What it REALLY Means to Be "Sonic 4"
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- Опубліковано 21 вер 2023
- The classic sonic games on Sega Genesis are some of the most acclaimed 2d platformers of all time; And for as long as they have existed, people have always held them in extremely high regard (and for good reason). However, all of these games are now around 30 years old and in those 30 years there have been quite a few 2D Sonic games that have attempted to capture that same magic! The most infamous example of this was when Sega released Sonic the Hedgehog 4 Episode 1 in 2010, and everybody and there mother absolutely despising it! However, i'd like to think it's because of how colossal of a failure that game was that sparked a lot of conversation about what games were considered the "TRUE" Sonic 4! I thought that since Sonic Superstars is only a few weeks away, what better time could it be to look at a few examples of 2D sonic games that people generally consider to be the "TRUE" Sonic 4, and see how well they go about doing so!
Enjoy!
Credits:
Sonic 4 Episode 1 Footage: • Longplay of Sonic the ...
Sonic 4 Episode 2 Footage: • Sonic the Hedgehog 4: ...
Sonic Rush Footage: • Sonic Rush playthrough...
Sonic Pocket Adventure Footage: • Sonic the Hedgehog Poc...
Sonic Mania Ray Speedrun (this blew my mind): • [Personal Best] Sonic ...
Sonic Boom Rise Of Lyric Glitch: • Sonic Boom: Rise of Ly...
Sonic Superstars Multiplayer Footage: • Sonic Superstars New G...
Sonic Superstars Speed Jungle Footage: • 9 Minutes of Sonic Sup...
New Super Mario Bros Wii Footage: • New Super Mario Bros. ...
Sonic Mania Unused Credits (Tee Lopes): • Sonic Mania - Unused C...
#sonicsuperstars #sonicthehedgehog #sega - Ігри
The thing about "Sonic 4" is, it wasn't SUPPOSED to be "Sonic 4" from the start. It was simply just going to be a mobile game that was instead brought to consoles as well and the only reason the game got that title was for marketability reasons. So technically it isn't really a sequel to Sonic 3 at all and I think that's why it was so disappointing.
Yep! As far as I (and I'm sure everyone) was considered, it was doomed at the very start; And it also highlights just how shady and scummy SEGA was with there marketing back in the day.
Looking back, I felt I should've included that tid-bit in the video. Only reason I didn't was because I felt like I was dragging on with providing context for Episode 1's existence and didn't want that section to go on for very long.
@@YoungAvJoenow that I think about it, that’s probably why episode 2 is better. They actually had the intention of making it sonic 4
I think sonic the portable was the best take for sonic 4
Also, fun fact: you don’t need the Homing Attack or Homing Dash to beat the game *ON MOBILE.* The physics of the mobile version are just better, which makes Mad Gear Act 2 possible exclusively on mobile, and the only TRULY impossible level is the console version of Casino Street Act 2, while the mobile exclusive version is completely possible. Also, Lost Labyrinth Act 2 is different between console and mobile, but both versions are equally as possible.
@@hereby9408Idk what about Sonic Advance or Mania?
I guess the true Sonic 4 was the friends we made along the way.
Fax straight from the Fax machine!
And we all know Sonic has made a LOT of friends along the way...
Sonic 4 was one of those games you see on those rom sites.
I’m surprised Sonic Triple-Trouble wasn’t considered on this list, considering it was trying to be the sequel to Sonic 3 & Knuckles. I know it was only 8-bit originally, but the fan remake into 16-bit really shows it was trying to be a sequel to Sonic 3 & Knuckles
Edit: I think three people at this point have said that it’s a sequel to Sonic Chaos. I got it now thank you
That's one that I STILL need to play lmao! But from what I've seen, it does seem to check most of the boxes of what I personally view as Sonic 4! Really gotta try it out sometime!
Sonic Triple Trouble was not trying to be a Sonic 3K sequel. It's a Sonic Chaos sequel. The remake changes the game drastically. It might as well be an entirely different game.
The remake is used in discussion too often for how it uses a *glitch that was fixed in &Knuckles* as a vital plotpoint.
The original 8 bit version was the sequel to Sonic Chaos, another 8 bit game. It's only the 16 bit fan remake that's taking place after Sonic 3&K
@@SenpaiCasey2023I mean, Triple Trouble has Knuckles in it, which means whether it's a *sequel* or not, it still must take place after S3&K
Watched the entire video, and honestly, this needs to be noticed by the Sonic Community. This is the first time ive seen someone actually disect this entire debate and youve done it well.
Appreciate the kind words, although I am a bit frightened by this community sometimes, lmao. But I'm really glad you liked the concept of the vid!
@@YoungAvJoe I never actually finished the game, so I never realised this. But now I'm like WHAT 18:25
@@YoungAvJoeAnd honestly, I think Sonic Mania should be Sonic 4, because even if it is based on older levels, I still consider it a sequel, because think about it this way: Sonic and Tails are in the Tornado to go to Angel Island, just to have fun there, meet Knuckles, etc etc. But then he sees robots from Eggman, tries to beat them, but they throw him in an interdimensional portal that teleports him back to Green Hills, where there are yet again badniks causing trouble. Sonic then runs trough a lot of places he already visited, including some new ones. And then, that thing of the ending happens and now it's Sonic Forces. I don't know if I consider Sonic Forces as Sonic 5, but that's a completely different story (wow this is a very long comment - but the video is awesome, so it's worth it). 21:47
@@YoungAvJoeOh forget it, it's obviously Superstars (i just heard you say the thing about 12 new original levels LOL)
1: If you want to completly ignore SForces, you can use the Phantoms Ruby's to say that it just moved Sonic directly to Sonic Mania Encore
2: Tecnically, Superstars is Sonic 5, since it's confirmed to happen after the Classic comics, which include caracters that where introduce in Mania, making Mania Sonic 4. Unless you'll take Mania as a weird naming like CD's
i mean you could say:
Sonic 1 - Sonic 1
Sonic CD - Sonic 1: Part 2
Sonic 2 - Sonic 2
Sonic 3&K - Yeah
Sonic Gen. - Post Sonic 3&K But not Sonic 4
Sonic Mania - Sonic 4
Sonic Forces - Between Sonic Mania and Plus
Sonic Mania Plus - Sonic 4: Part 2
Sonic Superstars - Sonic 5????
@@TakenUsernameAuradiumwhere would Knuckles Chaotix would be?
@@tapgames3465 I didn't think of that, but probably between sonic 3&k and gen. just anything classic Sonic released and 3&k, is well, after 3&k
This comment did not age well since it’s now confirmed that sonic superstar comes before sonic mania
@@SonicDudeDoIt no? Takashi Iizuka said exactly the opposite
surprisingly, when sonic 4 episode 1 first came out, people genuinely really liked it... which is why episode 2 happened. However, that's when people started hating it so episode 3 (which I believe had lots of potential to go even further like how 2 did, even maybe working kinda like heroes in 2D) got cancelled.,
Ik D:
Tbh, I really would've liked to see a 3rd episode. I felt like if they did learn the right lessons from episode 2, they could've made something that was quite good!
@@YoungAvJoe EXACTLY!!! episode 2 was genuinely really good, it sure had some mistakes but it definitely fixed all the issues of episode 1 and the physics were a LOT better, so yeah, episode 3 woulda been amazing and I'm really upset ;~;
@@SurfRaywouldn't say "really good" it was decent
By "people" you mean video game journalists. Sonic 4 EP 1 was never well received by general audiences despite it's good review scores.
actually 4 episode 3 got cancelled because sega of australia imploded
So, that was a good video.
I don't think that Sonic Advance not having new concept for zones is a problem to it being contenter for sonic 4
Both Sonic 2 and 3 has their majority of their zones be derivative of their prequels (Carnival Night - Casinino Night - Spring Yard Zone) (Marble Garden - Aquatic Ruins - Marble)
And Advance does different things with it's theme, Ice Paradise definitely feels different to Ice Cap
Fair. Again, like I said in the vid, a lot of people are with you in that. For me personally though, I feel like seeing new themes and gimmicks are an essential thing for making the game feel more like a progression than a throwback. And now that you mention it, having "sequels" to zones from past games does is something that the Genesis sequels did a lot, and comparing those zones to what we got in Advance, it really isn't that much different.
Even still I think that Advance 1 wasn't even trying to be the "4th Sonic The Hedgehog", but rather "The 1st 2D Sonic game in 8 years".
Advance’s soundtrack is painfully underrated to me. I’ve seen reviews where they call it forgettable and I’m like “Secret Base, Ice Mountain, Egg Rocket? No? Aww”
Sonic Mania has one tiny detail that doesn’t seem to affect anyone: it began as a Fan Game
everyone seems to have forgotten that so let me remind you guys about that
Nothing wrong with a "fan game". "Fan game" implies it was made by fans, which is a good thing. Could've done with more fans working on Superstars.
I remember before Mania came out, many considered Advance 1 the true Sonic 4
This was an excellent vid. You really hit the nail on the head with the difference between a great *game* and a great *sequel.* It really makes you appreciate how many new and totally fresh ideas each of those original games had, considering they came out back-to-back. The most exciting thing I’ve read about Superstars is Naoto Oshima joking that sometimes he’s scared his team went too far with the crazy new ideas. They’re finally willing to be daring with Classic Sonic again.
Thank you for the kind words!
I think I might know the exact article your talking about, and that single line by Oshima put the biggest smile on my face!
Sonic Adventure is the true Sonic 4 because it was Sonic Team’s follow up after 3 and Knuckles in fact the echidna storyline is straight out of the original JP manual.
This was a really good video. I was very tuned in a great this analysis was. I can’t wait for Superstars to come out and follow that great sequel formula that Sonic 1, 2, and 3 had. Keep doing videos like this bro!! Subscribed.
Thanks for all the kind words! Really happy to see people enjoying this one!
Great video! While Sonic Superstars isn't out yet it looks a lot like what we would have expected from the "real" Sonic 4. However I agree that Sonic 4 Ep II, Sonic Advance and Sonic Mania are the closest things we have, and I love Sonic 4 Ep II and Sonic Mania (haven't played Advance in a while). I might even argue that Sonic Generations is the real Sonic 4 just because of how it picks up and improves the classic formula, while adding in the new modern boost gameplay. Underrated creator, keep it up!
This was a great video. Clear, concise and funny all at once. I’d love to hear your opinions on Superstars now that it’s released.
I don't get the obsession over names and subtitle legacies to be honest. For me there isn't the "real Sonic 4" or the "real Sonic Adventure 3" or the "real Rush 3" etc, everything is just a Sonic installment. The next Classic game isn't the "real Sonic 4", it's just Sonic Superstars. Each new game is just the new game, each upcoming one is simply the next one. Sonic ain't a franchise like Mario where everything is mostly disconnected, Sonic has an attempted coherent structure, there is no real reason to spend time trying to identify each new game as some direct successor to an earlier subtitle, they're just additions to the Sonic canon.
Not to undervalue your points and stuff, video was great, just speaking my piece about this whole thing. On a kinda similar note, Sonic 4: Episode I sucks mhm, Sonic 4: Episode II however slaps, its actually amazing, I'm glad its getting love lately by both SEGA and the fans. Will forever be bummed Episode III never came to fruition (especially after seeing the teaser for it recently).
I TOTALLY understand that! Hell, in some ways, doing that to a game is only ever setting it up for disaster; As regardless of the direction the game is gonna take, people are inherently going to expect the game to be as good as it's predecessors and tear the game to shreds if it's anything less than that. However, I feel like when many people talking about the "TRUE" Sonic 4, there mainly talking about a follow-up in a spiritual sense. It's just something that I (at the very least) find fun to discuss
Also yea, Episode 2 is SUPER underrated and I'm glad it's starting to find it's fans!
For An Underrated UA-camr, This Is a Good Video! You Need More Support.
Great video
Thank you!!!
I was watching the video and I was like "This is a really good video the channel must have some good number of subscribers" and now I am very weirded out by the fact that you have only 654 subscribers with videos like these. You definitely need more attention. So, here is a sub for ya!
Comments like these mean more than you could possibly imagine! I greatly appreciate the kind words and thank you so much for checking my stuff out.
@@YoungAvJoe No prob!
Great video I agree sonic superstars (hopefully) will be what is the true sonic 4
I’m glad I’m not the only one that found Episode II to be a pretty good game. Couldn’t finish Episode I but I replayed II about 3 times
even though sonic 4 ep 1 and ep 2 didnt have the best reputation, I did enjoy them and I wish we would have gotten episode 3
Same! Although I don't really think it's that necessary, it still would have been really cool to see!
Sonic 4 definitive edition when
Man keep it up with the great videos!!!!
Also personal opinion, Sonic Adventure is Sonic 4. It to me still feels like the truest 3D representation of the 2D Sonic formula.
I’m curious about your take on Classic Sonic debate, should we still have him around or stop making classic Sonic games. Some say yes he should stick around as will get two types of Sonic such as 2D and 3D but on the other hand there are others that think Classic Sonic should be over it with as it takes away from 3D Sonic and the resources/attention for the mainline Sonic games
Thank you for talking about the positive aspects of Episode II. It’s easy to just lump in in with Episode I (especially since they were treated as one package) but I’ve always felt that II on its own was a solid game. The visuals, mechanics, and level design were all vastly improved on. I even think some (not all) of the music is good, I can still hum Metal Sonic’s theme to this day.
Maybe the true sonic 4 was the friends we made along the way
This is such a good video, thank you for this.
Appreciates the kind words! Thank YOU for watching!
6:15 I see an image saying Media Offline, but that gives one question. why is it there?
6:16 what is this picture that says media offline?
How's Superstars for you now that you got your hands on it? I personally really adore the game and all the new additions it's added to the gameplay (and cast!)
Do you have a list of the music you used or at least the song that plays at 10:35 or so
I still think Mania is worthy of being Sonic 4 despite the reused level aesthetics, because at least the level *layouts* and some of the enemies and gimmicks in them are new... or brought over from unrelated zones. So in that sense, they're still "new", despite the aesthetic being all too familiar.
Also, while Superstars does have completely new level themes... Green Hill is still there as a Battle Mode stage and in Amy's opening cutscene when starting the game as her. But you'd have to be *INSANE* to suddenly no longer consider Superstars as your personal Sonic 4 just because of that.
I was like, this was released 2 days ago, how haven’t you mentioned Sonic Superstars yet, and then I saw the end of the video
To me, Sonic Advance 2 would be a good enough Sonic 4. It keeps everything from Sonic 3&K except for the elemental shields, which appears to be a S3&K exclusive thing to let it have something dinstinctive, but also adds the ramps and the air tricks, the "boost" (the only version of "boost" I like) and you still have to use physics to earn speed. Yes there are a lot of dash pads, springs and so on, but in most places after that you have to react correctly to something coming after if you want to keep that speed. And the air tricks also help you gain speed faster (or not losing it) when done at the right time/height with the right direction, etc.
If we're talking strictly about the evolution of the 2D series, I guess I can kinda see that. Half a decades worth of 2D Sonic games more or less used/evolved that same boost mechanic from that game, so it does make a lot of sense.
The elemental shields weren't kinda exclusive to s3&k,the two shields appears too in sonic r
Terrific video
I'm interested in a followup about your thoughts on Superstars post release
Sonic 4 was the friends we met along the way.
Definitely agreed. Mania would have been the perfect sequel if all the levels had been new. I liked seeing old zones in new light, but I would've liked it even more if everything was new. Not the style and the graphics, that was PERFECT. I just mean that I wanted new zones.
Damn this was a good video
I think Sonic Superstars is a gonna be a really good contender when it comes out, seeing as every single zone in the game is original.
It was okay
The way I see Sonic 4 is a what if Modern Sonic was in Sonic 1 and Sonic 2
Sonic Mania and Superstars are definitely the closest considerations for a true Sonic 4 to me
Sonic mania is a glorified remake
On the 0 retrurning zones thing, yes green hill returns in battlemode, but again, only in battle mode, a side mode, all the zones in the main game will be original enough to be considered new
i think real sonic 4 would have to give new mechanic like elements were in sonic 3. giving emeralds an ability i think is basically that. so yeah thats why i think superstars actually feels like sonic 4 with few other things. sonic mania just feels like 2d generations or just copy of every sonic game but only with good parts about it more than new. if anything mania gives weird perfect 3.5 feels to me. just like cd would kinda give me 1.5 feels
In my personal opinion, the sonic games go sonic 1, CD, 2,3,triple trouble,mania, advanced, sonic 4 episode 1-2 and superstars
Whats the song at 2:00 i have nostalgia
When ever i hear about a new sonic game. I think, in the immortal words of Ashens. "Bloody hell, are we still doing these?"
Nice video
“Tails (the best character in the series)…”
You’re God damn right.
Knuckles' Chaotix was the true successor to Sonic 3&K. This game:
1) Introduced six new playable characters (Mighty, Vector, Charmy, Espio, Heavy and Bomb)
2) Expanded on Classic Sonic’s gameplay with the Ring Tether mechanic, Combi Catcher, a Level Hub, and a day/night system
3) Was made up of all new stages, each with their own unique aesthetic
It may not be the most loved game, but these qualities make it the real Sonic 4 in my eyes.
2:31 Which, honestly, baffles me. Unleashed was waaaay better than 06. Or even Shadow & Heroes. Easily the best Sonic game since SA2. Arguably even since SA1 (since Unleashed had a more coherent story and I prefer the Werehog gameplay over the non-Sonic playstyles from SA2). It also had the best hub worlds in the entire series with loads of memorable NPCs.
And nowadays you can play it in lovely 60fps on Xbox Series X.
The reason why the classics were better also was the music because that is what welcomes you to the level and to the game
No joke, when he said “add” at 4:57, an ad played for me.
Was this intentional?
We’ve done it…we made an official classic Sonic Heros…Superstars…because it’s 4 player and if u play as 3 player without amy that’s basically classic heros
20:32
In my opinion, a true Sonic 4 needs to expand on what Sonic 3 & Knuckles.
Have more of a focus on the story, evolve the controls, add more characters, have more unique levels, etc.
So out of all of the games mentioned, yes, Mania is the most Sonic 4. But I’ll argue SA1 is the true Sonic 4.
It evolves 3&K’s gameplay by putting it into 3D.
It adds more playable characters.
It expands Knuckles having his own story in 3&K, to all 6 playable characters having their own story.
The have more of a focus on story than 3&K like a Sonic 4 should.
It expands the lore of what was already established in the classics.
New human environments.
And while the levels aren’t the most original things in the world, even reusing areas from 3&K. Everything else counteracts that and makes the game still feel like an evolution to 3&K.
I know it’s 3D and it doesn’t take place immediately after 3&K. but timeline order and it being 2D like before aren’t going to stop other franchises, like FNaF, Spark, or Castlevania, why should it stop Sonic?
Does that mean SA2 is Sonic 5 and 06 is Sonic 6, and P-06 is the true Sonic 6? Maybe, and I don’t see the problem with that. But this is strictly about what’s Sonic 4, and I would say SA1 is the true Sonic 4.
Episode 1 I was able to tolerate for various playthroughs, but I don't think I was able to finish Episode 2 even once. I hated the forced and clunky interactions with Tails, the constant reminder that the devs think I'm a moron by placing 140 billion warning signs anywhere near a pit or something, the constant tutorial interruptions throughout the game, etc... I just couldn't put myself through it anymore. Such a shame, I was so looking forward at how they addressed all the issues with EP1... Oh well. At least Mania happened eventually.
From my knowledge superstars is meant to be the followup of triple trouble (which is probaly why knack the weasle is in it) so it'd be the sonic 5
I always have the head canon of this timeline order:
Sonic 1
Sonic 1 8 bit
Sonic CD
Sonic 2 8 bit
Sonic Chaos
Sonic 2
Sonic 3
Sonic & Knuckles
Sonic Triple Trouble
Sonic Superstars looks good and im definitely going to buy it, but Ill never forgive what they did to Amys moveset. Turning her from her completely unique playstyle from Advance to "Insta Shield and Drop Dash, but a little different" is so frustrating.
Sonic Superstars was actually called Sonic the Hedgehog 5 in development so...
Also what about pocket adventure? It serves as a transition from classic to modern as seen in Robotnik's clothes
Sonic Generations can't count?
I mainly discussed games that were widely considered to be the "REAL" Sonic 4, by most people. I guess if were using the canonical argument, then Generations would fit under there as well given that it does feature classic sonic in a modern storyline, but next to no one is saying that it's Sonic 3 follow-up.
Sonic from sonic mania i think there are two separate time after sonic r which the one that classic sonic does not go to generations the ending in sonic mania (mania mode) takes him straight to sonic mania (encore mode) but the one he did get to sonic generations he went to forces after mania mode and at the end of sonic force he does not go to encore mode but sonic mania adventures the UA-cam series
That's great an all but what about Sonic 5?
i just want sonic mania 2 man, all original zones, add more characters and i am happy
In my opinion the closest thing to sonic 4 is sonic advance. I’m not saying it’s factually sonic 4 but it’s the closest. I would never say advance 2 is sonic 5 and advance 3 is sonic 6 though, as those games are too different. It’s like the SA3 debate, people always argue which sonic game is SA3 but there’s no definitive answer.
Now can you do a video called, What it REALLY means to be ''Ghostbusters 3''?
Sega could come out and say the full name was “Sonic For Mobile” and fix everything
My personal headcanon is that Sonic Triple Trouble 16-bit is the true Sonic 4. Sure, it may be a fan-made remake, but if Sega released TT16 as an official Genesis game after Sonic 3, it would've made for a perfect sequel.
And triple trouble-16 bit is unofficial game
Idk man, I've always felt like Sonic and Knuckles was Sonic 4, and that Sonic 3 and Knuckles was a bonus 3-4 fusion game.
Sonic Superstars seems to be the closest thing to actual Sonic 4 that we've got so far.
The actual Sonic 4 was obviously not what we wanted from Sonic 4, because of multiple reasons.
Sonic Mania was mostly just a remix ofthe classic games, so not really Sonic 4 either.
Sonic Superstars on the other hand has those great physics that we loved about the classic games and Mania. But it also has some fresh new ideas like a proper sequel is supposed to have. Like the emerald powers for example.
Surprised there was no mention of Sonic CD. I mean, it can't really be classed as number 4, but it is part of the original '4' games.
Honestly, does a game even _need_ to be Sonic 4? The Advance Trilogy is a worthy trilogy in its own right, as is the Rush Duology (or Trilogy if you count Colors DS), Mania is a lovely celebration, and Superstars could be the groundwork for a whole new set of 2(.5)D Sonic games. Basically, rather than try to follow up S3&K, Sega should focus on following up that trilogy as a whole with new Sagas.
Still, great video!
You mentioned Mania trying to enter the Canon, don't forget about when they tried to tie the Sonic 4 stories into Sonic CD. With no Episode 3 ever seeing release, Little Planet is still kinda fucked. 😂
Somewhat lengthy comment. I've got a fair bit to say. If you're not the reading type, just skip this comment or skip to the final paragraph where I sum up my point.
I've seen the whole debate about numbered sequels in the Sonic community for quite some time, and I always thought it was rather dumb to be honest. Sonic 4 is Sonic 4 the same way DMC2 is DMC2. A game not being "good" doesn't disqualify it from being a numbered sequel. If the number is in the title, that's what it is. If the number isn't in the title, it doesn't matter how much the gameplay is similar, it's not a numbered sequel. That is to say, Sonic Colors DS is not Sonic Rush 3. It's the DS version of Sonic Colors. Sonic Colors Wii is not Sonic Unleashed 2. It's the Wii version of Sonic Colors. Sonic Rush 3 and Sonic Unleashed 2 are not games that exist, and there's absolutely nothing stopping SEGA from ever deciding to use those titles for something else in the future, even if it is incredibly unlikely.
There's a myriad of games that could "technically" be considered a sort of "Sonic 4" if you want to stretch the logic enough. Sonic CD is "technically" Sonic 2 since it's the direct sequel to Sonic 1, which makes Sonic 2 "technically" Sonic 3 and Sonic 3&K therefore is "technically" Sonic 4. Sonic 3 was released in two parts, so from a certain perspective you could say that Sonic and Knuckles is "technically" Sonic 4 since it's the direct sequel to Sonic 3. Sonic Advance is the spiritual successor to the classic games, but then again so is Sonic Pocket Adventure. There's also the spinoff game Chaotix, localized as Knuckles Chaotix. Sonic Adventure is the most direct sequel to Sonic 3&K for its time, so it could be on the list too. Then there's also Sonic Mania, which is a newer direct sequel to Sonic 3&K in a new timeline. Triple Trouble could be another example, etc.
None of these games are actually Sonic 4 though. Sonic 4, although not very good, is the only one that is actually the "real" Sonic 4. Not Sonic and Knuckles, not Pocket Adventure, not Advance, not Mania, not Superstars, etc. Just as how DMC2 is simply just not very good, the same thing applies to Sonic 4.
I don't think Sonic fans quite understand how confusing they are to prospective fans on the outside who don't know much about the series when they keep referring to games as what they aren't and use titles that don't actually exist to refer to games that do. Just call the games what they are, and if you want to describe similar gameplay styles then refer to it as a spiritual successor or something. "Sonic Mania is a spiritual successor to the classic Genesis/Mega Drive games" instead of "Sonic Mania is the REAL Sonic 4".
Agreed. I ultimately feel like applying names at the end of games like that does more harm than good in terms of how the game is gonna be received. I felt like I should've hammered this into the video more, but in relation to Advance and Mania I was more so regarding the "Real Sonic 4" in a spiritual sense. I felt like I should've used the phrase "Spiritual Successor" a lot more given that's the angel that I was looking at these games from!
@@YoungAvJoe Yeah. I was more talking in a general sense regarding the topic as a whole rather than in regards to your video specifically, so no harm done.
Dimps simply wanted to make a filler game for mobile and was then thrown under the bus by Sega because they suddenly had to do their darndest to refunction it into a proper followup. Even if I didn't like Sonic 4, I still wouldn't have the same grudge people have against Dimps because of it. In the end, EP1 was largely not made with being Sonic 4 in mind, while EP2 was...and it shows because EP2 actually connects to the plot of the original games by having Eggman call the original Metal Sonic back from the other timeline...which btw still does not contradict Knuckles' Chaotix you guys, that one is implied to be a diffrent Metal Sonic, that is why he's called Metal Sonic Kai. Anyways, I still wish they released EP3 with Knux(and I assume someone else like Amy or the Chaotix? The episode was going to be a bigger jump than EP2 before it was cancelled, Mania was greenlit specifically after Whitehead declined the offer to work on it.) and then later put the entirety of Sonic 4 into a neat package that allows you to come back to earlier episodes and use the characters introduced after them.
1:42 They are not tho. Sonic 1 is the community's punching bag and CD is as split down the middle interms of modern reception as SA2 and Unleashed. I personally don't think Sonic 2 is that great either and actually prefer 1 a lot(Minus the labyrinth Zone boss, that one sucks), but I can't fight the objective fact that the community simply does not agree with me there and puts it alongside 3...so yeah, 2 and 3 are the games generally agreed to be great.
7:02 it released exactly when i turned 8
How to make a Sonic 4
Graphics update
Technologically better than the predecessor
Bigger zones and game
Additional character on top
New gameplay styles and new moves
Sonic Superstars?
Or mania
i love how the adventure games arent even mentioned. "the only good sonic games at that point were colors generations and the genesis games."
6:15 lol
What about Triple Trouble?
You forgot to mention that the developers for both Sonic 4 and the Sonic advance games are the same.
Are you Joe from before he got older and more Angry?
The answer is yes...and no (your a real one if you get what I'm referencing!)
People can get mad but I don't think Sonic 4 has to be 2D.
I still think Adventures is Sonic 4. If we're talking about as you said "spiritual successor" I think it would be the Advance games. Yeah they had areas that looked and hinted to old zones, but they weren't the old zones. Sonic 4 though flat out didn't have areas that "looked" like old zones but flat out were old areas remixed, same with many areas in Mania from levels from all 3 games just remixed.
Advance did something every other 2D Sonic game did though. The main trilogy start in a green area, they all had some robotic base, they all had some amusement/casino like area. The only one that felt Sonic 3 only was the ice area as 1 and 2 didn't have one (Sonic 2 did have a mountain area with Hill Top Zone though).
The Sonic 4 vs The Yakuza 4
awseome media missing screen
Sonic & Knuckles is Sonic 4 since the two games released separately on different months in 1994.
Sonic & Knuckles was always meant to be part of Sonic 3, they just didn't have enough space to store the full thing on one ROM.
Just gonna say it, the Meta Era was the true dark age of Sonic.
Sonic triple trouble 16 bit: Am I a joke to you?
Nu uh man, is a fan game
Sonic 4 - doesnt exist
Sonic & knuckles - sonic 3.5
Sonic mania - sonic 4
Sonic superstars - sonic 5
I think they should remake sonic 4 episode 1 and 2
what about sonic rush?
To me Sonic Mania is the best Sonic game ever, but if this game delivers on everything shown in the trailer then im confident it will be even better.
Superstars is sonic 5 and no one can convince my otherwise
So, the real sonic 4 is sonic & knuckles🤓
I think sonic superstars well be “Sonic 4”
I see Superstars as Sonic 5.
Media Offline flashing hurts my eyes 😭
To be honest, i never called the genesis games a "Trilogy"
I actually like sonic 4 (and it was my second ever sonic game i played my first one was sonic generations)