Other things that can effect the range of the electric motorcycles is the temperature outside. Because battery performance can be effected by cold weather and very hot weather.
Here's something I really like about this in Canada, it's limited to 70kph. Which might sound annoying but it's also plated as a scooter. Which means you don't need the 1000$+ bike course, the 3x as expensive plates, the ridiculous insurance and the 250$+ permit. It's literally only a car licence past 18 or a regular scooter licence under that. Which is great.
I thought 70km was plenty for most towns and smaller cities. I hope to get one as the government is offering a $2000 rebate. Can get ones of these for under $3000 pretty awesome
When I first got mine I managed about 35 miles riding it like your first vid, but maybe a bit harder, but then tried it with a change of riding style, ie not wot when pulling away, anticipating roundabouts and coasting up, not braking last minute, so your off the power earlier etc, and keeping momentum wherever I could, I got home with 6% left and had done 48 miles mostly round town, but it seemed to limit the power from 10% it was limited to 30mph and had half the acceleration
Maybe your height/wind resistance is adding load to drain the battery. With that perhaps a wind shield above and below the handle bars to deflect air flow would assist increasing the mileage. As a car driver, I think this machine would compliment my life style.
Never been a biker (a cyclist, yes). I can’t fathom a motorbike gear box (and won’t be told - I’m a cyclist, the so handle pulls are for brakes and I’m too old to want to bother learning!) BUT I really like this bike! I have a 12 mile round trip to work and this machine seems ideal. We have an electric car on order for next year so I am totally taken by electric power. I think I might get one (and do it properly with a CBT course, even though I have a licence dating from 1983) Thank you for this review, I will go and watch the others.
Gr8 motovlog Mr Spicy! I decided to trade in my beloved CBR650R for an electric mountain bike - sick of being at the mercy of petrolium giants inflating petrol prices overnight and panic buyers. As an early adopter I would recommend if you're starting out with electric bikes, better to try something at the lower end price like the Socco and see what they're like. It's such a new type of bike I'm not even sure what resale value you will get with two wheeled EV's - I suspect not a lot - so if you're going to get an EV better to choose something that you know you will use for a long time. But any bike's a great bike, it's all about what makes you enjoy the hobby not what you ride :)
I have just bought one here in NZ. I live in Dunedin which has a lot of steep hills. It zips up them extremely well at town speeds. Range is looking pretty good so far but it is quite warm here at the moment. As my commute is only about 5 miles a day the thing will be perfect although I usually use my e-bike. I had no idea the brakes were linked until I watched this video :)
You should've swapped the left and right foot rests. The rests and thereby your feet go back about 3-4 inch and you get much better clearance with your knees to the rather sharp silver "tank cover".
Im considering getting this for work. I use a SUV for work which is too big for what i need to do. I think this would get me into work easier and get me to my jobs. I only do about 40 miles per day including the commute for work.
The fact that it is that light it would be fun just for that. It obviously won't be lively. Even with it being weaker it would be great for small commutes in the city.
Would you be able to ride and review the Artisan Horwin CR6 Spicy, it looks a larger more robust vehicle than the Super Soco . Great review enjoy your videos. 👍
This is perfect. monthly payments less than monthly diesel cost, have a 12-15 mile daily commute (both ways), goes fast enough for dual carriage way. Would this be alright for a first bike?
The price per mile is pretty impressive. If you exclude tax etc (which I assume you did for the soco) and just go on “fuel” then it’s still about 3p a mile cheaper than a conventual 125.
If you are buying to have cheaper running cost you'd need this bike for probably 10+ years to get the money back on what you payed for it, these are more than double what a standard ICE bike costs
@@wolfe1970 EXACTLY!! the Sondors Metacycle is $5000 + tax, also even though it's gas the Honda Navi that only uses a 0.9 fuel tank has a range of 110 miles and 60 mph is going to hurt all of these type small bike sales.because it only costs $1,800 total.
Another good thing about this small bike compared to a 125 petrol engined bike is that whilst they both do around 65mph top speed, your not thrashing the electric one compared to the 125 petrol.
I get what you mean, as in there's no piston or valves giving it what for at max rpm, but when you "thrash" an electric bike, you put a big load thru the battery, controller and leads, heating them right up you also watch your range plummet
A battery pack costing £1500....equates to £25 per month fuel cost over a generous 5 years of battery life that will lose voltage over that period of time and degrade performance; 3 years would be £41.66 per month! In my Honda MSX a busy month of fuel is £15. Normally my commute is a tank a month = £6. This Soco is an expensive commuter bike. Plus I don't have an expensive £1500 bill for a new battery every 3-5 years.
As I say it's early days for electrical. However, I feel you are working off a few assumptions there. With a misinterpretation of how long these batts last and how much you save in petrol, tax and maintenance.
@@spicy110 Well the lithium ion battery degradation is well observed by phone users. The semi conductor based batteries won’t really be available for the masses for a good few years. They should be cheaper and lighter. A replacement controller is big bucks. The Kelly controllers are the best out there. Again there should be an improvement in the design of the controller. Still at early stages compared to car electric vehicles. It’s a big investment/ experiment. Semi conductor shortages are effecting car production now. Imagine when there’s full battery production. Prices should fall but they won’t because of demand.
Did you try it on wet roads? In my experience with the scooter version (TC) the performance of the tires fall off pretty quickly. They become very slippery and you don't have abs to save you.
longevity of batteries is rated in charge / discharge cycles before it starts to fail. even then it may not fail completely or be unable to get any charge into it.
top speed be same with almost anyone ...reason been is that motor and controller can do a lot more than giving you .....so what happens when hit that top speed the controller limiting the power to just that to prevent over heating etc etc .....weight wont effect the top speed unless it quite bit more heavy then recommended .....What weight does factor in is power draw and that range and strain on controller ....Lighter person will get more range as less power been drawn to maintain consistent speed .......So if this bike was moded controller it can get more power out that battery and motor to get even faster and more torque ...at the cost of warranty breach and wearing battery out more and shorten range plus have to ride it more cautious on using full power on moded controller because well your overclocking it and that comes with heat and overvoltage etc etc ...kind stuff you dont really do on new bike but might on 2nd hand 6year old one
It may mention a number of full charge cycles in the paperwork for life expectancies also. so it 3 years or n cycles and after that its sort of unknown but would be surprised if after either it just stopped, there is normally a level of degradation sensitivity to temp etc but battery packs are way more robust than the oil ind negative propaganda implies.
You say it does 62mph, but you seem to be just reading that off the speedo and taking it as gospel. I'd be amazed if it's more than a genuine 50-55mph...unless you checked it with a GPS?
Why? What's the point, it is an electric small bike, the only people I have ever met who care enough about speed to ask for a GPS reading are getting their first bike or are new to bikes. Yes it maybe off a few % but look at the cars on the road, that's more important. Also, it is not made for speed and that top speed is going to drain the batt at a far faster rate. If you care about 5mph get a petrol bike that can do 75-80 mph and won't run out of power from you riding it pinned wide open all the time.
@@spicy110 You're probably too young to have ridden a Gilera Runner 180 2-stroke, back when they were the fastest scooter available - according to their speedos! Owners used to tell me how they did 90mph with ease, which was indeed their indicated top speed. A reality check with the GPS revealed that they were actually only doing a genuine 75mph...
@@pnblondon1087 it is Italian what do you exspect? hehe It maybe out by a little but as I say electrics are not intended for top speed as it is the wrose thing you can do to them for many reasons. Meaning if it is that inportant don't get an electric. I'm 36 so yer i was not riding bikes on the road when they were around just buzzing around feilds on a crosser. I will say I am suprised they only got 75 out a 180 2 stroke, they must have been a rocket off the line!
Could you get your hands on an Artizan EVO ? Or have you done that already and I missed it? Needs a better range on that fob, or it sort of defeats the object.
No one better than you to ask this, so I have a journey of 20km each way so 40km in total, with heights, 98% of it on the motorway, so the speed will be 90km most of the time, do you think Super Soco TC MAX is for me? so I'm looking into the other alternative with a battery that can be removed since I don't have a way to charge the motorcycle directly, so far I have been between: WELLTA BOREAL SUPER SOCO TCMax SUPER SOCO CPX ECOOTER E5 what do you think?
I'm looking for a good first bike. and thinking of an electric??? not sure? shall I go for a used one first around £1000 to get to used to then buy a proper one later? any recommendations?
Hi, I've seen a review where someone shows the bike having a neiman lock, which basically blocks the fork, just like you'd so with the scooters. Can you confirm? It should be on the right side of the bike, just under the handlebar.
@@spicy110 thanks, I've watched all the reviews and videos of the TC max but I was skipping some parts, was more into the riding part than the tech one so I may have skipped the part with the neiman lock. How much would you recommend this from 1 to 10 for commuting purposes? And also, how much did you like it and it's features from 1 to 10? I've noticed you said you'd miss this bike once it's gone, but as an overall score? I'm seriously thinking of buying one later this year as they'll release the new TC max on the European market. They'll also release a TC one model which will have a huge range, do you think you'll do a review on that too? Thank man, I like your videos a lot, keep going!
Hey, just my thoughts, but if your going to do a full series of videos on 1 bike you should put links to the other videos in the description. or make a playlist and link that.
Really enjoyed the videos. Definetely wouldn't buy one. Far far too expensive but well worth weighing up and comparing commuting costs and time savings if you work - i don't. You've definetely got me thinking. Thanks mate.
Ive owned mine for a few weeks, and im really disappointed with it, they claim 60mph, but thats a blatant lie, ive had bikes for 30+ years, and at 60mph according to the speedo it just didn't feel that quick, so i put my GPS on the bike and at 60mph (Speedo speed) i was actually doing 49mph, the speedo is 20% out, and i feel they do this on purpose to claim its a 60mph bike, So far in mode 1 ive only manage 43miles, and im not a big guy, 5"8 and under 10st, so not sure where they get 60 miles from, again that could be from the speedo reading false speeds, And the other thing, this does not have 170Nm torque, the motor actually produces 12.9Nm torque, so not sure where they get the 170Nm from!!! Seems like its just one lie after another to make the bike appeal to people who want the 125cc experience, this doesn't even feel like a 100cc bike, The speed being wrong is the biggest issue for me, i ride alot on A roads and i like to be able to do 55-60mph to keep up with the traffic, to not even be able to do 50mph constant for me is dangerous as cars do come flying up behind you, i dont know how they get away with such a big difference to what they claim.
I did not notice the speedo being off myself as it was keeping up with traffic, but you have tested it so yer odd one at 20%. As for the 170Nm , I am pretty sure that is at the motor spindle, once that gets though the drive train it will be less. Same as petrol bikes and cars with horse power and Wheel horse power.
Is yours linked so front gives a bit of back? Jealous! Mine has the back giving a bit of front, which is just annoying. The way you describe would be much better. Wonder if it was just set up wrong (quite possible, was one of the first ones in the country and had a few other bits done wrong that I had to fix) Edit: Also yours is newer and different in a few ways, e.g. the main breaker is in a different location, in mine it's in the battery compartment (you can see the cutout for it on the left on your bike)
@@spicy110 Yeah no worries I realise you don't have it any more, just find it interesting the brakes have been reversed compared to my very early model! Thanks for the review (and the reply)
not sure what it like on large Electric Motorbike ....i ride 28mph 30 mile range Ebicycle ......biggest battery range killer is ...WIND ....at least on the kind of weight ...not sure about Emotorbikes ..but on EBicycle level is wind wind destroys my range ...it dont effect my speed though
By the time they 'outlaw' petrol cars (and bikes follow), where will you buy your petrol anyway? There may be a few petrol stations left, but it'll be expensive - and then 'Range Anxiety' will be a fossil fuel thing (how near is the next petrol station) - not an EV thing (electricity is everywhere).
Hi I have a query, you say when you pull on the front brake it operates the rear a liitle too. Can you explain please as this would require a hose from the front brake master cylinder going to rear caliper with an extra independent piston. For front l linked brakes a hose comes from the rear master cylinder to the front caliper which operates a separate piston on the front caliper.
@@spicy110 I fully understand what linked brakes are, I was querying the rear being linked to the front, I can see 2 hoses feeding the front caliper for the 2 brake levers but I couldn't see the rear caliper to see if there are 2 hoses feeding the rear. My current bike has linked brakes however the front brake lever operates 2 pistons in a row of 3 in the front caliper only, and the rear lever operates a single piston in the rear and a smaller piston independently between the other 2 pistons on the front. This is the only system I have personally seen myself. I am seriously considering going electric when I've finished paying off my bike next year so you reviews are extremely helpful especially as I'm 6'"2 and pushing 18 stone so I have similar problems as you with smaller bikes as yourself.
@@spicy110 I had the Honda linked system on my VFR. Never liked it. Five years later I still never liked it. 🤷🏻♀️ seems like a cheap-assed way of avoiding the ABS legislation on these little bikes..
right lever feeds front calliper directly, second hose from front calliper feeds to T piece type device, which supplies rear calliper. Left lever feeds directly to T piece type device, which supplies front and rear callipers. diagram on page 2 www.outdoordreams.eu/media/products/TC%20ERSATZTEILE%20KATALOG%20MIT%20PREISEN%202018.pdf
@@chrisdavidson911thanks but that link only shows the headlight and speedo. If it really operates the rear as well from the front brake lever I would pass it OK the other way round. I've not seen this way of doing it before and it's a deal breaker I want the front brake to be just the front.
Spicy, how would you compare it w/ Zero FXS in regards to size feel, as you're around my height? Selling my SS TC as it's super tiny for a large bloke like me.
@Bob Sacamano when you have peak torque at 0 rpm, which electric motors can do, your bhp figure becomes meaningless; it will be 0 bhp, and only increase as the motor speed increases, and yet the motor is actually outputting maximum power from that 0 rpm. The bike has a soft start system which does give it a gradual torque curve initially, and therefore a power curve, but only at lower speeds.
With more and more electric bikes becoming available do you think they might change the bike tests so like a car you can do a automatic or manual licence ?
Well that just covers the cost of the batts and maybe a wheel. You can not compare the price on ICE to electric....wait a min! £2K!? you can't even get most Chinese 125cc bikes for that. Think you maybe dreaming a bit here, be cool if it was cheaper.
@@aliasgharkhoyee9501 "you can't even get most Chinese 125cc bikes for that" I said "most" yes there are a couple of bikes under £2k new they will not be great bikes.
I would like to see a fat bloke do a test review of this bike, show it climbing hills and a range test, also how comfortable a fat bloke would be on it, we always see skinny tall blokes, wispy women, never a regular 18 to 20 stone fat bloke, we see the same on petrol bikes testing them but never an electric, and all these electric bike makers claim decent range but that's with people who weigh next to nothing on them.
It seems just a small step up from an E Bicycle to me for short heavy traffic city slow speed commutes ? On the fence here with this one Brilliant video thumbs up, best regards Shaun .
@@spicy110 Yes i hear you , but there are legal e bikes , i wasn't saying ride illegal (35 yrs on a motorcycle here and still more ) how fast in heavy traffic for a city commuter can we use .... e bicycles have their place legally , Best regards Shaun
If it's the odd one at 40mph and under no issue but it will struggle a bit on a 60mph hill. Also if you live in a very hilly area it will decrease the range a lot.
@@andrewdart3367 thanks Andrew for replying. Once you get it let me know what you think of it. It’s an interesting bike alright. I’m only 5’ 6” so it would probably fit me perfectly.
5mm taller than a grom a very popular bike and It's cheaper than some petrol 125cc bikes and is a new technology. I don't know what scale you are using to determine value but in the electric market this is cheap.
@@terrancedactielle5460 Well, lets be honest... This hugely depends on where you live... Also fuel prices are expensive in europe cause of the wicked amount of taxes that are put on it. But let me break the bubble. Once plenty people move electric. Electricity prices will boom and will render your argument useless... a 125cc doesnt use a lot of fuel. Your really think you'll recuperate the double price you pay for electric just by fuel? By the time you get enough km on these electric bikes You'll most likely even already have moved on to a bigger bike. An electric motorcycle should be bought because of the silence, 'green' energy and acceleration (green being in parentheses because let's be honest, most prolly dont charge their EV's with their home produced energy... And rely on the energy provider...Which most likely isnt all that green...
E motorcycles are exciting but they need to be purposeful (open road, city etc). This one can do 60mph you say so its perhaps not enough for safe open road use. So then if its a city bike where speed limits are often about 30mph it might be fine providing it can climb city hills at 30mph. With e bikes, 60 mph on the flat may be quite different on a decent city hill.
I really like the look of this bike for my 1st bike but I am also just over 6ft. :( Can anybody recommend an electric motorcycle similar style/spec as the Super Soco TC MAX but built for taller riders?
It still seems to be pointless for me to own one. Range is the factor here, time for recharging is terrible. New 125cc can reach almost 80mph, burning as low as 122mpg (2L/100km) so the cost per mile is just above 4p. Considering advantages, such as range, time for refuel/recharge, availability of parts and prices, durability and so on, battery driven bike is still in antenatal stage... I do not believe they will stop making combustion engines before 2050, the cost of batteries, needed materials and technology will not allow for such quick swap...
All tech starts somewhere. Batteries are developing fast and getting more Ah per kg. And they're getting much cheaper. There was a price fall of 50% for some top makes - with improvements. Fast charge tech is possible for e-bikes and it just needs standardization to the Tesla charger connections and software - then it will get much cheaper due to economies of scale.
@@ejbh3160 Life expectancy of the battery is 5 years. Batteries are expensive and CO/CO2 emissions to make them is huge, not to mention radioactive materials needed to make them. Producing electricity is not cheap or emission free either, Euro 6 seems to be more reasonable and eco friendly than electric cars. How about used batteries? What to do with such waste? And charging will be always slower than refueling! Range on batteries will be always lower than on gasoline, travel time will be longer and as you go, your bike will remain heavier than with fuel tank!
There was no point to keep watching after mentioning that there is no redudancy for unlocking the bike if the fob stops working. Enough with their stupid digital controls.
I think what we’re waiting for is that “quantum leap” in battery and charging technology that will make electric bikes a viable alternative for something other than an urban commuter. And that’s coming from an “old fart” who loves his gasoline powered bikes 😜🏍. PS: I’ve enjoyed your detailed review of this one 👍.
I'd love an ele tri bike but they seem to be falling behind electric cars big time. I'd love a electric cruiser like the harley live wire but affordable but there's bearly any electric bikes out at all
@@jedidorn The others dont hear you mate, I'm a rider and a driver, lots of times while driving I notice that there is a motorcycle behind or next to me after hearing their exhuast's sound, I'm not saying you should put a noisy exhuast, but a motorbike with a decent exhust's sound within the legal dB limits, makes a huge difference. When riding you should do your best to make yourself visible as much as you can.
The Distant future of transport be it bike or car or plane is (Either) Plutonium/Uranium. A small chunk would power it for the lifetime of the vehicle with no worries about charging/ refilling. But for the foreseeable future ground based transport.... The vehicle would be powered by a Lithium-Iron battery for short range non-city use backed up by an Over-Air wireless charging network built into the roads of major towns & cities. The Car/Bike charges from the wireless road network as it's being driven & the user charged for the Electricity accordingly. Like a sort of Pay-as-you-drive scenario. Over air charging is not something of the future but technology that is available now but just needs to be modified for the intended use. I'm 52 so this is probably not something I will see in general use in my lifetime but will no doubt be used by future generations .... Just don't go over 88 mph while heading towards a clock !
It's a bike for small people, it gives small people half decent range but large people lousy range, it would struggle up a hill with a fat bloke on it but glide up a hill with his wife riding it assuming she ain't fat as well and most wives aren't compared to their men. It's not a bike to go out for a ride on cos you won't get very far before you have to come back, but as a commuter it would work, except all the roads are being shut off to motorcycles as well as cars and they have made no exceptions for electric motorcycles so they have to travel the same roads as cars which means going the long way round, which means where you may well have had enough on a soco to get to work you now have issues due to the extra mileage you are travelling. If the govt allowed these electric bikes the same right to go through those barriers so they would still be within range then they may become a more viable option, but they haven't, so petrol it is. Taking all that into account and the price and these bikes are expensive for what they are, but they do hold potential, if you had two batteries and one in a back pack you might be able to extend your range a bit more, but then that would make the bike even more expensive, and then there is the resale value.
Other things that can effect the range of the electric motorcycles is the temperature outside. Because battery performance can be effected by cold weather and very hot weather.
Here's something I really like about this in Canada, it's limited to 70kph. Which might sound annoying but it's also plated as a scooter.
Which means you don't need the 1000$+ bike course, the 3x as expensive plates, the ridiculous insurance and the 250$+ permit.
It's literally only a car licence past 18 or a regular scooter licence under that. Which is great.
I thought 70km was plenty for most towns and smaller cities. I hope to get one as the government is offering a $2000 rebate. Can get ones of these for under $3000 pretty awesome
Also in Canada. What is a realistic range at 70 km/h?
The more I see it, the more I like it. It very much reminds me of the Grom. That's no bad thing.
Similar type handling, speed, and fun.
Ahw man, the Grom is the most fun bike I've had. If this thing handles the same it's a serious option for some commute fun
4th year with my bike, 13500kms. Saved 1000s and 1000s. I couldn't recommend it more. It's utterly insanely good value.
Great to hear!
Is that with the same battery from new ?
Battery degradation percentage?
When I first got mine I managed about 35 miles riding it like your first vid, but maybe a bit harder, but then tried it with a change of riding style, ie not wot when pulling away, anticipating roundabouts and coasting up, not braking last minute, so your off the power earlier etc, and keeping momentum wherever I could, I got home with 6% left and had done 48 miles mostly round town, but it seemed to limit the power from 10% it was limited to 30mph and had half the acceleration
Maybe your height/wind resistance is adding load to drain the battery.
With that perhaps a wind shield above and below the handle bars to deflect air flow would assist increasing the mileage.
As a car driver, I think this machine would compliment my life style.
very tempted to get one of these to commute to uni and back...
Never been a biker (a cyclist, yes). I can’t fathom a motorbike gear box (and won’t be told - I’m a cyclist, the so handle pulls are for brakes and I’m too old to want to bother learning!) BUT I really like this bike! I have a 12 mile round trip to work and this machine seems ideal. We have an electric car on order for next year so I am totally taken by electric power. I think I might get one (and do it properly with a CBT course, even though I have a licence dating from 1983) Thank you for this review, I will go and watch the others.
there is a retro scrambler version of this and its really nice
Very tempted to get one in a few years once I've paid my car off would be an asset to my life I feel
" the torque is very much the same in all 3 modes, but when it hits 0%, it's done.." This news floored me.. lol XD
I see this as a great option for someone that wants a bike but has the scooter feel because of no clutch. Which is perfect for me
Very much so, you also get bike handling that I think is better in this case.
Likewise for my 12 mile round trip to work.
Gr8 motovlog Mr Spicy! I decided to trade in my beloved CBR650R for an electric mountain bike - sick of being at the mercy of petrolium giants inflating petrol prices overnight and panic buyers. As an early adopter I would recommend if you're starting out with electric bikes, better to try something at the lower end price like the Socco and see what they're like. It's such a new type of bike I'm not even sure what resale value you will get with two wheeled EV's - I suspect not a lot - so if you're going to get an EV better to choose something that you know you will use for a long time. But any bike's a great bike, it's all about what makes you enjoy the hobby not what you ride :)
I have just bought one here in NZ. I live in Dunedin which has a lot of steep hills. It zips up them extremely well at town speeds. Range is looking pretty good so far but it is quite warm here at the moment. As my commute is only about 5 miles a day the thing will be perfect although I usually use my e-bike. I had no idea the brakes were linked until I watched this video :)
Sounds perfect for you. Btw the brakes may not be linked on NZ modles as it's due to a EU law.
@@spicy110 i sold a smallframe vespa and my KTM to buy it. The performance is pretty similar to the vespa, a bit more torque maybe.
Hi paul, just found these bikes here in nz and quite interested. how is winter riding going? what is the cost of rego?
@@rikkimcguire8785 It's been fine in the winter so far. I haven't had to register it yet but I expect its the same as a 125cc ie about $400 pa.
how does it perform on the steep hills? have you tried it with a pillion passenger?
I get about 40km of range with a single battery TC but it locks your speed to about 15km/h if you get below 5% charge.
Thinking to buy one thanks for such an awesome review
You should've swapped the left and right foot rests. The rests and thereby your feet go back about 3-4 inch and you get much better clearance with your knees to the rather sharp silver "tank cover".
Nice food for thought mate thank you.
Im considering getting this for work. I use a SUV for work which is too big for what i need to do. I think this would get me into work easier and get me to my jobs. I only do about 40 miles per day including the commute for work.
The fact that it is that light it would be fun just for that. It obviously won't be lively. Even with it being weaker it would be great for small commutes in the city.
Thank. I test rode one but during the day so the night light comparison is really helpful.
Would you be able to ride and review the Artisan Horwin CR6 Spicy, it looks a larger more robust vehicle than the Super Soco . Great review enjoy your videos. 👍
Chain driven though?! Why!
Great review - extensive, and includes both positive and negative points.
This is perfect. monthly payments less than monthly diesel cost, have a 12-15 mile daily commute (both ways), goes fast enough for dual carriage way. Would this be alright for a first bike?
Yes very much so a good first bike in the sense it's easy to ride and not too quick.
The price per mile is pretty impressive. If you exclude tax etc (which I assume you did for the soco) and just go on “fuel” then it’s still about 3p a mile cheaper than a conventual 125.
If you are buying to have cheaper running cost you'd need this bike for probably 10+ years to get the money back on what you payed for it, these are more than double what a standard ICE bike costs
@@wolfe1970 EXACTLY!! the Sondors Metacycle is $5000 + tax, also even though it's gas the Honda Navi that only uses a 0.9 fuel tank has a range of 110 miles and 60 mph is going to hurt all of these type small bike sales.because it only costs $1,800 total.
@@wolfe1970 - & how long would it take to get your money back with a less expensive conventional bike, taking depreciation into consideration also ?
@@wolfe1970 You are right. Electric bikes are not a good deal. No wonder why people are not buying them. In 5 years I had seen only 3 on the roads.
Another good thing about this small bike compared to a 125 petrol engined bike is that whilst they both do around 65mph top speed, your not thrashing the electric one compared to the 125 petrol.
I get what you mean, as in there's no piston or valves giving it what for at max rpm, but when you "thrash" an electric bike, you put a big load thru the battery, controller and leads, heating them right up you also watch your range plummet
The Super Soco doesn't manage anything like 65mph top speed!
Love the vids my guy
Great review 👍👍👍
A battery pack costing £1500....equates to £25 per month fuel cost over a generous 5 years of battery life that will lose voltage over that period of time and degrade performance; 3 years would be £41.66 per month! In my Honda MSX a busy month of fuel is £15. Normally my commute is a tank a month = £6. This Soco is an expensive commuter bike. Plus I don't have an expensive £1500 bill for a new battery every 3-5 years.
As I say it's early days for electrical. However, I feel you are working off a few assumptions there. With a misinterpretation of how long these batts last and how much you save in petrol, tax and maintenance.
@@spicy110 Well the lithium ion battery degradation is well observed by phone users. The semi conductor based batteries won’t really be available for the masses for a good few years. They should be cheaper and lighter. A replacement controller is big bucks. The Kelly controllers are the best out there. Again there should be an improvement in the design of the controller. Still at early stages compared to car electric vehicles. It’s a big investment/ experiment. Semi conductor shortages are effecting car production now. Imagine when there’s full battery production. Prices should fall but they won’t because of demand.
thanks for the great vid mate!
Did you try it on wet roads? In my experience with the scooter version (TC) the performance of the tires fall off pretty quickly. They become very slippery and you don't have abs to save you.
longevity of batteries is rated in charge / discharge cycles before it starts to fail. even then it may not fail completely or be unable to get any charge into it.
Also by the time it comes to replace the battery , the cost will be much cheaper than now...battery prices are always coming down!
Im short, lots of pain, artritis, hate noise and no need for speed.
I feel this thing is perfect.
Depreciation is also a big question
How is your name Spicy 110 and you have 110K subscribers and this video has 110k views. Tickle me impressed
Luck haha
top speed be same with almost anyone ...reason been is that motor and controller can do a lot more than giving you .....so what happens when hit that top speed the controller limiting the power to just that to prevent over heating etc etc .....weight wont effect the top speed unless it quite bit more heavy then recommended .....What weight does factor in is power draw and that range and strain on controller ....Lighter person will get more range as less power been drawn to maintain consistent speed .......So if this bike was moded controller it can get more power out that battery and motor to get even faster and more torque ...at the cost of warranty breach and wearing battery out more and shorten range plus have to ride it more cautious on using full power on moded controller because well your overclocking it and that comes with heat and overvoltage etc etc ...kind stuff you dont really do on new bike but might on 2nd hand 6year old one
Max Wrist fans "Will it wheelie?"
What backpack are you using? Great video
Kriega r25 👍
Great video
It may mention a number of full charge cycles in the paperwork for life expectancies also. so it 3 years or n cycles and after that its sort of unknown but would be surprised if after either it just stopped, there is normally a level of degradation sensitivity to temp etc but battery packs are way more robust than the oil ind negative propaganda implies.
What in your opinion is the best 125cc replacement if anyone was to replace a petrol bike. ?
it would be the zero fx 11kw but it's like 12 grand. This is good but small.
You say it does 62mph, but you seem to be just reading that off the speedo and taking it as gospel. I'd be amazed if it's more than a genuine 50-55mph...unless you checked it with a GPS?
Why? What's the point, it is an electric small bike, the only people I have ever met who care enough about speed to ask for a GPS reading are getting their first bike or are new to bikes. Yes it maybe off a few % but look at the cars on the road, that's more important. Also, it is not made for speed and that top speed is going to drain the batt at a far faster rate. If you care about 5mph get a petrol bike that can do 75-80 mph and won't run out of power from you riding it pinned wide open all the time.
@@spicy110 You're probably too young to have ridden a Gilera Runner 180 2-stroke, back when they were the fastest scooter available - according to their speedos! Owners used to tell me how they did 90mph with ease, which was indeed their indicated top speed. A reality check with the GPS revealed that they were actually only doing a genuine 75mph...
@@pnblondon1087 it is Italian what do you exspect? hehe It maybe out by a little but as I say electrics are not intended for top speed as it is the wrose thing you can do to them for many reasons. Meaning if it is that inportant don't get an electric. I'm 36 so yer i was not riding bikes on the road when they were around just buzzing around feilds on a crosser. I will say I am suprised they only got 75 out a 180 2 stroke, they must have been a rocket off the line!
Could you get your hands on an Artizan EVO ? Or have you done that already and I missed it? Needs a better range on that fob, or it sort of defeats the object.
I have a GPS tracker hidden inside my bike.
That i can access from my phone and track.
would you share the model / manufactor? tks
It barely comes above your knees....or was that a perspective thing?
@Spicy - hi mate, nice review, what jacket & helmet are you wearing in this vid?
No one better than you to ask this, so I have a journey of 20km each way so 40km in total, with heights, 98% of it on the motorway, so the speed will be 90km most of the time, do you think Super Soco TC MAX is for me? so I'm looking into the other alternative with a battery that can be removed since I don't have a way to charge the motorcycle directly, so far I have been between:
WELLTA BOREAL
SUPER SOCO TCMax
SUPER SOCO CPX
ECOOTER E5
what do you think?
It will be great to see more electric learn illegal bikes, Great video keep up the good work 👌
I'm looking for a good first bike. and thinking of an electric??? not sure? shall I go for a used one first around £1000 to get to used to then buy a proper one later? any recommendations?
Hi, I've seen a review where someone shows the bike having a neiman lock, which basically blocks the fork, just like you'd so with the scooters. Can you confirm? It should be on the right side of the bike, just under the handlebar.
If you watch the video I point out the steering lock, I do not have this bike anymore it was a review bike.
@@spicy110 thanks, I've watched all the reviews and videos of the TC max but I was skipping some parts, was more into the riding part than the tech one so I may have skipped the part with the neiman lock. How much would you recommend this from 1 to 10 for commuting purposes? And also, how much did you like it and it's features from 1 to 10? I've noticed you said you'd miss this bike once it's gone, but as an overall score? I'm seriously thinking of buying one later this year as they'll release the new TC max on the European market. They'll also release a TC one model which will have a huge range, do you think you'll do a review on that too? Thank man, I like your videos a lot, keep going!
The three setting switch is really just a three separate speeds limit switch
Is there any that are bigger ? I’m 6”4 too it doesn’t very big lol
Yer but they tend to be electric scooters, in normal bikes you would have to go up to something like a zero fxe and then we are talking £13,000
@@spicy110 tbh it’s just to get around Manchester City to and from work. If the size wasn’t too much of an issue for you 🤷♂️
Caught between buying this or the silence connection scooter. Someone help 😫
Another good watch
How may miles you rider it for ?
Can this bike do 60 mph
Thank you.
Spicy, is it worth paying extra for spoked wheels? Would spoked wheels give a different/better ride or is it just a case of aesthetics?
On a bike like this, I think it's more about looks. Also remember spoked rims use inner tubes, cast wheels don't.
@@spicy110 Thanks for the info.
should try the lexmoto cypher next :DD
So what is the most powerful long range electric bike you have reviewed so I can check it out, I mean on a CBT licence, thanks.
Look at my recent zero FXE videos.
Should I buy this bike? I found it for 1700$ where I live. Someone please let me know
Hey, just my thoughts, but if your going to do a full series of videos on 1 bike you should put links to the other videos in the description. or make a playlist and link that.
If you click on my channel and search the bike name it will give you all the videos.
Really enjoyed the videos. Definetely wouldn't buy one. Far far too expensive but well worth weighing up and comparing commuting costs and time savings if you work - i don't. You've definetely got me thinking. Thanks mate.
If you did go the finance route, we're only talking 50-80 a month. With the amount you're saving on fuel it's worth it.
Ive owned mine for a few weeks, and im really disappointed with it, they claim 60mph, but thats a blatant lie, ive had bikes for 30+ years, and at 60mph according to the speedo it just didn't feel that quick, so i put my GPS on the bike and at 60mph (Speedo speed) i was actually doing 49mph, the speedo is 20% out, and i feel they do this on purpose to claim its a 60mph bike,
So far in mode 1 ive only manage 43miles, and im not a big guy, 5"8 and under 10st, so not sure where they get 60 miles from, again that could be from the speedo reading false speeds,
And the other thing, this does not have 170Nm torque, the motor actually produces 12.9Nm torque, so not sure where they get the 170Nm from!!!
Seems like its just one lie after another to make the bike appeal to people who want the 125cc experience, this doesn't even feel like a 100cc bike,
The speed being wrong is the biggest issue for me, i ride alot on A roads and i like to be able to do 55-60mph to keep up with the traffic, to not even be able to do 50mph constant for me is dangerous as cars do come flying up behind you, i dont know how they get away with such a big difference to what they claim.
I did not notice the speedo being off myself as it was keeping up with traffic, but you have tested it so yer odd one at 20%. As for the 170Nm , I am pretty sure that is at the motor spindle, once that gets though the drive train it will be less. Same as petrol bikes and cars with horse power and Wheel horse power.
It would be lovely if it fit Europeans. Looks better than most 125's. :)
The previous TC model looks much nicer than most 30mph/50cc equivalent bikes too.
Is yours linked so front gives a bit of back? Jealous! Mine has the back giving a bit of front, which is just annoying. The way you describe would be much better. Wonder if it was just set up wrong (quite possible, was one of the first ones in the country and had a few other bits done wrong that I had to fix)
Edit: Also yours is newer and different in a few ways, e.g. the main breaker is in a different location, in mine it's in the battery compartment (you can see the cutout for it on the left on your bike)
This is a review bike as stated at the start of the video. I can add no more than what was said in the few videos I did on it and the review.👍
@@spicy110 Yeah no worries I realise you don't have it any more, just find it interesting the brakes have been reversed compared to my very early model! Thanks for the review (and the reply)
How about the Macrais Z8X London Uk Electric CBT Z1000 🤞
not sure what it like on large Electric Motorbike ....i ride 28mph 30 mile range Ebicycle ......biggest battery range killer is ...WIND ....at least on the kind of weight ...not sure about Emotorbikes ..but on EBicycle level is wind wind destroys my range ...it dont effect my speed though
By the time they 'outlaw' petrol cars (and bikes follow), where will you buy your petrol anyway? There may be a few petrol stations left, but it'll be expensive - and then 'Range Anxiety' will be a fossil fuel thing (how near is the next petrol station) - not an EV thing (electricity is everywhere).
Probably a silly question what cc is this
Yes Ik it's electric what equivalent is it
It is not that silly tbh as is falls inside the laws of a 125cc when you are on a CBT.
Hi I have a query, you say when you pull on the front brake it operates the rear a liitle too. Can you explain please as this would require a hose from the front brake master cylinder going to rear caliper with an extra independent piston. For front l linked brakes a hose comes from the rear master cylinder to the front caliper which operates a separate piston on the front caliper.
it's called a linked brake system and is a legal requirement on small bikes if they don't have abs. You can find diagrams of how they work on google.
@@spicy110 I fully understand what linked brakes are, I was querying the rear being linked to the front, I can see 2 hoses feeding the front caliper for the 2 brake levers but I couldn't see the rear caliper to see if there are 2 hoses feeding the rear. My current bike has linked brakes however the front brake lever operates 2 pistons in a row of 3 in the front caliper only, and the rear lever operates a single piston in the rear and a smaller piston independently between the other 2 pistons on the front. This is the only system I have personally seen myself. I am seriously considering going electric when I've finished paying off my bike next year so you reviews are extremely helpful especially as I'm 6'"2 and pushing 18 stone so I have similar problems as you with smaller bikes as yourself.
@@spicy110 I had the Honda linked system on my VFR. Never liked it. Five years later I still never liked it. 🤷🏻♀️ seems like a cheap-assed way of avoiding the ABS legislation on these little bikes..
right lever feeds front calliper directly, second hose from front calliper feeds to T piece type device, which supplies rear calliper. Left lever feeds directly to T piece type device, which supplies front and rear callipers.
diagram on page 2 www.outdoordreams.eu/media/products/TC%20ERSATZTEILE%20KATALOG%20MIT%20PREISEN%202018.pdf
@@chrisdavidson911thanks but that link only shows the headlight and speedo. If it really operates the rear as well from the front brake lever I would pass it OK the other way round. I've not seen this way of doing it before and it's a deal breaker I want the front brake to be just the front.
I think you mean intracity, not intercity
Spicy, how would you compare it w/ Zero FXS in regards to size feel, as you're around my height? Selling my SS TC as it's super tiny for a large bloke like me.
I would watch my drz vs fxs video as you can see it next to my drz. The zero is much lager than this, this is defiantly small.
@@spicy110 thanks mate, will do!
How tall are you exactly?
Anyone have the word “security” light up on the dash panel and bike won’t go. Can’t seem to cancel it and go back to driving?
You say it's 7hp compared to a petrol 13ish hp. Is it 7hp all the time or is it like petrol where that's it's peak at a certain rpm?
That's tricky to say in theory yes but as the power is ramped up until 20-30ish. Below that speed you open the throttle full and picks up slowly.
@Bob Sacamano when you have peak torque at 0 rpm, which electric motors can do, your bhp figure becomes meaningless; it will be 0 bhp, and only increase as the motor speed increases, and yet the motor is actually outputting maximum power from that 0 rpm. The bike has a soft start system which does give it a gradual torque curve initially, and therefore a power curve, but only at lower speeds.
@Bob Sacamano evs give us max torque right from the beginning..thts why fastest cars in the world are now evs..
@Bob Sacamano it ok bruh, we are not going into space with all those top speeds with cars unlike in F9 😂 evs are the future anyway!!
With more and more electric bikes becoming available do you think they might change the bike tests so like a car you can do a automatic or manual licence ?
They already do this for the CBT I'm 90% sure
That's been out for long as I remember. If you auto licence you're restricted to an auto licence. If you do manual you can do manual or auto
@@JDMz Is that just for CBT or full license? I'm currently doing my full license.
idk, im on a CBT and the instructor recommended if i got a geared bike to redo the test on geared but didn't say anything about it being required
Currently CBT doesn't restrict you either way. You can complete the course on automatic and ride manual bikes.
i would pay about £2,000 for this not £4,399 which they are asking
Well that just covers the cost of the batts and maybe a wheel. You can not compare the price on ICE to electric....wait a min! £2K!? you can't even get most Chinese 125cc bikes for that. Think you maybe dreaming a bit here, be cool if it was cheaper.
@@spicy110you can definitely get some 125cc bikes for about £2k.
@@aliasgharkhoyee9501 "you can't even get most Chinese 125cc bikes for that" I said "most" yes there are a couple of bikes under £2k new they will not be great bikes.
I would like to see a fat bloke do a test review of this bike, show it climbing hills and a range test, also how comfortable a fat bloke would be on it, we always see skinny tall blokes, wispy women, never a regular 18 to 20 stone fat bloke, we see the same on petrol bikes testing them but never an electric, and all these electric bike makers claim decent range but that's with people who weigh next to nothing on them.
It seems just a small step up from an E Bicycle to me for short heavy traffic city slow speed commutes ?
On the fence here with this one
Brilliant video thumbs up, best regards Shaun .
One big difference this is legal, e bikes are not when they do comparable speeds.
@@spicy110 Yes i hear you , but there are legal e bikes , i wasn't saying ride illegal (35 yrs on a motorcycle here and still more ) how fast in heavy traffic for a city commuter can we use .... e bicycles have their place legally ,
Best regards Shaun
I'm probably just a little heavier than you. How does it cope with hills?
If it's the odd one at 40mph and under no issue but it will struggle a bit on a 60mph hill. Also if you live in a very hilly area it will decrease the range a lot.
Can you charge this bike with a car charger?
No
Actually there is an adapter from type 2 to classic plug, not sure if its safe tough.
Hi, can you do review on our motorbike ?
I'm just under 6ft will this bike be ok for me?
yes it is a little small for me at 6'4 but ridable so any shorter is fine. This is a small bike.
@@spicy110 love your reviews of this bike. Its looks fun to ride. I've ordered one without even having a ride!
@@andrewdart3367 any update, did you get it yet?
@@johnflavin1602 still waiting been wating over 2 weeks now. Its stuck at customs probably to do with the shortage of drivers
@@andrewdart3367 thanks Andrew for replying. Once you get it let me know what you think of it. It’s an interesting bike alright. I’m only 5’ 6” so it would probably fit me perfectly.
Looks tiny... Ott expensive aswell.
5mm taller than a grom a very popular bike and It's cheaper than some petrol 125cc bikes and is a new technology. I don't know what scale you are using to determine value but in the electric market this is cheap.
@@spicy110 He's comparing it to regular motorcycle prices.
Maybe more expensive than a petrol bike but the fuel cost of this is almost nothing.
@@terrancedactielle5460 Well, lets be honest... This hugely depends on where you live... Also fuel prices are expensive in europe cause of the wicked amount of taxes that are put on it. But let me break the bubble. Once plenty people move electric. Electricity prices will boom and will render your argument useless... a 125cc doesnt use a lot of fuel. Your really think you'll recuperate the double price you pay for electric just by fuel? By the time you get enough km on these electric bikes You'll most likely even already have moved on to a bigger bike. An electric motorcycle should be bought because of the silence, 'green' energy and acceleration (green being in parentheses because let's be honest, most prolly dont charge their EV's with their home produced energy... And rely on the energy provider...Which most likely isnt all that green...
E motorcycles are exciting but they need to be purposeful (open road, city etc). This one can do 60mph you say so its perhaps not enough for safe open road use. So then if its a city bike where speed limits are often about 30mph it might be fine providing it can climb city hills at 30mph. With e bikes, 60 mph on the flat may be quite different on a decent city hill.
Can you ride this at 16 ??
No, this is a 125cc equivalent.
@@spicy110 thanks anyway
No worries.
I really like the look of this bike for my 1st bike but I am also just over 6ft. :(
Can anybody recommend an electric motorcycle similar style/spec as the Super Soco TC MAX but built for taller riders?
Livewire
No.
It still seems to be pointless for me to own one. Range is the factor here, time for recharging is terrible. New 125cc can reach almost 80mph, burning as low as 122mpg (2L/100km) so the cost per mile is just above 4p. Considering advantages, such as range, time for refuel/recharge, availability of parts and prices, durability and so on, battery driven bike is still in antenatal stage...
I do not believe they will stop making combustion engines before 2050, the cost of batteries, needed materials and technology will not allow for such quick swap...
All tech starts somewhere. Batteries are developing fast and getting more Ah per kg. And they're getting much cheaper. There was a price fall of 50% for some top makes - with improvements. Fast charge tech is possible for e-bikes and it just needs standardization to the Tesla charger connections and software - then it will get much cheaper due to economies of scale.
@@ejbh3160 Life expectancy of the battery is 5 years. Batteries are expensive and CO/CO2 emissions to make them is huge, not to mention radioactive materials needed to make them.
Producing electricity is not cheap or emission free either, Euro 6 seems to be more reasonable and eco friendly than electric cars. How about used batteries? What to do with such waste?
And charging will be always slower than refueling!
Range on batteries will be always lower than on gasoline, travel time will be longer and as you go, your bike will remain heavier than with fuel tank!
My nami burn e e scooter goes that fast I've got 65 mph out of it
There was no point to keep watching after mentioning that there is no redudancy for unlocking the bike if the fob stops working. Enough with their stupid digital controls.
I think what we’re waiting for is that “quantum leap” in battery and charging technology that will make electric bikes a viable alternative for something other than an urban commuter. And that’s coming from an “old fart” who loves his gasoline powered bikes 😜🏍.
PS: I’ve enjoyed your detailed review of this one 👍.
there is a solid state EV battery due out this year that takes 5 mins to charge, cant wait
I'd love an ele tri bike but they seem to be falling behind electric cars big time. I'd love a electric cruiser like the harley live wire but affordable but there's bearly any electric bikes out at all
Silent bike = recipe of death, so, this bike should only be used on tiny slow speed roads.
Thought the same but having done a few hundred miles on electrics now it is not the issue you imagine it would be.
You mean for the one riding the bike or the others that don't hear you coming?
@@jedidorn The others dont hear you mate, I'm a rider and a driver, lots of times while driving I notice that there is a motorcycle behind or next to me after hearing their exhuast's sound, I'm not saying you should put a noisy exhuast, but a motorbike with a decent exhust's sound within the legal dB limits, makes a huge difference. When riding you should do your best to make yourself visible as much as you can.
The Distant future of transport be it bike or car or plane is (Either) Plutonium/Uranium. A small chunk would power it for the lifetime of the vehicle with no worries about charging/ refilling.
But for the foreseeable future ground based transport.... The vehicle would be powered by a Lithium-Iron battery for short range non-city use backed up by an Over-Air wireless charging network built into the roads of major towns & cities. The Car/Bike charges from the wireless road network as it's being driven & the user charged for the Electricity accordingly. Like a sort of Pay-as-you-drive scenario. Over air charging is not something of the future but technology that is available now but just needs to be modified for the intended use. I'm 52 so this is probably not something I will see in general use in my lifetime but will no doubt be used by future generations .... Just don't go over 88 mph while heading towards a clock !
tried it out just now, starts sooo sloooowwwww
It's a bike for small people, it gives small people half decent range but large people lousy range, it would struggle up a hill with a fat bloke on it but glide up a hill with his wife riding it assuming she ain't fat as well and most wives aren't compared to their men.
It's not a bike to go out for a ride on cos you won't get very far before you have to come back, but as a commuter it would work, except all the roads are being shut off to motorcycles as well as cars and they have made no exceptions for electric motorcycles so they have to travel the same roads as cars which means going the long way round, which means where you may well have had enough on a soco to get to work you now have issues due to the extra mileage you are travelling.
If the govt allowed these electric bikes the same right to go through those barriers so they would still be within range then they may become a more viable option, but they haven't, so petrol it is.
Taking all that into account and the price and these bikes are expensive for what they are, but they do hold potential, if you had two batteries and one in a back pack you might be able to extend your range a bit more, but then that would make the bike even more expensive, and then there is the resale value.
Those mirrors are ridiculous.
8:57 well maybe cuz u are a big dude.. usual rider standing around 5’9” to 6’ and weight between 70-80 kg.. no offence but good review tho thank you
This bike cost me £4,400
can't hit like becaus of 420 likes so i comment xD
Let someone give you one to play on ok but actually pay money for one over at the moment absolutely anything else do me a favour
More European sized and a super slippy fairing....