@@StringTechWorkstations I just ordered a Shechter mach 6 which I just noticed comes with an Ernie Ball compensated nut. My question is am I gonna have to file it down quite a bit because I play in drop C and drop B and will have to use Thicker gauge strings? I’m hoping that in those lower tunings, this kind of nut will help with intonation
Your skills are way under appreciated and even not even validated as credible in the guitar world ... I think it's a shame. You show how the compensated nut and set up works to correct the tuning of the guitar, which will never be perfect, every time you play an instrument you've worked on ... the proof is in the pudding, or playing in this case ! Great work man and mad respect from a nobody and fellow guitar tinkerer ...👍😎
It is way too inconvenient for the "industry at large" to accept this calibration method. There are too many variables, for this to become "commonplace".
BTW: FYI: I have a Gibson Chet Atkins guitar with nylon strings ... no need for a compensated nut on the classical guitars ( nylon string ) or bass guitars.
Very impressive result in terms of tuning stability and tuning across the whole fretboard as well! Nice to learn from You, thanks! What about tuning stability when it comes to bends? Can you achieve perfect tuning stability after huge bends? I mean 2, 3 or even 4 semitones.
Glad you enjoyed it! The tuning "returning to centre" after huge bends, will depend more on the mechanics of the guitar ( especially this one with the floating trem ). The fixed bridge guitars will obviously fair better. Cheers , MMcC
Very interesting. I have a few questions. 1. How do you determine the amount of “shelf” required at the nut over that first fret interval? 2. Are you intonating the open strings with the saddles first before determining the compensation required at the nut?
I do cover this in greater detail with my Tier 3 Patreon subs... with spec sheets and multiple examples. This is a moving target ... scale length / string gauge / tuning / action preference ... will all play into the final result.
Thanks Lucas. The 12" radius on the leading edge of the overhang has nothing to do with the fingerboard radius. I suggest that as a way to. " fast-track" the whole process of making a compensated nut. Cheers ! MMcC
I use budget strings of the same gauge for intonating and then when I'm happy with that I put on the actual strings. I don't want to sacrifice expensive strings. do you do this as well?
@@StringTechWorkstationsIf I may ask, do you take the tension of the strings into account as well? Or would it not matter that much, if it’s in the same ballpark? I can imagine that it would be a factor for intonation as well.
When you have a floating Trem like this ….it needs to be a lot closer than a “ballpark “ . A few grams of tension one way or the other will change the outcome.
Question: Once a nut comp is done, if I screw up the intonation by fiddling with the saddles, can my tech simply re intonate the guitar and will the comp still work? THANKS
Correct me if I’m wrong, but that’s a Misha Mansoor Jackson super Strat. Right? Super flat fret board (20” radius) and extremely hot bridge humbucker by Bare Knuckle. Fantastic guitar. I want one.
Compensated nut....luv it...! Just curious......what are your action readings on low to high E on 12th. fret and at 1st. fret..! Thanks for the video ....nice work you do.!
This was setup by the customer ( Dan ). He asked specifically to leave the action as he had set it . It was pretty close ... so I didn't bother measuring.
You didn't shape the radius on the underside of the shelf, where the shelf hangs over the top of the fretboard. Why did you skip that step? Not important?
The dimensions/ difference in how much of the nut is compensated may vary with different gauge strings….. so find “ your best” gauge set first…and then dial in the compensation for those strings…. Ask a very experience piano tuner technician who has experience working on Steinway pianos to show you the way their “scaling” benefits from their duplex system near the tuning pins …. For the Steinways it’s actually a way to tune the “back side of the string “… so that the very subtle harmonics are in tune with the main body of that specific string… The “compensated nut “ on guitars isn’t a a new idea…. But the poor intonation especially with the G and B strings at the first and second frets…was just… “accepted” as “ the sound of a guitar”….. but it’s not…. Poor tuning and poor intonation are signs of poor craftsmanship by the builder…and the player… NOT having the nut cut for intonation…. Is just less than excellence. And major manufacturers getting away with NOT providing a choice of compensated nuts ( per string gauge choices… ) ..is just upper management getting away with saving $3.00 per guitar…. While providing an inferior product. Again the MOST sensitive intonation problems are the G and the B strings… so three different compensated nuts…. For .090, .010 and 012 at tthe high E…. Would cut the out of tune-ness of the first fret open chords by A LOT… PS….to the people who say that “the nut slots are too high”…. Although high not slots do account for SOME..of the sharpness in SOME first and second fretting… ( as we ham fist and squeeze the strings too hard, and crush them into the fret board which bends them sharp)… the string length change …. Required to move that 1/2 step and whole step….. is quite different from wire thickness to wire thickness…. ( the required length change to move a 1/2 step on a .46 gauge string is ABSOLUTELY NOT the same length required to change .15 a half step….. and that’s the point….So ACTUALLY…the first and second “ fret placement” is the real failure…but correcting that would be even more difficult and expensive. So adjusting the nut relief position…is a compromise that cuts the pitch change error “enough” . Also…a great way to experiment with this issue… I have very small brass pins of various thicknesses that fit very nicely against the nut and under the G and B strings that work like “Zero Frets”.. ( zero is the location right next to the bridge)….i place the pin nest to the nut…. Re-turn the guitar… and then I can slide the brass pin toward the first fret… 1/64”or 1/32” of an inch…and PROVE… that “NOW THE FIRST TWO HALF STEPS ARE MORE IN TUNE”…. My brass pins are “piano flange pins”..( pivot pins) ..ask a piano tech if he can let you have one of a few different sizes… or …You might get lucky with even just using a very thin finishing nail… just for the experiment… Ps… yes I was a piano tuner… so I have the luxury of having over a dozen very fine graduations of those Flange pins….
I've been away for a week. Thanks for chiming in on this SBY ! This approach that I have developed requires "0" alteration of the original guitar. No drilling or cutting of the fingerboard or removal and re-placement of frets. The job is 100% reversible ( if the originality Police want to press the point ) .... it can be easily returned to it's un-tunable original condition. Touche ' !
I would be happy just knowing what Mike has forgotten. Love hi videos
Wow that guitar is in tune on all the chords! I haven't even finished the video yet and I'm already impressed!
Glad you like it! MMcC
@@StringTechWorkstations I just ordered a Shechter mach 6 which I just noticed comes with an Ernie Ball compensated nut. My question is am I gonna have to file it down quite a bit because I play in drop C and drop B and will have to use
Thicker gauge strings?
I’m hoping that in those lower tunings, this kind of nut will help with intonation
Not familiar with the nut or the Mach 6.
It will take some effort to duplicate your handy work. Very talented, thanks for sharing your knowledge. Great sounding chords too.
Thanks for listening
Your skills are way under appreciated and even not even validated as credible in the guitar world ... I think it's a shame. You show how the compensated nut and set up works to correct the tuning of the guitar, which will never be perfect, every time you play an instrument you've worked on ... the proof is in the pudding, or playing in this case ! Great work man and mad respect from a nobody and fellow guitar tinkerer ...👍😎
the certainly are in my world. A true master
It is way too inconvenient for the "industry at large" to accept this calibration method. There are too many variables, for this to become "commonplace".
quick question is this necessary on all guitars to make a comp nut and saddle ?
These two guitars were #10 + #11 from the same customer.
BTW: FYI: I have a Gibson Chet Atkins guitar with nylon strings ... no need for a compensated nut on the classical guitars ( nylon string ) or bass guitars.
@@StringTechWorkstations so that means this problem is exclusive of steel stringed instruments exept bass correct ? Acoustic and eletric guitar
@@diimuziku Correct.
Very impressive result in terms of tuning stability and tuning across the whole fretboard as well! Nice to learn from You, thanks! What about tuning stability when it comes to bends? Can you achieve perfect tuning stability after huge bends? I mean 2, 3 or even 4 semitones.
Glad you enjoyed it! The tuning "returning to centre" after huge bends, will depend more on the mechanics of the guitar ( especially this one with the floating trem ). The fixed bridge guitars will obviously fair better. Cheers , MMcC
Very interesting. I have a few questions.
1. How do you determine the amount of “shelf” required at the nut over that first fret interval?
2. Are you intonating the open strings with the saddles first before determining the compensation required at the nut?
I do cover this in greater detail with my Tier 3 Patreon subs... with spec sheets and multiple examples. This is a moving target ... scale length / string gauge / tuning / action preference ... will all play into the final result.
Great job, man!!!! May i ask if the why to contour de overhang part with a 12" radius is to math the fretboard radius?
Thanks Lucas. The 12" radius on the leading edge of the overhang has nothing to do with the fingerboard radius. I suggest that as a way to. " fast-track" the whole process of making a compensated nut. Cheers ! MMcC
I use budget strings of the same gauge for intonating and then when I'm happy with that I put on the actual strings. I don't want to sacrifice expensive strings. do you do this as well?
I use the exact same strings both times.
@@StringTechWorkstationsIf I may ask, do you take the tension of the strings into account as well? Or would it not matter that much, if it’s in the same ballpark? I can imagine that it would be a factor for intonation as well.
ok@@StringTechWorkstations
When you have a floating Trem like this ….it needs to be a lot closer than a “ballpark “ . A few grams of tension one way or the other will change the outcome.
That seems scary.
Question: Once a nut comp is done, if I screw up the intonation by fiddling with the saddles, can my tech simply re intonate the guitar and will the comp still work? THANKS
If they follow the step by step spec sheets that I send out to my Patreon Tier 3 subscribers . Yes.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but that’s a Misha Mansoor Jackson super Strat. Right? Super flat fret board (20” radius) and extremely hot bridge humbucker by Bare Knuckle. Fantastic guitar. I want one.
Yes indeed!
Compensated nut....luv it...!
Just curious......what are your action readings on low to high E on 12th. fret and at 1st. fret..!
Thanks for the video ....nice work you do.!
This was setup by the customer ( Dan ). He asked specifically to leave the action as he had set it . It was pretty close ... so I didn't bother measuring.
You didn't shape the radius on the underside of the shelf, where the shelf hangs over the top of the fretboard. Why did you skip that step? Not important?
The final height at the nut slot is determined by the tuning .... open string and fretted first fret note.
or there's a cheat way, cut a sliver of a Fender 1mm heavy pick and wedge it under the G-string at the nut . . .
ua-cam.com/video/5nT9ZcNHJq4/v-deo.html
The dimensions/ difference in how much of the nut is compensated may vary with different gauge strings….. so find “ your best” gauge set first…and then dial in the compensation for those strings…. Ask a very experience piano tuner technician who has experience working on Steinway pianos to show you the way their “scaling” benefits from their duplex system near the tuning pins …. For the Steinways it’s actually a way to tune the “back side of the string “… so that the very subtle harmonics are in tune with the main body of that specific string…
The “compensated nut “ on guitars isn’t a a new idea…. But the poor intonation especially with the G and B strings at the first and second frets…was just… “accepted” as “ the sound of a guitar”….. but it’s not…. Poor tuning and poor intonation are signs of poor craftsmanship by the builder…and the player…
NOT having the nut cut for intonation…. Is just less than excellence.
And major manufacturers getting away with NOT providing a choice of compensated nuts ( per string gauge choices… ) ..is just upper management getting away with saving $3.00 per guitar…. While providing an inferior product.
Again the MOST sensitive intonation problems are the G and the B strings… so three different compensated nuts…. For .090, .010 and 012 at tthe high E…. Would cut the out of tune-ness of the first fret open chords by A LOT…
PS….to the people who say that “the nut slots are too high”…. Although high not slots do account for SOME..of the sharpness in SOME first and second fretting… ( as we ham fist and squeeze the strings too hard, and crush them into the fret board which bends them sharp)… the string length change …. Required to move that 1/2 step and whole step….. is quite different from wire thickness to wire thickness…. ( the required length change to move a 1/2 step on a .46 gauge string is ABSOLUTELY NOT the same length required to change .15 a half step….. and that’s the point….So ACTUALLY…the first and second “ fret placement” is the real failure…but correcting that would be even more difficult and expensive.
So adjusting the nut relief position…is a compromise that cuts the pitch change error “enough” .
Also…a great way to experiment with this issue… I have very small brass pins of various thicknesses that fit very nicely against the nut and under the G and B strings that work like “Zero Frets”.. ( zero is the location right next to the bridge)….i place the pin nest to the nut…. Re-turn the guitar… and then I can slide the brass pin toward the first fret… 1/64”or 1/32” of an inch…and PROVE… that “NOW THE FIRST TWO HALF STEPS ARE MORE IN TUNE”….
My brass pins are “piano flange pins”..( pivot pins) ..ask a piano tech if he can let you have one of a few different sizes… or …You might get lucky with even just using a very thin finishing nail… just for the experiment…
Ps… yes I was a piano tuner… so I have the luxury of having over a dozen very fine graduations of those Flange pins….
I've been away for a week. Thanks for chiming in on this SBY ! This approach that I have developed requires "0" alteration of the original guitar. No drilling or cutting of the fingerboard or removal and re-placement of frets. The job is 100% reversible ( if the originality Police want to press the point ) .... it can be easily returned to it's un-tunable original condition. Touche ' !