I have lossless versions of movies that are on Disney plus like black panther 2, just listening to the beginning of both versions is all I needed to ever do. It's a huge difference!
Not sure if that's a fair comparison, first of all you're probably using 2 different devices, right? Second of all, could it be possible that Disney messed with the files to limit the bandwidth? A better comparison, IMHO, would be to compare a Blu-ray with a lossy audio track and a Blu-ray with a lossless audio track. While they're pretty rare, they do exist. The Dutch/Belgian/French Blu-ray of "It Chapter Two" for example, has a Dolby Atmos DD+ audio track, while many (most?) Blu-ray's from other countries have a Dolby Atmos TrueHD track.
@@TechnoDad if they have to know what to listen for to notice the difference, does it really matter then? it's like leading the witness, they might only hear it or think they hear it if you tell them it's there, but if they aren't aware without knowing then I'd argue it isn't affect their experience so not relevant It would be one thing if they heard the better one, heard differences on their own, then couldn't go back to the lower one without feeling let down or liek they were missing something. it's like the first time i heard sirus FM, I instantly heard the compression and went back to my mp3's cus it was just so irritating to listen to, but i've heard flac, and i go eh....the 320 kb/s mp3's are fine I can't notice a differnce in casual listening
Honestly i can only hear the slightest difference between dolby atmos wiith DD+ and dolby atmos with True HD. Both sound very good when I watch a movie via streaming or on disc. Or listening to music in atmos. As long as it sounds good in terms of 3D sound. Im all good!
I immediately hear a difference between DD+ and Dolby TrueHD. DTS is a little less noticeable IMO. I've been consuming DTS HD Master Audio and Dolby TrueHD since 2008. When Atmos and DST:X came out I quickly upgraded my receiver and speaker layout. My wife bitched for a long time about the 4 speakers I secretly installed on the ceiling 🙂 For a long time, I didn't realized as to why Blu-ray sounded so much better than Netflix even after seeing that my receiver was getting the Atmos data from my TV until one day I paid attention to the infamous DD+ showing on my Yamaha receiver screen.
Pretty hard for "us" as subscribers to do these close comparisons through UA-cam due to compression through UA-cam, or even our own Internet Providers. You providing files to compare will allow subscribers to hear exactly what you do on their own systems. - Cheers Channa!
Hey, I think the best way to do this is to do an mkv file. You can put inside it several versions of an audio track. All Dolby TrueHD Trailer files have those tracks - in TrueHD and in AC3 for compatibility. If you put 2 tracks in one MKV - and make sure there is no difference in Dialnorm flag for one - than we can play this file through a PC and switch between tracks on the fly.
I guess I was right on the other video, one factor for me that bothers me the most is to really enjoy the whole home theater thing you are dependent on how well the engineer mixes the track or movie. More than anything else probably will determine your experience
I always recommend the disc version if you have a blu ray player as the menu and navigation is a better experience - spatialcd.com/products/spatial-audio-calibration-toolkit-disc
COULD U PLSSSSSSSSS MAKE A VIDEO SHOWING WHATS BETTER APPLE MUSIC LOSSLESS OR APPLE MUSIC DOLBY ATMOS idk if its just me but dolby atmos music makes it so much quieter and i have to keep changing the volume for each song to keep it at level with a lossless track it makes every detail and voices so shallow lossless sounds better but i feel like im losing smtg im paying for with my aipords such as spatial audio etc PLS MAKE A VIDEO TECHNO DAD PLSSSSSS!!!!
Caleb just "answered" that over on a you asked on digital trends YT, it kinda depends on 1) your personal preference, 2) the quality of the mix/mixing engineer, Volumn is a function of the mxier (and some degree the format specifications) not really an ear mark of quality, louder recording level doesn't mean better quality recording....in fact more quiet recordings actually have more headroom for dynamics (asuming a good clean noise floor) so can provide a better experience, or at least more options and opertunities for dynaimc mixes. If lossless sounds better to you on the tracks you listen to, then you have your answer, you don't need anyone to tell you otherwise....Atmos can be and often is also lossless, it's just a matter of channels and processing man. It depends on the system too....listening to an atmos track on a 2 channel system is kinda almost pointless vs a 2 channel lossless mix. but again those tracks will be mixed, or again, can be, completely differently, so you might like the mix of one over the other, imersion aside. It gets a little more complicated with things like airpods that are essentially still just a 2.0 playback system using apples audio engine to create a pho atmos spatial audio field, but again you might not like what the mixer did for those spacial recordings, just not like everyone likes re-masters of old recordings, there is no right or wrong, do what you prefer. You aren't "missing out" or getting less then you pay for...just cus you dont use all the features, it's like saying you aren't utilizing your full subscription if you don't listen to podcasts or every genra of music
I hear a clarity and dynamics difference. Voice clarity is the main difference. I have not done a AB test. But i always struggle with understanding the speech in disney+ but never for the 4k blueray. What test I jave done is dts master vs dolby lossless. Dts was clear and dolby was not on my blurays. So from extrapolation, the lossy dolby is not great.
Playing from a disc for a movie approximately the file size comes aroung 120 to 180gb. When it comes for streaming the size of a rip can be reduced upto 350 mb . A decent 4k dolby atmos movie can be ripped around 5 to 8gb... When we say ripped defenitley we loose the quality...Also streaming platform has different rips in different sizes for a movie and depending on your device screen size and internet connection speed it switches to respective version dynamically... At the end if a streaming platform keep their fize as same disc there won't be any difference..but that is not practically possible due to their business model (except kaleidioscope).
you have to realize too it isn't just file size, streaming can and often does use different codecs then disc too. you can have an h.265 rip of an mpeg 4 dvd or h.264 blu-ray and get the same quaility in a smaller file size, also they can deliver less audio tracks then what a disc may have further dropping bit rate without affecting quality also the majority of 4k movies, the actual movie content is closer to 50-80 gb so the average bit rate, which really is what matters, not so much file size is for 4K HDR: 44-56 Mbps, and As of November 2023, the average internet speed in the United States was 219 Mbps for downloads, so the infrastructure is there, but you're right, bandwidth is expensive for the providers, so the less data they can send you, the better their bottom line, that's just the economics for sure.
A lot of people have nice speakers in crappy installations/calibrations/fidelity comprehension and room treatments. Even post calibration some retesting is long overdue
I just learned of another that heritage avrs with older surround formats, (a big deal for me right now). I purchased the Spatial Audio toolkit, to verify the REW and Audessy calibrations. “Spatial Audio is not referring to all Dolby labs formats but likely only Atmos/Auro”. The toolkit does not agree with heritage Dolby formats like upmixed Dolby Pro Logic IIx Cinema and DTS Neo:X. Neither work with your Spatial Audio Toolkit. Someday, I may use it but you will probably have a new DVD by then. A lesson that should be noted in a video, on the package or during ordering. It was a mind(cluck) for a minute.
Not being able to tell a difference can be attributed to UA-cam's compression, gear used to listen and FYI.. when asking audience to do critical listening, advise recommending they turn OFF 'Stable Volume' youtube setting, bc that influences playback
The biggest problem I foresee here is YOU made these files. Not Disney etc. Disney plus is probably the worst for audio as they absolutely crush the dynamic range on their streamed audio. I have to turn it up loads just to get reasonable audio most of the time and even then when there's explosions, gun shots, etc they aren't any louder. Like dynamic range compression/night mode is enabled. Resulting in action sequences being flat and lacking impact and immersion. I think the worst I ever heard was the entirety of Secret Invasion, which just made the show even worse than it's writing lol. I have some standard Blu-rays that at best have DTS (none X) including Marvel movies. If I compare say Avengers Assemble on Disney Plus to the none immersive none object bog standard Blu-ray I have the disc sounds miles better. It's not even close. Do keep in mind you don't know what people are listening to this test on either. A pair of headphones isn't likely to have the same frequency response as a decent speaker setup so it's entirely possible peoples headphones can't produce the extra information in a way they're going to notice any difference. Which is kind of the point of compression.. remove the information the majority won't notice anyway in order to reduce file size. People may not be noticing because they aren't doing the test in a home theater or with audiophile grade headphones. Plus it's entirely possible UA-cam is just compressing out the difference itself anyway. Making the files available for download would probably be a better idea. On a separate note isn't this what Auro have switched their focus too now with CX? Providing all audio in one stream whereby your audio equipment just ignores any headers it doesn't understand and plays what's left or something?
Atmos on disc sound much better as compared to anything streaming service. Amazon 5.1 sounds lot better than many Atmos on streaming service , it is hit or miss based on service and content, Music on Atmos doesn’t sound that good.
@ I fixed it, I meant to say streaming is not good. Too many content have very low sound I can’t even hear dialogue and that on sound system. Tv speaker sounds better at low level at high volume it is very bad.
For me regular surround sounds better than dolby atmos music. I need to turn up the volume so much when I play dolby atmos music. And It doesnt sound any better anyway.
I have lossless versions of movies that are on Disney plus like black panther 2, just listening to the beginning of both versions is all I needed to ever do. It's a huge difference!
I see!
Not sure if that's a fair comparison, first of all you're probably using 2 different devices, right? Second of all, could it be possible that Disney messed with the files to limit the bandwidth?
A better comparison, IMHO, would be to compare a Blu-ray with a lossy audio track and a Blu-ray with a lossless audio track. While they're pretty rare, they do exist. The Dutch/Belgian/French Blu-ray of "It Chapter Two" for example, has a Dolby Atmos DD+ audio track, while many (most?) Blu-ray's from other countries have a Dolby Atmos TrueHD track.
It depends on your equipment, and the listener has to know what to listen for
True!
@@TechnoDad if they have to know what to listen for to notice the difference, does it really matter then? it's like leading the witness, they might only hear it or think they hear it if you tell them it's there, but if they aren't aware without knowing then I'd argue it isn't affect their experience so not relevant It would be one thing if they heard the better one, heard differences on their own, then couldn't go back to the lower one without feeling let down or liek they were missing something. it's like the first time i heard sirus FM, I instantly heard the compression and went back to my mp3's cus it was just so irritating to listen to, but i've heard flac, and i go eh....the 320 kb/s mp3's are fine I can't notice a differnce in casual listening
i just got myself a 4k bluray player can you connect a soundbar to it
You can. 🤣
Yes, you should be able to…
Honestly i can only hear the slightest difference between dolby atmos wiith DD+ and dolby atmos with True HD. Both sound very good when I watch a movie via streaming or on disc. Or listening to music in atmos. As long as it sounds good in terms of 3D sound. Im all good!
Right on!
I immediately hear a difference between DD+ and Dolby TrueHD. DTS is a little less noticeable IMO. I've been consuming DTS HD Master Audio and Dolby TrueHD since 2008. When Atmos and DST:X came out I quickly upgraded my receiver and speaker layout. My wife bitched for a long time about the 4 speakers I secretly installed on the ceiling 🙂
For a long time, I didn't realized as to why Blu-ray sounded so much better than Netflix even after seeing that my receiver was getting the Atmos data from my TV until one day I paid attention to the infamous DD+ showing on my Yamaha receiver screen.
When it comes to music I’m not a fan of Atmos mixes
Understood…have you listened to my Atmos mixes?
Pretty hard for "us" as subscribers to do these close comparisons through UA-cam due to compression through UA-cam, or even our own Internet Providers.
You providing files to compare will allow subscribers to hear exactly what you do on their own systems. - Cheers Channa!
Anthem AVM90?
I wish!
Hey, I think the best way to do this is to do an mkv file. You can put inside it several versions of an audio track. All Dolby TrueHD Trailer files have those tracks - in TrueHD and in AC3 for compatibility. If you put 2 tracks in one MKV - and make sure there is no difference in Dialnorm flag for one - than we can play this file through a PC and switch between tracks on the fly.
I guess I was right on the other video, one factor for me that bothers me the most is to really enjoy the whole home theater thing you are dependent on how well the engineer mixes the track or movie. More than anything else probably will determine your experience
Totally agree.
Which Version Should I Buy Of Spatial Audio Calibration Toolkit? Disc Or Digital? I Have A Sony UB X700M Blu Ray Player
I always recommend the disc version if you have a blu ray player as the menu and navigation is a better experience - spatialcd.com/products/spatial-audio-calibration-toolkit-disc
COULD U PLSSSSSSSSS MAKE A VIDEO SHOWING WHATS BETTER
APPLE MUSIC LOSSLESS OR APPLE MUSIC DOLBY ATMOS
idk if its just me but dolby atmos music makes it so much quieter and i have to keep changing the volume for each song to keep it at level with a lossless track
it makes every detail and voices so shallow
lossless sounds better but i feel like im losing smtg im paying for with my aipords such as spatial audio etc
PLS MAKE A VIDEO TECHNO DAD PLSSSSSS!!!!
Caleb just "answered" that over on a you asked on digital trends YT, it kinda depends on 1) your personal preference, 2) the quality of the mix/mixing engineer, Volumn is a function of the mxier (and some degree the format specifications) not really an ear mark of quality, louder recording level doesn't mean better quality recording....in fact more quiet recordings actually have more headroom for dynamics (asuming a good clean noise floor) so can provide a better experience, or at least more options and opertunities for dynaimc mixes. If lossless sounds better to you on the tracks you listen to, then you have your answer, you don't need anyone to tell you otherwise....Atmos can be and often is also lossless, it's just a matter of channels and processing man. It depends on the system too....listening to an atmos track on a 2 channel system is kinda almost pointless vs a 2 channel lossless mix. but again those tracks will be mixed, or again, can be, completely differently, so you might like the mix of one over the other, imersion aside. It gets a little more complicated with things like airpods that are essentially still just a 2.0 playback system using apples audio engine to create a pho atmos spatial audio field, but again you might not like what the mixer did for those spacial recordings, just not like everyone likes re-masters of old recordings, there is no right or wrong, do what you prefer. You aren't "missing out" or getting less then you pay for...just cus you dont use all the features, it's like saying you aren't utilizing your full subscription if you don't listen to podcasts or every genra of music
@@Antimonkatshiit that makes sense
Thank u for the clarification brotha
If “lossless” is “lossless” why do I always feel it loses something?
versus, what?....live instruments Any recording will fall short of a live room with live isntruments even with mic'd sources like singers, drums horns
I hear a clarity and dynamics difference.
Voice clarity is the main difference.
I have not done a AB test. But i always struggle with understanding the speech in disney+ but never for the 4k blueray.
What test I jave done is dts master vs dolby lossless. Dts was clear and dolby was not on my blurays.
So from extrapolation, the lossy dolby is not great.
Man, I was waiting for this, but forgot what the hell I chose. I hope your personal “stuff” is going as well as it can, brother.
Appreciate it! There’s a lot still going on, taking it one day at a time.
Thanks
No problem!
That box has got to be either Anthem or Emotiva sent you something.
I wish it was from Anthem…
Doing this test over youtube is like trying to judge colors while wearing sunglasses.
Agree, but it’s the only way I can get it to you…
Playing from a disc for a movie approximately the file size comes aroung 120 to 180gb. When it comes for streaming the size of a rip can be reduced upto 350 mb . A decent 4k dolby atmos movie can be ripped around 5 to 8gb... When we say ripped defenitley we loose the quality...Also streaming platform has different rips in different sizes for a movie and depending on your device screen size and internet connection speed it switches to respective version dynamically... At the end if a streaming platform keep their fize as same disc there won't be any difference..but that is not practically possible due to their business model (except kaleidioscope).
you have to realize too it isn't just file size, streaming can and often does use different codecs then disc too. you can have an h.265 rip of an mpeg 4 dvd or h.264 blu-ray and get the same quaility in a smaller file size, also they can deliver less audio tracks then what a disc may have further dropping bit rate without affecting quality also the majority of 4k movies, the actual movie content is closer to 50-80 gb so the average bit rate, which really is what matters, not so much file size is for 4K HDR: 44-56 Mbps, and As of November 2023, the average internet speed in the United States was 219 Mbps for downloads, so the infrastructure is there, but you're right, bandwidth is expensive for the providers, so the less data they can send you, the better their bottom line, that's just the economics for sure.
A lot of people have nice speakers in crappy installations/calibrations/fidelity comprehension and room treatments. Even post calibration some retesting is long overdue
Good point!
I just learned of another that heritage avrs with older surround formats, (a big deal for me right now).
I purchased the Spatial Audio toolkit, to verify the REW and Audessy calibrations.
“Spatial Audio is not referring to all Dolby labs formats but likely only Atmos/Auro”. The toolkit does not agree with heritage Dolby formats like upmixed Dolby Pro Logic IIx Cinema and DTS Neo:X.
Neither work with your Spatial Audio Toolkit. Someday, I may use it but you will probably have a new DVD by then.
A lesson that should be noted in a video, on the package or during ordering. It was a mind(cluck) for a minute.
either arcam jbl or anthem
Nope, not one of those
OK that leaves monolith Emotiva iota and tonewinner
Monolith HTP1
Not being able to tell a difference can be attributed to UA-cam's compression, gear used to listen and FYI.. when asking audience to do critical listening, advise recommending they turn OFF 'Stable Volume' youtube setting, bc that influences playback
You’re right, good point!
Maybe just a dumb question but isn’t your room to small for the big towers you have and then the wee ones for the rear?
The biggest problem I foresee here is YOU made these files. Not Disney etc. Disney plus is probably the worst for audio as they absolutely crush the dynamic range on their streamed audio. I have to turn it up loads just to get reasonable audio most of the time and even then when there's explosions, gun shots, etc they aren't any louder. Like dynamic range compression/night mode is enabled. Resulting in action sequences being flat and lacking impact and immersion. I think the worst I ever heard was the entirety of Secret Invasion, which just made the show even worse than it's writing lol.
I have some standard Blu-rays that at best have DTS (none X) including Marvel movies. If I compare say Avengers Assemble on Disney Plus to the none immersive none object bog standard Blu-ray I have the disc sounds miles better. It's not even close.
Do keep in mind you don't know what people are listening to this test on either. A pair of headphones isn't likely to have the same frequency response as a decent speaker setup so it's entirely possible peoples headphones can't produce the extra information in a way they're going to notice any difference. Which is kind of the point of compression.. remove the information the majority won't notice anyway in order to reduce file size. People may not be noticing because they aren't doing the test in a home theater or with audiophile grade headphones. Plus it's entirely possible UA-cam is just compressing out the difference itself anyway. Making the files available for download would probably be a better idea.
On a separate note isn't this what Auro have switched their focus too now with CX? Providing all audio in one stream whereby your audio equipment just ignores any headers it doesn't understand and plays what's left or something?
Atmos on disc sound much better as compared to anything streaming service. Amazon 5.1 sounds lot better than many Atmos on streaming service , it is hit or miss based on service and content, Music on Atmos doesn’t sound that good.
You have it in reverse.
@ I fixed it, I meant to say streaming is not good. Too many content have very low sound I can’t even hear dialogue and that on sound system. Tv speaker sounds better at low level at high volume it is very bad.
Not a good test IMO
Copy that, thank you.
@TechnoDad the downloaded files will always hit right for test
For me regular surround sounds better than dolby atmos music. I need to turn up the volume so much when I play dolby atmos music. And It doesnt sound any better anyway.
I suppose it depends on the streaming service and platform you are using.
@TechnoDad i haven't listened to your songs yet. So no hard feelings towards you!:) i'm listening on my apple music app on the lg c1 tv.
months later 🤦🤦🤦
Yup! Life happens to all of us
This is useless