in the second Narnia movie, during the castle night battle, Susan THROWS an arrow instead of shooting it, and it impales an armored Talmorian soldier. You guys should test THROWING arrows
If you throw hem like a no spin knife and push the shaft with your pointer finger, you can stick a field point from like a yard. Maybe a yard and a half.
It’s easy (and undoubtedly incorrect) to think of arrows as smaller javelins. While a thrown arrow wouldn’t hit with as much force as a javelin due to its lower mass, it’s not that hard to imagine. Cue the much more knowledgeable enthusiasts who will enumerate the reasons why you can’t throw an arrow like a javelin… any minute now…
@@paulchapman8023 Actually, you can throw arrows. Not directly, not with the same kind of power as a javelin. But there's a technique with a leather thong that supposedly lets you throw arrows with nearly the force of a lightweight bow and achieve 200-300 foot distance. I've always wanted to try it but never had access to a good shooting field for it. Also the reason I stopped practicing with my bow.
The constant Shad smack talking from off camera is amazing. Also great to see Kramer physically with the crew. His knowledge and personality mixes so well with every one.
Kramer casually walking into the group might just make this my favorite Shadiversity video ever. That's quite the miles it took him to get there, love that you were able to make it happen.
Keep in mind you are stabbing a stationary target but Legolas stabs a charging target so he has to put much less force into the thrust and need only maintain grip to prevent slipping, the enemy impales itself.
Actually erroneous, he needs to resist the force applied to the arrow by the charging enemy otherwise it would just push it out of his hand. He needs the exact same strength to penetrate wether or not an enemy is charging. Its physics.
correct but incorrect as the other comments have stated BUT something to consider is i highly doubt legolas's arrows would be abused to the point of shads & likely would be extremely sharp meaning less force would be needed.
Fun fact: the person that was helping Legolas pull his friends up the wall was Arwen before they removed her from the battle entirely. There’s even footage of her in the caves protecting the villagers.
@@88-32 its not misinformation though, its deleted/edited content from the films... its like saying "hey, there's some content that never made it into a game or story", there's no misinformation about that. It may not be what happened in the books, sure, but all movies tend to do that anyways... besides its not at all misinformation to say there's a deleted scene where something happens. It's like mentioning a law that was drafted but never passed is somehow "misinformation" for being brought up... or that the first draft of a movie or book is "misinformation".
I feel like Legolas did the move not because it was a GOOD idea, but because he had already pulled the arrow out and was planning to shoot it, but realized he had an opponent that needed an emergency forever nap in front of him so he used what he had and it worked, then he resumed his regularly scheduled plan.
Yeah Shad has always been annoying with his interpretations of movies. It's like seeing someone use a bayonet and being like, "Why doesn't he just shoot him?"
@@rorschach775Not sure I would call it annoying... Seems' a bit rude. I'd figured that maybe he hadn't realized that or heard that interpretation/ explanation for Anakin's actions, or maybe he did and just forgot about it, either way. I was making a discussion point not a criticism. Shad often uses hyperbole and over exaggeration to make a point, which I don't think is a bad thing in context of a content creator/ youtube video. Dramatization is expected... I'd rather be charitable in my expectations than critical. I find I enjoy more things for what they are that way, rather than imposing my own expected bias on them.
@TheOGWiggle I mean, it's a generous effort, but he built a career on pedantic nonsense and clickbait strawmen. Even his guest is getting annoyed. People like him helped make the internet a swamp by giving every pointless criticism a chance to shine. Your perspective is probably healthier than mine, though. I appreciate the level-headed outlook.
@@rorschach775 I appreciate that this is your thoughts on it. Though if you feel so negatively about it, I wonder why you consume Shads content at all? The two statements you made, "pedantic nonsense..." and "even his guests..." I'd assume you have supporting instances in which you're thinking about. I'd be curious as to what those instances are? More for my own education than as a rebuttal. Separately though, saying "people like him helped make the internet a swamp" I think is overly aggressive. Shad is impassioned about what he does, and there's nothing wrong with disagreeing and voicing that disagreement. I'm not entirely sure what you mean by "pointless criticism a chance to shine" If he felt it was worth responding to that's his prerogative. If you disagree, that's fine but I wouldn't be so critical as to say what he does turns things into a "swamp." It just means you're not his target audience. There's a time and place for everyone to voice their opinions, but we don't all have to agree with those opinions. If you don't that's ok, but there's no need to belittle someone over it. It's better I think (my opinion) to meet them where they are and try to help them see other perspectives, rather than face them head on and fight or be critical and demeaning. This being said. I don't hold your opinions against you, just felt it might be beneficial to point out the difference in approach.
Shad is right! In the official companion book to the movies, The Lord Of The Rings Weapons of Warfare it gives clear detail about the bows which Legolas uses. His Lothlorien bow (which he has during the fight at amon hen) was "68 inches high when strung and could send an arrow 400 yards with great accuracy... There was some quality to the mallorn wood bow that kept its draw at around 150 pounds" it also mentions that the arrows were "about 40 inches long and slightly thinner than the Mirkwood arrows in order to keep the weight down; their green-gold flights were of Turkey feathers which has been trimmed into a diamond shape, their shafts dyed sage green and their long sleeved steel tips were of the mallorn leaf design that ensured maximum wound size and damage. Because of the high poundage, the nocks were reinforced with either bone or a special kind of flint found only in the Silverlode."
It was wonderful that Kramer appeared in the flesh. Elves don't often show themselves to humans these days. Legolas was cream of the crop, elven royalty wielding legendary equipment. What was merely plausible for you was easy for him...
Shads last 5 shots were pretty perfect. Really great video... To me; this is proven. An elf with natural superstrength, the keenest eye for stabbing and aiming and endless hours of muscle memory for knocking; totally possible.
I just had an amusing mental image of Legolas spending hours practicing knocking on doors. I know you really meant “nocking,” but I thought you might enjoy that mental image too.
Im really excited to see y'all doing Legolas shield sliding down the stairs while shooting trick. Easiest recreation I can think is get a sled and go down a hill in the Shadlands trying to shoot while staying standing, might need someone to pull you if it doesnt slide, or wet the grass so it slides better, OH! or roll out some slick water slides, skip the shield and just try to stay standing and get off a couple arrows, all sound fun. I do not expect any of you to remotely succeed at this task but it will be REALLY FUNNY to watch you try lol.
Actually there's very little of that in the Amon Hen fight, Aragorn often goes for the throat or the back of the leg, there are a lot of openings in their ill fitting mass produced armour anyway, and given that it was made so quickly I can believe sometimes it just would fail to deflect blows and you could break bone through it.
Thing you guys aren't considering is the Uruk-hai's running momentum would, yes impale the neck on the arrow more easily but it would also carry forward and knock the arrow out of Legolas's hand. Unless Legolas is so strong he can literally pick up an Uruk with one hand. Which is pretty funny.
The fact that Legoas has literally thousands of years of practice with a bow... SOOOOOO, I feel that he can do whatever technique he wants and be nearly perfect with it. He absolutely can do the warbow draw in terms of strength.
Legolas' original bow was the "Bow of Mirkwood", which was compact and very lightweight. Like Shad said, he gets an upgrade from Galadriel in the form of the "Bow of Galadhrim". It was larger and far more powerful than the Mirkwood Bow.
Now read the books. No but seriously, I read the books before the movies and I can't imagine it any other way, i'm stubborn. I just got new copies of the Hobbit and the Lord of the Rings to go with my original paperbacks from the 90's (actually they were my moms who gave them to me when she moved recently) and i'm thinking about rereading em since it's been a while. I actually got my mom into the books.
22:05 I couldn't help but be distracted from their banter when a bird nailed Nate in the shoulder... so gross when the rain started washing it down his shoulder!
Kramer!!!!! I’ve been waiting for this moment since Shad first promoted Kramer’s channel. That is where I found his work. I appreciate both of these channels a lot. This team up is a treat. You know how little kids get super excited to have a guest to their house and they can barely contain themselves like an excited dog? You know how it’s almost annoying to everyone else who actually lives at the house? Shad is definitely giving off those excited little kid vibes in this video. Shad seems like one of those rare celebrities who gets star struck by people less famous than he is just because he knows and respects the new kid’s work. Got to love those sorts of people.
According to a quote attributed to Tolkien by word of mouth: _"He was tall as a young tree, lithe, immensely strong, able swiftly to draw a great war-bow and shoot down a Nazgûl, endowed with the tremendous vitality of Elvish bodies, so hard and resistant to hurt that he went only in light shoes over rock or through snow, the most tireless of all the Fellowship."_
Even if the Elves aren't naturally stronger, it still stands to reason that Legolas, as old and famed as he is, would have significantly trained every possible movement he would need for drawing a bow from any given angle and on any draw weight within his capabilities. Plus, along with the elven occular precision, they have an equally high degree of precision in their movements. Otherwise they wouldn't be able to move as quietly as they do. Their strength, at minimum, will be from decades of dedicated training with levels of focus far beyond the other races. And even among them, Legolas is lauded as a genius, iirc.
Oh cool. Been looking forward to the vids of Shad, Nate and Tyranth with Kramer. Looking forward to what other vids you make, both here on Shadiversity and over on Living Anachronism.
@@Nurk0m0rath I tend agree, Arrows are like eggs. if you press (or bend in the case of an arrow) in the wrong way they do could snap. if used right are quite durable or they would be using metal or metal core arrows.
I legitimately laughed more during this video than I have at anything that's supposed to be a comedy in years. Kramer there with you guys is a phenomenal addition. Great video guys.
Legolas was an exceptionally strong Elf, but Elves in general were no stronger than Men; they even tended to have less brute physical strength. See Children of Hurin, wherein Turin Turambar is said to have the grace of an Elf and the strength of a Man, and even Elven warriors flee from him in terror.
This only works if we are talking about Numenorians, they were exeptionally strong. But an average elven soldier in the third age would be stronger than the average warrior of Rohan or Gondor.
Still crazy to know, that Danish archer Lars Andersen, got a faster rate of fire than movie Legolas with movie magic :D I know that Lars might not be using a superbow, but neither did Orlando Bloom :O
Mm. I think the core conceit behind that is that modern archery is based on sport archery rather than any actual practical battlefield technique and its just way slower than it needs to be. Drawing only one arrow from the quiver at a time for example cripples the effective fire rate. Lars himself based his technique on artwork of horse archers holding multiple arrows at once, and it turns out that when you don't spend needless time drawing arrows or pulling back to full draw for a nearby target, you can fire really fast.
Yeah, no, Legolas is freakishly strong. He managed to pull up a combined weight of dangling Aragorn and Gimly, all the way up the Hornburg's wall. Both are big boys (+ gear) and Legolas just pulled them up without struggling much. Actually, he did it using the same muscle group he uses for shooting the bows, which means it's a great measure. Aragorn and Gimly each would weight about 100kg (Including weapons, clothes and armour). It means, Legolas comfortably pulled 200kg, which is 440lbs. Heaviest warbow poundage is about 240lbs, which is half of what he casually did by pulling those beefcakes up the wall. Conclusion: Legolas is an absolute unit.
if he was stronger it would be from practicing archery for a long time. and likely not to superhuman levels. though he would be peak to high human and that is not weak by any means.
@@KaiHung-wv3ul stronger yes, but not superhuman or beyond high end human levels. I would also place Aragon and his line in the 'stronger, but not super human'. So legalos and Aragorn are not bench pressing say an elephant or even a large deer by themselves. as archers that enhanced back muscle would give them near or borderline super human levels of poundage though with the right bow.
Dwarves are stronger than humans so no gimli is stronger than boromir elves are about on the same level some are weaker than dwarves some are stronger some are the same but humans are not the strongest race you need only read the first book to find this out
@@KaiHung-wv3ul boromir is not Dunedain Aragon is Dunedain boromir is from Gondor legolas is from mirkwood the hobbits are from Hobbiton and Bree gimli I believe is from the blue mountains so if I may ask what in the fuck are you smoking lad?
One thing that gets me is that the second target is right behind the first target. While making the first target a harder action (or not what with momentum and what not) while the second could be easier since aiming is easier and distance to travel not being that great (transferring power to the bow might suffer idk). Great video, guys 👍🏻👍🏻
Legolas uses 2 bows in the books. I don't think its stated if the first bow is a war bow or just a hunting bow, but the second one is definitely a war bow. He gets the second bow in Lothlorien, and would have been using it in the scene where he stabs and then shoots. As for Legolas' strength; he is incredibly strong. He's shown pulling at least 600lbs up the wall of Helmsdeep with ease in the second movie.
I think Kramer is right that Legolas started with a hunting bow at first. A powerful hunting bow that was likely an 60-80 pound. so even with the hunting bow he is in or bordering on War bow territory. the animals and monsters in middle earth are tough.
"It's raining!" "Sean Bean didn't walk 2 miles up a mountain every day to get to set for us to complain about a little sky moister..." "Also, Kramer's here." "Ok fine, We'll just ignore it."
Kramer raises an interesting point about the strength of elves compared to humans in Lord of the Rings, while elves that reached Valinor seem capable of insane feats of strength, such as Feanor who took a whole troop of balrogs to go down, Fingon who fought the lord of the Balrogs solo (but lost eventually), and Glorfindel (the first) who also soloed a Balrog and killed it (admittedly, at the cost of his own life), but you don't see any feats like that performed by Sylvan elves, and the fact that humans like Turin, Hurin, and Beren were viewed as notable heroes of the wars in Beleriand suggests that they were comparatively quite strong too. Elves=deft/resilient/quick/untiring... strong? depends.
There is only one Glorfindel. The one who died in Gondolin in the First age is the same one who shows up in the Third Age. Unlike Men, who leave the world entirely upon death, Elves are tied to Arda and when they are killed their spirits are called to the Halls of Mandos* to heal their trauma before being reembodied. Glorfindel is the only Elf ever to return to Middle Earth after death, sent by the Valar in the Second Age to help against Sauron. IIRC there was an earlier Legolas, though the names were formed from different roots. * I get the impression from Beren and Luthien that Men do spend some time in Mandos' halls, or Luthien would not have been able to plead for Beren's return, but the point of the Gift of Men is they aren't tied to the world in the same way as Elves and the Ainur who entered into Eä are.
With the stabby part we have to take into consideration that a heavy weight champion wrestler sized uruk runs into the arrow at full speed. So you don't need much stabbing power I think, just good aim to find a soft spot
So, I rewatched, and he's actually grasping over the Fletching when he stabs. The Urukai runs into it, with the arrow going into its mouth from the look of it. He then draws it out white knocking at the same time, saving some time. Also, looking at it, I'm pretty sure it's a Hunting Bow. It makes sense considering Elves are super human, he wouldnt need as heavy a draw.
The heavier the draw, the harder it is to draw the bow at all. A lighter draw for Legolas would make his bow weaker than a human one, even if he was stronger, because the power of a bow is governed by the max draw weight it has. Higher, more power, but harder to use. If he tried to overdraw a bow with a lower weight to get more impact out of it, it'd just snap considering the strength of em.
It could be, but I believe it's a matter of a 100ish pound bow being the lower end (relative to normal bows) of an Elven bow, entirely because if they're stronger than a human is by a considerable margin, then what would their actual war bow draw weights be?@@bplatinumpaladin
@@wulfthemountaindragon5432 from what I researched, according to Screen Rant and descriptions from the book, it's a 150 lb draw bow. Meaning not in the realm of impossibility for humans, but still pretty strong.
there was an official movie book that came out around the time of the LotR trilogy called weaponry of middle earth, here is a quote from it "When the Fellowship was forged Legolas carried with him a standard Mirkwood bow, or so it appeared. In appearance it was made of dark wood, carved in the style of Númenorean longbows and fashioned with a pattern of golden leaves. It was thought that Legolas made this bow himself in his youth and was made for firing from within tree canopies. When strung, this bow stood at 60 inches and could easily fire an arrow with great force across a 250-yard reach. The arrows of Mirkwood were stained to match the coloring of the bow and were sturdy. They were 30 inches long and pointed with narrow tips that were designed to pierce both armour and flesh. In Lórien, Legolas was given a bow blessed by the Lady Galadriel; it was carved from a single piece of mallorn heartwood. This bow was paler than his other, and was carved so it appeared to have leaves and vines climbing over it. When the Lorien bow was strung it measured 68 inches and could send an arrow 400 yards with great accuracy. The string of this bow was rumored to contain a single strand of the Lady Galadriel’s hair. The arrows of Lórien were 40 inches long and thinner in make than the Mirkwood arrows. The arrows were dyed green and their tips were crafted into the shape of the mallorn leaves, which greatly increased the damage inflicted on a target. The Lórien quiver was crafted from wood and covered with leather and was crafted with the design of a peacock. This quiver held two dozen arrows and was belted across Legolas’ shoulders and torso ensuring that it did not move during travelling or battle." The main thing is that evles have insane levels of accuracy, poise and strength and Legolas as a paragon of elves racial characteristics would be aware of things like small variation in angle and relative movement of Legolas, the arrow and the target.
They will meat and he Kramer will be like "I'll be right behind you, just need to responsibly put out this fire" and they will tell him to go right at the next crossroads but he will go "the other right".
@@babilon6097What's gonna happen is Tyranth is going to be juxtaposed to the whole group, tell Kramer to go right at the crossroad, but Tyranths right is actually Kramers left.
Hunting bow, like you said, Shad, in the archery in the trees video, that it is incredibly hard to fire in different positions from the usually stance leaning forward. Even though legolas has semi superstrength the way he uses it does not scream warbow user. Even when Joe Gibbs uses much lighter weight bows he does the classic warbow stance. And hunting bows are just better in the wild, as the Comanches show us.
Hunting bow: 50 pounds or heavier. War bow: 100 pounds or heavier. Its easier for my enemies to get a gun than it is for me to get a gun bow: 150 pounds or heavier.
> Even when Joe Gibbs uses much lighter weight bows he does the classic warbow stance. Wouldn't that just how be he's trained though? That stance is what's he's practiced more than any other so it would be the one he defaults to? No idea who that is, just speculating
@@Koushakur It's also the only really way to pull a heavy bow. And. Even if the bow that legolas uses isn't heavy, he, like any good archer should have practiced more with a much heavier bow. Joe Gibbs is a fantastic Bowyer that makes Maryrose replicas. And in the books, Boromir is the strongest in the Fellowship.
Also, how far away was that goblin Legolas shot when in the mines, in Fellowship?? Wouldn't he need a powerful bow to make the shot and have it be as deadly as it was??
Fingolfin fought Morgoth in 1-on-1 combat and almost won. I think elves have super-human strength, otherwise I'm not sure how he lasted as long as he did.
If I had the money. I would pay for Shad and friends to go to TX just to have fun with guns and film it with DemolitionRanch. Seeing Kramer there... just makes me happy. But putting in so much work as part of your vacation, Here's praying the cost is more then reimbursed.
Hey Shad! Can you try throwing an arrow a short distance to an enemy like Susan from Prince Caspian? It’s blink and you miss it in the final battle but I’m wondering about the realism and battle effectiveness. @Shadiversity
You should consider testing liquid fire hand siphons, though there'd be complications with identifying a formula and a siphon design. Legolas: Elven hunting bow, which is probably about a 150 pound draw, compared to an Elven war bow, which would be pushing 200+ pounds.
I disagree about an elven hunting bow being that heavy. It would blow through the animal at that weight. 40 to 60 pounds is all that is required and more would not be better. If anything an elven hunting bow would be lighter, smaller and more durable than those of human make. Easier to carry long distances and less prone to failure in the field.
@@kennethpryde966 I'd actually say it would have the heavier draw, but elves would have had decades or centuries to know the exact right draw for their bow for the target.
This is probably my favorite video in a while! Can somebody explain why we are expecting that elves would use a lower poundage bow? Didn’t quite get that part. We also have to remember the “life or death” factor. Adrenaline has helped me do some pretty lightning fast stuff in the moment, and I’m not even an athlete. I don’t know if elves have something that passes for adrenaline, but if it does, I’ll bet it’s pretty insane. Might help account for speed, strength and accuracy
I think the idea was that Legolas never needs to penetrate armor, and rarely aims for distant shots as most of the combat is close quarters. Thus, it would be pointless to tire yourself out using a higher-power warbow (for piercing armor) over a hunting bow (lower power, penetrates flesh just fine). Also, Legolas shoots extraordinarily fast, and doesn't often full-draw (in the movies) which is more common for lower-poundage bows due to the muscles you use. ultimately, I'm pretty sure tolkien mentions it being a warbow in the books, or that he was capable of doing it with a warbow at least. So it probably was a warbow, because the elves are incredibly strong.
For clarification....in the movies, Legolas uses two different bows. The first one is the Mirkwood bow, the one we see him using in Moria. And it is considered to be less powerful then the bow he uses for the rest of the movies after arriving in Lothlorien. The bow given to him by Galadriel is described, by Tolkein, as a warbow. And in the movie, we're definitely seeing what looks to be a big sturdy powerful bow. I can understand the arguments of 'well he's firing it super fast, so it must be a lighter bow', but again, its a fantasy setting. You have a figure who has been alive for however many decades/centuries, with a physique that is greater then a normal human being's. I think that, given that condition, it'd be possible for him to do what he does even with a bow that would be considerably heavier and require greater force. Now yes, that is a kind of dumb defense, basically saying 'magic', but to be fair, you're trying to judge the capabilities of a fictional character from a race that doesn't exist in a setting with both creatures and characteristics that have not nor could be found on Earth. Some leeway in judging should be taken into account. That's like saying that technology in Star Wars can't exist because we don't have it. Yeah...we don't have it. YET. Doesn't mean we might not four hundred years from now. I mean heck, three hundred years ago, do you think anyone would think it'd be possible for hundreds of people to fly through the air on a daily basis, to travel beyond the limits of our planet, or that we'd be able to wipe out entire cities with a single weapon?
Considering legolas is above human strength and can do very precise strikes there is relatively little resistance to stab someone in the brain through the nose or eye socket. with some extra power, the arrow could go through the neck between two of the vertebrae severing the spinal cord, which would also be an instant kill shot
Just because you’re not trying to pierce the frontal bone doesn’t mean it’s an easy path to the brain. And even if you could shove an arrow through cranial bones, deformation of the head and shaft of the arrow would be assured. And withdrawing the arrow would not be smooth.
Also to quote Tolkein himself. "In those days Elves and Men were of like stature and strength of body... but Men were more frail, more easily slain by weapon or mischance, and less easily healed; subject to sickness and many ills." HOWEVER. Legolas is battle hardened, and the strength that comes with that absolutely should not be ignored.
Day unknown of asking for a video about the misconceptions of Medieval weddings and how they can be incorporated into stories. Also I want to know what the whole thing about bastard children is and why they were seen as bad.
Kramer is right about Elves not being physically stronger. They are however a bit taller, and a lot more experienced because they live for thousands of years.
@@rockinHurley777 I'm talking about the books and the actual lore not the movies. These are movie scenes. It's like saying elves are great surfers because Legolas and shield scene.
I remember Legolas pulling both Aragorn and Gimli up via a rope during the Battle of/for Helm's Deep after Aragorn and Gimli yeeted onto the bridge to kill (probably) heaps of Uruk Hai and he did it quickly and he did not seem to struggle with it. Given that Legolas looks really lean, I would argue that pulling that off while looking nice and somewhat slender means that Elves either are physically stronger than other races, or their bodies do not grow in (muscle) mass while being well trained.
I'm going to nerd out. So, according the Lord of the Rings Weapons and Warefare book, Legolas' Mirkwood bow was 60 inches when strung and the arrows where 30 inches. The Lorien bow he used for in this scene was 68 inches when strung, had a 150 pound draw, and the arrows where 40 inches long and narrower than the Mirkwood arrows.
Legolas was definitely an Elf Ranger as they protected the borders of both the great woods. The bow he brought from Mirkwood was a warbow, the one from Lóthlorien was a longbow, also equipped with much longer arrows.
The explosion sounds Shad makes verbally only add to his speed and accuracy, which was scientifically proven in this video. The other boys better be paying attention to his superior fighting skills!
Shad is right about it being a Warbow here is a statement from Tolkien himself about Legolas "He was tall as a young tree, lithe, immensely strong, able swiftly to draw a great war-bow and shoot down a Nazgul, endowed with the tremendous vitality of Elvish bodies, so hard and resistant to hurt that he went only in light shoes over rock or through snow, the most tireless of all the Fellowship"
Tolkien Elves are my favorite type. People treat modern Elves like wispy bitches you could blow on and disintegrate. Tolkien Elves are power houses and extremely tough to bring down.
Is that the mirk wood bow, or the Lothlorien bow?
@@zetsumeimaru Well the latter bow is of stronger make than the former but I think Tolkien meant generally here
100% Legolas is using a War bow!
Yeah, elf sarcomeres are built different.
Legolas was using the Bow of Lothlorien which was given to him by Galadriel, and Tolkien even states that the bow was stronger and more powerful than the bow he carried from Mirkwood. It was an Elven Warbow.
Yes. In my reckoning, he left Mirkwood with a hunting bow since he was just traveling without knowledge of the Ring. Once in Lothlorien, he got a proper warbow.
@@SpiritualHypertrophy not sure if it would be a hunting bow as the goblins or the like in the mountains between mirkwood & riverdale were starting to move again by this point were they not? i could be wrong of course, its been years since i read the books after all.
@@blackdeath4eternity "Riverdale" /eye twitch
But yes, the goblins of the Misty Mountains were on the move and travel was generally considered unsafe by that time. I can't really guess what type of bow Legolas would have left Mirkwood with (I could see either kind being plausible) but I would guess the Galadhrim bow he was given later on would be a in the lower ranges of war bows--like 80-ish pounds? That part just makes sense to me as Galadriel knew he'd be facing battles and would need a strong bow, but also a super-heavy bow isn't necessarily practical for someone who's going to be on the move as much and for as long as the Fellowship was.
Lol nerds
Tolkien was obviously influenced by the idea that the English longbow developed from the shortbow. That theory is only defended by a few scholars today. However, shorter yew bows did exist, and they tend to have a shorter draw length. Draw length is as important as draw weight for bow strength.
So glad that Kramer could finally join you guys on set. I hope to see you guys work together more...and yeah a 5 hour long debate on LoTR is accurate...don't ask me how I know.
Who is Kramer? What's the lore here?
@@commissardale Kramer runs his own channel (Living Anachronism?) but has been collaborating with Shad and the guys over the last half a year-ish on a number of videos. Mainly Kramer helped out with how adventurers could sleep safely in the wild in the video about cloak tents. He's also had small cameos in the adventure cooking, chopping a tree with a sword, Epic Adventure Quests, and now this.
@shadowwolf2608 oh ok. I guess I missed those videos.
@@commissardale Kramer does awesome stuff. Worth the sub as far as I am concerned.
@@shadowwolf2608 Don't forget the dodgeroll video.
I remember in the second Narnia movie, during the castle night battle, Susan THROWS an arrow instead of shooting it, and it impales an armored Talmorian soldier.
You guys should test THROWING arrows
That is actually stupid.
If you throw hem like a no spin knife and push the shaft with your pointer finger, you can stick a field point from like a yard. Maybe a yard and a half.
Well, there is an actual throwing arrow called atlatl.
It’s easy (and undoubtedly incorrect) to think of arrows as smaller javelins. While a thrown arrow wouldn’t hit with as much force as a javelin due to its lower mass, it’s not that hard to imagine.
Cue the much more knowledgeable enthusiasts who will enumerate the reasons why you can’t throw an arrow like a javelin… any minute now…
@@paulchapman8023 Actually, you can throw arrows. Not directly, not with the same kind of power as a javelin. But there's a technique with a leather thong that supposedly lets you throw arrows with nearly the force of a lightweight bow and achieve 200-300 foot distance. I've always wanted to try it but never had access to a good shooting field for it. Also the reason I stopped practicing with my bow.
The constant Shad smack talking from off camera is amazing.
Also great to see Kramer physically with the crew. His knowledge and personality mixes so well with every one.
Kramer casually walking into the group might just make this my favorite Shadiversity video ever. That's quite the miles it took him to get there, love that you were able to make it happen.
Also imagine all the great sites he's seeing.
something about him just feels so cheeful 😂 it’s wholesome
Keep in mind you are stabbing a stationary target but Legolas stabs a charging target so he has to put much less force into the thrust and need only maintain grip to prevent slipping, the enemy impales itself.
I dunno man. Facial structures are pretty tough.
Force goes through the arrow shaft either way. To even have a hope you'd want to choke up on the arrow maybe 2 inches back from the end
Actually erroneous, he needs to resist the force applied to the arrow by the charging enemy otherwise it would just push it out of his hand. He needs the exact same strength to penetrate wether or not an enemy is charging. Its physics.
the force is the same, you either push it or push back against it impaling itself.
correct but incorrect as the other comments have stated BUT something to consider is i highly doubt legolas's arrows would be abused to the point of shads & likely would be extremely sharp meaning less force would be needed.
Just the topic alone was a treat. Seeing Kramer is Icing on the cake. Glad to have you all together.
legolas did pull almost by himself (hard to tell, in two towers,helms deep battle) both Aragorn and Gimli up the wall.
Fun fact: the person that was helping Legolas pull his friends up the wall was Arwen before they removed her from the battle entirely. There’s even footage of her in the caves protecting the villagers.
@@Mr.Strickenshe was never suosed to be on the wall helping legolas, stop the missinformation
It doesn't count as misinformation if the movie was diverging from the book... which has happened more than once.
@@V3RTIGO222It does because they removed her for a reason.
@@88-32 its not misinformation though, its deleted/edited content from the films... its like saying "hey, there's some content that never made it into a game or story", there's no misinformation about that. It may not be what happened in the books, sure, but all movies tend to do that anyways... besides its not at all misinformation to say there's a deleted scene where something happens. It's like mentioning a law that was drafted but never passed is somehow "misinformation" for being brought up... or that the first draft of a movie or book is "misinformation".
I feel like Legolas did the move not because it was a GOOD idea, but because he had already pulled the arrow out and was planning to shoot it, but realized he had an opponent that needed an emergency forever nap in front of him so he used what he had and it worked, then he resumed his regularly scheduled plan.
"Emergency forever nap" im stealing that XD
Yeah Shad has always been annoying with his interpretations of movies. It's like seeing someone use a bayonet and being like, "Why doesn't he just shoot him?"
@@rorschach775Not sure I would call it annoying... Seems' a bit rude. I'd figured that maybe he hadn't realized that or heard that interpretation/ explanation for Anakin's actions, or maybe he did and just forgot about it, either way. I was making a discussion point not a criticism. Shad often uses hyperbole and over exaggeration to make a point, which I don't think is a bad thing in context of a content creator/ youtube video. Dramatization is expected... I'd rather be charitable in my expectations than critical. I find I enjoy more things for what they are that way, rather than imposing my own expected bias on them.
@TheOGWiggle I mean, it's a generous effort, but he built a career on pedantic nonsense and clickbait strawmen. Even his guest is getting annoyed. People like him helped make the internet a swamp by giving every pointless criticism a chance to shine. Your perspective is probably healthier than mine, though. I appreciate the level-headed outlook.
@@rorschach775 I appreciate that this is your thoughts on it. Though if you feel so negatively about it, I wonder why you consume Shads content at all? The two statements you made, "pedantic nonsense..." and "even his guests..." I'd assume you have supporting instances in which you're thinking about. I'd be curious as to what those instances are? More for my own education than as a rebuttal. Separately though, saying "people like him helped make the internet a swamp" I think is overly aggressive. Shad is impassioned about what he does, and there's nothing wrong with disagreeing and voicing that disagreement. I'm not entirely sure what you mean by "pointless criticism a chance to shine" If he felt it was worth responding to that's his prerogative. If you disagree, that's fine but I wouldn't be so critical as to say what he does turns things into a "swamp." It just means you're not his target audience. There's a time and place for everyone to voice their opinions, but we don't all have to agree with those opinions. If you don't that's ok, but there's no need to belittle someone over it. It's better I think (my opinion) to meet them where they are and try to help them see other perspectives, rather than face them head on and fight or be critical and demeaning.
This being said. I don't hold your opinions against you, just felt it might be beneficial to point out the difference in approach.
Kramer is an excellent addition to the show. Great episode!
Shad is right! In the official companion book to the movies, The Lord Of The Rings Weapons of Warfare it gives clear detail about the bows which Legolas uses. His Lothlorien bow (which he has during the fight at amon hen) was "68 inches high when strung and could send an arrow 400 yards with great accuracy... There was some quality to the mallorn wood bow that kept its draw at around 150 pounds" it also mentions that the arrows were "about 40 inches long and slightly thinner than the Mirkwood arrows in order to keep the weight down; their green-gold flights were of Turkey feathers which has been trimmed into a diamond shape, their shafts dyed sage green and their long sleeved steel tips were of the mallorn leaf design that ensured maximum wound size and damage. Because of the high poundage, the nocks were reinforced with either bone or a special kind of flint found only in the Silverlode."
It was wonderful that Kramer appeared in the flesh. Elves don't often show themselves to humans these days. Legolas was cream of the crop, elven royalty wielding legendary equipment. What was merely plausible for you was easy for him...
Shads last 5 shots were pretty perfect.
Really great video... To me; this is proven. An elf with natural superstrength, the keenest eye for stabbing and aiming and endless hours of muscle memory for knocking; totally possible.
I just had an amusing mental image of Legolas spending hours practicing knocking on doors.
I know you really meant “nocking,” but I thought you might enjoy that mental image too.
Kramer is a nice addition to the group both here and on the knights watch channel
Im really excited to see y'all doing Legolas shield sliding down the stairs while shooting trick. Easiest recreation I can think is get a sled and go down a hill in the Shadlands trying to shoot while staying standing, might need someone to pull you if it doesnt slide, or wet the grass so it slides better, OH! or roll out some slick water slides, skip the shield and just try to stay standing and get off a couple arrows, all sound fun. I do not expect any of you to remotely succeed at this task but it will be REALLY FUNNY to watch you try lol.
Good idea i hope they see this
I absolutely love the collab! Y'all are amazing. I love you guys!
Judging by how everyone can slice through Uruk 'iron' armor, the uruk has the physical consistency of a light cream cheese anyway.
Actually there's very little of that in the Amon Hen fight, Aragorn often goes for the throat or the back of the leg, there are a lot of openings in their ill fitting mass produced armour anyway, and given that it was made so quickly I can believe sometimes it just would fail to deflect blows and you could break bone through it.
Thing you guys aren't considering is the Uruk-hai's running momentum would, yes impale the neck on the arrow more easily but it would also carry forward and knock the arrow out of Legolas's hand. Unless Legolas is so strong he can literally pick up an Uruk with one hand. Which is pretty funny.
Elves are really very strong in Tolkien world.
While simultaneously light enough to walk on snow.
@@DinoslayMAGIC!!! (and also rule of cool)
@@christophershell7564Tolkien Elves are basically semi-divine although by the third age they have lost much of their power.
That kind of force would destroy the arrow even if Legolas was that strong.
The fact that Legoas has literally thousands of years of practice with a bow... SOOOOOO, I feel that he can do whatever technique he wants and be nearly perfect with it. He absolutely can do the warbow draw in terms of strength.
So Glad Kramer got to be here for this!! Also Legolas is definitely a fighter with 20 dex and sharpshooter!
I think the movie version of him at least would be a Kensei Monk.
Legolas' original bow was the "Bow of Mirkwood", which was compact and very lightweight. Like Shad said, he gets an upgrade from Galadriel in the form of the "Bow of Galadhrim". It was larger and far more powerful than the Mirkwood Bow.
Legolas is busy making toys with the other Elves at the North Pole.
Kramer! So glad that you could make it
This is actually hilarious cause the last video was Tolkien themed and I just wrapped up watching the films myself
Now read the books.
No but seriously, I read the books before the movies and I can't imagine it any other way, i'm stubborn. I just got new copies of the Hobbit and the Lord of the Rings to go with my original paperbacks from the 90's (actually they were my moms who gave them to me when she moved recently) and i'm thinking about rereading em since it's been a while.
I actually got my mom into the books.
The competitiveness is quite fun. Im hoping you guys are able to do some more videos with kramer before he heads back
i love how shad allways makes his own sound effects i bet he made "shwing" sounds playing with sticks as a kid
22:05 I couldn't help but be distracted from their banter when a bird nailed Nate in the shoulder... so gross when the rain started washing it down his shoulder!
Shad. Back quivers aren't for drawing and knocking, they're for carrying extra arrows to reload your side quiver.
They are if you wear it over bow-hand shoulder , as it should
The insert clip of Shad with the spear was amazing 😂
I laughed SO HARD when that arrow snapped. Imagine that actually happening in the movie!
Kramer!!!!! I’ve been waiting for this moment since Shad first promoted Kramer’s channel. That is where I found his work. I appreciate both of these channels a lot. This team up is a treat.
You know how little kids get super excited to have a guest to their house and they can barely contain themselves like an excited dog? You know how it’s almost annoying to everyone else who actually lives at the house?
Shad is definitely giving off those excited little kid vibes in this video.
Shad seems like one of those rare celebrities who gets star struck by people less famous than he is just because he knows and respects the new kid’s work.
Got to love those sorts of people.
According to a quote attributed to Tolkien by word of mouth:
_"He was tall as a young tree, lithe, immensely strong, able swiftly to draw a great war-bow and shoot down a Nazgûl, endowed with the tremendous vitality of Elvish bodies, so hard and resistant to hurt that he went only in light shoes over rock or through snow, the most tireless of all the Fellowship."_
"What was that?"
"That was... Shad Shut up!"
LOL
Glad that the filming went well with Kramer :)
Big fan of the usual trio of Shad, Nate and Tyranth but Kramer fits so well its always great to have him involved specially in person like this.
I would LOVE to see more Lord of the Rings related videos!
I as well.
Friggin Kramer made it down under!?!!!!!! Y'all know the next couple are going to be amazing!!
Great video with Kramer. And is it just me or has Shad's health improved since he visited real castles?
Very nice to see Kramer with you guys!
Even if the Elves aren't naturally stronger, it still stands to reason that Legolas, as old and famed as he is, would have significantly trained every possible movement he would need for drawing a bow from any given angle and on any draw weight within his capabilities. Plus, along with the elven occular precision, they have an equally high degree of precision in their movements. Otherwise they wouldn't be able to move as quietly as they do. Their strength, at minimum, will be from decades of dedicated training with levels of focus far beyond the other races. And even among them, Legolas is lauded as a genius, iirc.
I gasped a bit seeing Kramer walk on screen... I thought he'd been eternally 'lost in the woods'!
Excellent collab!
Legolas can do anything, even jumping while falling
As a Brazilian i can confirm legolas is one of the few non Brazilian who survived here and learned to Double jump
Shad became the raging out of control drunk of the show so gradually, I never even noticed.
It’s always a great joy to see a new Shadiversity video, Ill watch this after my chemistry test
You guys are such dorks but can't stop watching, great stuff.
Oh cool. Been looking forward to the vids of Shad, Nate and Tyranth with Kramer. Looking forward to what other vids you make, both here on Shadiversity and over on Living Anachronism.
Awesome to see Kramer on set with you guys.
He starts off using his own elven arrows. He later replaced them with orc arrows scavenged from various battles
Wouldn't his shots be worse then, most of the orc/uruk weapons were cast and fragile
@@KnightDragon20 Only in the movies. Because hollywood thinks that's how swords are made.
@@Nurk0m0rath I tend agree, Arrows are like eggs. if you press (or bend in the case of an arrow) in the wrong way they do could snap. if used right are quite durable or they would be using metal or metal core arrows.
@@shawn6860 realised something, ent tree wood
@@Nurk0m0rath movie only makes more sense, good catch
I am glad to see Kramer finally found his way to you after getting lost.
Came for a shad vid, stayed for kramer love ❤😂
Love the ninja turtle team you guys make 😉
I legitimately laughed more during this video than I have at anything that's supposed to be a comedy in years. Kramer there with you guys is a phenomenal addition. Great video guys.
Legolas was an exceptionally strong Elf, but Elves in general were no stronger than Men; they even tended to have less brute physical strength. See Children of Hurin, wherein Turin Turambar is said to have the grace of an Elf and the strength of a Man, and even Elven warriors flee from him in terror.
To be fair Turin come from a line of particularly strong men, Hurin (his dad for those who don't know) slayed like 70 trolls in a row by himself.
This only works if we are talking about Numenorians, they were exeptionally strong.
But an average elven soldier in the third age would be stronger than the average warrior of Rohan or Gondor.
This video was awesome, not just for the topic, but the banter and the playfulness of everyone put a big smile on my face.
Still crazy to know, that Danish archer Lars Andersen, got a faster rate of fire than movie Legolas with movie magic :D I know that Lars might not be using a superbow, but neither did Orlando Bloom :O
Mm. I think the core conceit behind that is that modern archery is based on sport archery rather than any actual practical battlefield technique and its just way slower than it needs to be. Drawing only one arrow from the quiver at a time for example cripples the effective fire rate. Lars himself based his technique on artwork of horse archers holding multiple arrows at once, and it turns out that when you don't spend needless time drawing arrows or pulling back to full draw for a nearby target, you can fire really fast.
Love seeing you guys bring Kramer on and do these videos together - thanks - great entertainment AND learning.
Yeah, no, Legolas is freakishly strong. He managed to pull up a combined weight of dangling Aragorn and Gimly, all the way up the Hornburg's wall. Both are big boys (+ gear) and Legolas just pulled them up without struggling much.
Actually, he did it using the same muscle group he uses for shooting the bows, which means it's a great measure. Aragorn and Gimly each would weight about 100kg (Including weapons, clothes and armour).
It means, Legolas comfortably pulled 200kg, which is 440lbs. Heaviest warbow poundage is about 240lbs, which is half of what he casually did by pulling those beefcakes up the wall.
Conclusion: Legolas is an absolute unit.
Dude I thought it was a voice over but then when he walked on screen I was like whaaaaaat!
So great to see Kramer, also I believe elves had average strength seeing as Boromir was physically the strongest member of the fellowship
if he was stronger it would be from practicing archery for a long time. and likely not to superhuman levels. though he would be peak to high human and that is not weak by any means.
He's Dunedain though, so he would already be stronger than normal humans.
@@KaiHung-wv3ul stronger yes, but not superhuman or beyond high end human levels. I would also place Aragon and his line in the 'stronger, but not super human'. So legalos and Aragorn are not bench pressing say an elephant or even a large deer by themselves.
as archers that enhanced back muscle would give them near or borderline super human levels of poundage though with the right bow.
Dwarves are stronger than humans so no gimli is stronger than boromir elves are about on the same level some are weaker than dwarves some are stronger some are the same but humans are not the strongest race you need only read the first book to find this out
@@KaiHung-wv3ul boromir is not Dunedain Aragon is Dunedain boromir is from Gondor legolas is from mirkwood the hobbits are from Hobbiton and Bree gimli I believe is from the blue mountains so if I may ask what in the fuck are you smoking lad?
One thing that gets me is that the second target is right behind the first target. While making the first target a harder action (or not what with momentum and what not) while the second could be easier since aiming is easier and distance to travel not being that great (transferring power to the bow might suffer idk).
Great video, guys 👍🏻👍🏻
"... and then loads it like a Chad on the proper side of the bow and sshoots it!"
^^I see what you did there.
The record scratch and glower is just a delightful masterpiece~
Good to see Kramer finally arrived from is long quest and being with the team
Indeed
My favorite part was when Kramer said "im gonna Krame!" then Kramed all over Boromir.
Legolas uses 2 bows in the books. I don't think its stated if the first bow is a war bow or just a hunting bow, but the second one is definitely a war bow. He gets the second bow in Lothlorien, and would have been using it in the scene where he stabs and then shoots. As for Legolas' strength; he is incredibly strong. He's shown pulling at least 600lbs up the wall of Helmsdeep with ease in the second movie.
I think Kramer is right that Legolas started with a hunting bow at first. A powerful hunting bow that was likely an 60-80 pound. so even with the hunting bow he is in or bordering on War bow territory. the animals and monsters in middle earth are tough.
"It's raining!"
"Sean Bean didn't walk 2 miles up a mountain every day to get to set for us to complain about a little sky moister..."
"Also, Kramer's here."
"Ok fine, We'll just ignore it."
Kramer raises an interesting point about the strength of elves compared to humans in Lord of the Rings, while elves that reached Valinor seem capable of insane feats of strength, such as Feanor who took a whole troop of balrogs to go down, Fingon who fought the lord of the Balrogs solo (but lost eventually), and Glorfindel (the first) who also soloed a Balrog and killed it (admittedly, at the cost of his own life), but you don't see any feats like that performed by Sylvan elves, and the fact that humans like Turin, Hurin, and Beren were viewed as notable heroes of the wars in Beleriand suggests that they were comparatively quite strong too. Elves=deft/resilient/quick/untiring... strong? depends.
There is only one Glorfindel. The one who died in Gondolin in the First age is the same one who shows up in the Third Age. Unlike Men, who leave the world entirely upon death, Elves are tied to Arda and when they are killed their spirits are called to the Halls of Mandos* to heal their trauma before being reembodied. Glorfindel is the only Elf ever to return to Middle Earth after death, sent by the Valar in the Second Age to help against Sauron.
IIRC there was an earlier Legolas, though the names were formed from different roots.
* I get the impression from Beren and Luthien that Men do spend some time in Mandos' halls, or Luthien would not have been able to plead for Beren's return, but the point of the Gift of Men is they aren't tied to the world in the same way as Elves and the Ainur who entered into Eä are.
My god, they actually did it. They memed Kramer so much they actually summoned him in the flesh!
With the stabby part we have to take into consideration that a heavy weight champion wrestler sized uruk runs into the arrow at full speed. So you don't need much stabbing power I think, just good aim to find a soft spot
but how is it a killing blow?
@@rottenhead8385if it’s through the face into the brain there you go
I have done some research, and all of the sources that I can find states that his bow is 150 pounds.
So, I rewatched, and he's actually grasping over the Fletching when he stabs. The Urukai runs into it, with the arrow going into its mouth from the look of it. He then draws it out white knocking at the same time, saving some time.
Also, looking at it, I'm pretty sure it's a Hunting Bow. It makes sense considering Elves are super human, he wouldnt need as heavy a draw.
The heavier the draw, the harder it is to draw the bow at all. A lighter draw for Legolas would make his bow weaker than a human one, even if he was stronger, because the power of a bow is governed by the max draw weight it has. Higher, more power, but harder to use. If he tried to overdraw a bow with a lower weight to get more impact out of it, it'd just snap considering the strength of em.
@@wulfthemountaindragon5432 it may be part of the reason he can fire so quickly in the film. The lower draw. But you do have a point.
It could be, but I believe it's a matter of a 100ish pound bow being the lower end (relative to normal bows) of an Elven bow, entirely because if they're stronger than a human is by a considerable margin, then what would their actual war bow draw weights be?@@bplatinumpaladin
@@wulfthemountaindragon5432 from what I researched, according to Screen Rant and descriptions from the book, it's a 150 lb draw bow. Meaning not in the realm of impossibility for humans, but still pretty strong.
there was an official movie book that came out around the time of the LotR trilogy called weaponry of middle earth, here is a quote from it
"When the Fellowship was forged Legolas carried with him a standard Mirkwood bow, or so it appeared. In appearance it was made of dark wood, carved in the style of Númenorean longbows and fashioned with a pattern of golden leaves. It was thought that Legolas made this bow himself in his youth and was made for firing from within tree canopies. When strung, this bow stood at 60 inches and could easily fire an arrow with great force across a 250-yard reach.
The arrows of Mirkwood were stained to match the coloring of the bow and were sturdy. They were 30 inches long and pointed with narrow tips that were designed to pierce both armour and flesh.
In Lórien, Legolas was given a bow blessed by the Lady Galadriel; it was carved from a single piece of mallorn heartwood. This bow was paler than his other, and was carved so it appeared to have leaves and vines climbing over it. When the Lorien bow was strung it measured 68 inches and could send an arrow 400 yards with great accuracy. The string of this bow was rumored to contain a single strand of the Lady Galadriel’s hair.
The arrows of Lórien were 40 inches long and thinner in make than the Mirkwood arrows. The arrows were dyed green and their tips were crafted into the shape of the mallorn leaves, which greatly increased the damage inflicted on a target. The Lórien quiver was crafted from wood and covered with leather and was crafted with the design of a peacock. This quiver held two dozen arrows and was belted across Legolas’ shoulders and torso ensuring that it did not move during travelling or battle."
The main thing is that evles have insane levels of accuracy, poise and strength and Legolas as a paragon of elves racial characteristics would be aware of things like small variation in angle and relative movement of Legolas, the arrow and the target.
I hope Kramer can stick around for a while...it was getting tiring having you guys searching for him in your adventures and never finding him!
They will meat and he Kramer will be like "I'll be right behind you, just need to responsibly put out this fire" and they will tell him to go right at the next crossroads but he will go "the other right".
@@babilon6097What's gonna happen is Tyranth is going to be juxtaposed to the whole group, tell Kramer to go right at the crossroad, but Tyranths right is actually Kramers left.
The adventurers are united! Welcome Kramer!
Hunting bow, like you said, Shad, in the archery in the trees video, that it is incredibly hard to fire in different positions from the usually stance leaning forward. Even though legolas has semi superstrength the way he uses it does not scream warbow user. Even when Joe Gibbs uses much lighter weight bows he does the classic warbow stance. And hunting bows are just better in the wild, as the Comanches show us.
Hunting bow: 50 pounds or heavier.
War bow: 100 pounds or heavier.
Its easier for my enemies to get a gun than it is for me to get a gun bow: 150 pounds or heavier.
> Even when Joe Gibbs uses much lighter weight bows he does the classic warbow stance.
Wouldn't that just how be he's trained though? That stance is what's he's practiced more than any other so it would be the one he defaults to? No idea who that is, just speculating
@@Koushakur It's also the only really way to pull a heavy bow. And. Even if the bow that legolas uses isn't heavy, he, like any good archer should have practiced more with a much heavier bow. Joe Gibbs is a fantastic Bowyer that makes Maryrose replicas. And in the books, Boromir is the strongest in the Fellowship.
Well that shuts me up
@@sr71silver And the punched through plate armor. Shad also has a great video on that!
Filming in the rain was epic as hecc. Imagine trying to convince your old squires to do that back in the old days. X'D
Also, how far away was that goblin Legolas shot when in the mines, in Fellowship??
Wouldn't he need a powerful bow to make the shot and have it be as deadly as it was??
The introduction of nearby Kramer (if anyone gets that reference we can be friends lol) made me unreasonably happy lol
Fingolfin fought Morgoth in 1-on-1 combat and almost won. I think elves have super-human strength, otherwise I'm not sure how he lasted as long as he did.
If I had the money. I would pay for Shad and friends to go to TX just to have fun with guns and film it with DemolitionRanch. Seeing Kramer there... just makes me happy. But putting in so much work as part of your vacation, Here's praying the cost is more then reimbursed.
I've literally just been on a J.R.R. Tolkien binge and then this drops. LETSGO!
YES!!!!!! Kramer has finally arrived!!! Awesome!
Hey Shad! Can you try throwing an arrow a short distance to an enemy like Susan from Prince Caspian? It’s blink and you miss it in the final battle but I’m wondering about the realism and battle effectiveness. @Shadiversity
She threw it with her right hand into a soldier with one fluid motion
love Shad's sound effects for stabbing Boromir
You should consider testing liquid fire hand siphons, though there'd be complications with identifying a formula and a siphon design.
Legolas: Elven hunting bow, which is probably about a 150 pound draw, compared to an Elven war bow, which would be pushing 200+ pounds.
I disagree about an elven hunting bow being that heavy. It would blow through the animal at that weight. 40 to 60 pounds is all that is required and more would not be better. If anything an elven hunting bow would be lighter, smaller and more durable than those of human make. Easier to carry long distances and less prone to failure in the field.
@@kennethpryde966 I'd actually say it would have the heavier draw, but elves would have had decades or centuries to know the exact right draw for their bow for the target.
So glad to see Kramer join you guys! I hope both the channels continue to grow. Thanks for the great video
This is probably my favorite video in a while! Can somebody explain why we are expecting that elves would use a lower poundage bow? Didn’t quite get that part.
We also have to remember the “life or death” factor. Adrenaline has helped me do some pretty lightning fast stuff in the moment, and I’m not even an athlete. I don’t know if elves have something that passes for adrenaline, but if it does, I’ll bet it’s pretty insane. Might help account for speed, strength and accuracy
I think the idea was that Legolas never needs to penetrate armor, and rarely aims for distant shots as most of the combat is close quarters. Thus, it would be pointless to tire yourself out using a higher-power warbow (for piercing armor) over a hunting bow (lower power, penetrates flesh just fine). Also, Legolas shoots extraordinarily fast, and doesn't often full-draw (in the movies) which is more common for lower-poundage bows due to the muscles you use.
ultimately, I'm pretty sure tolkien mentions it being a warbow in the books, or that he was capable of doing it with a warbow at least. So it probably was a warbow, because the elves are incredibly strong.
For clarification....in the movies, Legolas uses two different bows. The first one is the Mirkwood bow, the one we see him using in Moria. And it is considered to be less powerful then the bow he uses for the rest of the movies after arriving in Lothlorien.
The bow given to him by Galadriel is described, by Tolkein, as a warbow. And in the movie, we're definitely seeing what looks to be a big sturdy powerful bow.
I can understand the arguments of 'well he's firing it super fast, so it must be a lighter bow', but again, its a fantasy setting. You have a figure who has been alive for however many decades/centuries, with a physique that is greater then a normal human being's. I think that, given that condition, it'd be possible for him to do what he does even with a bow that would be considerably heavier and require greater force.
Now yes, that is a kind of dumb defense, basically saying 'magic', but to be fair, you're trying to judge the capabilities of a fictional character from a race that doesn't exist in a setting with both creatures and characteristics that have not nor could be found on Earth. Some leeway in judging should be taken into account.
That's like saying that technology in Star Wars can't exist because we don't have it. Yeah...we don't have it. YET. Doesn't mean we might not four hundred years from now. I mean heck, three hundred years ago, do you think anyone would think it'd be possible for hundreds of people to fly through the air on a daily basis, to travel beyond the limits of our planet, or that we'd be able to wipe out entire cities with a single weapon?
Considering legolas is above human strength and can do very precise strikes there is relatively little resistance to stab someone in the brain through the nose or eye socket. with some extra power, the arrow could go through the neck between two of the vertebrae severing the spinal cord, which would also be an instant kill shot
Just because you’re not trying to pierce the frontal bone doesn’t mean it’s an easy path to the brain. And even if you could shove an arrow through cranial bones, deformation of the head and shaft of the arrow would be assured. And withdrawing the arrow would not be smooth.
Also to quote Tolkein himself. "In those days Elves and Men were of like stature and strength of body... but Men were more frail, more easily slain by weapon or mischance, and less easily healed; subject to sickness and many ills." HOWEVER. Legolas is battle hardened, and the strength that comes with that absolutely should not be ignored.
Are any of you man enough to shoot an arrow through 12 axes like Ulysses?
Shad asserted range combat dominance in this video xD
Great video, horrible weather - Legolas knew what he was doing.
Day unknown of asking for a video about the misconceptions of Medieval weddings and how they can be incorporated into stories.
Also I want to know what the whole thing about bastard children is and why they were seen as bad.
An early bird may get the worm, but if you just skip sleep, you'll also get the worm.
Kramer is right about Elves not being physically stronger. They are however a bit taller, and a lot more experienced because they live for thousands of years.
Legolas swiftly pulls back a great war bow with ease. Yea, he's physically stronger.
@@rockinHurley777 I'm talking about the books and the actual lore not the movies. These are movie scenes. It's like saying elves are great surfers because Legolas and shield scene.
@satana8157 yea that line is in the book aka the lore.
@@rockinHurley777 I don't know what is the argument here. Is there no human that can use a war bow with ease?
I remember Legolas pulling both Aragorn and Gimli up via a rope during the Battle of/for Helm's Deep after Aragorn and Gimli yeeted onto the bridge to kill (probably) heaps of Uruk Hai and he did it quickly and he did not seem to struggle with it.
Given that Legolas looks really lean, I would argue that pulling that off while looking nice and somewhat slender means that Elves either are physically stronger than other races, or their bodies do not grow in (muscle) mass while being well trained.
He's a lotr elf. They are faster and stronger than humans.
I'm going to nerd out. So, according the Lord of the Rings Weapons and Warefare book, Legolas' Mirkwood bow was 60 inches when strung and the arrows where 30 inches.
The Lorien bow he used for in this scene was 68 inches when strung, had a 150 pound draw, and the arrows where 40 inches long and narrower than the Mirkwood arrows.
Legolas was definitely an Elf Ranger as they protected the borders of both the great woods. The bow he brought from Mirkwood was a warbow, the one from Lóthlorien was a longbow, also equipped with much longer arrows.
a 100 lb warbow would be like a hunting bow to an elf...
The explosion sounds Shad makes verbally only add to his speed and accuracy, which was scientifically proven in this video. The other boys better be paying attention to his superior fighting skills!