I always loved how Viren never became a Saturday morning cartoon villain. He never acted evil for the sake of it. He truly believed in this Xadian threat across the border and felt like nobody believed him and that he was perhaps the only one who could stop it. Even if I never believed it, I believed that HE believed it which is the sign of a great villain. Sometimes he failed and sometimes he surprised me, like how he initially was distrustful of Aaravos. He was the hero of his own story and a FANTASTIC character.
Viren's story was definitely very good and tragic at the same time. Plus he's kids Claudia and Soren reminded me of Zuko and Azlua, but actually cared for one another. But like Ozai the fire lord from Avatar, Viren put them on this path and now finding their own way. I'm excited to see what happens next with Soren and Claudia now without their Dad going forward.
Yeah honestly I’ve been a fan of Viren, Soren and Claudia ever since the first season because damn are they the most interesting and 3 dimensional characters in the show. They could’ve even rival The Fire nation Royal Family in mentality and possible tragedy. But unlike Ozai Viren genuinely cared for both Soren and Claudia but sadly similar to Ozai, he saw his kids as tools for power until he died. After his resurrection dude went through a mental therapy trauma session in his mind for the 5th season.
Pretty much. The problem with Callum, Ezran, and Rayla is that they are mostly Flanderized and it's honestly getting kind of old. Season 6 being the first season where Ezran didn't appear in every episode was really to it's benefit, and allowed the few scenes he did have to actually have more weight and purpose to them.
This season actually managed to make me cry three separate times, Viren being the cause of two. That whole scene where he was writing that confession shook me, and at first I was annoyed when he burned it but I understand now. Viren realized that telling Soren would only hurt his son more, and didn’t want his son to feel responsibility or guilt for actions taken to ultimately save his life. So yeah, this season is really good and may be my favourite so far.
You completely misinterpreted Viren in Season 1. He never wanted Harrow to die. After it happened, it was a point of no return so he took advantage of the power vacuum but Harrow was his best friend. When he told Amaya that his death broke his heart, he was sincere but he was trying to take Katolis forwards instead of dwelling in the past. Viren would stab A LOT of people in the back, but Harrow was one of the very rare exceptions. We also see Viren's good intentions in the flashback to Aanya's mothers' battle with Avizandum. Unlike with Harrow, Viren had no personal investment in the Queens' wellbeing but when he had time to flee, he turned back and attacked Avizandum himself to try and give them a fighting chance. He could have very easily been killed as Avizandum had wiped out entire armies single-handedly in the past, but Viren risked his life for 2 women who were basically strangers.
I would add that Viren offered the throne to Amaya. It's a huge sign of good faith. I don't like the idea that his death was the only time he was being selfless which is supposedly why it's his redemption, because he's actually a very self-sacrificing character. It's even the reason why he spiraled down in the first place. Disfiguring himself to save Soren, searching a solution so no one had to starve while Harrow and Sarai were opened to the idea to let everyone die, going back to save the queens of Duren whom he did not know, trying to die to save Harrow, risking a death sentence for treason, giving himself away to worse-than-death Aaravos and letting him manipulate his body in increasingly gross ways.
@@madeleinedartois4689 Granted, Viren was hoping to use Amaya as a kind of puppet Queen. He wasn't being entirely selfless, he just knew that seizing direct power wasn't going to work while Harrow still had viable successors. But you're right about Viren's willingness to sacrifice himself to achieve what he believed to be the ultimate good. My favourite example is when the Queens of Duren are distracting Avizandum. Viren could have easily fled with Harrow, Sarai and the others but he turned back and attacked Avizandum himself in an attempt to give the Queens, who were essentially strangers, a fighting chance. Viren's problem was that he was trying to plan too far ahead instead of focussing on what he should be doing in the here and now. Unlike Aaravos, he didn't have thousands of years of experience behind him and he also didn't have a Star Touched Elf's near godlike omniscience. His vision was far less mature and refined. Aaravos always knew when to take advantage of an opportunity that was right in front of him, planning for the future but also being able to relax and go with the flow in the moment because he was, for all intents and purposes, a god. Viren was so worried about the future that he couldn't focus on what he was doing in the moment because he was trying to control everything. Perhaps this was partially a result of that reckless decision he made to try and help the Queens, which was not only fruitless as they were essentially cannon fodder for Avizandum but ended up getting Sarai killed as well. Viren was traumatized by that - one of the few times he showed vulnerability in Season 1 was at Sarai's grave - so he tried to be more calculating and careful but he was getting so focussed on controlling the future that he kept making increasingly immoral decisions in the moment. Obi-Wan Kenobi and Qui-Gon Jinn sum up this mindset beautifully in The Phantom Menace. Obi-Wan: "I should be mindful of the future." Qui-Gon: "But not at the expense of the moment."
Tragically, it's not really anybody's 'fault' so to speak. Claudia was traumatized after her mother left and keeping her loved ones together is all that matters. Even if she sees Viren replacing Ezren or trying to wage war on Xadia, she loves and trusts him absolutely because he's family. It's the same reason why she doesn't hesitate to continue using Dark Magic because it's how she was raised and how could her beloved father be wrong? I just love how the Dragon Prince preaches love so much and proudly shows off LGBT relationships, but also shows a character who goes to very dark places; not because she's trying to be evil, but because of love for her family. She's not trying to seize power or wage war. She just wants to hold onto her family at all costs.
Honestly if Claudia is gonna have a redemption moment being that she sacrifices herself to defeat Aaravos for good, and Soren finds her and embraces her and maybe, just maybe find hope for a decent future as survivors
The story has more holes than Swiss cheese.😅 We still haven't got the love origin story for Terry and Claudia. And why she decided to come back after she left Terry and such.
@@jefferyhanderson7849 Terry in general isn’t much a character and just more Claudia’s Enotional support. He’s there to remind the audience of Claudia’s sweet side, though I enjoy his moments with Viren.
@@jefferyhanderson7849Personally I was hoping Claudia would of stayed unhinged the whole season instead of a Terry origin story but we got nether. Claudia is almost back to her season 1 goofy state.
Have you not watched season 6? Of course it’s Viren’s fault. His use of dark magic is what drove the mom away and he also put Claudia on the path of dark magic. That Soren was gonna die as a baby was sad but Viren’s attempt to reverse that fate rather than accept it set in motion the tragic events that destroyed his family
I think a big factor in this argument is Claudia's inability to make important decisions on her own, mainly when it involves her family. There are multiple examples throughout the story where she confronted with a tough decision that she is incapable of making (usually because she's trying to avoid the potential conflict that would result from making said decision) resulting in someone else making the decision for her.
Great analysis! You’ve given me even more insight into these characters and their motivations. Ever since I first started this show, Viren, Soren, and Claudia have been my favorite characters. I was so happy with how Season six handled all of their arcs as well as their relationships to each other. And after reading about Viren’s early development in the art book, I’m convinced that this was always the ending they had in mind for him. Viren realizing how he’s mistreated both of his children was really powerful. Especially when he decided to burn his confession letter as to not burden Soren with more pain. I also loved how his final sacrifice was in part inspired by Soren’s own courage and selflessness after he had offered his own heart for the spell. Soren spent his childhood admiring his father and wanting to be like him. And in his final moments, Viren decided to instead follow Soren’s example. He finally sees the Soren for who is his, and is so proud of him for breaking free of his influence and finding the right path all on his own. And so he realizes the best way to prove that he’s changed is to do what Soren would do. Sa fridge himself to save his son and the kingdom he swore to protect, not to be forgiven or remembered as a hero, but because it was the right thing to do.
I still can't believe that in the early parts of the series he told both Soren and Claudia in each of their separate missions. If each other gets in the way of one another that it wouldn't hurt to have them be killed basically. But then the whole reason why he turned into dark magic was because soren was sick when he was a kid
I think Viren has an obsessive personality. Whenever he obsesses over something (healing a sickly child Soren, using dark magic, “saving” the king/his friend, concurring Xadia, wanting to repent) he becomes so focused on it that he becomes blind to his own actions, often excusing or justifying them, and hurting those around him (even his loved ones he supposedly cherishes) to reach his goal. He had to literally die twice to see how horrible his actions were and the consequences they bore; but in the end he still obsessed about repenting, abandoning a mentally distraught Claudia and nearly emotionally damaging Soren further in his ‘attempt to tell the truth’. His final sacrifice was both selfless and selfish, as he wasn’t just doing it to save the Katalis citizens and Soren, but to fully make himself a martyr to alleviate his guilt and end his life for good in a ‘selfless/sacrificial’ way (he chose to kill him [suicide] but gave himself peace of mind that sacrificing himself was a good thing).
I think the theory that Viren swapped the soul of Harrow and the bird could be true, because the Quasar Diamond can connect the soul of the lost with their body again, and we in fact have one last quasar diamond left.
Hmmm… I always read the relationship between Hearo and Viren as they started off as that balanced each other. Hearo was overly optimistic and Viren was overly cynical but together they could build a good middle ground. But each became more and more destabilized once they lost their significant others and Hearo blamed Viren for the loss of his wife so he stopped trying to reach for a middle ground and instead leaned on his position and power to try and subdue Viren. Make no mistake Hearo BETRAYED Viren when he called him a servant not because Viren was opposed to serving but because Viren considered Hearo a BROTHER and thought that Hearo had seen him the same way. Hearo didn’t mean that Viren should serve the people but that he was subservient to HIM so he didn’t have to listen to his opinions. Hearo may have been trying to do good but he went about it in the most destructive way possible. Viren’s offer of sacrifice was not motivated by his need to be useful to the person in power and more motivated by the fact that he considered Hearo FAMILY and despite his narcissistic tendencies he was willing to put that part of himself aside to protect those he loved. Viren already had abandonment issues from his wife leaving him but Hearo breaking their bond made him close himself off from others completely and that left him at the mercy of his own worst traits. Narcissism is a really complex topic but at its core it is a deep feeling of insecurity that makes it so that the narcissist can’t bear to look at their own flaws lest they collapse into a self hating puddle. Up until season one I think Viren was a fragile person who needed a lot of help to self reflect but once he lost his counter balance he became a true narcissist and lost the ability to look at his own flaws. Instead he just kept pretending that he was perfect and his ends justified his means. This is where he moves from neglectful of his kids feelings to abusive and manipulative. His redemption is humbling himself, admitting that he was wrong, and using his trauma/wrong doings to help others.
@@DragonGoddess18 Thanks I am dyslexic and can’t ever remember how to spell names like these… I am debating whether it it worth it to go back and edit all the times I spelled it wrong or just be satisfied that people could understand who I was talking about.
Major Theory that might actually make sense (i think): Due to the recent fire in katolis by sol regem, I believe that the people of katolis will go to the kingdom of duren as they aided them duren (get it) a famine years ago! If you think thats dum I believe they duren will 1000000% help as their queen went to amayas wedding, speaking of their queen. I believe her and ezeran will get married and merge their kingdoms into an EMPIRE or just one kingdom. (i will try make a video about this but i would love it if you can!)
Was it all Viren’s fault? Uh going by his track record ummmmm ye but I understand why he did it….and it all stems from saving Soren’s life as a child from what is let to believe be something similar to Asthma or a similar breathing condition as the flashback mentions soren could t breathe well as a toddler and him relying on dark magic then the whole Xadian dynamic with the Dragon King
I will say i love how there is this constant theme of love being tied to Dark Magic. Every person who we've seen use it has come from love or wanting the best/to protect somethings. Ziard and Viren for their Nations Claudia for Verin And Callum for Rayla. It kinda reminds me star wars with Anakin and makes me thing what if Aravos is a Promethian figure but doing lucifarian acts, blinded by love. People are stardust bound by love but at what point does that love become a chain that holds us down like a bird in a cage to a point our wings might as well be clipped
In a Dragon Prince interview video I learned that Avatar Aang and Zuko’s complicated relationship is about Zuko trying to enlightenment from Aang from hunting him to joining him.
Soren is definitely going to die in the end. His life has been saved and healed soo many times via Dark Magic. He’s probably the only good thing that was continued by it and it’s would represent that dark magic can’t help for long
"[Soren's] probably the only good thing that was continued by it.." What about the Dark magic spell Viren did to stop the famine, effectively saving 100,000 people from starving to death?
@@DragonGoddess18 oof I forgot about that. Hold up….why isn’t that focused on more? If he saved people from famine but it’s only him and his daughter only practicing dark magic. If you think about it if a magic saved your family from hunger wouldn’t more people study it.
Dark magic is evil. Everything good that happened thanks to it, is, therefore evil. Soren should die via Primal Magic to restore the life that was stolen to the natural order -his. And so should the 100 000 people who should have died starving like Sarai said.
@@daralic2255I think Dark Magic is a more exclusive art in Katolis. Keep in mind that Viren is the high mage, he has very strong control issue and he killed his previous teacher. His only apprentice is his daughter. Plus, like Claudia said to Callum, Dark Magic is dangerous if nobody teaches you to cast it.
Claudia and Azula are completely different characters. They're both villains but their psychologies are absolutely nothing alike. Azula's a sociopath, maybe even a full on psychopath considering her own mother knew there was something severely wrong with her even as a child. Claudia's an empathetic but weak willed person who's clingy to the point of it being unhealthy and needs other people to tell her what to do because she has no real will of her own.
Yeah, that's how I feel as well. I honestly don't really understand why some many people want to compare her to Azula because they are completely different.
I think there's blame to share. Not just with Viren but also with someone else: Lissa, Viren's ex-wife and the mother of their two children I get that Viren wasn't the greatest to her and I can understand why she divorced him. At the same time, it seems really dumb of her to completely no-contact with Soren and Claudia,in spite of her not trusting Viren anymore. Never visiting them,never letting them visit her or even writing letters to them? That never happened. First time, I watched the show,I thought their mom died during childbirth or because she got really sick when they were little. Lissa is just not a good mother, especially since she hasn't been one because she hasn't been a part of either Soren or Claudia's life for a very long time
Since this tv show is the spiritual successor of Avatar the Last Airbender, I have recently found it wise for the creators to add elements to Avatar to show they are not coping but honoring the universe that they once worked with. I am hoping that we get to see the reveals of the Four Nations of b the other side of the globe and the books in Aavarovs’s prison/cottage that he has including the inspiring Avatar origin stories which would inspire Aavarovs to connect to multiple Primal Sources.
I don't really see Azula and Claudia as being that similar. Azula was cruel and enjoyed being cruel for the sake cruelty. Claudia is not like that at all.
Algo que descato de The Dragon Prince es la forma en cómo escriben a los antagonistas porque Viren y Claudia llegaron a estos extremos debido a sus convicciones. Al principio, Viren creía que lo que estaba haciendo era por el bien de su familia, su reino y la humanidad sin darse cuenta que perdió el horizonte al obsesionarse con el poder y el reconocimiento. Sin embargo, su "charla" con su versión más joven y la visión de Claudia sirvieron para darse cuenta las consecuencias de sus acciones y cómo ellas han influenciado a su hija para que siguiera por ese camino. Tienen razón que Viren no merecía ser "redimido" ni tampoco ser perdonado por las personas a quién lastimó y lo único que hizo fue sacrificar su propia vida para salvar a su hijo y a los ciudadanos de Katolis reconociendo cuál es posición "ser un sirviente". Respecto a Claudia, nosotros la conocimos siendo una chica alegre, divertida y gran fanática de la magia oscura porque su padre le enseñó esta ruta "creativa" para solucionar las cosas. Sin embargo, la partida de su madre Lissa la ha afectado mucho y provocó que Claudia haga lo sea necesario para mantener a su familia unida a través de las enseñanzas de su padre respecto a sacrificarse uno mismo como una muestra de amor a quiénes amas. Sin darse cuenta, Claudia cayó en esta mentira hace mucho tiempo y nunca se cuestionó sí lo que estaba haciendo era cruel o sí la magia oscura es la única opción que tiene. Mi escena favorita de la sexta temporada fue cuándo Claudia, por primera vez en su vida, se cuestiona eso aunque necesita de la guía de su padre para decidir cuál camino debe tomar. Esto hace hincapié a la incapacidad de Claudia de tomar una decisión por sí misma debido a nunca le dieron esa oportunidad cuándo sus padres se estaban divorciando. Su mamá tomó esa decisión por ella. Ahora que Claudia perdió a su papá está bajo la influencia total de Aaravos y él la va a manipular por medio del odio y sed de venganza a quiénes la han abandonado para la siguiente parte de su plan. Ya quiero ver cuál va a ser el destino de Claudia en la nueva temporada 😁
I think viren did try to do it by fource but when he started with himself it went and his soul was merged with a pure evil one from the snake or somthing because a pure evil man can't be born from nowhere even from harshness
honestly, I blame the wife of Viren for leaving. all she needed was to give her tears so their son could finally be cured but instead she had to make a pointless scene and leave her children. say what you may if I had to cry so someone I care about if protected I'll cry until the end of time.
Yeah, the mom,Lissa,kinda ticks me off. It kinda seemed like she loved her beliefs more than her son and that's just wrong. And she stopped being a mother after she left them. There's no evidence in the show that she writes letters to them or lets them visit her.
Hm, look at this. I have been bumping into the dragon prince ever since i first heard about it a year or so back when i was rewatching dragons: riders/defenders of berk and was looking for something similar. Then I copleately gave up on Dragons because i watched avatar... Oh my Glob, what a masterpiece has my childhood missed! And now I watched (this time all of) Adventure time and it's sequels. So basicaly I am still a die-hard Animanga fan who is also a little bit more open (lol) but still when it comes to this stuff I am into masterpieces (that's what happens to everyone when they expirience one piece lol) In other words: Should I watch it?
To the title, yes. Of course it was. That’s the point of his arc. Especially the end of it. He taught Claudia and was cold to Soren, his own son who’d only been sick from birth. Something outside of anyone’s control. Viren did the right thing at the end. But that doesn’t make him guiltless- far from it, he lead her this way.
It's absolutely his fault. Sure LV and Claudia are complicated people but in the end it was motivated by love. Doesn't excuse what they've done but it makes em human. That being said, viren had every opportunity to stop and change, but each time, he chose himself. Atleast in the end he decided to lead in his sons example and his duty
✧✸Join the Cartoon Universe Discord✸✧:
discord.gg/cartoonuv
S1 E1: **King to Viren** "You are a servant."
S6: **sobbing Viren** "I am a servant."
Last words. Brothers to the end.
I always loved how Viren never became a Saturday morning cartoon villain. He never acted evil for the sake of it. He truly believed in this Xadian threat across the border and felt like nobody believed him and that he was perhaps the only one who could stop it. Even if I never believed it, I believed that HE believed it which is the sign of a great villain. Sometimes he failed and sometimes he surprised me, like how he initially was distrustful of Aaravos. He was the hero of his own story and a FANTASTIC character.
Viren's story was definitely very good and tragic at the same time. Plus he's kids Claudia and Soren reminded me of Zuko and Azlua, but actually cared for one another. But like Ozai the fire lord from Avatar, Viren put them on this path and now finding their own way. I'm excited to see what happens next with Soren and Claudia now without their Dad going forward.
Bro he locked up Ezran for no other reason than he could dude is a 🍆
Everyone is the hero of their own story
Yeah honestly I’ve been a fan of Viren, Soren and Claudia ever since the first season because damn are they the most interesting and 3 dimensional characters in the show. They could’ve even rival The Fire nation Royal Family in mentality and possible tragedy.
But unlike Ozai Viren genuinely cared for both Soren and Claudia but sadly similar to Ozai, he saw his kids as tools for power until he died.
After his resurrection dude went through a mental therapy trauma session in his mind for the 5th season.
Pretty much. The problem with Callum, Ezran, and Rayla is that they are mostly Flanderized and it's honestly getting kind of old. Season 6 being the first season where Ezran didn't appear in every episode was really to it's benefit, and allowed the few scenes he did have to actually have more weight and purpose to them.
This season actually managed to make me cry three separate times, Viren being the cause of two.
That whole scene where he was writing that confession shook me, and at first I was annoyed when he burned it but I understand now. Viren realized that telling Soren would only hurt his son more, and didn’t want his son to feel responsibility or guilt for actions taken to ultimately save his life.
So yeah, this season is really good and may be my favourite so far.
I was actually expecting this show to end off with Season 6 until they Announced season 7
You completely misinterpreted Viren in Season 1. He never wanted Harrow to die. After it happened, it was a point of no return so he took advantage of the power vacuum but Harrow was his best friend. When he told Amaya that his death broke his heart, he was sincere but he was trying to take Katolis forwards instead of dwelling in the past. Viren would stab A LOT of people in the back, but Harrow was one of the very rare exceptions.
We also see Viren's good intentions in the flashback to Aanya's mothers' battle with Avizandum. Unlike with Harrow, Viren had no personal investment in the Queens' wellbeing but when he had time to flee, he turned back and attacked Avizandum himself to try and give them a fighting chance. He could have very easily been killed as Avizandum had wiped out entire armies single-handedly in the past, but Viren risked his life for 2 women who were basically strangers.
I would add that Viren offered the throne to Amaya. It's a huge sign of good faith. I don't like the idea that his death was the only time he was being selfless which is supposedly why it's his redemption, because he's actually a very self-sacrificing character. It's even the reason why he spiraled down in the first place. Disfiguring himself to save Soren, searching a solution so no one had to starve while Harrow and Sarai were opened to the idea to let everyone die, going back to save the queens of Duren whom he did not know, trying to die to save Harrow, risking a death sentence for treason, giving himself away to worse-than-death Aaravos and letting him manipulate his body in increasingly gross ways.
@@madeleinedartois4689 Granted, Viren was hoping to use Amaya as a kind of puppet Queen. He wasn't being entirely selfless, he just knew that seizing direct power wasn't going to work while Harrow still had viable successors.
But you're right about Viren's willingness to sacrifice himself to achieve what he believed to be the ultimate good. My favourite example is when the Queens of Duren are distracting Avizandum. Viren could have easily fled with Harrow, Sarai and the others but he turned back and attacked Avizandum himself in an attempt to give the Queens, who were essentially strangers, a fighting chance.
Viren's problem was that he was trying to plan too far ahead instead of focussing on what he should be doing in the here and now. Unlike Aaravos, he didn't have thousands of years of experience behind him and he also didn't have a Star Touched Elf's near godlike omniscience. His vision was far less mature and refined. Aaravos always knew when to take advantage of an opportunity that was right in front of him, planning for the future but also being able to relax and go with the flow in the moment because he was, for all intents and purposes, a god.
Viren was so worried about the future that he couldn't focus on what he was doing in the moment because he was trying to control everything. Perhaps this was partially a result of that reckless decision he made to try and help the Queens, which was not only fruitless as they were essentially cannon fodder for Avizandum but ended up getting Sarai killed as well. Viren was traumatized by that - one of the few times he showed vulnerability in Season 1 was at Sarai's grave - so he tried to be more calculating and careful but he was getting so focussed on controlling the future that he kept making increasingly immoral decisions in the moment.
Obi-Wan Kenobi and Qui-Gon Jinn sum up this mindset beautifully in The Phantom Menace.
Obi-Wan: "I should be mindful of the future."
Qui-Gon: "But not at the expense of the moment."
Tragically, it's not really anybody's 'fault' so to speak. Claudia was traumatized after her mother left and keeping her loved ones together is all that matters. Even if she sees Viren replacing Ezren or trying to wage war on Xadia, she loves and trusts him absolutely because he's family. It's the same reason why she doesn't hesitate to continue using Dark Magic because it's how she was raised and how could her beloved father be wrong? I just love how the Dragon Prince preaches love so much and proudly shows off LGBT relationships, but also shows a character who goes to very dark places; not because she's trying to be evil, but because of love for her family. She's not trying to seize power or wage war. She just wants to hold onto her family at all costs.
Honestly if Claudia is gonna have a redemption moment being that she sacrifices herself to defeat Aaravos for good, and Soren finds her and embraces her and maybe, just maybe find hope for a decent future as survivors
The story has more holes than Swiss cheese.😅
We still haven't got the love origin story for Terry and Claudia.
And why she decided to come back after she left Terry and such.
@@jefferyhanderson7849 Terry in general isn’t much a character and just more Claudia’s Enotional support. He’s there to remind the audience of Claudia’s sweet side, though I enjoy his moments with Viren.
@@jefferyhanderson7849Personally I was hoping Claudia would of stayed unhinged the whole season instead of a Terry origin story but we got nether. Claudia is almost back to her season 1 goofy state.
Have you not watched season 6? Of course it’s Viren’s fault. His use of dark magic is what drove the mom away and he also put Claudia on the path of dark magic. That Soren was gonna die as a baby was sad but Viren’s attempt to reverse that fate rather than accept it set in motion the tragic events that destroyed his family
I think a big factor in this argument is Claudia's inability to make important decisions on her own, mainly when it involves her family. There are multiple examples throughout the story where she confronted with a tough decision that she is incapable of making (usually because she's trying to avoid the potential conflict that would result from making said decision) resulting in someone else making the decision for her.
and the one time she does make a decision by herself is her just straight up leaving terry for like 2 episodes before crawling back
Yeah, I started rewatching the series and I was shocked how friendly and nice she was. I had forgotten she wasn't always so messed up.
Great analysis! You’ve given me even more insight into these characters and their motivations. Ever since I first started this show, Viren, Soren, and Claudia have been my favorite characters. I was so happy with how Season six handled all of their arcs as well as their relationships to each other. And after reading about Viren’s early development in the art book, I’m convinced that this was always the ending they had in mind for him.
Viren realizing how he’s mistreated both of his children was really powerful. Especially when he decided to burn his confession letter as to not burden Soren with more pain. I also loved how his final sacrifice was in part inspired by Soren’s own courage and selflessness after he had offered his own heart for the spell. Soren spent his childhood admiring his father and wanting to be like him. And in his final moments, Viren decided to instead follow Soren’s example. He finally sees the Soren for who is his, and is so proud of him for breaking free of his influence and finding the right path all on his own. And so he realizes the best way to prove that he’s changed is to do what Soren would do. Sa fridge himself to save his son and the kingdom he swore to protect, not to be forgiven or remembered as a hero, but because it was the right thing to do.
Claudia also has dependence tendency like she has to have someone to praise her for her to love herself
I still can't believe that in the early parts of the series he told both Soren and Claudia in each of their separate missions. If each other gets in the way of one another that it wouldn't hurt to have them be killed basically. But then the whole reason why he turned into dark magic was because soren was sick when he was a kid
I think Viren has an obsessive personality.
Whenever he obsesses over something (healing a sickly child Soren, using dark magic, “saving” the king/his friend, concurring Xadia, wanting to repent) he becomes so focused on it that he becomes blind to his own actions, often excusing or justifying them, and hurting those around him (even his loved ones he supposedly cherishes) to reach his goal.
He had to literally die twice to see how horrible his actions were and the consequences they bore; but in the end he still obsessed about repenting, abandoning a mentally distraught Claudia and nearly emotionally damaging Soren further in his ‘attempt to tell the truth’.
His final sacrifice was both selfless and selfish, as he wasn’t just doing it to save the Katalis citizens and Soren, but to fully make himself a martyr to alleviate his guilt and end his life for good in a ‘selfless/sacrificial’ way (he chose to kill him [suicide] but gave himself peace of mind that sacrificing himself was a good thing).
@@trika91it was a good thing.
I feel sorry for Claudia. She's Callum's foil in every way
I think the theory that Viren swapped the soul of Harrow and the bird could be true, because the Quasar Diamond can connect the soul of the lost with their body again, and we in fact have one last quasar diamond left.
Yeah I don't think its a theory anymore.
Hmmm… I always read the relationship between Hearo and Viren as they started off as that balanced each other. Hearo was overly optimistic and Viren was overly cynical but together they could build a good middle ground. But each became more and more destabilized once they lost their significant others and Hearo blamed Viren for the loss of his wife so he stopped trying to reach for a middle ground and instead leaned on his position and power to try and subdue Viren. Make no mistake Hearo BETRAYED Viren when he called him a servant not because Viren was opposed to serving but because Viren considered Hearo a BROTHER and thought that Hearo had seen him the same way. Hearo didn’t mean that Viren should serve the people but that he was subservient to HIM so he didn’t have to listen to his opinions. Hearo may have been trying to do good but he went about it in the most destructive way possible. Viren’s offer of sacrifice was not motivated by his need to be useful to the person in power and more motivated by the fact that he considered Hearo FAMILY and despite his narcissistic tendencies he was willing to put that part of himself aside to protect those he loved. Viren already had abandonment issues from his wife leaving him but Hearo breaking their bond made him close himself off from others completely and that left him at the mercy of his own worst traits. Narcissism is a really complex topic but at its core it is a deep feeling of insecurity that makes it so that the narcissist can’t bear to look at their own flaws lest they collapse into a self hating puddle. Up until season one I think Viren was a fragile person who needed a lot of help to self reflect but once he lost his counter balance he became a true narcissist and lost the ability to look at his own flaws. Instead he just kept pretending that he was perfect and his ends justified his means. This is where he moves from neglectful of his kids feelings to abusive and manipulative. His redemption is humbling himself, admitting that he was wrong, and using his trauma/wrong doings to help others.
*Harrow
@@DragonGoddess18 Thanks I am dyslexic and can’t ever remember how to spell names like these… I am debating whether it it worth it to go back and edit all the times I spelled it wrong or just be satisfied that people could understand who I was talking about.
Claudias character development this season broke me ngl
Major Theory that might actually make sense (i think):
Due to the recent fire in katolis by sol regem, I believe that the people of katolis will go to the kingdom of duren as they aided them duren (get it) a famine years ago! If you think thats dum I believe they duren will 1000000% help as their queen went to amayas wedding, speaking of their queen. I believe her and ezeran will get married and merge their kingdoms into an EMPIRE or just one kingdom.
(i will try make a video about this but i would love it if you can!)
Was it all Viren’s fault? Uh going by his track record ummmmm ye but I understand why he did it….and it all stems from saving Soren’s life as a child from what is let to believe be something similar to Asthma or a similar breathing condition as the flashback mentions soren could t breathe well as a toddler and him relying on dark magic then the whole Xadian dynamic with the Dragon King
It kinda wrote like a damned if you do, damned if you don’t, situation there
@@dragonstouch1042 He became a monster to save his son and monsters dont make good parents even when they try.
i always thought Claudia was like Azula, but if her character was focused more on tragedy.
Claudia seemed to have her hair cut short and some growth
She also quit Dark magic. That's a big deal that isn't being talked about enough.
I will say i love how there is this constant theme of love being tied to Dark Magic. Every person who we've seen use it has come from love or wanting the best/to protect somethings.
Ziard and Viren for their Nations
Claudia for Verin
And Callum for Rayla.
It kinda reminds me star wars with Anakin and makes me thing what if Aravos is a Promethian figure but doing lucifarian acts, blinded by love. People are stardust bound by love but at what point does that love become a chain that holds us down like a bird in a cage to a point our wings might as well be clipped
In a Dragon Prince interview video I learned that Avatar Aang and Zuko’s complicated relationship is about Zuko trying to enlightenment from Aang from hunting him to joining him.
Soren is definitely going to die in the end. His life has been saved and healed soo many times via Dark Magic. He’s probably the only good thing that was continued by it and it’s would represent that dark magic can’t help for long
"[Soren's] probably the only good thing that was continued by it.."
What about the Dark magic spell Viren did to stop the famine, effectively saving 100,000 people from starving to death?
@@DragonGoddess18 oof I forgot about that. Hold up….why isn’t that focused on more? If he saved people from famine but it’s only him and his daughter only practicing dark magic. If you think about it if a magic saved your family from hunger wouldn’t more people study it.
He's not going to die. None of the main good charecters will die. Harrow may still be in Pip.
Dark magic is evil. Everything good that happened thanks to it, is, therefore evil. Soren should die via Primal Magic to restore the life that was stolen to the natural order -his. And so should the 100 000 people who should have died starving like Sarai said.
@@daralic2255I think Dark Magic is a more exclusive art in Katolis. Keep in mind that Viren is the high mage, he has very strong control issue and he killed his previous teacher. His only apprentice is his daughter.
Plus, like Claudia said to Callum, Dark Magic is dangerous if nobody teaches you to cast it.
Claudia and Azula are completely different characters. They're both villains but their psychologies are absolutely nothing alike.
Azula's a sociopath, maybe even a full on psychopath considering her own mother knew there was something severely wrong with her even as a child.
Claudia's an empathetic but weak willed person who's clingy to the point of it being unhealthy and needs other people to tell her what to do because she has no real will of her own.
Yeah, that's how I feel as well. I honestly don't really understand why some many people want to compare her to Azula because they are completely different.
Viren toppling the Sun Elf empire brought peace, unity, and balance to the world. No two ways about it.
I’m so glad I enjoyed season 6 bc I did not care for and was kind of let down watching season 5
Short answer, yes, it is Verin’s fault. His actions literally set everything in motion for the series.
In recent online interviews that I found, the creators confirm it.
I think there's blame to share. Not just with Viren but also with someone else: Lissa, Viren's ex-wife and the mother of their two children
I get that Viren wasn't the greatest to her and I can understand why she divorced him. At the same time, it seems really dumb of her to completely no-contact with Soren and Claudia,in spite of her not trusting Viren anymore. Never visiting them,never letting them visit her or even writing letters to them?
That never happened. First time, I watched the show,I thought their mom died during childbirth or because she got really sick when they were little.
Lissa is just not a good mother, especially since she hasn't been one because she hasn't been a part of either Soren or Claudia's life for a very long time
It's practically Ursa from Avatar all over avatar (Ozai's arranged wife and Zuko and Azula's mother).
Technically she didn't have a divorce. She just left.
Claudia has signs of BPD, oftentimes, those abused by narcissists, develop BPD, or narcissism itself.
14:10 Love Amongst The Dragons
Is that a reference to the Love Amongst Dragons play Zuko mentioned in The Ember Island Players?
Yes. Xadia is (probably) on the other side of the world from the 4 Nations.
@@TheMrPeteChannel they are not part of the same world
@@Moonstriker2514it's like ancient times. For 10,000 years people didn't know of other continents.
Since this tv show is the spiritual successor of Avatar the Last Airbender, I have recently found it wise for the creators to add elements to Avatar to show they are not coping but honoring the universe that they once worked with.
I am hoping that we get to see the reveals of the Four Nations of b the other side of the globe and the books in Aavarovs’s prison/cottage that he has including the inspiring Avatar origin stories which would inspire Aavarovs to connect to multiple Primal Sources.
I don't really see Azula and Claudia as being that similar. Azula was cruel and enjoyed being cruel for the sake cruelty. Claudia is not like that at all.
8:03 I love it when I get something right the UA-camr get’s wrong.
This feels great after being wrong about Moxie killing his mom
I've only seen to Season 4 but no $h*+ it was all Viren's fault.
Algo que descato de The Dragon Prince es la forma en cómo escriben a los antagonistas porque Viren y Claudia llegaron a estos extremos debido a sus convicciones.
Al principio, Viren creía que lo que estaba haciendo era por el bien de su familia, su reino y la humanidad sin darse cuenta que perdió el horizonte al obsesionarse con el poder y el reconocimiento. Sin embargo, su "charla" con su versión más joven y la visión de Claudia sirvieron para darse cuenta las consecuencias de sus acciones y cómo ellas han influenciado a su hija para que siguiera por ese camino. Tienen razón que Viren no merecía ser "redimido" ni tampoco ser perdonado por las personas a quién lastimó y lo único que hizo fue sacrificar su propia vida para salvar a su hijo y a los ciudadanos de Katolis reconociendo cuál es posición "ser un sirviente".
Respecto a Claudia, nosotros la conocimos siendo una chica alegre, divertida y gran fanática de la magia oscura porque su padre le enseñó esta ruta "creativa" para solucionar las cosas. Sin embargo, la partida de su madre Lissa la ha afectado mucho y provocó que Claudia haga lo sea necesario para mantener a su familia unida a través de las enseñanzas de su padre respecto a sacrificarse uno mismo como una muestra de amor a quiénes amas. Sin darse cuenta, Claudia cayó en esta mentira hace mucho tiempo y nunca se cuestionó sí lo que estaba haciendo era cruel o sí la magia oscura es la única opción que tiene. Mi escena favorita de la sexta temporada fue cuándo Claudia, por primera vez en su vida, se cuestiona eso aunque necesita de la guía de su padre para decidir cuál camino debe tomar.
Esto hace hincapié a la incapacidad de Claudia de tomar una decisión por sí misma debido a nunca le dieron esa oportunidad cuándo sus padres se estaban divorciando. Su mamá tomó esa decisión por ella.
Ahora que Claudia perdió a su papá está bajo la influencia total de Aaravos y él la va a manipular por medio del odio y sed de venganza a quiénes la han abandonado para la siguiente parte de su plan. Ya quiero ver cuál va a ser el destino de Claudia en la nueva temporada 😁
BRO, HE JUST Said THAT AARAVOS GAVE VIREN A 30 DAY TRIAL
I think viren did try to do it by fource but when he started with himself it went and his soul was merged with a pure evil one from the snake or somthing because a pure evil man can't be born from nowhere even from harshness
This is a great analysis and comparison with ATLA.
I theorize . . . Aaravos made Soren sick
honestly, I blame the wife of Viren for leaving. all she needed was to give her tears so their son could finally be cured but instead she had to make a pointless scene and leave her children. say what you may if I had to cry so someone I care about if protected I'll cry until the end of time.
Yeah, the mom,Lissa,kinda ticks me off. It kinda seemed like she loved her beliefs more than her son and that's just wrong.
And she stopped being a mother after she left them. There's no evidence in the show that she writes letters to them or lets them visit her.
Well she'll have to make up for that in s7
You forget there back together and hopefully they will marry
Do you think there’s gonna be an endgame war in season 7 like season 3
truy a tragedy
Hm, look at this. I have been bumping into the dragon prince ever since i first heard about it a year or so back when i was rewatching dragons: riders/defenders of berk and was looking for something similar. Then I copleately gave up on Dragons because i watched avatar... Oh my Glob, what a masterpiece has my childhood missed! And now I watched (this time all of) Adventure time and it's sequels. So basicaly I am still a die-hard Animanga fan who is also a little bit more open (lol) but still when it comes to this stuff I am into masterpieces (that's what happens to everyone when they expirience one piece lol)
In other words: Should I watch it?
So many questions about the backstory will stage is set for the dragon prince
Well yeah but no since we're all dancing in aravos palm...literally 😂
To the title, yes. Of course it was. That’s the point of his arc. Especially the end of it. He taught Claudia and was cold to Soren, his own son who’d only been sick from birth. Something outside of anyone’s control.
Viren did the right thing at the end. But that doesn’t make him guiltless- far from it, he lead her this way.
Please Timeblind Elfcut I need your wisdom I'm really stupid
can u unlish a video of the game?
It's absolutely his fault.
Sure LV and Claudia are complicated people but in the end it was motivated by love.
Doesn't excuse what they've done but it makes em human.
That being said, viren had every opportunity to stop and change, but each time, he chose himself. Atleast in the end he decided to lead in his sons example and his duty