How to Coil Your Shoulders for Maximum Distance Potential
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- Опубліковано 1 лип 2024
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0:34 - What is Coiling?
1:09 - When Do We Start Coiling?
2:15 - How Do We Coil?
5:55 - How Do We Uncoil?
8:20 - How Much Coil Do You Knead?
10:16 - Eggsamples - Спорт
hey Beavis, did he just say to coil my unit?
Heh he hehe heh. He said load...
Huh huh huh. He said out, in, out. 🤘
Been playing three years and I throw about 275-300. I don’t think I’ve EVER coiled. Can’t wait to try this!!
Thanks, Josh. This answers my question from your other video. Keep up the good work!
This may be the most useful disc golf form tutorial video I have seen so far. Thank you!
Love your videos. It makes me se all of my misstakes and gives me a lot to work on.
This is such awesome information, I love the way you teach techniques and can't wait to try it. I would like to see more videos or just teachings for those of us that only do standstill throws.
Really good video, basically highlighting all my problems. Why is this game so hard... but I love it.
So good. It’s so hard for me to get myself to delay the coil. I always do it early, and then turn forward early before my weight is planted
Yea Zack my arm still "beats" my body sometimes and I really have to work on leading the throw from the ground up and keeping my lower body ahead of my arm.
This video is a revelation for me! I have not been tilting my shoulders and now I see why I was stuck power wise. It was great meeting you in person a few months ago. Keep on being awesome!
That shoulder tilt is something I figured out/started working on just last week! It was probably mentioned before, but it's still nice to find some understanding and get a confirmation that I'm working on the right movements. I also noticed the off arm movement/shoulder drive made a lot more sense to my body from a tilted coiled position than a flat one.
Good stuff, fellas. Love the seabas love.
You guys are the best. Such good content.
Great video!!
It’s kind of crazy watching this because I’ve watched hundreds of disc golf form videos and I’m somehow not doing like 75% of what you mention here. It’s not that I’ve never seen what you’re showing. I guess I’ve just never had each step of it broken down in a way where the importance of each little detail resonated with me enough to make me even attempt to incorporate it. Looking forward to trying to add these changes after work.
Great breakdown on the shoulder turn
Golf instructor here, love OT and wanted to say keep up the good work.
9:28 great advice! That makes total sense, can’t wait to try these out
This video literally added 100ft to my back hand. Reaching back to early in the x step was killing any distance I was trying to get. You the man!
Good stuff! Thanks for the shoutout!
Been plying two years and spent all summer on BH now to incorporate coiling and putting it all together. Can’t wait to try it and let it become ingrained and fluid. #nextyeargoals
straight on the grizzy .... ty for your free tips from the heart!
Something I have found helpful in coiling is to concentrate on my off/non-throwing shoulder (for me, that's my L shoulder). I had a problem with shoulder compression where I would "reach back" with my right arm, but wouldn't coil my torso along with it. So, in essence, I was just reaching my right arm almost across my chest. This killed my distance and ended up causing some shoulder pain because I was trying to get power from just my arm. Now what I do is focus on the feel of my non-throwing shoulder. If I focus on coiling/twisting that shoulder, my right one (throwing shoulder) necessarily follows and gets me in the appropriate position to uncoil/throw.
I then initiate the throw with my non-throwing shoulder (I kind of pop it in to start the uncoiling process) and intentionally create some compression between my non-throwing and throwing shoulder (while keeping my throwing arm relaxed) to create the whip. I've found all of this has helped to keep my right arm much looser and I'm better able to get the whipping motion. I don't even really think about "pulling through" anymore. My arm just follows everything else.
This was a bit of a revelation for me and I landed on it after realizing that my stand-still form was pretty decent, but that I would change a lot of it when doing the run-up. Now I almost try to mimic my stand-still form after planting my foot for the final stride like Josh described above.
I tried my best to make my thinking easy to follow, but not sure I succeeded. Hope it's helpful for somebody!
Feel like you’re talking right to me lol, thank you for this one! Helpful to see these visuals
Hey, it's the Socrates of disc golf! (-: Good stuff!
Thank you! I definitely am pulling the disc too far back. That lead shoulder down is a great tip. I am most likely not doing that.
Thanks for highlighting the "coil & uncoil" mistake creating the dreaded "horse stance"... a great reminder that I needed
The shoulder tilt down bit - that’s going to take me some work. It seems to be the last step to me finally unlocking some real power.
Would love to see a video on how much (if at all?) arm length affects distance potential!
Man I really liked the brick wall analogy. Makes sense
hey Josh, I looked back at a few videos I took of myself. I found myself forcing my weight to be on my back leg keeping my right shoulder slightly more upwards. I would x step find myself coiling back but I feel like I'm losing power somewhere in the uncoiling. I'm not sure if self consciously I'm pulling with my right arm. I also noticed I had to readjust my body for my hyzerflip shots aswell. thoughts?
Yes! We have sticks. We are becoming more and more like ball golf!
I'm assuming that front foot leaking open is what's causing my early release sometimes. I will occasionally get a ton of power but it's in the wrong direction because I'm unloading off my line. That actually opened my eyes a little bit.
Great Video! Just Kneads more Eggsamples.
I tried the coil and broke my distance record by 50 feet. But it was late release by 45 degrees. It was the most amazing shank I’ve ever had. It gets tough because as my core and upper body start going faster, I have to work even harder at not rounding and to not have my front foot “in line” to the target or else I guarantee a monkey paw.
this had so much good information and actionable coaching; I'm going to have to watch this a couple more times. something i've started noticing in the pros and something you demonstrated in your max coil example is an extra 'hitch' in the backswing right as the offhand initiates the uncoil; the disc hand snaps out or further/farther back an instant before it starts travelling forward into the pocket. not the point of this video, i'll be tilting my shoulders down, up, up if you need me, but I thought it was interesting enough that your swing is basically pro-level to mention it.
That happens if you can keep the lead arm loose enough when the trail arm starts coming through. Didn’t realize I was doing it
@@OverthrowDiscGolf I wasn't expecting a lightbulb moment, but here we are. That makes so much more sense than trying to force an extra movement at the apex of the backswing.
Whenever I reach back low and out like this it releases hard hyzer 100% of the time. I'd love to figure out how to flatten it out or throw on anhyzer when needed.
Love this video. Great stuff!!! I have a major problem, trying to keep head forward. I watched your video on head placement but still havr a very hard time. My head wants to always turn back. How do i stop this?
Use a mirror until. You shouldn’t be able to see yourself in the mirror until max coil.
Im a little confused about the mirror thing. Am i coiling towards mirror or away?
Get better bro. Solid content as usual...
Great video, as always. One point I was confused about, what exactly is making your arm go down at the end on a more straight reach back? People often mention pulling through on a straight plane (not necessarily flat), as if pulling something across a board, and doing this right now I can easily pull through straight and get my release to be straight/flat as well. So that part doesn't seem true or relevant to coiling.
Seems like you were just trying to drive home the point about engaging your hips/torso to create that space and angle for power (more coiling), but again none of that seems to inherently force someone to release down at the end.
Shortest version: flat to flat doesn’t tighten the oblique sling; therefore no power.
Short version: you can keep your shoulders level the whole time but there isn’t that much distance potential with it. You could use it for powered down shots. Try coiling back with level shoulders then with a tilt. Take note of your left obliques/back. When you tilt it stretches those muscles out better (loading them). Seabas22’s video we linked in the description has a good visual of that when he draws the blue line through.
Also, shoulder mobility makes it nearly impossible to follow through totally flat with any kind of speed.
Are you only coiling the right shoulder or are you trying to coil both shoulders at the same time?
Grew up playing ball golf righty, and I naturally gravitated towards lefty disc sports because my shoulders have so much muscle memory coiling to the right/clockwise. Coiling the other way just feels wrong.
I always start golfers on that side if they are beginners to see if it is more natural.
your hilarious in such a subtle way. he he.
Do you feel this content translates to the forehand throw as well?
7:35 how do you do this up and out trajectory while still keeping the nose angle down? That’s something I’ve struggled with for awhile.
Nose angle is relative to the plane you’re throwing on. Imagine you were throwing a spike hyzer (rhbh) so severe that it was straight up and down. Nose down in this case would be for the nose to point more right. Nose up would be if it pointed left at all.
Which is right, when reachback have I twist right shoulder back, or twist left shoulder forward (to the throwing direction)? Got the point?
Both are correct. Technically it will be your core rotating your shoulders
This is soooo close to what ive been trying to answer! Someone please help me to the finish line!
My issue is that when I try this "Out and down" reachback, all I do is throw basically spike hyzers. I have an incredibly hard time visualizing how you go from the "Out and down" position to a flat release.
You can bend at the waist less and pronate the forearm a little during reachback to get the disc flat
@mikey what's that dope beat?
I started in 2020 and I am finally getting to 350 and feel like I am coiling ok. Can always improve. I am curious how important is the placement of the non throwing arm? I notice a lot of pros tuck it into the body. On mine I have noticed I tend to keep it out. Not sure if my body is doing it instinctively for balance but have struggled to get it into my body. Any drills for that if it is important?
It’s important for sure. We have some videos on the left arm that need to be updated. Check out our buddy John over at AceIt disc golf in the meantime.
@@OverthrowDiscGolf thank you so much for responding. I will look them up and begin working on that.
Unless I stride long on my plant foot, I have alot of trouble actually driving off the back side. I just pick my back foot up and swing onto my front foot. Anybody figure out how to train a long stride with the back knee dropping to really push onto a active and angled brace?
It’s very simple… I see overthrow video, I click watch
You have our thanks
Can we get video about throwing standstills? As I started to rebuild my form I have dropped extra elements and throw only standstills off the tee. With my new form I get the same distance with standstills as previously with runup/X-step. Most guides tell timing regarding to the x-step and I struggle to implement them when throwing standstills. Standstill guide, with foot placement, weight transfer, kicking off back with back foot, coiling etc. would be much appreciated.
Benefits with throwing standstill, how much distance you sacrifice and what you gain in control or repeatability might be touched also. In effect is it good idea in some situations to throw standstill. In practice and even when playing.
Still on the list.
In the intro I thought u said “the crying never stops” and I felt that
industry standard for ball golf for a typical off the tee drive is 45 degrees of hip rotation and 90 degrees of shoulder turn. Do you think its roughly the same for disc golf? I know Dave Dunipace is a big fan of Seppo Paju and how he doesn't really extend his arm but still gets a lot of distance. I'm fairly certain its because he has a very high "x factor" which is the difference of degrees rotated between the hips and shoulders which in the ball golf community is the the biggest indicator or speed.
Yep! It looks to be about the same for disc golf. I’m glad you threw out those numbers because I have used them without knowing that’s what golf has been teaching so it confirmed that for me. X factor is the key as you’ve mentioned and whether or not the elbow is relatively straight or broken like Seppo seems to be a timing mechanism. It’s about that X factor not straight or bent arm.
Would the low to high motion not cause you to sky the disc and possibly cause it to be nose up? I had that issue when I tried low to high in the past
Nope. Two things: first, your disc doesn’t have to come out on the angle/level of your swing. Second, nose angle is relative to the plane you are throwing on. For example, spike hyzers can be thrown nose down.
@@OverthrowDiscGolf Hmm I see. I definitely have some learning to do haha!
You should do a form-review of Cynthia Ricciotti
Brother, I started a journey of teaching myself by watching your videos, but I am struggling to keep my lead shoulder down, and I can't seem to understand how to move my hips before my upper body. I don't seem to be able not to do It wrong😢
Josh loves Seabass!!! Josh ❤Seabass!!! Girl germs no returns...wait ummm... Hey look squirrel
Hold on, so if my shoulder is going up at the end is good? So why does my disc seem to fly extremely high upon release?
Do you have a video on backhand Off axis Torque?
We do not
@@OverthrowDiscGolf guess you know what to do next 😜
Make sense, I was wondering why sometimes I throw so low. And again rounding is the killer of everything. This somehow reminds me Jennifer Allen, she seems like having the good coil as you instructed. Another question, why does women tends to throw lower than men? Or is it because of women are shorter? Even women with good power don’t seem to be able to throw high, nose down , stable driver flip up shots. . I mean in general.
I coiled my unit once
This is probably a dumb question but how would one throw flat with the tilt at the waist?
Not dumb. You’d adjust by standing up more at the waist and potentially with the forearm. Check out the Simon and Drew slow mos we have on here as a reference
How do I submit a form video for review? I’d really love some advise
It would be through our Patreon (link in description). If you want it to happen this month then you would have to get everything submitted by this evening. If not it would be best to wait until next month
8:27, did you intend to say need as ‘knead’ on the titling? lol
Hey! isn’t this countering what ezra said in his 2 minute ”rotate, don’t lean” video?
Nope
Shoulders can get vary confusing especially if learning from others, some keep shoulders level while others drop the throwing shoulder.
Practice practice practice
Lots of people kneaded this video
My condolences about your throat.
I know I’m gonna ask a question that has a relative answer but how far on average should I be able to flip a putter with my wrist only on a sidearm
I just started my sidearm training a week ago . I can only using my wrist throw a putter about 125 ft. That seems unacceptable to me I was thinking 150-200
Not sure. But why would it matter? Just use a little more arm to get out further
I have recently come to understand that most power throwers really lead with the hips during the throw phase and keep that "coil" tension and maintain hip/shoulder separation for as long as possible to explode at the very end of the throw. This is something I really struggle with so would have loved to hear your thoughts on that as well!
We discuss it in the Hula drill, although briefly
Man you hit it on the hide. I start my reach early, peak, and have to start my throw before my foot hits.
What happens then is my foot is searching for the ground and fully open by the time it finally hits
This has been my big problem so this video is well timed
ASMRRRRRR
Been stuck at 350-370 for a bit. I think after watching this I realized how out of time my reach back is. Hmm
I think there is a little more to the story. Hip coil and shoulder coil are separate from each other and part of the lag. Hip coil on the x step and shoulder coil on the last step. Hip doesn’t coil as much as the shoulder. leading to the tension in the core.
There’s definitely a lot more to the story. But that would be a thirty minute video
@@OverthrowDiscGolf I get that and would watch it! I could see the one video to rile them all! 60 minute complete break down of every detail lol us form junkies might die and go to heaven
After watching this video and then the seabas one, I started using an exercise band anchored to a door handle. I have it so theres a little tension on the band when I’m at the start of the x step, so as I complete the step the band pulls my shoulders round and extends my arm. It also make you feel a little off balanced if you don’t step across a bit when planting your foot. You then get the feeling of what muscles come into play as you uncoil. Think it could be a good exercise if done correctly, so maybe you could have a go and see whet the proper form should be, and do a video about it?
You would throw 100' further just getting in shape. Optimal shape to throw
Josh throwing disc golf gang signs
I'll work on it. Tilt? Well okay.
Dear Josh, Sorry you're sick. That's lame. So I was watching this video from Ben's Big Drive (ua-cam.com/video/jN7HMVWg4MI/v-deo.html), and he makes a big deal about keeping your body level during the coil. He says that tilting down at all in the coil interrupts the angular momentum (my term: I used to be a tennis coach) by inserting a vertical momentum. He says that twisting in a way that is not level will cause your body to go into subconscious self-protection mode, trying to avoid injuring itself. I think the interesting thing is though that in his own example of his throw at the beginning and end of his videos (which looks great), he seems to be less upright than he is teaching everyone to be. But overall he looks like he has a lot of good things to say and makes a good video. Would you check him out and help me understand what he is saying? Maybe y'all are saying the same things. Peace.
Hey Jacob. So I’ll say that I didn’t watch the video from Ben (solid guy btw), but I’ll just address the concept using a tennis metaphor since we were both tennis coaches at one point.
Does tilt disrupt angular momentum?
No. Think of the serve where we lift the left side up with the ball toss and drop the right shoulder respectively. The hips are also mirrored here. So we load down into the legs and spring up causing the shoulders rotate up and forward. Super similar mechanics to the throw here regarding tilt and rotation. Same thing on tennis forehand where you load into the back leg (tilt), left shoulder is up (also tilt), and the hips rotate counter clockwise to open while the swing path loops upward. Seemingly conflicting motions but we know from tennis that they don’t conflict.
Again, unsure of what Ben says in his video but just addressing your underlying question.
@@OverthrowDiscGolf Sweet, brother. That makes sense. I understand! AND, today I had five minutes and threw 4 discs smoother and more accurately than I've ever thrown them after watching this video... just thinking about coil... so thank you! I really enjoy y'all's method. I have been stuck at 330 for a few months and am trying to figure out how to get to 400. I am trying to tap into my tennis, but I'm struggling to find the right mechanics. I think to myself "I have been playing tennis all of my life, I know I can do this." But something in the timing has to be killing me.
@@FrJacobRogers yep. A bunch of little things. 400 is no joke. If you had a decent backhand in tennis the odds are in your favor
I’m surprised that it wasn’t a HIGE frunk.
Missed the "drop" at like 315. Come on... You guys can do better. Lol. Great content.
That cough though
rofl that intro
"Look, I didn't come here to be criticized by a man stuck in a coil!"
ua-cam.com/video/Wb1GFwMi8wg/v-deo.html
both these videos together really helped me with my form
Off topic, but what happened to deep roots disc golf??? They disappeared from earth
I met up with them not too long ago. They are doing well just a lot going on with them. Just busy life stuff for the most part.
hey stop dropping videos on league night you are costing me MONEY$ $ $
I feel like this video would have been better if you were throwing the Tilt. You only say that word no less than 100 times 😂
I’ve got one of those. Lol. But after we filmed this
I'm soooo confused 😅😅
But sir, your coil was just what you said "not to do"? The "reach out" was behinde your body 🤷
Or that what it looked like...
Yeah. It’s close to being too far behind me but you’d have to look at the angle from directly behind my throwing line to be sure. Basically though, “do as I say and not as I do” wouldn’t be bad to apply here if you think it is too far behind me.
A guy that probably gasses tying his shoes should not post videos on how too.
Oh I can tie my shoes without getting gassed so I’m good to go
Slingshot Disc Golf can fix ya.
Coil the Waist Not the Shoulders, Drive Off the Right foot since your power is coiled that way.
Why do you drive off your Front Foot? Your Way Fd My Knee
Slingshots Fixing Brody. He can Fix Your Issues. Before you Hurt Yourself or Others with Misguided Lessons in Sports Sciences.
Don’t Believe Me Watch Brody On Slingshot Disc Golf s Newest Vid.
I unsubscribed Your Hurting People
This is not the way
Controlling the off arm movement is money in coiling too👌🏽👌🏽💸💸🥏🥏
Are you only coiling the right shoulder or are you trying to coil both shoulders at the same time?
Right goes back and left goes forward to the target